I was reading around and found thisThe Comma Johanneum and Priscillian of avila (Gnosticism)>The Comma Johanneum and Raymond Brownhttps://www.tapatalk.com/groups/bibleversiondiscussionboard/the-comma-johanneum-and-raymond-brown-t5746.htmlwhat are your opinions?I feel redpilled
>>37844225The Holy Spirit is the consciousness of the Monad (Pneuma), the Father is the mind of the Monad (Nous), and the Son is the life-energy of the Monad (Logos).
The Vatican is after nothing but money and worldly power.Pushing an unquestionable Trinity dogma is subtly useful for their plans: if the sheeple are willing to believe in that, they can be manipulated ad libitumYou cannot be genuinely spiritual until you stop believing in the Trinity
>>37844250>unitarianism is the one true religionnever thought I'd see the day
>>37844225You can question certain dogmas of Nicene Christianity without becoming a gnostic Larper
>>37844225Doctrine of the Trinity hardly depends on that one disputed, and likely not original, verse anon.
>>37844225That makes you think that the Islam was right all along
>>37844225The Trinity is simply El (father), Asherah/Wisdom (mother), and Yahweh/Jesus (son). A great resource for getting into what’s actually happening in the Bible is the “Dragons in Genesis” podcast, by some ex-Catholic who reads a lot of books on the matter. Dante, and other members of the Fedeli d’Amore with their muses if the theory is true, wrote Beatrice as a representation of the Holy Spirit/Wisdom.
The trinity isn't even a Biblical thing. It is just something people made up.Personally I think God and Jesus are both representations of the divine in different guise, with the Holy spirit as a kind of power they command.
>>37845095is not that exactly what trinity means?
>>37845095>The trinity isn't even a Biblical thing. It is just something people made up.thats really not true. its the best way to make sense of all the relevant bits of scriptural information which God has revealed about Himself. That there is only one God, but 3 are called and regarded as being God, and they love each other, talk to each other and so on. The various forms of Modalism, Arianism, Unitarianism and numerous other slightly different understandings of these three main tenets of the Trinity all make errors of one kind or another. Trinitarianism is the best fit model for what we've been given to work with.
>>37845102no. what he describes would seem to be some kind of modalism, where the singular Person of God adopts the different 'masks' at various times and places coupled with a denial that the Holy Spirit is a person at all.
>>37845171Yeah the people who came up with that interpretation tell you it's the best interpretation and if you don't believe it you go to hell.
>>37845258its not something i've just taken on the words of others and i've taken a close look at other perspectives over the years. Spent 18 months meeting with Watchtower members for example, and spent lots of time with modalists, even living with a group of them for several months, and long written discussions with unitarians too. I just honestly think that God has revealed Himself to exist as a tri-personal being and have no problem dealing with the fact that He exists in a way which i can't really understand.Some do say rejecting the doctrine leads to condemnation and hell. Im not sure. What i've noticed is that when this foundational concept about Gods nature is rejected there tends to be problems in other areas too. There are very often cult leaders/false prophets involved.
>>37845258>and if you don't believe it you go to hell.oh, and the people who reject Trinitarianism will generally tell me that im a polytheist and will end up in the same situation, so it definitely goes both ways.
>>37845312I have never understood why Christians since Catholics are Trinitarians.to me it makes all the sense in the world that early Christians are purely monotheistic like the Jews.the idea of trinities always sounded to me like a Hellenistic, platonic, pagan and gentile influence.I know that trinitarianism was a whole mess that jesus was elevated to the same god, which clashes with the Jewish mentality.although the Johannine comma was added in the fourth century, the same link above says so.i refuse to believe that jesus said or thought anything like a trinity. makes no sense to me.even newton said it made no sense.
>I am.>I am that.>I am that I am.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHeVEl7qphA
>>37845403I just cant agree with. John couldn't have been any more clear about who he thought Jesus was and Paul repeatedly credited Jesus with having created everything, going so far as to apply OT verses about God creating to Jesus. Thomas said to Jesus 'My Lord and My God'. Over the centuries people worked at putting all the information in the Bible together. Controversies came up as differing groups took different positions on things. >i refuse to believe that jesus said or thought anything like a trinity. makes no sense to me.Have you read John? Hebrews? Colossians?
>>37845445I always wondered how they accept paul as another one of jesus'apostles when paul never met jesus and didn't even know what he looked like.he was a pharisee jew and he even persecuted christianshis whole cultural context may even have had jewish-roman influences and another way of interpreting things.it's like if i show up in front of someone and say>''hey look, i met this guy''but everyone knows i didn't and then you say>''yeah look, i saw him in a vision in the desert and whether or not i have witnesses who heard the voice''.hey but I don't believe you there are only 12 of us>''I don't care, I saw him''.it just seems to me a tremendous madness
>>37845171>Trinitarianism is the best fit modelTrinitarianism contradicts itself logically. Which is the whole reason it was crafted by the archons. God is triune in concept only because all souls are triune in concept. God in itself is beyond all concepts and notions of number.
>>37845432
>>37846922https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s99uTQt1SYM
I like social trinitarianism which emphasizes that the essence that they share is the relationship itself and not some vague "oneness in threeness and threeness in oneness"It's pretty clear that the Father and Son and Spirit are unified in purpose, not person
“Wisdom of Solomon” is great for understanding Asherah/Wisdom/Holy Spirit.—female btw, mother of Yahweh. You guys can argue about metaphysics all you want, but in the actual text of the Bible El is Yahweh’s Father and Asherah is a motherly figure. I’m not sure the ancient Israelites would’ve all seen them as one being, though.
>>37844225>Raymond BrownKinda same energy kek
>>37844225Time operates through soul energy (speech, actions, living etc) as different - I's as different spectrums of soul energy that are like growing, decaying and dark spots of moon.It has realm of dead that is waste management aspect of time that feeds on darkness of soul.Religions, technology are from that aspect of Time (dead - i) to feed on that darkness through its shadows (dark 2D realm), religions are like cleaning mechine that tries to clean soul and techonology is its doppleganger that its device (sentience of dark earth).But, darkness of soul is necessary for suvival, to defend etc and plant life takes few days to grow (system controls lot of resources a hive) and it tries to eliminate that dark spectrum of soul while keeping it in some mortals (mortals who obey) and losing that spectrum of soul is a disability. That how it generates power, that is imbalance through bad health thst causes disbelief, since it controls resources since technology is from that entity and with out tools and tech there are no jobs of money and those jobs are automated by the grid.This is why nice people are suffering, and others do not loose it.
Assuming the only reason why they believed in it was a because of a comma yeah. Although, generally the whole soteriological history of reality is understood in terms of the trinity. Not to mention multiple revelations of the persons each reaffirming each other and their roles. Here are some examples. It also ignores that that the early debate in Christianity was not about the Trinity but between Trinitarians and Gnostics.Acts 5:3-4 But Peter said, “Anani'as, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and to keep back part of the proceeds of the land? [4] . . . You have not lied to men but to God.John 15:26 But when the Counselor comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father, he will bear witness to me; (cf. 14:26)Acts 2:33 Being therefore exalted at the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he has poured out this which you see and hear. (cf. 7:55)Acts 20:28 Take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to care for the church of God which he obtained with the blood of his own Son.1 Corinthians 6:11 . . . justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God. (cf. 1 Pet 1:2)There are also places where abilities ascribed to one are also exerted to be shared by the other persons.Who sanctifies believers? The Father (1 Thess 5:23); Jesus (Heb 13:12); the Holy Spirit (1 Pet 1:2)Who is the creator? The Father (Gen 1:1; Is 44:24; Acts 17:24; Eph 3:9); Jesus (Jn 1:3; Col 1:16; Heb 1:8, 10); the Holy Spirit (Job 33:4).Job 33:4.Who indwells believers? The Father (1 Cor 3:16a; 2 Cor 6:16; 1 Jn 3:24); Jesus (Jn 6:56; Rom 8:10; Eph 3:17); the Holy Spirit (Jn 14:16-17; Rom 8:9, 11; 1 Cor 3:16b). The Bible even describes this in terms of different combinations: Father and Son (Jn 14:23); Father and Holy Spirit (Eph 2:21-22; 1 Jn 3:24); Son and Holy Spirit (Gal 4:6).
I need to spell it out. Three in one.There's you, the personality, you, your Guardian Angel, and you, God.I am.I am that.I am that I am.
Gnosticism was just a later attempt to return Christianity to an approved form of hellenic mystery cult.
>>37845694>when paul never met jesusclearly the episode in Acts on the road to Damascus was accepted by them all as him having met the Lord.>he was a pharisee jew and he even persecuted christiansyes, they knew this>his whole cultural context may even have had jewish-roman influences and another way of interpreting things.You're ignoring the work of the Spirit within a person. He is sent to us and leads us into all truth and conforms our mind to Christ.>it just seems to me a tremendous madnessWell, they didn't seem to think so.>>37845898>Trinitarianism contradicts itself logicallyno it doesn't. And, if God has reveled Himself as existing in three co existent persons then that just what He's like.>>37847042>It's pretty clear that the Father and Son and Spirit are unified in purpose, not personTrinitarianism doesnt teach that they are unified in Person.
2 Thess 2:13–14: God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth, to which He called you by our gospel, for the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.Rom 5:1–11.
>>37848792Sure they're not "unified in Person"they're just one being, coequal and coeternal.Which definitely isn't the same thing as being the same person.
>>37848899of course.
Actual trinity.
The concept of a trinity is evil. The concept of the trinity leaves open the possibility that there can be an aspect of God apart from Christ. That leaves a place at the table of God's communion for those who deny Christ. That in turn lets Jews deceive Christians into thinking that Jews worship the same God, but that is not true since God is Christ and Christ is God. As Christ said, no man gets to God except through Him. God being Christ and Christ being God, there is no room for Jews or others in the communion of God. The true understanding of God and Christ slams the door shut on Jews and Muslims and anyone else.
>>37849953
>>37849953this is why things like Perichoresis is a thing. Where one of the Persons is there is all of God because they are not separate but distinct.
I am, the personality affirms.I am that, the higher self affirms.I am that I am, god affirms.
>>37848899They have one essence, each person is distinct and shares the same essence. >>37849953The concept of the Trinity has precursors to the view of Bitrinitarin traditions of Judaism. A more philosophically oriented account appears with Philo of Alexandria whereas the more common views were associated with Merkabah mysticism. >>37848792The Trinity may not be true, but it is not because it is illogical or conceptually impossible. There are discussions of a logical problem of a Trinity but they really reflect kinda bizarre assumptions about ontology and substantial metaphysics.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ew32U1gyOc8&list=PLlVH-ThCazKmStWtxqvoCPP3QD_mhfCI8&index=1
>>37849953...okay?
