After playing both this year, I have concluded that T2X is better than TBP.
Beat TDS in honor of the 20th anniversary next month and now I'm playing the 2014 game out of morbid curiosity and it is total garbage.
>>10865909To expand, the stealth system falls for the trap of making you always be crouched or you get spotted in pitch darkness (even though there are no truly dark areas in the game), the game takes no real advantage of dynamic lighting unlike TDS and you will never have situations like light pouring in after opening a door, if you get caught you have a dodge that makes you invincible and you can just mash the quick melee button to take out any guard, you can't jump unless the game feels like it, making the navigation extremely restrictive, white flashing screen indicators whenever you go from darkness to light, retarded storytelling and atmosphere because french canadians don't know how real people talk or behave, more loading screens between areas than TDS, tedious animations. I could go on and on but the gist of it is that it sucks, has nothing to do with Thief, and even as its own IP it's not really a stealth game.
>>10865627>female protagonistI can already tell its shit
>>10866061Not every custom character gets to be Sean Connery.
>>10866076Yeah but it should never be a girl, it never ends up well.
What's a good thief game? Tried Filcher, found it meh. Art of Theft is meh too.Thi4f is utter shit and I hate it.
>>10866076I hate that wanna be Markiplier Brony faggot FenPheonix so much and I hate that I can't deny he's a good voice actor.
>>10866612Literally nothing, that's why we keep replaying Thief and FMs.
>>10866612The Dark Mod but I'm guessing you've already played it.
>>10866807Sadge. Guess I'll have to dive into FMs.>>10866856I did, but it was a few years ago, and it was very badly optimized. Like, opening a door would take 20 FPS until it was closed again.I assume it got fixed?
>>10866896It recently got a major performance optimization, and they also improved leaning and blackjacking.https://www.thedarkmod.com/posts/the-dark-mod-2-12-has-been-released/If you have a decent GPU I'd probably recommend using shadow maps over stencil shadows as well since newer maps make use of it for cool effects but it depends on your personal preference.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJ49pCVQaf8Didn't know Daniel Thron made a fan film about Thief last year, posting in case anyone here hasn't seen it yet.
I noticed no two people play exactly the same way with the exception of those try to ghost. Got me thinking about how people relate to this game and stealth in general. Would you still like and play Thief if there were no weapons (blackjack included) at all? How much are you willing to part with before you walk away from the game? If all you had were the movement and stealth ability inherent to the player?
>>10867342I've played fan missions that had forced ghosting, but I would not enjoy the game as a whole as much if it didn't give you the tools they give. It's a lot more enjoyable to roll with the punches when you mess up than reload for the 100th time.
>>10866996OH yeah everybody knows I think.If you havent listened to his interveiw on" inside at last" do it. I love Dan.
>>10866992I had a laptop. Now I have a PC that can run anything.
>>10867342honestly the game would be much better if it didn't have the blackjack
>>10867342>Would you still like and play Thief if there were no weapons (blackjack included) at all?No. Give me choice, even if it's considered unskilled or low. Adam didn't ate that fruit for my freedom of choice to be voided.
>>10867997Yeah I agree Its more about encounter design.There should be more guards who are immune to it in certain locations, more even than BP did but with cool alternate ways to get around.BJ is to me just a RP tool right now or a get out of trouble free card with flash bombs since truth be told, there is some bullshit with the dark engine that sadly unavoidable, like when you mantle and you do loud sounds, some can be avoided with player experience, but i bet new players woudl fumble everything. Especially rope arrows and a ladders.>>10865627Zendaya is fucking trash wtf anon.
>>10868004Hume is worse than trash. Retarded Garrett going through his emo phase with a story where he ultimately does nothing and dies of AIDS.
>>10868180Joking aside. I did like Thief2x when it came out. However I really fucking love BP muhc more. The ambient sounds and the overall design.In fact I like death cold embrace more than 2x.Speaking of which now I understand why people love into the odd, only at the early stages but I think i broke the mission mid way, in the underground section i think you have to come back later right? I new mantled something i should not.Cant believe i took so long to play it.
>>10868256DCE, Godbreaker, and Calendra's Legacy are probably my favorite campaigns.
Is it a common opinion that thief 1 goes to shit after Constantine's mansion or did I get filtered?
>>10868276You got filtered.
>>10868280
>>10868283What's wrong? Haunted Cathedral, Song of the Caverns, and Undercover are some of my favorite missions in the game. I also think Escape is an underrated mission even if it's considered a nightmare to ghost.
>>10868305Civvie was a fag when he came down memey hard on the last missions, I think they are awesome and a a great way to play differently.You can still stealth, and they feel like the stakes are getting really high.
>>10868309I go out of my way to avoid that guy's videos so it's sad to see people take them seriously.
>>10868305I stopped at the lost city because the dungeon crawling just wasn't fun to me.
>>10868316I dont hate him, its okay, I still think he did a good homage to both games.>>10868325Try it again, It gets better and the tomb raider 1 feel coupled with eldritch stuff gets good.
>>10867342I would like it more if blackjack was replaced with the limited amount of gas arrows. To me, undead levels are fun because of the limited amount of weapons that's able to take them down, so you have to calculate if it's worth destroying that zombie or maybe keep your holy water in case something bigger appears
It's easy to say the blackjack is too easy when you've played the game for decades now and most FMs are city missions without mechanical or undead elements. I don't think Thief's blackjack is any easier than knocking/taking enemies out in Deus Ex, MGS, Tenchu, or Dishonored and the base game would feel lacking without it as a tool and when you watch new players, it's greatly appreciated by them for making "stealth space" in levels. That said, I'd totally play a fan mission where you don't have it and I recommend people check out Spoonman's recent Thief FMs (and King of the Mountain for TDM) for missions where you don't start with equipment and have to do some proper sneaking. They have low ratings despite being really well built because people get butthurt and see him just releasing missions as an attack on them because they're "not serious enough".
>>10868650One thing that would work well in dark engine is a small stun, the blackjack woudl neutralize a completely unaware guard for like 20 seconds, in a stun animation maybe, and BJ woudl do no lethal damageSo you could choose to set up gas mines or arrows.
>>10867342I love thief but I'm honestly over the human guard stealth at this point. I much prefer the more loose avoidance interaction you have with the monsters.
>>10868343I genuinely loved how Thief 1 felt more like a Rogue game than a Thief, with all kind of monsters.
Why not just simply have more guards wearing helmets for FMs?
>>10866184Culture wars really mindraped zoomers into hating anything blindly with women/poc. Good thing T2X came out to great fanfare when you weren't even born.
>>10868998Normal guards already wear helmets don't they, they're just made out of tin foil
>>10869120I kinda forgive them cause the situation is not good. Really not good.>>10868998Well sure, the models are there and they are unbonkable
>>10866712He does not voice Conall.
>>10869120>zoomerI'm older than you probably are buddy.
>>10869807Then act like it you inbred manchild
>>10869445Huh, no he doesn'tit's been years since I played FfP and Godbreaker but for some reason I always thought it was him but I'm getting Conall mixed up with some random Hammerite he voiced insteadNevermind then, I hate that wannabe Markiplier Brony Faggot FenPheonix and he's NOT a good VA
Going to retry playing through The Den and The Black Frog since I'm running out of missions. My biggest problem with The Den was having to go around collecting eye things to beat the map after it has already been cleared.
>>10868768>They have low ratings despite being really well built because people get butthurt and see him just releasing missions as an attack on them because they're "not serious enough".I think most people just see it as a shame that he puts so many hours into the architecture (while being EXTREMELY skilled at that), without properly finishing them
>>10870810Finished The Den and it wasn't as tedious as I remember, I was likely burned out from playing so many FMs but this time I accepted it as a mid-2000s FM and played it accordingly instead of trying to sneak past the huge packs of patrolling guards.
First mission of The Black Frog is giving me Calendra's Legacy vibes.
New FM just droppedhttps://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152616&p=2514403#post2514403
>>10870227That's some dangerous simp behavior you're exhibiting, you aren't going to get any E-pussy.
>>10873932Im pointing out how retarded you are for dismissing T2X solely for the fact it has a female lead while dismissing how much of an achievement it was for the community. What else are you going to complain about? That Thief 2 had females in the city watch?You just reek of current day culture war brainrotism
>>10874012I agree for sure, I would say Thief community made bigger bangers than other classic games way before its time.Its very interesting. There is effort in it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjS7_U1WyLcThief fans have always been the best even with the bickering.
>>10874038>director works at Insomniac nowRIP
I'm ready.Where do I start? Need a launcher?
>>10865627Never heard of it.Gameplay looks good.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQiv_LA0MnY
>>10875476Aiiiiie, a female character, a giiiiiiiirl!
>>10874012Spare your time & energy. They'll never change their minds. Or they know it's BS and think of themselves as mastertrolls.Calling you a 'simp' 4 defending a virtual fem lead was teh cream of the cropreally here.>>10875461I also bought teh collection during teh sale 4 my deck. Didn't look @ them yet. Anyway teh purchase was kinda dumb since you've to configure it manually anyhow.Tfix 1/2 for the classics.Deadly Shadows Sneaky Upgrade FullThese're just bare-bones recoms.There are numerous tweaks and adjustments one can make if desired. Detailed guides on steam & forums are available.Then I'd install T2X and TBP as teh 1st FMs.Some1 really should put that in teh general.Also teh portable of teh classics some anon made a while ago since every1 agreed they turned out quite noice. Don't have teh link anymoar/they're down.
>>10875567What the fuck am I reading.
>>10875461 here, should've clarified, I finished all these games (except 4), but I meant the fanmissions. Where to find them, what do I need, I prefer Thief 1 over Thief 2 because the Rogue aspect appeals to me...
>>10875573Cut me some slack... Just got out of bed!
>>10875578Waking up? At 1 PM?
>>10875581Time zones are a thing you know?Likewise not everyone is forced to wageslave one's life away.Also it was a power nap.
>>10875585The Earth is flat, therefore timezones are a myth.
>>10875461Use the lite versions of TFix and T2Fix, check cam_ext.cfg and modify it to your liking, and consider modifying your Thief 1 install to use Thief 2 creeping instead of having two move forward keys by replacing your user.bnd file. And play on Hard your first time through.
>>10875889Oh and make sure in cam.cfg or user.cfg you make sure to add the line "character detail 1" to ensure the high detail character models are used for Thief 1. If you play with a high refresh rate mode, make sure to use vsync mode 7 in cam_ext.cfg or to cap your physics. Also you can enable raw mouse input by adding "use_raw_mouse_input" in cam_ext.cfg.
>>10875461https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=839934571
>>10875567https://www.mediafire.com/folder/qmzlu84u988rh/Portable_Thief
do timed thief fm exist?
>>10875889>>10875907I meant to get into the FM, I already finished Thief 1 in Hard mode, and never finished Thief 2 actually.>>10876039Why you showing me that?
>>10877109Go beat Thief 2, then I'd recommend starting with the 20th anniversary contest FMs for Thief 1 and 2.
>>10877120I don't find Thief 2 as enjoyable as the first one. I loved the first's weird atmosphere.Also, checked, I have Thief Gold, not Thief 1. Which is neat, I never actually played Thief Gold.
>>10866076I thought the guy doing the voice for this was doing a Bane impression at first.
>>10867342I try to always use as little as possible, barely use regular arrows, hold on to moss for way too long, always fuck up flashbang throw to the point where I banned myself from using it, probably would not notice if some stuff straight up went missing from inventory, but at the same time, to this day, I refuse to play deadly shadows, because there's no rope arrow.
I instantly drop a fm if it features a w*man protagonist (t2x) or if a w*man plays an important role in the story (calendras)
>>10877278calendra's legacy is top tier and made by a chad coomer who still writes shitty fantasy novels and hasn't trooned out (unlike the mission x guy)
As you are thief fans; I was curious to know if anyone enjoyed Thief:Deadly Shadows? The one that came to console later. I know it's not as retro; but did you guys like it?
>>10877303It's the first one I played back when it was new and introduced me to the series. It has a lot of problems in retrospect but I think there was a solid attempt at a new game with a different team. I replayed it a few weeks ago and enjoyed it, then played through Thiaf for the first time and I think of Deadly Shadows a lot more fondly after that.
>>10877365Same basically; deadly shadows does have a few issues; but I really liked the freedom and openness to it. It's what got me into thief in the first place and I really enjoyed the story with the keepers. That being said; I played like 30 minutes of the thief installment that came after that and immediately put it down disappointed. Did anyoneEnjoy the very newest thief or was I far from alone in disliking it?
>>10877651It's bad enough that a developer of the previous games (FM author for 2 and worked on 3) publicly stated he didn't like it which is pretty rare for a game dev to openly admit.
>>10877659Ty. I feel affirmed. I was legit angry at that game. Thanks for the feedback frens. :)
>>10867342i used to ghost because of a very dumb reason so i would always reload when spotted, at some point i told myself that's dumb and stopped reloading unless the situation was truly hopeless and i realized that in my 300+ hours on thief i missed most of the voicelines and even cool mechanics like guards warning each other that an intruder is lurking abouti have no problem playing without a blackjack but it's better to let the player decide for themselvesfor example the no kill objective was always a bit silly to me, if i were cornered why would i let myself be killed out of "professionalism"?>>10877651it's not just you, in fact, i often got angry at the game not letting me do the simplest shit: the devs really put a pipe connecting point A to point B but wont let you walk over it forcing you to face the "stealth arena" down belowthe consensus seems to be "its an ok game if you forget the ones that came before it" which is rather dumb, imagine half life 3 came out tomorrow and it's just CoD with the most generic and bland story, no cool gimmicks or mechanics, would the steam store page be filled with thubs up and "its a good game if you forget hl1 and hl2 ever existed"?also thief 4 is not a good game even by itself but that's just my opinion
For someone that hates and despises small facehugging spiders, is this game playable? I have no problem with horror elements or larger spooders, but I want to know how frequent the little jump scary pieces.of shit are.
>>10878761They're fine, you can kill them with one broadhead arrow if they are unaware and block their attacks with your sword.
>>10877303It’s enjoyable enough to revisit occasionally. I liked it much more on release but even back then I noticed how different it was and went right back to playing T2 when I was done with it. There’s nothing from T3 that I wish were in the previous games. Right now it’s part of my not-Thief stealth game rotation alongside Darkmod and whatever other stealth games I’m trying out. I used to find it surprising nobody made a suitable successor for T1/2, but after all this time I don’t think it can be done. Talk about original flavor.
>>10868309Katie, pull up that clip of my shtick getting extremely repetitive and then bring me a black bull to prep. *honk honk*
2000s FM moment
>>10878761Scary shit is generally rare in Thief games and fms (the actually horror-themed ones excepted). Game generally try to go more for that dark weird fantasy vibe than actual horror.Of course, YMMV.
>>10867342Blackjack is too OP not to use, especially with a flash bomb. Makes the game too trivial. I wouldn't outright remove it, but if I was to make missions, I'd add more helmet guards to key areas. I don't think improving the AI to the point where suspicious guards have a chance to resist it and guards becoming suspicious of their fellow guards dissappearing is feasible in this engine.If Thief got a proper new entry, I'd like to see more pattern breaks in the AI and just smarter AI overall.Lighting up torches you put out or turning electric lights back on, becoming alert if doors that are supposed to be locked are wide open, searching for missing guards, etc.That way if you blackjack someone in your way it might bite you in the ass later on and being a messy thief to get the job done faster won't be as safe as being a methodical one that takes his time and leaves no traces.Maybe make it so that guards you knocked out can get back up or if you alert like half the map you fail the mission because they tighten up their defenses.
>>10881397The only issues with thief are only that, in a more modern engine they could follow you better, go up ladders, etc.And yes have more helmeted guards forcing you to gas arrow or other types of traps.I love the simplicity of derg0sign of thief.
>>10881397They do relight torches.
>>10881615In Dark Mod and Teef 2014 yes.
>>10881992And Thief 2 for any gas based light sources in OMs and FMs that support it. You just make the AI frob the light source when it's out. Thief 3 also had relighting torches.
Mission 4 of The Black Frog is godawful.
>>10882950Finished it, the latter half of the campaign was a total drag with the switch and key hunting, but the first two missions were good.
>>10876864Mission 2 of Calendra's Legacy has a timed objective.
https://youtu.be/efF-dYmNxRwShame this never made it to the finished release (the mouth poses are obviously custom).
>>10885208I also remember seeing dynamic lights in the dark engine.If lgs lasted a little while longer the fm scene might even be more nice.
>>10866061I guess you also hate Dino Crisis, Metroid, Tomb Raider, Bloodrayne, and Resident Evil 3 then, huh?
I finally gave Thief 1 and (somewhat) 2 my fair share. I found that I disliked both, and quit on the Sword, out of all missions. Now hear me out a bit. All the strengths the games purportedly have are indeed strong - the interplay of light, simple yet effective, even streamlined stealth mechanics, good story carried by great protag (especially how he's voiced), the exploration of large maps itself.There are some weird decisions, inventory UI is kinda nonsensical, you get to shuffle through useless items like loot and they give you two lockpicks for some reason, not that you even needed one to begin with. Just trivial details marring the otherwise well done gameplay.Now where the game really fucks up for me is the abundance of guards who have no subsystems (like, for example guards in MGS have) and while this is in line with the streamlining present in stealth, here it actually works against the game. There is not a single instance on any map where I didn't just wish for the retarded guards to dissapear and stop bothering me. It's not hard to get rid of them, it's just tedious. Their AI seems wonky - I played Thief Gold with TFix and they don't seem to react to noise arrows in a way I'd expect them to. Thematically, the game is uneven. I'd wager that introducing all the supernatural elements was a mistake, but okay - maybe people like them. I was unimpressed with the Sword not because it's poorly designed, but because it's American McGee's wet dream - all those assets jumbled together to completely fuck up what zombies couldn't. Hell, right before that is the single worst map I ever played in my life, that Thieves Guild one that was added later on. I'd even say that the game is frontloaded to some extent because m1 and m1 are significantly better than what comes after, especially in terms of aesthetics. Ramirez's Mansion is particularly guilty here because there are just lazy copypasted banners everywhere and the house itself is marked with a giant R. (cont)
(cont) so the aesthetics are all over the place. Some amazing sections, some extremely lazy and poorly done, tons of completely empty rooms, repeated galleries with five stock paintings total, which is another clash with the setting. I admire that the scene keeps exploring the game, but I don't think it can be salvaged except in improving the scale and puzzles on the maps themselves. Community maps that is. The AI is just horrendous and makes the game unplayable, and most of them feature voice acting that was obviously recorded by a random team member who is so obviously a late 90s American. I unironically consider Deus Ex to be a stealth masterpiece compared to this.
>>10885404>m1 and m1m1 and m2 obviously, I mean Bafford's and Bonehoard (if Bonehoard is the 2nd one)
Remember to not reply to shitposts.
Rather impressive for 1998 that the guards have compound viewcones meant to simulate peripheral vision and also to emulate ambushes. Their vision factors in darkness, distance, geometry proximity, movement speed and equipped target armament, and that vision is augmented based on whether they're unaware, suspicious or alerted. When previously highly alerted, the vision cones expand, including the rear one, allowing them to pretend to not notice you sneaking up on them so they can ambush you. Their hearing is based on distance and sound propagation nodes and augmented by their alertness state, and the sounds they can hear are based on the material that is emitting the sound. If only other games took this approach as the base level standard all those years ago.
anything I don't like is a shitpost
>>10865627Finished TBP earlier today. They both have ups and downs over each other>Zaya is the better protagonist, Hume is an idiot just look at his predicament>TBP has much better cutscenes and voice acting>TBP has bigger and better designed maps but they are to claustropobic at times compared to X's much more open map design>X has the elemental catalyst adding more options for using arrows>Both undead levels in TBP overstay their welcome because they are to big while the ones in X are just big enough.There is more i can say but all in all they are both great and hopefully we get more campaigns like them in the future.
>>10885979TBP's levels were too big for their own good. The kind of thing where I'd be more forgiving if it was a bunch of one-off contest missions instead of a continuous campaign, but I just found the missions (especially the undead ones) to overstay their welcome. Also the frenchies/euros that did heavily accented english was worse than any voice acting in T2X. Regardless, the campaign overall was impressive from a technical level but I think it spent too much time in the oven. I was worried about that the second they started posting videos of scripting haunts that explode into bones then reassemble, making tons of noise on tiles (which I'm grateful they removed from the finished product) and bragged about the insane amount of triangles onscreen in some of their scenes. I also think their "Neo-TDP atmosphere" doesn't actually capture the atmosphere of TDP at all and is some sort of grimdark version of it.
>>10886064I think marble man did a great VA job on the noble.
>>10865627I love everything about the first two Thief games save for the spidersUsually I tolerate them in every other game but here I cannot stand them. One day I'll become courageous enough to beat Gold.
>>10886601Most games have spiders that are either just big tarantulas, bulky and hairy, which just makes them look cuddly. Other games have fantastical demon spiders that are too unrealistic to be scary. Thief has the scariest form of spiders. The ones with the long, thin and shiny legs.
>>10886109Is that the one with the heavy accent? That one was in fact amazing and very memorable. Same with the chef
>>10888219Yeah its marble man, he does Thief videos and worked on ton of fms.I dont get the grim dark TDP tone the anon said, its their own thing and I kinda love it. Same with level design. The only fault is that its missing a mission or two with the necromancers.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIkJeaFdaZg
>>10886601Just shoot them with broadhead arrows.
Soulforge is the best final level in gaming history and more games should take notes from it on how to make their final level. It truly puts your stealth skill to the test having you in a metal factory with limited supplies, especially water arrows so you can't just disable all the robot guards.
>>10885494Its all in a "primitive" engine now, but you can really see nobody ever tried to do something similar, imagine with a modern engine the possibilities.
>>10888350It's the first level in the series where I had to truly start using all of the game's arsenal. I couldn't just remove all the stealth by knocking out all my opposition. There aren't enough resources to do that. So, I actually had to learn to sneak past those that I could avoid. Right then I realized what I was expected to be doing all along, and in the previous game too.
>>10888392Splinter Cell did try some things. Visibility of individual body parts of the player character. Sound processing to create audio cover so enemies can't hear. An actual infrared effect layer allowing the player to visualize things through thin surfaces and see their residual heat. But shortly after Chaos Theory, nothing. Nothing new was ever done with stealth games.Sound processing has improved. Real-time raytraced lights are now a thing. But nobody uses either for any gameplay purposes.
>>10888402Splinter Cell was the only one. You could tell SC devs were looking at what LGS did.Dishonored was a big bummer for me because of that. It does not try to really immerse you like Thief. It will come full circle one day, and it will be a great experience. Thief slow paced gameplay seems perfect for true VR.
>>10888404You know what's fucked up? The gradient visibility? The analog movement speed? Those actually exist in Splinter Cell Blacklist, but the game's feedback and control interfaces are programmed on top of it in a way that binarises it so the player can't access it in any way.I like the way Blacklist pretends to cater to the action crowd, though. It was marketed as this ridiculous action roller coaster to the brainlet audience. In-game it gives them epic headshot points and tallies up their kill counts in the results screen. They get the illusion of doing a good job, never realizing that stealth players get a hundred times the score they did for playing the game the right way. It's a participation trophy disguised as a gold medal.
>>10888224>I dont get the grim dark TDP tone the anon said, its their own thing and I kinda love it.It was described as Neo-TDP during development, and they claimed it was a return to that style over Thief 2's "clean" look.
>>10888224that guy is a huge fag
I'm done with all the objectives in the second level in Bathory except for planting a stolen guest item in Rozi's box, I can't find anything and there are only two guest rooms that are unlocked, one with a guy sleeping and the other with some woman doing the thriller dance.
>>10889010Missions from that era basically expect you to check the forum thread for hints on what to do next.
>>10889027Really? Maybe I should just go do a normal Garrett FM then.
>>10885494where can i learn more about this? its very interesting>target armamentwhat does this mean? the weapon you're carrying? i always thought lgs programmed it so that if you carry the bow while moving it adds a +2 to the lightgem and a similar thing with the sword because that's what it seems to be doing ingame>allowing them to pretend to not notice you sneaking up on them so they can ambush youno fucking way, i didnt even know they had a rear view conei only recently stopped save scumming so my encounters were always with non-alerted guards so this is news to me, pretty fucking coolwhy does no one make things like this anymore?
>>10889692I think the best way to learn about the inner workings is to ask FM creators or Thief tech experts. I doubt Tom Leonard himself remembers much about the details. Jayrude is one of the fandom members who knows a lot, iirc.>what does this mean? the weapon you're carrying? i always thought lgs programmed it so that if you carry the bow while moving it adds a +2 to the lightgemThat's basically what I meant. It's not strictly "the AI" doing things, but it still factors into the depth of the system that is visibility. Being crouched, close to a wall, wielding no weapons, all of those contribute to your invisibility.>i only recently stopped save scumming so my encounters were always with non-alerted guards so this is news to me,Guards that have been highly alerted, e.g. they've actually chased you and lost you, will retain a level of alertness for many minutes after last sighting. It expands all of their viewcones so that their detection happens faster even at longer range. While in this state, the rear view cone can alert them when you're trying to sneak up on them and because they're already suspicious, they skip straight to a combat state, turn around and try to hit you immediately. So, it's like they're pretending not to see you so they can counterattack.While in an alerted state, the audio design changes to reflect it. Guards who are alerted will never whistle or hum, they will only clear their throats or sigh sometimes, to indicate to the player that they're serious. Once the alertness state fades, they will say one of the standard reset lines "Nothing here now" or the equivalent, and will return to normal idle state.
>>10889731i always praised thief for being extraordinarily complex but this goes beyond what i thoughtguess i'll make a ttlg account and ask around for detailsthanks for bringing this to my attention
>>10889769The best thing about Thief's complexity is that it's just complex enough for interactions to stop feeling "gamey". You start making assumptions about how things would work in real life, and because of the complexity of the simulations, those assumptions are more often right than wrong. With simpler games you can't make those assumptions, and you need to just "learn the game mechanics" -and then things become predictable based on those simple rules.
>>10889769Yeah absolutely. LGS were a bunch of mit dudes aiming for the sky.It could all been expanded much bigger, in terms of audio lines of guards etc.>>10889778Its still an old engine with limitations. But I agree that the combination of factors, and particular good taste in world building created a true cult classic for the ages.
>>10889692https://web.archive.org/web/20180422061740/http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/131762/postmortem_thief_the_dark_project.phphttps://twitter.com/nothings/status/1604286285312823296https://nothings.org/gamedev/thief_rendering.htmlAnd it's possible to find out more by reading Thief 2's source code as well as poking around in the editor. Anons itt are understating how advanced the Dark Engine was in pretty much everything but its renderer. Some of the stuff they did, other devs wouldn't do again until 2007.
>>10890286I only realized that until very recently. After some talking about newdark.I wish there was some way to make less clunky npcs as well.
Speaking of newdark, why does it seem to make Garrett "thicker"? I'm having trouble fitting through tight passages in very old fan missions, before newdarks inception I guess
>>10891098garrett is a pair of spheres and that hasn't changed between newdark and olddark, although I do think there is a slight discrepancy with the headbob collision on vents between the two but you can just move back and go in or lean while going into a vent
>>10891112There is and sometimes its very annoying.
what was this guy's problem?
>>10892176iirc he was a murderer who was put in solitary for so long he went crazyi wished he'd react to noises, imagine banging your blackjack on the door and he starts talking crazy to you
>>10892176https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r26ZIkE0do8
>>10865627I haven't played Thief before, but I understand that Thief Gold makes some changes level wise. Is there a way to downgrade to the original version without the changes that Gold made? I'd like to try tht first.
>>10892962There's GoldToDark but you should just play through Gold your first time.
>>10892968Thank you. I might do that, but I always like to try things in their original/vanilla release before going on to later editions.
>>10892962See post>>10876150Its a portable version of thief vanilla and gold and thief 2.Already ready to play FMs, with only optional cam:ext file tweaking for shit like bloom etc.
>>10865627Downloaded thief gold over a year ago and still have yet to play it
>>10893028Thank you, anon.
>>10893072No problem, Thief is the only game i got to these lengths. It deserves to be remembered.
Can someone post the recommended FM list file?
>>10893119Play:Calendra's Cistern (original)Calendra's LegacyCoSaS Mission XHidden AgendaHeist SocietyInverted ManseT2XOminous BequestA Night In RocksbourgGems of ProvenanceThief 20th Anniversary missionsThief 2 20th Anniversary missions
>>10893119Feast of the PilgrimsGodbreaker (sequel to FofP)Fables of the Penitent Thief
>>10893119Anything made by skacky, melan and Dirk Bogan. And DrKubiac.
>>10893265>A Night In Rocksbourgfucking don't>Thief 20th Anniversary missions>Thief 2 20th Anniversary missionshuge mixed bag, what sort of recommendation is this?>>10893319>skacky, melan overrated as fuck >Dirk Boganhad to look him up because I didn't even know who he was, but yeah pretty much shit >DrKubiacsee rocksbourg
>>10893369Ascend the Dim valley and Builders paradise is shit?Sure thing anon.Also I played a lot of stuff recently and I like skacky.>>10893119Also Forgot Nick Dablin.Recently played Thief Training and was a fucking bangerfor a dudes first mission. Scarlett Cascabel as well, dont know why I took so long. Great mission.
>>10893265Also:Down in the Old VaultLord Robert's PaintingDeath's Cold EmbraceAlcazarThe Cinder NotesThe DenBones: Episode 1Bad HangoverRavensreach>>10893369You are gay and boring.
I'm still a total newfag, played my first Thief game just this february, but I enjoyed everything by morrgan
>>10893119not sure if you need this too, but here's a pic I saved a while ago that has some recommendationsand here's a video on Thief fan missions I found too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIkJeaFdaZg
>>10867342Diversity is our strength.Seriously, If you talk about designing a game and not one mission I'd prefer different kind of missions, and maybe even branching the story depending on what you do. And diverse enemies.-One enemy or device the player can neutralize quietly and freely, from the distance or in melee-One that can only be neutralized in melee-One that requires spending specific resource-One that is connected with the level specific mechanic (such as switch)-One that will force the player to make a loud sound (for example using a firearm) to remove-One that is unkillable whatsoever-One that ignores sound distractions but does not hear footsteps-One that can see in the dark-One that can be removed but that will trigger an event (such as guards moving it to the location to check what's wrong)
>>10895070That's one of the reasons why Thief 2 feels a bit too samey compared to 1. Less functional enemy diversity. Undead is so rare that it's not a factor. Fire elementals aren't around at all. There are no burricks or demons, and even spiders are rare (can KO but can't move body). Most of your enemies are guards and robots. There's a small number of heavily armored guards that can't be blackjacked and a single SCUBA mechanist who can only be taken down with lethal weapons.
>>10895070what about an enemy that can see in the dark but not in the light? there was an enemy in splinter cell pandora tomorrow who had nvgs which turned the game upside-down and i thought that was a cool bit but was used only once in the entire game
>>10894689This is a decent list.
>>10895219How would that work for human guards in Thief? They don't have night vision tech, maybe it could be used in those levels where you run into monsters and it could be some creature that normally lives in caves so it can track you down even when your little gem ui is fully darkened but it is blind anywhere that has light encouraging you to find torches or fire arrows to light up the place.
>>10895070So you want a puzzle game. Pretty much every enemy type in thief can be neutralized in various ways either temporarily or permanently. Robots can be taken out with mines, gas arrows, water arrows, and fire arrows.
>>10895861>So you want a puzzle game.You can put it that way, but if there are many moving elements and some degree of randomness it would feel very dynamic.Some guards are stationary, some are on fixed route, some pick randomly between several pre determined routes and some are driven by events or pure randomness. Hitman games are great at this. They are puzzles, but don't feel like it. It doesn't need to be complicated btw, I'm listing possible elements.
>>10893074Since I am lazy, I was wondering, do your packages have all that's commonly recommended to install with Thief 1 and 2?And if I want to install some other mods, I can just put them over your portable stuff? I refrained from modifying T1 because nu textures fuck up the style of the game.
>>10897730Its not mine, but yeah you can add stuff, I have a reshade and tweaked some stuff on the cam_ext file.
>>10893265Calendra's Cistern didnt really age that well.Also Rocksbourg 1 needs a remake to get rid of the pixel hunt keys, the other two missions are pure kino though.
>>10897504Thief actually does support random patrols, if you have one patrol point linked to more than one other destination point, the AI will randomly choose between them.
>>10865627>female protagonistI can already tell its ludo
>>10897956I like Rocksbourg Part 1 and never finished Part 3 because it seemed like a slog.
What in the hell is this abomination
>>10899253A cut/early design enemy from TDPMore importantly, what is that FM and are you in the Red Room from Twin Peaks?
>dum-dum-dum dum-dum-dum dum-dum-duuuuuuum-num
>>10885280Bloodrayne is fucking trash bro.
>>10899253House of the ArchitectWhy was it cut? Seems just to be a reskin of those mantismen, except not goofy but horrific
>>10899745>Notice there's never any birds around, anymore. Used to be birds.... Singin' in the mornin' an' wake you up. Singin' at night lookin' for girl birds to meet up with. Just don't hear them no more. Kinda sad.it is indeed sad
>I HATE CREEPY NOISES
>>10899730Shame there is no FM made by David Lynch.
>>10902531> David LynchNo weird red room in it, but have you tried Brainchild ?
>someone behind me?
