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Other jacketed wrestling styles welcome.

>IJF World Tour Schedule 2022

February 17-19 - Tel Aviv Grand Slam
March 25-27 - Tbilisi Grand Slam
April 1-3 - Antalya Grand Slam
May 20-22 - Kazan Grand Slam
June 4-6 - Dusseldorf Grand Slam
June 24-26 - Ulaanbaatar Grand Slam
July 8-10 - Budapest Grand Slam
July 15-17 - Zagreb Grand Prix
October 21-23 - Abu Dhabi Grand Slam
November 4-6 - Baku Grand Slam
December 3-4 - Tokyo Grand Slam

>watch: https://www.youtube.com/c/judo

previous thread: >>62177
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Stealing some webms
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>>83945
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>>83946
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>tfw found a decent judo club after moving
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>>83945
don't know if I like this
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>>83992
>closest Judo club is an hour away
rip
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>>83946
Spinning Bird Drop Toss, well-played.
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>>83942
Bros, do you use the classic elbow-down or elbow-up when doing uchi mata? I just cant get it to work in sparring.
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>closest judo club is 1 hour away
Should I do it bros? I’d probably only go twice a week at most if I do.
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>>84349
Go and see if its worth the drive
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>>84348
Your footwork is probably the problem.
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Has anyone read Iatskevich's "Russian Judo"? Is it worth reading?

Because I moved, I can no longer train with my Russian coach, but I want to try to continue self study with that sort of tactical philosophy.
>>
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>>84407
Is this guy a mutt?
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Any foreign bros know of any good non-english educational judo youtube channels with or without english subs? Some korean bro told me about hanpantv which was really helpful. Are there any good websites for downloading those paid instructionals?
>>
>>
Name your favorite throw bros

> Harai Goshi
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>>84645
I watch Ivan Vasylchuk Sambo Academy, Fluid Judo Japan, Koji Komuro and the Kodokan's official channel, they all translate or sub their stuff into english. Can't say I know more. And yes HanpanTV is great. The How to do Uchimata video they did really changed my views on that throw.
>Are there any good websites for downloading those paid instructionals?
Ru tracker has martial arts torrents, most of them are in english
https://rutracker.org/forum/viewforum.php?f=1581
Use a translator if you get lost
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Is there anything like ADCC Submission Wrestling for jacketed styles? I.e. a competition that seeks to unite and test all the jacketed styles against each other with a permissive ruleset? Freestyle Judo maybe?
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>>85227
Tomoe Juji
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>>85227
>Tai Otoshi
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>>85247
>Freestyle Judo maybe?
That's like a dozen people in Kansas City. It's a gigantic meme.
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how dangerous is judo sparring? do you just get slammed over and over?
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>>85349
not dangerous, although minor injuries are common. I've only seen fractures / dislocations every few years.
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What’s the chances the company making and selling a dummy can make me different ones with a custom heights and weights?
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>>85349
one of the founding principles of judo was for the techniques used in randori to be safe and repeatable over and over. that's why joint locks and striking (these are still in the kata) were cut out early on and why the reverse seoi nage was recently banned
so not that dangerous on tatami mats
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>>85349
Practice your ukemi and don’t fight the fall and you’re unlikely to suffer serious injury. If you’re worried about it just tell your partner you’re not ready to take falls yet.
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>>85349
People's legs often get entangled and hurt their knees, and you can't just let your ankles flop when they get thrown. And there are a few techniques where people tend to get hit in the head. There's a reason a lot of professional judoka retire before 35. It's a rough sport.
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>>85349
As long as you don't fight the fall when being thrown, do good ukemi, and avoid randori with people you know to be spazzes, or know enough grip fighting and footwork to shut down dangerous attacks (like tani otoshi when tori is trying to launch himself sideways into uke), then it's pretty safe. Fail to do those things, and your shit will get fucked up to a greater or lesser degree.
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>>85349
>>85599
I say this, and then one guy in our club breaks his fucking leg and one girl has hurt her knee in one practice, so what do I know.
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>>
Had a pretty good randori today; ended up mostly using soto-makikomi and tomoe-nage, since those were the opportunities that presented themselves.

How's everyone else's training been?
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>>86148
somehow I don't think this bothers him much
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>>86148
>>86222
oh yeah? what about THIS?
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>>86287
Are all his belts honorary? Did he actually earn any of them?
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>>86222
it might, he adores judo
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>>86302
He earned his judo belt. I don't know anything about TKD.

>>86222
I think you'd be surprised. He's been seen at IJF events in Russia, and made a point of being at the Judo competition in London at least. It's a big part of his life, and I would be upset if I got kicked off some board of a sport I care about because of a bunch of gay Americans that don't.
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>>86345
Hopefully his countrymen starving to death will distract him from missing out on the international judo scene.
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>>86302
He was a KGB agent so there’s a good chance the Manlet knows how to fight
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>>86345
he wrote a book about judo too
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What made 90s judo so exciting to watch? Was it just generational talents like Koga
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>>86291
>>86417
appreciate what you do, webm anon
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Is it possible for an extremely small man (5’9”) to defend himself with judo?
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>>86452
no it only works if you're 200 cm, which is why it's popular in asia
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How frequently should you look to train Judo? I want to do Judo again but I work shifts at work which sadly means I can't commit to lessons consistently. Sadly I am thinking of just taking up boxing which is 24/7 near me and would mean I can at least consistently do a combat sport.
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>>86872
at least 2 times a week and maybe squeeze in an open mat if you can
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>>86877
Sadly I think I'd be able to do maybe 3x a week one week and then not be able to attend any sessions the week after as I'd be on late shifts and working through the nights.
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>>86878
maybe that's ok, you'll have a week to recover but you'll be paying to attend half the month.
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>>86880
Hmmm, I may just go with the boxing then because at least I can actually commit to that. I can try to pick up Judo when I change work.
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2 newfag questions
1. best gi for a poorfag (trying not go over $150 if i can avoid it)
2. will a school that emphasizes self defense/combat judo still teach leg attacks
thanks bros
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>>86919
>1. best gi for a poorfag (trying not go over $150 if i can avoid it)
Fuji double weave or Euro Comp; get one in white, one in blue and never think about gis again.

>2. will a school that emphasizes self defense/combat judo still teach leg attacks
Sport clubs (which is to say most) tend to teach like kata-guruma, te-guruma, and maybe some sneaky knee/ankle pick stuff because those were more successful in competition back in the day.
>>
>>86919
In order,
>Fuji double weave
>maybe
I can’t really answer the second one without knowing the school, but I will say that even my predominantly competition focused school does still occasionally work le forbidden jujutsus
>>
Since gis are in some sense made to imitate street clothes, I wonder what jacket grappling with a hoodie and no belt as the competition uniform would differ
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>>86992
>I wonder what jacket grappling with a hoodie and no belt as the competition uniform would differ

There are European jacket wrestling traditions where they wear a jacket with no belt. Probably be similar to those.

webm unrelated
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>>87350
threw himself off balance with that ouchi
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>>86411
>>86345
Pretty sure his judo belt is honorary, and he only "co-authored" i.e put his name on the book cover

I hope he nukes the US and all NATO countries and conquers the world though
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In a street fight, is morote gari the safest option? The execution doesn't require precision and it's easy to learn.
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>>87713
>In a street fight, is morote gari the safest option?
don't about safest but probably the most efficient
>The execution doesn't require precision
disagree
>it's easy to learn
agreed
i would nominate osoto-gari as being the "safest" in a street fight
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I'm a newfag and got an abdominal strain last friday. I had difficulty sleeping due to the pain on the first day, but now it is a lot better and only hurts if I activate the muscle. How long do I need to rest? Feeling really bummed because I was just getting into it
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>>87713
Yes, look at early UFCs. Nobody did actual wrestling shoots, everyone did morote gari (ie. not going down on one knee to shoot but simply tackling and pulling with the hands and pushing with the head like a blast double). Look up old vale tudo tutorials by Marco Ruas or the Gracies on YT.

BTW morote gari doesn't come from wrestling but Yoshin Ryu. The vale tudo variant comes from renaissance wrestling, the technique is described in several martial arts manuals of the 17th and 18th century (It was described as a typically English technique btw).
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>>87991
Are you sure its not a hernia?
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>>88018
I don't feel any lumps, tenderness, holes in the musculature, nausia, constipation, etc.
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How do we change the newaza rules to discourage passive turtling?
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Post your workout routines please judofriends.
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>>88141
>How do we change the newaza rules to discourage passive turtling?
Almost impossible to do unless you outright ban the position, because of how strong it is under the judo rules. A proposal:

From newaza, to restart the match standing up you need:
1. Both judoka to get disengaged.
2. Newaza stalling without progression when no judoka has an advantageous position (like in guard, half-guard).
3. When the judoka on a superior position stalls and don't try upgrading his own position.

Turtle should be considered a disadvantageous position, so unless the judoka on top disengage voluntarily or he himself stalls, the newaza continues. If the judoka on the bottom keeps himself turtling, the time keeps going on as long as the one on top is actively trying to find a way to progress his game.

How does it change from current rules?
1. If the judoka on top is losing on points and he sees he will not break this position, he can disengage and restart the match to avoid losing time.
2. If the judoka on top is winning on points, basically the match will end unless the judoka on the bottom tries changing position.

This change in ruleset just takes the advantages of turtling unless you are winning and on top.
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Do you guys have good suggestions for MMA fighters or no-gi grapplers/wrestlers with great judo? Think Justin Flores type-stuff.
Craig Jones has been incorporating some cool stuff, so have the Ruotolo twins. I'd love to watch more but I don't train in the gi anymore (BJJ)
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>>88634
yan and valentina shevchenko
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>>88634
Yoshihiro Akiyama
Shinya Aoki
Michihiro Omigawa
Zabit Magomedsharipov
Karo Parisyan
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>>83942
Ok
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Fuuuuuuuuck! Why is this book sold out?
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>>86420
That and the IJF didn't hamper it with stupid rules like no leg grabs.

If you look at judo footage from the Olympics and World Championships in the 70's, 80's, 90's, and 00's; they were quite explosive and allowed more time for matwork.
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>>89485
The Canon of Judo by Kyuzo Mifune is even better because it incorporates more exposure to groundwork/submissions as well as trips/takedowns.

I'd also highly recommend Isao Okano's Vital Judo: Throwing Techniques book and his Vital Judo: Grappling Techniques book.
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>>86302
Putin was a legit sombo and judo practitioner. He may not be Olympic or World Championship level, but he could definitely hold his own.
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>>85247
I wished there was an integrated rule-set and competition which emulates pre-Olympic/World Championships judo. In the 1920's, leglocks were still being utilized in Japanese competition when guys like Yaichihyoe Kanemitsu and Tsunetane Oda were still exploring and refining groundwork and submissions.

I like a spectacular throw, but that's only half the battle. You land a decisive takedown to the ground? That's only Waza-ari; you have to do a submission or pin (holding it for 30 seconds) to get the full Ippon. So once a throw is achieved, the action continues on the mat until somebody submits to a lock, choke, or pin.
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>>89608
This book is even more sold out!
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>>89616
The IJF has been contemplating newaza-only tournaments; kinda like the old school kosen format. This would be neat since Judo + BJJ + Sombo would be the ultimate combo in jacket grappling.
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>>89685
Newaza tournaments I think would be good fun for recreational players especially. Big throws are rough on some of the older guys. A newaza division would be a lot of fun, and I think there would be good participation.
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>>89685
>This would be neat since Judo + BJJ + Sombo would be the ultimate combo in jacket grappling.
the thing the differentiates these are the rules
>>89704
>Newaza tournaments I think would be good fun for recreational players especially. Big throws are rough on some of the older guys. A newaza division would be a lot of fun, and I think there would be good participation.
newaza
USA judo tried doing it. It's a hard sell for judoka's though
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What kind of exercise regime would you recommend for judo and grappling in general? At the moment I am doing stronglifts 5x5 with some basic accessories alongside running but unsure if there is anything further I can do.
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>>90022
I feel SL is a worse SS, which is itself a worse Starr 5x5. If you're making gains and aren't bored, who am I to tell you what to do.

However, once you stall on the flat 5s, instead of doing basically SS phase 1 as Mehdi suggests, consider something like the Juggernaut Method or Westside for Skinny Bastards. Also, get a WL coach and learn to power clean or power snatch.
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>go to a different club to train with their guys
>we go around teaching lower belts some moves
>I teach young lads my iconic uchi-mata into hane goshi combo
>randori comes
>one of the youngsters lands me on my ass with my own combo

I'm proud
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>>90022
Practicing uchi mata on trees until you run the bark raw and throwing heavy bags around.
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>>90702
based and wholesome
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>>90716
>>90718
webm anon is back!
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judofags be old and shit
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>>87625
Nah he's an actual black belt, his like 8th Dan or whatever is honorary, given for contributing to judo on a political/social scale
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>>91003
Pretty much every high Dan is given for the same reason though. After like 3rd or 4th it’s less about your knowledge and more about what you’ve done for the Judo community.
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>>83942
Isnt that a kani basami? I know it's super low risk since it's clear of the legs but still
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>>86148
This is probably the only thing that has really hit him where it hurts personally for him during the entire Ukraine war so far.
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I think I almost go metoo'd today.
I been doing martial arts (mostly krav maga and bjj) for over 10 years and I started Judo a couple months ago, today at the end of class, one of the girls calls me aside and tells me I'm making her feel really uncomfortable with the amount of physical touch. It's about stuff like clapping her on the shoulder after sparring or stuff and going "nice one", which I do to everyone not just girls. I guess she's right, and she was trying not to make me feel bad about it, she could've easily told it to me in front of everyone I guess, she even said she didn't want me to stop coming or anything, but it made me feel like a fucking creep.
Anyone has had experiences like this?
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>>91123
No, quit groping your gym bros.
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>>91130
That's the weird thing, I don't think I did anything creepy, at least nothing intentional. I guess I'll just be extremely careful around this girl.
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>>91136
or don't just launch the fucking bitch every time you do randori together, don't be a wimp. Hurt her really bad
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>>91144
Good advice. She’s already accused you of being the gym sperg, punish her by leaning into the spergery
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Judobros, is 23 too late to start? I really wanna practice and compete
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>>91326
>Judobros, is 23 too late to start?
no
>I really wanna practice and compete
you can do this, just have the expectation you're not going to be a world class athlete
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>tfw like Georgian grip stuff, but two coaches say my morote-seoi nage looks good
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>>91326
I went to a judo gym for a bit and there were guys there who started at 40 and had been doing it for 10-15 years. Yeah they werent gold medalists, but they were still very skilled grapplers
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>>91326
23 isn't too late to do anything. Jesus Christ.
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>>91375

Start. I started later than that, now I'm a shodan and one of the main instructors for the club. Get going dude.
>>
How did (You) find your tokui-waza? Or did your tokui-waza find (You)?
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>>91482
its been 10 fucking years and I still haven't found it
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>>89728
Speaking of newaza, these interview from judo legend Isao Okano (who contributed greatly to BJJ via his student Osvaldo Alves) really sheds light on what competitive judo needs to address:

http://www.judo-voj.com/contents/okano.html

>Newaza are essential to judo. Gaining skill in Newaza depends on how you use your legs and requires hard training in using all four limbs, both arms and both legs. Many of today’s judo athletes don’t know of these fundamentals.
>When you watch Newaza in matches these days, you find a tendency to lie face down on the mat waiting for the referee to help you out with a “Mate” call. With tactics like this, Newaza are as good as dead. Turning your back on your opponent means getting attacked from behind, and that kind of tactic has no place in the martial arts. You have to lie face up and spar. Shouldn’t they be considering laying penalties on athletes so passive as to lie face down waiting for help from the referee? That would be one way to get Newaza back to the position it deserves.
>There are also problems with the referees. Referees don’t know enough about the process of Newaza, so they have a strong tendency to make the two opponents return prematurely to their feet. If they had a good knowledge of the unfolding process involved in attacking and defending in Newaza, they would know whether it’s coming to a standstill or not. There are all too many referees who don’t know much about it, or who have only shallow experience. There’s a need to stop giving refereeing positions to people like that. While on referees, to make another point, it’s really regrettable how many times in international matches you find techniques unqualified as Ippon being declared, nevertheless, as Ippon. There is a clear need for the training and drilling of referees.

The IJF needs to address the decline of newaza standards. When you see footage from the 1950's to the 1980s, there was quite a bit of impressive guards and sweeps.
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>>91765
This is from 2 reddit threads that translated an interview from Okano about the current state of Judo and what needs to be addressed about newaza. I can't find the original Japanese source, but the interview definitely aligns with the interview I linked above.

https://www.reddit.com/r/judo/comments/8jf59q/isao_okano_current_judo_will_not_produce_judo/
https://www.reddit.com/r/bjj/comments/8jjp02/judo_legend_and_big_contributor_of_bjj_isao_okano/

>Okano: There are not many people, even among coaches, who have their own special technique. A player with his own special technique is fun to watch out for (when will he use it?) but nowadays there are few like that, so it’s very disappointing.
>Very few, even coaches, can do newaza. Recntly, Jiu Jitsu is very popular in U.S., and I was wondering what is Jiu Jitsu because what they’re doing is judo’s newaza. Jiu jitsu is largely an imitation of judo and they bring sambo technique like a knee-lock or leg-lock. The level was lower than judo’s newaza, but they are practicing only newaza and become better. Even imitation becomes better which grows confidence.

>I have a friend who has a dojo in Brasil and some Japanese judoka went and my friend said to me: “My dojo is not high level Jiu Jitsu but my students beat Japanese judoka easily.” I was so surprised that Japanese judoka were so weak in newaza. I believe it is so because the coach doesn’t teach newaza in Japan. In America, judoka say that in order to win over Japanese judoka, you should go to newaza.
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>>91766
>Interviewer: Is that so? As soon as possible, they have to make an effort to do newaza. Is there a good training way to become strong?

>Okano: In order to make a strong newaza, why doesn’t Japan put on an All-Japan Newaza tournament? You have to do that, or Japan’s newaza will get weaker and weaker. In other words, the player who doesn’t have confidence in newaza will have less chance to win. If in gripping time an opponent puts their knee on the mat, the player with good newaza will always have an advantage. Currently the problems with gi or rules it is hard get your grip for tachiwaza. Most people can be very competent newaza in two years. However, if you start newaza before tachiwaza, then your tachiwaza will not get strong and you will not have confidence in tachiwaza. This is why when you have some confidence in tachiwaza, you should then start newaza. Some people say in order to develop good newaza, one idea is to do newaza match. You start tachiwaza, but even the person who throws, there is no point until newaza starts. I think this is a good idea for practice to develop newaza.

Just like how Judoka studied Sambo in the 80's and 90's because of their distinct and unorthodox grips and pick-ups that aren't typically found in the Olympics and World Championships, there's definitely going to be more rediscovery and emphasis in newaza. Judoka used to compete and win in international Sambo tournaments like Nobuyuki Sato, Katushiko Kashiwazaki (great practitioner of newaza), Kaneo Iwatsuri, and Chris Dolman (who only trained in judo and wrestling when he competed and won gold in his first tournament). So there's definitely hope out there.
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>>91768
>>91766
>>91765
Kosei Inoue had the national team train in BJJ as well as Okinawan sumo so they definitely know what Judo needs to do. Yasuhiro Yamashita is forging strong ties with Sambo since even he noted that Japanese judoka gained a lot from sambo competition.
>>
I started doing judo a few weeks ago, going twice a week. I'm just doing this to lose some weight and have more fun than just going to the gym.
I'm a fat fuck, weighing in at 240 pounds, and I've realized that I need to do more regular exercize so that my body is used to the intensity of judo, and so that I actually have the strength to move people my own size.
What are some good exercizes to build up my strength? I know I'm going to be the class punching bag for some time but I'm prepared for that. I'm not expecting quick results.
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>>91848
things that work your posterior chain (deadlifts, rows, and cable pull downs), squats to help out your knees, a type of over head press to help out your shoulders
>>
gonna start judo in the summer, how much do you think I could learn in just a few months? How long would you say you'd have to train to be ready for a competition?
>>
How do you do, fellow judoka? I've been itching to know, how do we train our hands in our sport, which we all practice?
>>
Which weight class should I be in if I am 176 cm and want to be the strongest judoka ever.
I currently weigh 79-80 kg and I'm pretty fucking shredded (almost bodybuilding level) considering I also used oral steroids.
>>
>>87713
its called a double-leg among non autists
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>>92631
Where do you think we are?
>>
>>87713
i don't like doubles and singles because there is a risk of being headlocked or kicked/punched in the head compared to judo throws
>>
how to make osoto gari work on my bjj friend who is stiff arming me and acting very defensive when we do standing sparring? usually i can't land any judo throws on him and end up doing arm drags and takedowns from the back. i'm quite new to judo, started training it 2 months ago
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>>93199
Why would you do osotogari when his body weight is forward? You fool! Apply the principles of judo!
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>>93199
Hug him tight and consider doing kosto gake instead. If you must do osoto make his momentum go forward and then hug him tight and do it
>>
Why does Russian judo have a reputation of being particularly dangerous when their men's team hasn't been that good in a decade - the French men do better, even without Teddy.
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>>93199
let me guess, its the stiff arm + hunch over combo?
Assuming right vs right, someone stiff arming makes it easy to break grips so this should be your first priority; if he has no grips on you his defense will be alot weaker and he wont be able to attack at all. use your left hand to grab his right sleeve very close to his hand and yank his right hand away from your lapel.
Next, get a dominant grip and position, instead of having your right hand gripping his lapel close to his chest, grab much higher in the back of his collar, like the back of the neck, then apply pressure downwards to keep him hunched.
you should now have his right arm not gripping anything controlled by your left hand and his upper body controlled by your right hand on the collar. i personally wouldnt recommend an osotogari in this position since youre in a completely dominant position, i think whats more natural, especially with him hunched over would be a tai otoshi, koshi guruma, harai goshi, uchimata, or a simple snapdown to get back control.
if youre deadset on osotogari, then slowly inch to your left so youre on his right side, then take a left step, do your kuzushi, and finish the osotogari. Best part of collar dominant grip is that its so hard to get countered by an osoto with that grip since collar grip gives full control of his torso, while all he has is his left arm holding your right sleeve.
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>>87713
as someone who wrestled in HS, i personally dont think a double leg is that easy to get. its simple but so is the defense of sprawling, and making space between your legs and his arms. maybe i suck at it but I've never hit a double leg successfully during sparring or competitions despite it being the one technique i always practice, single legs from a russian tie is so much easier to get. I also rarely see highschoolers successfully get a double leg, and one of my go to in a spar (which is scummy) is to just wait for someone to double leg before i sprawl and get back control. which brings the second shit part about it, failing a double leg means youre on the ground with the guy on top of you, or youre in his guard getting headlocked.

for a judoka i think whats safest is to get into a super close clinch where youre comfortable and where his strikes wont be as effective, do some close range muay thai knees to the body or elbows and punches to the face to disorient and double as a kuzushi, then go into osotogari then kesagatame, from kesa you can go for an armbar or americana with your legs on his arm, or you can use your left hand to rain hammer fists and punches to his face.

easier said than done though, and if he has a knife youre fucked.
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>>93274
Like you said, they weren't as dominate as before but they still medal in Grand Slams / Prix, though for guys these tend to be the heavier weight categories. Also there are more regions with "dangerous" judo like Mongolia, Korea, Georgia etc and Japan obviously being number 1.
>>
Why is standing ippon seoi nage easier than morote?
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>>94276
Everyone goes: I am a genius. I would never fall for that.
Then they go: oh no I've been bamboozled. How could this happen to me.
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>>94276
because most beginners cant figure out the kuzushi required to pull off a morote. standing ippon also just requires your right arm to wrap around the other persons right arm, while for morote you need to get your elbow underneath his right arm while still holding on to his lapel. people either dont have the elbow flexibility or the technical skill to pull it off. Its just a harder technique to pull off similar to tsurikomi goshi
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>>94372
Conversely drop morote seems easier than drop ippon to most people in my experience. It's just kinda weird to me.

>elbow flexibility
I think it's more in the wrist. If you grip hard with your tsurite, it's a lot harder to swing your elbow under.
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>>94394
im personally not a fan of drop down techniques philosophically even if theyre easier to get since your putting your entire body weight. i think in terms of self defense standing techniques hit harder and are more useful to practice. The "solution" my judo club came up with for the wrist flexibility issue was to hold the lapel lower than usual
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>>83942
Beginner who just took their first class here. Any tips or general advice? Thanks in advance judo-bros.
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>>94937
Practice your break falls at home. Do your break falls during tandoori. Don’t fucking reach for the ground when you fall.
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>>94937
unless youre aiming for the olympics, do lots of randori but dont randori too hard. thats a mistake i made. theres always tomorrow, but a concussion/tendon injury lasts a long time and is counterproductive for training.
Dont spazz out, tell your partner to not slam you and trust in your ability to breakfall. most slams happen because of persistent defence on the uke and the tori using strength to finish the throw.
Also, if youre throwing, try not to force the throw, and keep their heads from touching the ground with your tsurite if you do throw them. keeping the heads off the ground will mess up their breakfall form but it beats risking a concussion; throw as gently as you can - not only does it improve technique but its safer for whoever you are throwing. when you want to kill someone, you can always use more force.
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>>94937
>>95051
oh and i forgot, dont be averse to sparing with girls. it will teach you to relax in randori, and is a great opportunity to practice some of the more timing based and elegant throws since the risk of injury is lower when you spar chicks. also great to practice counters since alot of women cant do the kuzushi right: they lack the technique or upper body strength to do it.

i mention these as advice but i honestly need to practice taking it easy as well. im personally too hotheaded when i spar, especially if im sparring with the boys.
>t. yellowbelt
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>>95051
>>95053
Very good advice anon. Thanks.
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>>
after almost 18 months of meaning to do it, I am officially starting judo on thursday :))
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>>95091
nice
make sure the dojo you go to doesn't make you wait 4 months before you start at least light randori (sparring). if you go 3 times a week, you should be able to randori within 1-2 months depending on how fast you learn to breakfall.
and take it easy, judo is harsh sport on the body if youre reckless
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>>95091
let us know how your first session goes
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>>94942
tandoori = randori? Also I have hardwood floor so I'm not sure how to practice at home without breaking my shit.

>>95051
>>95053
I'll try to trust my breakfall ability. seems scary at first, but i'll try my best. Thank you based yellowbelt anon. I hope I know as much as you when I get to yellow.
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>>95432
I was phone posting at the time yes I meant randori. Don’t bring chicken tandoori to the mats.
>Also I have hardwood floor so I'm not sure how to practice at home without breaking my shit.
Big yoga ball. That is the answer. Also you can roll from side to side to practice your side break falls or do your front break falls from your knees.

Other advice, don’t ask questions here, ask your coach. Looking at the responses most of the people here have less than a years worth of experience. Why a yellow belt, which can be obtained in less than six months, feels compelled to answer questions is beyond me. I don’t want to discourage anyone from the sport or pull rank but these are questions for your coaches who have the training hours and tournament experience to know what you need to be doing and what you shouldn’t worry about yet.

You probably won’t listen to though, and I won’t judge you for it. God knows I didn’t.
>t. Actual judo brown belt
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>>95432
Just have fun. It's a fun weird sport, and you'll quickly find yourself becoming physically capable of things you never thought you could do before - like an uchimata.
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>>95246
i wonder what the statistics are for sankaku
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>>85360
>seoi nage banned
isn't that like, one of the best throws in judo? is that just in olympic judo?
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>>96298
he means a variation of it called reverse seoi nage
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>>96304
that's still a shame, Im gonna drop some weight and scout the local area for judo gyms: should I ask if they do these types of moves typically banned in comp/olympic judo?
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>>96307
i guess i should have clarified in my post, yeah it was a ban for competition/olympic judo
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>>84348
>>84366
What he said, and also you might be aiming for the wrong leg. You're supposed to straddle them on the tree trunk of your leg and roll them off (classically).
I like his explanation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnMoNfZ2WiU
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>>85227
>Yama Arashi

Just kidding just kidding!
>O guruma
But I lift them up with my leg, sensei said it's an old old variation but we can't find the name.
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>>86885
They blend well together, so take one at a time.
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>>90840
Aww my heart.
>>
>>
>>
Man I really want to do this sport but all the gyms near me are ridiculously expensive.
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Man I really want to start Judo again but I work shifts and would only be able to do a few sessions a month as a result. Very few judo clubs are 24/7.
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>>85227
O goshi or ouchi gari
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>>85311
Based
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>>87619
The form and balance is ludicrous, also wtf was that deashi
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>>91136
I do the same when I have good randori and never had a problem, maybe I should think twice before complimenting others? I might ad that I'm completely devoid of sexual desire or anything related when inside the tatami which in turn makes me blind to such stuff I guess
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>>85227
Sasae-tsurikomi-ashi or morote-seoi-nage
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>>91123
don't spar with any girl who isn't a black belt. they always have a problem with something.
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>>85227
osoto gaeshi
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>>98399
Fuck, I was about to argue but then I started thinking about it and it's true, 70% of the girls I sparred seemed to indeed have a problem (My ex, even when we where together, a friend of hers, and another dumb one) the only ones who where cool is another girl from my dojo and a black belt who occasionally comes, wtf is wrong with woman man?
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>>98453
They are in an element that is not compliment to their existence.
I would advise you from my experience to change your persona, gradually. You don't want to change to drastically or they'll freak out.
Start by implementing the sempai-kohai relationship. Take the initiative as a serious judoka, keep your confidence, and don't smile too often. Don't be a hard ass, but present yourself with a more serious tone, focus on judo, not on the girl.
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>>98921
That's the thing I couldn't give less of a fuck about woman or wtvr, on the tatami I can only think on judo, anyway, thanks for the advice
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Im looking to get into judo but im slightly unfit so im gonna start going to the gym this week also, are there any good workouts to do at the gym for judo along with a standard strength routine?
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>>99060
Single arm rows, single leg stuff in general, power cleans - or heavy db cleans if you can't do olys/don't have someone to teach you. If they have bands, you could do some band uchikomi
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I didn’t realise this board had existed or had martial arts, so two questions.

1. I’m sorta worried my coach is rushing me through belts. I started just under a year ago and only train once a week, but he wants to put me up to orange belt next week. He is a 6th Dan and he obviously knows his shit, but I can probably only name 4-5 of the 8 throws I needed for yellow belt, and probably only know 12 judo throws I can think of, let alone 16.


2. I can only train at the judo gym once a week because I teach BJJ at another gym 5 nights a week, so I can’t make any of the other judo classes, is there anything specific I can practice with my mat space to try and make up for the lost time? I do try and do the foot sweep think where you keep only the side of the foot sliding along the ground, and one of the guys showed me about wrapping your belt around a pole and you practice the kuzushi (the balance break part) and the entry and try and not let the belt go loose to practice moving in while continuing to pull them, is there anything else like that?
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>>99092
When I was coming up throw color belts it took roughly 3 months for my yellow then 6 for my orange. It gets progressively longer as you get higher up. Don’t worry about those belts. The only ones that matter are the jump from orange to green and brown to black since those change what level you compete at. Also I just looked at your other post, if you’re teaching bjj you probably know more Judo than you realize even if you don’t know the names of techniques.

Aside from making sure you’re doing standup during sparring? Make your students pull out crash pads and do throws for 10 minutes every so often. Practice your osoto Gari by putting a hand on the wall and going all the way through the reaping motion. If you have some extra cash, buy a grappling dummy, then practice picking it up and tossing it around. Good for both strength training and throwing practice.
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>>99096
Oh I assumed all judo competitions were open-grade (I've never competed in judo) so I didn't realise there were those milestones, that makes me feel not so bad about not feeling deserving of an orange belt.

The gym I teach it is more of a hobbyist gym aside from our competition MMA guys, so we don't really have crash mats, though I do practice on the MMA guys I teach but obviously they're more looking for the nogi and wrestling style stuff, but stuff like that osoto gari drill is definitely something I can try.

I think I sort of get what you mean about the knowledge transferring over. My first BJJ coach for my first 8 years was a greco-roman wrestler and I trained with him pretty seriously so I understand some of the movements behind a couple of throws and grips, and my next 5 years was at a heavy competition-focused gym so they did a lot more freestyle takedowns. I guess I was more worried about the grading because I felt like my coach might've been moving me up more based on the randori because I was able to throw the competition black belts (though nowhere near as much as they throw me) but they were mostly with hip throws (I don't know the name of those ones) and uranages which are things I was already familiar with from wrestling, rather than learning the actual techniques, because I still struggle with what are supposed to be easy techniques like the inside leg reap where you step in and behind the foot while staying square one with them (I think it's kouichi gari)? I do really enjoy uchi mata and osoto gari though and feel like I can use them well compared to when I started.
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>>99103
Ko-uchigari and O-uchigari are absolutely not easy techniques for most people. Don’t worry about it so much. Most everyone practices for awhile feeling like they’re making no progress then one day out of nowhere suddenly everything starts clicking together. Im almost certain you had the same experience when you were first learning jiujitsu. Remember that.
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>>84349
agree w/ >>84352 . and hold off on becoming a member til u've made up ur mind after a few classes, so u're not tied down if u find out the school is not to ur liking after already having signed up.

i've been going to a kung fu school that's also 1 hour away so i can train in sanda for a month now, and while the sanda classes are great, just about everything else is subpar, and the instructors' vision on martial arts and self-defense couldn't be more opposite to mine. plus i don't jive well w/ the ppl there, even the instructors. i joined well into the season which has kept me from signing up, but i'm glad i didn't cuz i'll be training there for the last time this weekend, and continue my search for a good school that gets me the results i want and where i feel at home.

i recommend u take the same approach, my friend. it's judo so it should be good but tread w/ caution regardless, especially if u live in america.
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>>99106
Ko-uchi gari is hard as fuck, the timing is so fucking strict. Actually I only use it as a finisher in the o-uchi ko-uchi chain
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>>85227
Onatogashimatag-wo-toro-da-nei
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How can I tell if a judo club is legitimate or not? They do contests with the ATJA and AJJF but I don’t know anything about Judo federations in the US. I’m going to do a trial lesson and see how it goes.
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>>99103
>>99106
>>99214
Yo, why do jap TMA always insist on using japanese terms instead of just transliterating it to whatever language they are speaking? is it a mysticism thing, a pride thing, or just being obtuse?

IDK, just seems unneccisary to me.
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newfag question - can i expect decent results from 2-3x a week judo training? (1.5hr lessons)
I'll be doing weightlifting 3x a week on top of that and have muay thai 2x a week.
So far i feel fine recovery-wise (but only had judo once a week)
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>>99555
yes, ideally 3 times a week
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>>99548
Because they tried that with Ed Parker and American kenpo but it sounded gay. Let me pretend to be a samurai you fucking cunt.
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>>99540
Judo has national and international governing bodies. If they’re a part of their respective organization it’s almost assuredly legit. I’ve never even heard of a fake judo dojo. It’s not popular enough for bullshitters to try that shit
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Does anyone have gi recommendations? Preferably 100% cotton with no branding
>>99576
Okay I messaged them and asked about a trial class, I start my 2 trial weeks on the 19th
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>>99574
maybe transliterate is the wrong word. but why not just use frank speak like leg sweep or something?
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>>99740
It’s just how judo culture is and as far as I know every country in the world still uses the Japanese terminology most of the time. I like it tho so fuk off
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>>99555
depends on how much randori youre doing. if youre doing it every session then yeah it should be good enough. Randori is straight up the fastest way to improve, both as a judoka and in self defense, but its also dangerous if you're stupid, and most people are stupid, me included.
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>>99548
i think its purely autistic tradition, but i like it, it makes it so that you can speak across different languages and understand judo across cultures. i don't need to understand the english translation of osotogari to know what throw someone is doing. but if someone mentions a wrestling term like an arm throw it could mean alot of different things depending on where you are.
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>>99548
It makes it easier to be a global sport if everything has the same name. I could go to France or Vietnam or anywhere to a judo club and basically do a class there without knowing the language because they all use the Japanese terms. The only people that don’t are the Koreans coz they’re still butthurt about a little fun years ago.
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>>100197
Why do they even do judo? Just steal all the moves and pretend you invented it like they did with kendo.
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*freeze frame*
yep, that's me
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>>99607
Fuji or Adidas
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>>91814
Didn't the sambo guys introduce the flying armbar?
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>>95074
Does this pin have a japanese name?
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What runs should I be doing to have better cardio for judo?
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>>100412
find someone willing to randori with you for awhile
find a gym that does the 12x5min rounds of randori, which is what japenese colleges do
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>>100412
are you out of shape?
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>>100414
Cardio is a deficiency, and running a couple times a week seems like a good thing to do outside of the gym to fix it.
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>when someone defends the leg grab ban
>when someone insists Judo is only a sport and not a fighting style
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>>100481
I hate the ijf so much bros.

Ostensibly the leg grab van was to prevent people from diving for the legs to stall for time, but it would have made way more sense to just ban that specific practice than to ban all leg throws.

Nevermind the he fact that even at the international level judging is so fucking shit. The other day we were watching a shohei inouie throw and in his osoto montage there’s one throw where the judge scores it opposite. Initially, the. Continues the match like he didn’t and waits until he’s pinned him for 20 seconds before ending it. I genuinely don’t understand how the highest level of this sports administration can be so fucking bad at it. Even HEMA which is making it up half the time does a better time of running their sport.
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>>100481
Judo being a sport is somewhat good in that it makes it safe (but ironically more effective because you can train harder and more often which is what bjj and wrestling did). but yeah within that sport you should focus so that winning a sport match translates to winning a fight.
but leg grab ban is the most retarded shit ever and actively makes judo a worse martial arts. This shit is why people started shitting on judo and claiming that wrestling and bjj is better. which it currently is because judokas dont practice takedown and takedown defense anymore.
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>>100493
I think theres just too many rules, and judging is actually hard since alot of throws require full body weight against the pros, so its actually difficult to judge an ippon when someones doing a massive sacrifice throw that is sloppy and then end up at bottom position even if they got the throw.

I dont know how well this will work as a solution, but i propose that for unclear throws (i.e. head diving, sloppy throw to a scramble, etc.) it shouldnt even count as a ippon or waza ari and judokas should fight in newaza for a pin or submission. naturally, most of the time the initiator of the sloppy throw will get top advantage, but not necessarily. this kills two birds with one stone: it will bring more newaza into judo and make judging alot easier with sloppy throws, all this while rewarding being aggressive because doing throws even if sloppy will usually give you top position

another thing i would change is purely defensive newaza but isnt a pin like turtling or guard, which i think is not ideal in an actual fight (guard) and may be completely horrible (turtle). if youre in those positions after being stood up after say 15 seconds of newaza with no progress, then your opponent should get 0.5 points. i think this would force guard players to actually go for reversals and submissions and will destroy turtling because turtling has almost 0 counterattacking options.

your martial arts is shaped by the competition ruleset, so if your ruleset is shit your MA is going to become shit.
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>>88605
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>>100481
I don't care for the leg grab ban and the IJF sucks balls.

Having said that, it seems the most vocal opponents of the leg grab ban are people who've never done judo before.
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>>100611
>bjj is better. which it currently is because judokas dont practice takedown and takedown defense anymore.
Idk what you mean by "better" but you can make a similar argument that gi bjj doesn't practice stand up as much therefore judo is "better". It's a dumb argument either way.
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>>100622
better as in you can do judo in a bjj/wrestling match but you cant do bjj/wrestling in a judo match. generally, the less restrictive a sport the more closely it emulates a real fight, with clear exceptions like guard pulling, which is possible largely because competitions dont happen in concrete floors for obvious reasons. Im not shitting on judo. i fucking love it, but the leg grab ban (or say the reverse seoi ban) is stupid and just makes judo worse by putting unnecessary restrictions on technique. Theres other things that you can penalize or do to deal with passivity or a dangerous technique.
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>>100622
>>100658
Admittedly I do beej more than judo so I might be biased, but at the buttscoot meta in BJJ was something that occurred because grapplers started doing it, rather than it being enforced by a governing body. None of my students pull guard because I teach them takedowns quite often, but the BJJ rules allow them to pull guard or go for just about whatever takedown they wish.

With that being said, I do appreciate the leg grabs because it means I can use throws without fear in judo, but I also get to attack the legs in every other class with BJJ as well so I can have a well-rounded game. I couldn't imagine only doing one or the other.
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>>100697
>With that being said, I do appreciate the leg grabs
I mean leg grab ban
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>>100658
>>100697
>better as in you can do judo in a bjj/wrestling match but you cant do bjj/wrestling in a judo match
You can. In either case, you most likely won't win.
>generally, the less restrictive a sport the more closely it emulates a real fight
That's part of what makes an art good for "the streets" but there are many other factors that contribute to "street effectiveness" (never mind all wrestling arts have the important restriction of no strikes). For example, freestyle and sambo are more restrictive than bjj but I would say they are better arts for self defense than bjj. Anyway, my main issue with your statement is that I don't believe the leg grab ban and the way judo is taught today makes it significantly worse for self defense than bjj, both are pretty much equivalent for that imo.

I have mixed feelings about the leg grab ban for competition but dislike how it effected the pedagogy of judo (i believe kata-guruma should be an essential nage-waza taught and practiced). In an ideal world, competition judo is separate from how it's taught. Hopefully a solution is found because all the guys that competed pre-leg grab ban era are getting kind old kek.
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>>100612
>I think theres just too many rules, and judging is actually hard since alot of throws require full body weight against the pros, so its actually difficult to judge an ippon when someones doing a massive sacrifice throw that is sloppy and then end up at bottom position even if they got the throw.
And with the leg grab, sure you could enforce "false attack" shido, but that gets really subjective.
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>>100712
If you watch or do Sambo, jacket grips + jigotai stuffs a lot of wrestling-style shots. What you see is more like kata-guruma, or using a leg grab to finish a trip. These should be in judo, and I think the difference in scoring and penalty systems makes them a nonissue within the existing sambo false-attack rules.
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>>100697
>i can use throws without fear in judo
well thats the thing. im of the philosophy that judo should evolve so that it mostly keeps and practices what works against the highest level grapplers. if some judo throws wont work because people can hook your legs or catch your back, then we should develop variations of those throws that is high percentage even in cases where uke defends with every tool in his disposal.
I also think that judo shouldnt shy away from grappling techniques that are not part of traditional repertoire, they should steal them and own them by adding their own "judo" twist to it.
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>>100720
I think the 1990s rules struck the best balance. If we want to RETVRN TO TRADITION and bring back leg grabs, I think we need to look at what rules changes and meta evolutions led to the the 2000s shoot-and-stall.
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>>100718
>If you watch or do Sambo, jacket grips + jigotai stuffs a lot of wrestling-style shots
Exactly, you only have a few seconds to do that or else grips are going to be established. In sambo specifically, it's sort of risky to do a double leg, the belt make it easy to counter, though i've seen "attempts" near the end of matches to waste time if the other person is ahead.
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>well thats the thing. im of the philosophy that judo should evolve so that it mostly keeps and practices what works against the highest level grapplers.
Put a judogi on a high level greco guy and judo throws works just fine against him.
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>>100729
To be honest, I think judo's specialty is foot techniques. If anything, judo has more to learn from the greco guys about upper body throwing than greco guys can learn from judo.
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>>100729
whoops i didn't quote >>100720
>>100734
Meant to reply to that guy >>100734
Anyway, my original point is that judo throws will work just fine against a high level greco guy if you put a judogi on him, even if the judo guy doesn't use ashi-waza.
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>>100724
i would be down with this.

i think a decent solution is to lose 0.5 points if youre turtling or defensive in bottom position after a referee standup. it would not only destroy shoot and stall but also alot of false attacks because the defender would just have to collapse on top of you and you would lose points for being shit at attacking.
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>>100806
A penalty that's below a shido could do it. Alternatively, maybe put the onus on the turtle player to get out of the newaza exchange. If the top player is working the back take to strangle a passive turtle player, the ref shouldn't call mate. If the top player can't get his hooks in, and the bottom player is trying actively defend by coming up to a single or doing a granby roll, and it's stalemated - then a mate would be appropriate. It seems as though vs older players, while the state of guard play has improved, the turtle has become much more passive.
>>
What should I do if I can't afford to go to a judo/jiu-jitsu school and I don't have a car? I go to a local gym to work out and that's about it.
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>>100837
Get a job or beg them to let you train for free? You can try and replicate movements, but there’s no substitution for a living partner and coach, especially as a beginner. You MAY be able to get away with it for a bit if you’re good enough to coach others.
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>>100837
get together w/ friends and practice grappling by rough housing. that's kinda how catch wrestling was born, if i'm not mistaken, which influenced bjj a great deal.
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>>100865
> get together w/ friends and practice grappling by rough housing. that's kinda how catch wrestling was born,
That is absolutely not how catch wrestling was born unless you’re talking about prehistoric peoples.
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>>100865
>which influenced bjj a great deal

You probably could’ve chosen just about any grappling style except BJJ (or Judo) and been correct, but BJJ is a direct offshoot of Judo and catch had basically died out before BJJ got big, not giving it a chance to influence it.
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>>100837
You shouldn't do martial arts if you're too poor for judo, which is often one of the cheapest.
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>>100481
Good.
Because without it it would literally just be catch wrestling.
Yes, I know I'm based.
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>>99841
I can respect that. But it just seems a little tryhard to me and has a sense of mystique instead of straightforwardness.
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Guys, I would appreciate some help. I used to love doing Judo and I need to do a combat sport again for exercise and my mental health. I would love to do Judo again but sadly I work shifts and, unfortunately there are no Judo clubs near me that offer club session that fit around my shifts. This would mean I would only be able to go to Judo about 2 weeks in 4 for every month, possibly going to 2 sessions a week (for the weeks I could make it). Do you think it is worth paying for Judo when I can barely make sessions and would barely be able to progress in training.

Alternatively I am looking at doing boxing, which I also used to do and enjoy. The only thing is I don't think I would ever want to compete in boxing again but I enjoy the art of it.

Sadly moving jobs isn't really an option for me as the job I have is very good.
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>>101040
My two cents is that if possible, Id negotiate with the people in charge with the sessions and ask if you can pay for a "half subscription" or whatever, telling you will only be there for some of the sessions due to work. They should probably be flexible.

And yes, I would recommend boxing because its a whole hell of a lot easier to practice by yourself with shadow boxing even giving a good work out. In my experience (at least where I am, boxing is seperated into practice sessions and bout sessions because they dont want people to fight on campus or something, I think most boxing gyms and sessions do something similar since preparations for drills and stuff are decently different from actual bouts with mouth protectors and headgear and stuff. Usually we do shoulder tag and stuff in practice sessions.
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>>85247
regular BJJ but you can´t do some things,
if you want jacket striking you have to go with combat sambo, but they dont have sleves,
you also have combat JJ but you can only palmstrike on determinate situations
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>>87713
yea but keep your head up so you dont get guillotined
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>>101025
It's not mystique, it's just a different language. The names of the throws are just about as basic as can be when translated like "inner leg reap" or "high hip throw". The same language is just used globally so it's easier for everyone at international events to communicate with each other. Similar to how all BJJ matches start with "Combate" instead of "Go" in English or "Hajime" in Japan, or "Lute" instead of "Stop".

>>101049
Jacket striking can also be that Kudo or whatever it's called with the bubble helmets, although it's harder to knock someone out. I do like in Kudo though that they have some formula for their divisions that includes both height and weight instead of just weight divisions, which I wish was applied in other arts and MMA as well. That way, you wouldn't have lanky fucks cutting weight to bully manlets with their reach in striking.
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>>101129
I looked up the divisions to see what you meant and it seems okay but
>what division are you in Kudo
>woman
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what should i look for in a judo gym/dojo as a beginner? the closest place to me only has 1 hour and 15 minute sessions 3 days a week along with self practice at any time, is that good? also what about size, is too many people in the gym bad?
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>>101129
I dont disagree, with that part, I dont really care that they say engarde in fencing, or as an initiating phrase of tradition, but that basic terms of engagement when you are describing WHAT things are casually. its like if you said "coup" instead of "thrust" when you are talking about thrusting in fencing.
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>>100837
some of (if not all) the best people in most gyms are going to be from a sekrit club
which is to say a small circle of friends who aren't too shy to just play around with positions and shit in a garage or personal space and can afford to give each other alot of time to drill and try stuff
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>>101025
>theres like 50 different throws
>if you check the records for a match and see what technique was used, you can refer to that technique in the kodokan/video/literature/reference material
its actually pretty simple and legit
besides, not all leg sweeps are the same
the typical combo iirc is ouchi>kouchi>some third throw but by your logic it should be translated as "leg sweep into leg sweep", nevermind the fact that theres like 15 different leg sweeps
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>>101185
>what should i look for in a judo gym/dojo as a beginner?
emphasis on break falls
fair amount of randori time, uchi komi time, and special techniques is a good balance imo
>is too many people in the gym bad?
itll give you time to take a breather if they cant fit everyone onto the mat which isnt bad if youre not fit
and a bigger pool of opponents during randori is way better than a small pool, and uchikomi-ing with a small range of sizes, and physiques is fucking shit
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>>83942
do the IJF tourns allow newaza
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>>101431
yes
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>>101405
Those don’t translate to leg sweep though. Kouchi gari is minor inside reap, ouchi gari is major inside reap. Theoretically it could be translated as “minor to major inside reap” but I prefer the Japanese terms so whatever.

Ashi harai is foot sweep in japanese
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What do you guys like to do against people who are shorter, but much stronger than you? I had a lot of difficulty moving or off-balancing my opponent in general let alone throwing him.

t.lanklet
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>>100870
didn't it originate when miners in england would wrestle out of boredom to submit them by catching their opponent anywhere they could?

i've read that the dutch folkstyle wrestling of medieval times, 'lyfvat neergooi' (which translates to 'body catch down throw'), which influenced catch-as-catch-can, included a game still played to this day by kids called 'stoeijen' (modern spelling is 'stoeien', which now means 'play-fighting' but comes from the word 'stuwen' which means 'to stow'), in which the goal is to pin or submit ur opponent until they raise their hand or verbally give up.

so how is that such a crazy idea as to how catch originated? idgi
>>100893
didn't the gracies have catch wrestling coaches they took a lot of techniques from to incorporate them into gracie jiu-jitsu? didn't judo and bjj get the kimura from catch? what about leg locks?

it's funny to me when martial artists are so proud of their "style" that they routinely deny any influence from other arts on theirs.

anyways, here's a sherdog post on the topic
https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/catch-wrestlings-influence-on-kodokan-brazilian-jiu-jitsu.2432075/
this dude may be onto sth... https://youtu.be/yWVYnpPCzCE

maybe that'll give u sth to think about
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>>101476
> didn't it originate when miners in england would wrestle out of boredom to submit them by catching their opponent anywhere they could?
No that’s fucking retarded anon why the fuck would they just make up a style from scratch instead of building on already existing style?

Just read the wiki page history section dummy
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch_wrestling
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>>101438
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>>101480
i did, but wikipedia isn't always a reliable source, especially on martial arts. and they could've used pre-existing styles and built on them further and synthesized them. that doesn't contradict my claim at all. anyways i'm p sure i heard it in a ramsey dewey vid.
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>>101499
Your original claim was that you can just start from scratch and learn to wrestle by fucking around with ur bros, and that’s how catch was developed. Neither claim is true and youre retarded.

>muh wikipedia is unreliable
>I use YouTube videos as a source instead
COME ON NOW
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>>101465
what are they doing? are they powering through? learn how to address grips with technique so you only have to contend with 1 established grip if at all
also staying at distance should be easy since you're lanky, if they're scrubs with bad/unrefined form you can usually step around a tripping leg
at least me as a short person I struggle vs sacrifice throws since I have to move in to get them even higher, but that means you can grab around and just collapsr
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Has anyone here ever used an Iwata Co dogi? They look pretty neat and I’m thinking about ordering one.
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>>100893
The modern leglocking systems that catch guys claim is completely retarded. Yes, heel hooks and ankle locks predate the Gracies. However, the leglocking game as we know it today relies heavily on the guard position - which would be a losing pin in rules of historical catch wrestling.
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>>101532
Honestly they're outgripping me. I'm not exactly the best at grip fighting. My strategy after getting outgripped is to essentially try a bail-out throw or try a foot sweep to unbalance my opponent and rip a grip off. Only problem is that it was almost impossible to off balance that guy. What do you mean by address grips with technique?
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>>101577
I meant ask about non ogre/ strengthy ways to play with grips
a deathgrip on your arm for instance while you have the lapel grip you want is essentially an arm grip so if you tug it in you draw that side of their body to you
other things you can try is grip switching, the brown belt in my gym sucks alot more left handed so when I switch grips his setup movemebt is a lot easier to step around
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>>101476
>didn't the gracies have catch wrestling coaches they took a lot of techniques from to incorporate them into gracie jiu-jitsu? didn't judo and bjj get the kimura from catch? what about leg locks?


Depends which Gracies you’re talking about, but if you’re referring to anything from the early 1900s when BJJ started until the 1990s then no, they didn’t have catch wrestling coaches at all. Pretty much all their techniques are derived from Judo. Their idea of a kimura came from Judo (and is a basic shoulder lock that’s been depicted over 500 years ago anybody could come up with) and leg locks were banned forever in Gracie Jiu Jitsu. After the 2000s catch wrestling is basically dead, but BJJ in general seemed to evolve a lot more (I believe due to straight BJJ starting to lose to practitioners that mixed and matched in MMA) and would have incorporated moves from lots of styles including catch.

I have a feeling you’re confusing BJJ which is the judo offshoot in the gi, with Luta Livre, which is a nogi catch wrestling offshoot that also was big in Brazil. Both styles hated each other, and leglocks were a big part of Luta Livre, and was seen as “dirty” by BJJ.

If you’re talking modern BJJ though then yes it probably has influences, but so does every grappling style or martial art in general that wants to be effective, so you can take what works from each style, especially with the use of the internet to find out all these different tricks.
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>>101577
getting outgripped by someone with less reach and shorter than you is pretty impressive by itself desu. im one of the shorter guys in my club and the only reason i can outgrip people is because most people in my club doent even know what a good grip is; it also helps that im stocky and strong lmfao.
anyways, taller people will usually have an easier time getting good grips because of reach. Good grip is generally right hand on the collar near the back of their neck (like where you would pick up a cat from) and a left hand completely dominating his right sleeve and preventing his right hand from reaching your lapel. Once you have that grip, push his posture down and make him hunch over, then use your own movement (like stepping to the left or right or forward and backward) as part of your kuzushi. Travis steven and shintaro higashi should have a couple of youtube vids on this, but obviously you need to practice this in randori
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>Ukrainian butthurt brigade btfo by Marius
el oh el
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Just got my yellow belt bros. What should I expect from now on?
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>>101724
for most schools, pretty much the same thing. getting better at martial arts is not pretty or fancy; there is no secret mojo juice they teach you at black belt, or at least there shouldnt be. all the best high percentage moves in fact should be taught to you day 1 and those are the moves you should keep drilling and practicing at randori.
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>>101618
Haven't played much judo on the opposite side, but I'll try it out. For the arm grip part am I trying to pull my elbow into his chest?

>>101640
To be honest I'm pretty garbage at grip fighting. I usually like to play morote seionage/otoshi, so I like to play with my hand near the shoulder. Though I suppose that's not the best throw to play against someone shorter than me. I'll probably have to find some other throw to play against him.

If I like morote seio nage, would you still recommend to grab near the neck? Higher grips make it harder to put my elbow into their armpit, but maybe that's because I'm bad.
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>>101819
>If I like morote seio nage, would you still recommend to grab near the neck? Higher grips make it harder to put my elbow into their armpit, but maybe that's because I'm bad.
Morote from a high collar grip is how you tend to ude-garami yourself over time and lose your morote seoi-nage. These pointers from Choi helped me; if you'll note he doesn't have his lapel hand super high.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VccIfu0VQk
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Any advice or attacks from that position where you have one hand basically in the centre of their back (or belt if they’re really small) and one sleeve? I keep being told I should do this grip and just turn in but I don’t really understand what I’m turning into. If anyone has any videos or something that shows a technique or explains the position I’d appreciate it, just so I can see every way they’re moving their body and work out what I want to do other than just move them around.
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To japanese jiu jitsu practicers here, how is the striking ? The few I've seen was good to me but I'd like more personal experiences
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>>101880
it's a grappling art, anon: that's like asking how the throws and locks are in boxing.
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>>101882
Not him but I think he's talking about sports jjjj, where it's basically a combination of karate and judo
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>>101882
og judo had strikes and kicks, and some jujutsu styles still have them
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>>101956
old school boxing had straight up wrestling in it
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Is Ryoko Tani the GOAT of women's judo?
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>>101874
>one hand centre of back or belt and one hand on sleeve
i guess it depends on whether your hand in their back (likely right hand) has is under their left arm or has cleared their left arm, but that sounds like a classic ass ogoshi grip.
im pretty sure harai goshi and koshiguruma are also great with this grip assuming you cleared the right arm, osotogari is also strong. i think sumi gaeshi is also strong here
if your right arm is under their left arm, ouchi gari/gake and kouchi gari/gake while basically hugging them and driving forward sounds like it would work. ogoshi should also work but harai and koshi and osoto probably wouldnt work as well anymore. maybe kosoto gari/gake?
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>>102041
>i guess it depends on whether your hand in their back (likely right hand) has is under their left arm or has cleared their left arm

I think it's the position the koshiguruma you mentioned can go from, but deeper. If it helps, they always say it's a classic heavyweight grip. In more detail, my right arm goes over their left should and I try and grab as far down the back as I can, which prevents them from being able to straighten up and forces them to be bent over. My left hand I think goes for a sleeve on their right hand. From what I can gather, this sorta forces me to only be able to sweep them forwards, and them only be able to take me down backwards (though in prime position for a double leg), but I don't really know what a finish is. It's not really something we go over in class because it seems like it's something you can only do if you're bigger/taller than the other person, otherwise you can't really reach deep enough to bend them over.

I found pic related by just searching "judo bent over grip" and it looks like a left-handed version of it, but I think you'd want to go more side on to do a takedown? I have no idea what to call this position to search though.
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>>102042
look up the georgian grip, that is very similar to what you have and there are many attacks from there, you just have to clear the head to be a georgian grip. the more conventional grip i dunno the name but all the throws i mentioned earlier (harai goshi, ogoshi, koshiguruma, osotogari) are great throws from this grip since you control their posture and centre of gravity well.
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>>84349
hah mine is a 5 minute walk from home sucks to suck mate
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I got a good randori session; I've definitely gotten better at setting up my seoi nage.
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>>102778
Ok
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I finished my first trial week this week and everything so sore it hurts to move lol
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this is my judo-fu Diyora Keldiyorova

say something nice about her
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>>101819
>For the arm grip part am I trying to pull my elbow into his chest?
I was more thinking you could worry less about breaking his grip or addressing it and instead play around it, whatever is more secure for you and keeps your center of mass uncompromised
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>>83942
idk much about judo but I like how snappy what I've seen of it looked. Very elegant
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>>103196
It's an interesting grappling art, that's for sure
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>>89485
>>89608
>>89659
http://libgen.rs/search.php?req="Kodokan+Judo"+Jigoro+Kano
http://libgen.rs/search.php?req="Canon+of+Judo"+Kyuzo+Mifune
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>>101189
I've been to dojos and events where not everyone training spoke the same language but where everyone knew the Japanese terms for what we were doing and how to directly translate those terms back into their own languages. It's not about tradition, it's about establishing an international judo lingua franca.
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all my local dojos are closed in the summer cuz trainers are on vacation :/ will resistance band practicing be fine? also is there a way to practice ukemi at home?
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>>103332
>is there a way to practice ukemi at home
...what kind of dojo were you training at, anon?
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What doth a judo Jim do if his opponent monkey grabs his torso preventing limb manipulationization?

It seems that a lot of judo throws are hard to do if you are flat against each other in a grapple of exceeding closeness. Like lovers in the midst of coitus.
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>>103404
Look at the cover of this book >>103389
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>>103389
... nevermind, i was thinking mostly of the non sitting down stuff but ill just do it on the floor for now, ill try it on some stacked yoga mats maybe
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Is it true that the hopping finish to the inside trip is something more common to judo and sambo?
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>>103445
If you're starting from sitting you should be fine on just a normal carpet or out on the grass so your yoga mats will be good; just enough padding to protect bony areas from imperfect form. The more you practice good ukemi the higher the fall you can take and the harder the surface you can fall on. I used to be able to jump and throw myself at hardwood floors for ukemi practice but I've gotten lazy and I don't think I could do that without risking hurting myself right now.
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>start front rolls at class
>have sharp lower abdominal pain after first one
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>>103522
Anon, did you poop in your judo gi?
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>>103590
Not this time, it just hurt a lot. I couldn’t take my shoes off last night so I had to sleep on top of my bed face down with my feet hanging off. It doesn’t feel as quite bad today but last night I could barely stand after attempting the first breakfall.



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