Next door I have a boxing club and a thai club, what should I choose? Which one is more efficient?Thai seems more complete to me but I'm naturally not very good with my legs, I don't use them much in combat and I have the impression that with thai it's mainly kicks and punches only for supportBoxing is more natural for me but it seems incomplete and I would never know how to place a good kick or with thisSo?
>>67169a gun, op.
What should I take to become a beast and feel safe and confident in my ability to defend myself again?And I live in Western Europe so no I can't buy a gun, or even pepper spray
Both, if not then thai. I know you don't have confidence in using your legs but fact of the matter is you'll have to learn how to anyways. In boxing footwork is everything. The term "muay thai style" is kind of a misnomer because it really depends on who's teaching. Schools in Thailand train differently; some have emphasis on knees in the clinch while others are more kick heavy. Either way you'll learn how to use all 8 limbs and it's really up to you how to utilize your tools. If you want to be more boxing heavy but still use kicks you can subscribe to Dutch kickboxing.
>>67179>Both, if not then thaiThis seems like the easiest solution. Just try them both and see how you go.
>>67169Learn grappling first.
>>67228It just works. People act like badass expert fighters until someone grabs them, then they act like a fish and don’t know what to do.
>>67231It's not going to do me much good in the street if there's more than one of them, and even if the guy is alone and knows how to punch I'll eat his fists and his knee before I can grab his legs
>>67169You will learn to use your legs - go muay thai and branch into boran moves just in case you like fucking people up. Your best training is situational judgement and running the fuck away.
>>67231This is why Thai works. A good wrestler has the lights go out fast when the elbows start crashing down to the back of his head in the clinch.
>>67262i do judo and wrestling, ive competed against thai fighters before (my judo teach is good friends with the owner of the muay thai place across the street so we sometimes do cross over shit) and they are a pain in the ass to fight.
>>67262Which is why strikers typically defend wrestling shots with hail mary elbows/knees, right?Back in reality, the most commonly practiced defense to offensive wrestling is defensive wrestling like sprawling - which you learn from grappling.
>>67169>I want to be able to defend myself in the streetFirst, use your head- stay away from trouble spots, stay away from bad people. Know your surroundings and be alert, and leave when you sense a problem developing. If you stay you get what you deserve. Fighting for fitness or fun is different than fighting for survival. If want to fight in the street to be tough you are an idiot. If trouble starts to try diffuse and get away. You cant lose a fight if there is no fight. If you must defend yourself there are no rules, you must strike first. If you cant have a gun use a knife and slash the eyes, throat, arteries in the arm, leg and get away as fast as possible. If you are not willing to kill the other person to save yourself you are not prepared to save yourself, or you simple are not able to do it. This not mean to be a lame larp post, don't fight if you don't have to. There are plenty of vids of people getting destroyed because they thought they were tough, they were stupid, or they were just unlucky. The best trained killers in the military get killed or seriously injured all the time. Stay away from bad people, bad places, leave the area if you sense trouble. This is the best. Fighting is a last resort.
>>67316A lot people expect they're going to be able to pull off the clinchwork and knee combos that they see in MMA fights against a wrestler because they've never faced that heat. In reality a good single leg or ankle pick is going to dump you on your ass faster than you throw any strike.No shortcuts m8s, you gotta grapple to deal with grapplers.
>>67169Running is extremely more efficient self defense form. If you truly want to be safe on the street I'd go with that.If you still want to train any sort of sport you always go for the one you think you'll be more consistent at and if you still cannot decide you go for the one with better facility, instructors etc.
>>67169Depends on a lot of factors :- what is your level in fighting sports, and what is your current fitness ? If you have none, choosing between boxing or muay thai is not much of an importance. It is better to master a skill (punching + footwork + evading) than to be bad in many fields combined (punch, elbows, knees, clinch), and furthermore, in the street you don't kick a lot (stability and groin exposure).- "trivial considerations" : which club in the closest to you geographicaly ? In which one will you fit in the more with the members? Which one is the cheapest ? Who are the people who go there (professionals, amateurs looking to just have fun, people like you,...?)Check both clubs if they allow "free trials" and choose with your guts.
>>67316Street fights are different than MMA fights. You don't functionally understand why shots to the back of the head are banned to begin with (short answer THEY WORK) or how open the back of the head tends to be while shooting, especially if you can get back up against a wall. Hell look at that last Adesanya fight versus the Italian guy, Vittorio or whatever. He effectively used strikes to the side of the head just to prevent takedowns once his back was to the wall, and that's against a prime wrestler without using the best spot to aim.
>>67469Which is true if you know how to keep your balance during a takedown. Izzy is good at it because he uses the fence and keeps a wide base. On the streets, unless you know how to sprawl (defensive wrestling) you are probably landing maybe 1 or 2 elbows before landing on your back.
>>67169The first principle of legitimate defense is avoidance, OP. If you're doing something that needs you to fight to defend yourself you did too much of dumb shit.
>>67169exercise romanticized by movies. you can do martial arts for 15 years and still be a pussy. try do at least enough exorcise so you dont end up dying of heart disease. or strong enough that your women doesn't think youre a total cuck >aim for achievable goals then exceed them >>67170Conner mcgregger,d the rock, maywether batman , joe rogan on pcp cant and horse de-worming agent cant beat a gun
>>67469>You don't functionally understand why shots to the back of the head are banned to begin withBecause wrestlers would get people into a turtle position and wail on their heads; in fact, it's something you see very often in street fight videos. It's primarily to nerf ground-and-pound.
>>67169muay thai because they teach countering with grapples. a more realistic scenario where you will have the upper hand. anyone can punch
>>67276Your coaches sound based as fuck. That's a fantastic combo for self defense.
>>67169Boxing is better but you will probaby not get trained correctly if you aren't talented enough to make it.Thai boxing is inferior but more easy to train in.I'd say go for Thai boxing and try to concentrate on punching, elbows and clinching. Kicks aren't important in street fighting.
>>67231t. hasn't roughhoused as a kidWhat is it with you Americans? In Europe, everyone wrestled as a kid, on the schoolyard.
>>67780Kicks are very important in street fighting. I'm a boxer but my friend who does Muay Thai coached me on doing a good low kick and it was a game changer. You can maintain distance and since most people have never conditioned their legs it's almost always a fight ender.
>>67785Street fights almost always start from punching distance. You must be a teenager who thinks "behind school at noon" is a street fight.
>>67811If you let someone who is agressive get into punch range you are stupid as fuck and you already fucked up.
>>67811Yeah basically what >>67815 said. If you let someone inside boxing range you already fucked up. Not to mention you could always move back into kicking range lol
>>67815>>67832lmao called it.Duels on the schoolyard aren't street fights. Street fights start suddenly, often without any warning.
>>67847>Street fights start suddenly, often without any warning.Maybe if you're an autist. There are almost always social cues that someone is about to get clocked. It usually starts from two tipsy guys getting into an argument about something, and emotionally escalating until they start fighting. Needless to say, it's pretty obvious when a fight is about to go down.
>>67847In that case it's not even a one on one. I'm at bar or in the streets you are getting jumped by me and my goons. You can consider yourself lucky if you don't get shanked.
>>67856Yeah that's why sucker punches don't work, oh wait...>>67857You're American lol. You haven't ever fought.
>>68679I've been in riots and had cinder blocks thrown at my head. I spent my teenage years in the California Youth Authority. But of course I don't know how to fight lol.
>>68686Sure, anon. And i'll have you know i'm trained in gorilla warfare and graduated top of my class in the navy seals, have over 300 confirmed kills and you're nothing to me but another target. You're dead, kiddo.
>>68728To be fair is not that unbelievable if you look at current events lol
>>67785Kicks are almost entirely superfluos to street defense. The warning to not kick above your waste is mostly a meme if you are good at kicking in full contact competition you will be able to pull it off in a lot of street situations as well, but you really do not need it. The vast majority of situations caught on film of someone fending off multiple attackers is legitimately footage of amature or pro boxers. Having good foodwork with a nice and basic 1 2 combo is more than enough to defend yourself against 99.9% of the population. Add in basic defensive wrestling and clinch work and its enough. You don't need to learn kicking or submissions at all desu and focusing too much on them is actually detrimental imo if your goal is to optimize for self defense. I say this as a karate black belt who has done kickboxing and most of my current training is kicking a heavy bag in ny garage. I'm not biased towards boxing its just the reality if you review the actual footage.
>>70451Learning a solid leg kick wouldn't hurt. Good footwork with a 1 2 will get the job done against most people, but a solid leg kick against an untrained person will make them reconsider immediately. If the guy is bigger than you then staying out of clinch range is a good idea. There's also the added benefit of not fucking up their face as much for legal reasons.
>>70481Lol no leg kicks don't do shit unless your opponent is a massive pussy at which you point you can aikido or tkd him to deatht. ate so many leg kicks in a fight couldn't walk the next day but did not feel them during the fight at all
>>70481Nvm you said untrained so I guess yeah. Untrained weak dudes are still dangerous if there are 5 of them so leg kicking them makes sense.
>>67781They made the trouble kids get into for rough housing too extreme. Punishment is so hard that people are afraid to do it.My friend lives in Portland. And he told me that for mutual combat street fight, both combatants will get put into jail for an absurd amount of time, something like 30 days. That might not sound like much, but it's enough to lose your job for a lot of people and then if you don't have savings that's something that could make you wind up homeless without a good support system.One street fight as an adult could lead to losing everything. That's ridiculous and should be seen as such. But between that and the internet where people can insult each other kind of consequence free has lead to an odd situation where he says it's lead to people saying absolutely horrific shit to one another and just sitting there and going back and forth with it like that. He said basically no one fights ever, even with just cause to do so. It's a problem that is going to continue to spiral worse but I hope it helps explain why some of the vitriol on the internet seems to have become exponentially worse over time.
>>70487I guarantee you've never been kicked in the leg by a Thai boxer if you think this.
>>70495Getting into fights over mean words is asinine and should result in deterrent punishment. FFS "talk shit, get hit" is the working class/ghetto meathead complement to the effete college kid's "speech is violence!"
>>70481Thing with leg kicks is self defense wise if you have the chance to kick someone in their leg you might as well just kick them in the balls
>>70685I thought about explaining why youre wrong but decided i would rather just call you a retard insteadretard
>>67169If you can’t get a gun get pepper spray, or a stun gun, or sap gloves at least, weapons are what is used to defend and attack, trying to go without them is impractical.
>>70685While I won't call you a retard I'll explain why you're wrong. Groin kicks require a much shorter range and are less open compared to an entire leg. Outside leg kicks have more leeway to land then inside leg kicks, but yeah you might as well go for the crotch if you're throwing inside kicks.
>>67236Nope. Watch ufc 1. You cant knock somebody out who is going for a takedown unless you actually know what you are doing and have trained specifically for that and have footage of their previous takedowns. It happens too fast.
>>70767You're assuming a random guy knows how to stand properly in a fight
>>70790They generally don't, which makes leg kicks even more effective.
>>70760I would only recommend pepper spray in an altercation in an altercation. You have to remember in most places weapons are illegal. Shit in big cities in America you can't legally carry a gun on you concealed or not.
>>70819Pepper spray is considered a weapon in most municipalities.
>>70815Also makes it so its not harder to kick them in the groin than the leg
>>70871Uh yeah if you're throwing inside leg kicks. Not sure what point you're making.
>>70497I've been kicked in the leg by a thai boxer idk if you are aware but adrenaline numbs pain to the point that victims of stabbing often don't feel much/think they are punched. Hell I had a rib broken once and didn't feel much of anything until several hours later.
>>70846Yeah so no obvious weapons then unless you don't mind catching a charge. If your place is really cucked use keys, any debris you can find though that may still be illegal, or a bike lock or chain. The best advice everyone gives is always be aware of your surroundings and beat feet as soon as you can.
>>70451I have a friend that almost killed someone after land an ura do mawashi during a street fight.Kicking is dangerous.
>>70495That's weird, because I heard that barfights and streetfights were way up in Portland this Summer, as it was across all the US, really. I think it's good, honestly. I'm tired of people thinking violence is necessarily bad.
>>67171do a striking art and a grappling art. Start bulking up and build some muscle if youre skinny. The arts you pick should ideally have active sparring that is relatively safe to practice, but thats harder to find for striking arts desu. good and safe to practice grappling arts are much easier to find, any combination of BJJ and either grappling or judo should set you up nicely as long as you find a good dojo that spars regularly.>>67228because close range fighting with some grappling is probably going to be the most common 1v1 scenario. knowing how to takedown or throw someone and then break his joints or choke him is massive. most people aren't boxers don't know how to throw a good punch, but almost anyone can ground and pound or supplex you, so knowing how to avoid that or take advantage of the ground is essential. theres a reason why almost every mma fighter knows some basic level of BJJ
>>67169Fights generally start in punching distance and involve clinching, so boxing will be pretty identical to your average street fight if you learn some takedowns on the side.
>>70497He's right. Leg kicks work over time with accumulated damage. Since a street fight will not be 4+ rounds, they're not very useful. Even in Thailand, they're seen as low level techniques.Also you can counter them by just taking a step forward. They have no stopping power. In a street fight, use teeps to the pelvis or knees instead if you want to kick.
>>70768>You cant knock somebody out who is going for a takedownlol it happens all the fucking time.
>>72160It happens, although I wouldn't say all the time. If your gameplan to defend a takedown is a knockout knee you are probably fucked.
>>72167What's your plan, sprawling? What do you do if the other guy is a better wrestler?Anything can happen all the time, "what if" is not an argument.
>>72186Working on your wrestling or guard game and sweeps are both way, way better options than praying for a knockout strike on his way in. You are choosing the lowest percentage option as your first line of defense.
>>72189>Work on your wrestlingSpecialization > generalizationIronically, that's what MMA taught us.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rW7vvwWsufQ
>>72192Indeed, I'm not saying you need to be better than Ben Askren to deal with his double legs. Play to your strengths. But you will need to focus on defensive wrestling to not get taken down at will. Trying to be Jorge masvidal every time someone shoots in on you is not a real plan.
>>72159Yeah but most likely the person you're fighting has never been kicked in the legs. Without any conditioning they're gonna feel it immediately. Since most people don't know how to defend it and put a lot of their weight foward you're more than likely going to at least throw them off balance.
>>72236It's a myth. I'd tell you to try it in a brawl and see for yourself but you'd get beaten up.
>>72314I don't need to. There's enough video evidence online of them being effective. If even pros struggle against them what makes you think an average Joe can take them?
Are liver shots useful in a street fight>>72335post evidencenever saw anything convincing but maybe its just mei myself would not discount low kicks but wouldnt rely on them either
>>72151violence is bad because you never know if the other retard is going to croak from an aneurism after you punched him or something or you end up with torn clothing i mean it's always a lose lose scenario unless a girl sees it and thinks you are coolor you take their things but i guess it makes it even more likely to get in legal trouble
>>72713Here's some leg kicks being used effectivelyhttps://youtu.be/DLVWQR5_KjUhttps://youtu.be/OQfcq-1k5SoHere's a liver shot https://youtu.be/U_o6_IZwoZo
>>72735goddamn that 2nd video is attempted murder.
>>72735All of these are hilarious but in the 1st vid dude got basically sweeped, in the 2nd dude ate multiple low kicks and was dropped with a fist.
>>72735The liver kick was beautiful. Prolly too risky tho.
>>73023The KO was set up by the leg kicks. Had him thinking low, stepped in with a hip feint, then went high. Happened with the hook and the cross, both set up with the kicks.
>>67169Kicks to the groin, eyepokes and fast legs. Also, watch this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bxTLE7O_Ac8
>>67169Prevention is better than cure. Avoid black areas and you'll be fine./thread