karate thread - Kyokushin Bull editionprevious >>85346
>>126367This dude had essentially 2 wives as his first wife encouraged him to bone some other bitch?
I have the chance of create a dojo in a few years, I have the idea of mix standard karate with boxing punches and footwork alongside of try to follow Muay Thai way of training (pads, sparring and so on).Probably kickboxing with extra steps but I simply want to "modernize" the style, the techniques still but with a more practical approach.
>>126411I believe it was actually that he developed traps that were so huge people said he looked like a bull.
>>126428Which style are you trying to modernize? A lot of karateka have done this from different backgrounds. By "standard" do you mean shotokan?
>>126428See >>126443 why try to reinvent the wheel? This has been done repeatedly by some of the best fighters who ever lived.. See Kyokoshin Karate with Shiinken Shobu rules, Japanese kickboxing/K1, Kudo, Karate Combat (maybe since a promotion not really a comp format let alone style?)?
>>126428>have the chance of create a dojo in a few yearsMy advice is to learn how to run the business, book keeping, and liability stuff and see if you have tolerances to the paperwork side of things before you start spending money. I found out that while I love teaching I REALLY hate running a business. It's so much work for so little of a return. Unlike actually teaching it's self, which is super rewarding, fun, and doesn't really feel like work at all.
Why no old karate master thought about put his hands up and use the other hand to cover his chin while punching?
>>126443>>126461Shotokan, mostly because the current training method seems very outdated.>>126751I'm gonna try my best.
>>126428>>126751How much experience do you have in karate/boxing/muay thai?Like another anon said, teaching is one thing and running a business owner is another. I've had a few coaches who used to own their own gyms and they all said they were happier when they were just coaches instead of coaching and having to run a gym.
>>127102Because i can still punch your hand and hit your head?
>>127102I don't think anybody knows for sure, but I doubt anybody was doing hikite while sparring in the 19th century and earlier. I think that was invented with ippon kumite in the early 20th century.
Tell me something in karate that would be useful for MMA that I already dont know about
>>128181We only really ever saw lunge punches used really well by guys like machida. I don’t think anyone e looks e is incorporating them into their game as anything bother than a one off gimick
Am I wrong or is Karate coming back in fashion?
>>128824Why do you think so?
Anyone interested in fighting next year? >>128824Kinda… its not just for kids anymore it seems.
>>129088These three seem open to most people, which is always fun
>>129089I’m going to try to make lightweight for the French WKO tournament and then I’ll see how I feel about the Scottish Open and the Diamond Cup
>>128824Cobra Kai effect plus Karate Combat modernising it.
So, Feitosa and Filho have officially resigned from their positions within the IKO, and the IKO have formally expelled the two of them. This is most likely because of their involvement with the KWU and Senshi, which have strong ties to the Bulgarian criminal underworld, and not because the IKO hate all other forms of Kyokushin. A shame really but the KWU are only going to become bigger and bigger, and can throw more money at people like this than organisations 4 times their size. Does anyone here have experience with the KWU or Senshi??
>>129549What is KWU and Senshi?
>>129567KWU is a sort of.... It's a loose affiliation of Kyokushin dojos, mainly across Europe. It stands for Kyokushin World Union, and has the supposed goal of getting Kyokushin in the olympics (which was Oyama's dream when the IKO was at its peak), it was founded by Ivo Kamenov, who also is one of the founding members of the Bulgarian criminal organisation, TIM. It's not an ironclad organisation like IKO, and has various associations with Shinkyokushin (WKO), KyokushinKan, the IFK, and the KWF etc. Senshi is their "pro-karate" organisation, it's mainly a kickboxing/K1 clone but it has multiple rulesets that allow for "prokyokushin" (kyokushin in a ring with rounds but still full gi no gloves etc) and despite being extremely low on the kickboxing ladder (nowhere near Glory, K1, Rizin, ONE, etc etc) it has managed to attract official appearances from every major K1 star, even those with no association with Kyokushin or karate. They have enough funding it seems they'd pay for Andy Hug's corpse to appear if he hadn't been cremated. I think in the near future they'll try to absorb the IFK, as the president, Shihan Pickthall, has been spending lots of time with the KWU and Senshi, appearing at many of their events and camps. There's actually so many splinter Kyokushin organisations around it gets really confusing, it's more than suspicious when Filho and Feitosa announce their resignation and then immediately offer to teach classes for Senshi and KWU. Nevermind the fact they seem to be able to afford Pettas, Semmy Schlitt, etc to appear at random no-name fight cards in Eastern Europe
>>128181Karate conditioning methods such as makiwara punching, rolling kali sticks on shins, hitting forearms with kali sticks.
>>128181Zen or other meditation.. highly underrated or understood in the modern fake identity era.
>>129088Can I fight the promoter? After all, he owns these slaves . Perhaps global battle royale would be more my thing. An actual battle with actual stakes, actual status and actual victory.
>>126367Kyokushin fucking sucks in Karate Combat
>>129694People who are actually good from kyokushin get picked up by real kickboxing orgs
>>129694ok Adam Cuckvax
>>129674are you retarded or just underaged?
>>126428Think you can reinvent the wheel?Boxing, muay thai and others have dynamics, ways of using the body different from karate. You can't mix them.Karate is a set of a whole. Katas, kihon, bunkai, kime... everything has its reason for being. If you change something, you change everything.Maybe you don't believe in Karate anymore, if you believed in it, you would be doing like Patrick McCarthy, deconstructing Karate, recovering its techniques and working to recover its potential.
Any reccs for high-quality book about history of karate?
>>129694I hardly see any Kyokushin in karate combat.
>>129742Very rigid mindset
Just been awarded my 7th Kyu in kyokushin let’s go
>>129707Give me some fresh examples pls
>>129574I would support Kyokushin in olympics.Get rid of taekwondo. I would also welcome Kyokushin as the dominant form of karate instead of Shtokan and its unefficient ruleset.As one of my hudo teachers said : "In (shotokan) karate, when fighter gets knocked out he wins. How are normal people supposed to understand this?".
>>130220Some of the current literal best kickboxers in the world come from kyokushin. Obviously they are cross training but so are the people in krotty cumbat.https://youtu.be/0WxOzqHRA6s
54th Shinkyokushin All Japanhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLQSK35zk_AGonna post some highlights.
>>130295Once more, with feeling.
>>130297Rolling Thunder appears to be the kick of the day
>>130299And some fun angles
>>130301Felt bad for the guy, even when he stood back up he fell down again on the tatami.
>>130302Cool stuff, can't wait for day 2 tomorrow.
>open stream 2>fucking naruto musicamazing..... Shinkyokushin... I kneel
>>130585>working with only 3mb is pretty toughAlright lets get a few webms before bed
>>130599Always feel bad when the flight instincts kick in after a guy goes down, and the ref has to wrangle them back into position for the decision. Amazing angles here
>>130600Grit, determination, will, fighting spirit, heart, guts, chin, etc etc, this is kyokushin.
>>130602Ochiai too strong.... Great showing from his opponent, but his huge punches, unstoppable forward movement win him the fight. Ochiai ga taosenai....
>>130603until.... eventually one brave soul does the impossible o7
>>130604Absolutely murderous leg destruction
>>130599These are pretty cool but to be honest it looks silly that they're avoiding headshots the whole time. Asking as a non-karate guy (save for experience as a little kid)... how much of karate focuses on the "internal" i.e. body mechanics, intention etc? What's the training like?
>>130599>working with only 3mb is pretty toughusing vp9 helps a lot now that 4chan supports it
Did you know they teach karate in hell?
>>130623Depends where you go? The place I train, that sort of thing only happens after yellow belt, and even then it's always secondary to technique. The reason behind the no headpunches rule is that one, they're bareknuckle, a tournament with full contact face punches would lead to so many broken hands by the second rounds it would just be untenable. Secondly, they're also testing your determination, your ability to endure constant punishment, as opposed to just getting knocked out by one lucky punch. Of course there are lucky kicks and head kick KOs are quite frequent but the idea is that there is a much higher level of control and skill that goes into a head kick KO, a body blow KO, and a low kick KO than punches to the head. Don't get me wrong, I love kickboxing, muay thai, MMA, etc etc, but Kyokushin will always be my favourite.>>130707how do you use vp9? I still used webm4retards lol
>>130929no one else is posting so i might as well tweak my own webms
>>129742>Boxing, Muay Thai, and others have dynamics, ways of using the body different from karate. You can't mix them.Japan and the Netherlands have no shortage of athletes who contradict this.
>>129694I cannot remember watching any KC matches where somebody came from a kyokushin background. Please post proof, though, because the hemorrhoidal tears of "kyokushin or bullshido" elitists would be priceless.
>>130929>how do you use vp9? I still used webm4retards lolcheck the box that says vp9
>>131065There was one Kyokushin fighter, Zsolt Zsiga. He did okay but very clearly lost. There's a German guy who says he's Kyokushin but spends most of his time in Thailand and doing some weird off brand of Kyokushin that has awarded him 7th dan.... He's honestly a retard desu and just believes in walking forwards and tanking hits without delivering any real techniques. However, (here it comes, the caveat etc) Karate Combat has a very unfavorable ruleset for Kyokushin, no low kicks, no striking in the clinch (I believe) means that anyone seriously good at Kyokushin would have to train completely differently to do well on KC, and since Kyokushin is so big (it's probably the biggest style of karate, there are tournaments and dojos everywhere, of various qualities, there's a lot of bullshit kyokushin of course) there's not that much incentive for a Russian or Japanese or Brazilian Kyokushin competitor to enter karate combat if they want that full contact experience, it's easier for them to enter kickboxing/MT than something specific like KC. A lot of the bantamweight, flyweight, featherweight, divisions of kickboxing across the globe are dominated by People with Kyokushin backgrounds, like Tenshin Nasukawa, who was one of the best fighters in the youth divisions. Takeru went through the gloved shin karate youth leagues as well. Different rules attract different styles of fighters, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMQC5fYScd8&list=PLYqfpmJlqGIe8RTjgoZqh-FjS10SoPr-T watch baby tenshin completely style on some poor kid.
>>131119Yeah if some of the best kyokushin people were in kc it would be punching down by a lot. As is Gabriel Varga in that org... That last figh he hadt was some Johny Rhodes vs Fred Etish tier mismatch.
>>128181I don't know what you already know.The basics of kickboxing have a lot in common (for obvious reasons) with karate. So if you already know how to kickbox you know most of the functional stuff of karate.I mean there is stuff like roundhouse and front kick variations that are pretty good, and useful to know compared to just having the standard MT style roundhouse and nothing else. But again, I don't know if you already know those.A good front leg side kick is fantastic for controlling distance, but if you have good kickboxing training you should probably already have that in your toolbox.Karate stresses being able to fight well on both sides and being able to switch lead leg. Which is a cool ability but I don't know if you are willing to dedicate the training time to become a switch stance fighter. But yeah, don't know what you know so can't advise.
>>131165this angle is crazy, from the side it's quite normal looking, also the spin is of course sped up, still a really nice kick to watch in real time. https://youtube.com/watch?v=LtAyHXxuKW0&si=EnSIkaIECMiOmarE&t=3176 kick is at 51 mins or so
>Have to spar with brown belt with two stripes>He is 6'5” lanky skeleton>Taller and lankier than everyone else in dojo>All he does is strike with lead fist while backing up>Constantly tells people that their combos are too basic and predictable>Will never even stay put so anyone can work on anything other than chasing his ass downYou anons have any advice? Literally no one can fucking close a gap because all he does is jab and backpedal the entire time.
>>131896bum rush him, lowkicks (if allowed), especially on his inside lead leg, get in real close and get messy, everyone is taller than me at my dojo so i have to get in and fight like a dawg
>>131898I'll give that a try, thanks anon.
>>127102Probably the same reason they never invented a shield while the bow and arrow was their main weapon of war.
>>131899What style do you do? Depending on the rules etc, I think its also worth trying to sweep/counter him the moment just before he strikes, stuff like this. ALso i don't know how much you're allowed to grab, but parrying his leadhand or pulling him in closer to you for a follow up punch combo or possible kickhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwW9p6eE5gw
>>131902Shit, i like that. Thanks anon. We are technically an mma (weird karate/kickboxing with judo and JJJ) dojo. Only issue with the takedowns when sparring and him in charge when the sensais are out is "boxing gloves only" which i hate because I'm ocd about making a proper fist and the boxing gloves limit what I can do.
>>131904have you tried boxing bag gloves? My dojo mainly uses bag mitts rather than actual boxing gloves for sparring and pad work, better than MMA gloves but still good enough to make a fist?
There was really any "violent times" in Karate? Probably a fictional take but I'm curious.
>>132170There was the “blood and guts era” of American karate, which was still point scoring but with no padding, combinations legal, and for example in places like Texas, groin strikes and throat strikes were legal. People like Bill Superfoot cut their teeth in the blood and guts era, and then people realised you needed rules and regulations and gloves and American kick boxing was spawned (all American kickboxing was once called pro karate) and the full contact emphasis went to kickboxing and point karate became point karate. In Europe it’s different as kyokushin was always bigger than shotokan and that’s actually had a pretty solid ruleset for years, there was an early period where throat strikes were legal, at least in Britain, and it was common for people to foul and lose teeth at tournaments. Everyone has some story of a dojo war from the 80s or before. Genuinely used to have dojo storming but that was always more of an American thing than European. In the 60s it was pretty normal for your senseis etc to just wallop you with a shinai if you weren’t in the right stance, even during the kids classes. There’s a famous story of our founder whacking a kid with it for having a bad stance, and then having to whack the kid’s dad who stormed onto the mats when he saw it.
>>132199And in Okinawa?
>>132212In Okinawa there were kake-dameshi, wich translates as defying someone, puting them to the test.They were fighting hoodlums sometimes.And later they used to fight misbehaving GIs from the american base.
>>131896I saw 6'6" blue belt oblitarated black belt at local IKO1 competitions
Should I learn karate?
>>132629Learn boxing or muay thai instead
Any other "unorthodox" Shotokan master like Asai?
Anyone do Kudo? As a kyokushin guy it looks fun
>>133748I actually had the privilege of meeting Takashi Azuma more than 15 years ago when he visited the US. Apparently, Kudo or Daido Juku as it was called in the 80's and 90's, was meant to be an expansion of Kyokushin tournaments, but the no punches/elbows to the face (kicks and knees are allowed) and bare-knuckle format was already too popular and widespread. Kudo is what Karate should've been (alongside Nippon Kenpo which actually predates it by several decades). >>132199One of my coaches did karate in the 70's and a lot of what you said is true. It's natural for Americans to put on gloves and punch to the face along with the kicks they took from Karate/Kenpo as well as Tae Kwon Do/Tang Soo Do (which was originally termed 'Korean Karate" back then). It's a real shame that Kyokushin never really took hold in the US like it did in Europe and South America. My coach was originally a Goju stylist and he encountered kicks to the thigh when he visited Okinawa on a trip. That was something rarely seen in the US karate circles outside of Kyokushin since they had exposure to Muay cut kicks. He also picked up toe kicks from an Uechi ryu guy he met. Then he went on to train in the Netherlands and then Thailand to broaden his skills.
>>126428>standard karate with boxing punches and footwork alongside of try to follow Muay Thai way of training (pads, sparring and so on).this is how they train in japan, what you described is literally what japanese kickboxing is, you are doing nothing new.
>>133752This, Kudo looks very interesting but historical reasons make so that it will never be as popular as other fighting sports.Now that there is so much money on mma, almost no one will invest in full contact karate with throws.
>>133784Kudo does seem like the next step in the evolution of karate, it's a shame the fragmentation of Kyokushin seems to have prevented karate from progressing further.>>133784Kudo is super popular (outside of the west) it's massive in eastern Europe and many Kudoka go on to participate in sambo, MMA, Sanda, and other larger sports with a variety of results. The problem is that in the English speaking world it has next to zero visibility
>>126428yeah p much what >>126443 , >>126461 , and >>133768 said. this is the kb gym i train at in a nutshell. the only difference would be that we don't wear a gi. and we don't rlly use the japanese terms as much for the kicks.but many kickboxing gyms, especially if they have an instructor/coach who's a former karateka or tkd practitioner, for example, will have those tma snapkicks, typical point fighting in-and-out style, some traditions as a holdover from whichever tma the instructor(s) have a background in, etc.anyways, most modern karate styles are bastardizations of the original okinawan karate, as a lot of the "traditions" we associate w/ the art now weren't practiced back then, and they barely had kicks above the waist afaik. so w/e style of karate u intend to modernize is undoubtedly modern already in its revisionism.don't be silly anon. take an introductory class at the nearest kickboxing gym, and see for urself how much of what u describe has already been realized. u should visit different gyms/clubs/dojos/academies in ur area anyway to familiarize urself w/ what's out there, bc nothing beats first-hand experience.
How i would make karate combat based and actually good to watch.>allow fighters to wear dogi tops>add a kudo division>do a big one night tournament just like a real karate tournament, so that all the fighters with no real record can prove themselves in one night>allow low kicks of all kindsI think having throws etc in the ruleset but no dogi tops is just retarded, especially when you're billing the event as "KARATE", but if you have any idea as to why they make a dogi top but then never let the fighters actually fight in it (it looks too heavy and like a BJJ gi to be honest not a karategi) your guess is as good as mine
>>134414With things like KOTS getting traction maybe they made the fighters wear rope around their fists and try a "no holds barred" scenario finally showing the "brutality" of "real karate".
>>134414You will create just another UFC/combat sambo clone no one cares about
How I would change kyokushin.1) Add kickboxing ruleset competitions (with gloves and head punches). BJJ has gi and no gi categories, same idea should be done in kyokushin. Why not ditch classic kyokushin rules? Because they are the only one that itilize bare knuckles and force you to condition your knuckles2) I see kyokushin practitioners want to add throws or some sort of grappling all the time. I even saw kyokushin schools that make their students to learn throws for belt examines. Should I say they don't really now how to throw people? Judokas spent shit ton of time to learn how to throw people with most basic throws, do drills, practice them etc and still you can teach BJJ practioner with no stand up defend against single hip throw at almost 100% efficiency (I don't say judoka can't throw BJJka, they can but they need combine techniques - when you threaten opponent whith hip throw he usually becomes open to sweep). And I didn't even mention ground fighting which is whole new world.Let's look at combat sambo that combines grappling and striking. It doesn't have sport schools like regular sport sambo or judo where you can bring child and teach him "combat sambo" techniques from scratch. What really combat sambo school is place where you can come having CMS-MS in sambo, judo, wrestling or boxing and continue competing while learning techniques somewhere else. What does it mean? If you want to learn ground fighting better, you will go to grapplers or BBJitsers gyms. Or maybe your combat school already has some grappler or BJJitser? Then you are lucky and you can learn from them. Same for striking, you will learn it from boxers. I just want to show what a hell is to have a school that tries to combine striking and grappling.
>>136129It's always seems to be good idea on "how to create perfect martial art" - "let's get boxing hands, muay thai legs, freestyle wrestling and judo throws, throw in some BJJ chokes and submissions and sweeps from dangerous positions", but reality is it's better to learn those things from specialists.You should keep your school specialized, that's how it becomes usefull. Freestyle wrestling is best style to stay on top of opponent. Greco roman wrestling - best upper body throws and clinch. Judo - best jacket throws and sweeps. Grappling and BJJ - best groundfighting and chokes and submissions. Kyokushin IMO should aim to become best striking art first and foremost. Because now it is sorta okay but ruins your head defence reflections.3) Ditch kata - this is questionable and lot of people don't like it, but katas are useless even in styles like goju ryu that study them heavily and have bunkai (absolutely fantastic and not realistic). Judo had usefull pair katas and even most schools ditched even them. You don't need kata in modern gyms. At the same time it is usfull to keep kihon because IMO it is best thing to teach uncoordinated adult to use technique.
>>136130>but ruins your head defence reflections.*reflexes
>>136129Hatsuo Royoma's offshoot, Kyokushin-kan already addressed this deficiency. His Shinken Shobu tournaments have the participants wear fingerless gloves to allow punches and elbows to the face, sweeps/throws/takedown, and limited clinching (when you grab, you have to initiate a knee or some kind of strike immediately). They even allow limited matwork, but only AFTER a throw/takedown/sweep.Seidokaikan's World Cup would have the competitors put on boxing gloves if they were tied and allow face punches. Super-middleweight boxing champ Frankie Liles was a coach at the Seidokaikan honbu. Shidokan in Japan allow Knockdown Karate (no face punches) as well as Kickboxing bouts (put on gloves and you can bang away). In the US and Europe, Shidokan would host the Tri-athalon of Martial Arts: 1 round of Knockdown Karate, 1 round of Kickboxing, and finally 1 round of Submission Grappling. Kudo is basically MMA-esque with safety gear like Combat Sombo. Even in the early days of Oyama's single dojo in the 1950's and 1960's, students would wrap towels around their hands to spar or wear boxing gloves. It's how Kyokushin was the only karate style to compete against Muay Thai in 1964 because they were conditioned to withstand full-powered hits. So people are seeing the defects that Kyokushin has. Back in the 1960's when the knockdown rules for Kyokushin were finalized, Japanese law prevented bare-knuckle strikes to the face. Oyama wanted to keep Kyokushin without gloves so he compromised. But nowadays, Japan even allows Lethwei tournaments in Japan so bare-knuckle punches and elbows can be introduced but how many people are willing to do that?
proper sumo shiko is the secret to getting good high kicks
>>126367https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6Ed-ygptk8Not linking said anime opening is a sin! Commit sudoku.
>>136130> Ditch Kata because I don't understand it!DYEL fatty that can't move in 3D space.
>>129624> Kali sticks =/= Karate.Either knock more on the maki board or do knuckle/wrist push ups. Goju-ryu has some body conditioning that could be useful (hojo undo.)
>>133748That's 100% of good application of Karate technique. Fast and strong, keeping good form "KARATE DOESN'T WORK!" maybe it doesn't if you don't do it right like this guy here in blue."Ikken Hissatsu." That's all.
>>136311Hello, DYEL fatty that can't move in 3D space.>Ditch Kata because I don't understand it!No, ditch kata because they are useless. Learn to read
How many masters throw shit at Funakoshi?Aside of Choki.
>>137559Mas Oyama thought Funakoshi was soft because he only did kata and never sparred. Oyama did have respect for Funakoshi's son since he actually fought dudes.
>>137560Gigo Funakoshi went to China and that's where he picked up high kicks from
>>136326>ditch kata because they are useless>he doesn’t knowIf you don’t do kata you’re not going to make it.
>>137616Not the anon you're talking to but when you break down the 3 K's of Karate/Kenpo, it needs to be like this:Kihon (Fundamentals): I'd say at least 20-30% of practice. You need to strongly develop the basics of technique, generating power via torque/hip movement, breathing, muscle memory, etc. Kumite (Sparring): No less than half of your time needs to practice against a resisting opponent. Be safe and wearing protective gear, but natural instinct like flinching from a head strike needs to be addressed and how to block, parry, and check kicks are all essential. Kata (Forms): This is only done after the student has months of drilling and perfecting their techniques. It'll allow them to have a deeper understanding of certain moves and applications of basics, but this is a supplement to training and not the be-all end-all.
Scottish open tomorrow, anyone else fighting this weekend?
I want to learn more about Mas Oyama.What are some good books worth reading?
>>137812i lost jej, this knockdown stuff is hard
>>137616I know more than you, kata are cringe and useless as well as bunkai>>137618>It'll allow them to have a deeper understanding of certain moves and applications of basicsThey do not, stop parroting old memes
>>126443Just train KUDO or SAMBO if that's your goal tbfh.
>>138716>i know more than you>proceeds to know lesslol
lol I love karate
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qz5xBkvQ2MI&t=37s How this technique manage to be in Shotokan?The "Japanese Karate have some Jiu Jitsu influence" thing?
>>139276Gichin Funakoshi, the founder of Shotokan, and Jigoro Kano, the founder of Judo, were friends. Funakoshi taught karate at the Kodokan for the time.
>>139280It looks out of place
>>139281People used to do that scissor sweep in jka point karate tournaments all the time lol
>>139281When lowkicks weren't allowed in point karate the sweeps used to be crazyhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0wsMoZwdx8It's an all time classic in Sanda, especially the flying type
>>126367I have the chance to join a dojo where they do full contact Karate. Is it any good for self defense? The boxing gyms are full of niggers.
>>139420The niggest, most ghetto boxing gyms are actually the places you wanna go for boxing. Regarding your question though, full contact karate should generally give you an edge over Joe Schmo in a fight, yes
>>126428So like Enshin, Ashihara or Seido?
>>126428> standard karate with boxing punches and footwork alongside of try to follow Muay Thai way of training (pads, sparring and so on).Already exists, it's called Dutch thaiboxing.
How much Muay Thai influence have Shidokan Karate?
>>139950Quite a bit. Muay Thai has influenced Karate and Kenpo ever since Japan was exposed to it since the 1950's. Shidokan via its roots in Kyokushin took the torque generation that Muay Thai does for its kicks instead of chambering it. And it incorporated Muay clinch techniques when Shidokan had its Kickboxing format. Kickboxing in Japan is basically Muay Thai techniques with a different scoring criteria (punch, kick, elbow, knee are all scored equally).
>>139967And a style that use elbows more often?
>>139968Karate and kenpo did have elbow techniques, but they never utilized them as effectively as Muay Thai does. Muay training really allows people to get a good sense of how to deal with elbow strikes. Exposure to Muay Thai had Karate/kenpo reassess the aliveness of using certain techniques that were considered too dangerous outside of pre-rehearsed kata. A couple of karate and kenpo schools had students hit a sandbag to practice hitting with the elbow, but I don't think there were elbow guards at the time to allow them to receive it safely out of fear of cuts and detached retinas.
>>139970Can you use elbows to the face without cuts?
Streams for the WKO European Karate Championship 2023https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=la4naOoJRUshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XG29ExSkRighttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaGmfosfpuI
>>131165Spinning back round kick!
Shirtless gi looks cool or gay?
>>141505Just the pants and the belt, not the "jacket"
>>141506>>141502It's not necessarily a ether or thing.
>>141502Looks cool when competing in other sports like kickboxing desu
Opinions on Shorin-Ryu?
>>141811Its just Shotokan with a different punch?
Might have the opportunity to teach again, and the pay is even decent.The problem is most of the students are 4-6 year olds and there is zero sparing in the curriculum.I really don't think I will enjoy teaching kids that little, and I don't think it's real karate if there is no sparing.Am I just being picky. I still get to teach and it's $20 bucks a hour (not that many hours but still).It even fits within my work schedule. I just have to skip a bit of sleep that day and caffeine up around midnight or so during my shift.But watching a class it was barely controlled chaos because kids that little really don't have a attention span or discipline yet.
>>126367If there are no school in my town is it possible to learn solo? I just want to throw heavy axe kicks.
>>143008>there is zero sparing in the curriculum.Why not? Karate is a sport, and judo kids are doing randori at that age
>>143008Does it actually matter if toddlers are sparring or not? Teens and adults should be sparring for sure, but how much are little kids actually getting out of it?
>>143492nothing. teaching kids martial arts classes is like running a glorified daycare.
>>143617>glorified daycareThat's what karate dojos are by quantity
>>143683maybe, but bjj is one of the most popular martial arts as well, yet the adult classes they teach typically aren't glorified daycares. then again, bjj fags are pretty serious about quality control, so they shave the bs off of their art, and karate nerds don't seem to do that nearly as much.
>>143735>and karate nerds don't seem to do that nearly as muchMaybe I'm wrong, but the "muh hardcore traditional 0 sport" mentality It's rare in official dojos, even If there is instructors that acknowledge that "side" of karate the vast majority still stuck with the kid-friendly point style for the money
Just technique-wise muay thai kicks generate more power than karate kicks?Why?
>>144117Roundhouse kicks have more force than snap roundhouse kicks because you pivot your foot more and swing your hips more whereas the snap kick is just that snaping your leg. The bad thing is that the roundhouse is much more telegraphed. At this point it doesn't really make sense to call it karate vs muay thai kick because people who do either martial art do both those kicks its not the 1960s anymore.
>>144117agree w/ >>144487 . the karate style tma snap kicks offer you more control and more options/flexibility. they're faster, and bc each kick is chambered, not only can you kick the desired target more accurately, you can also do some misdirection and change the course of most kicks, eg the question mark kick (the classic). on top of all that, you can retract each kick midway, so they're harder to catch, which is arguably even more useful in muay thai w/ the sweeps and all. snap kicks and thai style round kicks both have their applications, so it's good to train both.although karate/tkd practitioners also pivot on the ball of their foot, no? whereas i've seen a lot of thaiboxers/dutch style kickboxers not do this, and instead kinda drag their supporting foot across the floor clumsily like a penguin sliding over ice, bc they were never taught to pivot on the ball of their foot for maximum efficiency. i'm guessing they tend to develop this bad habit from setting up their kicks w/ the sort of V-step commonly taught at kb gyms, presumably bc it's easier to teach a whole class of noobs how to throw kicks faster this way. in which case, as i've said before, crosstraining in sth like tkd would be very beneficial bc you learn to throw kicks most efficiently. not sure if the average muay thai instructor teaches students to pivot on the ball of their foot, but from what i've seen most karate(-adjacent) instructors do.
>>144117Simple, mass.One puts more mass into the kicks in exchange for control and recovery time if the kick doesn't connect. The karate style puts less mass but is faster on recovery and more control so it's easier to use in a string of techniques.One is a two handed war club the other is a one handed mace. Both smash good but they both have their own strengths and weaknesses.Learn and practice both.
>What is goju?Goju aka Gōjū-ryū (剛柔流) (or hard and soft style) is a modern martial art originating on the island of Okinawa in the 1930s by a man named Chojun Miyagi (the real life inspiration for Mr.Miyagi in the karate kid film series). It is much more modern and refined compared to traditional martial arts such as boxing and brazilian jiujitsu>What does hard and soft style mean?Hard and soft style means goju could be considered the original mixed martial art! It was created on the Island of okinawa which was at the center of trade in east asia. It combines striking techniques found from china and thailand with the indigenous okinawan wrestling techniques to create a truly complete fighting arthttps://youtu.be/5kv8HkGWo2Q>What is the purpose of Goju?the purpose of goju has always been for personal self defense as well as building a hardy and fit body through rigorous daily training and conditioning>I've heard it's related to Kyokushin?That's correct. Mas Oyama was a 7th degree black belt in Goju, however he wanted his students to compete in competitions therefore he had to strip away some of the more dangerous techniques found in Goju to create Kyokushin which by comparison is much safer to use in a sport setting. Similar to how Kano needed to modify battlefield jujitsu into judo.>What is sparring like?Sparring in goju is done with full contact and intensity, however for safety reasons Some of the more dangerous techniques are generally left out of sparring so as to not permanently injure other studentsexamples of striking and grappling training can be seen herehttps://youtu.be/vvJo4B50TVIhttps://youtu.be/TsBsyCLBTUghttps://youtu.be/dK__ILvQ20whttps://youtu.be/NBrWIfIbX-A>Sounds great! how can I learn it??Goju is not very wide spread outside of Okinawa, because its so modern and exclusive, but it does exist in other parts of the world as wellif you cannot find it near you, you can get started with thishttps://youtu.be/_RmCzJ0m1Xs
>>145214I want to believe an organized branch of karate can be as based as you make it sound.
>>145214>https://youtu.be/vvJo4B50TVI [Embed]>https://youtu.be/TsBsyCLBTUg [Embed]>https://youtu.be/dK__ILvQ20w [Embed]>https://youtu.be/NBrWIfIbX-A [Embed]Thisis soFUCKING BADEspecially grappling and takedown part
>>145486you're never going to find another martial art more complete and well rounded than goju
>>145525Combat sambo, kudo. Also, going to judo 2x times per week and muay thai 2x per week or concentraining on grappling martial arts for 2-3 years and then going to striking martial art (and vice versa) is also an option and will produce better result than some shitty meme karate style
>>145214What about Uechi-ryu?
>>145525Martial art shouldn't be complete or well rounded, it should be specialized
>>145214if you leave out the more dangerous techniques in sparring, thereby never applying them against a fully resisting opponent, how will you ever know they work, let alone become good at using them?
>>145536Yea, yknow, widely available combat sambo and kudo. Definitely not niche styles that have literally no fucking presence in the US.Judo is barely better, just as rare.
>>147217They have an online belt certification program...I'm tempted....
>>147539so they took the worst thing about gracie jiujitsu and decided yup, that's the part we want to copy!no but seriously it says you need to be a black belt already in an actual karate style and not some american kempo shit or whatever, but the more concerning part is the website hasn't been updated since 2020
Almost had a decent teaching gig but of course there was a catch.The company has a non-compete clause that prohibits teaching any martial arts anywhere in the state during working for them and for 3 years after leaving the company.And agreeing to pay $70 dollars a day in damages for every day found in violation of the contract. Which is more then the job pays in the first place.It's literally the worst contact clause I have ever seen for any job I have ever thought of working.There is no way I am signing that bullshit.I can't believe others thought it was remotely acceptable. Like did they actually read the contract. It's only 10 pages long.
>>148438That one seems overly broad and not enforceableEven if you got a job in the same town it's hard to enforce anything that says if you have a profession and stop working for us you arent allowed to have your profession anymoreI've never honored any non-competes anyway. They can suck my mound
>>144739>whereas i've seen a lot of thaiboxers/dutch style kickboxers not do thisI know what you mean Alex Pereira does this as did Anderson Silva actually but those are not traditional thai roundhouse kicks. Actually kicking with that much swing without pivoting your foot is a bit bad for your knees. They are definitely doing it to avoid telegraphing though.
>>147218>Judo is barely better, just as rare.not in europe it isn't. not where i live anyway.t. dutchbro
I want to get back into martial arts again after having taken a decade-long hiatus due to impinged nerves and life reasons. I used to do Kukkiwon TKD for well over a decade prior but, while I enjoyed the kicks immensely, there was a severe lack of proper blocking or striking techniques that didn't strictly involve the instep or ball of the foot. I tried Aikido and that was very obviously a meme. I would like to find a Karatedo that I can at least integrate a fistful of what I've learned without it being a complete waste. I was eying Goju-Ryu and Kyokoshin, but I wanted to get some input on what all entirely there is that would be reasonably located and taught in the United States. I live in the South, and the vast majority of what I've found are all McDojos regardless the martial art. So far, I've at least tried to look out for the following for schools:>Charge $100+ a month and require at least a six-month signup plan>Teach out of an outlet-mall style rent-a-space>Have anyone over green belt who has any form of belly>An exceptional surplus of child students and only a very few amount of adult students>Any belt colors like camouflaged>Don't practice sparring of some form, either light contact or full contact>Teach more than two wildly different styles, like TKD and BJJDo you have any other recommendations? I used to post on /asp/ and figured this might be the next-best place to ask. I'm still interested in hard-style affects, but I wouldn't be opposed to picking up something that has soft-style elements, too. I'm very big in traditional elements and it seems a concept lost on most schools around here, sadly. I've tried getting back more into shape and practicing my old kicks, but I move so slow and everything feels so painfully telegraphed. I don't intend on my future school also being a place that will get me more into shape but simply teach me martial arts, but it would still be very welcome.
>>131165What the fuck is this kick? My brain is full of fuck right now. So he turns and it looks like it could be a spinning heel kick but he somehow maintains the momentum to throw a roundhouse in the direction in came from? That was crazy cool.
>>150284Any offshoot of kyokushin.Any karate styl where they do free sparring.Or you can try kickboxing, I did it for 3 years after karate because I had moved from my city and it's close to full contact karate and can be very fun.You can even surprise the people with precise kicks.Godd luck in your search anon.
>>151829Jo Miyahara about to debut in Karate Combat.. maybe it'll be worth watching again
>>152412Honestly hate karate combat, it's not karate, it's not kick boxing, it's just crypto shit with point fighters poking each other.>>151833the most recent kudo world cup was so fucking good, so many headbutt KOs, amazing throws, spinning kicks etc etc, I love Kudo so much.
anybody watching the crypto scam tonight?
first the olympics and now karate combat has done more to damage karates already poor reputation in 2 years than all of MMA did in the last 30this shit is absolutely embarrassing, I'm done trying to defend this stuffso you can just double leg your opponent repeatedly into the wall, do no damage and then win a fightwhy are double legs even allowed in a karate match? just do MMA at that point
>>153003only watched Jo Miyahara, he won as expected, catching up now on the fighters I like to find out
I keep seeing in japanese fiction that there was a time period when karate was really "le killing art" but the closest thing to it its Motobu Choki and Oyama biographies
>>153097Oyama was a grifter, he straight up faked thingsand choki was actually a known street fighterHe definitely beat up a western boxer once and also definitely beat up funakoshiHe was known to get drunk and fight people and believed drinking alcohol is as important for karate as Eddie bravo thinks smoking weed is for jiujitsuIt was never some kind of ancient battle field art. Just a way to get some exercise and fight at the bar
>>153097The real time of the "Killing art" was the 60s/70s, mainly because lots of black belts ran their mouth about being one hit killing machines, and people hired kyokushin black belts as bodyguard etc. Oyama was never a real killer but a lot of his students would get into major brawls, Hideyuki Ashihara was probably the most real "killer" of that time period, mainly because he was always brawling until the 80s.
>>153097Karate when born and introduced to Japan was infused with the spirit of Budo that's where "le killing art" kind of meme started.You pointed two ways of effective karate.Motobu was pure Okinawan karate mentality, he didn't even try to put japanese concepts or mentality into his karate so it remained pure okinawan without any budo in it and it mostly failed to expand to the rest of Japan and now it's very small, almost a lost art.Oyama it's pure japanese karate, infused with budo, as his kamikaze ultra-japanese past show, so these tendencies made a great impact in his karate, giving it with a clear budo mindset.Many of the old masters (pre-funakoshi) have a more subtle aura of what karate was suposed to be but it seems mostly lost.Also apparently a Kanbun Uechi chinese student killed a man in a land dispute making the teacher to stop teaching karate for some years.
>>153100Oyama was a grifter but still a great deal of him is real enough.He trained hard, won tournament, mastered styles and created his own system which is a solid style with a lot of credibility.Choki was the real deal but maybe his own instruction was incomplete because of his own character faults. He liked to brawl at bars and red light discricts but he was pretty unique in that endeavour. His own teacher was a royal bodyguard who apparently was very displeased with such practices.
>>153100>>153319And during and after WW2?
>>153369Karate pre-WW2 was mostly an Okinawan thing, even with Funakoshi bringing it over, it was less Japanese than Kendo or Judo, and thus you didn't have that many crazy military karateka going to China to practice killing blows on POWs like you did with kenjutsu, Jujutsu, Aiki-jujutsu, Judo, etc etc
I have the choice between training Goju-Ryu Karate or Kyokushin, which one is more useful when it comes to becoming better at hand to hand combat? I am interested in both grappling and striking in martial arts, as well as full-contact sparring as a way to train. So which one is more recommendable ?
>>153493>Goju-Ryudo you really need to ask?goju is the ultimate karate stylejust compare for yourself this is gojuhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7X9pAPl7VwIthis is kyokushinhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maiQ2SzSJnMeven to a novice its clear which one has more practical fighting applicaitonsone is full contact with grappling and submissionsthe other is 2 retards standing chest to chest punching each other in the belly and leaving their heads totally unprotected
>>153493Go to both of them and talk with the teacher and the people there. The style matters way less than the teacher.Most dojos I know you can go a day or two for a free trial. Try both if you can and you will see which one adecuates more with your goals.In Kyokushin full-contact sparring is almost guaranteed, so heavy training with a lot of focus in pseudo-realistic combat.But Goju-ryu is more tricky as dojos vary greatly beetween them, some do very hard training with a lot of emphasis not just in more realistic sparring but in real self defense and some do way less sparring and combat and focus more on kata and choreographed combat series.My personal opinion is that "fight focused" Goju-ryu is usually better than Kyokushin but much rarer to find.Good luck anon.
>>153497>le different tournaments.... have le different rulesetsretard
>>153663this isn't training, this is abuse of cult membershttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQBBSLtReNknothing about this will make you a better fighter, in fact it will make you a worse one because it breaks your body down fasterit's also the lions share of what kyokushin practitioners spend their "training" time doing, just standing in one spot hitting objects or getting hit
>>153664>Oooh goju ryu is so much better it's so much tougher>posts normal conditioning for any traditional hard style>woaaaah they're in a cult woaah it's abusiveYou think they dont do that in Goju ryu you retard? I've seen Goju ryu karateka in sanchin take completely unprotected groin shots for "conditioning". All full contact karate styles do stuff like this. MMA fighters, boxers, Muay Thai fighters do this. Even old school free style wrestlers would do insane neck strength exercises like that.
>>153664Dude, all strikes were delivered with controlled force precisely to large muscle groups that when trained can take tons of impacts without lasting damage.It's honestly not that different from any training nessasary to prepare for full contact fighting.Hell, even pro wrestlers who don't even fight for real do conditioning similar so they can take hard "bumps" show after show after show.Such a session as shown in the video has a pretty low likelihood of causing injury.
>>153664Wtf lol traditional karate like goju and uechi ryu is all about punching makiwara and getting hit with the shinai. But kyokushin does it and you say it is bad. You can't have your cake and eat it too 99% of goju ryu looks literally nothing like the video you posted and even if it did why not just do mma instead? https://youtube.com/shorts/1PslrhcaAC0?feature=share
>>153666>>153720>>153729Tell me all about how standing on someone's face and jumping up and down is normal training
>>153731The side of the head isn't someone's face and there was no actual jumping on the head.Quit being a hyperbolic queen.
>>153733with that attitude I will keep the scroll my sensei gave me to myselfit has our styles final technique included in it, only to be used when there is no other optionI haven't mastered it fully myself, but now I won't even share it
>>153737If you had such a thing why would you share it to begin with lmao
>>153744Because he entrusted it to me and only 2 others, and I was his chosen successor but I betrayed him and left to follow my own path before my training was completeHe had no sons so his wish was for me to train his grandson when the time cameBut now that I'm on my own it's mine to do what I will with it, and I don't believe in hoarding secretsAnyone that has a willingness to learn should be able to learn. Martial arts is the inheritance of the world
My shihan wants me to take a kyokushin fight in cage…. What do bros? It’ll be with shin pads and nothing else, anyone ever fight in a cage before what’s it like?>>153737Does it involve shoving the scroll up your ass and have a sissy prostate orgasm you tremendous faggot?
>>153791>kyokushin>fightNo punches to the head means it's not a fightBro it totally is a fight! We just don't do the most basic common moves literally everyone else does
>>153865While I do believe this, if we applied to logic thoroughly a lot of styles would suddenly be bullshit. If you draw the line in the sand at attack the head, what else can you point to and go, look if that's not in it's a fight.In the judo gen just a bit ago was a dude asking about armpit & collar holds, which the IJF don't permit...How is that not the same in principle?
>>153866I don't consider grappling sports to be fights either, even less so than karate because at least in karate there's blunt force involved I think it's really cringy when bjj people talk about having a fight coming up. You mean a match, you're wrestling, there's no real reasonable risk of damage to you
>>153493Kyokushin at least try to fight, the vast majority of dojos are glorified daycares
>>136129Thats the prob about changing things, how far do you go. My class has drifted to a mma/ kickboxing class more and more which is positive. Sparring is pretty much kick boxing now but imo i been saying about making one eve trad, in some ways its less effective but better in conditioning
>>152415how is it not karate? bc they're not wearing a gi top? bc they wear gloves? and how is it not kickboxing? they're kicking and boxing w/ limited grappling and groundfighting allowed. sanda is much heavier on the grappling and is still called chinese kickboxing.it's important to remember that both dutch and american kickboxing have their origins in karate, and in their early stages of development it was often even referred to as karate, and many kickboxing orgs had karate in the name. w/ that in mind, karate combat is pretty much long pants kb w/ mma gloves and limited grappling and groundfighting in a 'pit' instead of a ring.
>>153015there was a lot more grappling in original okinawan karate, apparently. if anything, i would say it's a return to tradition.also, karate and really any tma w/ bad reputations stand to gain a lot from full contact competitions, as all the ineffective techniques get filtered out.
6th kyu grading tomorrow lets go>>154268>reddit spacing>no open handed strikes>no low kicks>no gi top>no elbows>only just added knees>very limited striking in the clinchI remember the grappling rules being retarded desu bt they might have changed them. It's not kickboxing because 90% of the athletes are sport karateka and would not survive a kickboxing bout, so visually there's none of the skill, finesse, power, etc associated with the legends of K1, the Asahisa Brothers, Tenshin, Takeru, any of the karate based kickboxers who continue to dominate in other leagues till this day etc etc. So when actual kickboxers turn up they have been domiating. Also everyone knows all that crap about the origins of kickboxing etc that doesn't matter, they have nothing on the original American kickboxing leagues, and nothing on European kickboxing either.
>>154273in retrospect it has been discovered that in the karate combat the rules specifically state that single and double leg takedowns are strictly forbidden techniqueswith one exception being the single leg is allowed on a caught kick. you aren't allowed to take shotsthey have no idea what their own rules are, the guy was doing blatant fouls the entire time and not only was the referee not calling him for it, but he was allowing it to happen and the judges scored the illegal techniquesmade even worse because also based on the judging criteria takedowns in and of themselves are not scoring techniques. they're a tool you can use to get ground and pound damage, but the takedown with no damage doesn't count for anything.
Why Azuma and his students choose to add boxing, jiu-jitsu and muay thai to karate?They explain the benefits?
>>154399Good marketing buzzwords
>>154280They would make it a lot easier on themselves if they just use modified American kickboxing rules for their gimmick pit.American kickboxing was literally just full contact karate.
>>154488Why the hell do they flinch so hard?This is what happened when you're not used to hitting hit in the face, you get a little slap from the foot and go down like you're being attacked by a swarm of invisible bees
>>154491You can't be serious.I would like to see how you would react to a full force kick to the head.I doubt you would be very coordinated when viewed in slowmo.
>>154550If someone gets KOd they're KOd, they go stiff or limp and just dropThey don't flap their arms and turn their face away going owey ouch ouch ouch owwwwIt happens every time you see these pussies try to fight a boxer, glancing blows that any self respecting fighter would just eat and shrug off makes them take a knee to collect themselvesIn fact they do that a lot with body shots too. Never seen people take a knee so oftenIt's a disgrace, complete trash
>>154491>>154566It's that or WKF
>>154577karate will never have anything better because it never demands anything betterpeople are too addicted to their echo chamberthe funniest thing in the world to me is going to a karate tournament and yelling "hey sensei!" and seeing 50 people turn around to lookfucking losers
>>154491u r retarded
From karate point of view, do you think kudo should work kata, how kata can help them?, or do you think karate should be like kudo and just stop teaching kata?
>>154725Kata is an obsolete solution to the problem of illiteracyNobody knew how to read 100 or more years ago, kata was the only way to organize and remember things. The illiterates couldn't exactly write down notes to review later.It's being preserved because of muh tradition. It's only appropriate at this time to show it to beginners so they have something to sink their teeth into while starting outBut if you're practicing for 6 months and still use kata there's something wrong here
>>154725>>154729How you convince a 60 years old japanese man that has being training the same way his whole life?
>>154775Gomennasai ojii-chan, but kata is shit desuyo~ Wakarimasuka??At that age maybe it's not too bad, it's something the old timers can do like the elders doing Tai chi at the parkIt's the new generation that needs to adopt a modern evidence based approach to training
>>154779The old timers control everything
>>154781Then beat em up idfk
Check it out this game, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2t79umkvrUhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-J_lcRfSMQIt's on sale right now, fucking cheap.
>>155497Already have it.It's ok but I got bored when it started to require a lot of grinding to progress.Definitely feels artificially padded with grind to make up for having low content.
>>154725>do you think karate should be like kudo and just stop teaching kata?Yes.I have never been a fan of kata. It's my least favorite part of karate.
Of all the okinawan styles which one has the most down to earth mentality/philosophy?Like "we must spar with a resisting opponent and exercise with weights".Not the zero contact and just kata method of Funakoshi.Oyamas mentality was really that revolutionary in Karate?
>>155783well unfortunately the funakoshis influence to karate is undeniable at this point, even okinawan styles have adopted much of his cancerous philosophy but obviously the answer is gojuhojo undo is the defining characteristic of it above all else I'd sayand then I guess read chokis book
>>155783>Oyamas mentality was really that revolutionary in Karate?No, but it is very rare in Japan and the "bushido mentality" in Kyokushin is almost the opposite of the okinawan styles mentality.As >>155784 said some Goju masters still have a spar and strengthen the body curriculum.The whole problem is that all okinawan styles had a down to earth philosophy and singlehandily Funakoshi, and his son Gigo, transitioned that martial art karate into a more philosopical sport karate.You can even see this in Funakoshi own account, in his book "karate-do. My way of life":"The karate I am teaching is not the karate I was taught by my masters."And also goes on also about how both his teachers did extreme body coinditioning, wrestled with each other, etc...Many of the "old masters" actually fought and trained to fight: Sokon Matsumura, Motobu Choki, Chōtoku Kyan, ...Also from the same Anko Itosu, teacher of Funakoshi:"The primary purpose of karate training is to strengthen the muscles, making the physique strong like iron and stone"
>>126367I bought a used hardcover of Masutatsu Oyama's "This is Karate".
>>137886I meant to reply to you -> >>156335 herehttps://annas-archive.org/md5/2113c4003e05f789488e51afdd968675I'm pretty sure this was his magnum opus. It has details about his life too.
>>154729>Kata is an obsolete solution to the problem of illiteracy>Nobody knew how to read 100 or more years agoGod damn you are retarded
>>147218>Yea, yknow, widely available combat sambo and kudoRead more than first fucking sentence
>>153493Goju Ryu is low rivalry rubbish, katas are useless and and bunkais are absolute fantasies
>>153497Greco roman wrestling looks even less like it has practical fighting application, but weakest greco roman wrestler would absolutely destroy any "strongest" goju ryu "fighter"
>>153865>>greco roman wrestling>>fight>No leg trips means it's not a fight>>free style wrestling>>fight>No submissions means it's not a fightHello retard
>>156945Those aren't fights either
>>156941The literacy rate in japan at the beginning of the 20th century was about 40%It wasn't until 1950 that greater than 50% of the adult population had completed primary school
>>157081>source: my assI know you got it from jewpedia, same thing. There was no mention of literacy rate & priory to the education reform no one gave a shit about primary school because they still heavily relied upon apprenticeships.>>154729It was not a solution to illiteracy you lying sack of shit. You're making that up & there is not 1 shred of proof. Just your extremely retarded opinion. Kata was a solution for injuries & mass instruction. Imagine how much more dangerous practicing this shit was back in the day. How easily it could cripple & ruin livlihoods. This is the core reason why all TMA styles get shat on for not pressure testing enough. Because it wasn't made for that shit. No common man was doing martial arts back in the day to get into frivolous vanity fights for fucking money. It was either going to be used in a real situation or not at all.
>>157081Before karate went to Japan it was something that aristocrats do. And katas still existed
>>157080I don't care about your definitions, wrestler can absolutely destroy karateka with no additional training
>>157096>no mention of literacy rate & priory to the education reform no one gave a shit about primary school becauseso your argument is people were more literate prior to education reform?that doesn't make much sense now does it
>>157130No my argument is that anon is pulling shit out they ass & literacy was not an issue. Education reforms in Japan was all driven by westernization. And the issue of literacy in japan has fuck all to do with the purpose of kata.
Does this sound like a McDojo anons? I simply asked if they did sparring at this guy's Okinawan Karate dojo.
>>158149well the good news is if you sign up you'll probably learn how to make a killer dressing to go with that word salad
>>158149It sounds like some form of premade kumite for self defense like Goshin, so it may not be a "hard kumite" dojo but is not a "game of touch kumite" dojo.My personal opinion is that, if done well, it is more useful than sportlike kumite for those who want to learn self defense but, without live hard sparring with hits that contact and no separation after a hit it will be very difficult to attain the mental state to perform well under pressure, as in a self defense situation.I have seen good Goshin performed and it is way better than hard kumite for learning how to deal with an actual combat situation outside the mat.
>>158149That sounds like they only do 1 step sparing and created a fuck ton of cope around not doing any free sparing which is total bullshit. Leave/don't give them money.
Best stretches for kick flexibility? Mostly having trouble with getting my leg high enough laterally.
>>158239https://youtu.be/VL5CIMJZSgQI use this for my students.
how does one move up in the karate belt system?
>>126367Am I better off learning at home then a mc dojo that promised me a black belt in 2y?
>>159165From my experience:For beginner belts (white to brown) usually the instructor says when you are ready to take the next level and either just gives you a new belt or does a small test, usually involving the performance of some kata, mock kumite and kumite, and afterwards awards you the next belt. For learned belts (Shodan and up) a test has to be arranged and paid for in the federation you are part of and you are judged, usually with a bunch of other candidates, by several masters in all aspects of karate (knowledge, kata, kumite, bunkai, etc...).>>160493A blak belt in 2 years is a reasonable timeframe for an adult. Shodan is just a learned beginner rank, so it may not be a mcdojo. In the old days the white belt was just for complete novices and a black belt was expected after 6 to 12 months to start doing real karate.Now is there are children with black belts running around, no real kumite sparring, or no well defined lineage or federation then you are dealing with a mcdojo and you are better off stayin away and learning on your own. There are several books written by founders and true masters that deal with solo training that will take you way beyond what any mcdojo can offer. Good luck..
>>160594They also had a no sparing rule, and offered to start me at a high belt for a extra price. So i just guessed they were a mcdojo.>There are several books written by founders and true masters that deal with solo training that will take you way beyond what any mcdojo can offer. Good luck..Could you give the name of the author or books? Sorry but I am not finding them with google.
>>159165For the ranks below blackIts about coming consistently to class and making progress. Every few months there will be a test where if the instructors agree you are ready they will invite/allow you to participate in. If you pass the test then you rank up.Continue until your black belt. From there your path is much less certain for advancement as you are usually expected to start guiding the direction of your own training. Your increase in rank is generally reflective of your progress along the path you chose in your training. For example I started running classes and becoming a instructor and then teacher. So my ranking up showed my mastery along this path. Some become competitors and tournament fighters. Some become historians and philosophers of the art. Writing books and tracking down obscure bits of the lost past. Some are innovators, pushing karate forward and keeping the art properly "alive"Some are technicians working towards technical perfectionAnd so on and so on.At least that is my perspective and experience. Your results may vary.
>>160738>offered to start me at a high belt for a extra priceYou were right, that's a mcdojo.Of the top of my head, you can search them on libgen or anna's archive:Okinawan:-The essence of okinawan karate by Soshin Naganime. (Shorin-ryu)-Okinawa Goju ryu by Eiichi Miyazato (Goju ryu)-Okinawan kenpo by Choki Motobu (Motobu ruy)Japanese:-Karate do Kyohan by Gichin Funakoshi (Shotokan)-Dynamic karate by Masatoshi Nakayama (Shotokan)-Mas Oyama's Essential Karate (Kyokushin)Still having a good instructor is way better than training solo. By training solo you can only train some aspects of karate (kihon, kata, conditioning) and they are not being trained properly (no supervision or corections when necessary). Also you can't do kumite which should be about a 1/3 of the training.So with the books you can learn the basics and get some good fitness, technique, speed, strength and some muscle memory but finding a good instructor should be a priority.There are many styles that have no books or are very difficult to come by, so my list just includes some solid works of some main styles.I have to repeat that just solo training can only take you so far.You have to learn to take a punch, to measure distance in combat, to react by sheer instinct,... and solo training can't offer you that.Good luck anon.
I did it brosCurrent kumite state champion. 2nd place was a close friend of mine who is a muay tai national champion. Obviously not the same kind of fighting, but he is a genetic freak at 6'10 and around 260 lbs. Me and him spar/train regularly together which is why we crushed the competition and also why i was familiar enough with his reach and style to win. Feels awesome.
>>161014I once had a fake gold medal made for a competition that didn't exist just so I could get some attention at work
Anyone have any good books about Sabaki and other concepts?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-aV5SnnENM>>153791I did the cage fight bros, it was awesome. 10/10 would reccomend everyone to try knockdown karate, especially in a cage
>>160493Any dojo that gives you an EXACT timeframe for a belt is a mcdojo. The time it takes for you to earn a belt is up to you, not just because you've been to many sessions, you have to learn the techniques, the kata, and standard of fitness, discipline, and martial prowess.
>>163870Enshin's founder has a book Sabaki Method: Karate in the Inner Circle.I also recommend Ninomiya's teacher (who incorporated much of Sabaki in his interpretation of Kyokushin), Hideyuki Ashihara's Fighting Karate book.
>>155783Oyama wasn't the only one who wanted a more realistic application of karate. He just popularized it. Choki Motobu was a rough-and-ready practitioner. He's the one karate instructor (along with Kanbun Uechi) that I wish was still around. Motobu famously knocked out a European boxer who was challenging Japanese in one of those popular West vs East matches. However, Gichin Funakoshi was inaccurately given the credit and publicity to Motobu's fury. Motobu's disciple, Tatsuo Yamada took his mentor's teachings even further when he incorporated Muay Thai training and techniques in the 1950's, thus formulating the early stages of Japanese Kickboxing.
How much training volume is required to git gud? I'm wanting to branch out from my grappling background to some kind of striking and I always loved the idea of Karate. I've found a Gojū-Ryu gym that seems to.be from a fairly reputable organization in my country (local instructors are 5th and 3rd dan, headmaster in another location is 8th dan), BUT due to schedule issues at best I'd be able to train 3x a week there. Alternatively I've found a good Muay Thai gym with even a couple pro fighters based out of there that I could take classes in up to 6x per week. Obviously MT 6x per week would be unhealthy for a beginner, but I think I could manage something like 4x per week and work up from there as I get used to it.I'm/fit/ (working out 6x per week religiously for about 2 years and only plan to reduce thhat if the volume + fighting proves too much) and have about 6 years of previous martial arts experience, so I don't feel general conditioning to start training would be too much of issue. However, with Karate offering me at most less weekly volume than the alternative I feel a bit conflicted about what to choose.
>>165370Also, there's a Kyokushin place associated with the KWU I've found that could give me 4 weekly classes, but they honestly didn't seem that impressive. I know basically nothing about Karate organizations, is the KWU recognized as a decent one for making good full contact fighters?
>>1653703x a week is good enough based on your build, its more about the sparring that's required to get good, learning the Kata might take longer depending on your memory.
>>165372>3x a week is good enough based on your buildBut how much better off would I be with 4x or even 5x a week? I could get that at the Muay Thai gym and Muay Thai training tends to be more focused on sparring, mitts and other "hard" training methods than any Karate style traditionally is. I'd prefer Karate because I love Nip shit and already have experience with Jap and Jap-influenced martial arts, but becoming a strong fighter is my #1 priority. >learning the Kata might take longer depending on your memory.I feel I do have good muscle memory, back when I did BJJ I'd spend most of the day running the movements for sweeps from more complex guards through my head while I was going around my day and that always gave me great results between sessions. Obviously not the same as Kata, but I feel once I get the movements down I wouldn't necessarily need to be at the dojo to actually train Kata, I could improve that on my own with probably decent results.
>>165374Rest is almost as important for the body as the act of training, x4 is probably the top you need as non-pro.Myau Thai is not bad for the goal of becoming a strong fighter in your weight category, its highly cardio focused though, your grappling will def be of use in the clinch as long as you have good understanding of headlocks from stand up position, you might have to train less in the gym and more for conditioning in Myau Thai to have proper rest for your body to recover from the abuse.Kata is not the same as practicing single movement patterns like in boxing 1-2-3 but, step, block, step strike or sometimes throw and finish combined with yells (kiai) and shit of that nature. It is more akin to dancing or choreography than pattern building in the sense of combat sports with Kata.
>>165377>It is more akin to dancing or choreography than pattern building in the sense of combat sports with Kata.Yeah, I get that. I mentioned my BJJ mental exercises are also fairly complex and long movements, though not to.the same extent or detail as Kata. Either way, my focus would definitely be on "combat" and Kata something I'd do mostly because it's part of the curriculum. As I've said before, I'm not intimately knowledgeable about Karate, but I hear the actual application of Kata in fighting (Bunkai?) is a pretty controversial field, so I'm expecting the translated value of good Kata to be fairly limited to me. If lifelong Karatekas can't figure it out I most likely won't be able to.
>>145214What's the difference between Goju-ryu and whatever the hell is "Gojukai"?
>>1454861st video had pretty good grappling for what you can expect in a Karate competition setting. 3rd video had decent techniques but sloppy execution for training, they need to cross train with no gi BJJ guys or catch wrestlers to improve. 4th video with the Kudo-like competition had solid takedowns and takedown defenses from the guy with his back to the camera, the other was a bit meh.Not bad for something that doesn't focus 100% on grappling, you're overreacting. >t. has done Judo and BJJ for years.
>>145782>Martial art shouldn't be complete or well rounded, it should be specializedIf you want to become world class at one thing and shit at others, sure.
Newfag here, I have the choice between a Goju Ryu and a Kyokushin dojo, both apparently at least pretty decent (no major redflags). Which one should I go for if I like sparring best?I know Kyokushin is more famous for beating the shit out of each other, but the GR sensei told me they also do a lot of full contact and that the Kyokushin ruleset is a bit more restricted with no head punches, whereas they do it with gloves and helmets.
>>165731Kyokushin, you probably exercise more and techniques have a more practical approach
>>165731the answer is clearly goju, kyokushin is even less useful than sport karate point sparring when it comes to fightingit's mostly just a toughness contest where they stand in front of each other and wing body shots until someone can't take it anymorethere's no defense at allwhat's the #1 thing untrained guys will do in a street fight? punch you in the headwhat's the only thing you DONT practice in kyokushin? exactly
>>165740I don't really care about self-defense. I don't chase fights and always try to desescalate tense situations, if someone's mugging me I'm not dying over a phone. I just want to wear the kimono, talk in broken nipspeak and POONCH hard like my anime characters.
>>165751well if this seems desirable to you then be my guest I guesshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQBBSLtReNk
>>165752That's just conditioning. It's not a big deal, back when I used to box we'd do the same with gloves and medicine balls. I've never practiced it but I heard it's common to strike and rub shins with wooden staffs in Muay Thai.
>>165755Blunt force Impacts aren't like creating a resistance to poisonIt's all bravado stuff, your body will break all the same whether you do that or not
>>165764Your bones will 100% get tougher from it, and if you do it to big ones that don't move live your thighs, shins and forearms the side-effects are pretty manageable. Blows to soft tissue can help you understand better the USE of your muscles to mitigate damage; you might not get inherently more resistant but your use of the body will make you harder to hurt. And of course that's already disregarding the mental strengthening from getting used to being hit. That shit hurts and hurty things are scary, so it can be useful to condition that fear out of your response.
>>165740There is exceptions but the vast majority of karate dojos are obsessed with forms and sparring its nonexistent, you can say all you want about Kyokushin but at least sparring its supposed to be guaranteed.
>>165806Would watching graduation exams be a good gauge of a dojo's worth as a newfag? Regardless of what they try to sell you in those graduations you'd actually get to see what they actually value and emphasise on the curriculum. I'm >>165731 and the GR instructors I talked to invited me to watch the exams they'll be holding tomorrow morning. Any tips on what I should be watching out for to see if they're legit? They promised me they frequently spar, but would not seeing a lot of Kumite be a red flag, or is that just not common in those? Back when I did Judo while we were primarily graded on technique execution we still needed to have a match against other guys our rank to show we could actually use what we were supposed to know. Not about winning, but performance quality.
>>165811post their websites
>>165813Why? Either way I doubt it'd be of much use, I'm a brazilmonkey so its all in Portuguese
>>165814I want to see any videos they have posted and can infer a lot
>>165814Though in their website they lista their training programme >seiza and meditation>warm up and conditioning >stretching>Kihon Tachi>Kihon Idō>Jiyu/Shiai Kumite techniques>Yakusoku Kumite/Tori Te>Kata & Jiyu/Shiai KumiteClasses are 2 hours long, so from googling those terms I guess I'd have about 30 minutes of free or point sparring in a day? Is that decent?
>>165818No videos, but they have a single post about a student getting a gold medal in the national levels in what appears to be point fighting. It's just a single one and from last year, and given this is supposed to be a pretty big organization with 17 dojos across the country I guess not THAT great?
>>1658113 hours in, it has been only kihon, kata and bunkai so far. About 25 people, mostly blue belts. No sparring as of yet, but I saw the yellow belts putting on gloves and shin guards, and from what I can gather only they'll be having kumite, though I don't know if that's because the higher belts are supposed to go bare knucle full-contact.The absolute highlight has been a flatelicious alt girl.
>>165858Ah OK, blues are gering up now, so I guess the higher belts will too and just haven't done that yet because they're supposed to help out with some thing or another.
>>165858Try to look the Kyokushin class too
>>165889I got some videos from the end of the exams, there was point fighting and full-contact for the greens and up, and bare knuckle for the one brown belt that was taking the exam. I'll post the webm if I find a converter that isn't gay about conversion size limits.
>>165896Fuck that shit, have a drive instead. I only uploaded what the Brown Belt did, since everyone that was a lower rank did the kumite in batches of 4 or 5 and it just got a bit too chaotic to look good on camera. First he did point sparring with another Brown Belt that wasn't taking the exams, then light contact with a guest Black Belt from a school of another organization (asian dude, he looked sick though, I saw him hunching over a toilet before). At the end he had full-contact with the Dojo's main instructor (that 5 foot nothing ball, who'' supposed to be 5th dan)https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/17QSlqj_dtztV7FpH_PPhTR4FMfwOcZmOI think the access setting are alright, but let me know if not.
>>126367How do I fasten the results of my dim mak?Eight years ago I hit a friend of mine with a dim mak in during a spar and just two weeks ago he died of cancer (no doubt the latent effect of my deadly technique) but how do I make it set in faster?
>>166209>Anon used jabbing vax palm>Anon's friend dieThe chinks and japs warned us and we made fun of them. Dim Mak is real.
Is there a specific Okinawan/Japanese hojo undo to toughen up your cock. For combat of course.
>>165740you're retarded and will never beat even the lowest kyokushin noob in a street fight lol. If kyokushin had head punches the fights would be over in seconds, the objective of a tournament is not just about greatest technique, the most skill etc etc, but about who has the strongest will. Kyokushin only becomes stronger if you let them punch you in the head lol
>>165919...... you should skip this and do kyokushin lol. Only good/interesting part of any of that was the few throws and ground work. The rest was just the standard "shout really hard and do no damage" that is prolific within all karate that aims to compete under WKF rules. You live in brazil, you should try to join a dojo that was or is affiliated with Francisco Filho or the IKO. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMQmOIUgO84
>>166541A kyokushin guy would just headbutt you first before he would throw a punch, they are close quarters sluggers.
>>166567At the range they fight they're are the mercy of a grappler that will do what ever they wantAh no! Don't grab me! Just stand there and let me hit you!! So dishonorabuuuu*ack*
>>166542I won't blame you for not knowing local geography, but Francisco Filho's dojos are.mostly concentrated on a specific part of the country and the closest one is over 6 hours away by car.Locally speaking the only IKF dojo is about 1.5 hours away cutting through the unironic worst traffic in the entire country, and the area has become thick with hundreds of literal crackheads over this last year. Around my general area there's only Gojū-Ryu and Uechi-Ryū dojos, and a single KWU dojo that, quite honestly, is nothing to write home about. Just 4 students, technique even I could tell was sub-par and pretty ugly looking kata.I'm not bothered by WKF style point fighting at all, I think it's a valuable toll to develop certain skills you often see lacking in people that only do full-contact. The opposite is also true. I'd prefer to be able to train and ventually compete in both. I'll try to keep looking into what I could get on neighboring cities (metropolitan area) that isn't too out of the way, but after a certain point it's just too inconvenient. I work 8-18 and weight lift early in the morning, so if it's too far away I'll get home too late to rest properly to hit the gym the following morning. Either way I'm thinking about getting a versatile punching bag I can train head and body blows in to supplement my training, whatever I end up choosing. This one I found for pretty cheap, it's big and sturdy enough and from my previous boxing experience gives a lot of versatility.
Question to all the karate practioners on this board.How does it feel knowing you train every day just to get clowned on by someone who knows muay thai, wrestling, boxing, MMA or even BJJ?Do you guys enjoy the humiliation?
>>166608How does it feel knowing that you train muay thai, wrestling, boxing, MMA or even BJJ every day just to get clowened on by someone who knows gun?If you practice for anything other than just self-satisfaction you're a retard.
>>166613People don't own guns in my country you mutt.Nice try tho, but I'm better than you. In more ways than one.
>>166621They can't in.my country either, but criminals still have them, and literally anyone anywhere can get their hands on a chef knife to mess you up. The only reasonable real life application for fighting skills is if you get into street fights, but doing that takes conscious effort and marks you as a lowlife.
>>166625>they can't in my country either>criminals can!So they can in your country.You basedboy ai kido/karate geeks are pathetic.
>>166627Yes anon, you're a very strong and scary boy. We just couldn't hope to come close to you.
>>166628If you geeks ever man up and decide to try a real combat sport you'll realise I'm right.Keep cowering away in your comfort zone, little man.
>>166629I traded pro boxing for Karate. It's more fun.
>>166630So you couldn't handle a real sport and went to sandbag in the pussiest martial art you could find?You're a big fish in a small pond. Gradually getting weaker and weaker until you're no stronger than the next Ai Kido/Karate schmuck.
>>166633I'm just funmaxxing. Give trying out something you enjoy instead of attaching your ego to a fairly useless activity a shot, you might end up liking. If you do whatever you practice because you legitimately love that's great, but never for a second trick yourself into thinking you're a "warrior", a "real man" or some other kind of ego garbage. You do a sport like everyone else, that's it.>https://blackbeltmag.com/leandro-lo-deadHere's what happens when you think you're hotter shit than you actually are, you get unceremoniously killed by a drunk baboon.
>>166636As a Brazilian, I cannot help but say that the police are big criminals in this country. In this case, Lo was executed in the back by a drunk and drugged police officer, a very common occurrence around here.
>>166637Yeah, and it wouldn't have happened if he didn't decide to take the guy's bait and fight him over a whiskey bottle. Way too much ego, it only attracts trouble and invites other egomaniacs to try and get into a dick measuring contest with you. In his case it ended with one guy losing his life and the other wasting his (3rd degree murder charges in a popular jury? Cop or not he's fucked).
>>166636Listen up you submissive runt.If you're ever attacked and use your virgin karate/ai kido shit you will die. If you use a real martial art you will live.Obviously exceptions exist like getting fucking shot, moron. Does any real martial artist (MMA, muay thai, BJJ, wrestling) claim to be fucking bullet proof.Go back to your McDojo, boy. And don't you dare talk to us top dogs again until you put on your big boy pants and find the courage to start boxing again.
>>166656At the end of the day, I guess you are more respectable than any of the fat obese slobs who don't do any training whatsoever. I'll hand you that at least.
>>166656>>166658I never get into fights, I deescalate and disengage from conflicts. I gain nothing from fighting and fights don't just magically happen, they take an effort from both parties to end up getting violent. I don't go around trying to fight, I don't associate with people that go around fighting, I don't even go to places where people may be intoxicated enough to feel fighting is a good idea. Prevention and deescalation are the best self-defenses.If I'm in a violent situation it's because someone wants something from me, and in that case they're almost certainly armed one way or another. You want my phone? Fine, I'll buy a new one, it's not a big deal. Definitely not worth risking your life for.
>>166608I don't care because the only ultimate sport that beats everything is freestyle wrestling. So the question should be really>How does it feel knowing you train muay thai, karate, MMA or BJJ every day just to get clowned on by someone who trains wrestling?Also>training MMA>as amateur adult>1 day of shitty grappling, 1 day of shitty striking, 1 day of conditioning or cringe sparrings>thinking you will learn anythingLMAO, you'll get outpunched by boxer and outwrestled by wrestler
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