so, can we agree that Disco Elysium had the greatest RPG system ever conceived in any video game?
I think it's a testament to how shitty the game is past "muh political representation" that the only way you can think to start a thread on it somehow is worse than Reanfags do
Reanchads, spam this thread up!
>>1198299Absolutely not. It's innovative and stylish, but mechanically it might be the most shallow you'll ever play.
>>1198299Not the best system, but probably among the best storytelling.
Not even one dungeon to crawl in this shitty eurotrash game.
Does the pale/swallows cause entropy and degradation, or does breakdown of society encourage swallows to form?
It's more of an RPG than FFXIV desu
>>1198299Ah yes, the glorious 2d6, the greatest RPG system ever conceived.
>>1198299>wordswordswords: the game I read visual novels and even Disco Elysium had too much words for me.
>>1199552The pacing contributes a lot to that. The 'square footage' of this game is really small so there's not much to explore, and of course there's no combat to change up the pace.
>>1198299DISCLAIMER:The game is being shilled heavily on /vrpg/, so, here's some things the shills don't want you to know.> The developers claim to be hardcore and nothing is off the table. Despite this, Faggot is censored and any racial slurs are changed to abstract ones.> The game developers consider themselves to be "Soviet" and the game uses the likeness of, and voice acting of podcast members of ChapoTrapHouse and RedScare, members of Antifa, a Domestic Terrorist organization according to the DHS.> Your companion in the game is a gay Asian. You have no option to permanently remove him from your party. He will get upset at the player for dialogue options and chastise them for choosing them.> Despite the game claiming to "Punch all sides" and present a diverse range of political opinions, in order to unlock right-wing politics, one must subject themselves to health damage every time they choose one.> Choosing left-wing options will reward the player with health, experience and even money.> Whilst the game, and shills declare the game to be an RPG, it is completely devoid of combat, party management or even meaningful choices that affect the ending of the game. It instead plays more like a visual novel
>>1198299Why is "commie propaganda lol" the only criticism some people can hurl against this game? Did they get filtered?
>>1199971Because that's the only bad thing about it. Lack of combat, lack of gameplay beyond rolling a couple of dice, lack of real choice in the plot at large, all those could be seen as design choices and reasonably justified. But the fact that they squandered their many brilliant ideas about skills/stats and some top notch writing on a faggy, partisan, sheepishly inclusive and progressive piece of commie propaganda is just unforgivable. That game could have been so much more.
>>1199971I try not to support people or industries that actively hate me. I can probably afford to skip a pretentious piece of communist propaganda that could afford neither an editor nor a game designer.
>>1199971because I don't care how nice the hamburger is if there's a fucking turd on top of it. if it's commie shit I drop it immediately.
>>1199971Because it's the cherry on top of the whole piece of shit that is the game.
>>1200109>>1200081>>1200045>>1200024All filtered, and unable to interact with a piece of art unless it confirms their preconceived notions.
>>1200125just because the game dug up idea of dialogues with more than 4 options 3 of which are effectively the same and 1 some variant of "can you repeat that" doesn't necessarily make it any sort of masterpiece
>>1200024>Lack of combat, lack of gameplay beyond rolling a couple of dice, lack of real choice in the plot at large, all those could be seen as design choices and reasonably justified.Lol are you being sarcastic? You're correct about all those flaws, but then what's left of the game? The only way you could justify it is if you showed up for the politics.
>>1200125lmaoDisco Elysium isn't art at all, specially for thinking it has a good notion of realpolitik to justify scolding you on every choice when in reality it's embarrassingly surface level and to top it all off, funnels you into the same disappointing ending.If I wanted real political art then paintings, books and movies are a better medium for letting the audience absorb the thoughts of the creator. Disco Elysium OTOH, is aimed at midwits at the peak of mt. stupid who want to justify games as a 'legitimate art medium', because you fags seek validation because you fags fail at life hence why you relate to Harry so much.
>time mechaniclmao didn't even leave the apartment
>>1200167Or the deep story, had there been one. What I'm saying is, nothing wrong with making a VN, but if you do, at least bother to give it good story as opposed to political squabblings. The same way it's justified in Planescape, where the story carries the effectively superfluous mechanics/combat.
>>1200268There's a lot wrong with making a VN when you market it as an open-world RPG. And your comment about Planescape makes no sense. You listed a bunch of game mechanics that aren't present in Disco, and said they're easily justified. So how could Planescape need to justify those things "the same way" when it has everything you listed? It contradicts your description of them as superfluous. They aren't superfluous, they are game mechanics that make it a game.
>>1199971Katyusha is a piece of commie propaganda to, it's good music, but it still propaganda.If you seet for people calling out propaganda in entertainment, you are fucking retarded.
Not at all, it's nothing really new or great.The game has a really good first part, but gets convoluted and linear after you see the game doesn't present a good exploration as it should I would say they missed a potential for more exploration and maybe more features, that was definitely because design choices and narrative, it limited the game.Hope they explore it a bit more if they make another game like it, it could have been a kino detective game.
Not an RPG
>le ironic ugly meme gamenope
>>1199452>>1199832>something is an RPG only if you're allowed to be a murderhobo and butcher everything you seeI bet you faggots would complain about MUH STORYSHITTING as well if this was /tg/
>>1199832>The developers claim to be hardcore and nothing is off the table. Despite this, Faggot is censored and any racial slurs are changed to abstract ones.Who gives a shit, I'm not an edgy teen.>The game developers consider themselves to be "Soviet" and the game uses the likeness of, and voice acting of podcast members of ChapoTrapHouse and RedScare, members of Antifa, a Domestic Terrorist organization according to the DHS.So? Would you hate the game equally if they considered themselves nazis? I judge the product, not the producer.>Your companion in the game is a gay Asian. You have no option to permanently remove him from your party. He will get upset at the player for dialogue options and chastise them for choosing them.Sounds funny, but someone will probably mod him away if it makes you seethe that much.>Despite the game claiming to "Punch all sides" and present a diverse range of political opinions, in order to unlock right-wing politics, one must subject themselves to health damage every time they choose one.Same as above, but even funnier.>Choosing left-wing options will reward the player with health, experience and even money.Wow, just like in real life. I love realistic games!>Whilst the game, and shills declare the game to be an RPG, it is completely devoid of combat, party management or even meaningful choices that affect the ending of the game. It instead plays more like a visual novelThat's a semantics argument and doesn't affect the game at all.I can already tell your only counter-argument will be to call me a "commie tranny" and that "I will never be a woman", so don't bother.
>>1200045Why would you actively choose to live in an echo chamber?
Problems that are more objective:The clothing system mostly lead to a bunch of non-interesting inventory management and the thought cabinet was a cool idea but overall didn't contribute anything worthwhile that couldn't have been accomplished with the game just keeping tabs on your dialogue choices (which it already does). Music was good, but the switching between very distinctive tracks (such as whirling rags and the outside) meant that it could be jarring. More subjective shit: I get that they tried to emulate a PnP system where failed rolls are natural and expected instead of the normal RPG system where failed rolls are always bad, but I don't think they managed to make the world reactive enough for it to really work. Maybe it was meant to facilitate additional playthroughs; some people seem to have replayed the game 4-5 times, but I dunno how much of that was due to actual differences in how Harry could be played. At best I think you could do 3, with the second focusing on the skills you didn't specialize in the first time around and the third as an intentionally gimped challenge run with Harry as a disaster cop. I binged it during my first playthrough, but after letting it brew for a bit I think most of the substance was in the setting, writing, art direction, as well as choosing to keep combat very limited. It's definitely more than a VN, but none of the ways it approaches its RPG elements feel that well executed.
>>1200125>All filtered, and unable to interact with a piece of art unless it confirms their preconceived notions.You misunderstood me. I said I wasn't able to SUPPORT it. I'd still pirate it if I thought the game was worth my time, and I'm not convinced it is. >>1200941Again, the word here is SUPPORT. The culture is left wing, it's impossible to avoid left wing discourse in this culture. I turn on the TV, left wing. I open twitter, left wing. I go to the movies, left wing. I read the newspaper, left wing. But when Ben and Jerry's is actively funneling their profits into the political campaign of Bernie Sanders, you know what? I can eat a different brand of icecream. When Disco Elysium uses their platform to disparage people like me? Well I can buy a different game.
>RPGs are badass cartoons where you get to kill people and everyone sucks my dickAmericans...
>>1200994I agree about the clothing system. I think it should have been used to change how other characters perceive you, like in a sort of reputation system, instead of simply giving skill bonuses. I liked the thought cabinet though, especially when thoughts unlocked dialogue options. >but the switching between very distinctive tracks (such as whirling rags and the outside) meant that it could be jarring.I liked this too actually. I get that music is usually meant to be something that's supposed to reinforce the mood of a scene without being at the conscious forefront, but I always liked films where music is closer to the forefront than the background. Like Trainspotting for example.
Politically, I think most of the problems are with player dialogue. The NPCs were handled way better.
>>1200783>””meme”” example is clearly an infographic with no pretense of being humorousYou will never be a woman
>>1201360Pirating the game is the right way to support it, because the developers are bourgeoisie despite espousing communism.
>>1201464Throughout all of history, all communists have been middle class at a minimum. The reason for that is the working class knows what's best for their own lives and it's not communism - but communists are rich people who think it falls on their vast intellect and wealth to improve the world. Or they're vain opportunists who know it's the easiest and surest way to power.
There is only one communist in Disco Elysium
>>1200352Communists are immune to propaganda. That is why everything they say is true.
>>1201380If thoughts only affected dialogue I would have probably enjoyed it more. I didn't like how there was no way to know what the effects of a thought would be before finishing it. Buying slots and getting rid of bad thoughts both requiring skill points disincentivized experimentation and always felt like throwing points away. Using it to level up a skill both permanently improved that skill and gave you a new chance at white checks. It also doesn't help that a majority of thoughts were more or less useless: why give a situational benefit (unlocking white checks of a certain stat) as a reward for something impossible to know beforehand without reading a guide? Compare that to the exp giving thoughts which are always objectively correct to go for, unless you're RPing/going for a challenge run. Fair enough about the music. I think it's only really a problem when you go out to the balcony, which you only really do twice at most.
>>1201506I think the thoughts about considering suicide and quitting alcohol were great though and were a good marriage between story and gameplay: an immediate reward with a grave but predictable consequence for going too deep, and a long, substantial investment with a satisfying but not too good payoff. If all thoughts were like that they system would have been great.
>>1201380>>1201506For thoughts I think a better way to implement the effects mechanically would be to have them give a bonus/detriment while they are brewing in your head and then when they finish always still have that same bonus/detriment with something else as well. This way they would be a more sound investment while still being able to surprise you. It wouldn’t work with the way some are designed like finger on the eject button but with some minor tweaks it would result in a much more mechanically sound system.
>>1201360that's because the left is usually objectively correct though, your racist infographics without sources aren't reliable>>1201466oh you just like talking out of your ass, nevermind
>>1201550>that's because the left is usually objectively correct
>>1201555>no argument>anime reaction imageI accept your concession
>>1201555Just report him for being off topic and then ignore.
>>1201545Yeah, I think that sounds good. There's a video on youtube where one of the devs talk about all the plans they had for the system; they were basically happy it turned into something shippable.
>>1201360>WAAAAAAAH LEFTIES ARE OPPRESSING MEEEEEEEEEEI still come to this place even though I have to suffer through thousands of tumblrinas like you who get all pissy about the tiniest perceived shit, even though you've been granted more safe space than you actually deserve, if I can do it you can too.Not to mention, categorically refusing to engage with different ideas a priori just because they're from a different football team than yours isn't exactly smart, it's the mark of a weak mind.
>>1201637>AAAAAAAAAAAAAA STOP OPPRESSING MEEEEEAgain, you're weak, so weak you pretending pirating games isn't a thing, posting wojaks is truly all one needs to see that.
>>1201637Wow, it's like fucking clockwork and utterly formulaic, just like your transplanted worldview.
>>1201608this dude can't even quote properly
>>1201647Just ignore him, he's the usual midwit who thinks getting the last word while not quoting your post number gives him some kind of moral highground, he'll keep repeating that until you get tired of dealing with him because that's the only form of validation he can get.
>>1200352katyusha as in meme rocket-launching machine?katyusha as in a song about war and love?katyusha as in the way japs refer to maid headgear?
how many rpg fans like cyoa games, akin to this or sunless sea?cause i'm making one and totally shilling it on this board
>>1200313what is better: shit gameplay or no gameplay?you, in the """current year""", aren't playing planescape because it's another crpg like it was in 1999, but because it's a classic for its writingyou could argue that sort of combat was necessary to hammer in the ebin subversion of crpg tropes (bandits at literally every corner trying to shank a walking corpse; entirety of modron cube)i don't think it's disingenious to call DE an rpg, but it would be better to call it a choose-your-own-adventure or simulator
>>1201939How about adventure-rpg? It's basically a point-and-click adventure game with rpg mechanics.
>>1199971Because even if the game openly mocks every political ideology, if it mocks mine then that means it's communism.
>>1198299>game so uninteresting every discussion immediately becomes political >greatest RPG system Nah man
>one anon mentions Disco Elysium>the entire board descends into bloodthirsty mayhem and No True ScotsmanAt least now I know how to farm some cheap (You)s on this board.
>>1202113Eighty percent of Disco Elysium threads turn into a schizo fest.I really enjoyed the game, and it should be obvious to anyone who played the game that any political ideology Harry chooses is just his coping with Dora leaving him.
>>1202192If it's just him coping, why do the developers treat some ideologies as being better than others?
>>1202213Everyone gets shit on more or less equally, even centrists.
>>1202213The devs have an obvious bias for communism; that much is obvious. However, when Harry adopts an ideology, he simplifies it to hating women or the elite, both of which Dora was, worshiping a woman with Dora's appearance, or convincing himself that he is a high net-worth individual.
>>1200210that's a lot of cope
>>1202232>Say fag>Die of a heart attack
>>1202254>not understanding how stress works
>>1202232I personally just dislike how woman-hating was such a large part of the extreme right wing representation. Would have preferred if there was separate sexual alignment, where you can be a woman hater, a lecher, a turbo-simp or relatively normal person.
>>1202254only obese neets use fag as an insult, so it makes sense that their heart collapses
>>1202285Wasn't women-hating just a part of Harry if he chose to be nationalistic? Rean, the friend of the cryptologist, and even Measurehead weren't explicitly sexist.
>>1200024You do realize the game shits on commies right?
>>1202310>Wasn't women-hating just a part of Harry if he chose to be nationalistic?Oh yeah, I meant *Harry's* right wing dialogue options. It would be more fun if you could be a sperg about those things without r9k-tier stuff, or vice versa, to be an r9kommie or whatever.
>>1202232They absolutely do not. Why would you even attempt to pass off such bullshit?
>>1202342t. hasn't played the game
>>1202236ironically enough, the actually disparaged ideology is ancapharry's version is obviously retarded, but among npc (characters whose views are actually developed) there's only a mega rich guy (easy to miss) and arguably joyce (who's mostly a liberal)
>>1202311>Shits on "Commies" >portrays their in-universe version of Marx as a good boy who dindu nuffin and had his ideology "abused">developers thank marx on stage and have a bust of him in his office.Very transparent and cringe.
>>1202361Joyce is actually pretty alright for a lizard freak, and even Fascists get at least one cool character with RenéI think all that the game really needs is a shiftless "socialism means I don't have to work haha" union member to balance out the rest of them
>>1202383They could stop being racist and add a decent right-wing white character too.
>>1202192>it should be obvious to anyone who played the game that any political ideology Harry chooses is just his copingThat gives them some plausible deniability for putting all the politics in, but that's all it is, and it doesn't make it interesting or a good story. Harry's relationship with his ex is poorly developed. It's set up as this enormous dark secret, like repressed trauma. Your inner voice tells you your world is going to end if you confront it. And then it's like...oh your girlfriend left you over money? She got an abortion? OK. Worse things have happened to many men. It doesn't adequately explain Harry's wacky antics.I'd like to chalk it up to the author being homosexual, but that shouldn't matter. Clive Barker is one queer I can think of who could depict normal relationships believably. Maybe it's a cultural divide cause he grew up in Eastern Europe? I don't know but it's bad writing, and the politics is bad writing. Whether the one is a smokescreen for the other, it's bad.
>>1202366>>portrays their in-universe version of Marx as a good boy who dindu nuffin and had his ideology "abused"Ah yes, same as always>That wasn't REAL communism
>>1201939Planescape's gameplay is scaled-down IE engine gameplay. You can not like it, but it exists to have an opinion on. The point I'm making is that one is more of an RPG than the other, which you (or the person I replied to) had already stated when they described Disco as a VN and listed all the gameplay mechanics it doesn't have. If it's not disingenuous to call Disco an RPG, it wouldn't be better to call it something else.
>>1202383>Fascists get at least one cool character with RenéRene's a monarchist though.
>>1202660That is fascism.
>>1202232>even centrists.Specially centrists. The game has a hateboner for moralism.
>>1202809I still thought moralism was the best option (as an ideology, not necessarily the institutions that represent it) even after all the shit the narrative threw at it.
>>1202706>monarchism = fascismAnon, do you even know what these words mean?
>have any view other than communism>penaltyJust a vn being modded by a virtual jannie.
This is the RPG board not the mediocre VN board.
>>1200268>deep storyIt's babbies first bait n switch."Whoa I have amnesia [from a bender on the town question mark]." (totally novel setup there)"Whoa lovecraftian elements how wacky never seen those before in a magical realism setting.""Whoa it's a detective story PSYCHE it's really a sad sack of shit meandering over his ex.""Literally a nordic detective noir novel with the parts that require skill, like setting up a proper mystery with a case and resolution, replaced with trite political observances and break-up fiction pastiches".Further proof that esti cannot into nordic.
>>1202660>>1202706>>1202832In the game, nationalism, traditionalism, monarchism, and, to a certain extent, conservatism, are clumped into the fascist ideology. It should be noted that the world of Elysium never really had any fascist movements like in our world; there's just one country who is mentioned to be more right-wing than most of the Coalition.
>>1203019Good thing Disco Elysium is an RPG then.
>>1200939>Sounds funnyIt's not. It's literally just some nanny-stater whining over your every choice and reaction while patronizingly giving you a backpat for being a fuckup. Like a twitter SJW's dream role come to think of it.NAYRT but you will never be a woman.
>>1203101Can you at least be a better man than him so he doesn't get the pleasure of looking down on you? Or is mayor fuck up the only lifestyle to follow?
>>1201987>point and clickNo fuck you. We already have the scummy walking sim fags trying to muscle in on our genre and shit it up and fuck us over so we won't find the games we're actually after under our own genre.>t. p&c fan
>>1203101Go play Persona 4
>>1203104Nazis aren't monarchists, anon.>>1203101>muh SJWsRent-free.
>>1203107Your only option is being judged by him it's only a quesiton of how much. He's literally the dev favorite and you can tell by how much shit he gets away with unquestioned, not even giving you the option of telling him to fuck off. (well not counting the one where they instantly kill your character for calling him a fag) They thought they were clever when they made him wrong about everything detective-wise too but it doesn't make him less of a smarmy instutionalized twitter-derived faggot.
>>1203107You can earn your colleague's great respect throughout the game. >Can you at least be a better man than himDepends on your perspective. He's fairly stiff and rigid, and you can prove your own sidquest-focusing, weird idea-having methods produce great results for the investigation and good outcomes for the people of the district if you play it that way. If you remain sober throughout the game he'll also respect you for that, and in the end you can get him to leave his own high-prestige police station in favor of yours as a permanent partner. >>1203115>No fuck you. We already have the scummy walking sim fags trying to muscle in on our genreAnon, I'm a point-and-click fan as well. It's a fairly wide genre with wide variations in mechanics outside of SCUMM games. What makes walking sims bad is you don't feel like you're accomplishing anything, you're neither solving problems nor working towards a tangible goal.
>>1203139He needs to be stuck up and boring to contrast with the (usually) deranged player character. It's literally every cop movie ever, taken to an extreme.
>>1198299It has RNG skill & speech checks, so no.
>>1203144>Anon, I'm a point-and-click fan as well. You're a fucking entryist cocksucker newfag masquerading as a fan as far as i'm concerned.>It's a fairly wide genre No. It fucking isn't.Point and Clicks are a very specific subset of games and they do not consist of throwing dialogue at a player based on a character build. >with wide variations in mechanics outside of SCUMM games. Again. No. If you had actually played a decent number of point & clicks you'd know 99% of them fall under the same mechanical framework as provided by Infocom, early/late Sierra, early Lucasarts, late Lucasarts and Legend. Those who take a large step out of the framework inevitably fall under some other genre label like hidden object or similar trash.>What makes walking sims badIt does't matter what the quality of a walking sim is.It's not a fucking point & click regardless you daft cunt.
>>1203164Man, who pissed in your cereal? Have you been boiling ever since the release of Grim Fandango or what?
>>1203153>He needs to be stuck up and boring So give the supposedly "deranged" player the option of telling him to blow it out his ass like they usually did in buddy cop movies?Where the straight man usually hated the guts of the wonky comedian ending up in some fistfight or other interrupted by the actual bad guys which they bond over kicking the shit out of?Of course that would actually be enjoyable, like old buddy cop movies, and not a dreary exercise in having the writers talk down at you only made marginally enjoyable by reading out their nonsense in a classical nebbish hollywood-caricature-nerd voice.
>>1203049Thats literally the wiki definition of conservatism its "fascism"Wikipedia is the best source material to write your game.
>>1203179>So give the supposedly "deranged" player the option of telling him to blow it out his ass like they usually did in buddy cop movies?I would like if there were more options to do this yeah. Pulling rank on him to force him to get down on the dance floor in an illegal rave club you helped start was fucking hilarious.
>>1203179Is it really bad writing if it's gotten this deep under your skin
>>1203171>Man, who pissed in your cereal?I already told you. Cunts who want to shit up my favorite vidya genre with trash that has no relation to it.You're exactly like those sacks of shit who called any procedurally generated game "roguelikes" for marketing purposes and practically destroyed the use of the term for ages until someone had the sense of shame to dub their game a roguelite instead.>Have you been boiling ever since the release of Grim Fandango or what?Grim Fandango falls under late Lucasarts you cockmongler.
>>1201620>refuse to give money to commies >"what's the matter, not strong enough to entertain an ideology that destroys all it touches and forces people into destitution"
>>1203186>the point of writing is to annoy people.
>>1203186"Is it really bad X if it evokes a reaction".You're the kind of scum who sprays diarrhea all over public toilets because it creates a job demand I take it?
>>1203187>I already told you. Cunts who want to shit up my favorite vidya genre with trashYou're a very small toddler having a very big tanty. >Grim Fandango falls under late Lucasarts you cockmongler.So you like the company, not the gameplay style? Grim Fandango is completely different from Monkey Island.
>>1203188Here's the thing anon, there is no true communism, socialism, etc. because society is controlled by billionaries and corporations.The ones in power benefit the most from capitalism, while everyone else suffers the most from capitalism.The US is the prime example of how capitalism just doesn't work. When you're effectively the only developed (questionable if you could call the US that) country without universal healthcare and can send people into crippling debt (or even being unable to afford basic healthcare) that says what a gigantic joke that country is. Especially since the people are so naive that they think giving billionares more money is somehow better.But hey, keep rolling with what you've got, you're clearly not interested in actually making the US the "best country in the world".
disco elysium is a point and click, iso tard games can be point and click too. Its also a vn.
>>1203212>You're a very small toddler having a very big tanty. You're a cockroach trying to live off your betters. Clearly not a point & click fan like you pretended either.>So you like the company, not the gameplay style? And an illiterate to boot.
>>1203209Hes a leftist that thinks the entire point of life is to be noisesome
>>1203216>Clearly not a point & click fan like you pretended either.Wow, I guess I'll stop liking Fate of Atlantis and The Dig because a kid on the internet is mad at video games
>>1203226You're exactly like those retards off adv gamer who insisted that Portal was a point & click. Then Gone Home was a point & click.Ad nauseam.
>>1203234No, I don't think any of those games are. Stop spazzing out so much. Did you get fired or dumped today or something?
What's the difference between /v/fags upset that they don't feel represented in Disco Elysium and American blacks upset that they don't feel represented in Polish video games taking place in middle eastern Europe
>>1203238>No, I don't think any of those games are.Yet you claim Disco is which is no different from those other non-point & clicks.
>>1203240One is actively misrepresented I guess?Not that them not getting rightwingfags make up even half of what people are complaining about ITT.
>>1203213Theres no such thing as communism because communism is just macro capitalism, Communists are mentally underage retards and believe in a low iq economic model like a religion.They then waste their lives trying to undermine their host countries and societies, ironically making their lives worse for the slim chance communism is installed. Which everytime manifests as a ultra conservative Chad and Stacy society that looks identical to the socoety they seethes at (now woth red decor)Communists are morons that are reactionaries to the inevitable that everything will always be the same in the long run.
>>1203240Both of them can complain but the developers should not have to oblige to any of them.
>>1203242No, I didn't say it's "no different" from them. I said I see it as mix of a point-and-click game and an RPG, making it an adventure RPG in my mind. Like, compare with FPS-RPGs. It would be really silly if I called Fallout 3 an FPS-RPG, and someone got mad because Fallout 3 is nothing like Doom II.
>>1203258>>1203258>I said I see it as mix of a point-and-click game and an RPGExplain which part is exactly even remotely like a point and click?Reminder that we have examples of actual point & clicks with RPG mechanics courtesy of Sierra.
>>1203250The biggest retards are capitalists since they're scared shitless of anything that's not capitalism to the point they become paranoid, all the while not realizing that capitalism hurts them the most.Unless you're so comically rich to the point where you never have to work a day in your life and still live like a king capitalism is not helping you. If anything something like socalism or some shit would be better. Or at the very least, implement shit that helps 99.9999% of your population at least.
>>1203261>Explain which part is exactly even remotely like a point and click?Mouse-controlled 3rd person perspective, puzzle solving through interaction with environment objects, characters and inventory items. Do you see Blade Runner (1997) as a point and click game by the way?
>>1203285t. american whose never had any real interaction with socialism or communism in their life.
>>1203285You don't even know what capitalism is little guy thats how socialism has melted your brain.You leftards always refer to capitalism as the opposite ideology of communism, its not even an ideology.Lets just point out the irony that in communist china they had a revolution so they would hever have to live in a "capitalist" society. Only to end up working in sweatshops for capitalists. While being told that they they should be thankful for the revolution freeing them from capitalists.
>>1203295>puzzle solving through interaction with environment objects, characters and inventory items.Is this the primary mechanic through which the entire game is driven? Is it screen-based and not open world drek with extensive environment interaction through hotspots?No? Then it's not a point & click.
>>1203317>No? Then it's not a point & click.I know it's not a pure point-and-click game; it's a hybrid.
>>1203285>all the while not realizing that capitalism hurts them the most.Capitalism is literally the driving force lifting the majority of the world out of poverty, producing all sorts of medical innovations, producing an abundance of food, producing all the entertainment you enjoy including this website and the internet and general, and you think capitalism is bad because there's income inequality. Genius, there was income inequality under feudalism and socialism and fascism too. But only under capitalism can poor people not have to worry where their next meal is coming from. In fact the poor in first world nations have it better than the poor have had it at any other point in history; they have food, they have roofs over their hands, they have access to a great deal of entertainment options, etc.
>>1203349Hybrid of VN and hidden object maybe.
>>1203358>Bringing third world nations out of extreme poverty by taking first world nations into just regular poverty.
>>1203314>You leftardsSo you're an ignorant extremist.
>>1203358>america is a shithole bordering on 3rd world countries, in some ways even worse>it's the laughingstock of the world>burger still thinks that defending and help the ticks at the top suck the nation dry is a good thingThe US is regressing before your eyes and you're helping it. You probably unironically think that the US is the greatest place on earth too, which is why shit will only get worse until in a few years the next Fallout can take place there.
>>1203777>>The US is going through some economic problems because of forced lockdowns in part of the country so that means communism will somehow make things better.The only thing communism results in is mass death and ruination. Peddle your bullshit elsewhere, red.
>>1203777>The US is the only capitalist country on earth????Also the US' problem is the increasing size of its Government and mass immigration lmao. Hardly capitalistic drives.
It's hilarious how much this piece of entertainment has enraged facies and chuds to the point where they abandon all pretenses of being "objective" about game quality to shit on the superficial politics and culture war instead of trying to evaluate the game as a whole. These are the people in other threads who claim that a game having gay characters makes it "political".
>>1203975>faciesYou can't even type properly.
>>1203766>he called me a leftard>thats extremelmao gtfo you retarded red cunt before i deck you.
>>1200210Have a nice life
>>1203161>skill checks in an RPG are badI bet you also say it's not a real RPG.
>>1203214>Disco Elysium is a point and click adventure game and a VN>Disco Elysium is exactly the same as Ace AttorneyI know this is bait, but come on. At least put some actual effort into it.
>>1203295>Mouse-controlled 3rd person perspectiveApparently, you don't know what the term "isometric perspective" means.>puzzle solving through interaction with environment objects, characters and inventory items.Might and Magic has elements of point and click adventure games?
Is the idea that isometric adventure games can't be RPGs or something? That's ridiculous.
Also, the concept of "greatest rpg system" is practically meaningless in this context.It would be like trying to compare WoD to DnD in virtue purely of the systems involved.Rather, the question should simply be whether DE provides a narrative that is well written and richly responsive to the choices the player makes, and that is true. It is also true that a handful of other RPGs do this as well, and hence close analysis of all such games would be required.Fuck munchkinsFuck weeaboosFuck LARPERsFuck codexfags
>>1205543>richly responsive to the choices the player makesCan you give some examples where you feel the game does this?I like the game, a lot even, but it's static. You choices can affect dialogue, but characters don't really change their overall opinion on you, and there's no way to really make decisions/mistakes that have consequences later (with the possible exception of noticing the hanged man was shot before sending the body away).
>>1205829The idea that choices must have long-ranging consequences in an important facet of roleplaying, but to reduce the best criterion of roleplaying to that is simply untenable.It would be ridiculous to claim that a game which is linear except for a handful of choices that have long ranging consequences is a greater rpg than one which had a handful of the latter but a plethora of well-instantiated options for each encounter making up the game.
>>1205856Dunno about long-ranging, I'm just asking about instances where the game reacts to your choices. I'm not saying anything about DE being a greater or less RPG than anything. I think the game's strong writing, art direction and characters make the game feel more reactive than it really is. You take dialogue seriously because the world feels real, but in reality the developers just didn't have the budget to make a game that actually reacts. >plethora of well-instantiated options for each encounterWhat are you thinking about saying this? The instances where Harry goes 'I will now tell you my opinion on this'? I felt the developers were kinda intentionally making fun of themselves with that, especially in the latter half of the game.
>>1205894There are problems which have multiple solutions, like how to pay off your tab, how to get into the docks, how to take the body down, and there are choices: taking sides in the Union conflict, arresting Klaasje, letting Ruby shoot herself, how you handle the Tribunal. It's just that none of that really matters. The narrative doesn't change, and you still get the same ending. It's reactive in the mind of the player, not in game. Which is fine if you like the game, but if the game didn't completely win you over then it will feel cheap. Again, I really liked the game. I just think it's better to be honest about its strengths and weaknesses, and in my mind its 'reactivity', or lack of, is one of the weaknesses it has as an overall low-budget offering from a new studio.
>>1205894I don't know what you are looking for me to tell you. Examples include finding the millionaire in the shipping container, sitting/not sitting for the union boss, doing graffiti or not, telling on the hot girl or not, finding the phasmid or not. God knows how many others.If you're expecting the attitudes of characters you interact with a handful of times to significantly impact the overall plot of a game that spans the length of several days then your expectations are out of line with the context of the game, nor can they really be satisfied by any other game that we can sensibly refer to as an rpg.
>>1205918>The narrative doesn't change, and you still get the same ending.Your assumption that the ending(s) of a game provide the locus of roleplaying is completely arbitrary. In the case of many games it is much more accurate to say that meaningful roleplaying occurs through the choices one makes in reactive, non-linear contexts that follow a set storyline.
>>1205928Oh yeah, the plasmid is a good, valid example. Your interaction actually changes significantly depending on several choices made through the game. Not sure I agree with most of the other things you mentioned: choosing to not do a sidequest isn't really what most people have in mind when talking about choices in video games. Regarding your last point, I presume Witcher 2 isn't a RPG in your eyes then?
>>1205939Roleplaying? I thought we were talking about the game being responsive to the player's choices?
>>1205942>Regarding your last point, I presume Witcher 2 isn't a RPG in your eyes then?Your criticisms apply just as much to Witcher 2 as Disco Elysium. By your account most of the choices you make and the sub quests you do lead nowhere and have no long-term resonance, the only key ones are to be had with the main characters in the story. Of course, as I've said, this is an erroneous conception of roleplaying criteria.
>>1199832I didn't even have to put the guy through physical pain to get the right wing thought. I bullied and hated on the Gardner because she was a bitch. Dilate
>>1205939>ending(s)There is one ending.
Disco Elysium's ending (the outcome of the last confrontation with the RCM) changes depending on your actions throughout the game
Do you think they'll add ending slides in the Final Cut?
>>1206248You can say that about any RPG. Disco's is very limited relative to most games. For example you can drink alcohol once and they'll react the same as if you were drinking constantly. Ultimately only a couple of major decisions influence whether you get kicked off the force or not, like whether you ask Kim to escort the woman to prison and end up on the island alone.
> trannies still spam this garbage VNmental illness
>>1206628Excuse me, I meant whether Kim is injured in the shootout, which depends on whether you got your gun, which depends on whether you had him escort the woman.
>>1206287I wouldn't mind something to make the cut to credits less abrupt but I don't think Fallout-style "where are they now" ending slides would fit
>>1206661>I meant whether Kim is injured in the shootout, which depends on whether you got your gunThat's not true. I didn't get the gun, but I still managed to save Kim from being shot. I think I've heard getting the gun increases your chances though. It also affects which and how many of the Hardy boys survive.
>>1206675I mostly want some closure with the murderer after apprehension, depending on how I handled the conversation with him.