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Something I have never understood --

What is Darth Vader's motivation to stick with the Emperor and continue to do evil? Anakin went to the dark side because Sheev promised him that if he did so, Padme would be saved. Well, when he did, she immediately died.

Wouldn't you tell Sheev to frig off at that point?
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He still wanted to rule the Galaxy
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>>147058276
>Wouldn't you tell Sheev to frig off at that point?
And then he kills you
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>>147058276
He had already burnt all his bridges. I think he just tunnel visioned and did whatever after that to cope with the pain
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After you kill a bunch of kids you’ll probably pal around with the only guy in the galaxy who is down with that
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>>147058276
He had already min maxed into dark side so he couldn't
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>>147058276
he doesnt think he is doing evil
no one who is evil thinks of themselves as evil
>he makes his decisions in ROTS based on allegiance to the republic, the chancellor, the senate, and his wife.
when he loses his wife all he has is the chancellor and the republic which becomes the empire and then the senate is dissolved at the beginning of 77
he was also under the impression that the jedi were actually trying to take over
by this point hes too committed to have his mind changed
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>>147058753
Wtf Vader is a chud???
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>>147058276
Dark side of force. It's just works.
Frankly making emperor his master was worst thing they did. It would made all the sense in world for Darth Vader to be one of few people who were really controling whole empire whit puppet on throne. Like it was ment to be originally. then return wouldnt need to take place in death star but In some massive station orbiting some planet. Rebels get hunch there will be meeting of said group there and even puppet emperor will be there. So they make plan to kidnap emperor and blow rest of them up. That way they get control of whole empire. You still have shield generator on ground. Space battle and they have reason to get inside. Finally when luke comes face to face whit Darth Vader he found he has killed every one of his colleagues in order to take over himself now that tarkin is dead. They fight and finally luke reaches him. He goes good and helps luke and emperor to escape and stays behind himself.
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>>147058753
>>he makes his decisions in ROTS based on allegiance to the republic, the chancellor, the senate, and his wife.
No, that's all cope. He makes his decisions based on his selfish desires. He said as much:
>I NEED HIM!
Everything else is cope.
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>>147058879
He needed him to save someone's life. Is that selfish? Maybe
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Writing a backstory to fill all the plot holes was beyond George
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>>147058753
>he doesnt think he is doing evil
Oh, and also he does.
>WHAT HAVE I DONE?
Also, pic related. He is in the never-ending cycle of self torment and victimization.
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>>147058955
Yes, it is selfish. The whole point is that Anakin can't let go of people, and that he wants to possess people. He doesn't do it for someone, Padme never asked him to save her, and she would have never agreed to the lengths Anakin would go to. Anakin did it for himself. He never cared about Padme, or the Republic, or the Jedi, or all those people he killed. He did it to make him feel good.
>I can't live without her.
It's all about him.
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He felt stuck like a battered housewife. I don't think he ever truly turned to the dark side. His lack of humanity had more to do with being a cybernetic zombie imo.
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>>147058959
Yup. At that point what did emperor has to offer for him after it was established that he was little slave boy for him. Bitches? He dosent even have cock. Money? For what? Only thing would have been somekind ideological crusade or revenge, but even that would be reach after what we saw in OT. Best shot would have been to make jedi order so rotten that it makes all sense for him join force whit palpatine. Maybe throw in third party of sith to fuck things up.
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>>147058276
he was dead inside and stopped giving a fuck. Luke gave him a renewed sense of purpose
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How is the Empire evil?
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I mean it was post-order 66 and after the massacre at the Jedi Temple, his choices were to either try to stomach the Empire or go off to be a hobo like most of the other surviving force users from that period
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Just go to your containment general
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>>147058276
Darth Vader is the ethical parts of Anakin with all his shitty mommy issues literally burned away. What we’re left with is an Evil character who does shit like torture Han Solo to prove to Luke Skywalker that torture is wrong and should be stopped. His goal in Empire is to unite with his son and bring “an end to this destructive conflict” by overthrowing both the Empire and the Republic that spawned it. His goal? Full communism.
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>>147059066
> I don't think he ever truly turned to the dark side
If you go by third movie. At first movie he is as close to satan as possible. But he mellowed out after that in thrid he is full housewife.
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>>147058276
he still believed that the dark side could save padme, i guess bring her back from death
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>>147058276
The cybernetic suit is symbolic of the hollow shell of a human he became after what happened in RotS. More machine than human. After he loses Padme he has no concience anymore. He only functions to attain and preserve power.
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What I don't understand is why he was running around the galaxy doing Sheev's dirty work all the time when he could have just smoked space weed and watched holomovies in his pod thing.
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>>147058276
Canonically Darth Vader despised himself and remains a slave to the Emperor only to punish himself.
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>>147058276
I know most of the time it sounds like flowery bullshit, but when Sheev told Anakin it was because of him that Padme was killed - at least to me that was when whatever was left of Anakin died and all that was left was Vader, a weapon and tool for the Emperor that would be replaced once something better come along i.e Luke
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I think since he had lost everything, he just doubled down on hate and wanted to share it with the rest of the Galaxy. So he started doing evil just for the lulz. Make the universe suffer for his pain.
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https://www.lacan.com/zizekfinance.htm
I love Zizek and this article from him about what exactly Darth Vader is and the nature of the Empire is really interesting.
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>>147058959
>>147059134
If he did the most likely response which would be to an hero then we wouldn't have a movie I guess.
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>>147059352
A man needs a hobby. Vader's happened to be killing Jedi.
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>>147059494
I wish the prequels gave him a better reason to hate jedi so much. One of them should've actually fucked Padme or something.
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>>147059367
This. Deep down, Anakin absolutely loathed himself for what he had done, and in order to function, he had to kill literally everything that served as a reminder of Anakin Skywalker that was a good man. This was all one big cope that started in the Chancellor's office when he chopped off Windu's hand.
>Anakin Skywalker was weak, I destroyed him.
>That name no longer has any meaning for me.
>There is no conflict.
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>>147058553
Kek
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>>147059572
Yeah, if we take only the prequels into account, it is absolutely bizarre, and no wonder Anakin comes out as mentally ill bipolar maniac for so many people. George focused too much on Anakin's absolute lowest point, and he never explored his other side, that would make his fall actually tragic. It wasn't conveyed too well in the movies. At least The Clone Wars did him justice, and his distrust in the Council and Obi-Wan, the feeling of being lost is a lot more justifiable.
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>>147058276
He is just evil
Does a psychopath or someone evil in the real world need 100% explanations for their actions?
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>>147058276
He wanted to bring peace and order to the galaxy.
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>>147059572
Was there even a reason? It came across like he stopped Windu only because he saw him as an obstacle in saving Padme, and then he basically goes fuck it guess I'm a Sith now.
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>>147059682
You’re getting close to understanding what we’re shown in the movies. Anakin as a baby just wants to free the slaves and be with his mom. But after he spends ten years in the Yoda Youth he comes out as an angry Nazi. He comes out *wrong*. And this really bothered a lot of people. “He’s not supposed to be a Nazi! Obi-Wan said they were best friends!” Like the idea that Obi-Wan lies to Luke - like everyone else in A New Hope - just never crosses people’s minds. He’s a Good Guy! Good Guys don’t lie!
So we had to get this terrible Clone Wars show that also shows Anakin as an angry Nazi but like he has some chill moments with Kenobi and Ahsoka so now it meshes. He’s both an angry Nazi AND he was best friends with Kenobi.
>>147059712
Vader’s not a psychopath though. He doesn’t kill at random or for pleasure. Everything he does in Empire is in service of overthrowing the Emperor. He just happens to think the rebels are wrong too (and they are).
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>>147059783
He was still bitter about how the council operated and not promoting him to master but that shouldn't be enough to give him a lifelong desire to snuff every single one of them.
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>>147059682
>At least The Clone Wars did him justice, and his distrust in the Council and Obi-Wan, the feeling of being lost is a lot more justifiable.
Sometimes watching TCW I'd forget Anakin was to become Vader.
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>>147058276
1. Palpatine would kill him.

2. He still blamed the Jedi for most of what happened to him.

3. Serving the Empire gave him purpose and allowed him to lie to himself and pretend all of his mistakes and crimes had some purpose. Of course, the longer he clinged to this, the further he fell and the more mistakes and crimes he committed.

4. The dark side is like a drug (in case my previous point did not make that obvious). It allows you to turn your emotions into power. The power high is enough to seduce almost anyone, but especially someone like Vader who has so much hatred in him. Imagine if every time you got pissed at some asshole who wronged you, it gave you the power to get revenge on him. Who wouldn’t get addicted to that? You would probably start looking for people to piss you off just to enjoy the sweet sense of justice and revenge when you get to fuck them up. That’s Vader. You can tell he enjoys conflict.
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>>147058276
You are a fucking nigger, and a jew
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>>147060078
1. He’s convinced he and Luke can overthrow the emperor if they work together

2. This might be sort of hinted at in A New Hope but he really opposes the Republic AND the Empire.

3. He didn’t stick with the Emperor because he wanted to keep his job lol. And what mistakes is he making in Empire?

4. Yoda whips out magic powers without any sort of heightened emotional state. Vader isn’t going around looking for fights lol.

I’m guessing you read a lot of comics and wookieepedia.
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>>147060255
4. Yoda isn't using the dark side of the force
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>>147060355
Mutant psychic powers are the dark side. The light side is faith in Christ.
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>>147060392
Star wars takes place before Christmas was born so the light side was a little different
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>>147060469
Phone changed Christ to Christmas. Guess that's what I get for phoneposting
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>>147060469
Vader’s a Christ figure...
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>>147060517
either way you are right
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>>147059857
I never said he was a psychopath
He hanged a colonel from his own army, tortured han solo, cut his son's hand unnecessarily, killed several children without remorse, killed his own mentor who did not want to fight, etc ...
"He only did it for the empire" is as silly as a murderer saying "I did it because society is wrong in my pov"
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>>147060255
>1. He’s convinced he and Luke can overthrow the emperor if they work together
Exactly. WITH Luke’s help, he could. For 20 years, he didn’t even know Luke existed.

>2. This might be sort of hinted at in A New Hope but he really opposes the Republic AND the Empire.
Do you have any evidence to support that?

>3. He didn’t stick with the Emperor because he wanted to keep his job lol. And what mistakes is he making in Empire?
Again, you have no evidence. And what crimes? How about hunting down and killing innocent people? How about not so much as voicing concern when his buddy Tarkin destroyed a planet? How about cutting off his son’s hand? Threatening to turn his daughter to the dark side? Torturing Han? “Altering the deal”? Etc, etc.

>4. Yoda whips out magic powers without any sort of heightened emotional state. Vader isn’t going around looking for fights lol.
Do you even know what the force is, you fucking philistine? Yoda’s whole point was that the light side is better path because, though it’s harder, it won’t corrupt you by playing into your emotions. That’s why he warns Luke not to go to Bespin.

>I’m guessing you read a lot of comics and wookieepedia.
You’re bitching that I actually know the lore... but you don’t have to read anything to make the points I did. It’s all in the originally trilogy. You seem to not understand that force has a light and dark side. That was half of Episode V. Yoda trying to teach Luke patience and how to let go. Because, as Yoda says in that movie, the dark side is quicker and easier. But not stronger. Yoda is worried because he sees Luke making the same mistakes as Vader. Of course, Yoda is making the same mistake his made with Anakin, too. Luke actually proves that you can be on the light side of the force without severing all connection to your friends. As long as friends are good people.
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>>147059408
This. He is just an opressive automaton until he finds out that his son is alive.
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>>147058276
Ignore the prequels entirely. His name is and always has been Darth Vader, and he and Obi-wan were good friends until Vader was seduced by the power of the dark side and subsequently fell to evil. That's it, don't think about it further than that because it serves its purpose in Luke's story perfectly fine.
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>>147059857
You are wrong. Anakin WAS a good guy, Lucas just never bother showing us, only telling us via other characters.
>Not Anakin, I don't believe you.
>I don't believe it. I can't watch.
>Boy you trained gone he is.
>You are a good person, don't do this.
It was implied he was good friends with Kenobi via that very little amount of dialogue in Revenge of the Sith, but it was never explored enough in the actual movies. And when ANH was written, Vader was not Anakin, and Anakin WAS everything Obi-Wan was talking about, there was no reason for him to lie.
Lucas realized this in 2005 before Revenge of the Sith even hit the theaters, that he needed to elaborate on the clone wars and Anakin Skywalker, because he didn't have the time to do so in the movies.
>terrible Clone Wars show
Contrarian, please. It is better than the prequels, and effectively redeems them and makes them at least somewhat cohesive.
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>>147061031
>t. Sheev rewriting history
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>>147058276
>"It's too late for me son"
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>I must obey my massa
why was he so black?
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>>147060903
>Exactly. WITH Luke’s help, he could. For 20 years, he didn’t even know Luke existed.
He makes the same offer to padme as well. He’s thoroughly convinced he can stop Sheev as long as he has someone with him.

>Do you have any evidence to support that?
”Don’t be too proud of this technological terror you’ve created...”
“I find your lack of faith disturbing...”
In Empire he mostly threatens the officers of the Empire with summary execution and kills more Imperials than Rebels.
I’m curious where you think he supports the Empire? He never really voices any support for what Sheev’s doing.

>Again, you have no evidence.
Vader simply isn’t worried about the unemployment line. This is a ridiculous position to take.
I want to pick out torturing Han in particular out of your list of things because I think you have literally no idea why he did it other than some vague notion of “revenge.”

>Do you even know what the force is, you fucking philistine? Yoda’s whole point was that the light side is better path because, though it’s harder, it won’t corrupt you by playing into your emotions. That’s why he warns Luke not to go to Bespin.
Yoda never even says the words “light side.” In fact these words aren’t said in any of the six Lucas films! I’m getting the sneaking suspicion you don’t know what you’re talking about.
The Force is Christianity. You have this omnipresent God (“The Force”), his son (Darth Vader), and the community of believers (the Holy Spirit). When Luke gets a vision from God about Vader torturing Han, leaving Dagobah isn’t a “dark side” move. It’s faith in God. You have fundamentally misunderstood these films. Which isn’t surprising, because...

>You’re bitching that I actually know the lore
...you conflate reading wookieepedia articles with understanding the movies.
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>>147061111
>1111
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>>147061089
>You are wrong. Anakin WAS a good guy, Lucas just never bother showing us, only telling us via other characters.
Anakin’s nazism was tolerated most of the time because he worked with the agents of the republic. People only start to get uncomfortable when he’s like “why don’t we use our magical powers to end slavery?”
>Lucas realized this in 2005 before Revenge of the Sith even hit the theaters, that he needed to elaborate on the clone wars and Anakin Skywalker, because he didn't have the time to do so in the movies.
Lucas skipped the clone wars because he accurately identified that they don’t matter. It was intentional that he skipped the whole thing.

>Contrarian, please. It is better than the prequels, and effectively redeems them and makes them at least somewhat cohesive.
It’s weightless, boring, bland shit for idiots and children.
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>>147058276
Honestly I think he was just depressed as fuck and just went through the motions until he found out about Luke which gave him some semblance of purpose. However, this is looking at it with the knowledge of the PT. I have no idea about the OT by itself.
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>>147058276
From his point of view the jedi were evil
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>>147058276
Self-punishment. Everything else is just cope.
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>>147061491
>It’s weightless, boring, bland shit for idiots and children.
That's the prequels, because Lucas didn't even bother writing the script until it was too late, and he let the concept artists create the scenes and designs for him before actually writing the story. No shit it was never properly planned out and contradicts itself every step of the way. Yet again, you are ignoring the obvious fact, that Anakin was described as a good person in the movies, and in Star Wars 1977, before Lucas wrote him to be Vader. And even after that, Luke tells him multiple times that there is conflict in him, and there is good in him. And we see Vader's internal struggle multiple times in TESB and RotJ. Luke reminded him of a Jedi and a good person he once was. And it was Lucas, who brought Anakin into the show in the first place, and gave him the characterization, that actually aligns with the movies and the original trilogy as well.
And yet again, trying to belittle something as "for children" when talking about Star Wars really makes you look retarded. But hey, we are on /tv/ after all, so I am not surprised. Universal critical and public acclaim about the clone wars disagree with you. So that in fact makes you a contrarian, and you might as well argue the OT is also for children and idiots. Here is your last (You).
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>>147058276
After Padme died he lost any ambition for life in general. Might as well stick with the person who’s basically his Dad. It wasn’t until he found out Luke was his son that he had any spark to overthrow the emperor.
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>>147058276
palpatine has a lot of executive orders to sign before he can circle back, give him a chance, he is your emperor
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>>147058276
Because Lucas is a hack trying to stick on a backstory after the fact while running roughshod over the source material.
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>>147058276
>Jedi: "conflict bad, peace good"
>Luke fails to overthrow Vader or the Emperor
>Vader's internal conflict is the only reason the galaxy is saved
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>>147058276
If he doesn't establish order in the galaxy then it was all for nothing
>betrayed the Jedi
>murdered younglings
>killed his pregnant wife and (as far as he knows) his children
>lost however many friends and allies in the Clone Wars
>mother got raped to death while he was off training to be a Jedi
His end goal was always establishing peace and order. If he doesn't make that happen then all the pain and sacrifice and bloodshed was all for nothing. It's sunk cost fallacy combined with dark side influence, which is why him saving Luke is so powerful.
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>>147058809
Have you seen his face?
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>>147058553
>After you kill a bunch of kids you’ll probably pal around with the only guy in the galaxy who is down with that
It's a big galaxy, there is no reason to not believe the outer rim cartels are churning out sullustan child snuff films and running underunderground ewok brothels.
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>>147058276
What else is he going to do?
> Vader can go off and join the rebellion
Like they would have him after what he has done
> He can just retire and fuck off to a distant planet
As if Palpatine would just trust one of the most dangerous men in the galaxy to live on his own, no telling what an AWOL Vader could get up to, Sheev would likely murder him in that instance
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>>147058276
You could say he blames Obi Wan and wants revenge on him.
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>>147061111



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