BoPs the size of D'Dexes EditionPrevious Thread: >>81691868A thread for discussing the 'Star Trek' franchise and its various gaming adaptations.Game ResourcesStar Trek Adventures-Official Modiphius Page (Rules, FAQ and Player Resources)>http://www.modiphius.com/star-trek.html-Homebrew Collection>https://continuingmissionsta.com/-PDF Collection>https://www.mediafire.com/folder/0w33ywljd1pdt/Star_Trek_Adventures/stg/ Other RPGs (Previous Licensed, Unlicensed, and Third Party)>https://pastebin.com/v5BgQxabStar Trek: Attack Wing-Official WizKids Page (Rules, FAQ and Player Resources)>http://wizkids.com/attackwing/star-trek-attack-wing/Star Trek: Fleet Captain-Official WizKids Page (Rules and Player Resources)>https://wizkids.com/star-trek-fleet-captains/Star Trek: Ascendancy-Official Gale Force Nine Page (Rules and Player Resources)>http://startrek.gf9games.com/Lore ResourcesMemory Alpha - Canon wiki>http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Portal:MainMemory Beta - Noncanon wiki for licensed Star Trek works>http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Main_PageFan Sites - Analysis of episodes, information on ships, technobabble and more>http://pastebin.com/mxLWAPXFStar Trek Maps - Based on the Star Trek Star Charts, updated and corrected>http://www.startrekmap.com/index.html/stg/ Homebrew Content>http://pastebin.com/H1FL1UyPThread Topic: What happens when the Federation encounters a union of worlds similar to its own? As in one governed by a representative government with voluntary membership for the purposes of collective security and prosperity? What would happen if such a union were more powerful or advanced, enough to be more appealing to UFP member worlds?
>>81708263>What happens when the Federation encounters a union of worlds similar to its own?Hopefully peaceable relations.
>>81708263>What happens when the Federation encounters a union of worlds similar to its own?The single most passive aggressive dinner ever. Both sides one upping each other about how philosophically advanced they are and belting out backhanded compliments to each other.
I remember seeing some anon here a while back who was asking about Rhode Island and Nova class ships.Looks like his wishes are coming true now.https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/11499863-updates-to-the-nova-family-of-ships
>>81709069For real, the model team over at cryptic are maybe the one redeeming feature of the company.
>>81709633It kind of has to be since the ships are the only reason people keep coming back.
I was rewatching a scifi show, and its final season dealt with the "resurrection" of a main character, that had died seasons earlier, in a robot body. The MC has an existential crisis about having all of the emotions and memories of his past selves, then an identity crisis, and eventually suiciding-by-heroic-sacrifice midway through the season. But then he's brought back again, and then witnesses himself and the rest of the main characters get murdered over 87 times in a timeloop. He's died more than any other character and he's always brought back, and by the end of the show you can see it having an effect on his mental state. The show adds a lot of weight to the resurrection process and it fucks you up, knowing that you're both a clone and a continuation of someone else. I'm curious how much Picard S2, if at all, is going to acknowledge that the human Picard died, that the dude we're following is a robot. Will they bring it up in passing, or will they just handwave the fact that the human Picard died? Will Picard have any reaction to not being human anymore? I hope they don't just handwave it away.
>>81710009Agents of SHIELD, it's pretty good
Can someone survive on a holoship or in a holodeck infedinitely? Assuming the ship retains its energy source.
>>81708263TT: I'd imagine that peaceful relations would be struck up in very short order. The Federation goes out of it's way to try and maintain peaceful relationships with Fanatical Authoritarian Xenophobes who occasionally are extremely Xenophile, but only for the ladies, so finding a likeminded government would be a welcome relief. The cultural exchange between the two would be very interesting.I actually don't think there'd be any issues of a more powerful/advanced union being more appealing to an existing Federation member world unless a given member world is right on the frontier next to this union. I'd imagine that for many worlds, the immediate geographical situation is a strong element in their membership of the Federation, so unless this new power can literally teleport themselves to the planet, they'll stick with the Federation.
>>81708263>TT If they are exactly as they say they are, then a union between the 2 would be sensible. To avoid favouritism or factionalism, a new capital and integrated defence forces would be ideal.
>>81710186There was an entire episode in DS9 where a dude has a full on holo society and town and seems to be making by well and true enough.
>>81710186Assuming that the holoship/holodeck has access to replicator tech (and a suitable feedstock of matter), yes.
>>81710186If the food is replicated rather than just a projection then yeah, absolutely. The real problem would be psychological. If nothing matters and you can just change things at a whim, then whats the point?
>>81708263I love the how the vastly different sizes of BoPs on screen fucks with canon autists.It pains me that fans of Trek can miss the point so damn hard
>>81710648If I remember there are three different sized BoPs that all have the same shape, as an excuse for the studio to reuse models.
Why is Voyager a Slog?I loved watching TNG, I got excited to go from one episode to the next, generally. I liked watching it, and I remember many of the episodes well. DS9 was even more so, And with the exception of the Mirror Universe episodes, I was captivated and excited to go from one episode to the next.But when I watch Voyager? It seems... like work. It feels so much more like a chore rather than something I want to be doing. I kove star trek, I love the setting, the ships, the races, the idealism... and I can't say that Voyager is really missing that. The tone is still optimistic, the Lore is... fairly consistant (I have not finished Season 3 yet, and I hear they screw over the Borg though), The sets still look good, and the different species they meet tend to express different ideas like they did in TNG... but something is off. Like really off, and I can't place it! Why Did DS9 and TNG do such a good job of reeling me in, but Voyager feels like an obligation?
>>81710955It needed to do more to set itself apart from TNG
>>81711018But I LOVED TNG. If it was supposed to be "More TNG, different crew... logically I should enjoy it. And sure, a few episodes are great, but... generally? It feels like a chore to watch through it all.
>>81710955There's coffee in that nebula, anon. There's good bits you have to dig to find.
>>81710955Inconsistency. Basically there were 2 camps of writers in Voyagers production. The first camp wanted to tell a story about a ship gradually running out of supplies and having to make do with alien alternatives. A ship where they had to be a lot more careful to survive because there was no cavalry to save the day.The other camp wanted to do the TNG formula but with different aliens. Mostly consequence free adventures in space.This wouldn't be a problem if the 2 were able to find a middle ground between them, but by numerous accounts there were spats and arguments between the 2 groups and they basically didn't coordinate or colaborate unless they were forced to. So the tonal irregularity in Voyager is far higher than any contemporary Trek. One week, Janeway is carefree, inviting aliens aboard for hilarity and hi-jinks. The next, she's on the verge of eradicating an entire species because she'll do anything to get her crew home. Mulgrew is even on record as saying she played Janeway like someone with severe bipolar disorder. The same problem affects almost all elements of Voyager.
>>81710955Matter of taste, loved TNG rewatched many times, DS9 was ok but it never really clicked for me (never rewatched). Voyager didnt click either for most of the first 2 seasons, but it reeled me in after, rewatched it several times over the years
my man made it up there
>>81710955Voyager was the Discovery of its day (not as bad but all the same problems) It was meant to help launch UPN, it had to tie in with, but be distinct from TNG. And like most TV of its era, the kinks had to be worked out in flight. So what you get is like 3 seasons of absolute struggle before things find solid ground. And yeah >>81711232 is correct, the writers had no idea which Voyager they were working on week to week. Imagine enterprise, but weaving 1:1 a season 1 fun exploration episode, with a season 3 Xindi "must do anything to protect earth" episode constantly. Tonally it failed to land. Either tone would be fitting if they dedicated themselves to it. Despite all this, I prefer it to TNG, so YMMV.
>>81711349Just watched the Shatner launch.Worried that we saw zero internal footage during the flight, unlike the first go round. CAPTCHA: Nygga
>>81710955You've basically watching TNG Seasons 8 and 9 (check out the episode production numbers), and TNG already struggled a lot to fill S7 with enough stories. Moreover, the premise was crippled from day 1. The execs wanted no inter-crew conflict, which rendered the presence of the Maquis pointless. This resulted in a lack of enthusiasm in the production crew, no-one really gave a fuck until 7 of 9 was introduced and they also discovered Robert Picardo was a goldmine of talent.
>>81711455I will admit, Picardo has been a breath of Fresh air throughout. And Mulgrew's acting is phenominal, her character just feels written inconsistently.
Shatner's trying to give a speech. It'sInteresting
>>81711535"It's the covering of blue" -Shanter.
>>81711535So now Avery has to be sent up so that nobody can claim that Blue Origin is racist, right?
>>81711561I would love for Avery Brooks to go up.
>>81711484Yeah, Kate is great, perhaps the second-best performer after Picardo, but Kathryn is inconsistent as fuck. Some days she'll blow up her ship with everyone inside to protect the Prime Directive, others she'll non-chalantly commit war crimes to get closer to home.Sometimes Voyager will give you the impression the writer's room weren't on speaking terms with each other. Jeri Taylor wrote a handful prequel novels that were meant to serve as the backstory for the show, but only she would follow them.
>>81711535Man Bezos is over here Nodding along like "Bro what? You're famous though gotta keep going."
Why does using a transporter not result in an extinction event-level explosion? You're converting a person's worth of mass into energy. For reference, the atomic bombs dropped on Japan only converted about 1 gram of mass each. Is it because transporter beams transmit through subspace and that lets them sidestep the issue? What about those absurdly powerful phasers? How does a starship channel that much energy on the regular?
>>81711583Archer has the same problem. "Tucker dont you fucking teach that sex slave to read fuck sake thats their culture we cant interfere"Nekminnit, interfering with every fucking culture, especially where it involves breasts.
>>81711607Bro what are you talking about?
>>81711610I blame it on writers really, really not understanding the Prime Directive or not having consistent direction on what the Prime Directive is.
>>81711640Honestly I love enterprise but it seemed to have the weakest sense of continuity. The prop for the Plasma Injectors was also referred to as like 5 different things. Vulcans cant all Mind Meld, and then they can. etc etc etc.
>>81711664>Can't all mind meldTo be fair I don't think any series referred to this rule after TOS except for STD, and STD made it the product of the magic mind crystals under Spock's family palace.
>>81711561I cant imagine any criticism of Blue Origin that wont come from it being done by Bezos in the first place
>>81711610I'd say Archer was more consistently insane early on, and consistently a normal human being later on (read: S4)FFS the man was fully committed to letting an entire benevolent species die because of his belief that evolution was a god.
>>81711691Wasnt it more Phlox basically refusing to help and convincing Archer to soothe their symptoms for like 100 years rather than hand them a cure? Archer was on team interference for most of that episode.
>>81711620What's confusing about what I wrote?
>>81711674>STD made it the product of the magic mind crystals under Spock's family palaceExcuse me but what the fuck?
>You're from outer space?>No, I'm from Quebec. I only visit outer space.
>>81711640The Prime Directive seems to run the gamut from "good general rule of thumb but flexible by necessity" to "Starfleet's secular I Can't Believe It's Not Religious Dogma" depending on the captain (but actually the writer).
>>81711739The entire physics of your question. Star Trek Establishes that Matter-energy transport, or replication or whatnot can be done non-dangerously, and since that is consistent, that's all that matters.For instance, Graviton particles exist in Star Trek, But don't IRL, but they are consistantly used, so it works in universe.Same here.Star Trek is Fantasy with a science Vaneer, their physics are different from ours.More importantly, matter energy transport isn't a real technology, which means that it doesn't need to follow known physics, which may sound like a sarcastic answer, but seriously; if it exists ir means they found some way around the issue you ask. If you were just asking how they found a way around it? It isn't elaborated on. Something something containment field.
>>81711713The original plot had Phlox wanting to withhold the cure and Archer wanting to give it to them.Then the execs showed up, said "no inter-crew conflict", and they both ended up agreeing with the genocide by inaction
>>81711877What I am asking is whether the writers ever came up with an explanation, recognize the issue but never bother addressing it beyond "it's the future," or they just plain forgot.
>>81711885What's with this retarded no-conflict rule that keeps popping up?
>>81711953I think on broadcast tv, seppo boomers dont like seeing the good guys argue.
>>81711953Holdover from TNG. Gene wanted no conflict within the crew because "muh utopian society and evolved humanity", and that carried over to VOY and ENT because the clueless execs were chasing the same audience numbers TNG drew, not realizing tv had changed since then
>>81711535>"Everyone in the world needs to see this"Not gonna lie that got me good, god bless you Bill.
>>81712287I'm so glad that STD and PIC have conflict between the crew.
>>81712462I meanWhen you put it that wayMaybe Berman and Braga are remembered too harshly
>>81712287But TNG started to put in crew disagreements as soon as Gene kicked the bucket.
>>81712462One step forward, two staggering lurches to the side and off a cliff.
Michael Pillier:Executive Producer TNG: S3x05 to endExecutive Producer DS9: beginning to S3x19Executive Producer Voyager: beginning to S3x01Wonder if that has anything to do with it.
>>81711936No, why would they?
>>81711953Gene Roddenberry said Humanity would move beyond it. No conflict.
>>81712462So what exactly is your point in posting this?Is your point that no conflict is a better option?Or that conflict is an all or nothing element, not a sliding scale?
>>81712495Berman? No.Braga, Behir, Pillar and Neuss? Yes.
>>81712496Yes, but only minor disagreements that never went past a single episode. Compare Voyager to Ron Moore's Battlestar Galactica, the show he made after being invited to write for Voyager and seeing firsthand how little they cared for their product.
>>81712665Because some things they would actually try to explain or get right while handwaving others.
>>81712681Spock and McCoy constantly got into arguments and the crews of both Enterprises had to deal with bullshit from further up the chain of command. There was always some level of conflict from the very beginning.
The difference between then and now is that previously humans still did what they thought was legitimately better for everyone and conflict stemmed from differences in opinion and even the bad guys tried to exhaust other methods of achieving their goals before shooting each other. Even jackfucks like Sloan, Eddington, and Leyton kept to this, and it meant that the times where characters did choose violence actually had meaning behind them. Meanwhile in CBS schlock, characters get into more petty squabbles, and have a far lower threshold for getting the phasers out.
>>81712693Conflict between characters is not like MSG, which makes everything better, and is not the reason why writing is shit.
>>81712784>>81712681Yeah exactly, by the time of TNG Gene was old and senile and not making a lot of sense.It's important to understand the spirit of his words, not the litearlly interpretations of the shit he said while he was going off his rocker. Ethical disagreements and questions are core to Star Trek.
>>81712784Gene had more control over early TNG than he ever did over TOS
>>81712856>Ethical disagreements and questions are core to Star TrekI like that time Wesley told Picard he was wrong and if that meant he couldn't be a part of Starfleet then so be it.
>>81712968Picard should have grasped the opportunity to get rid of wesley.
>>81711687Well there are the reports coming from internally where it's indicated that they're massively rushing things and not showing nearly enough due diligence for something so dangerous to operate, so it's only a matter of time until it kills a bunch of people from critical maintenance being rushed because some executive demanded that a launch meets the date required for optimal media coverage or the like.Honestly though I was hoping it would kill Shatner, that would have been funny as fuck. >>81712820This. "Gene's box" as Michael Pillar would call it is surprisingly fundamental to the feel of star trek. It's not that everyone has to have the same opinion on things, as seen every time Picard canvasses for options in a meeting and then ignores Worf's sensible idea, it's that shit doesn't devolve into soap opera style screaming and crying matches, and that the crew are not gonna advocate for things radically outside what's appropriate for star fleet, so that the drama has to work on a different level. And that often worked out to push far smarter stories because the writers couldn't rely upon just hitting the base emotions to make things engaging. DS9 had a bit of a work around in having non-star fleet crew to have some drastically different takes on things thrown in, and some actual "I'll go solve this my way" stuff as seen with Odo, Garak and so on. Voyager threatened us with a good time by having the Maquis to fill that role and have some actual divergent approaches but well, neutered that immediately and then had to bring in Seven of Nine later to fulfil that same role. But even so the characters have to be seen to work together and not get caught up in petty bullshit and feuding.
>>81713364Wesley left of his own accord so it would have been redundant. Picard might have felt conflicted or upset for getting looked down upon by Wesley Crusher of all people, but he wasn't petty enough to shoot the kid out an airlock.
>>81713424>but he wasn't petty enough to shoot the kid out an airlock.Nobody's perfect.
>>81713405Voyager had a problem with Janeway giving a pithy speech to solve disagreements or moral quandaries.
>>81711535>There's... something on the wingUm, bros...
Federation Scout Ship has a crew of up to 4. Have to wonder what it's like to be stuck in one of these, how long is a mission? Weeks? Months? It's roughly the size of a Traveller Scout/Courier and I could see it as a player adventureboat, but the runabout seems to fit the main role for "small ship that does minor things" for the federation.
>>81713660It’s a dedicated scout/courier. The Danube is an all rounder that can be configured for various different missions. The scoutship is an overpowered warp drive, bolted to a sensor array, a modest combat suite and enough space for some people.
>>81710955For a show about a ship lost in unknown space just tying to get home...they do a whole lot of the same old shit over and over again.How many episodes involved 2-3 crew members being sent to some planet to conduct a study in the Delta Flyer only to get stuck there and need rescuing before some storm or anomaly explodes? Why the fuck are they doing Starfleet business as usual scientific studies when they are supposed to be rationing and escaping the quadrant as fast as possible?The aliens in the area do not come off as anything we have not seen a hundred times before in TNG and DS9 only with slightly different foreheads. Same with their ships, it was all the same old shit we saw in TNG. So no amazing new and different cultures or technologies that we have never encountered before. Just typical forehead aliens of the week in their (Not)Klingon Bird of Preys and (Not)Cardassian Galors pew pewing at Voyager.
The different sized BoP is an after the fact fan/author creation.The ships show up on screen because it's what directors want. Think of the OP's image with "canon" sized BoPs. They would barely show up on an old 30" color TV and be completely non threatening. So they were blown the fuck up for dramatic effect , making the canon autists REEEEEEEEEEEEE and creating a scaled up ship (non sensical). lol
>>81711953>>81712287Except for McCoy hating on Spok consistently, and later the season 2 doctor of TNG hating on Data as much as possible.
>>81714041meant for >>81710724
>>81714075Pulaski was a crime against television
>>81712760>>81714075That and every single Federation Admiral being a warlike asshole that every captain had to undermine for the episode.
>>81714075>>81714094That doctor made zero sense to me. Someone who grew up in the 2200s had to have been surrounded in AIs, machines, computers, and various robots of all kinds for the weird level of prejudice she had. As if she time traveled from the 1950s to the Enterprise and hated having toasters and radios talk to her like they're human.
>>81714000VOY was the worst for holodeck abuse (you'd think a recreational facility would have just been shut down the first time it threatens the ship).VOY was the worst for 'Humans but with a slight nose alteration or funny hat every week'VOY was the worst for having great ideas and doing jack shit with it. Starfleet/Maquis,,,dropped, Resource starved survival show,,,mostly dropped, GIANT CITY SHIP OF SENTIENT EARTH DINOSAURS ,, one and done episode, etc, etc.VOY was the BEST at tits. Until ENT.
>>81714157>VOY was the BEST at tits. Until ENT.Booba Trek supremacy.
>>81714128>That doctor made zero sense to me. Someone who grew up in the 2200s had to have been surrounded in AIs, machines, computers, and various robots of all kinds for the weird level of prejudice she had. As if she time traveled from the 1950s to the Enterprise and hated having toasters and radios talk to her like they're human.Reminds me of the episode of DS9 where they could have replaced a dudes failing organs with artificial pieces, but he was worried about losing his soul if he eventually became completely machine, so he chose death.Trek often had a really regressive view of technology.
>>81714000>Why the fuck are they doing Starfleet business as usual scientific studies when they are supposed to be rationing and escaping the quadrant as fast as possible?This was my problem with it. They made up a huge setting change with endless possibilities but then got to work just making more TNG episodes. Voyager flies up to some planet for no actual reason, interacts with the local aliens and helps them with some issue. When they should be passing any planet they do not have to bother with and only stop for a supply run or if they run into trouble somehow.But they would just stop every ten minutes to go study some thing in space or stop to meet with locals for no actual reason and get into the episode adventure.
>>81714226Are you talking about the dude who got chunks of his brain replaced? Getting the robo-brain demonstrably and progressively altered his mind the further he went.
>>81714128>Someone who grew up in the 2200s had to have been surrounded in AIs, machines, computers, and various robots of all kinds for the weird level of prejudice she had.Exactly. She's someone who grew up in the 2200s and has been surrounded by AIs, machines, computer sand various robots which INVARIABLY go on murder sprees. From ship autopilots to mining equipment to entertainment systems. Data was an exception to the "murder all humanoids" rule that AIs operate in, and even then an android with the exact same design went into the murder all humanoids mode. This is a universe where it's accepted as normal that a supercomputer will take over a civilization and start murdering people.Fucking conduit gellcaps, whatever those are, went into murder mode.What AIs didn't do this other than Data? Exocomps?
>>81714298Seemed fine in my memory, but I just started my DS9 rewatch so I am sure I will get to it.
>>81713768Runabouts are just glorified shuttles. I want something in between those and a Defiant-class. I dare you to tell me you wouldn't want to buzz around in this little beastie.
>>81714128With the number of times automated systems gained sentience and went nuts or had a myriad of other problems, Data probably looked like a walking talking timebomb with command authority.
>>81714325That looks bigger than a Defiant.
>>81714331With how many times Data himself went nuts or had a myriad of other problems, Pulaski sounded reasonable.
>>81714325There's the Raven which apparently a family of scientists can own and operate. Sits between a Runabout and an Oberth, crew of 2 to 10.
>>81714354Then I want that ship but smaller than a Defiant.
>>81714379Is there something like that but less... civie?
USS Raven being an Aerie class surveyor. Have to wonder how hard it is to get one of these if you're a Federation citizen. Do you need to be a prominent scientist? Made a huge contribution to society?
>>81714157Why didnt Amelia Earheart join the Voyager crew
>>81710955Man, I cannot look at Jennifer Lien without seeing the crazy, drugged out cat lady she becomes.
>>81714157She hated that outfit since the corset prevented her from bending.I also remember a webcomic called "Fans" that hated her for some reason and made her an antagonist who eventually is raped by one of the main characters.
>>81714447She knew they'd eventually figure out she was a fraud like that Rasmussen guy.They're not even the same ethnicity.
>>81714426You basically gotta ask Starfleet for one and if they think your use of it would be worthwhile and you pass various checks then they’ll let you have it.
>>81714447Voyager writers loved hitting the reset button and Amelia would have been too interesting an addition.
>>81709983>I hope they don't just handwave it away.Q could just snap it away as the writer's method of backpedaling on a move that may have been ill-conceived and worse received.
>>81709983They won't address it at all. He's totally the real Picard because science magic.
>>81714379I'll admit it's a bit dodgy between the episodes where it's name dropped, but ultimately it's revealed that the USS Raven is a Federation exploration vessel on a sanctioned mission for the Federation that the Hansen's blew off to go searching for the mysterious rumored Borg. They misfiled a flight plan, buggered off into the neutral zone, and ignored orders to return to the Federation.But, yeah, technically own, as in nine tenths of the law, and operate. I'm talking more about acquiring.
>>81714314You do realize that just about every single aspect of Fed technology involves an AI on nearly all levels of society. There are trillions and trillions of AIs out there in every ship, every starbase, every colony, and city on every planet. And a single ship going nuts in the early 2200s, after an unknown type of space radiation fucked it up, one time does not make all of that totally threat level obselete. Your argument is basically the same thing as there is a single black guy that robbed someone a century and a half ago....that means all black people everywhere in all parts of history will rob everyone every time. Better be safe and cull them all.
>>81714699I kind of figure that since they just swapped his mind into a body that doesn't have super strength and is basically running a random number generator for when he'll keel over dead. I'd be surprised if it isn't brought up when Q changes the past, as in Picard suddenly realizing he's a real boy again as a consequence of this different timeline, but if it's not even mentioned then or by Q himself then we'll know.
>>81709983>>81714699He's the real Picard in the same way post-SFS Spock is the real Spock or any transporter results in the same person. Star Trek canonically has the soul as a real thing that defines the person, so transferring the soul from one vessel to another does not create a new person.Clones are another entirely different matter however.
Oh look the guardian has an opinion.>https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/oct/13/jeff-bezos-blue-origin-star-trek-space-william-shatner>Blue Origin should be the antithesis of all that is Star Trek, and in many ways, it is. Star Trek’s universe is one in which humanity has overcome its differences and established the one world state of the United Earth Government, and eventually a cross species alliance under the United Federation of Planet – often just called the Federation. Humanity eliminated poverty, currency, and capitalism as we know it. This allowed the United Earth Government to more effectively utilize its resources for projects like space travel and bringing dignity to all of the people of Earth.>https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Zefram_Cochrane>His primary motivation for commencing warp technology was financial gain in the devastated, poverty-stricken America that existed in the wake of the Third World War. roflcopter.
>>81714888Also Zeph didn't even accomplish anything himself, he got help from Starfleet from centuries in the future.
>>81714920Wasnt that necessary to correct for borg sabotage?
>>81714873That was Spock's mind going back into the original Spock body.Picard is a copy in an externally duplicated body.
>>81714942No, the original body was interred in the torpedo, and a brand new body was grown by the Genesis effect from conception. The original body was worm food.
>>81714486Also the neck collar was so tight it pressed against her carotid, causing her to faint on one occasionBut hey, it saved the ratings
>>81714873It varies by episode and writer. All of Star Trek should be considered soft canon by default.
>>81714936This is where time travel shenanigans comes into account - the borg went back and tried to prevent the launch, right, and so the Enterprise followed them and unfucked it, and chose to remain anonymous so as not to bork the timeline. So was that always the case? Or did it only become part of history once the Borg attempted it? I dunno, but it makes my brain hurt and I feel stupid contemplating it.
>>81714888Who exactly were they expecting to get us into space, NASA? Some magical international collaboration between America, the EU, Russia, and China?
>>81714973Pretty sure other anon is correct. Spock's body got regenerated but also de-aged.
>>81715108That's contrary to how the Genesis effect normally works. Either that or Spock's old body was broken down and a new body was created, which is functionally no different from creating a new body completely.
>>81714426According to STA, a lot of old Oberths apparently got handed off to minor universities(IE, not the Daystrom Institute, Vulcan Science Academy, or Starfleet Academy itself) for their own scientific studies. As for how you get one, it's probably just a matter of submitting a requisition form to Starfleet explaining what you intend to use the ship for, a brief psych check to make sure you're (probably) not going to run off and set yourself up as God King over some pre-FTL civilization or singlehandedly start a war with the Tholians, and then once everything's cleared they'll get you a spare ship or print one out for you as soon as there's a free slip in the shipyards somewhere.
>>81715042Honestly, there's enough time travel crap from other episodes to support either interpretation
>>81715042>So was that always the case? Or did it only become part of history once the Borg attempted it?All this depends on whether you consider ENT canon. If you do, then the paradox always existed and there was no point where Zef never had help from the Ent-E.For his accomplishments to have ever been all his own, ENT would need to be rendered non-canon and the events of FC at best created an alternate timeline.
>>81715141>That's contrary to how the Genesis effect normally works.Yeah well it also wasn't supposed to build planets out of nebulae or bring back the dead period. What are you going to do?
>>81714727So basically Seven's parents were complete retards and she was doomed from the get-go.
>>81715239Well they were brother and sister.
>>81715042It was always the case. Otherwise you'd see the Time Police in VOY and ENT go back in time to stop it.
>>81715256But given Enterprise's explanation for the Mirror Universe divergence point, that makes no sense. There wouldn't have been a mirror Enterprise E to go back through time and assist first contact because of the Terran Empire's collapse.
>>81715286There is a mirror Enterprise-E though.
>>81714888>An English paper is retardedAnon why would you post something so redundant?
>>81715286Not to mention that Mirror Phlox compares the history of the regular universe to his own and the divergences date back to at least centuries before First Contact
>>81715256Easiest assumption is to always assume the time police can't actually deal with time shenanigans that originate from their past, because then they're changing their own history. They only deal with shenanigans that originate in their time period or in their future.
>>81715286Mirror Borg are really big on personal space, and foster individuality through recreational herbs
>>81714936'Borg Sabotage' being an orbital bombardment on the launch site that barely did any damage. First Contact's storyline continues to give me headaches because the entire premise can be derailed by a SINGLE DRONE beaming down onto anywhere on Earth and proceeding to fuck the timeline severely that way.
>>81715481Yeah. The movie was long on feels and short on cohesion. Honestly I still prefer it to "Controls are down, deploy the riker joysticks" of Insurrection. I often think of Insurrection as the shark star trek jumped, causing all the modern nonsense.
>>81715481I'm doing the writers' work for them, but it can be argued the Borg didn't beam down specifically to lure the Enterprise crew into a false sense of security so they could beam onto the ship instead.
>>81715558Not that guy, but surely they could BorgGyver a transporter out of whatever bits of the Enterprise they were fucking with.
>>81715580Arguably beaming down themselves would have been a bad idea because the Enterprise and her crew could easily locate and mop them up unless caught with their pants down. It would have been a shortlived attempt. If they captured the Enterprise and were able to handle everything themselves, all well and good. If not, well, priority one was contacting the Collective and calling them in early so they'd ultimately win either way.
>a pod with baby changeling send out by the Founders crashes upon a world inhabted by prewarp humanoids>infant changeling is discovered allowing local scientist to collect great deal of data before the creature succumbs to their less than optimal care and the injuries it sustained during the crash>grim mood sweeps the planet as they realize in an universe full of immortal shapeshifters they are doomed>"In order to survive as a culture we must give up our biological nature">by the time they invented warp the original species was nearly extinct with only few elders remaning>their artificially created children while biologically immortal and certainly not solid lack the impressive shapeshifting abilities of a proper Founder remaing translucent and gooey no matter what form they take and only have limited abiity to link>yet on the other hand they posses fully developed sense of smell and are much more resilient to damageWhat happens when they meet Dominion?
>>81715543Personally, I enjoyed Insurrection more than I did First Contact, and I give Riker's joystick a pass because the youth planet gave him a cavalier streak.
>>81715798The Founders are a bunch of dicks, so they'll probably claim this shows how jealous the Solids are of their abilities and that they need to be destroyed.
>>81715481>'Borg Sabotage' being an orbital bombardment on the launch site that barely did any damage.Pretty much everyone involved except Lily and Cochrane himself were killed. That tends to cause problems.
>>81715835Considering how chock full of them the galaxy seems to be, it's a small miracle the Founders haven't encountered any energy being that mocked them for still relying on a physical form
>>81715901Founders were like" You just jelly of our superior matter, photonboy"
>>81714920No it was all him for principals, Starfleet just helped repair it.Tt. Literally rewatched that movie a few days ago.
>>81715959Well, we did quite literally see them shapeshift into energy forms and even a fucking warp capable interstellar form so yeah sure, that.
>>81715328The Mirror universe comic series that features bearded Picard.
>>81716540There are a multitude of takes on the mirror universe, including one in which the Terran Empire never falls. I'll need more details than that.
>>81716371And pilot it. And oversee the launch. And inspire him after he tried to run away.
>>81715339So why didn't they stop Ancient Janeway from saving Voyager when she went back in time? Are you implying Janeway going back in time was "their" actual timeline and that in all timelines where Janeway doesn't go back in time the Time Police aren't formed because the Federation falls to the Borg during the Borg invasion?
>>81716682The answer is that time travel works differently depending on the episode/writer, as is any chance the time police will get involved. It's not consistent and should not be assumed to be.
>>81716682>So why didn't they stop Ancient Janeway from saving Voyager when she went back in time?Because, relative to the time cops, it happened in their past, and is therefore history that should not be altered.>in all timelines where Janeway doesn't go back in time the Time Police aren't formed because the Federation falls to the Borg during the Borg invasion?It's a possibility, though the uncertainty is why they shouldn't mess around with it.
Why is Worf always such a drip? You’re from a warrior race who drink and fuck twice as much as they fight. Chill your shit, bro.
Making the Borg Great Again. 1. Borg Cubes infiltarate and assimilate ships as they fight their way through them. Successful Cubes soon have ever larger growning fleets of borgified ships with them. 2. Borg Cubes scavenge ships for their crews and useful materials. Successful Cubes grow ever larger with the material of defeated ships.
>>81716876>1. Borg Cubes infiltarate and assimilate ships as they fight their way through them. Successful Cubes soon have ever larger growning fleets of borgified ships with them.<WE WILL NOT BE BOUND>
>>81716540Mirror Picard is going around in the Mirror Enterprise-D which has all the extra bits that the future Enterprise does in All Good Things.
>>81717264Published before the DS9 mirror universe episodes I believe.
>>81717361What? No, the MU TNG comics are from the last couple years.
>>81717394Well Mirror O'Brien shows up in this week's issue on the Enterprise, so it's either an alternate Mirror Universe or before DS9's episodes.
>>81717460Oh you mean in setting? Yes, the Comics take place in the early 2360s.
Is there a good list of must read novels? I want a comprehensive understanding of the various factions/cultures of the galaxy.
>>81717542I dont know if it is in print, but the Day of Honour omnibus is pretty readable, and goes into lots of klingon shit. I found the DS9 novels worthless. I really enjoyed the Shatner trek novels, but I understand that their level of canonicity is below soft. Shatner elevates kirk to some kind of unkillable demigod, cursed with the mission of forever upstaging Picard. Its great. Star Trek New Earth is a self contained side series that occurs before TOS season 2. The Starfleet Corps of Engineers is pretty good if you like technobabble, but I recall even at the time it was fairly heavy handed from an inclusivity perspective. Theres a novel about Kirk as a kid, camping out, sneaking aboard the enterprise. Its pretty dope. Cant remember the name. I havent read any trek in a while so other people will have better responses I think.
>>81717542The Rihannssu novels are great for the Romulans, if a little campy. A Stitch in Time is a must and Una McCormack’s Cardassian novels are solid.The Day of Honor books do great work with the Klingons.
>>81717542Oh and read all the Romulan War/Birth of the Federation novels. They use the Enterpsie cast a lot better than the show usually did. Hoshi and Mayweather actually do things, it’s surreal.
>>81716619Zefram piloted it.Launch was ultimately unaffected by overseeing it.He only tried to run because they interfered.
>>81717658>I really enjoyed the Shatner trek novelsI appreciate them for bringing back Mirror Kirk as Emperor Tiberius as he's usually killed off by Mirror Spock and never allowed to develop.
>>81717542That little green block in the pic labelled Temporal Investigations was fun to read.
>>81715384Only humanity is different in the mirror universe. Any difference in the aliens is caused by their interaction with the terran empire.
>>81717542It's gonna be a short list because Jesus fucking Christ is the mass of 'Trek novel fodder just complete crap.Goes double for that whole 'relaunch' thing where in more recent years an attempt was made at having a shared timeline between book series, which just made things worse with a ton of just complete garbage getting published with tons of deliberate character assassination level use of established characters, massive playing favourites (like ignoring DS9's cast to throw in TNG rejects as replacements) and baffling choices all around. Most of the good books are gonna be the real old ones from before the relaunch happening, like How Much For Just The Planet? and A Stitch in Time.
>>81718235>massive playing favourites (like ignoring DS9's castReally? As a writer that comes across as remarkably petty
>>81718235My favorite was when David Mack brought back Melora Pazlar so he could have a canon disabled person on the ship, then gave her a special room where she would be in zero gravity all the time
>>81715239Seven of Nine is basically the Trek universe equivalent of moronic hippy parents that took their kids off to a secluded mountain in Alaska to study bears, and were almost entirely eaten by bears.
>>81718434>the bears take Annika in and raise her>she becomes absolutely feral
I felt dumb for pre judging it so I downloaded Lower Deck's first season and it's actually enjoyable. A lot of the jokes fall flat but it's good overall.The Cerritos is an ugly-ass ship though, holy shit.
>>81716876I think a big step would be to quit making the Borg into generic evil villains that do evil for the sake of being evil like randomly attacking Earth for no real reason all the time. Get rid of the damn queen while we are at it. Have them only show up when there is something they deem important enough to need a cube there, and they do not bother shooting or assimilating a ship that just happens to be there since it is no threat and does not add anything the collective needs right now. Have Borg cubes only show up when something cosmically or technologically interesting happens, and they are too damn OOC for the local ships to do shit about. Like a Fed science ship is studying some giant thing in space, a cube appears and begins assimilating it. Fed ships fires at it but the cube ignores everything and then flies off when done. They only appear to a Alpha Quadrant ship when they do something interesting like test out matter phasing cloak. Cube appears and assimilates it and flies off. While stil ignoring the other ships around trying to stop them.
>>81718522I think the borg should adapt to federation diplomacy somehow.
>>81718588Wasn't that the point of Locutus? he was going to convince the Federation leadership that assimilation was the only way. That's why he was given some semblance of individuality.
>>81718509It grows on you. I still don't think it's a good design, but I'm fond of it now.
>>81718684Yeah but he didnt work. I am thinking, non threatening ship, cool diplomat guy. Like open legit diplomacy. And then during some run of the mill trade deal, theres a line item thats assimilate earth. Bam gottem.
>>81718826>you all seem suspiciously cybernetically enhanced..."No no, we're fine. just sign here, here and here. You must comply.">what?"Oh, nothing..."
>>81718702well you're wrong with bad taste in ships
>>81718901>Borg join the Federation>Offer up technology and a huge cultural database>Some citizens get borg augments as a status symbol>Some federation people resist this new cultural trend>Borg exert political influence to ensure the federation doesnt condone this xenophobia and augmentphobia>When they hit critical mass they just press the assimilation button.
>>81718509It was designed as one of those background ships you see in the rear of shots, since it's meant to be the butt end of Starfleet... which is honestly nice, seeing most of the crew are still better than modern humans in general. Season 2 is even better.
>>81718509Don't feel dumb man, I ignored it for a year since STD/STP were so bad, but I saw enough clips to decide I would give it a shot. That initial trailer was really misleading, it's a fun ride and at times feels like a Trek Trivia Scavenger hunt.
>>81718965See the problem is then the Borg win. If they are peaceful and careful they can't lose.
>>81719025the opening sequence is still funnier than most of the jokes so far
What exactly does Rutherford's implant allow him to do?The only thing we've seen it do is mess with his memories and emotions, and even then we don't really know what function that has normally.Does he get perfect memory? Better hearing or vision like Geordi? Direct interfacing with machines or computers?I seem to recall he got it voluntarily, so I assume there was a good reason for it.
>>81718962This is the first time I've disagreed with a skeleton.
>>81719404Accident, it's to fix an injury.
>>81719404it allows him to be convenient to the plot
>>81719502it won't be the last
>>81716906>In return for their help, the ones known as Pakleds will be given half the ship parts in the galaxy. An ample return for repairing this Cube's systems, and leading my drones back to me.>>81718522That was what the Borg were like early on, roving, unstoppable tech pests with no set territory that simply commandeered any technology that interested them. It might have even been the case that assimilating organics was simply a practical step: if you pull the interesting metal bits out of an ant colony and you have the means to convert the ants that get reeled in with them into something that proves useful, why not do it?
>>81719404So far we've seen it affect his brain as you've said, he can store data on it and directly interface with a computer like when he had to upload a virus to that ship, and it gives him some fighting skill like during that training scene or when he kept blacking out and apparently doing all sorts of skilled shit while unconscious as his implant took over. I think he got it after an accident in engineering, not by choice?Basically it's plot convenience and I'm okay with that, it's mostly used for humor anyway. Get too good and you start wondering why we don't all get visors like LaForge, and even then his unique vision only really came up when he needed to see special energy waves. He even got hacked once to assassinate the Klingon ambassador. Tech should have a lot of downsides or something everyone would become cyborgs.
>>81715835IDK about that. What if they don’t realize what these are and assume they are natural?
>>81711413Jesus fuck, the man's 90 years old. He's gonna die up there.
>>81720859Anon...he came back
>>81721006Or at least something that looked like him did.
>>81719404They really havent used his implant at all this season, which is good, since his character relied too heavily on it, but it has left him far less dynamic.
Wej duj was such a good fuggin episode, I wanna see how/if they tie in with the finale. Most accurate depiction of life on a Klingon ship since Worf gave the Dahar master an honorable death.
>>81721006That's a damn shame.
>>81721300It was actually pretty neat when rookie Klingon took the seat and told them to set course for the homeworld. The whole sequence was the most Klingon scene since DS9.
>>81721847Agreed. Plus, Ngl, the Vulcans made me chuckle, but I was more intrigued at how Their ships were run.
>>81722020Vulcan chick seems to be a fan favorite already.
>>81722070I hope, DESPERATELY, that the analysts at CBS see the popularity of older Trek and LD, and the falling viewership of STD and STP, and take that as a reasonable sign of what the consumer wants, and put more people like McMahan in charge of Trek.
>>81721300"Avoid death and cower" amused me more than it should have.
wew, that episode was intense
>>81722467Last one was more tightly scripted but this feels like a move towards actual stakes.Honestly thought this was for the Doopler incident at the admiralty ball at first.
>>81722070I was one of those mehs!>>81719404Very prescient question, it seems>>81722521Mike McMahan give Freeman a break, she deserves it
>>81722751>I was one of those mehs!Me too.
Not the cavalry hero shot I was hoping for but at least they remembered Starfleet is an actual fleet.
>>81714128Its most likely she was a holdover in attitude to the TOS mentality of "robots don't matter" remember how many times kirk an co didn't even consider robots could be leaders or sentient and actively worked against them?
Thinking of starting a game of Star Trek Adventures, I'm making a ship.I want one that is sort of medium sized (scale 3/4, maybe 5), and used everywhere throughout the federation, that's not too old or too specialised.Any suggestions ?I was looking at the Excelsior or the Centaur,
>>81724300What era are you looking at?
>>81723164I'm amazed, often time not even the writers do
>>81723164>>81709069A good week for Novas
>Can't we just warp past the debris?I'm with Kayshon on this one, Ceritos was outside the system, the debris was in the inner system between the star and the planet. Ceritos could have come in from the outside and avoided the debris.
>>81724811Is the nebula quite a common ship ? Are there any alternatives I could consirder ?
>>81724838>>81724811I'd go with Intrepid if you're going midsized. Nebula rivals Galaxy class.
>>81724838Fairly common. The Miranda and Excelsior would have been most common in the decade before hand but the Dominion War did for a bunch of them. You could also do an Akira or an Intrepid.
>>81724661I think that's meant to be an in-joke because there's so many times that should've been the solution but just wasn't.
>>81724794>>81724838TNG is in the 2360s, 70s is Voyager and the bulk of DS9. If it's TNG era then you're limited on the number of ships to choose from; they mostly reused the Excelsior and Miranda models from the movies but those are obviously late 23rd century designs. The Nebula is your safest bet for a more recent design that isn't a major ship like the Galaxy.The 2370s is when ship designs get a lot broader, for the in-universe reasons of Starfleet diversifying after the Borg incursions and Dominion related conflicts, and for the real-world reasons of switching over to CGI after TNG ended so they weren't limited by what physical models they could come up with, combined with First Contact creating a fuck-ton of new ships which DS9 could simply reuse as background ships. That being said, the Nebula is still pretty common for that era, and not counting the hero ships or the Yeager actually has the most appearances across TNG, DS9, and Voyager.The alternatives, not including the hero ships, are the Akira, which is typically specialized as either a missile boat or pocket carrier, the Saber and Steamrunner classes which are smaller, and the Yeager which is a goofy kitbash ship that someone on the DS9 production staff loved shoving into the background for some reason.If you're fine including hero ship classes, the Intrepid is also a possibility, but keep in mind we've only seen an Intrepid other than Voyager a total of once so it may not be that common.
>>81725012Intrepids are more complex, with the bioneural circuitry. That would likely make them difficult to produce.
>>81724300I'd look into some of the smaller offshoots of the Galaxy class, like the New Orleans class. They're reasonably modern, but have had enough time to be built in numbers unlike the most modern designs (such as the Akira or Intrepid).I'd recommend having a look through the Command Division book, as that contains a good variety of additional ship hulls (including the Centaur and the New Orleans).
>>81724661Creating a <25 millicochrane resonance wake within 10 AU of a radiolithic tachyon field? Do you want to create a subspace tear?
Do your meals have honor?
>>81725095Looks good, would it be reasonable to suggest that the Centaur or the Excelsior would still be in service at this date ?
>>81725012Very informative thanks...Probably want to avoid hero ships, Akira seems nice but would it be used outside of tactical roles ?
>>81722300Excelsiors are best ship
>>81723164That Archimedes is one sexy looking ship.
>>81723164Oberth-chan still putting in the work.Awyeah.
>>81708263>What happens when the Federation encounters a union of worlds similar to its own? As in one governed by a representative government with voluntary membership for the purposes of collective security and prosperity? What would happen if such a union were more powerful or advanced, enough to be more appealing to UFP member worlds?Already happened, they choose hostility and war crimes
>>81726341Imagine being an Oberth captain, just constantly getting called up to tag along in some rescue operation long after the action is over and some big leaguer capital ship needs salvaging.Honestly sounds comfy as hell.
I have a sneaking suspicion that some of Starfleet's less scrupulous admirals assigned captains they didn't like to Freedom class vessels as an unofficial punishment.
>>81711691>FFS the man was fully committed to letting an entire benevolent species die because of his belief that evolution was a god.As much I hate Disco, Dear Doctor is still the worst single Trek thing ever existed
>>81727158Worse than Hoshi is invisible, saves the enterprise, then it was all a dream she had in the transporter buffer?
>>81727158I would love for an episode of Trek where a visiting captain points out how absurdly dogmatic some of their colleagues get about the Prime Directive thanks to essentially deifying natural selection.
After watching the latest LD episode I am just going to admit it. Lower Decks is my favorite Star Trek series.
>>81727281Leaning in that direction myself.
>>81726663>Congratulations, you have to fly around in a ship that looks vaguely like a child's toy raygun.
>>81727281It's not my favorite, TNG still is for how much it makes me think and leaves me with deep questions that are hard to answer. But it's fun even if it's not classy.
>>81727281Imo it's some of the best trek we got since June '99
>>81727340I wouldn't be surprised if it's also slow, underpowered, poorly armed, and suffers from an unstable warp bubble.
>>81715798Considering founders are resilient and can take almost any form, why not make living spaceships based on stripped down founder biology? Just make the creature stupid and obedient. A trully multipurpose vessel!
>>81725599If it's a torpedo boat then you can use it to send out a bunch of probes, and the capacity means the ability to carry specialized scientific equipment instead of the generic class whatever probes that the Enterprise sends out. If it's a fighter boat then you can load it up full of research shuttles. Or you can just say that the torpedo/fighter pod was converted to hold a bunch of scientific and/or engineering facilities like you'd see on a typical cruiser.
Well lads I don't know what to say. I went into Discovery with an open mind, not wanting to let mob think influence my experience, and I'm enjoying the fuck out of the first season. The visuals, aesthetic, most of the characters, all of it. I have enough race/ship/problem of the week for a lifetime and this serialized action story is hitting the spot. Fuck I even like Michael (especially the Sarek/Vulcan angle).I know this is unpopular here and I won't bring it up much because I'm here for Trek nerdism and not autistic E-fighting but I had to put it out there,
>>81726663What purpose is this thing even supposed to serve?>>81726658They're using the Oberth's cargo pod to carry refugees and evacuees.
I pretend I do not see it.
>>81725599If you really want to expand to more ship classes, Lower Decks has introduced several. California, Parliament, Luna, Obena. While they've been shown in 2381, it's not too much of a stretch that some of them were already in the service in the 2370's.
>>81727588Honestly did the same with the opposite result. It leans too heavily on the trek I didnt like, and it usually does it to avoid canon. I think the writers have realised their mistakes, Section 31's influence is mostly fucked off, they have teleported the discovery to the future etc etc. I also think they over designed everything. The klingons especially. I remain hopeful for Strange New Worlds because I suspect that all of my complaints will be addressed.
>>81727634(me still griping)I actually have a huge problem with anything that goes back in time before $cool_thing and then now everything is even cooler than $cool_thing but its secret.Its lazy writing.
>>81727595>According to Issue #118 of the Star Trek: The Official Starships Collection, the Freedom-class was a type of light frigate. This class was approximately 430 meters in length, had a maximum speed of warp factor 9.2, and a approximate crew complement of 370. Starfleet used this class primarily for light exploration or planet surveys. Secondary roles assigned to this class included defending Federation borders or guarding supply convoys. An unique feature of this class was the phaser cannon found on the ventral surface of the primary hull.Patrol boat & coastguard cutter.
>>81725576I would say it is entirely reasonable. Both classes were present during the Dominion War, so they must've been fairly commonplace (the Excelsior moreso than the Centaur) throughout the Federation.The Centaur does seem to be a smaller vessel for more routine duties, while an Excelsior would be the default 'big' ship sent if something odd is happening (or if an Admiral needs to attend to business personally).
>>81727588> I'm enjoying the fuck out of the first seasonGood for you, I guess - did you finish it yet?Some of the later twists and story developments sort off killed it for me.
>>81727281I wouldn't say favorite Star Trek series since that's still TNG for me by a mile but LD is easily hovering around DS9 and VOY at this point. I definitely think it's better than ENT and surpasses VOY on a lot of fronts.
>>81727588Fair enough, somebody has to like it or it would have died years ago. It just smacks very much of most modern sci-fi and tv shows in general from what I've seen of it, needless tension and drama. There's also a clip I saw where a character legitimately called Michael A QUEEN and it just made me roll my eyes.
>>81726663Light ships like that seem like they could be used for a variety of mundane jobs - personnel/prisoner transports, courier duty, picket ships, planetary militia, etc. They're also fun to use in ST Armada 3 as meat shields for more valuable craft.
>>81727719For me it's "That's the power of math, people!"
I will say that I dont think the problem with STD is the actors. I feel they are doing their best with terrible writing, directing, set design, production, makeup and effects.
>>81727711Its hard for me to pinpoint exactly where STD jumped the shark, but if it wasnt the sporp drive it was probably klingon time crystals.
>>81727973>klingon time crystalsThe what now?
>>81728066Hey buddy a completely diverse group of hollywoods greatest female writers decided that the blue klingons have a monastery full of time crystals and its kinda racist to question it.
>>81727674This seems entirely reasonable. It's just a "modern" take on the Saladin, which is at least on-a-screen canon if not fully on-screen canon.I'd theorise that it's a sort of early post-Ambassador design, since it uses the earlier phaser strips rather than the full sized arrays seen in later oval saucer starships like the New Orleans and Cheyenne classes, and has some other Ambassador-like features like the upper decks of the saucer. Though it uses the then most modern nacelle type, a full sized Galaxy class style one, so I'd also venture that originally it had a full sized Ambassador type nacelle to match the age of its other features, and was refitted.Additional fun fact: not actually a kitbash.
>>81728066You know, the poH qut usually found on Boreth that were previously unmentioned.
>>81727973For me STD started losing me when all the characters acted like assholes out of the gate (security chick and chief engineer come to mind). But it lost me completely when it tried to say a single planet -- inhabited by what looked like 19th century coal miners or oil drillers -- was somehow responsible for providing like 1/3 of all dilithium in the Federation or some shit. A planet that vital would literally be swarming with Starfleet vessels and planetary defense platforms, not to mention massive extraction facilities that would probably span much of its service but nope. It's just a dingy mining colony surrounded by mountains.And then they pulled that retarded 'maneuver' where Lorca beat the Klingons by sporedriving out and leaving a bomb in middair to blow up the fake birds of prey like some kind of Looney Tunes bit.
We often talk about starship porn in here but this was the first time we've actually seen a ship strip naked before our eyes.It was magical.
>>81727674There is no way you can convince me a single nacelle ship can do warp 9.2. That is a lot of faith to put in your field stabilizers. Sure technology has advanced but I'd never take it higher then warp 6, and even then only in clear stretches of space.
>>81728232Maximum speed is a lot different from maximum recommended speed. Yes it can technically hit warp 9.2, but probably not for long nor without something bad happening.
>>81727719>>81727754Have you watched Isaac Asimov's Foundation yet?
>>81728270No but why do you ask?
>>81727973It lost me at Episode 1 when Michael phoned up Sarek on an individual holocommunicator that wasn't even invented until DS9, decided that conversation justified her overthrowing her captain and starting a war, and we were expected to empathize with her and believe her imprisonment was unjust and tyrannical.
>>81728270Not that guy but I haven't and I kinda want to. How bad is it?
>>81728177STD (and Alias, which is also Kurtzmann so it's clearly deliberate) has a lot of things that exist exclusively to feed the needs of having a particular scene and do not arise or fit with the setting or characters. It is to me the quintessence of being a hack.
>>81727281It has the potential to get there, but I feel like we need more episodes to be sure. At the end of season 3 or 4 I'd be able to say for sure, but it's already an easy top 5, maybe top 3.>>81727588I'd actually like you to say what you think as you continue to watch, it seems that people who love season 1 end up liking the show less and less and those that hated it like the show more and more as time goes on. Especially curious about your opinions on season 3>>81727651That's my big problem, they had to make the entire first 2 seasons a secret just to make it fit, why even bother?
>>81728296muh science ship. muh secret section 31 etc.
>>81727674>>81728092To me the design makes more sense as a cost-cutting measure. Employ some new warp drive tech that -should- make a single nacelle sufficient, spend fewer resources per ship, pump them out faster and in bigger numbers. Only of course it turns out the design has a number of flaws, doesn't work terribly well, production numbers get cut, and the class gets assigned to lower priority tasks.
>>81728295You'll LOVE it. Math and Science is treated as a replacement for God by the main character, and nobody can understand sufficiently advanced math except unique individuals.https://myflixer.to/watch-tv/foundation-72427.4665640
>>81728297The actors actually do okay and if this was only about the unique elements created by the writers and directors that aren't part of the Foundation story at all it'd be an interesting scifi Game of Thrones. The bad bits are all the Foundation scenes and the writing.
>>81728345I thought Asimov was anti-religion, so why invent and endorse a whole new one, complete with a priestly caste?
>>81728177>A planet that vital would literally be swarming with Starfleet vessels and planetary defense platforms, To be fair, this won't be the first time star trek writers have had no sense of scale, consider all the times Earth has been attacked with minimal effort.>not to mention massive extraction facilities that would probably span much of its service but nope. It's just a dingy mining colony surrounded by mountains.They could have multiple automated mines on other parts of the planet, or it just could be a highly concentrated seam. You would be surprised how often in the real world a relatively small mine that only lasted a few years ended up supplying a huge chunk of x strategic resource for its respective nation.
>>81728301Its biggest crime was that it made its universe seem so small and insignificant with nothing that resembled anything we'd seen before to really anchor it to the Trek universe. Even when the fucking Klingon-Federation war was happening, we barely saw any other Starfleet ships - let alone whole fleets.I got more Star Trek out of this single frame from the LD intro than I got from the entire first season of STD.
>>81728379It doesn't. The main character is a dissenter/heretic against a religion native to her planet but spread across the galaxy. But she says in her monologues that math and science replaced God for her and instead of praying she counts. Also a lot of heavy-handed >We're scientists we KNOW what to do and you don'twithout ever cluing into the bits in the first two short stories about the Encyclopedists and the state of Imperial science.
>>81728398That sounds like expanded universe damage control material.
>>81728345I don't see the show treating the math as a replacement for God. Seldon actively tries to pull back from people deifying him and treating his work as some sort of prophecy. And I can very well see some hyper advanced math being only be understood by a few people. There are only a handful of people today who understand the really advanced theorems and equations of quantum mechanics, for instance.
>>81728066Technobabble crystals that are useful for making time machines or a device that can set up a time loop. Apparently the klingon planet that's full of monks has a naturally occurring deposit of them, so in addition to normal monk stuff they just keep an eye on it probably so someone doesnt just fly in, steal a crystal, and then make themselves a Time Ship to screw over the galaxy like that one Krenim guy in Voyager.
It's fan favourite character Sonya Gomez from the SCE novels mostly known for spilling cocoa on Picard.
>>81728414So it's just run of the mill fedora-ism?
>>81728398The fact that it forces viewers to fill in so many of the blanks on their own isn't a good sign, it's basically saying "we're not going to put in any effort into justifying this, but feel free to do it for us."
>>81728335I'd go with that they knew it'd be for low priority work anyway given there's long been experience with single nacelle designs so their limitations would be well understood.Though really the main problem with a single nacelle design is gonna be endurance, since one stack of coils is carrying the whole burden of generating the warp field, it's probably gonna need to run comparatively slower a lot of the time to avoid over-taxing it. But being a massive nacelle designed for big ships (as compared to other contemporaries it was with that had the marker pen or small but long Galaxy style) it probably has enough oomph to go real fast when needed for at least a bit.But there's a need for that kind of ship and yeah, cheaper to construct and man since it's small and uses a bunch of stuff already in production for other ships, more up-to-date in many ways than an older formerly front-line vessel. A real filler material design. A design with character if not capability.
>>81714486>I also remember a webcomic called "Fans" that hated her for some reason and made her an antagonist who eventually is raped by one of the main characters.fucking wut
>>81718434>Seven of Nine is basically the Trek universe equivalent of moronic hippy parents that took their kids off to a secluded mountain in Alaska to study bears, and were almost entirely eaten by bears.>almost entirely So what happened to the rest of them?
>>81728876Either bear drones or eaten
Did he eventually got off his planet? I suppose Federation warning beacon must to Pakleds or Ferengi what lamp is to moths.
>>81728925These are the profitable ventures of the ferengi vessel qok. To exploit warning beacons, seek out new opportunities left behind by moronic species.
>>81728956I'd watch it.
>>81728925This is the story of Pakled ship... pakled. To find things that make us go, to look for things that make us strong. To bravely go where people say not to go.
>>81726663Tell me you accidentally broke one of the nacelles from the model without telling me you broke one of the nacelles from the model
>>81728876Well, dad was turned into a bear, then Janeway blew him up
>>81728417>>81728457I am not saying I like it, I am just saying it is not new to the setting.Some other settings benefit from strong integration between books, video games, RPGs, shows, etc. but Star Trek is primarily show based, and the show writers have never made much effort to be consistent on the scale of Starfleet, nature of planetary defenses, etc.Though to be fair, many planetary battles (in universe) would consist of hours of skirmishes between ships, followed by hours more of systematically dismantling planetary defenses, so not surprised this gets skipped over to just show the highlights.>>81728925There is a LD joke about him still stuck on the planet while getting prank called.
>>81729218>then Janeway blew him upFirst coffee, then warcrimesJaneway truly is the doge meme of captains.
>>81728956Entrepreneurs log, supplemental. Cousin Gok laughed at me when I paid 4 bars of gold pressed latinum for a medically sealed isolation pod. However, when we detected the hewmon beacon indicating a unique plague was present on this planet I knew I could show him how useful it is. He practically begged to be the first down to the planet, as I told him the beacon was hiding federation treasures. He doesn't like his new pod, but if he survives until we reach federation space, I can sell him, Pod and all, for 1000 bars of gold pressed latinum, or maybe even a spare warp core. Rules of Acquisition number 6, never let family stand in the way of profits.
Resettle the colonists... or else.>>81729070>>81729070>>81729070
>>81729235https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OH4JT6f_LB8Oh yes. But listening to him cry in desperation as Picard beam out it made me feel sorry for Armus. Feels like the Titans were the real villains here.
>>81729337Now if only they had the balls to make ferengi spin off, probably would work better animated
>>81727844I feel a lot of sympathy for actors, especially after the Sequel Trilogy. They're doing their job the best they can and have no perspective on how the scene will look in the end or fits in the story as a whole (a lot is often shot out of order), and have to follow director's directions on how to act or say a line, but they take the most blame since they're the ones on the screen.
>>81728457Okay, if that's a Klingon, how does he fit in? We have the "traditional" ones introduced from TNG onward, we have the TOS mustaches and makeup retconned by ENT as being a genetic disease of some sort, and then there's this guy? Klingons are going to have more offshoots than the Vulcans at this point.
>>81730927I think they are supposed to look more klingon-y with hair. And the rest of the added ridges are probably just indicative of a subrace or something.