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Trying to make GURPS more approachable edition

>GURPS is a modular, adaptable system, capable of running a wide range of characters, settings, and play styles with level of detail varying from lightweight to completely autistic.
Optional rules allow you to emulate different genres with a single system, even switching genres within a single game.

Previous GURPS >>78410021

A nearly complete trove of GURPS books can be found by those who pay attention to file extensions.
A genre guide can be found in the trove, under Unofficial > GURPSgen. It tells you what books and articles you need for many common genres.

Thread question: What would you add/change to/in GURPS Lite to make it better?
>>
>>78524449
I was thinking of simplifying the basic rules of magic which already use them as skills.
What do you mean about powers? Like instead of having magic rules, have rules for creating powers?
I'll check out the Alternate GURPS articles, thanks!

>>78524989
Yeah i really like templates, will try to include some basic templates or at least talk about them.

I'll also try to expand combat a little bit, adding all the maneuvers, they aren't that hard

Any ideas on simplifying the math? i know it isnt hard but the bookkeeping as the other anon said is kinda boring but i fear that it will break the game balance
>>
>>78525531
>powers
Granted, I've not read the powers book. I'm not suggesting lifting that in full. But the Innate Attack advantage is incredibly customizable. A small handful of broadly applicable powers that fit in the basic Advantage framing while still being simple enough™ for Lite would break it out of the strictly-heroic-realism box a little without making it overly genre-specific. Spells as skills isn't too complex, granted, it's just super genre-specific and is ultimately Just Another Fuckheug List. Fuckhuge lists are what the catalog books are for; simple but extensible systems is mechanically distinct. Basic is honestly mostly a catalog/compendium of traits.

Speaking of fuckhuge lists, there's a weird diversity and specificity of skills in Lite. It covers a broad range, but honestly Wildcard! skills (and specifically how to improvise/make them for the situation) would be super useful.

>Templates
The three example templates from Basic are a good guide, I think, establishing a generic basis for their respective major archetypes.

>Combat maneuvers
I'm not sure that *all* the maneuvers are necessary, but Lite is just not enough to showcase what GURPS can do easily. It's ability to handle a skillful swordfight as easily as a shoot-out is a big feature.

>Simplifying the math
On what, damage or point-buy?

Optional FATE-style and/or "pointless" skill pyramid would ameliorate point-buy some.

As it is, Lite only bothers with explicitly listing 3 wounding modifiers. Burgers are just bad at fractions. Honestly, I don't know a way to communicate damage/wound type more cleanly.

If there's a gripe it's that there's no hint that mooks should probably be run with 1/2-1/3 health or 1 hp most of the time. You're left to assume that this super detailed hp system applies all the time to everybody, which is daunting.

On a re-read I'm impressed that they list so many characterization/mental disadvantages. That's one of the *key* features of GURPS for me.
>>
>>78525960
>Burgers are just bad at fractions
And yet they measure everything in 11/17s of an inch.
>>
>>78525960
Really cool ideas, saved them for future reference
I'll do some reading, search through the pyramids and start doing something, will try to post soon
>>
>Thread question: What would you add/change to/in GURPS Lite to make it better?
1) Update it to be in line with 4e, especially latter 4e books. I'd rather GURPS Lite lacked rules that you can plug from GURPS 4e, rather than conflicting rules.
2) Templates and Sorcery Magic
3) Simplified Ranged Combat table from Action.
>>
bump
>>
>>78524804
>Thread question:
I would throw it away and rewrite it from scratch to make sure it is actually easier to pick up and play instead of just being a very messy stripped down version of Basic.
>>
Make it not roll under. It makes resolving vs checks very awkward.
>>
>>78526245
Ya I fuckin' know. I don't know how powers of 2 are so hard for these yokels
>>
>>78530025
What
>>
>>78530444
There are people who find subtraction very hard. I don't know how they handle wound modifiers and enhancements/limitations.
>>
I'm wanting to run my first GURPS campaign, but I'm having some difficulties determining what point total I should start the PCs on. It's going to be a TL4 campaign about a group of people going to a recently-discovered continent that's infested with monsters to try starting a new life. Ideally characters would have enough points to reasonably survive a good amount of combat, since I enjoy the tactical combat system, but not be so strong they feel like superheroes. The books I'm looking at using are Basic, Low-Tech, Martial Arts, and Ritual Path Magic.
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>>78531026
Somewhere in the 150-250 point range is probably good. Depends on the monsters a bit; the scarier they are, the tougher PCs need to be.
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>>78531178
I think going with a 150 total might be good, I'm not intending on having them go up against legions of mummies or anything. Does 115/-30/-5 sounds like a reasonable starting baseline? I should clarify that I'm also hoping to allow for a good amount of roleplay, so putting all their points in combat wouldn't be the best idea.
>>
>>78531207
I would go with 150/30/5
Idk 100 points is really low for conquistadores and adventurers
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>>78524804
New GM here. I am hearing conflicting reports: That GURPS is both hyper-lethal (one skilled hit can kill a character), and that Dungeon Fantasy is just not lethal enough. What makes this difference? Is it the starting point values of 250? Is it combat rules that give characters more options out of the DF books?

I have a lot of recent experience playing Descent and Swords & Sorcery. Both are fairly lethal games with small HP pools and lots of tactical options characters need to utilize. Is playing GURPS/DF comparable to that?

And critically: How does one balance DF encounters? Is there a way to ensure I can get Descent/S&S levels of tactics and difficulty, without killing characters willy-nilly? How does character advancement and growing power play into this?
>>
>>78531207
That seems low. When I said '150-250' I meant points total, not just positive points. Note that the basic templates from After the End are 150/-45/-5 for 200 points in attributes, skills, and advantages while the Steampunk Colonial Adventurer is 150/-50/-5 and Explorer is 150/-60/-5. I'd say 150/-35/-5 should be the bare minimum you want to consider.
>>
>>78531219
>>78531358
I'm a bit concerned about high point totals leading to degenerate shit I'm too inexperienced as a GURPS GM to really handle, but that might only be a problem if I play with people who are experienced enough to really min-max. Maybe I'll go with the 150/-35/-5 total and restrict attributes to, say, max 15?
>>
>>78531371
I dont think people will even have attributes that high unless they spend everything in attributes.
Remember, DX and IQ costs 20 per level if someone wants it to be 15 it'll be 100 points into ONE attribute leaving only 50 for everything else
>>
>>78531290
Idk its not that easy to kill someone is GURPS unless the GM really wants it or if you dont have armor
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>>78531290
The recommended combat skill levels of DF are really high, so their defenses are really good. You can have 250 point Navy Seals and still be grounded to reality by limiting options (realistic attribute levels, your place in society/rank, background skills), DF says fuck that let's go clear dungeons. Skill at level 20 means you're the greatest of your generation, the Knight starts with a melee weapon at that. He has a Parry of 13 + 2 (from shield). That means that the first parry against any enemy he has the ST to defend against he will do so 95.4% of the time.
In GURPS if you're down on the ground you're good as dead, but you have your Maneuvers + Attack/defense options to do anything you can think of to stop it. But remember, the more detail you add, the more things you have to keep track of. Fortunately the system is built on layers so it will work even if you strip it naked.
>>
>>78531371
Max fifteen sure, but one thing I have to tell people from D&D is that high stats are not requisite in the system. They think that like, they need like 13-15 in everything. Not at all. I do reccomend that all the adventurers have either HT12 or HT11 plus Fit. (or both)
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>>78530779
>>78530025
how the fuck do these people play RPGs
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>>78531371
Yeah, for new players you generally need to go with higher point totals because they're not going to be using those points very efficiently. I could make a very competent cinematic frontline warrior with 100 or even 75 points, but new players still learning the system may need 150 or even 200 to do the same because they don't know the system inside and out and will inevitably pick options that are inefficient or sub-par for their concept.

If a player surprises you with a busted character, just tell them to revise it.
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>>78531951
Occams razor solution:
>if shit happens you dont like, ask for it to change
Youre the GM, just...fucking talk to the players. "Hey guys, we're all new to this, just bear with me while we realign"
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>>78531931
They get around a table, roll some dice while the GM tells them a story (and their characters are kinda there as the story unfolds) and then they get mad when somebody does subtraction in front of them and go post on reddit, /tg/ or twitter about perfidious minmaxers.
>>
>>78531290
DF characters just have tons of defense. Two good hits could incapacitate them, but they very rarely get hit.
I'd recommend just taking a predefined character and testing whether lethality is to your liking. By default it's more modern DnDish where your character can take a dozen attacks, but instead of soaking damage you simply avoid most of it. If you want more lethality, just tune defenses down.
Also, lethality is greatly impacted by which rules you use, such as hit locations or bleeding rules. Normally it's much easier to get incapacitated than to get killed (unless your enemy really wants you dead).
>>
>>78530779
They rarely need to substract though as Quick Contests are uncommon except for influence. Just compare the dice and the result to see which is lower. If you need to see shots hit just add your recoil as many times as you can to the dice you rolled until you hit effective skill.
>>
Shattered world: dungeon delve
>Getting away with it

So the party headed out to meet with the Councillor of the city of Valloire, and in the Gallery of his hall, they witness a weird fight between the man and a High Lord Scipio. The two nobles butted heads, the military man publicly rebuked by the local lord, and then dismissed....somewhat magically. As if he was compulsed somehow.

Aside, all the players with Power sin the Æther could hear the manipulaiton in his voice, amplified by some compulsive force.

The party resisted interfering, saw the High Lord retreat after failing to resist, and then swept in on their own appointment as an SBI delegation under their man Victor.

Within his chambers, they parleyed; Victor taking a roundabout approach to subterfuge, failing to be canny about it, and then playing his hand too badly. The mechanical doctor gave the party a signal, a moment to prepare, and then distracted the Councillor so they could strike.

Elize set off an anti Ætheric charge, knocking out the sphere and Care (their own transformed caretaker orb)
Carlson sealed them in the office
Daisy drew down with Marina on the man
Peter OBLITERATED a secretary with a crushing charge

And then the Mexican standoff began!
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>>78533768
The standoff peters out quick; the Councillor relents and surrenders his weapon and stays very still under all the guns

Eliz ebegins diggin apart the Calculator; it has a facade shell and underneath the fake mechanical armor its a solid orb of Ætherite. Her grenade knocked it out, and she keep sit under with a Gadget roll and everything in her pockets at the time.

The councillor speaks with the party about the Order; he suspected Victor came to him under their care, but is sad to hear he hasnt followed in his fathers footsteps. Also, he suggests that the man (or the lord of acid) is there in the city somewhere.

The Calculators are devices given out to Order members by another; Lucious Verspringer. Victor is aghast, he is an old friend from his childhood education. Deep emotional ties.

Care eventually comes to, and the party needs to get going. They weigh diving out windows (arrow slits) and going out the front door (big fight with lots of Galician soldiers). Care suggests using The Ways and her own powers, and the group agrees magic seems best. She punches a hole in the world, they slip through and take the Councillor prisoner, and leave a grenade in the door as a surprise.

They have a lead, and they have the option of an ally in Scipio.

Until next week
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>>78533591
...do you... not ever use penalties on effective skill?
>>
>>78531290
GURPS isn't *hyper* lethal except by comparison with modern D&D with its hp bloat. The lower HP totals in general *do* mean that you can down an average unarmored person in a couple hits, but not necessarily outright kill them. Armor is actually armor, active defense options provide a lot of agency, and a high Health attribute can keep you up and alive -though in poor shape- for a long time. Guns, however, are more or less rocket-tag, doing consistently high damage to fleshy bits. It's quasi-realistically lethal at its most abstract, and if you use shock, knockdown, bleeding, major injury, locations, all of which can be and probably should be ignored while introducing the system, it becomes increasingly punishing to take a hit.

Dungeon Fantasy tone is kind of middle ground between OSR and modern D&D in some ways. On the one hand, adventurers are competent and assumed to be established, capable, and survivable at the outset. On the other, "balanced encounters" isn't an idea that really exists. Letting the players encounter what's story/dungeon appropriate and feel variously powerful, challenged, and outmatched is a legitimate mode of play. Make them play smart, make sure they know subduing or running away is an option rather than always fighting to the death.

The effectiveness of monsters you run will in part depend on how smartly you play them, and in how much detail; they all have the potential to be lethal if a cockup cascade happens. It's often advised that mooks you mean to throw at the players in hordes go down in 1 hit or at 1/2 health, and that fully simulating an enemy's health should be reserved for named/important characters.

If you want a more reliably math-based way to go about balancing encounters, Combat Effectiveness Rating is a thing, which is from an article in Pyramid #3/77. This, like CR from D&D, is of limited utility, and the subject of balancing is much discussed. Often to the result of "just eyeball it, lol"
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>>78531290
>>78535629 combat balance cont.
A good general guideline to setpiece/story battles is, broadly, as follows:

have an enemy that can consistently do some damage to the highest DR character. The more damage and abilities they have, the fewer allies should show up for a "balanced" encounter. Keeping the tankiest character tied up with occupying the heaviest damage dealer will challenge them. Not necessarily glass-cannon, just highly damaging.

Have an enemy that is consistently tough, but not impossible, to hurt through conventional means for the average character. Making them get creative (holy water, silver blades) or otherwise occupying the most threatening character with that will be challenging. If this is the same as the hard-hitting enemy, it may be appropriate to cull allies to a couple spare mooks, or none.

A handful of mooks will certainly pose a threat to any glass cannons the party has. They're not meant to be difficult to dispatch, just a nuisance that distracts the party from the king and queen of the encounter. Their actual threat can vary from actually doing damage and posing a lethal threat, to just occupying and distracting.
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>>78533591
>It's just as difficult to solve a Rubik's cube as it is to scale a cliff as it is to jump a 3.5ft hole in the ground as it is to tie a trucker's hitch.
Gross. I really don't understand why people run games like this.
>>
What do you people say that GURPS Lite lacks?
Some anons said that it would have to be redone from scratch, why is that?
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>>78538743
Its had zero updates since the day one launch

Literally every improvement to the game is missing. Hell some pretty basic shit is missing.
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>>78538983
Care to list them? Im kinda new to GURPS
>>
BUMB
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>>78531560
This I definitely have heard.

>>78531608
I'm definitely capping out certain skills and attributes, and will force players to refund is something is just broken. But I really need to learn what's what first.

>>78532440
This again reminds me of Descent/S&S. Tanky characters can block a lot, squishy characters get nearly squished. The tactical options being necessary for survival is great, I enjoy combat that won't just be run in, hit thing for many turns until dead.

>>78535629
>>78535981
This is SUPER valuable, thank you. I first encountered the idea of hordes of one-hit mooks with 4e D&D, and I liked it a lot. Will definitely use it here. But the bigger-creature advice is great, I appreciate it.
>>
As a gm who has been told they are sometimes too strict with allowing things in games how big of a deal is gunslinger from gunfu without the bulk penalty from close combat is?
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>>78542100
The improved version of Gunslinger from Action, Gun-Fu, and High-Tech basically just makes it competitive with more points in guns. If you don't use those rules, then it generally isn't worth buying unless you manage to stack a bunch of limitations onto it to bring the price down.
>>
Bu

Mmp
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Looking to do a 1930s pulp novel style adventure - is GURPS the way to go?
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>>78544118
Tell us more about it anon so we can guide you better

But the answer is yes
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>>78544162
Indianna Jones style adventures, i.e. finding artifacts, fighting yetis/nazis/mad scientists/critters etc, chase scenes.
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>>78544428
Basic set + Action 2 + high tech
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>>78544428
GURPS Action is all that, you're golden. It has rulings based on what Basic Set presents which are exclusively for the genre to do the heavy lifting for you (opening vaults, sneaking in, etc).
GURPS Cliffhangers has a lot of historic research done for you (like realistic travel times and how the world worked back then), and GURPS High-Tech and its Weapon companion has guns and gear if you want to add full detail.
>>
>>78544688
>>78544699
Thank you both for your guidance, checking out the trove now.
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>>78539090
Not him, but why would someone list all that shit? Just go read Basic if you want to play or grab How to Be a GURPS GM, which goes into choosing books and options.
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How does GURPS calculate 1/2D range? Is it literally just "here's where it'll be after one second?"
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>>78545123
No, it's a complex calculation that factors in the round's muzzle velocity, mass, cross section, and air resistance to determine where the round has lost (roughly) half its energy.

1/2D only equals travel time for guided or homing weapons; for any other type of projectile, it's unrelated.
>>
What are some "Core" books for building characters, in your opinion?

I'm not necessarily talking books like Martial Arts or Powers, where they're significant expansions, but smaller stuff like Power Ups 4 & 8.

I'm about to buy the Pyramid Bundle and I'm going to toss some other bits and pieces in.
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>>78545273
Perks, Quirks, and Talents are among the ones from the Power-Ups line that I'd suggest any player (and any GM) have on-hand when designing a character.
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>>78545361
seconded. great stuff
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>>78539090
Hit locations, teamwork, a bunch of other things. PDF related.
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>>78545123
In theory, it's when you have half the penetration as you did at the muzzle, which is more or less the same thing as having one quarter of the kinetic energy (assuming the bullet impacts over the same area, which is mostly true for ones which don't expand or tumble on contact), which in turn should equate to having half the velocity.
I believe that, in theory, the ability of a bullet to retain velocity while travelling through a medium of a given density is simply a function of its drag, mass, and velocity, 1/2 D range should be directly proportional to damage (i.e. penetration into a dense medium). However, this is not actually the case in published books, so I guess they either use a more detailed formula to figure it out or make shit up and I can't tell which.
>>
https://www.sjgames.com/general/stakeholders/

> Our top three lines for support in 2021 are Munchkin, The Fantasy Trip, and GURPS

Oh god I wish we got a 5e or at least 4e revised, but I know this isn't gonna happen

But its good to see GURPS as a top 3 priority
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>>78545495
A GURPS 5e that is essentially 4.5 would be good. Consolidate a lot of the books and pyramid articles as actually decent PDF's meant primarily for that purpose, and then re-release all the 3e setting books (WW2 line, western, ect.)

That said, any support is good.
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>>78545495
I bet there is a huge powergap between Munchkin and the rest of their products.
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>>78545470
>half the penetration as you did at the muzzle, which is more or less the same thing as having one quarter of the kinetic energy
Why wouldn't it be half the kinetic energy? Their formula takes into account the joules and the cross section of the projectile. I did the math for a Glock 19 and it came out to 2d+1, identical to how it appears in High-Tech. However, the range was WAY longer. In High-Tech its 1/2D range is listed as 160ft, but in my testing it was consistently going 840ft before it got to half the penetration that it had at the muzzle. I honestly have no idea how the hell they calculate half damage range. Maybe they looked up "effective range" for the weapons, but that seems more like it would be covered under Accuracy.
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>>78545814
>Why wouldn't it be half the kinetic energy?
As I (not a physicist) understand it: because your penetration (which is the same thing as 'damage' for bullets in GURPS) scales with the square root of kinetic energy (if your bullet has the same shape and size) and kinetic energy is mass times the square of velocity. So doubling your projectile's velocity quadruples its kinetic energy, but only doubles damage, because damage scales with the square root of KE. Ergo, half damage is one-quarter KE.
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>>78546012
>Ergo, half damage is one-quarter KE.
There's zero chance that's what's happening, because that would make the ranges way longer than even what I calculated.

The Glock 19 that I did the testing with has an average muzzle velocity of 1,130 feet per second, giving an average of 442 joules of energy. Given the cross-section of the bullet, this gives it a damage of 8, or 2d+1.
At an average of 840ft, the bullet is traveling at only 800 feet per second. While this is 70.8% of the muzzle velocity, this means that the KE is halved (.708 x .708 = .501). If I do the math for a 9mm round going at this new speed, I get 4 damage, exactly half of what it was at the muzzle.

I'm not blaming them for not getting the numbers right, because I can't expect them to go out and actually shoot every gun in High-Tech, but I really do want to see what their logic was.
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How do you stand on top of an enemy in GURPS?
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>>78546361
B387 says going up a hex of stairs is Move 2 per hex. If you rule that robot as 2' tall or more, there are two options in B352. You either calculate your Jump height and follow the rules, or simplify it as a full Move Maneuver for the sake of keeping the game going.
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>>78546361
>Roll n' shout!
Get atop it like >>78547045 says (maybe treat is as an attack roll based on DX or Sumo, to provide the possibility of getting out the way) and then add the trooper's weight plus gear carried to the droid's encumbrance; a successful DX or grappling attack would throw the clone trooper off. Because encumbrance reduces Dodge and the droid seems to lack any limbs to defend itself, the trooper is safely able to AOA (Determined) with a RoF5 burst at no range penalty.

You can do more if you include the rules from Fantastic Dungeon Grappling or Technical Grappling, but if you want to keep things simple the above will do the trick.
>>
GURPS? More like in need of bumps.
>>
How does a player buying wealth after character creation work? Do they just get more money right then and there?
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>>78550109
I'd like to second this question. I want to work and earn money - is it possible?
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>>78547408
Which was the Pyramid article about extra-large enemies?
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>>78550277
Combat Writ Large (in vol. 3 no. 77)
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>>78550109
It works like anything else.
1.Provide justification in-character
2.Spend CP
>>78550226
Your character is assumed to work and earn money as part of their normal wealth level. If you look in Basic, you will note that there's varying costs of living as well.
Any money you find during the game can be treated in any of the following ways:
1.It's just a pile of cash. Spend it once and it's gone.
2.It's just a pile of cash. Invest the money, spend CP and it will become Wealth.
3.It's just a pile of cash. You can spend it on things that may become a permanent part of your character depending on the campaign's CP-to-$ conversion rate. E.g. buying implants, mutagens, super soldier serum or wondrous potions.
Similarly, if you post a "mercenaries wanted, good pay" advert in-character, that does not automatically force you to buy Ally, nor being nice towards and oprhan automatically gives you Dependent.
>>
>>78546356
>If I do the math for a 9mm round going at this new speed, I get 4 damage, exactly half of what it was at the muzzle.
What math are you using to calculate the damage? If you're scaling damage directly with KE, of course halving KE will halve damage.
The 'official' formula (from 'interior and terminal ballistics for GURPS') is:
Damage (points) = sqrt(KE^1.04/Xsect^0.314)/13.3926
Which means that it should scale with approximately the square root of KE.

A simpler formula which seems to match pretty closely to published stats is:
D = [(k^0.5)/(c^0.33...)]*0.23
where D is dice of damage, k is kinetic energy in joules, and c is diameter of the round.
Again, this scales damage with the square root of kinetic energy.

However, none of these approaches match the published stats, since pistols in GURPS books typically have 1/2 D ranges of 100-200 yards. Even using your system, you get almost twice the published 1/2 D for the Glock and mine would be even worse.
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>>78524804
Someone playing with range bands from Action? Is it good and useful for Dungeon Fantasy or After The End? My players are terrified by Size-Speed-Range Table
>>
I know I can check the tech books for specific technologies of a given TL, but will any resources in particular help me with a world that is built on discovered technology from lost civs? I want a mix of ultra-tech and low-tech depending on what each society can find and salvage.
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>>78550453
It works fine for Theater of Mind combat when nobody knows exact positions anyway. It makes absolutely no sense for grid combat, and why wouldn't you use grid in DF game?
>My players are terrified by Size-Speed-Range Table
Tell them to stop acting like little bitches they are. Like, seriously, what's so """terrifying""" about it? You find the distance, you get the modifier, done.
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>>78546356
You got the math wrong, but I have no clue what they're doing either. You are right that the gun does 8 damage at the muzzle using the equation in >>78550412, but if you reverse the equation to solve for damage then it's insane. Let's solve for 4 damage and find the KE.
>4 = sqrt(KE^1.04/0.0000639^0.314)/13.3926
becomes
>53.5704 = sqrt(KE^1.04/0.0000639^0.314)
Giving us a final KE of 114J. However, if it still had 221J at more than 5x the listed 1/2D range, that means that the actual 1/2D range would be something like 9-10x the ones listed in High-Tech.
I thought the formula would make sense of this but it's just made it worse.
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An IRL friend asked me to make him a character for My Hero Academia to show GURPS can pull it off. I admit I don't like Supers in GURPS too much, but I accepted anyway and here's what I showed him.
I don't know much about My Hero Academia beside that there's a qt bunny girl super so I mimic'd her and made a Biomorph character from Super. I don't know what's the power level in the show so I didn't alter the CP total of the template.
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>>78551121
The correct form is to ask them what powers to put in, down to minor details.
Otherwise they can quibble that "it's not like in the show".
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>>78551709
Don't worry about it. He's not some headstrong anti-GURPS fa/tg/uy or anything. In fact, he doesn't know much about TRPGs to begin with and was just curious.
>>
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>>78551096
To follow up, here's how fucked it is when you calculate the ballistics on a 9mm pistol.
>>
How well would GURPS handle shounen fightan anime? And in particular, is there a mechanical way to represent HOT-BLOODEDNESS? (I realize normally that wouldn't be seen as very much of a simulationist concern of the kind that GURPS leans toward, but it's definitely the case that getting fired up in shounen anime can have an effect on how effectively you fight.)
>>
So, memeing aside, what's the quality like on the "gurps sex" thing?
>>
>>78552719
>How well would GURPS handle shounen fightan anime?
Decently, I guess. I'd recommend making light use of the rules, considering those are geared towards some realism while shonens tends to play fast and loose with it.
>HOT-BLOODEDNESS
Blessed (Heroic Feat) with some limitations like Emergency Only and/or Backlash might work.
>>
>>78552719
>a mechanical way to represent HOT-BLOODEDNESS?
Extra Effort
>>
>>78552830
GURPS Sex and Pregnancy is an updated version of GURPS Sex. Both supplements are for Third Edition.
>>
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>>78552719
Power-Ups 9: Alternate Attributes introduces Stun Points, which gives you larger HP pools and allow for bigger attacks to be thrown around without the PCs turning into paste. I still recommend reigning in combat numbers a bit, but for instances where you can be kicked, sail a six yards back, and land on a car with enough force to crumple it, you'll need the extra HP.

As for HOT BLOODED, you can houserule this with a simple switch of letting Will stand in for most HT rolls, allowing people to stay standing despite a big hole in their chest through sheer determination and passion. Another option is requiring a Will roll before allowing a player to spend FP on Extra Effort or character points on Buying Success, requiring not only the resources but the will to use them to get an edge in critical situations. Lastly, you could apply pic related so your Go Nagai types can channel their temper and desires into positive effects more directly. Ignore the red box; that was added by me to tell my players which option we were using.

If you're willing to go the extra mile for anime tropes, Conditional Injury can do wonders. Shonen protags often have powerful "finishers" but those don't really need to exist in GURPS where people can be safely poked to death and be taken out by the 18th 1-HP jab; having a powerful attack with lots of drawbacks (slow, eats FP, requires using THAT, etc.) is more relevant when using CI since you need a big fuck-off attack to take someone down.
>>
>>78552993
>allowing people to stay standing despite a big hole in their chest through sheer determination and passion.
That's canonically HT roll, though.
"Will" is just a label for "general mental toughness" and has nothing to do with determination or willpower.
Any sort of task to push physical limits is for HT, which also is not necessarily about "health" but "general physical toughness".
>>
>>78553085
Will is also used for feats of "sheer force of will," which is why non-combat Extra Effort requires a Will roll (p. B356). Thaumatology also makes reference to Will-based magic being, in essence, forcing your will onto the universe, so willpower is definitely a component. It's more than just the ability to withstand mental attacks.
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>>78552830
It's hilarious, worth a read just for that alone. See pic related.
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>>78553249
Meant for >>78552830
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>>78552719
You will absolutely be able to represent any specific powers, but GURPS (even cinematic GURPS), like all non-narrativist games, struggles when powers are not discretely quantifiable.
It's why GURPS can do super heroes well, but not super hero fiction. The answer to 'how strong is Marvel's Colossus?' is 'however strong he needs to be for the plot'.
So how well GURPS does depends on the kind of shounen anime, do you have anything specific in mind?
>>
>>78552830
What do you mean by 'quality'?
>>
>>78524804
>What would you add/change to/in GURPS Lite to make it better?
Use Kromm's essential skill list. You can still keep the others in it, but having some skills clearly marked as important would be really helpful, I think. Having too much choice is a problem if you're new.
>>
>>78553883
Maybe bundle Lite with How to Be a GURPS GM. It comes with said list on pp.21-22.
>>
>>78553931
Yeah, I consider how to be a gurps gm absolutely essential, so I think it'd make sense to bundle them (or at least, some shortened version of it).
Also stuff like basic guidelines on how to create NPCs definitely belongs in there imo.
>>
bumppppppp
>>
How would you handle something like a witch bottle in GURPS?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witch_bottle
A witch bottle is a kind of anti-curse talisman which rather than (or as well as) stopping the effects of the curse, causes the person who cast the curse pain (or the effects of the curse, or death) which either forces them to lift the curse or reveal themselves.
In a typical narrative, these objects would be prepared in a ritualistic manner with specific components, but often not by the magician who prescribed it, who would instead give instructions on how to do it. Presumably that's something like Thaumatology or Occultism allowing 'diagnosis' of the curse and identifying what ritual and components are suitable for countering it, but not casting the spell itself.
The only rules I can find for this kind of thing are the knot-magic ones from Thaumatology, which don't cover the whole backlash against the curse-caster, nor giving instructions to a non-skilled person to work counter-magic.
>>
>>78555942
Going by Everyman Skills (Pyramid #3/65), something like following clear orders should give enough of a bonus to cancel out default penalties, so in the case of Occultism (defaults to IQ-5) you roll at +5. Someone totally ignorant would roll against flat IQ, but someone that lives in a time or place where folk remedies are widely accepted and most people know about salt and evil spirits, a point or two in Occultism wouldn't be out of place and anyone trained would have a sizeable bonus to following the magician's instructions correctly.

As for the effects of the witch bottle, that's entirely up to you. Maybe have it mimic the effects of Reflect (p. M122) or Pestilence (p. M154) depending on the type. If you need a quick contest, I think it would be most fair to use the skill roll of the instructing magician (maybe at +2 if the client critically succeeded on making the witch bottle).
>>
>>78552840
>>78552903
>>78552993
Nice. Thanks, anons!

>>78553532
>do you have anything specific in mind?
Basically the PCs live in a shitty part of town and a gang moves in and starts harassing people (they're actually paid to do so by a guy who wants to buy the property cheap), and the PCs, who are basically all friends who live there so they can afford to train martial arts in hopes of one day living their Street Fighter dreams, have the option to do something about it.

Tonally I want to borrow from pic related and Hajime no Ippo.
>>
>>78552830
... there's no way anyone has actually used that, right?
>>
>>78559039
>she doesn't use GURPS for all her ERP sessions
ngmi
>>
>>78559039
You haven't lived until you've Technically Grappled your GF
>>
>>78559039
>not managing her realm
>not ritually pathing your magic on her
>not tactically shooting your load in her
>not keeping in contact with her
Get a load of this guy.
>>
>>78557813
One thing to note is that requiring Will rolls slows down the game and takes away from the feeling of actual hot-blooded heroes who are usually know for their impulsive nature, not always for literal ability to shrug-off fear and mind-control.
Instead, consider ways to make Extra Effort more accessible for heroes, or tied to its own special resource separate from FP and see into the way Extra Effort can be used to enhance Powers (in the Powers book).
>>
>>
>>78550109
B291 says first you need to amass money equal to the starting wealth of the desired Wealth level, to then spend the points to get it.
B517 mentions B291, but in a negative tone. It seems like it's a fix to having poor PCs put points into skills then getting a high-paying job and effectively nullifying the disadvantage. So apart from free Status gain you get at certain thresholds (B26), paying in-play for Wealth is actually a penalization.
>>
>>78531290
>and that Dungeon Fantasy is just not lethal enough.
High DR, Scaled Magic, and Dodge and High soak pools is what make Dungeon Fantasy more survivable, but it's an adaptation of OSR for GURPS so that's to be expected.
>>
Does anyone have any experience using eggplant's Sorcery variants? In particular, I'm interested in Wizardry, https://enragedeggplant.blogspot.com/2017/11/sorcery-wizardry.html but I'm trying to parse out why exactly a player would choose it over default sorcery, if the option's available.
Also, I was wondering how I would "convert" all the spells he's made to Wizardry. Do I just slap that -10% on any spell without a casting roll? Do I apply I any penalty for spells that normally cast from an attribute?
>>
>>78563034
But OSR is super lethal
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>>78565010
>Also, I was wondering how I would "convert" all the spells he's made to Wizardry. Do I just slap that -10% on any spell without a casting roll?
Yes, and possible the gesture/incantations limitations as well.
>Do I apply I any penalty for spells that normally cast from an attribute?
Only if you want them to have forced gesture/incantation requirements. No Requires IQ Roll is required.
>I'm trying to parse out why exactly a player would choose it over default sorcery, if the option's available.
You do not choose wizardry over default sorcery, if that's an option. It's more of a setting and internal balance thing. I do not use sorcery with unlimited scope, so sorcerers usually are quite limited in that regard. However, wizards are the only casters that have unlimited scope, making them great at utility spellcasting, if they have time (and money).
>>
>>78565010
>I'm trying to parse out why exactly a player would choose it over default sorcery, if the option's available.
That last part is a *big* assumption. By and large if a GM likes Wizardry over Sorcery, he's only going to have Wizardry.

It's like the Costs Fatigue limitation: willingly you should never take it because it gives a paltry discount for the inability to spam it, but the GM can require it to balance certain options.
>>
What have you been playing /gurpsgen/?
>>
>>78566612
My bronze age game is going well.
>>
bump
>>
So how do I use Sorcery to simulate rituals the way RPM does? I also want to make talismans or small objects that hold spells the way RPM can.
>>
>>78569233
>>78565228
Adding onto this, Eggo do you think you could do a write-up working sorcery into all the different magic systems like that one issue of Pyramid does for Ritual Path Magic?
>>
>>78569233
That's just Ritual Powers from Pyramid #3-66. As for talismans and small objects - those are just single-use enchanted items.
>>78569518
There's no need for this. Everything will look like Ritual Powers from the aforementioned Pyramid article, just taking spells as alternative abilities to the main spellcasting advantage of the other system.
>>
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>Oxcart (p. LT137) has LWt of 0.9t or 1800 lb.
>As a two-wheeled cart, its effective weight is only 10% that for the purpose of being able to pull it (p. B353).
>An Ox has ST 27/BL 146, Move 4, and Enhanced Move 1 for a top speed of 8 (p. B460).
>With effective weight of 180 lb, an oxcart should put an ox at Light encumbrance, reducing its speed to 3/6 assuming a fully loaded cart
>However, an oxcart requires *two* oxen for a whopping Move 1/1 and a five-hour max on travel time

Why is that? Why is the ox cart maxed out at a five-hour walk?

I'm looking at playing a Nomad or Trader in AtE and the way Low-Tech handles unpowered vehicles doesn't seem consistent with the wider rules for encumbrance, travel, and animal stats. Similar issues exist with other vehicles: a single draft horse at BL 125 should be able to pull a loaded wagon (1860 lb true weight, 93 lb effective weight since four wheels divides true weight by 20) at no encumbrance for Move 6/12, but LT requires two draft horses for Move 4/8.
>>
We need to work on a list of the best Pyramid and supplemental rules that should be in Basic.
>>
>>78571126
As in which ones should be core default rules or which ones every player should know about? Because I'm a huge fan of Conditional Injury and think everyone should know it exists and how it works but even I'm not deranged enough to think it should replace the core HP system.
>>
>>78566678
Are you using low-point characters or DF? I'm interested in how a game in this era feels for players. How often do they get into combat? How does it end up going? What scenarios have they encountered thus far?
>>
>>78571046
>Why is that? Why is the ox cart maxed out at a five-hour walk?
Because of the oxen. I don't remember the physical details but oxen don't have the stamina to do anything for more than about five hours. There is also some reason they're used in pairs when one alone should do.

I vaguely remember a discussion surrounding the LT playtest. The movement rate of animal drawn vehicles was taken from real world data rather than generated from Basic's rules. Again, it's been too long for details to stick with me but I remember some discussion about slopes.
>>
>>78571472
That... makes a lot of sense sadly. Dang I was hoping to get a good wagon dragger for cheap; affording a single ox was already going to require some creative accounting but getting two draft horses is basically impossible.
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>>78571326
We're using normal GURPS, with Low Tech and Martial Arts. Characters are about 200 points, though a significant chunk of that is their magic. I've artificially "balanced" the game by limiting normal attributes to 12 and requiring maintenance for skills above 13. It's been interesting seeing how much difference even one point of skill between combatants makes.

The players get into combat about once a session and usually their magic and armor give them the edge they need to win fairly convincingly, although when they have been forced into a bad position, even inferior opponents have been able to threaten them. They have avoided, up to this point, any fights against those with equal equipment or training (or magic for that matter).

Last session they had to track down a city gang that was using forged imperial documents to pose as tax collectors in an occupied city. Before that they helped a boy take revenge on those who had killed his father.
>>
>>78571046
Either the pulling and dragging rules, or the method of assigning ST to creatures (and vehicles), or both, fail a reality check. The numbers don't work out for any trailer or carriage that I've tried.
I think it's mostly the dividing effective weight by 10/20 that is causing most of the issue. That seems way too generous. A 200 lbs. hand-cart over rough terrain is definitely going to slow you down more than a 20 lbs. backpack. Likewise, pushing a one-ton car on a good road is possible for one man, but it's slow compared to carrying a 50 lbs. sack of coal. I think that something like dividing by something like 3-4 for a single-wheel barrow, 4-6 for a two-wheeled cart or bicycle and 5-8 for a four-wheeled one is probably more realistic.
For maximum realism, heavy loads on wheels should also reduce acceleration more than top speed; once you get a wheelbarrow or car or whatever moving, you can often get it up to a decent jog or even a run, but it takes a while to get there. GURPS is generally over-generous on acceleration anyway; few people can get up to 10 mph in one second, lions take 3-4 seconds to get up to top speed, while most hooved animals take 5-7 seconds. However, fixing that means a lot more fiddling with rules than just reducing the benefit of wheels.
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>>78571750
Yeah, you'd better start with just a donkey and try to buy/steal a better ride later.
It's also funny how dumping all your free points into cash gets you barely enough money for a shitty broken car that doesn't even start most of the time. Nomad really requires a lot of GM cooperation to not suck too much early on.
>>
>>78571881
Yeah divide by 10 or 20 seemed really generous, but I figured GURPS editors knew better than I did.

>>78572062
One thing that really gets me is that the example they give for the Trader is a mule-drawn carriage but that specific combination isn't stated out in Basic, Low-Tech, or AtE. Since the stats for unpowered vehicles are bespoke instead of derived from a fomula, I can't accurately determine its load or speed!

Also there are multiple places where they ignore their own advice from Basic and have an unpowered vehicle treat its top speed as its "cruising speed."
>>
>>78573036
>Since the stats for unpowered vehicles are bespoke instead of derived from a fomula, I can't accurately determine its load or speed!
Design a cart with Vehicles, then.
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>>78551121
wtf is going on in this character sheet? Why is DR 2 68 points?
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>>78573566
Tfw no GURPS Vehicles 4e
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>>78573819
good
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>>78574672
You son of a bitch
>>
>>78571126
>>78571190
How do we start? a public google docs?
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>>78573587
That's Damage Reduction, not Resistance.
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>>78576344
An HTML file in a git repository
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>>78576344
First let's pitch some articles because that gets the thread moving. My favorites are:
>#3/54: Civil arts. Techniques for Influence. Elicitation alone gives it spot, but romcom's Crowd Song is good too.
>#3/56: Past Presents and the Future. An interesting historical idea that could be used for many settings.
>#3/57: Modern Warfighter Gear. Good read and gives useful gear.
>#3/60: Wizardry Refined. I've never played DF, but that spell list is great.
>#3/61: More Power to Dungeon Warriors. A great collection of interesting traits.
>#3/65: Alternate Gun Specialties and Techniques. In case you don't like Guns (Rifle, Shotgun, and SMG), it's Guns (Longarm) instead. But there's more to that.
>#3/70: Gaming in the Ancien Régime. A must for a Three Musketeers campaign.
>#3/72: Dungeon Fantasy Video Gaming. Wacky traits and a Job system.
>#3/77: Combat Writ Large. Expands on the overly simplistic SM.
>#3/88: Better Improvised Weapons. Short guidelines for cinematic fun.
>#3/112: More Skillsets for Specialists. An expansion for the genius Action 4.
>#4/3: Putting Science in your Fiction. This is one of the best articles. Go get knowledge to make more knowledge.
>>
>>78577496
haha I'm retarded. I made up in my mind that it was a fav pyramid articles. Here's what I'd add to Basic.
>#3/54
>#3/65
>#3/77
>#3/88
>#4/3
>>
Is there a torrent of the general's mega? I want to download everything, would seed on my seedbox too
>>
>>78576634
I see, my bad.
>>
>>78571830
Interesting limitation. What empire are they in right now? Are they near to the collapse?
>>
>>78579440
The Lunar Empire is at its height during the period this game is set. The players are natives of a local kingdom called Sartar which was conquered about seven years ago.
>>
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Warehouse 23 is having a 23-percent-off sale on Transhuman Space PDFs, if you weren't aware.
>>
Is there a list of what articles/books/whatever would be useful for a fantasy bioengineer? Messing about with my setting, and due to reasons, I want rules for mages bioengineering new monsters, slave races, etc.

Obviously, I want Biotech as a starting point, but where should I go from there?
>>
I am excited for game tomorrow

For many reasons. I have plans
>>
>>78577496
>>78577629
No these are all great and helpful!
>>
Bamp
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>>78580871
Foreshadowing!
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>>78584704
Are those ki rolling pins in the middle picture? Does your setting have those?
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>>78584854
FORE
-shadowing
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>>78573036
The stats for unpowered vehicles is:
>the animal stats, plus as much as it can pull reliably
>>
>>78573819
Do it yourself
>>
*sings* GUUURRPPS baby!
>>
>>78577496
>>78577629
If we are taking about things that should be on Basic, I think we should focus on generic rules over setting-specific content.
Although a document with simple descriptions of all Pyramid articles could also be useful.
>>
FnordCon so far, regarding to GURPS:
Eric Flint's "Ring of Fire" is coming to GURPS, probably in 2021.
Girl Genius PDF is ready, kickstarter very soon.
2021 kickstarter PDF challenge is going to happen.
>>
>>78545570
4.5 would be good IMO. There's just a lot of little things; like swing damage. Like the armor and weapons in Ultra Tech.
A FEW things in low tech and MA that are just a little bit incongruous with the rest of the system.
>>
>>78591321
>Eric Flint's "Ring of Fire" is coming to GURPS, probably in 2021.
Based. The story (along with the idea of incorporating copious officially-sanctioned fanfiction) is a cool concept, but I just can't stand alternate-history stories that focus on characters rather than imitating history textbooks (e. g., Sobel's For Want of a Nail, Wells's The Shape of Things to Come, and Thande's Look to the West). The 1632 series currently consists of literally SEVERAL DOZEN books! How can anybody think this is necessary when Sobel managed to fit all of North American history from the 1760s to the 1970s into a single novel?
The GURPS sourcebook probably will be more fun to read than the original material.
>>
>>78591321
meh
more stuff is always good but those are a bummer
>>
>no comment
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>>78591321
Any more updates anon?
Keep us informed
>>
>>78593241
Something in the works with Vehicles, but they aren't talking. It has apparently been done since 2016.
>>
>>78593241
David Pulver said that there are ongoing conversations with SJGames about what to do with Vehicles, but he cannot say anything.
I'll be asleep for the main GURPS panel, so I hope that somebody posts a recap or other news here.
>>
>>78593304
I'll do it.
>>
ahem...Fuck vehicles
>>
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>>78593686
>>
>>78593304
>>78593360
what time + tz will be the main GURPS panel?
>>
>>78594459
hour and 15 mins from this post
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>>78591321
>Eric Flint's "Ring of Fire" is coming to GURPS, probably in 2021.
This sounds pretty cute, but isn't that really niche?
>>
>>78595145
Oh my god, the guy who wrote 1632? Bonkers
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1632_series
>>
>>78595145
Yes
Its not going to bring more people nor sell enough
They should try to get bigger franchises

>>78594938
Thanks anon
>>
>new character has a Secret Identity
>NPC announces it to the party within 10 lines of his introduction
I mean it expedites things since the other PCs are duly suspicious of strangers, but…
>>
>>78595290
>Its not going to bring more people nor sell enough
People who buy their books from Baen might squee over another DRM-free publisher, at least.
>>
>>78595298
Man, considering the day Adelaide had, youre lucky she didn't fast draw her massive revolver and *for the third time* end a wizard where he stands.
Kat vouched for ya hard looking at your soul. That counts for something in the positives column
>>
GURPS PANEL SOON
>>
>>78596256
Aaaaaand its nothing
>>
>>78578045
I don't think anyone here maintains such a torrent. Mega should let you download the whole folder as a zip though.
>>
>>78595433
>>78595298
Things turned out okay. Apparently as a font of useful information, and a tea drinker, the new guy checks out
>>
>>78597375
Literally nothing?
>>
>>78595298
>Your player is playing as Wei Wuxian
That sounds awesome.

How did they decide to build his abilities?
>>
>>78597978
Only TFT stuff from what I've seen
Maybe I missed something?
>>
>>78597989
Oh sweet Jesus maybe

Mute be cool
>>
>>78598361
I've just looked through the questions, and you're right - it's literally nothing. Why was the GURPS panel actually 90% TFT? That's quite disappointing.
>>
>>78524804
I don't think I would make it a part of lite, but something like
https://gamingballistic.com/2021/03/07/announcing-delvers-to-grow-for-the-dungeon-fantasy-rpg/
would be really sweet for a potential basic set 4.5, ideally for all technology levels of course. Just something to quickly build basic characters.
>>
>>78595182
It's a 1632 supplement.
>>
>>78598850
It's a shame really
But well let's see what they'll release this year for GURPS.

This only makes me want even more on a GURPS clone
What if I create a wiki so /gurpsgen/ could work on it
>>
>>78602095
Only if GrimWyrd and Shattered Worlds are the default settings
>>
>>78602231
I approve.
>>
Yeah...
>>
>>78531026
I would go 100/50 or 125/50, it'll force them to specialize more. If they are going push the frontiers they are going to need to forage, do basic medical tasks, defend themselves, and probably a few trade skills like carpentry and armory. If they are too light on pts it's always easy to slip in a few extra every session until the power level feels right.
>>
>>78602095
Getting people on /tg/ to collaborate is really, really hard. I've repeatedly tried to start projects which people here can contribute to in small pieces and found that there would be at best one other person willing to put in any work. I've come to the conclusion that it's better to just write the whole thing yourself and hope that someone else is willing to proof-read it.
A full re-write of the entire system would probably be several years work, even copying a lot from the original, and getting someone else from here to provide meaningful feedback would be extremely unlikely for a project of that size.
It's easy to form an impression that collaboration on such projects is easy from seeing the many successes, but you need to bear in mind that only a tiny fraction of users actually contribute to something like wikipedia, and almost all of the articles are created by lone obsessives, often engaged in competitions with each other to push their viewpoint.
I strongly suggest trying something a lot less ambitious at first, to get an idea of how hard these things can be. Do an adventure, or a gear book, or a single house-rule, or a collection of powers, magical / martial arts / social interaction style, some monsters, adding a couple of rules into Lite, that kind of thing.
For that matter, maybe help with ongoing /GURPSgen/ projects, like the bestiary, before starting a brand-new one.
>>
>>78597989
The picture was part of a hasty last-minute Pixiv search for something fitting.
He's actually based on an old Exalted character
>>
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>>78524804
What PM I can make for martial characters like knights, chevaliers, samurais, thugs and swashbucklers to make them different from ninjas, martial artist, karatekas and other chi users.
>>
>>78606365
>knights, chevaliers, samurais, swashbucklers
Pact (B113) of Code of Honor, Honesty, Sense of Duty, or Vow. Trademark for the swashbuckler.
>thugs
Pact of Fanaticism or Disciplines of Faith.
>>
>>78606365
Are you looking for a name, or rules?
Name could be simply 'martial', or 'mundane', 'martial training', 'heroism', 'warrior conditioning', 'battle focus', 'cinematic skill', or 'combat mastery'.
Rules-wise, it probably needs two power modifiers, one for passive abilities like DR, which are always available, and one for active ones, like innate attacks, which require freedom of movement. The former probably doesn't have any real limitations, so it is simply a +0% modifier which allows interaction with the powers rules. The latter is probably a -10% limitation, equivalent to mundane countermeasures.
Required disadvantages don't really fit the concept as I understand it, but compulsory temporary disadvantages (possibly with the aftermath variant from Bio-Tech), as per the Savant modifier (from Powers: Enhanced Senses), might work. Suitable ones could include Bad Temper, Berserk, Bloodlust, and Callous.
If you wanted a dark take, you could possibly make combat-autism dependent on having a PTSD-like condition, in which case compulsory disadvantages could make sense, including the ones mentioned above plus Chronic Depression, Flashbacks, and Paranoia.
Channelled energies don't seem to fit the concept at all.
>>
A few years ago there was like 30 or so GURPS blogs, and now 90% of them are dead. Sad.
>>
>>78607526
People probably migrated to games that have real support like SWADE

I really like GURPS but after this fnordcon I got really disappointed
>>
>>78607617
eh, I think it's more so that GURPS is mostly popular with boomers, who slowly drop out of the hobby, and younger people are more into games that are more simplified.
Fnordcon was pretty disappointing, but I think part of the issue is that they have a bunch of stuff still stuck in their pipelines. Them not getting any noteworthy licenses is definitely an issue though.
>>
>>78608342
The problem is that GURPS has basically zero marketing, so it can't attract people who might be interested in a crunchy system.
And it's a vicious cycle: No marketing > Few sales > Low budget > No marketing
The only way to solve this is for SJG to somehow get a big cash injection that they could use to invest in expansion. Someone make Elon Musk start playing GURPS and convince him to invest in SJG,
>>
>>78608527
Maybe pay that Gurm guy to livestream his GURPS games while procrastinating on his next book.
>>
>>78608573
An ASOAIF license would be really good for GURPS, but there is an official RPG already so who knows what kind of rights deal they have.
>>
>>78608527
I'm just not sure if there is even a real market for crunchy systems anymore. GURPS is essentially the only survivor.
>>
I ran a gurps blog for two years

Zero engagement, other than some aggregate reposting from the gaming ballistic

I lost interest when I realized nobody else had any interest in hearing me
>>
>>78608527
Having more cash will not solve the problem as SJG will keep investing it in dumb things like TFT or DFRPG.
They need an equivalent of Paradox's Fred - someone smart enough to realize they need to invest money in business, not just development.
>>
>>78608752
I don't know but I really doubt it. People did not change so much in 20 years. GURPS is never going to be as popular as 5E or PBTA systems, but it should have enough of a market.
>>78608779
To be fair, not a lot of people follow blogs in general anymore
>>
>>78608752
There's tons of people who would love to play crunchy games, but the RPG market (and tabletop in general) is completely retarded.
>shitty ancient products with no actual value continue to sell because of brand recognition, mostly to people who barely play
>extremely fanatical and reactionary audience
>lack of marketting so normalized that a single successful podcast can completely outperform the marketing of the entire industry combined
>absolute lack of informed decision making by both consumers and producers leaving large untapped niches and a lot of people that hate what they game but hate the idea of shopping around or trying new things even more
The only other industry that's as retarded and stagnant is firearms manufacture and even then you see some new developments despite people's insistence on the continued use of 19th century pieces.
>>
>>78607617
GURPS gets hundreds of pages of material published every year. What other rpgs currently enjoy that level of support? D&D, CoC, Runequest, all get less. The only games that seemed to produce more stuff than GURPS were D&D 3rd edition and the original World of Darkness and that was a long time ago.
>>
>>78608876
>not a lot of people follow blogs in general anymore
I think this is it. As a zoomer, no one my age reads blogs, even amongst people into niche RPGs. I only check them occasionally, binge reading a few months of content at a time.
>>
>>78609066
What we need are some GURPS youtubers with good production quality and voices that don't sound annoying
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>>78608342
>GURPS is mostly popular with boomers
No, it's just don't have enough oomph for zoomers
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>>78609046
Yeah but hundreds of pages of girl genius or literally who book author doesn't count

Having its base system without any kind of revision or streamlining for almost 20 years also doesn't help
>>
>>78609131
>exactly five quirks
I swear, not all my characters are like that. Sometimes I don't even hit disad cap.
>>
>>78608616
Martin is a GURPS player, it should be easy for SJG to get a license but the truth is : they don't care about GURPS, they only release a couple of things just to not let it die

It's funny because they have proof that if GURPS was a little bit more simple, but still crunchy, like DFRPG it would sell a lot more.
>>
>>78609120
I've been told I have a great voice (to the point where I'm hired because of it), and I've recieved the highest levels of public speaking awards available in my country.
I've considered starting a GURPS YouTube channel of some kind (mainly to stream games, review new content, etc.), but the issues are:
>Most people don't know what GURPS is
>The number of people who do know what GURPS is, is a tiny fraction of the population.
>The number of people who know what GURPS is, and are interested in GURPS related content, is even smaller.
> Most people want "easily digestible" content for watching streams/gameplay etc. The mental "barrier to entry" is way higher with GURPS, and most people just defautl to D&D because it's popular and easy to understand.
If I wanted to do something like a GURPS YouTube channel I'd have much better viewership figures, engagement etc. by just doing D&D instead.
>>
>>78609679
Make a series showing people how simple GURPS can be and how you can build upon it by using optional rules
>>
>>78609679
Can you read the introduction to the Disadvantages chapter on B119 and upload it on Vocaroo?
> Most people want "easily digestible" content for watching streams/gameplay etc.
Yes. GURPS needs something more digestible than the 50+ minute videos of dudes saying what comes to mind and labeling as "for beginners". I was thinking of doing a 4-min primer on playing GURPS (mechanics, what's on your sheet and what the other books are for), then a LT combat + injury video, a gun video, and a social video. But my voice is shit.
>>
>>78610694
> Can you read the introduction to the Disadvantages chapter on B119 and upload it on Vocaroo?
Here's an example, with the shitty mic I've got on hand (and also on only a few hours of sleep with a slightly blocked nose). I've probably oversold it desu, I'm much better at reading impassioned speeches for sure (because I can inject emotion into it) rather than sort of "fact-based"/"dictionary-style" sorts of things, which GURPS tends to be.
https://voca.ro/1gCdtNsoviXs
>>
>>78610694
Not that anon, but this is kind of fun. Voice rate?
https://vocaroo.com/1lcD8OEglQPn
>>
>>78610857
Anon who was requested to do the voice recording here - honestly, I'd totally listen to a YouTube series with your voice.
>>
>>78609679
Honestly, the best way to do it would be to advertise it as a "roleplaying campaign", sell it on the grounds of the actual campaign, and just never really mention what system you're using until someone asks. Just take advantage of the underlying mechanical system and how much can be handled in the background/off-screen. Character creation, for example, is probably never going to show up on-screen, and that's one of the biggest "OH NO MATH!" bits that GURPS has. Everything at the table is just stuff like "he's 15 meters from you - roll at -5 to hit." "I do a Deceptive Strike at -2 to his defense." "Roll your Dancing skill at 4."
>>
>>78610850
>>78610857
GURPS audiobooks when?
>>
>>78610694
Also that anon, and wow, I did not realize I slurred so much when I spoke.
https://voca.ro/14GpjTXCOyaI
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>>78611205
Not that anon*, fuck.
>>
>>78610850
You didn't oversell it, you do sound like a professional. But you're right, >>78610857 fits the GURPS tone much better and gives a more down to earth impression.
You two are great, I'm off to go write right fucking now and post a beta script here so other anons critique it as much as they can.
>>
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>>78611318
Don't you bastards tempt me into doing something fun and productive with something I love!
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>>78610894
>>78611318
You're too kind.
Longer sample (the Basic Set introduction, six minutes): https://vocaroo.com/153mhfVeFmHf
>>
>>78611318
>You didn't oversell it, you do sound like a professional
>You two are great, I'm off to go write right fucking now and post a beta script here so other anons critique it as much as they can.
I mean, if you want me to record a voiceover for something let me know, I'm more than happy to do it for free
>>
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>always give a little setting primer/what books and expanded rules are going to be used at the beginning of each campaign
>tell players we're using the expanded and additional combat options from Martial Arts
>mfw the first combat two sessions in it becomes apparent they didn't read Martial Arts

It was a fucking slaughter and I may have slightly lost control.
>>
>>78612438
Give us the gory details. Anyone take massive brain trauma?
>>
>>78612633
Let's just say it was just like that famous movie, not sure what it's called, where there's a panda who does kung fu.
>>
>>78612438
Since MA is one of those books I always use but never fully read... please give us details so that I may educate myself.
>>
>>78612438
But what went wrong? Did you expect them to do 3 Rapid strikes per turn? Aggressive Cross parries and beats? What was the average skill level? Armed or unarmed?
>>
Bump.
>>
>>78611661
There's an Easter egg at the end of this audio file.
>>
Is there any system that is not dead but is comparable to GURPS?
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>tfw getting paranoid about offering your players no combat and them claiming to not mind it
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>>78616186
What's your criteria for 'not dead' if GURPS, with new material being constantly released, doesn't qualify?
>>
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Here's the first attempt, since it's supposed to be as short as possible please critique every single line you have a problem with: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1h08hAoS4lIJ1xidd8ghfVav0qskN1Nxipe5cwPK-KkE/edit?usp=sharing
My first idea was to present the absolute basics to playing GURPS. I did not go over what Maneuvers do or what's Per, Will, and Speed. If I had went over Horror, then I'd do Will. But "descending order" is determined by Speed is good enough. Tell me if it worked.
And I tried to put as many genres in there for examples as I could to illustrate generic, if you think one that'd be better I'm all ears.
I'll do Social tomorrow, it'd be just Reaction Rolls and Influence anyways.
>>
>>78606333
Fair fair.

The picture jumped out at me as the badass xianxia necro-bard.
>>
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>>78616710
>Google Docs
Cringe. https://files.catbox.moe/v2v6en.xhtml
(Unfortunately, I do not have time right now to make a full HTML version, or to fix all the weird capitalization.)
>>
>>78617344
I wrote it down on docs so it can be commented on but posted the pdf in case you don't wanna click on google docs. I wrote game terms in capitals on purpose. Would that be an issue?
>>
>>78617457
>I wrote game terms in capitals on purpose. Would that be an issue?
Standard practice (e. g., in the Action books) is to write them in boldface (<b>, not <strong>, I think).
>>
>tfw an annoying voice, so I cannot help with this YouTube stuff
>>
>>78616710
>>78617344
I'll see if I can take a crack at it tomorrow.
I'm (>>78610850)
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Fine I'll doxx my voice
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>>78617344
Looking good! Keep it up.
>>
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For anyone who uses the Foundry VTT module, have you found a way to successfully adapt The Last Gasp to it, particularly the Action Point system? I'm curious about using it, but I'm not sure how I'd go about implementing it. For extra information, I'm wanting to use the variant by the author that lowers costs for movement.
>>
>>78620015
Forgot to post link to the variant:
https://gamingballistic.com/2013/08/29/increasing-mobility-while-using-las/
>>
>>78620015
FVTT charsheet have several blank pools one of which you can assign to AP.
Only tricky part is automatic AP payment for movementand turns, but at bare minimum you can make macro for that...
>>
Which magic system should i add to lite?
Sorcery appears to be the simplest all around.
>>
>>78620306
>Sorcery appears to be the simplest all around
lol
>>
>>78620320
nice answer
the whole system is 6 pages, it algo teaches how to create spells
looks good enough for lite
>>
>>78620306
some anon was working on a magic expansion to lite literal ages ago, i have no idea if they ever did it though.

honestly though, either sorcery with premade spells (the second you start finagling with advantages you're done), basic magic with a shortened spell list (don't need to get like. ignite fire, sniff fire, lick fire and hear fire before you get fireball) or syntactic magic.
>>
>>78620306
Magical, -10%
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>>78620387
To properly use Sorcery you'll need the entirety of the Advantages and Modifiers chapters, preferrably with Powers, which is not really "Lite" anymore. I'd go with basic magic or even RPM because it also is not long and teaches how to create spells without relying on 200 pages of material.
>>
>>78620306
a simplified version of rpm that condenses the modifiers probably
>>
>>78612633
>>78612777
>>78613088
It was a hundred point game. One player was using a long spear and got shived to death by a guy with a knife who kept keeping close to him, another got instagibbed by a guy using a combination attack, and the third player was ruthlessly bullied by a guy with a shield and a sword that kept using defensive attacks.
>>
>>78620435
>RPM
>the system that completely breaks outside of its very narrow scope (both setting and power-wise)
>the system that has nothing to do with the rest of the GURPS
>the system that boil down to mother-may-I every time you cast a spell despite being 40-pages long
That's retarded and stupid and retarded.
If you want free-form LITE system, just use Ritual Magic with condensed colleges.
>>
>>78620491
nice meme answer, play a game with RPM first
>>
>>78620508
Same to you.
>>
>>78620491
isn't ritual magic literally just a less refined rpm or am i missing something
>>
I was thinking of taking a note from rimworld in order to make melee weapons marginally more relevant against guns. In particular the shield belts. Basic idea is that you can have wearable shields that negate damage from any ranged weapons, but due to the nature of how they work you yourself cannot wield guns while using them. They're also not useful against melee weapons

Figure they would be easy to do as Gadgets with Semi-Ablative vs. Ranged attacks (-40%). Seem like an workable idea?
>>
>>78620571
I did that before in not!Dune

You're golden
>>
I haven't touched GURPS in a few years, last thing I remember happening was pyramid ending. Any new cool supplements I should look for?
>>
>>78620644
New Pyramid volumes, I guess.
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>>78620732
I thought pyramid ended?
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>>78524804
who made the cover with the animals in it? What's the meaning of that?
>>
>>78620798
Anon. To celebrate GURPS Furries.
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>>78620819
>GURPS Furries
what how and
where?
>>
>>78620830
http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/books/furries/
>>
more like sjw games
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>>78620864
I'm amazed they are still putting out new stuff while the last time they updated their website was in 1990. That said I'm disapointed the art direction of the boom seems to be classic old school "furries" which I don't appreciate but cool book nonetheless
>>
/GURPSgen/, I bought the Pyramid Bundle, and I'm slowly going to be printing out bits and pieces.
I'm tossing up between binding them in "Series", such as Alternate GURPS 1-5, or in order, so Pyramid Issue 3/1-3/5.

Which do you think is better/more usable, and why? Assume, for now, that I'll eventually have them all printed and bound.
>>
>>78620306
Magic-as-powers is the only thing that has a place in Lite.
Sorcery is close enough to that, so I'd say it's a good choice.
>>
>>78620754
It did. But then it came back.
>>
>>78620754
They moved to Kickstarter because it works for Hexagram.
>>
>>78620306
Discworld magic is made for (Discworld) lite and is the shortest freeform system.
Path and Book with half the paths and all the options cut out should still be functional.
Basic Set magic chapter is actually a good, short spell-list.
>>
>>78620435
RPM also requires a huge list of advantages, disadvantages, and modifiers, because it refers to them rather than having a comprehensive list of effects.
>>
>>78524804
Alright, /tg/, give it to me straight. What's the appeal of GURPS?
>>
An anon asked for some FR sorcery spells. I made some, but Spider Curse ended up being disgustingly expensive.
https://enragedeggplant.blogspot.com/2021/04/sorcery-forgotten-realms-spells-i.html
>>
>>78622995
I like that it's generic (great support for a ton of genres/settings while still having a lot of flavor), modular (if something is important, add corresponding rules, keep it rules light for less relevant parts), can do both gritty, high verisimilitude as well as cinematic games, allows incredibly in-depth character customization and great distinction between approaches.
The splatbooks are also very well researched and overall just really, really good. I use them even if I'm running other systems (even narrative ones).

Do you have experience with other generic systems? It's probably easier to explain the appeal of GURPS in comparison to other systems.
>>
>>78622995
I like playing Martials, and GURPS Lite alone beats D&D in that regard. Couple that with how consistent and reliable the dice mechanics are, and that there actually are rules for everything (if you want them), it's a far more rewarding system.

If you stick around here for a few of these generals, you'll inevitably see a fair few interesting questions and answers that come up that'll pique your curiosity further.
>>
>>78622995
What I absolutely love is that characters don't blend together.
I was a savage worlds guy before coming to GURPS and it's advancement system leads to characters converging.
Even just after a few sessions, initially distinct characters become more and more samey.
GURPS is basically the total opposite, Even characters with similar concepts (e.g. a group of martial artists) can be build very differently at the start and tend to diverge even more with advancement.
>>
>>78621377
I'm doing exactly that
Just document binders
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>>78621377
Print them out in order, but also print out the "In These Issues" file as a separate "table of contents" booklet that goes on top of the pile.
>>
>>78624462
>Print them out in order
Also, I think three or four (or six) issues per binding is better than five. You should have a consistent number of bindings per year.
>>
>>78620271
Yeah, I'll probably have to make macros for that, though I'm unfamiliar with programming and not sure how much I could automate tracking while automatically applying penalties without conflicting with anything else.
>>
>>78624211
How do Savage Worlds characters become samey? You have so few customization options, you are always forced to spend them on what is essential for your concept/build and never have any ability to "round out" your character. In a fight-heavy GURPS game you can always pick Combat Reflexes to round-out your character.
In SWADE you're forced to stay on track all the time.
>>
I've begun dreaming in my setting now. More than once...
>>
>>78622995
With GURPS, I have run/played in:
A Star Wars campaign
An couple campaigns set in Eberron
A Jumpchain campaign
An Urban Arcana campaign
A campaign loosely based off early-story Naruto
A campaign where the players were all the half-demon children of literally the Devil set in modern day.
A campaign based on a homebrew version of the Infinite Worlds setting.
A couple Pathfinder adventure Paths.
A solo campaign where the player was the immortal avatar of Magic, with her powers channeled through a sword made from the soul of the daughter of the previous God of Dark Magic.
A solo campaign where I was the necromancer-captain of a pirate ship.
Three different Dragon Age campaigns, where the magic actually felt like the magic from Dragon Age.
A campaign where the player woke up in basically-Ravenloft with amnesia and had to find clues to her past by interrogating the fallen angel that was following her around.
A campaign where a Victorian noble's daughter learned magic, then promptly got tricked by a Fey and utterly fucked over.
A bunch of others that I only vaguely remember or didn't actually get off the ground due to my players not being interested in the premise.
>>
>>78622995
As a player, it's the variety of characters types I can make *and* the level of mechanical support for them. I can have just as much variety in characters types if I played something like FATE, but they'd all play the same: being a noble knight, a cyberpunk hacker, and a literal god are all handled though the same mechanics and the unique aspects of the characters are just different coats of paint on the same dull mannequin.

Also the level of detail lets you really differentiate characters even within a narrow focus. Another Anon already brought this up but it bears repeating that you can have an entire party of mundane warriors and each of them can have their own unique feel to them. A hopolite with a medium shield and a long spear will not feel the same as a landschnet with a greatsword and neither will feel like playing an iajutsu-focused samurai; hell, even if you limit it to warriors from a single location and time period, you'll still get a ton of actual mechanically-significant variety between the differences in attributes, advantages and disadvantages, skills, perks, and gear.
>>
>>78622634
How does Discworld Magic work, anyway?
>>
>>78627501
It's RPM / Incantation Magic, but streamlined.
>>
>>78627501
Magic is divided into Paths. There's a significant number of example spells, but also a reasonably robust set of guidelines for making up your own spells. Spells have both skill penalties and cost energy, and casters have a pool of energy separate from FP. Casting times vary from near-instant (for fireballs) to lengthy rituals (for subtle withchery).

Wizards mitigate the cost of powerful spells with deep pools of energy (usually external, in the form of their staff) while witches can get big discounts on spell cost by acting witchy and by tying their spell and actions to a larger narrative trope. As an example, a witch can curse a local turnip farmer, but they have an easier time cursing a princesses because witches cursing princesses is a thing that happens regularly in stories; however, that witch should be ready for a brave and skilled and magically supported knight to come slay her because that's ALSO something that happens in stories.

A skilled wizard is one with the energy and skill to fireball obstacles into oblivion while skilled witches are smart enough to make sure the stories they time themselves to have a happy ending (for them at least; see above for a story a foolish witch would tie herself to).
>>
>>78605987
It's true. It was easier to colaborate like ten years ago but not now. I don't think a rewrite of GURPS is nessecary. I'd like to see some tweaks, like changes to unarmed skills to make them suck less, especially Karate. Unarmed in general, as well as techniques need a pass to make them more attractive.
>>
>>78627969
What do you think unarmed skills are lacking?
>>
>>78625897
But this, combined with there just being few sensible choices in general, is exactly why good builds play the same. If you have two characters of the same archetype in your party, even if they try to differentiate themselves, unless they go out of their way to pick worse stuff, the overlap in skills and edges is crazy.
>>
Hey guys,

Im going to be running a TL 4 pirate fantasy game. The PCs will be hunting a organisation of pirates headed by a undead pirate lord.

What monsters would you guys suggest from GURPS resources? I know that Krakens are obligatory ofc but Im a bit stuck on other fun monsters.

Also what are some fun and powerful spell combos I could use for Magicians that help the pirates?
>>
>>78629616
Oh, in that case, yeah, absolutely right.
>>
>>78629617
GURPS Horror has a TL 4 pirate setting, with a bunch of example monsters. I think there was a pyramid article about water monsters which had deep ones and stuff.
>>
>>78622995
It's complex enough to have more depth in things like weapons and combat, something other generic systems kind of struggle with, and comes with a number of expansive and well put together books but is still designed in such a way that I can easily simplify, modify, or ditch parts I don't love. Also I find the painfully bad art of most of 4e funny.
>>
>>78629617
Lanternfish mermaids or otherwise horrifying sirens
Colossal turtles that, at rest, can be mistaken for very small islands
All sorts of land-based threats stalking around the Caribbean jungle
Murlocks, Sahuagin, Deep Ones, or any other flavor of violent tribal fish-people
The ghost of a slain albatross that treats any passing ship as its killer's and heaps curses and bad luck upon it
A humpback whale; they're huge enough you shouldn't need to add much more than a bad disposition to make it a legitimate threat
>>
>>78620528
No, Ritual Magic is Basic Magic but with the colleges as skills, the spells as techniques and a bunch of other details.
>>
Whats the simplest magic system GURPS has?
There are too much of them
>>
>>78632112
the base system, arguably.
>>
>>78632112
Define "Simplest".
Spells as Skills is simple in the same way that D&D magic systems are simple - each spell is basically its own independent exception to the baseline rules and doesn't require much reading outside of how any given spell works on its own.
Semantic Magic Systems are simple in the way that Mage the Awakening/Ascension is simple - you propose an idea, the GM goes "yeah, sure, that sounds about right for that Realm." and game balance is already out the window in favor of Mage Supremacy.
Sorcery is simple in that it's basically just an implementation of the baseline underlying ruleset so if you know the ruleset, you already know how it works. It also mostly shares the Spells as Skills benefit of each spell being its own defined "thing."
>>
>>78632112
Chinese Elemental Powers. It's a fixed list of abilities, based on the existing advantages framework, with no fancy stuff, and every ability is described so you don't need to really refer to the advantage rules to work it out.
>>
>>78524804
What books should I check out if I want to run a nautical-heavy campaign? I know there's Pirates from 3e, but is there anything else?
>>
>>78632112
In terms of simplicity, the simplest system is the one most integrated with the rest of the system, since then you need to learn and manage less moving parts.
So it goes like:
Powers>Sorcery>Magic>some Thaumthology variants>RPM
Note that this is a tier-list based on simplicity, not on whether something is good or bad.
>>
>>78633878
>Pirates
I think you mean Swashbucklers.

In Third Edition, you obviously want the Vehicles series. (Vehicles Expansion 1 in particular has details on different sail configurations.) Additionally, Who's Who 1 has information on Dread Pirate Roberts, and Who's Who 2 has information on famous pirates Grace O'Malley and Ching Shih.
In Fourth Edition is, of course, the Low-Tech series.
>>
Time for a new thread!
>>
>>78633921
I'm curious if you'd put Divine Favor to the left or right of Sorcery. Learned prayers work exactly the same as learned spells, but Divine Favor's general prayers are handled much more loosely and freeform than Sorcery's improvised spells; building within a point budget is replaced with Appearance and Reaction rolls and determining the spell's effects from the result.

On one hand, you could argue that this change makes Divine Favor simpler because you aren't (as) worried about specific point values, but on the other hand you could argue that this makes divine favor more complex because it requires more adjudication by the GM as well as more rolls. What's your take?
>>
>>78636562
Personally, I'd say Divine Favor is harder. It requires more judgement at the table, and more DM calls, since effects are less standardized, while with Sorcery, it's more "Okay, player, here's the campaign grimoire, go wild."
>>
whos gonna create the next thread?
>>
>>78626782
Whoa whoa, you got any session reports for these? I'd love to read them
>>
>>78626782
Like >>78638606 said, I'd like to know about if you got session reports, or at least how did you manage to do the 2 solo campaign and the one-on-one ones.
>>
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>>78636562
Divine Favor is fun.

>GM ran a game set in a low-fantasy not-Europe with a not-catholic church being invaded
>play a bishop-prince whose land was taken
>play it straight but ham it up a bit
>campaign ends after several months when we get to where we want and the GM lowkey takes me aside as I'm leaving and tells me that pretty much every time my character did something I had divine favor because of how well I was role-playing it
>>
>>78637788



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