Anyone here ever run into a cougar while doing /out/ stuff? If so, please share your story here.
>>2279578>be out hiking>see a cougar in a clearing>oh sweet a cougar>it leaves>I leave
>>2279578Does a bobcat count as a big cat?
>>2279578>be me>be 27>be sad after relationship falls apart>start banging 47 year old Latina divorcee at my work >take her hiking Seen a cougar, banged a cougar. Felt good too.
>>2279578>be me>out in the mountains doing fieldwork with one other person>involves checking trail cams and collecting data on the location around them>get to a camera around 9am, spend next 7 hours working within 200m of the camera>we split up and go in different directions to be more efficient>finally finish, swap SD cards, and pack up to leave>hear a "HHHHHHHHHHHHH nnnnnnnnn" type noise from somewhere nearby>ask partner if he heard it, he says no>I mimic it for him, he says "idk, sounds like a puma">shrug it off and leave>get back home, check SD card>puma was captured on the camera 10 minutes before we got there>cat had hung around all day and watched usFucking spooky. Got goosebumps seeing the picture pop up on my computer
Those cars are spooks they won't be seen until they've seen you. Definitely the scariest thing in the woods.
>>2279578>be me >rancher >riding horses to check cows in my trees>see top of a big fluffy tail>shit paints and realize its a mtn lion>ride the fuck out of there (didn't have a gun)>be a few days later and find cow mauled by a lion>get madI'll teach that fucker to eat my cows>buy license and carry rifle slung at all times>a week goes by without a sighting or dead cow>mom sights it says it is "big as fuck">two days go buy and we find two cows mauled in a mud pitmy fuck he's murdering for sport>rage>drive up and down the creek everyday on 4wheeler looking for this murderer>see nothing for two weeks>have friend over assuming the cat is long gone>we out driving around for fun>see deer spook out of the creek>see the cat leaping up the bank>its huge fuck>slide down the side of the creek and chase up after it into the tall grass and bushes>realize I'm chasing this thing where I can't even see 5ft infant of me>realize Im retardedThis was the last time I ever saw the cat and never thought to look for any prints so just like that hes gone forever.
>be me>living in my rural redneck hometown for a couple years while "between things">really into camping, nature photography, field recording>one summer night decide to record the wildlife at a swamp in a 1000-acre nature reserve a few miles down the road>hop on my mountainbike>huff down there just at twilight >lock my bike to a tree and take my pack of gear into the woods>dark and spoopy, no moon at all this night>hike about 30mins through the reserve until I get to the swamp>hastily setup all my recording gear at the edge of the swamp; so full of frogs and crickets and insects and beavers and birds, perfect>once it's recording it's basically completely dark out>hike about 15mins away from the recorder so I don't interfere with any wildlife>get to the big rock™, a giant boulder about the size of a single car garage>scuttle up the side and sit atop to just wait in silence, want to get at least an hour+ recording>dark as fuck, can't see my hand in front of my face, looking up through the trees I can see a few stars peeking through, that's it>after about 30mins or so I get bored, pull out a ciggie>flick my lighter>there's a big fucking lion face right in front of me>HISSSSS>it runs away, crashing through the woods>a fucking mountain lion was skulking up the boulder about to fucking neck me>turn all my lights on and book it back to the recorder>packup as fast as I can, still takes like 45mins before I get back to my bike, horrified I'm being stalked the whole timea couple days later pic related was in the local paper, spotted about 1 mile from where I was
>>2279578Do these motherfuckers actually attack people? I would think they'd be timid around us unless they're injured or something
>>2279696they generally try to eat children but attack adults in self defense or under extraordinary circumstances, like when a parent tries to save their kid from attack
>>2279626Sure!Slaw one run across the road driving at night once, near Thompsonville MI.A few years later was grouse hunting 25 miles away from that, walking along a sand ridge above a wooded floodplain and saw a set of fresh cougar tracks.At first I though it was big dog tracks, but no claws, the pad was a bit different. Not a bear.That's all I got.
>be me>go /out/ a lot. >see at least one cougar or bobcat a year. >have never seen a porcupine that wasn't roadkill. Why are porcupines like this?
>>2279669did the fire of the lighter scare it away?
>>2279626I've only seen a bobcat on the trail but my dumbass got scared and ran away from it
>>2279852it must have. the thing was like 5ft away from me it was fucked
>>2279578No but I sure as shit have seen tracks. NC coastal public land.More or less swamp and with built up gravel roads though it. The animals use it as much if not more than people do. See turky, deer, kitty, puppy, tracks all next to each other. Funny how big bear tracks are least common.
>>2279578>be in back yard>stared at by a huge cat>both stare at eachother>staring contest>half hour goes by>it blinks
>>2279901and then you fucked it?
>>2279829Porcupines spend a lot of time in trees and look like a squirrel nest. I usually spot them from quite a long ways away.
>>2279632will add that other big cats I've been around are cheetah in South Africa (on a game drive, wasn't sketchy at all) and plenty of jaguar tracks in Central America.Medium cat sightings include lynx in Alaska, jaguarundi in Central America, and caracal in South Africa. Fucking pissed I haven't seen a bobcat yet.
>>2279696yes. they have killed 126 people in N. America in the last 120yrs or so...lots of them adults.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_cougar_attacks_in_North_America
>>2279578>Be me>Hikin in flawda>Walking along a long dirt road>See a panther about 15 yards ahead of me walk out of the woods, across the dirt road, and into the woods on the other side.>Think how cool and pretty that cat is>Think about how few there are left and how special that moment wasThank you panther
>>2280078>they have killed 126 people in N. America>"A total of 126 attacks, 27 of which were fatal"Idiot.Cows cause an average of 22 deaths each year in the US. Bees, 53 deaths a year.
>>2280178>Idiot.I deserve that. didnt read it fully. But I wasnt suggesting they were prolific or attacked a lot...just responding to the question of >Do these motherfuckers actually attack people?Which they do...you kinda sperged out on the cow and bee deaths.
>>2280189>But I wasnt suggesting they were prolific or attacked a lot...just responding to the question of>>Do these motherfuckers actually attack people?>Which they do...you kinda sperged out on the cow and bee deaths.They don't attack people. The number of attacks being higher than zero does not change that the risk does not exist in any practical sense. Do you consider a cow to be an animal that "actually attacks people"? Because you're roughly 100 times more likely to be killed in a cow attack than a mountain lion attack.
>>2280192>They don't attack peoplenot a factual statement. Quite being obtuse.
>>2279627Based couger fucker.
>>2280078>>2280178It's worth noting that a not insignificant number of missing persons could be victims of cougar attacks. We actually suck at finding dead bodies, even with hounds. Deaths caused by cows and bees tend to be a little more conspicuous. >but that can't be. We would find shreaded clothes and other remains.Do you know how many odd bits of fabric I come across nearly every time I go out? I live in the most remote region of the lower 48 states and I still see random cloth all the time. I usually chalk it up to someone needing to poop and ripping their shirt sleeve off to wipe. And once an animal is broken by a predator. All the scavengers come and scatter the rest. Nobody pays any attention to bones unless they see a skull. The same thing should also be considered in regards to shark attacks and missing swimmers. By the known numbers, shark attacks are fairly rare. But it shouldn't surprise anyone if they account for many of the people who have gone for a swim and never returned, dead or alive. Food for thought.
This occurred 5 minutes from my house: https://www.kdvr.com/news/local/bailey-8-year-old-recovering-from-mountain-lion-attack-shares-terrifying-story/amp/Apparently they are all over the area, and they show up on game cameras/Ring literally every day. But I have never seen one when /out/, I don't think I ever will, and I don't know anyone who has.I have always been told, if you see a mountain lion, it is because they are okay with you seeing them, which is usually bad. They are so sensitive they can hear me fart inside my house from 2 miles away. Old timers up here will spend their entire life in the woods and never see one. They are just too sneaky.
>>2280283Further thoughts:How often do we hear of some old guy going hiking or cross country skiing in the fall or winter alone, not coming home, and inspite of an earnest search; he never turns up until his scattered remains are uncovered in the spring? It is often said that any gnaw marks and cracks are from scavengers who consumed him after he was already dead? They usually claim that the man had a heart attack or a bad fall. But would anyone be able to tell that he wasn't ambushed killed by a mountain lion? Would a wildlife biologist be willing to propose or entertain a theory on big cat predation? Many of those guys are very committed to bio diversity and should not be considered unbiased sources. And I'd like to dispel a major misconception. Predators do not have a natural fear of man. They have a natural fear of the unknown. In many of the lesser populated of the US a wolf, bear, or cougar that started getting too familiar with people would normally be shot by a rancher, sheep herder, or hunter. Before the beast might feel comfortable attacking one of us. California is a hotspot for reported cougar attacks. And they have been sharply increasing in frequency in the last decade. Why? I submit to you that the average Californian is meeker and more naive than the rest of the western United states. The Californian may stand and marvel at a lion, take pictures and even talk to it gently. He educates the cougar on humans. The cougar may start observing people's movements through his area. Determining where the best place to lay an ambush is. In a straight on fight the average man could make more than enough trouble for a cat to bother with. But they don't attack straight on. If they do their job right, they already have ahold of your neck before you know you're being attacked.The majority of the victims aren't average men. They consist of the very young, the very old, and the very female
>>2280350I see them on my trail cam but I have never seen one in person...
>>2280350>Pike received more than 60 staples to his head and doctors had to reattach his eyeball to his skull so he could seeWould have easily been fatal 70 years ago. How did the kid escape? The article didn't say
>>2279578Saw a cougar once one a deer hunt. It was creeping along about 50 yards off through knee-high grass. I saw it for about 10 seconds and then it disappeared into a thicket. Waited there for about a half hour. Never saw it again. It's remarkable how elusive they can be.
Damn. I was reading about mountain lion attacks, and then I started on wolf attacks. You'd think if you shot and clubbed a few wolves to death, they'd quit attacking you. >When searchers arrived at the scene of an attack by a large pack of timber wolves, they found the bones of a man's body, a rifle with a broken buttstock, and the bones of eleven large timber wolves. The man was initially presumed to be Ben Cochrane, as he was employed in trapping animals in the area. Seven of the wolves discovered at the scene had been shot and four had been clubbed to death by the man's rifle buttstock. It is likely the remaining wolf pack overwhelmed the man, causing his death. On May 18, 1922, Ben Cochrane turned up alive and well in WinnipegGood for ben. But it's kind of sad we don't know who the dead warrior was. He fought admirably. >Pic relatedI could have saved her bros. She was 23 years old :(
>>2280569Here's some other good ones. Mexico 1890s>A horseman met a woman and two children who were walking to a relative's remote home. He offered to accompany them as protection from the dangers of wolves (species Mexican wolf) and robbers. The mother declined. The next travelers a short time later found the remains of the three, scattered on the same trail. The cited source indicates the incident was not a lone anecdote but representative of frequent incidents, owing to the fact the local residents were poorly armed.Michigan 1885>The temperature had dropped to -43 °F one night in mid January, the weather was severe and small game had become scarce. Mr. Duging failed to return that night from a hunting trip. His friends found his body gnawed to the bone the following morning, within 2 miles of their logging camp. Thirteen wolves that he had shot dead lay scattered near his body. At his side was his Winchester rifle with one round still loaded in the chamber.Saved one for the devil
>>2280583Ontario, Canada, 1922>On 12/23, an elderly trapper left his camp to "mush down" to the village to pick up his mail. Later in the day, two miles from the settlement, two First Nations men discovered his bones and blood in the snow amidst torn pieces of harness. The two men took their own dog teams and extra ammunition out in pursuit of the same wolves but did not return. The following day, two miles from the village beyond the scene of the first fatal attack, a search party discovered the rifles and bones of the two First Nations men amidst bits of clothing and empty shells. Scattered in a circle about the scene were the carcasses of 16 wolves.
>>2280592*benny hill music plays*> rabid wolf entered the Ft. Larned military outpost on the Arkansas River, furiously snapping at everything and everyone, tearing tents, curtains, bed clothes, etc. It entered the hospital and bit a bedridden patient, Corporal McGillicuddy, severely on the left hand and right arm and nearly severed off the left little finger. The wolf then rushed into a group of ladies and gentlemen who were gathered socially and singing on the front steps of Colonel Wynkoop's house. It bit Lt. Thompson of the 3rd U.S. Infantry, severely wounding him in both legs. Colonel Wynkoop and his scout James Morrison immediately took up arms and gave chase as the wolf ran into another structure and bit a Private soldier with the 10th Cavalry Buffalo Soldiers in two places. A sentry at the guard house fired a shot that went over the wolf's back as the wolf ran between his own legs. The wolf entered the quarters of the laundress and tried to attack her in her bed, but she was protected by the bed covers. The wolf finally charged at the sentinel at the haystack, but the guard shot it dead and escaped injury. The injuries were all cauterized with nitrate of silver and washed with alkali washes regularly at the base infirmary. Hospital records show that on the evening of 6 September, Corporal McGillicuddy began showing marked signs and symptoms of hydrophobia. No further treatment was given to him. He died on 9 September. A large Newfoundland dog that also had been bitten died with marked symptoms of hydrophobia. The other patients fully recovered. Hospital records indicated speculation that Corporal McGillicuddy's refusal to allow amputation of his finger may have contributed to his death. Lt -Col. Dodge made inquiry with Indians camped in the local vicinity. They told him attacks by rabid wolves that entered into their village were not infrequent, and they knew of no person who had received even the smallest scratch from a rabid wolf ever to have recovered
>>2280569>>2280583>>2280592>>2280597There are people who want to reintroduce wolves in my state after our ancestors painstakingly eradicated them. Those people should go fuck themselves
>>2280618Look on the bright side. If wolves get reintroduced, no one will be able to argue against carrying guns or for magazine capacity limits anymore.
Mountain lions are one of the only animals that I really fear because they stalk and can surprise pounce. Luckily I don’t currently live near any. What about bobcats though? I’ve seen several of those. Do they ever attack people, or even dogs?
>>2280620Bobcats will rarely attack humans, never fatally. Nothing to worry about. They'll eat your dog, though.
>>2280619Yeah. It would be good cause to repeal the NFA and sell belt fed to civilians. >>2280597Corporal McGillicuddy's great grandson went on to fight the Japanese in ww2. And he was equally stupid
>>2280619>400 wolves laugh at your pathetic 30 round magazine
>>2279578Went hiking and one came out onto the trail where my buddy and I were at.We shot it with our shotguns and fled the scene.
>>2280597>An African American worker who had spent a day helping neighbors slaughtering stock was attacked while returning home in the evening, carrying portions of meat given to him in pay. Before succumbing he had defended himself with his butchering knife, killing five of the wolves: this led to speculation the pack which attacked him had perhaps numbered "a dozen or more".You don't get between a black man and his BBQ without losing some of your own>In 1778 John Pencil, a Loyalist, caught his brother Henry fleeing with other American Patriots to Monocacy Island, and killed him for treason. After the Loyalists were expelled in 1780, John Pencil fled from Tryon County, New York, to Canada (present-day Ontario). He was attacked there by wolves three different times. Local Natives rescued him the first two times, but seeing him as wicked and cursed for killing his brother, they told him they would not help him a third time. John Pencil was attacked a third time by wolves, and having no rescuers, he was torn to pieces.Fitting end for a kin slayer.
>>2279578>be hiking with wife in santa monica mountains close to sunset>walking down mountain trail back to car>hear scream>sounded like grown man getting murdered>hear it again>walk faster>hear it again, this time closer>run as fast as we can back to our carPretty freaky and didn't realise it was a mountain lion till we got home and looked up 'mountain lion scream'Another time I was riding my dual sport early in the morning in the mountains above Santa Barbara and i came around a corner and just caught a mountain lion walking off the trail into the brush, that was pretty cool.
what caliber is needed to stop a mountain lion? would a shot from a 22 scare it enough to make it fuck off?
>>2279633>He doesn't know about sasquatch.
>>2280509His parents ran out and chased the cat off. He was playing in his front yard.
>>2280701>>2280701Also. I see this dangerous mountain cat on a daily basis. Just look how long he is.
My cat weighs nearly 20 pounds he is very big and also likes snow
>>2279578>Neighbor says he sees Mountain cat>everyone laughs about it behind his back>something big hit my trailer yelping then quiet>I check it out but don’t see anything>expect to find dead cat in the morning>find out neighbors pit got eaten>poor dog rip
This. Except most places around me it's not legal to have a pet off leash--in fact most trails ban pets altogether... so I yell at them. You wouldn't believe how many retards let pets offleash in wildlife restoration areas that LITERALLY HAVE NO PET SIGNS ALLOVER.I once kicked some lady's little yappy dog (some sort of chihuahua) because it was jumping on me (offleash) on a park trail (specifically marked at the trailhead no offleash) and yelled at her for not having them on leash (only one of the two was barking at me).She tried to hit me with a stick and her and I kept dodging at the right time to make her keep falling over herself. Her husband took a swing at me (he was a little behind her on the trail and didn't show up immedialty)--I politly threw him to the ground face down and punched him in the kidneys until he decided to stop fighting. She was an old hag who I basically ignored while "convincing" her husband it was a bad idea to keep fighting.They decided to stop fighting after they realized I was handing them both their asses while calmly telling them I'm well trained in hand to hand (while demonstrating it). THY FUCKING ATTACKED ME BECAUSE THEY WERE RETARDED.I hate pet owners in parks so god damn much.
>>2280627That pack leader must be a boss
>>2280772>neighbors pit got eatenBased mountain lion. Fuck niggerdogs.
>>2280905Take your meds.
>>2280930If they operate like coyotes, they likely don't have a firm alpha. Coyotes form into larger mostly non- hierarch packs when food becomes so scarce that larger numbers are needed to take down prey that a lone coyote or a small pack couldn't handle itself. A lot of the fatal wolf attacks on humans seem to have occurred at times of great scarcity when the wolves seemed half crazed with hunger. That's why the victims could kill over a dozen wolves and still not drive them off. They don't have social cohesion. They are behaving more like a swarm of locusts than a ordered pack. In 2009 a small female Canadian county singer was the only adult ever known to be killed by coyotes. The coyotes were so aggressive that her would-be rescuers had trouble driving them away from her.The largest male there was 42 pounds. It's not a stretch to think that a dozen or more 110 pound wolves could be more than a match for an armed and stout hearted mountain man.
>>2280905I thought this looked like copypasta in the dog thread, guess it's not only copypasta but a shitty bot too>>2280965kinda odd looking, but i wouldve given her the stink
>>2279716>>2279857This past summer I was a dumbass and took a cheap styrofoam cooler camping. I wrapped a couple bungee cords around it and figured that would be good.1:30am I hear rustling outside my tent. I shine my flashlight out there and point it right at the cooler, which is maybe 17 feet straight ahead, and I see two eyes glowing at me. I grabbed my son's flip-flop and chuck it at the cocksucker. The flip-flop hit the cooler and there's an unmistakably feline growl, and he runs off. I get my own flip-flops on and run out there, and he's long gone. I survey the damage, he chewed right through the cooler of course and ate all our hot dogs. I duct tape the hole, put the cooler in my truck and get back to bed. Maybe 20 minutes later I hear him snarling, then killing something.
>>2280978>kinda odd looking, but i wouldve given her the stinkShe wasn't a sculpture for sure. But she tried to fight them off with her pocket knife. I have a lot of respect for the people who go down swinging compared to those who turn tail and buy it in the back like a prey animal.
>>2279578nah but my grandpa ran into one and here i am
I live right in the thick of them but have only ever seen one in my life spending tons of time outdoors, was right at dusk and I was downwind from it, about 150y away. My neighbors constantly catch them on trail cams and lose goats to them. It's incredible how good they are at not being seen by humans. Makes you think twice about sasquatch being "impossible" because nobody can catch one.
>>2281047>Makes you think twice about sasquatch being "impossible"No anon, it really doesn't
>>2281047>Makes you think twice about sasquatch being "impossible" because nobody can catch one.Kek what the fuck
>>2280731Post pics of this beast
>>2279669>>2279871You catch the pants shitting on recording? Post pls.
>>2281262anon I was a good km or two from the recorder, I wasn't anywhere near it so no, schidding my pants wasn't on it. I might have the raw/unedited recording somewhere where you'll be able to hear frantically running up to the recorder and shutting it off but usually I only keep the edited topped/tailed versions
>>2280150were you frightened at all? did you take any precautions or did you just keep walking?
>>2281267Fair enough. What do you do with the recordings? I also record a bunch of audio of the Aussie bush - we don't have native cats but heaps of shit makes noises out here. It just sits on SD cards because I don't know why I do this besides autism.
>>2281272I put them on Soundcloud and Youtube for the enjoyment of others. Sometimes a filmmaker or video game designer will license some stuff for their project but really it's just a scrapbook of interesting places I go.
Quite a few years ago, my only cougar story. >be me, 21 years old sperg>like spending times hiking and sleeping innawood, nothing else much in life>get hit on by a colleague who is 40 years old>she is nice, play along>end up in relationship for five years>break up>still like hiking and sleeping innawoods
>>2279633>Skinwalker fingers typed this post
>>2279578Never while /out/, but I live in an area with quite a few and have seen a few while driving. It's always the same shit.>driving home at night on dirt road in BFE, Colorado>see cat>drive closer>holy shit that's a big cat>get really close and it runs off>was cougarI've also almost hit 6 separate bears with my car. Reckon it's just a matter of time until I hit one.
>>2280680A centerfire .22 will work. A.22 lr could kill one, but if you gotta ask, you couldn't do it. If I had a reason for a north American big cat gun, I'd go up to 6 or 7mm. Not because it might run both ways, but because a wounded cat is a dangerous and cats are hard to kill.Col Jim took out dozens of maneaters with a .275 (roughly equivalent to a 7x57) but he only took head shots and was all cool an' shit.
>>2282042cat killers need to be skinned alive and peppered with salt.
>>2282047>peppered with saltForgot image!
by a license?your a rancher or hand and you don't have a gun already?where do you live ?Obviously not in the US
>>2279578I was at the Gates of Lador in CO on Dec 22 while i was fishing. I herd one maybe two wild cats screaming for about 15-30 minutes.I never did see anything however.Personally no, I have never encountered a cougar other than that. I have seen some small bobcats on the east coast before.
my little runt of a stray went face to face with a gigantic bobcat one winter. the thing was at least 4x her size. i threw a snowball at it and it ran away. little kitty would have barely left a stain behind.
>>2279578This is where I go fishing
>>2283468yeah frick that shiggy
>>2283468>Based Americans are always hurh hurh you Euorpoors dont have guns!!...sure, but remember the reason is we shot them all, look at fox and wolf population
>>2283474now we just have potatoes and carrots
>>2283468Like I literally passed that camera
>>2283479Did it hurt when it came out?
>>2279626Bobcats might not be large but they make up for it in large anger
>>2283467So much this.
>>2283467What's the gist, for us non-Danes?
>>2280354The cats are doing the human race a favor, culling the feeble and weak.
>>2280965>The coyotes were so aggressive that her would-be rescuers had trouble driving them away from her.This is hard to imagine unless you're not wearing denim and boots and gloves.Coyote bite strength is a joke. Just stomp them like the giant ratniggers that they are they'll fucking move. God I fucking hate coyotes. I kill them constantly but my hate for them never wanes.
>>2283589The warmest barn in town, lol. Seriously though, this looks like some chaos cultist thing from W40k...
>>2283595>giant rats with thick full coats of often gorgeous fur are an invasive species killing my livestock's young and damaging the ecosystem in which I farm.That's a photo of a man who is capitalizing on catastrophe like a boss.Like someone in Illinois opening an Asian carp fried fish sandwich shop.I think it looks fucking badass. The rim of foxes at the top really sets it off too. He's an artist.
>>2283567>>2283575i genuinely dont know why i decided to post that, its a sign on an old Telecommunications tower i found in the woods warning about asbestos and saying not to drill anywhere
>>2280350If you live in Bailey then you are surrounded by lions. 100%.I am over by Pine/Buff Creek every week and the burn scar there is their prime habitat. There are close to 100 individual lions within 5 miles of Chair Rocks.
couple times>be me, 12 years old at time, on boy scout outing>me and buddy got a bit behind the group>not a huge problem, for our age we were pretty experienced and fine on our own>stop for lunch>been sitting for about 15 minutes>look up>see cougar off in the trees>stand up and yell in surprise>cougar fucks offsecond time>be a year ago>hiking in sierras alone>stop for a break>sitting on rock, eating tuna out of a pouch>see cougar in trees>stand up, shoulder rifle>don't intend to shoot it unless I absolutely have to>ask it politely yet firmly to fuck off>it doescougars scare me more than bears, but honestly most of that is just that primitive ape brain fear. I rationally know that cougar attacks are rare, and that since I usually carry while hiking I am more than capable of defending myself.
>>2280618California? I'm a califag and know that in the 2010s a wolfpack made its way down from like Idaho to far norther CA up near Modoc county. Apparently the reintroduction of wolves have been giving some ranchers hell, but they can't legally shoot them because they'd get fucked by the state government. Wolves are beautiful creatures, but they're also vicious predators and were killed for a reason.
>>2279578>>2279626Serious question: can you pet these things or will they always think you’re a threat?
/an/>OMG so cute, I wanna pet one/out/>one of these will ambush you alone or gang up in groups of 100 if they get hungry and kill your familyDamn.
Kinda.>be me>2001 or so >camping on kankakee river, northern Indiana >no big cats here, not even bobcats>here movement outside tent>think nothing of it, lots of wildlife on river>wake up next day>big cat prints by bank>disappear a few feet later when the ground firms upThe old men will swear up and down that there are Cougars on the river that got set free back in the 60s. Always figured it was a bullshit rumor, exactly zero evidence has ever been found despite literal thousands of people using the area monthly. I believe in them now, to this day not a shred of real evidence from anyone but I saw the tracks myself. Hope they are still there.
>>2280618God forbid you have a functioning, intact ecosystem. The elimination of predators is fully retarded and anyone who supports the elimination of predators is a fucking moron.
>>2280350Nigger, you live in bailey? I know the kid that got mauled. Small world.
>>2279665you should have baited that sonofabitch instead of chasing after it every time it killed one of your cattle
>>2280597america in a nutshell
>>2279578I heard one before while walking in yosemite and noped right back to the cabin and stayed there. I was 10 years old and would have gotten rekt
>>2280618Those are the risks of going /out/. If you seriously think the removal of species is a logical thing to do you are actually retarded. Now we got big cats up the ass in Yellowstone, and elk populations have been gutting riverbanks of vegetation.
>>2279578South Africa reporting in. Grew up on a game farm in Limpopo, bordered Kruger park. Plenty of run-ins with Lion. Thing about big-cats is that you dont need to worry about the ones you can see, because they are letting you see them. Its the ones you cant see that want to eat your face.Example >tfw riding the fence-line looking for holes cut by poachers>smell a kill>jump off bike and walk into a thicket >behold, a dead impala up a tree>hairs on my neck instantly stood up >ran faster than I have ever run in my life Leopard pull kills into trees, leopards never leave an unfinished kill, leopards kill more men than lions. There is a leopard, I cant see it = danger.
>>2284355>hurr blanket statementsDepends on the context you fucking retard. Predators in a game park are fine, predators in agricultural areas are a problem, predators near human settlements are a big problem. Only a brat from a suburb would think that it would be suuper cool to have predators running around all over the place.
>>2284461>hurrdurrr no shit sherlockFuck you cunt. I live in the sticks with wolves, griz and lions on my property. Predators are a vital piece to a functioning ecosystem. Some management is needed to reduce conflict but eliminating them entirely is really fucking stupid. Anyone who says otherwise is retarded.
>>2280354>If they do their job right, they already have ahold of your neck before you know you're being attacked.mfw mountain lions aint shit
>>2279632Really fucking spooky, how do I get that job?
>>2279669smoking saves lives
>>2284572write grants to work with wildlife researchers and/or apply to wildlife tech jobs
>>2282104shout out to Moffat County. Gates of Lodore is badass.
>>2283644Maybe if we stopped killing every predator larger than a coyote, they wouldn't be able to spread so prolifically.
>>2284915Don't kid yourself, this would have happened regardless. The idea that predator and prey populations scale with each other is just a myopic anthropocentric simplification of a much larger, longer and more complex ecosystem than we're capable of comprehending without being educated about it. And even then most people will fail to come to terms with the fact that their brain is not wired to process these ideas, and will continue to lean on their intuitions. Leading to hilarious takes such as>hurr durr human did it
>>2284453>elk populations have been gutting riverbanks of vegetation.Sound like you should open up Yellowstone for elk hunting. Wolves were killed off for a reason. It has be proven time and time again that our ancestors knew what they were doing. They wouldn't have expended the effort if it wasn't important
>>2284959? Actual ecologist here. Ranges do shift over time naturally, but the coyote's expansion west and east of the great plains is definitely due to humans. Hell, the red foxes that we find across much of the US aren't native. Plenty of research shows that wolves legitimately affect coyote distributions, so it's not at all unreasonable that wolves kept coyotes restricted to the plains until the wolves were killed off.I mean fuck, the U.S. and Canada only have 5 large carnivore species left (black bears, brown bears, polar bears, puma, wolves), and Europeans didn't drive any predators to actual extinction when they got here. We used to have cheetah, lions, other bear species, smilodon, dire wolves, etc. here too. The people who crossed the Bering land bridge are the ones who made those animals disappear. You cannot understand ecology without considering humanity's role going back millennia.
>>2280618And what trouble do you think the wolves will cause?
>>2284987>ecologist>omnivores is carnivoresNow I assume you know something because you didn't include Griz (U.arctos horribilis) on your list, but what does it take to call yourself an ecologist? Is there like some sort of test, or a certificate or something?
>>2281268I wasn't really scared no. You learn over time that nothing cares about you when innawoods.
>>2279578>be me>out with my very young daughter taking her on her first camping trip in the N. Cascades>hike 5 miles innawoods and set up camp>everything is great>she finds a moose track and starts getting nervous>lel>hike around the area>have dinner>it starts getting dark and she starts freaking out>can't calm her down>fuck it, we'll try again when she's older>rapidly break camp, pack up, and start jogging back to the trailhead hoping to beat the dark because the trail runs along a steep cliff that falls into a creek>about a half mile from the trailhead, as I'm urging her to hurry because it's almost fully dark, I turn a curve and spot a cougar less than 10 feet up the trail walking straight towards me>consider going for my sidearm but know I wouldn't have time to draw and fire before it'd fuck me and my daughter up>we stop and stare at each other as I'm yelling for my daughter to stop and slowly back away>cougar turns and walks up the slope into the woods>we make it back to the car and leave>she never realized what happenedSeriously, I almost shit myself. Had I have been looking over my shoulder to encourage her to hurry, I'd have jogged right into that bastard and who knows what would have happened.
>>2284988Minimum: eating livestock Maximum: see the wolves of Paris, winter of 1450
>>2280192there's a fuckton more cows than mountain lions thothat alone should skew the stats
>>2285089I've got a B.S. in wildlife ecology and am about to finish up my M.S. in the field as well. Yes, grizzlies are just North American brown bears that don't eat fish. The distinction is ridiculous and exists solely to make Alaskans feel like they have big dicks.Black bears and brown bears are definitely omnivorous, but they will readily take larger prey if given the opportunity. If we're worried about prey species, we should consider omnivores that are potential predators as carnivores. Plus, they are carnivores by definition since they're in order Carnivora. >>2285139>Minimum: eating livestockPretty cheap to compensate farmers/ranchers for the few losses they suffered compared to the costs of managing against wolves and the costs of not having wolves around at all.>Maximum: see the wolves of Paris, winter of 1450Doomposting. This is not a problem in North America and never has been, and it's rarely been a problem in Europe.
>>2285264>Pretty cheap to compensate farmers/ranchers for the few losses they suffered compared to the costs of managing against wolves and the costs of not having wolves around at all.It doesn't cost anything to not have wolves around. People pay the state to hunt the surplus game>Doomposting. This is not a problem in North America and never has been, and it's rarely been a problem in Europe.Motherfucker, people have posted seven north American stories of armed men being killed by large packs of wolves, even into the 1920s. And that's only some of what we have recorded. There could have been hundreds of mountain men who met the same fate since 1800 and tens of thousands of American Indians. There is nothing magical about the wolves of Europe. In fact, they tend to run smaller than the Canadian and Alaskan wolves that we are forcing onto the states that have already eradicated them. BTW. Those wolves are entirely different than the wolves that used to live in the western states. A Mexican wolf would be a better fit. But they just look like an overgrown coyote and fill a similar ecological niche so they don't give the fur fags like you a big dick. Pic related
>>2285278I remember reading an article out of Grangeville, ID where a guy went hiking with his two dogs and barely escaped with his life after a gray wolf ambush. His dogs sacrificed their lives to give him enough time to reach his vehicle, and all that was left of them was fur poking out of wolf shit when he returned. Even though the guy was armed, he stood no chance of surviving.That article was from the 90s, early into the reintroduction efforts, and the tenor was "WTF are you assholes doing? You're going to get us all killed!" Wolves are seriously no joke, and are kill-on-sight on my ranch. Luckily, I haven't had to do this yet: I have a team of Kangals with spiked collars that keep them at bay. The only predatory animals I've actually had to shoot were a couple of brown bears who the dogs couldn't manage to deter. That said, I've come across carcasses of black bears, a cougar, two wolves, and numerous coyotes that wouldn't get the hint and the dogs tore them to pieces.Livestock guardian dogs are the shit, and putting spiked collars on them turn them into the Mountain from Game of Thrones: they can pretty much murder anything except a grizzly. Luckily, I've not had one of those on my lands.
>>2285264>B.S. in wildlife ecology>doesn't know basic facts about wolvesyeah that checks out
>>2285332>KangalsI've been fascinated with them since I read the story about the one who killed the Ottoman Sultan's pet lion in one on one combat (the dog lost a leg). They apparently do stirling work even today. >and are kill-on-sight on my ranch. The best way to deal with wolves and the trash horses the feds pretend are mustangs is to shoot them through the gut with a FMJ round. The bullet will bury its self in the dirt and the gutshot wolf or horse will skitter off and die a mile or two away leaving no evidence for ballistic identification.
>>2285356>basic factsoh yeah? name 5
>>2285359>big bad, with the breath>minnesota timber>the one that ate red's granny>blues singer Howlin'>newscaster Blitzer
>>2285387>>newscaster BlitzerDelayed kek
>>2285357There are downsides. My land used to harbor a decent outfitting business for hunters. When I bought the place out and let loose my Kangal pack, the equation changed. They murder the fuck out of deer, elk, and the occasional moose that enter the pastures, let alone rabbits, squirrels, skunks, or basically anything else that moves that they don't recognize as my livestock. I dare say, if I ever had a trespasser, they'd probably murder them as well. They are such efficient predators that I rarely have to feed them: they do fine on their own, and usually aren't interested in the beef I offer them. The only real problem that I have with them is that they have a nasty habit of killing my barn cats if they stray from their hunting grounds. Since I keep the cats fertile and they breed at will, I still retain enough to do the job, but it is sad to come across their carcasses when they get a wild hair up and decide to explore.Seriously: iif any /out/ person comes across a sign announcing the use of LGDs, they should take it seriously and fuck off. You may get lucky and run into a Great Pyrenees that'll just bark at you, but you may just as likely run into a Kangal that will feast on your liver because you're a stranger. I've had instances of Kangals getting aggressive towards cows to protect newborn calves: if they are willing to take on something the size of a VW, what do you think they'd do to you? They might be friendly with me and my family, but they will kill any stranger in their territory or die trying.
Obligatory farmerbro post.People don't really understand farm animals. I'd never allow a bull on my land without a nose ring, and every time I approach once who I haven't placed a lead on their ring my nuts shrivel: even the tamest of bulls is a deadly threat. That lead stays on them even when they're fucking my cows, because one good tug is all it takes to tame them down due to the pain. Horses and ponies? They're crazy as fuck, ponies moreso than horses. Those bastards will bite you, kick you, or crush you against stable walls if you don't assert dominance. So what do you do? You literally punch them in the nose when they misbehave. It sounds crazy, but it works. Goats? There's nothing you can do about a ram who randomly wants to fuck you up: they never learn, regardless of consequences. They're the geese of the animal world: no matter how many times you grab them by the neck and fling them away, they keep coming back to goose you. That's why I no longer raise goats ... or geese. Roosters can also get aggressive, and the only solution is to put them in a kill cone and rotisserie them after a few days hanging. I've had issues with broody cows, and the solution is the same as horses: punching them in the nose usually gives them enough pause that they stop acting like assholes. Strangely, pigs have never given me grief, and are personable enough that it pains me to have them slaughtered ... I'd rather slaughter my horse, he's such a cunt. Last week he bit my son's ass as he was cleaning his stable and got a shovel to the face for it. I'm really tempted to turn him into mystery sausage.
>>2280965>dont have a firm alpha>also russia400 communist wolves sounds scary
>>2284575this is why I always keep a pack close to my heart
>>2284355fuck wolves, they eat big cat cubswolves reinsertion has some nasty unsaid ends, in my opinion
>>2286144the problem is people seem to think of wolves like a panacea predator, when in reality they introduce more problems than they solve more often than not.there are literally thousands of other predators you could introduce.
>>2280680The issue here, is that by the time you know your being attacked, it is far too late to draw.
>>2284915Kinda true. Wolves are really territorial with other canines. I have a pretty good finger on the pulse of my local wolf population and when it drops periodically I start seeing coyotes again for a couple years. They never quite disappear fully though.
>>2280667>John Pencil, a Loyalist, caught his brother Henry fleeing with other American Patriots to Monocacy Island, and killed him for treasonCuck faggot
>>2285135>>consider going for my sidearm but know I wouldn't have time to draw and fire before it'd fuck me and my daughter up >>we stop and stare at each other as I'm yelling for my daughter to stop and slowly back awaySounds like enough time to draw your firearm.
>>2285135Where are in the Cascades friend?
>>2279578My dad's friend had one attack a coworker and they shot it a few years back. Pic rel. I'm from Eastern Canada, never seen one irl.
>>2285439Kekd. Horses are retarded.Lived in NE Shasta county for a decade, saw two cougars in daylight, both were medium sized. Saw maybe five bobcats, all small. Saw some timber rattlers that would make you think twice about where you step.Often walked home from my cousin's house after dinner, five miles and 1500 feet of gain. Winter nights with no moon, would stay on the road by looking at the stars between the tall timber. Dark as satan's butthole, no lights or neighbors the whole way. I'm big and mean and fairly brave, but still would have times when a sound, or nothing at all would make my hair tingle and heart race. Stand there in the pitch black listening, gripping my knife and wondering if I'd get any warning.We would joke about it, "At least it's an honorable way to go, fighting tooth and fang with a lion."Then one night in the truck, about a mile from home, I see two big cats cross the road in front of me. Nose to tail, looked ten foot long. Spooked me pretty good, they were BIG fuckers.Next day had report from a neighbor that they ate one of his goats.Next trip to town I bought a new Remington 870 and never did that walk again without it. Figured they could still end me if they wanted to, but man it was a warm and fuzzy feeling holding a bunch of 00B at ready. Never did see any big ones in daylight.
>>2284458Amazing. You have any other scary encounters?
>>2287504Ever see a Lemurian? I saw one when I climbed Shasta.
>>2283468nice fishing locale
>>2284177it's real. cats will go out of their way to attack. bears are mostly timid. when you have little kids and love to go outside, you get an innate hatred born out of necessity.
>>2283589Read Coyote America by Dan FloresThe more coyotes are killed the more they breed. You could cull 90% of an areas coyotes for 10 years and not kill 50% of the original number.
>>2288359My state put a 50 dollar bounty on coyotes 15 years ago and completely proved that book wrong. The author doesn't understand anything other than the captive observations of coyote mating. >but that just means you've only killed the coyotes that are easily found! All coyotes are easily found with a thermal scope. Which I paid for with bounty money. Deer and Turkey populations are rising, while livestock predation is falling. There is not a single indicator that the coyote population hasn't been drastically reduced.
>>2288573jesus christ, you could make a living off that. how slim are the pickings these days?
>>2288577Slim. I used to see coyotes daily. Now I have to hunt for them just to make sure they're still there. Nobody makes a living off the bounty alone. But you can also sell a good pelt 30 dollars if you can green tan them. But those are mostly trapped coyotes. Shooting them can harm the value I know some guys who make trapping a legitimate side hustle. But most coyote hunters in my state don't break even on the hunts. I only shoot them as I come across them so it does give me some pocket money. But selling plasma would probably make you as much more reliably.
>>2288577>>2288585I will say, that at the beginning of the bounty drive, some guys were probably killing enough to quit their day job. But the program has been so effective that those times are long over.
>>2288588I can concur. I grew up near a naval air base and there were so many coyotes that they'd constantly run onto the runways and fuck up operations. They put up a $20 bounty on them and every billy bob in the area came out to snipe them. Some of them made serious money in the process. Within a year there weren't any more coyotes.Every now and then you'll find one as roadkill or whatnot, but the few that survived learned to stay the fuck away from anything even remotely resembling human lands.
>>2279578Yes my friends and I were camping in Appalachia we were drinking and cooking pork chops on Sharpened sticks like cavemen casually discarding the bloody styrofoam packaging nearby. My best friend who is now deceased from an unrelated matter suddenly stop talking and became very quiet I turned to him and asked him what was wrong and he grabbed my head and put it against his head and pointed into the bushes where I saw a cat eye the size of a golf ball staring back at me we emptied our weapons into the brush but in the morning we didn't find a corpse. Locals said that there was a cougar in the area that had attacked several people in the last few months. Good times I miss my friend
>>2280055Where did you spot the jaguarundi?
>>2289446>but in the morning we didn't find a corpse.I love the implication. You just unloaded into the dark and went to sleep like babies. Love it.
>>2285264>North American brown bears that don't eat fishBut they do. They feed on spawing cutthroats in Yellowstone and other N. Rockies locales.
>>2284987>it's not at all unreasonable that wolves kept coyotes restricted to the plains until the wolves were killed off.its less reasonable when you take into account that wolves were on the plains as well. Lewis and Clark first encountered a coyote in what is today Iowa
>>2289896Alaska anon here. There's a big difference between bears that eat fish when they stumble across it and bears that depend on fish for most of their seasonal calories.The difference between coastal and interior bears continues to widen with each generation
>>2289942>There's a big difference between bears that eat fish when they stumble across it and bears that depend on fish for most of their seasonal calories.for sure. Griz in Yellowstone dont get most of their calories from trout- but they do following spawning seasons and actively return each year to feed- its more than "stumbling" across. Then they move on to moths lol.
>>2289896>>2289942This just reminded me of something that made me sperg out in autistic rage >be me. 10 years old.> at school, state biologists comes to give presentation on the local ecosystem. >she talks a lot about beavers. How important they are, what their families are like, how they almost went extinct. >but then she says "they only eat plants. They never eat fish.">raise my hand>ask "why don't they eat fish? Wouldn't it be a good source of protein?">"no anon! They never eat fish. They get their protein from plants">so you're telling me that if a fish died right next to a beaver, it wouldn't be at all interested in it? >"absolutely not">O-ok>10 or so years later>walk by a beaver damn>see a beaver eating a fish>try to explain to the beaver that he shouldn't eat fish>beaver doesn't care>leave as my hated for civil servants and the college educated deepens. >Check search results for beaver eating fish today>pic related Beavers eat fish. Wolves kill people. Killing coyotes results in fewer coyotes
>>2289952> pic related
>>2289952well done anon. you are quite the rebel. Beavers are ominvores and scavengers just like bears. Although you are more likely to see a beaver eating a fish than you would to die of a wolf attack.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ES0YQyqv4O0
>>2289963>Although you are more likely to see a beaver eating a fish than you would to die of a wolf attack.True. But that's mostly because beavers are a few miles away from me and wolves aren't even in my state.
>>2289963>beavers behaving badly Trust the science!
>>2289963>>2289976to be fair. the beaver doesnt really eat the fish- more like testing it out with his mouth before leaving and leaving 99.99% of the fish unconsumed...despite the out of context snippet of>>2289976
>>2290016I've seen beavers consume fish, guts, bones and eyes. It is profoundly silly that biologists make the absolute statement that large aquatic monogastric rodents don't eat fish. And as for the clip, I can't even tell how much of the fish is consumed. Because the color of the flesh looks white under water. That entire filet could be missing. As well as the other side
>>2279632Do you mind sharing pic ?
>>2290020>I've seen beavers consume fish, guts, bones and eyes.ok buddy.>as for the clip, I can't even tell how much of the fish is consumed.sure you can. he flips it over. and you can see the flesh inside. he basically tests/tugs on the skin a few times and then leaves it. he doesnt actually eat it in this clip.>>2289963
>>2284255Please pet them retard. And film it and post it with your bloody hands.
>>2284315>/an/>sheltered house pets>/out/reality
>>2285439Kek. You're also right about the pigs, in a way I don't feel comfortable with eating them. They're really intelligent, they're omnivores like us, their organs are so similar to ours that they can be transplanted into humans, their eyes look human as well and I get the feeling that there's something behind those eyes. It's also said that human meat tastes like pork. Hits a bit too close to home. I wonder if they pass the mirror test.
>>2284975>It has be proven time and time again that our ancestors knew what they were doing.Your ancestors ate lead paintchips, did heroin, lived with asbestos insulation and it shows in posts this retarded.
>>2279633they can be :^)
>>2280618I don't get it. Why don't we just eat more deer meat instead of letting wolves do so?
>>2280078Good thing they don't forget 9/11 already.
>>2289612Belize. Ran out in the road and jogged in front of our truck for a couple dozen meters before jumping back into the jungle
>>2289896>>2289942Which helps illustrate how stupid the designation really is. Coastal bears get enormous because of how much protein they consume through spawning salmon. That's it. Genetic subpopulations of brown bears are not distinguished between coastal and interior, they're distinguished by barriers to gene flow.>>2290301Don't have it, unfortunately. It's sitting somewhere in a database that I don't have access to. I was just a field tech at the time.>>2290796Wolves don't eat that much. Say a pack has a territory of 100 square miles, and say they need to eat once a week. If they kill a deer once a week, that's only 52 deer a year. Hell, double that for fun and it's still only 104 deer. There are plenty of deer left. This is what anti-wolf retards don't understand.
>>2279626Had a bobcat that used to hang around my homestead. Never bothered any of the animals.