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>clear cut and burn hardwood forests
>blow up and demolish entire mountains
>kick up coal dust giving everyone COPD
>pollute groundwater with coal slurry
>bury streams with rockfill
>basically make a beautiful area look like a desert shithole
>hire way fewer miners than conventional
>buy out WV and KY politicians to get around even meager regulations
B-but windmills make noise!
>>
You guys ever find it weird how these random poles just grow out of the ground all over the planet?
>>
Why do you care about some Chinese jew owned country wagie?
>>
>>2092032
I care about the mountains
>>
>but my deciduous forests
>I never see that anyway since all I do is day hike and stay at Air BnBs
>Alltrails steers me clear of this
where is DC ban evader?
>>
>>2092035
>Appalachians
>mountains

lol
>>
>>2092039
It's a beautiful area, despite the fact that these are mostly large hills
>>
>>2092024
why people unironically believe that ruining their homes/bodies/children's futures just to print money for some corporate shareholder they'll never meet is beyond me
>>
>>2092039
>>2092051
And even if they are mostly just glorified hills they're glorified hills that matter a lot to a lot of people and hold a lot of natural beauty
>>
>>2092054
/this
Capitalist brainwashing is a hell of a drug.
>>
>>2092066
>>2092054
friendly reminder that mitch mcconnell has a mailing address that can receive packages of all shapes and sizes
>>
>>2092068
this. coal barons and their enablers should get the guillotine in minecraft
>>
>>2092054
Because they want a tiny portion of that money to survive/consume with.

People have to survive, anger should be targeted at the corporations/people who created that scenario and who intentionally maintain that scenario.
>>
>>2092035
Bullshit. You care about your own backyard.
You are perfectly happy with calling for all the nasty pollution to be moved to the other side of the world where other people have to deal with it. You don't care that these people don't have the technological finesse to deal with it. You don't care about their mountains.
>>
>>2092083
>>2092071
>>2092070
tldr read theory and arm the workers. Environmentalism and capitalism cannot coexist
>>
>>2092070
>>2092068
Good to see the FBI is hard at work trying to entrap some incels into thought crimes to beef up their white terrorism narrative
>>
>>2092086
>read theory

faggot detected
>>
>>2092094
>It's gay to read. only gays read
>>
>>2092093
I mean literally any reputable study you look at will show that environmental degradation disproportionately affects nonwhite communities

https://www.nccj.org/environmental-justice
>>
>>2092094
if you can't bring yourself to read a 23 page pamphlet you're a crayon eater
>>
>>2092086
Environmentalism and any other ism can’t exist. The Communist will get the rope along with the Capitalist. Both ideologies have a terrible environmental record and can’t coexist with real environmentalism.
>>
>>2092110
>NCCJ
>Reputable
Gonna have to stop you right there, Bobby.
>>
Trees grow back.
>>
>>2092128
explain why without using triple parentheses
>>
>>2092068
I see what you’re getting at. I’m winking at you FBI man, but not totally ironically
>>
>>2092127
Environmentalism is fundamentally antihumanism.
>>
>>2092139
If you consider anti-industrialization to be antihuman then sure.
>>
>>2092129
but not the same ones. clear cutting or logging of an area is an invitation for invasives to take over, or not let some natives beat others out. in wv only about 6% of the original spruce forest remains
>>
>>2092083
Is that such a bad thing?
>>
>>2092139
Good
>>
>>2092086
>read theory
>read theory
>read theory
No thanks, do you think the average worker/consumer cares any more about the environment than corporations? because I can tell you most don't and the few that "do" are only pretending for social points.

The issue is not a question of capitalism or communism. I'm not going to read what some stupid communist or capitalist has to say about the environment because both of them are ultimately only using it to push capitalism/communism. I cannot trust them to be realistic and practical. I would rather go out into nature and see for my own eyes what harms it and talk to people from other nations who share my interest.

Not read some gay pamphlet some inner city communist/capitalist came up with to justify their gay economic ideology bullshit.
>>
>>2092355
This this this. Communist countries have an environmental record just as bad, if not worse than capitalist ones. They both are industrial ideologies at their core and have no place in environmentalism.
>>
>>2092110
not the heckin niggerinos!
>>
>>2092024
Thats why nuclear is the best option.
Windmills make noise, obliterate birds and ruin landscapes.
Solar farms take up too much space, swallowing entire landscapes
Hydroelectricity obliterates fish and changes the landscape drasticly
Coals obviously the worst thing of them all, annihilating entire landscapes and pumping cancer into the air.
Meanwhile a handful of nuclear reactors deliver more than enough power, waste the least amount of space (therefor ruin the least amount of landscape), dont fuck with wildlife anymore than any other building and dont pump cancer into the air.
>>
>>2092371
Nuclear power isn’t the answer to everything you think it is. Nuclear power will only ever be something that the elites can control. We will never have a say in nuclear power as it’s so specialised. It is ultimately an un-democratic energy. Then there’s the factor of nuclear waste, possible nuclear catastrophe, which, you know, aren’t too fresh for the environment...
>>
>>2092366
Why are you arguing for capitalism and communism?
>>
>>2092366
I'm slowly becoming eco-fascist
>>
>>2092374
All forms of energy are un-democratic except for possibly hydro and wind. And nuclear disasters are rare as fuck. Waste is easily managed because there isn’t a lot of it.

>>2092375
I’m arguing for neither. Communists and Capitalists should hang.
>>
>>2092374
Ah yes tearing up thousands of acres of open space for a solar plant or Wind farm is so much more "democratic".
>>
>>2092371
80 iq post
>>
>>2092389
You should be. Eco-fascism is the only path forward that puts the planet and the human experience on Earth first. Everything else is a slaves ideology.
>>
>>2092392
Im also not advocating for solar plants or wind farms. Ideally the best way to go is not to sustain the system that required heavy energy usage at all times
>>
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>>2092024
They voted overwhelmingly blue in the early 90's. They got completely fucked over, the 90's were the worst decade ever in the history of West Virginia. They vote red out of spite.
>>
>>2092389
>>2092394
Eco-facism is a meme internet ideology. Facism and capitalism go hand in hand you cringe dolts
>>
>>2092374
>nuclear catastrophe
Fukushima and even Chernobyl is quite livable and the second generation animals and plants aren’t even deformed. Don’t fall for the tv hype and terror. Nuclear radiation isn’t as deadly as we think it is.
>>
>>2092401
Wrong. Eco-fascism and Fascism share some things but in many ways are drastically different. And capitalism shares almost nothing with fascism as corporations that existed under Fascist Germany and Italy were essentially prawns of the state that would have been otherwise shut down had they not complied with government/military demands. An eco-fascist government would seek to eliminate corporations outright and deindustrialize as quickly as possible. Illegal immigrants would be deported and borders would be closed off to migration. Urban centers would be dismantled. It’s funny that you think eco-fascism is an internet ideology considering it’s been around for almost as long as fascism which emerged in the late 19th century. You sound uninformed.
>>
>>2092371
Based
>>2092401
Cringe, but Jew ovens do put a lot of C02 and Air pollution into the atmosphere, so eco-fash makes no sense
>>
>>2092406
I like how you get your information from all of the successful eco-fascist governments that have existed throughout history. Very rooted in reality your ideology. This is why you only see ecofacism on the likes of 4chan; because it is, and I stand by this, a meme ideology.
>>
>>2092406
Nazi Germany did Privitize key Corporations but for the most part the Nazis simply built on the foundations of the Bismarkian Parental conservative Economy of the Prussian state/German Empire, but your description sounds a lot like the Khmer Rouge
>>
>>2092054
This.
On an outdoors board even ironic anti-environmentalism deserves scrutiny. Doesn’t matter about your political leanings, if you can’t agree with the idea that the beauty of nature should be preserved, than you shouldn’t be here.
>>2092068
Uncle Ted is that you?
>>
>>2092113
>if you don't consume my propaganda you're an idiot
you must be really smart because you read stuff you like :^)
>>
>>2092127
Agreed. The communists dried up the Aral Sea. Sorry, Commies. It’s not like I am advocating for the opposite, just that we need to defend nature when we absolutely can, and not expect an ideology to do the heavy lifting for us.
>>
>>2092409
Lmfao. Do you get all of your information from all the successful communist governments in history? Of course you don’t, because there haven’t been any and won’t ever be. I get my knowledge from writers who have discussed the subject and have laid an (albeit small) framework for what an eco fascist society could and should look like. Again you seem uninformed.

>>2092411
Read The Rise and Fall of The Third Reich. The Nazis promised a lot to the capitalist class to earn their support before turning around and fucking them as soon as the Nazi Party took power. Some businesses were able to get away with operating independently but the vast majority were government in proxy’s in every way but name.
>>
>>2092424
>everyone that is against my ideology is a communist
That must be your big brain writers expanding your brain to galaxy levels. I’m very impressed. Though I will say you seem solely informed in your fascistic larp ideology, and not much else. More fool you lol
>>
Commercial fishermen want to kill me for doing survey work for offshore windfarms. I don't blame them, I'm practically a foreigner coming in to change their way of life.
>>
>>2092427
Sorry when I see a retard say capitalism and fascism are the same thing I usually assume they’re a stupid communist, and usually I’m right. Either way you’re extremely uninformed and you seem to be able to only argue in 4chan terminology. Enjoy living life as a dependent slave brooding in misery and emptiness.
>>
>>2092433
Hilarious how under the tiniest bit of scrutiny of your delusional ideology you fall to bits and start with the insults. Maybe read some more useful writers, ey bud? Absolutely seething lol
>>
>>2092438
You start off with an insult and are now indignant about being insulted? Grow the fuck up, or better yet don’t and take your own life, for the environment.
>>
>>2092441
Where did I insult you personally? I may have insulted your retarded ideology but not you yourself. Because I don’t know you. But you’ve made the (most likely a projection of yourself because all “fascists” are miserable, empty, bugmen larpers) assumption Im a “slave, brooding in emptiness”
If this is where your writers get you in the argumentation stakes, I’d probably give up if I were you lol.
I will continue to live for my friends and family anon, I’m sure you can say the same, right? :^)
>>
>>2092444
> Eco-facism is a meme internet ideology. Facism and capitalism go hand in hand you cringe dolts

Started by calling us cringe, so yes you did immediately resort to personal insults. And I’m happy for you that you live for your friends and family, so do I. I hope you don’t consider that an accomplishment because it’s not, that’s normal. It seems that I touched a nerve when I called your life empty, you either feel like that and know it or it’s something that you’ve buried deep down inside of you but are aware of in the back of your mind. I’ve heard Prozac helps.
>>
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>>2092024
>>
>>2092448
You’re seething on a yak milking forum because someone didn’t like your ideology. Yet I’m the empty one lol. Keep doing your armchair psychology bro, whatever helps you sleep at night
>>
>>2092451
I’m pretty calm and am enjoying the back and forth, good way to kill time while waiting for my girlfriend to get back home from work. Maybe you should actually read some books about the ideology instead of just assuming everything is just a meme.
>>
>>2092401
My idea of nationalism (I don't really call it fascism) is free enterprise but regulated in the interests of the nation and its people. Utilities and natural monopolies are centralised, everything else is business as usual as long as it doesn't harm the nation including it's ecology and citizens. R8
>>
>>2092371
Nuclear power has a 100% chance of contamination. Even if it doesn’t explode we still have to do something with the toxic waste. There is nowhere to put it except the earth. It has to go somewhere and don’t say shoot it into spqce because that’s never going to happen.
>>
>>2092455
9/10 would be okay with as a libertarian. There is quite literally nothing wrong with a government protecting economic borders.
>>
>>2092455
Bu friend free enterprise has killed the environment too. We need to deindustrialize, and that means eliminating free enterprise beyond the local level.
>>
>>2092083
Corporations made that move on their own, specifically because we voted that they shouldn't be allowed to fuck up the planet. We don't have control over those other places, that's why the corporations moved their pollution there

Framing it this way is a bigger lie than "immigrants do jobs americans don't want to!"
>>
>>2092458
Libertarians literally want to dismantle economic borders. They want to dismantle EVERYTHING and sell it to the highest bidder- anything to take things out of the hands of voters and put it into the hands of the international elite and banking cartel. That is what "small government" means.
>>
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>>2092457
Damn right, all those nuclear waste dumps that are destroying the earth...
>muh contamination
okay? when chernobyl of all places is more or less habitable after less than a century, minescule levels of contamination is literally a non issue.
>>
>>2092444
>>2092427
You have never even seen a living fascist on television.
>>
>>2092431
>Commercial fishermen
Dragfags can get fucked.
T. Former Fisher
>>
>>2092462
You're thinking of ancaps retard
>>
>>2092466
Isn’t economic deregulation/the rise of corporatism how we got in this mess in the first place?
>>
>>2092468
>corporatism
God I hate newspeak.
It's a combination of corruption/cultural apathy/crippling lack of personal responsibility. The idea is to stop relying on the government like it's a parent and be responsible ourselves.
Seriously learn what the libertarian ideology actually is, and not what literal fucking communists tell you it is. It's basically nationalism influenced by the enlightenment.
>>
>>2092472
Libertarians, just like communists want open borders
>>
>>2092481
No they don't, and no they don't. Neolibs are not communists and neocons are not libertarians.
The people you're thinking of this time, are jews.
>>
>>2092460
Maybe you misunderstood, the enterprising would be free insofar as it falls within regulations of not harming the nations ecology or the interests of its citizens. The industrial revolution was and has been a tragedy but why not take the good from it and dispense with the rest? I know I personally want to have time outside of surviving as a working man, to be close to nature. Without various industrial developments that would be impossible.
>>
>>2092463
>chernobyl
>inhabitable
Not quite friend. Samosely live there but you wouldn't want young people living there or eating produce from there. Samosely are all quite old.
>>
>>2092515
I get what you’re saying now and while it seems like a more realistic approach, it still has a lot of major problems. For one thing most of the major companies in the US aren’t doing direct damage to our countries environment anymore, they’ve shipped that destruction overseas which is equally bad. Secondly while I believe in eco-fascism is the only real way forward, I know it’s not ever going to happen in this country or any country specifically because people are to comfortable with the benefits of an industrialized society. In my opinion the only way to combat that comfort is to hammer on the drawbacks without mercy in the hopes society moves slightly away from the path that it’s currently on and we reach a point where a decent minority of people are living independent of society and causing minimal environmental damage, while the rest of society lives in a “green” industrialized state which will at least reduce environmental damage but obviously won’t completely end or reverse it.
>>
>>2092523
This would be the idea, people would have to accept not having so many trinkets and spending more money on necessities to keep them local and sustainable. Things don't make us happy anyway, people and quality time doing what we enjoy does. We need a philosopher king, a moral guide for the masses like Marcus Aurelius. The minority living closer to wilderness would likely be involved in low impact agriculture to feed the green industrial zones.

If everyone has purpose and the earnings to cover basics, with the right philosophy and spiritual/religious outlook, people would be much happier and healthier and wouldn't be drawn to shit like communism or consumerism. Just my 2c developing on the idea. Lets start a political movement.
>>
>>2092541
The problem is that people living in those green industrialized cities aren’t likely to give up the consumption of worthless shit, which means that other nations will continue to have their environments raped. I currently work as a manager for Amazon on the phones and can see the order history of any account I’m on the phone with (or care to look up), people buy soooooo much worthless shit constantly and it’s only gotten worse since Covid-19. I agree that the only way you’re going to be able to stop people from doing this is by providing them a higher purpose, but unfortunately I don’t think any would stick as consumption culture is to deeply ingrained in people’s lives.

I’d love to start a political movement. But thing anything with fascism in its name would get you banned from politics because of the Nazis, and anything with environmentalism in its name draws in communists and open borders types which are antithetical to environmentalism. Best thing that could happen is to infiltrate the Democratic and Republican parties and start pushing this shit from their platforms.
>>
>>2092024
>windmills make economic sense!
Take away the subsidies they would be all gone. The cost of maintenance obliterates any value from energy production.
>>
>>2092024
Boo-hoo nigga, environmental destruction is a fact of life
>>
Just to be clear since most people here don’t seem to realize this: any leftie who isn’t a total retard is anti USSR communism. Yes they fucked the environment as much if not more than the US in the same time period pic related. So saying that the USSR didn’t care about the environment is not the gotcha against marxists/leftists that you think it is.

People who are pro USSR or CCP are called tankies and should get the wall along with fascists, capitalists, and trumpanzees.
>>
Nuclear, especially thorium, is the only hope for the human race
Shame there is a such a retarded stigma against it
>muh three mile island
>muh fukushima
>muh chernobyl
tfw no one died at 3 mile and studies show no increased cancer rate compared to the rest of the state
tfw no one died at fukushima aside from those in the tsunami and the panic
tfw Chernobyl only happened because of corner cutting and communist retardation
>>
>>2092619
Based brainwashed “capitalist” retard
>>
>>2092586
Take away fossil fuels and they couldn't even make windmills
>>
>>2092650
you're a fucking idiot.
>>
>>2092457
>the U.S. has produced roughly 83,000 metrics tons of used fuel since the 1950s—and all of it could fit on a single football field at a depth of less than 10 yards.
>>
>>2092650
Eh, actually kind of based. I mentioned earlier in the thread , the Soviet Union is literally the reason the Aral sea dried up, in other massive environmental catastrophe.
Really all we need is some level of regulation to prevent further destruction of native environments, and vigilant citizens ready to stand up for their home, in other words the power and the people, not that I am not leery of government overreach, but they are the ones with institutional power.
>>
>>2092549
My arm will be called the Australian Democratic Nationals
>>
>>2092586
Energy production should be centralised. It's not a fucking commodity m8 you nestle type faggots wanna own all the fresh water and probably oxygen after that.
>>
>>2092650
Yeah never mind all the lefties who identify as stalinist or trotskyist or maoist dumb tankie
>>
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We should focus on the eastern menace as well as start more widespread use of nuclear power. Going back to monkey is a pipedream, reducing global population and doing away with fossil fuels is a possibility.
>>
>>2092030
all the poles I know grew up in poland
>>
>>2092129
but soil ecosystem collapses entirely
>>
>>2092406
>An eco-fascist government would seek to eliminate corporations outright and deindustrialize as quickly as possible. Illegal immigrants would be deported and borders would be closed off to migration. Urban centers would be dismantled.
And then they would get "liberated" by their neighbours. Ecofascism is not an evolutionary stable strategy.
>>
>>2092139
>Environmentalism is fundamentally antihumanism.
When taken to the extreme?
Sure.
You can be a bit more moderate about it and only scale down things down to the point where it becomes "sustainable" (i.e. only use shit that can be regrown and only as fast as you can grow more of it)
And right now...there are too many humans (or sub-humans if that's more your thing), it's one thing to have 1 billion people, 2 billion people...4 billion people. It's different when all of them expect (or slowly tend toward) an hyper-consumerist lifestyle.
You can't argue against the fact that there's only one fucking planet Earth and it has limits. That and that capitalism as a system is inherently wasteful even of limited resources in its pursuit of profit.
>>
>>2092684
>Socialism totally works, guys. Trust the plan
>>
>>2092650
God damn I hate communists so much. You do realize Marxism/Communism is an ideology that literally revolves around fucking industrialization right? Have you people never actually read any communist lit? You’re all so god damn stupid and any future attempt as a communist government will lead to much of the same environmental destruction as all the others have.

>>2092706
Disagree, at least in America’s case. An invasion of America by its neighbors is impossible because Mexico and Canada are in no way capable of doing so and never will be. Foreign powers may make an attempt but this country is filled to the brim with guns and people willing to use them, imagine Afghanistan but a million times worse. I do agree though that most countries undergoing such a transition would be vulnerable to invasion, which is among the many reasons why I’m a realist about this and understand it won’t ever happen even if it should. Like I said my realistic best case scenario is a cultural movement emerging where a decent minority of people remove themselves from modern life and focus on independence from society.
>>
>>2092024
liberals stop making bait on my board
>leftists are just edgy liberals
>>
>>2092024
This should only be allowed if the mining company restores all the soil and plants trees afterwards.
>>
>>2092024
How do you make windmills without mining?
>>
>>2092674
literally smaller than your local wallshart
No reason it can't be stored underground in the middle of nevada and used as fuel in thorium salt reactors when we get them up and running
>>
>>2092375
Nobody is, the argument I made that Anon is replying to is that both capitalist and communists of various types only pretend to care about the environment to push their own economic ideology when both are equally as fucking terrible for the planet.

>>2092401
Eco-fascism is such a poorly defined ideology (in terms of how it is applied in discussion) that it is essentially meaningless. Depending on who you ask Eco-fascism could literally just be greenpeace or it could be the (literal and more correct sense) use of Fascism to preserve nature.

>>2092418
This, people always think they're immune to propaganda from their own side, reality is they just don't know how to spot propaganda.

>>2092139
Eh no, you can still be pro-human (as in wanting a continued existence for humanity) without encouraging overpopulation and consumption to excess which are ultimately the main causes of the current state of affairs.

>>2092650
So which communist do you support then? I'm guessing it's not China or North Korea.
I honestly can't think of any communist nation that isn't also guilty of equal environmental crimes. The Aral sea is just the best example.
>>
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>>2092230
>clear cutting or logging of an area
>is an invitation for invasives to take over
So are Californians
>>
>>2092398
So which 4 hour period of the day would you prefer for your no-electricity allocation
>>
>>2092714
Low IQ take on my post (((shapiro)))
>>
>>2092054
It's the natural endpoint of christian morality.
>>
>>2092718
Incorrect. You really should actually read some Marx because he’s totally based.

For one he decried industry for how it centered the means on production in the few and alienated the working class from any sense of autonomy. Also one of the main points in das capital is that capitalism is inherently unsustainable because it relies on increased production and consumption despite the fact that resources will always be limited. He writes extensively about how capitalism will eventually catastrophically fail once resources run dry and society will return to a state of barbarism. He also writes about how based native Americans were because they lived communally and practiced subsistance resources extraction opposed to the accumulation of mass surpluses. I could go on. Seriously annon, try to rid yourself of Cold War era propaganda and read some Marx.

Tankie communism is anti Marx for the major reason that it takes on capitalist qualities to compete with capitalist nations. They’re essentially just state run capitalism and share little in common with what Marx was theorizing. Marxism scares a lot of people because it is a total revamp of society into something not based on wanton resource extraction, production, and consumption but we need radical changes if we want the earth to survive with any semblance of its natural beauty or for humans to gain and form of autonomy and dignity.
>>
>>2092866
How much did you pay to retard yourself college boy?
>>
>>2092024
It'd be less misleading if both of the photos were from the same time of the year. Second photo makes it seem that all the trees have died, while it's only winter.
>>
>>2092866
You’re dead wrong and again clearly haven’t read Marx, or if you have you didn’t understand most of what he wrote. Marx never once calls for an end to industrialization and only considered Native Americans “based” because many tribes lived in a communal setting, which he considered primitive communism. Marxism is an industrialized ideology and you’re lying to yourself if you think otherwise. Sad I need to tell a communist to go read Das Kapital for fucks sake.
>>
> Is there any greater evil than Mountaintop Removal Mining?
One way use of life, products and enviroment. In short, the Fossil fuel age. Let me guess, this is our entire lifetime eh?
>>
>>2092129
>Lausitz
These lakes look nice, but there are almost no fish in it because they are acidic. The mining water is also full of iron which seeps into every creek, killing all the trout. They did the best they could, but it's still crap if you look closely.
>>
>>2092872
I never said he did call for an end to industry. He did call for totally different organization of industry that would not succumb to the inherent pitfalls of capitalism and therefore be more environmentally sustainable.
>>
politics is for the past.-
>>
>>2092024
The only correct answer is being an atom chad
/thread
>>
>>2092892
de·lu·sion·al
/dəˈlo͞oZH(ə)nəl/
adjective
characterized by or holding idiosyncratic beliefs or impressions that are contradicted by reality or rational argument, typically as a symptom of mental disorder
>>
>>2092783
you can't

but you can require cleaning up/repairing the landscape as best as possible after the mining operation
>>
>>2092962
Lol you’re the one who said I don’t comprehend Marx all while you don’t even have the reading comprehension level to understand posts on 4chan. Cold War boomers did a good job cucking you into simping for a self destructive ideology.
>>
>>2092461
>specifically because we voted that they shouldn't be allowed to fuck up the planet.
Wrong. American laws do not govern the planet. The corporations moved because environmentalism became important in the West, specifically. Environmentalism as we know it in the West relies on globalism to shuttle the problem elsewhere. Do you not know about the numerous municipal "recycling programs" that ended up being simply shipping/logistics companies, that removed waste from Western nations and dropped it in Bangladesh, India, etc.?
The point is that the motive behind most of the cries to regulate come from the desire to offshore the more environmentally dirty processes to nations which no not have the restrictions on manufacturing, in order to lower costs and increase profits for companies that are big enough to straddle the globe. The West is better able to handle the impact to the environment through technology and regulation, so it would be less damaging to the environment to pursue those industries here, where we can oversee it.
But, citiots would rather protest a pipeline and have a cool plastic bin to put their sandwich wrapper into so they feel better about themselves, rather than approach the problem intelligently and honestly.
>>
>>2092987
Literally the entire time I’ve been in here I’ve been saying capitalists need to hang with the communists. You’re retarded and your ideology is the biggest threat to the environment compared to any others.
>>
>>2092892
>Broooo it's a different strain of industry, just try it bro

No, industrial society will never be compatible with nature, there is simply no accountability for industry within an industrial society. The great machine of industry is simply free to do as it pleases to the environment whether under communism or capitalism.
>>
>>2093016
Real capitalism has never been tried
>>
>>2093111
It sure if you’re a faggot communist being sarcastic or a libertarian being retarded. Either way it’s been pretty fucking close and has had horrible effects on the individual and their mental well-being. Communists and Capitalists will hang together.
>>
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>>2093181
We all thought he was a bot, this is the non updated chart
>>
>>2093214
Are you in a discord? I have talked to jannies about his shilling, but I didn't know he spammed /out/ too. I am 100% certain this is the same person
>>
>>2092133
Black people make bad financial decisions and self interested white people hire poor whites for higher wages/more often than poor blacks, so when environmental degredation ruins a space, those who can move out (most often whites) move out and poor blacks take over the "low income housing" created by the blight.
>>
>>2093223
No, but if you want to find DC anon look in the appalachian threads and the Amish thread. He posts in every thread but sticks around for a few.
>>
>>2092651
This.
Molton Salt or GTFO.
>>
>>2093233
or wait for him to spam /pol/ with links to his faggot discord
>>
>>2092834
Yeah if I can describe todays society in one word, Christian and Moral are definitely not the first two words that come to my head.

Explain all the shitholes being non-christian too.
>>
>>2093265
>taking obvious bait
>>
>>2093242
You are obsessed with a guy you think is a homo, come out of the closet fag
>>
>>2093272
HI Dc anon
>>
>>2093272
You hate venomous spiders you must be one
>>
>>2093272
>a guy you think is a homo
He is though...
>>
>>2092024
Right looks better 2bh
>>
>>2093282
Why are you obsessed with a homo ? Are you a homo?
>>
>>2092024
I bet you drool over the grand canyon. How do you think it got like that? A river? Lmfao
>>
>>2093342
Loled.
>>
>>2093316
Closeted gay men are much more likely to express homophobic views and men who express negative sentiments about gays are more likely to show penile arousal to gay porn than men who aren’t negative about gay people.
>>
>>2093358
Yeah, and lesbians who hate men actually love men, they just need a good dicking.
>>
>>2093362
women are walletsexual
>>
>>2092039
Oldest in the world
>>
>>2093181
We hate him here, and would welcome any effort to rid us of this pest
>>
>>2093358
All normal men and women despise homos because they are dangerous to the tribe and kill children and transmit disease you are just spouting commie propaganda
>>
>>2093373
You hate the figment of some schizos imagination
>>
>>2093492
Poor bait
>>
>>2092110
>reputable
>sociology

Good one retard.

Be careful telling the /pol mfs that coal kills minorities they'll start burning it in their backyards.
>>
>>2092374
Retard. If you want to supply your own power you can buy solar for your house if you really want. You can't power the entite grid with a de-centralized system like that unless you want industry to cease 100%. You would need 100's of windmills to power the industrial sector of any given city and that requires expensive land and/or devastation on the environment. Solar is even worse/less efficient mass scale. And all of the above require toxic and horrrible materials to be mined to exist in the first place. You'll end up with 100x the waste and less efficiency.

Nucleur accidents are a meme. Less people have died from nucleur accidents than any form of power generation on average. More mfs die falling off rooves installing solar, building solar, repairing windmills, etc. Your anti-nuke points are gay and so are you.
>>
>>2093494
>i saw a schizo meme picture it must be true

Keep chasing shadows larper
>>
>>2093516
>You'll end up with 100x the waste and less efficiency.

Why does that matter?
>>
>>2092086
>read theory
Too obvious now.
>>
QRD
>capitalism is actually bad for the environment
>communists pretend to care for the environment, also, “read theory” is a meme, because shrimp dicked faggots spinning around in their office chairs philosophizing is not the same as actual practice. Theory <<< practice.
>same deal with eco-fascism. “Hey, let’s slap, “eco” onto fascism to make it more palatable
Reject modernity. Embrace monke. Go back to city states and small tribal villages.
>>
>>2093358
Dude spiders lmoa
>>
>>2092686
yeah, they are called tankies idiot. along with hoxhaists and dengists which you didnt mention. (trotskyists are not really tankies imo but whatever) tankies obviously dont call themselves like that and identify as leftists cause their ideology sprang from leftist spheres
>>
>>2092139
fuck humanist thought. all my homies are deep ecology egoists
>>
>>2094152
>>2094171
Retards who can't run their own life think they can solve the world's problems. Start by cleaning your room
>>
>>2092024
You forgot some crucial steps:
>Reneg on your deal to clean up after you make a mess
>Spend millions of dollars on legal expenses and consultants that claim you don’t need to clean it up as much as the EPA says you do
>End up passing the bill onto the taxpayer
>>
I blame GDP. It's too short sighted a measure. The US and Europe need to wake up and move away from GDP asap and adopt an index that takes into account a broader range of factors.
>>2092129
>all types of woodland are the same and totally interchangeable
>>
>>2095110
Oh look another big government bootlicker who is shocked the government is corrupt and incompetent but still demands more government
>>
>>2092834
>come to Earth 2000 years ago
>you and your disciples spend most of your tine traveling through and living in the wilderness
>teach the poor and downtrodden masses that greed and wealth breed evil
>tell them that happiness comes from simple living, love for God and Creation, and brotherhood
>killed by greedy elite after you hurt their bottom line
>some atheist from r*ddit spouts nonsense that you are the reason for greedy secular corporations
>>
>>2092995
You are a retard. All you did was reiterate what the anon said. Can you read?
>>
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>>2092834
Get a load of this retard straight from the depths of plebbit
>>
>>2092619
Environmental destruction is a byproduct of a consumption-driven globalized world order. Every government is competing for the most growth in population and industry because it generates dollars, which means grinding up natural resources to feed the machine.
>>
>>2095130
Clearly he never read Martin Luther's book "On the jews and their lies"
>>
>>2095137
Maybe if you cry more on your iphone your carbon footprint will disappear like your precious amazon rainforest you are cutting diwn
>>
>>2095149
The real solution is the same as it is for most of society's problems: kill politicians. I'm too much of a comfy coward though so i'll probably just get killed by the cops when they come for me alone over taxes or some gay shit. I never thought i'd side with scumbag leftists but here we are.
>>
>>2095130
Nobody brought up Jesus, the other guy said "christian morality" which was invented after him. In fact, I've never met an atheist that ever criticized his teachings at all.
>>
>>2095156
You’re a fool if you think we need to stop at the politicians. Your neighbors need to die, half your family needs to die, everyone in Brazil and Indonesia needs to die. A lot of people need to die.
>>
>>2092066
>Capitalist
>implying they wouldn't do the same shit in any other system
Retard, maybe even American.
>>
>>2095192
People like you never actually look at the hogs eating all the pie, just the crumb eaters. Consumption data is public to find, and just a few hundred thousand people, or less even than that, on this planet are responsible for the destruction and consumption of nearly all the resources on it
>>
>>2095156
Going after politicians isn't a leftist motion.
>>
>>2095209
Because all politicians are leftists so only commi retards kill their own
>>
>>2095209
You're right, i'm not sure where i got the idea that leftists would ever do a single god damn thing that isn't explicitly in the interests of the current hegemoney of amoral stateless 1%ers. Even the dip shit BACK THE BLOOOOOO boomers do more good sitting on their fat worthless asses and cheering on the state's thugs.
>>
>>2095205
AHAHAHAHAHA YOU’RE SO WRONG IT HURTS AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HOLY FUCK.
>>
>>2095261
Not an argument
>>
>>2095123
Oh look, another corporate cocksucker who thinks businesses should be able to do as they please
>>
>>2095276
I don’t need to argue with poor or the retarded, it’s better to laugh at them.
>>
>>2092457
If people weren't sacred of it and it got investment we could have thorium reactors and fusion power which would both reduce waste to almost nothing
>>
>>2095636
How cute, you think the people are in charge of ZOG
>>
>>2095647
More to do with public reaction than being in charge
>>
>>2092457
A single large nuclear reactor plant can take the equivalent of 80 million co2 emitting vehicles off the road for a one year period over a 30 year operating cycle and power roughly 1 million *American* homes completely year round. All while generating enough waste product to fit in an area smaller than a 1 acre plot size without being double stacked over that whole 30 year period, and that waste can be further used to power thorium reactors for decades which themselves generate even less waste and less radioactive waste than conventional plutonium-uranium reactors.

You could put it deep underground below the water table and it will essentially never interact with the surface and continue to be buried deeper over millions of years, but why do that when you could already use most of the present nuclear waste to power thorium cycle reactors for decades or centuries. Public opinion is often severely misinformed and utterly stupid when it comes to nuclear all because of a couple of preventable high profile accidents over the entire 80 year history of nuclear reactors.
>>
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>>2095130
yeah because christians have always applied Jesus's teaching about simple living.
>>
>>2092024
damn, that picture is disgusting. Someone should be hanged for that
>>
>>2095936
Start with yourself hypocrite
>>
>>2092457
0% because gen 5 is waste-free.
>>
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>>2092024
>>2092371
>>2093516
Windmills don't just make noise, it genocide birds and insect, and fuck you health but citfyfags don't care about the rural villages. Place those fuckers in the City but not in nature. And you know what? The Windmill Industry Lobby doesn't care about those people, they are the biggest faggots on the planet, supported by "green energy" fanatics. They telling our gov for years, that windmills don't harm anyone.

>muh just build them in nature
To build a Windmill you need a asphalt street and this isn't just temporary, they replace parts every few years. Gratz, now you have the entire nature full of windmills and asphalt streets. Beside the effect on animals near the windmill.

Just look what happenend in Europe you stupid Burgers. We already tried everything for you guys out, from socialism to "green energy", nothing work. But still half of you country want that shit.
>>
>>2096013
You are one dumb ass mother fucker. May god have mercy on your soul.
>>
>>2096013

Yep windmills are why germany and most of europe has the highest electric rates in the world. Never trust a childless female
https://www.statista.com/statistics/263492/electricity-prices-in-selected-countries/
>>
>>2092086
>read theory
Read Ted instead.
>>
>>2096105
>Read Ted instead.

https://archive.is/djx7I

In the psychiatric evaluation, Johnson reveals that Kaczynski had persistent and intense sexual fantasies about being a woman. While he was a graduate student at the University of Michigan in 1967, he went to a psychiatrist to discuss his wishes for a sex change operation. But in the waiting room, he decided he could not go forward. Instead, he told the psychiatrist he was depressed about the possibility of being drafted.

His near confession of his feelings so filled him with rage, in this case directed at psychiatrists, that he went through a major transformation.

"As I walked away from the building afterwards," Kaczynski wrote in documents released today, "I felt disgusted about what my uncontrolled sexual cravings had almost led me to do. And I felt humiliated, and I violently hated the psychiatrist. Just then there came a major turning point in my life. Like a Phoenix, I burst from the ashes of my despair to a glorious new hope."

Kaczynski's new hope? To take his rage out on others, including the psychiatrist. "I will kill," Kaczynski wrote. "But I will make at least some effort to avoid detection so that I can kill again."
>>
>>2096107
>>
>>2096039
how do windmills make electric prices higher? or are you being sarcastic??
>>
>>2096013
You've seen multiple tons of bugs and feathers on the ground all around each and every windmill everywhere ever?
>>
>>2096336
Because wind and solar power costs 4 times as much as gas , coal or nuclear college boy and that doesn't even factor in massive subsidies for windmill
>>
>>2096469
what’s a nuclear college boy
>>
>>2096482
A college retard
>>
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>>2096469
Why does it cost more? The cost to build it is more than coal & nuclear 24/7 upkeep and 24/7 employee pay? I don't see how that is. Constantly digging coal costs less than wind? Or did you just read a NYTimes article?
>>
I work in windmill in my country with the latest technology you guys aren't prepared to be blacpilled.
Coal and hydro still the best wind energy is a joke and money wash thing.
>>
>>2096773
>than wind? Or did you just read a NYTimes article?
>>2096896
This is me.>>2096896
Okay I'm gonna say some facts that you can ask for anyone who works in Winfields.
>Wind turbines only works for 20 years
>Wind turbines only works 3 months of the year
>the rest of the year we just shutdown so we don't lose the money repaying and buying more pieces
>It take 10 years to repay the full price one wind turbines in energy.
>you can only construct in like 0,01% of the land in the world to be able to produce energy
>it's actually a money wash thing
>does not create highskill jobs and don't bring money to the region
>it kills a lot of birds and change the wind currents

Maybe in 200 years we will have good windturbines, but in the actual situation is just a scam.
>>
>>2095104
Great input.
>>
>>2093370
>nursing home mountains is a good thing
>>
>>2096107
>t. tranny butthurt that Ted saw through this shit
Join the 40%, troon.

>>2096108
Just wait for the encore.
>HE WAS PART OF MKULTRA!!
>>
People on welfare are a greater evil than cutting a few trees on a mountain, at least the trees or rocks that get harvested have a use whereas jobless envirotards are literally killing the planet
>>
>>2097034
>not collecting as much welfare as possible
Take back your tax dollars one way or another, and put strain on the treasury.
>>
>>2097034
this is what /pol/ does to your brain
>>
>>2096896
>>2096902
Wind: 11g of CO2 per KWH.
Nuclear: 12g of CO2 per KWH.
Coal: 980g of CO2 per KWH.
It's like you literally avoided looking up the actual fucking data because you knew it would prove you're full of shit.
>>
>>2096896
>>2096902

"The assertion that wind turbines don't reduce carbon emissions is a myth, according to conclusive statistical data obtained from National Grid and analysed here in the Guardian for the first time. With a new wind generation record of 4,131 megawatts set on 14 September, the question of how far the UK's wind generation fleet can help in meeting our climate targets is increasingly controversial. Now it can be shown that the sceptics who lobby against wind simply have their facts wrong."

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/environment/blog/2012/sep/26/myth-wind-turbines-carbon-emissions
>>
>>2092371
The Uranium still has to be mined from somewhere.
Nonetheless Uranium mines have less of an environmental footprint than Windmills, Solar Panels or Hydro dams.
>>
>>2097157
>Source Big government and fake news

There is nothing dumber than a college boy
>>
>>2097228
There's no retard like a retard with a chip on his shoulder about his total lack of education. You can have your opinion, retard, but you can't have your own facts. You're. Fucking. Wrong.
>>
>>2097165
Nuclear and wind are extremely comparable in terms of total emissions.
>>
>>2097237
Not him, but can you independently verify the results of the study for me? Congratulations on your ability to sit in a classroom and follow instructions, by the way. Really. I mean it.
>>
>>2097237
Lmao the college boy thinks he got educated . All you did was prove that you would believe whatever they told you and prove that you can't think for yourself, you are just a compliant puppet that's why you idiots can switch from global cooling to global warming to global the climate is changing and we are all going to die in three years unless we get locked in our wagie cages
>>
>>2097258
If you went to school, then you have an education. The problems begin when people conflate having an education with being intelligent, or wise.
>>
>>2097302
No the problem begins when thick cunts think their opinion matters
>>
>>2097385
Whose opinion matters?
>>
>>2097433
The people clever enough and educated enough to see the problem and want to solve it. The thick cunts who watch Hannity and vote Trump don't have an opinion that counts, they're just fucking obstacles to solving the problem.
>>
>>2097545
>educated enough
Anyone capable of taking out a loan is, “educated” yet lord knows how many of those people are insufficiently clever to pay the loan back.
>>
>>2092139
based
>>
>>2097545
What about people who watch the Daily Show and John Oliver? Do their opinions matter?
>>
>>2092024
Yeah, the company saying they will do the minimal rehab, and then skipping out on that too
>>
>>2096469
Nope
Australia's wholesale electricity prices are the lowest they have ever been thanks to the addition of solar, wind and battery storage. So much so that it's forcing coal plants to shut down earlier because they become too costly to run. That's right, a coal power plant now costs more to run because of how inefficient they are. Even if we built a modern coal plant from scratch, it would not lower costs as much as an equal investment in solar and batteries. Infact it would likely raise power prices.
It was good while it lasted, but the age of coal is over
>>
>>2097986
Most cities are not near an ocean in the desert anon
>>
>>2097990
Roof top solar played a crucial part in solar uptake. Mine wipes out my usage and gives me a credit each quarter.
You own a house, right?
>>
>>2098002
My point is that renewable energy prices can only compete with coal when you have perfect geographical conditions, which most Australian cities do.
>>
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>>2098002
>You own a house, right?
>>
>>2098010
I prefer to eat avocado toast.
>>
>>2098002
Good job milking the taxpayers and sending money to china and destroying the environment to virtue signal
>>
>>2098012
On quinoa bread, organic, of course.
>>
>>2098022
willing to run his own country into the ground extracting fossil fuels to own the libs
>>
>>2098005
Ironically most of the US also has geographical advantages for renewables as well and nuclear but many states are having difficulty transitioning because people tend to lose jobs in the initial transition or protest to anything nuclear in their backyard. From the great plains westward the US has some of highest solar irradiance and wind potential in the world on top of large uranium deposits and already existing large hydro projects. It also has massive fossil fuel reserves to so there's an overabundance of choices but the current infrastructure is geared towards the fossil fuels.
>>
>>2098022
Coal miners not paying their taxes > any solar rebate ever
>>
>>2098005
>perfect geographical conditions
What do you mean? water in front, tiny mountains behind ? Isnt that every US city on the east and west coast?
Or just sparsely populated centre? Isnt that the whole american mid west ?
>>
>>2098042
Renewables don't make much sense on large scale. Let's do some math.

1 nuclear power plant uses 360 times less land area than an equivalent wind farm. To match the power output of one average nuclear power plant, you would need ~468 square miles of wind mills. There are 88 nuclear power plants currently in operation in the US. To replace them all with wind farms, you would need ~31,680 square miles of land. And even then you would only be providing 20% of America's total energy output. To produce 100%, you would need a total of ~158,400 square miles.

Do you really think this is an environmentally friendly solution? Solar wouldn't be much different btw.
>>
>>2098032
It's ZOGs country you naive child
>>
>>2098057
>Solar wouldn't be much different btw.
3 acres per GWh with vs 26 acres with wind. Plus solar generates more power per acre when compared to wind (x8).
Wind power is just there for a dynamic power generation capability, solar + battery storage is where it's at if you want cheap and efficient energy that btfos everything else.
That's also discounting roof top solar, which anyone with a roof can do, no need to buy farm land or clear land.
>>
>>2098075
>>2098057
Would require 20,000 square miles of solar panels to power the US, half the size of the tiny Mojave desert.
Compare this with how much land the oil and gas and coal industry lease: 40,000 square miles and tell me again which industry doesn't work at scale
>>
>>2098075
>3 acres per GWh with vs 26 acres with wind.
The average nuclear power plant in the US produces 108GWh. So one nuclear power plant uses 47 times less land area than solar. Basically just divide the wind numbers by 7.6 and you'll get solar numbers - 20,842 square miles to produce 100% of the US's energy needs (this is being generous in terms of assuming the best current technology).

That's still about the equivalent of a land area the size of West Virginia, totally sterilized and void of any natural life. And that's just to MATCH what we already have, much less accounting for growth into the future.

>That's also discounting roof top solar, which anyone with a roof can do
Rooftop solar panels are a toy for rich people, and they're useless in a lot of geographical locations.
>>
>>2098077
This is bullshit. The best figures I could find from the most shilly pro-renewable website says that solar would take 2-3 times as much land area as fossil fuels.
>>
>>2098079
>toy for rich people,
A 6.6kw system costs less than $7k.
Pretty decent price for never having to pay for power again.
How is the cheaper option, the one where we aren't paying for fuel constantly, for rich people?
Feel free to stay cucked to fossil fuels and staying poor.
And don't kid yourself with nuclear. No investors are willing to stump up the cash for a power plant that takes a decade to build and start giving them a return on investment, when solar does straight away.
Which is why when old nuclear plants shut down, they don't get replaced with new ones.
>>
>>2098083
https://www.freeingenergy.com/how-much-solar-would-it-take-to-power-the-u-s/
First result in Google, using production figures from 2018.
>>
>>2098084
>The average U.S. home uses about 900 kWh per month. So that's 30 kWh per day or 1.25 kWh per hour.
You would need at least 5 of those, which would run you 35 grand. Do you have a spare 35 grand laying around? Plus you would still need to spend money maintaining them.

Is it the better option if you can afford it and live somewhere where you could actually utilize them to a decent extent? Absolutely. Is it feasible for the average American? No, not at all.
>>
>>2098087
Ok so the problem is that they use leased land instead of destroyed land. Most of that leased land is not sterile.
>>
>>2097155
>>2097157
I was like you guys, but upon entering in the wind industry you start to understand that they don't exist for a world with lesses CO2 (btw this wasn't and will never be a problem as a geologist I can asure ,you can throw millions of CO2 and the planet will find a way) they exist for first world countries pretend to be the good guys while investing 500x in thermoelectric and uranium.
Like I said windturbines are a joke and in 200 years we will have like 1% of the world energy made by wind.
>>
>>2098088
Ah, i think you have tripped yourself up with kilo watt and kilo watt hours. Don't worry, everyone does it.
A 6.6kw system will produce between 25-35 kwh a day.
This is with 18-20 panels, which will fit on a roof space about 40m2 or 400 sq feet. Average house has what, a 2000 sq foot roof ?
So absolutely feasible for the average American.
>>
>>2098089
Is the land used for solar sterile ? Considering you can get a third of the required area as roof top solar. The rest could be in any desert or field and easily dismantled to return the land to its original use. I say easier because what is it, some concrete and steel racks? Compared to even the most delicate mining operations, i know which site is rather rehabilitate
>>
All these niggas in here talking about how we can keep industrialized society powered with the sun and wind. Real niggas talking about how we can destroy industrialized society altogether.
>>
>>2098093
Not everyone wants to pay five times as much and constantly replace broken equipment so no it's not feasible
>>
>>2098255
Real people aren't larping here about destroying industrial society they are actually doing it by pushing green energy, democracy,wokism and other toxic ideologies
>>
I don't wanna live with this shit anymore bros
https://youtu.be/7pNJsckgsOI
>>
>>2098255
Based and Tedpilled.
>>
>>2098118
>Is the land used for solar sterile ?
Yes it is.

>Considering you can get a third of the required area as roof top solar.
You wouldn't though because A: It's private property, and B: no one is going to go around giving everyone free solar panels for their roofs

> The rest could be in any desert
Deserts contains tons of wildlife. Why are reptiles, scorpions and cactuses any less important than mountain lions, fish, and evergreens?

> to return the land to its original use.
Once you destroy local habitats they can never be restored to their former self. At best you would need to make a concerted effort to re-establish them, but we all know that would never happen because there's no profit in it.

Again, I'm not against renewable energy and I think it's great that some people have the means to go solar on their private property. Putting a few solar plants scattered around where it's most efficient and least destructive would be great. But right now the technology is just not there for full-scale power generation of the entire country. Nuclear is still the most realistic route for putting a real dent in greenhouse emissions without taking a massive toll on the surrounding environment. We'll figure out renewables eventually, but jumping the gun will cause irreparable environmental damage.
>>
>>2098328
You gay nigga.
>>
>>2098402
and i imagine you're too much of a brainlet to effectively insult.
>>
>>2098404
>t over socialized zogbot.

Uncle Ted can still save you from yourself friend.
>>
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>>2098093
Ok so you would still need two of those to account for peak hours since the figure I supplied was an average, and most people have little to no power usage during sleeping hours. That would run you $14k. If you don't think that's a lot of money you probably live in a bubble.

>The Federal Reserve reports that 39% of Americans don't have enough money on hand to cover a $400 emergency.
https://www.federalreserve.gov/publications/2019-economic-well-being-of-us-households-in-2018-dealing-with-unexpected-expenses.htm
>>
>>2098395
>A: It's private property, and B: no one is going to go around giving everyone free solar panels
Don't be retarded here anon. People have no reason not to make some money out of their rooftops. And they're going to rent out the space to companies if they don't have the money for it themselves.
>>
>>2098416
If power companies are renting every rooftop in America that would drive the cost of solar power even higher. It's just a roundabout transfer of wealth - you get some rent income, but you end up putting that right back into your power bill. Solves nothing.
>>
>>2098415
To be fair most Americans are dog shit with finances and put themselves in precarious situations like not being able to afford a $400 emergency. A lot of those same people who couldn’t afford a $400 emergency probably could qualify for financing $14k for solar or whatever as many of them somehow qualify to finance a $50k car.
>>
>>2098418
It solves the problem of not having space for your solar panels. And yes, power would become somewhat more expensive like that - but that will happen no matter which way we're trying to get off fossil fuels.
>>
>>2096028
>Yes, buy my green energy Windmill goy.
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>>2098430
>And yes, power would become somewhat more expensive like that - but that will happen no matter which way we're trying to get off fossil fuels.
It would end up being maybe 5-6 times higher. Who can afford a power bill that's almost the same price as their mortgage payments? Why is this a better solution than nuclear?
>>
>>2096773
>>2097155
>Wind: 11g of CO2 per KWH.
>Nuclear: 12g of CO2 per KWH.
>literally 1 single gramm difference
Windmill same as Solar can't operate 24/7. As example Germany needs to import energy from Poland and France from nuclear and coal because green energy is not reliable.

Why you shilling for this shit?
>>2096336
We pay that shit with extra taxes? 0.372 USD for a single kWh.
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>>2098438
>It would end up being maybe 5-6 times higher.
Source?
Either way anon, I never weighed in on this nuclear vs solar debate. All I'm saying is, you can make use of rooftop spaces if you let the market handle it. There are arguments against solar power, but this is not one of them. And rooftops are not the only dead spaces available.
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look anon we saved nature
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>>2098451
Renewable volatility is a problem. An extensive load management system could make it work, but the costs and loss of productivity would be considerable.
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>>2098302
Bro, it's 7 grand for a system that generates all the power you need.
I know people who have had them for the last 12 years and they be replace 0 panels so I got no idea what large scale maintenance you think needs to be done

>>2098395
Not as sterile as a coal or gas mine.
There's a beef farm near here with a mw worth of panels and old mates cows aren't bothered by the extra shade so you might have a different view of sterile than them.
>>2098415
>still need two
No, you don't.
Households are still connected to the power grid. They export power when they can and import power when they need too. Overall, the average house hold will get a CREDIT each quarter (the power company paying you) because they generate more than they use.
14k is a lot, but again you only need one 7k system. If you think turning your roof I to a money maker is a bad thing, you live in a bubble.
>39% Americans are poor
Yeah first world only because the US came up with the definition.
>>2098418
>>2098438
The thing is, with large scale solar adoption power prices come DOWN, not 5 times higher in price.
Solar panels on your roof physically earn you money while youre at work, pating themselves off withing 5-7 years. They make absolute financial sense for someone with a roof and a couple of brain cells.
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>>2092024
buy the land for cheap when they're done and bilk some lefties to reforest it
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>>2098866
Go shill your environmental cancer and financial suicide on reddit you college retard
>>
>>2098892
Lmao its called getting a trade. Enjoy starving to death with your mcjob
>>
>>2097027
Imagine angrily arguing about which mountains are good mountains over the internet

get fucked, you people are so goddamn insuferable
>>
>>2098909
I’ve lately become convinced that people on /out/ are the biggest snobs of any posters on any board.
>>
>>2098944
>>2098909
What do you expect when the average poster is in their 30s
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>>2098905
Haha the smug college retard has to work for a living
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>>2092024
The best answer is Thorium Power, but that makes too much sense, and the greenie commies need to get their political power from somewhere.

When the collapse comes, it will fix this problem. But it won't come for a while longer.
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>>2096107
>Trusting the government
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>>2092024
Just came to say fuck your faggy thread.
>t. posting from a coal mine
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>>2092024
Not my problem
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>>2099319
Enjoy your blacklung faggot
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>>2092793
Eucalyptus actually grows incredibly quickly....... But Yeh they are terrible in mono culture for Forest fires
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>>2092650
Fuck you
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>>2099359
Hasn't been a thing for like 100 years.
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>>2092024
>cutting down a few sq. mi of low quality second growth forest
>bulldozing a few hills (they're legally required to rebuild them after they're done mining)
>provide only real source of revenue for the region
No tears shed.
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>>2092448
>>2092451
>>2092454
whiny fucking bitches. never degrade yourself like this kids
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>>2100260
>they're legally required to rebuild them after they're done mining
Never happens tho, mine rehab is a joke. The funds are never there so we just do a half arsed job
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>>2092024
[spoiler]No![/spoiler]
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mines dont have to look horrible
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>>2092086
(((read theory)))
>>
global warming is fake
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>>2101174
It's not fake, it happens naturally.
The real problem is Co2 emissions and thinning of the ozone, Isaac Asimov spoke about that decades ago
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>>2101429
ozone is regenerating and set to fully recover in our lifetime
it was mostly lead based petroleum fuels that did a majority of the damage and have been outlawed for a long time now
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>>2096013
>muh nature
fields are hardly nature one would go to to enjoy anyways.
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>>2101439
the damage comes from literally fucking everything. industrial society is a blight on nature and the /out/.
>>
>>2101174
>Not pictured
>Several thousand other climatologists who say it's real
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>>2102417
Scientists, who are all trained seals,say what they are paid to say . None of them believe the big lie of global warming





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