https://youtu.be/IftyD7hnOqs?t=45Where does this schizophrenic narcissism come from for you to think you know better than people that have run this engine for thousands of hours in a facility like that? You think OEMs are going to risk ruining their reliability reputation and/or having to warranty replace tens of thousands of engines by recommending the wrong oil or an unreasonable change interval? Quit your Boomer "oil is cheaper than engines" and "that sissy oil is too light" horseshit and stop being a fucking faggot and do what the god damn book tells you you contrarian narcissistic retarded fucking faggot. Most of you retards blow your engines because you suck at driving and don't actually know shit about engineering and don't heat up and cool down your cars properly or run around town screaming the engine until it overheats and spins a bearing. That's your fault as a shitty fucking driver, not the oil.
>>26667231>You think OEMs are going to risk ruining their reliability reputation and/or having to warranty replace tens of thousands of engines by recommending the wrong oil or an unreasonable change interval? But that's the thing, they're not. By the time you've killed your engine by extending your oil change intervals a few thousand beyond ~5k or so, it's far beyond the 3 year/36k warranty. It'll be your problem, not theirs. >Quit your Boomer "oil is cheaper than engines" and "that sissy oil is too light" horseshitNo, because they engineer that shit for climates that actually get cold (unlike mine, so I don't need extremely thin oil for cold starts) and for eeking out miniscule amounts of fuel economy to make the car look better on paper. Oil is cheaper than an engine and you can't change my mind about that, why would I wait for the oil to wear its additive package out and shear thin before changing it, instead of always having good oil in it?>stop being a fucking faggot and do what the god damn book tells you you contrarian narcissistic retarded fucking faggot.If you actually read their service manuals, they usually recommend thicker oils for hotter climates and severe duty. >Most of you retards blow your engines because you suck at driving and don't actually know shit about engineering and don't heat up and cool down your cars properly or run around town screaming the engine until it overheats and spins a bearing. That's your fault as a shitty fucking driver, not the oil.I've never blown an engine and I do wait for it to reach operating temperature (not just the coolant!) before beating on it.
you're right it's mostly boomerlore like every other thing 'enthusiasts' believe
Big oil chads got ya seethin??
>>26667231Big yikes, get some fresh air my guy
why didn't you post this in the existing oil change thread? could it be because you're a pathetic attention whore?
>>26667257>3 year/36k warrantyWhat the fuck car has a 3 year/36k mile warranty anymore? When was the last time you bought a new car, if ever? The standard minimum is 5 year/60k for drivetrain and some go up to 10 year/100k.>why shouldn't I listen to my fear, uncertainty, and doubt instead of lab testingBecause you're a retard.>If you actually read their service manuals, they usually recommend thicker oils for hotter climates and severe duty.Some older cars did, most newer ones don't. Synthetic has advanced, your brain, sadly, has not.>I do wait for it to reach operating temperature (not just the coolant!)If your coolant is at standard operating temp, the oil is warm enough to flow as it needs to, it doesn't need to be searing hot to safely flow. A V8 tuner that is very reputable told me 110 F oil is sufficient to send it, and I get 110 F oil right as the coolant passes the 165 F mark, which is the lower end of standard operating temp (generally won't go below that on a cool day). Once again, proving you don't actually know sht but feel confident in second guessing people that know more than you.
>>26667294Because this discussion is why you think you know better than a testing lab and a manufacturer with their reputation on the line, specifically.And, honestly, I didn't even see that other thread, this is actually in reference to being tired of reading this shit over and over again across the internet. Why can't you faggots just do the book maintenance and shut up? Why does "enthusiast" always mean "second guesses everything a manufacturer tells you even though you have no sound reasoning for doing so other than paranoid schizophrenia"
>>26667312I'm second guessing them because they're in the business of selling me new cars and engines, not keeping the one they already sold me running forever. I'm not going to take worse care of my beloved shitbox because some retard on /o/ thinks I can run oil longer than Blackstone Labs told me was safe for my own car after several analyses. >just beat on your car before it's fully warmed up with ancient oil in it bro it'll be fine!Enjoy your prematurely worn engine. Now, I'm not saying "let it warm up before driving", that's old wives tale horseshit, after starting it and giving it a few seconds for oil pressure to build, you should drive it gently until it's warmed up. THEN beat on it.
>i put in 20-50 because5-30 instead of a weak 0-20 I understand, especially for more southern areas,But a 20-50 is definitely causing long term issues with the pump and bearings. Guaranteed.
I do 20w50 because I have a cast iron 4cyl running 30psi at 7500-8000rpms and the thicker oil helps save the oil pump gears during momentary oil pressure loss (high G corners) or detonationI'm running aftermarket rods and bearings with looser clearances already and the original 5w30 spec'd in 2003 is like piss water, even outside USA the spec was closer to 5w40.
>>26667324Blackstone labs tells pretty much everyone I've ever seen do a test that they're changing their oil twice as much as they need to, so please tell me what snowflake case you have where a more aggressive change is recommended. Popular Mechanics even had an article where a lawnmower owner didn't change his synthetic oil for 10 years and Blackstone said it just looked like some normal used oil and still had life left.>just beat on your car before it's fully warmed up with ancient oil in it bro it'll be fine!I've literally said in the original post that not warming and cooling an engine properly (easy driving at 50% revs/throttle or less) is why people are blowing engines. Nearly every case of an engine blowing I can think of that I've seen involved high G loads and oil sloshing without a baffled pan, hard driving while the engine was cold or excessively hot, oil contamination from some dumbass literally pouring coolant or brake fluid into the oil filler, oil contamination from a blown headgasket (from not properly warming and cooling the engine), some dumbass turning up boost with no supporting mods, etc. I've never once seen an engine blow from factory recommended oil change intervals with the correct oil and no shortcuts (i.e. not changing the filter for multiple oil changes) or an extreme service cycle like being a taxi in NYC with 95% idling time and going an average of 2 mph.I've never changed oil sooner than the book calls for and I've never had a mechanical failure of any kind on any car I've owned. I've only ever had weird electrical problems from a wire rubbing on the frame weird or possibly a rodent biting it. You are wasting your time and money based on wive's tales.
>>26667361>I completely changed everything about the engine so your comment about stock engines is dumbFucking really? No shit you should use a different oil on a completely rebuilt aftermarket engine.
>>26667361oil pressure should be increasing with rpm because the pump runs faster. are you absolutely sure you understand the engineering behind oil flow and pressure, how much you actually need for what you do, etc?cus i think you dont
>>26667389a 4 cyl with 30psi of boost is probably putting massively higher bearing loads that will then need a more viscous oil to keep them from contacting metal on metal. He also mentioned cornering loads causing oil slosh that may momentarily prevent oil from going in the pickup, though that should be remedied with a baffled pan.
>>26667383>so please tell me what snowflake case you have where a more aggressive change is recommended.It's a 25 year old Subaru with 224k miles, they recommended 5500 mile intervals with 10w40 Castrol Edge (10w40 being recommended in its owners manual for 0°F to 100° F+, where 5w30 was not recommended for 90° F+ where it spends a lot of time in). They did not like the sharp increase in wear metal content with a 7500 mile interval.>I've literally said in the original post that not warming and cooling an engine properlyThicker oils take longer to warm up. > You are wasting your time and money based on wive's tales.I'll take wasting money being better safe than sorry, rather than replacing an engine early because I took a gamble and lost by running oil too long. You're getting mad at me for maintaining my car too well, when you should be focusing on the retards that somehow forget to change their oil at all or do things like ignore metal on metal brake pads until the caliper explodes from overextending the piston or drive on bald dry rotted tires until they explode or send them careening into a ditch in the rain.
>>26667231>Drive commercial vehicles and use an oil life monitoring sensor. Ultrasonic oil sensors tracks viscosity and particulates, along with comparisons over lifetime of the current oil change vs prior oil changes.Why the fuck would you use some sort of dogmatic text or divination, when you can actually sense how good your oil is and change it accordingly? Are you retarded? Do you require someone to tell you to eat at a specified time? Breath at intervals? The future is fucking now old man, and now was back in 2008. Stop using consumer slop, and just buy a fucking aftermarket oil life sensor.Pic unrelated.
>>26667231IDK man, I used to agree with you. Now I am not sure. The reason OEMs would lie about the proper oil is because a lighter oil gets better MPG. Spread over hundred of thousands of vehicles it makes a significant change is gas emissions. My fiesta st required 5w-20, it ran way nicer with 5w-30. So I used 30. My 4.6 truck also says to use 5w-20. It runs way better on 5w-30. The thing with the truck is, it is the same engine used for years, and for years Ford said to us 5w-30. Then they changed to 5w-20. What would be a legitimate reason for that?
Just to put this out there most engines don't blow up due to running the "wrong" oil. Most blow up due to running no oil. The new engines have low tension rings those are great for power and fuel economy, but suck at keeping oil from entering the combustion chamber. For this reason all cars made in the past 15 years burn some oil. If your not checking your oil and going for very long services between changes it doesn't take a whole lot of excessive oil loss to suddenly find yourself in a situation where there is not enough oil in the pan for the engine to operate safely.
>>26667479The very last gasp of Oldsmobile. They had some cool shit here and there over their 100 year run.
Easy fix. just use Lucas Oil amirite
>>26667231Suck it tranny, everything I own gets either 0W40 or 15W40 and there’s nothing you can do
>>26667398ding ding ding dingit's a 420whp Evo 9 with a 4G63 and the oil is valvo vr1 20w50the clearances are old american v8-tier and the weak point is in its bearings and oil pump. the thicker viscosity adds additional film strength to the oil which gives more of a cushion in case of a detonation/low oil event. the viscosity actually doesn't add additional heat, and it takes effort to even get past 260f oil temp (avg is usually closer to 140-160f street driving)you can disagree until you're blue in the face but these cars dont last long and the engines with the least amount of wear have a 50w of some kind. the weak point is the bearings and the load placed on them. next engine build will be a stock shortblock or cheap h beams and low mass pistons (something like manleys rated for 150whp/cyl) to try to decrease rotating mass where possible in hopes of saving bearing life. the wiseco/manley turbo tuff combo it has now is proven to 250whp/cyl+ but weighs like a brick (almost same weight as stock rod/piston) and can beat on the bearingsI love VR1 because it has motorsports reputation/pedigree and costs $40 a oil change. I dump the oil every 1200-2000 miles or if it gets past 260F (track day with intense lapping). It has GTX Classic 20w50 atm I'm gonna dump soon after some street miles. >>26667522what he said, look at the absolute sludge they put in hot third world countries and the engines keep running.
i just blew up my fa20d but i know it was my fault
>>26667312>A V8 tuner that is very reputable told me 110 F oil is sufficient to send itOil has an operating temperature. Just because someone told you something doesn’t mean it’s true nobody can know everything.
>>26667231Book says every 8k and every 16k for the filter. Most shops give you a filter everytime you buy 4L of oil and my engine takes 2.7L. I do oil & filter every 4k but it's not religious, more at my convenience. 20yrs ago equivalent engines needed oil every 4k. I don't think that engine & oil technology has improved that much since then. I think that it's a cost saving measure as dealers will sell service packages with the vehicle and less frequent intervals saves them money. The consequences won't be faced by the first, second, or even third owners of the vehicle but I reckon it takes a 200k life engine down to 150k.
>>26667231Inb4 OP is portrayed as an angy wohjak derivative
>>26667361>I'm running aftermarket rods and bearings with looser clearancesWhy would you do something like this??
>>26667231You can't tell me what to do.Oh, and the manufacturers are incentivized to have longer oil change intervals. Then they can say "this care only costs 1000usd every year to maintain" or some shit.You can't stop me, it's my engine and my right.
>>26667897why don't you get a accusump if you're so concern about losing oil pressure
>>26667897140-160f is pretty fucking low, that oil isn't getting close to temp, have you thought about running lower weight when you daily it? if you're running e85 then your oil is probably getting really diluted with ethanol/water
>>26668182Because he's a retard wrenchlet who repeats shit he sees on forums, although he's usually ranting about suspension and not oil.
I think you guys know nothing about flow, pressure, viscosity, and the needs from clearance. And I think you guys run on voodoo-tier "knowledge" on the subject.If you're hitting 100PSI at your 8k redline your "loose" engine is fine.Turbos need a thinner oil and pressure regulation down to the 50s-60s anyways.
>>26668585the turbosmart OPR (oil pressure regulator) for turbos does 40psi. running one of those suckers because my engine makes 7 bar of oil pressure.got any source or reference for that thinner oil in turbos? I have some holset documents I could pull up on the subject if anyone's interested.
>>26667231weak bait from an unlearned wrenchlet.
>owners manual says ONLY USE 0W-20 OR ELSE ENGINE WILL EXPLODE!!!!>next page with specifications for 3rd world shipped cars has a graph showing which oil to use in which temperature range>0w-20 is for arctic tempsits for emissions
>>26668692>I have some holset documents I could pull up on the subject if anyone's interested.I am
>>26667257Even in cold temps thick oil is fine. 15w-40 is good down to -25 Celsius.
>>26668140because loose engines run better
>>26667231>"oil is cheaper than engines"this is an argument for changing your oil, not using heavy unspecified oil. some of these ultra thin modern oils are used simply because the decreased drag helps them in fuel economy ratings. on my 19 miata, 0w20 is recommended by mazda for the US and canada. for mexico, south america, all of europe, australia, russia, china, literally everywhere in the world they recommend 5w30. the difference between 0w20 and 5w30 isnt much but its enough that that they will sacrifice oil protection for fuel economy in the US and canadia. you cant say that the difference is due to climate because the climates of europe, mexico, south america, russia, and australia are completely different but Mazda still recommends 5w30 for all of them.
>>26668692>>26668905https://content.benzforce.com/HE221W.pdfthis is my source, there are ones for other holsets toohttps://files.catbox.moe/i4omlz.pdf backuppicrel, the relevant page
>>26668922Who says that bullshit?It gives you more wear and a lose of power.
>>26667231>he doesn't put shitbox oil in all his carsngmi
>>26669033That’s just a manual nothing that gives much insight sadly
>>266672315w20 every 5,000 and it's never been cheaper to amsoil your ride.
>>26667249Yes, you got a problem?
>>26669033>literally says load PSI should be at least 50>I said turbos need 50-60 regulation>you said:"does 40 PSI"
>>26667231I think it the manufacturer expects everyone to drive like a grandma and recommends oil for that application. However I think in summer If you drive hard bumping up a thickness is wise to avoid sheering and I think if you leave the car outside in winter thick oil will likewise will wear down an engine faster.With that said I typically just go recommnended
>>26669292oh.>>26669917ok and? what would you do in my position? has done 20k miles like this.
>>26670329sorry, meant for >>26670179
>>26667231>The book says to tighten the headbolts on my 7M-GE to 58ft-lbs.>I wouldn't dare claim to know better than the book.
>>26668967"Oil is cheaper than engines" was referring to 2,000 mile change intervals, retard.
>>266703611) an oil spec that was dyno tested for tens or even hundreds of thousands of miles is not in any way related to the torque figure of a single bolt on an assembly of hundreds if not thousands throughout the car. Next, let's compare C8 Corvette markups to the price of tea in China.2) does anyone know for certain that the factory worker didn't mis-calibrate their instruments when assembling the engines to cause the issue? Has anyone rebuilt an engine and used the original specified torque and had an issue? Doubt it.
>>266705011) it’s not the oil manufacturer that’s implementing the oil change but the engine manufacturer.2) they gave out new torque values themselves if I remember correctly.
>>266705381) I don't give a shit what the oil manufacturer says, the car manufacturer (or engine manufacturer if it's a borrowed engine) is the one that does the dyno testing2) HOLY SHIT, SOMEONE MADE A MISTAKE ONCE 40 FUCKING YEARS AGO, SOUND THE ALARM, THAT'S NOT ALLOWED! MAKING ONE TORQUE SPEC TYPO IS THE SAME AS RECOMMENDING A HEAVILY TESTED OIL WEIGHT AND INTERVAL FOR HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF CARS!Fuck off.Thanks confirming that you're just contrarian narcissists that think you know better because you simply have decided you *must* know better.
>>26668706Yes, all of those cars that followed the book specs for weight and change interval on original engines with 400k+ miles sure proved me wrong.
>>26668158>plows into a light post trying to drift at 35k miles and totals the car anywayheh, nothin personal, kid.
>>26667522I don't know what you guys are doing to be burning oil. I've never added oil between an oil change in my life and I do check it every 1-2k miles or so.
>>26670490youre using that phrase incorrectly retard. it doesnt have anything to do with 2000 miles.
>>26670576Wow, going to try this one more time, ESL"Oil is cheaper than engines" REFERS TO FUCKING EXCESSIVELY SHORT CHANGE INTERVALS YOU ABSOLUTE FUCKWIT. 2000 when the manual says 7500 is short changing it out of fear, uncertainty, and doubt and is justified with that cop out "I don't know shit" chant "oil is cheaper than engines"
>>26670553Imagine, for a moment, you are so unhinged that you erupt into diarrheal screaming the moment someone disagrees with you and brings up a valid point why.If you are genuinely dumb enough to think that:>car manufacturers can't and don't make mistakes when issuing servicing recommendations>the corporations that make cars have your wellbeing in mind beyond making a sale>said corporations don't trade long-term reliability for better performance to make more sales...then you are more than welcome to fill your crankcase with the watered-down canola oil the book recommends.At the end of the day, I don't care what you do with your car. I'm confident enough in my choice to use thicker oils that I can do it and not feel the need to make an autistic thread about it in order to validate my opinion.Maybe you should reassess your position if this is the kind of shit you have to do to convince yourself that you're right.
my truck seems to use metric bolts all over, but when i look up tutorials on fixing my vehicle, the boomers always mention what sizes work in imperial mesurements.what the fuck? what is the logic in doing this? what the fuck?
>>26670648To ruin your bolts and fasteners faster with my dear
>>26670643climate cucks are emotional and estrogen poisoned
>>26670643Except cars with 400k+ miles and counting have already proven you wrong. You have nothing of substance to back up your claims. You only do it *because* it's not what you were told to do, because your ego won't *allow* them to be right. YOU have to have the right answer, YOU must be smarter, no matter how wrong you are consistently proven.Or maybe you just like the car equivalent of having diarrhea spewed out on your chest every time you do an unnecessarily short duration oil change with extra heavy viscocity for no reason.Despite any of your baseless conjecture, car companies, above all else, know that blowing engines due to bad recommendations is a death sentence for a manufacturer. Nobody that blows up an engine in 100k miles is going to run back to the same manufacturer for another. They also make a shit ton of money (or at least their dealers do) every time you bring a car in for service, so when they tell you the oil can go 7500 miles, they're putting every fucking chip on the table all-in on that claim.You're a schizophrenic delusional narcissist and the least you can do is fucking acknowledge it.
>>26670845I could waste another 10 minutes of my life explaining why everything you just said is wrong and retarded, but clearly you're emotionally invested in your position to the point that you'd never see reason anyway.My 30 year old truck with 250k miles is getting diesel oil again so it can continue to not burn oil. My brother's '07 Rav4 that didn't make it to 100k on 5w20 could only dream as much. This is the way things will be until I see more compelling evidence than a vague, 3-minute long video and a string of posts calling people "schizo delusional narcissist nazi pig-fuckers etc etc" for slightly deviating from service recommendations.
>>26667231>You think OEMs are going to risk ruining their reliability reputationYes.
didn't askdidn't read>>26671472no, not think, know, because it's an indisputable, historical factthey have had no reliability reputation whatsoever for a long time nowit's a fact that GM's recommendations for oil cause failed lifters, varnished clogged oil passages, damaged cams, oil consumption, and engine failuredoing things to ensure that their cars don't last past 10 years has been the norm for decades
>>26670501The 7M's tendency to go through head gaskets is not because of any miscalibrated tools, the story goes that the 7M was originally intended to use asbestos head gaskets. Then suddenly asbestos was announced to be banned worldwide, so they had to quickly make a graphite gasket instead, but for reasons unknown, they neglected to revise the torque values. As a result, torquing these engines up to the factory 58 ft-lb is guaranteed to result in eventual head gasket failure, sooner if you run the engine hard, later if you baby it, but it is inevitable.>>26670538>they gave out new torque values themselves if I remember correctlyLots and lots of sites and forum posts mention some revised torque specs, but nobody can ever seem to provide any technical service bulletins, or any sort of proof of the sort. What we do know is that the minimum torque spec should be 72 ft-lb. Some people torque theirs up to 90 but that is insanely high and there's a very real risk of crushing the aluminium around the bolt holes.FWIW i torqued mine up to 80 ft-lb and have been beating the piss out of it for 18,000 miles and it's still running like a top
>>26667479World record. Until the head studs fail.
>>26667231I actually go 3k over because they're still underselling it. 300k no issues in Transit v6
I'll have you know I use 10w50 in everything regardless of manufacturer recommendations. 20w50 is cringe and boomer tier
>>266705531) that’s exactly what I said
>>26667231>OEMs are going to risk ruining their reliability reputation and/or having to warranty replace tens of thousands of engines by recommending the wrong oil or an unreasonable change interval?yes, you naive retardaccording to (((GM))) their piece of shit LT is "totally supposed to" burn a fucking quart of oil every 1000 miles on low mileage, and theres totally not a piston ring problem and their female-tier suggested oil change intervals on a an engine with direct gas injection is "A-ok"
>>26670278(((US owners manuals))) are just made to keep the dealership happyowner manuals for the same car with the same exact spec sold in a different country will have totally different oil recommendations down to telling you oil to use based on what ambient temperature/weather like >>26668810 said
I change oil and filter every 5k miles in my daily despite people saying you can go like 7,500 and 10,000 miles on full synthetic.
>>26669261loose is fast retard, it's common engine building knowledge.
>>26672175Oh that must be the reason why F1 or nascar engines have super tight clearance, because they don’t know how to build engines unlike you lmao.
>>26670648probably because they don't have metric tools.
>go to costco>get the big fuggin 0w-20 jugs for cheap>change oil every 5k milesThat reminds me, I gotta change my oil. At ~5,200 miles currently.
>>26667231I dont know. Most of the stories i read on forums are hearsay and conjecture. I read people saying they ran factory recommended oil for 200k and suddenly feel the need to switch to some high viscosity desile engine oil for no apparent reason other than some random on the internet said its better.Atleast when using manufacturer recommended oil if you get a bad filter or batch of oil you're covered under the oil/filter warranty if it destroys your engine.
>tfw you've been on 4chins so fucking long that everything becomes a conspiracy, including how often you're supposed to change your shitbox oilthe internet is quite possibly the most damaging invention of all time
>>26667897>thicker viscosity adds additional film strengthWhy not choose an oil based on film strength then? Viscosity is not film strength and there's no evidence to support a correlation between the two>the viscosity actually doesn't add additional heatA higher viscosity oil will, by definition, turn more pumping energy into heat. This is compounded by the fact that a thicker oil will not be able to cool your engine components as well as a thinner one due to the deceased flow.It's not the 1960s anymore, you can get more protection from an oil that will free up power and keep your engine cooler. Thick oil is for stupid boomers
>>26667317Cars are designed to a price point, and to last just long enough to not require a recall and no longer. Everything has tiny engines with turbos to meet government economy and emissions standards. These engines are not made to last, and the manufacture is not recommending maintenance for your benefit, it is what is required to pass above mentioned standards. If they ran super thin oil for the government tests but printed in the manual, “psst, actually use this other oil for longer engine life,” they would get raped by the EPA like VW and their “test mode” diesel emissions. Cars are not made for car owners, they are made for the government so the company stays in business.
>>26673417Also, apperently the government has some kind of tax based on the amount of maintenance related waste they recommend generating. So if they say lifetime oil, transmission fluid, air filters etc, then they get environmentally friendly status, even if that results in the entire car being wasted
I run 5W-40 in everything turbo I own and 10W-40 in everything non turbo I own. Most cars are pre '00 though.