[a / b / c / d / e / f / g / gif / h / hr / k / m / o / p / r / s / t / u / v / vg / vm / vmg / vr / vrpg / vst / w / wg] [i / ic] [r9k / s4s / vip / qa] [cm / hm / lgbt / y] [3 / aco / adv / an / bant / biz / cgl / ck / co / diy / fa / fit / gd / hc / his / int / jp / lit / mlp / mu / n / news / out / po / pol / pw / qst / sci / soc / sp / tg / toy / trv / tv / vp / vt / wsg / wsr / x / xs] [Settings] [Search] [Mobile] [Home]
Board
Settings Mobile Home
/n/ - Transportation

Name
Options
Comment
Verification
4chan Pass users can bypass this verification. [Learn More] [Login]
File
  • Please read the Rules and FAQ before posting.
  • There are 91 posters in this thread.

08/21/20New boards added: /vrpg/, /vmg/, /vst/ and /vm/
05/04/17New trial board added: /bant/ - International/Random
10/04/16New board for 4chan Pass users: /vip/ - Very Important Posts
[Hide] [Show All]


Janitor applications are now closed. Thank you to everyone who applied!




In this thread we discuss the current and past trend of urban planning from across the globe.
Urban planning is /n/ related.
>>
>>1806880
Isn’t urban planning more tied to politics than transportation?
>>
>>1806890
transportation is a part of urban planning
>>
File: Untitled.jpg (639 KB, 1341x876)
639 KB
639 KB JPG
Is there a name for developments with a few streets for motor traffic and parking but you can only reach the perpendicular row houses on footpaths?
>>
>>1806890
Transportation Planning is the act of getting people from point A to B in as little amount of time. There are many modes that you can try to accomplish that goal such as cars, trains, bikes, busses, and walking.

However, the most important way of shortening the amount of time it takes to get from point A to B is to somehow make A and B closer to each other. At a city level that is accomplished by urban planning. I think having a thread to talk about how we plan the cities that our systems of transportation go through is worthwhile. It also doesn't fit in politics as well because it's a more localized practice, and /pol/ usually focuses on national politics.
>>
>>1806940
There are plenty of threads about bikes, buses, trains, and a ton on cars. Urban planning itself is a political policy issue.
>>
If you think /pol/ can talk about urban planning in a civilized manner you've never been to /pol/ or you're a medical sensation because you've made it to adulthood without a brain.
>>
>>1806942
>Urban planning itself is a political policy issue.
It is also far more encompassing than transportation, which is why it doesn't fit on /n/.

>>1806943
This board is mostly an echo chamber though, which is why you wouldn't dare post it on another board.
>>
>talking about a drawing is /pol/
the absolute state of /n/
>>
>>1806946
>I dare you to take your general to a cesspit containment board where you'll be drowned in shitposting and racism at the slightest cue
>>
>>1806952
I do dare you, actually. You won't. No balls.
>>
>>1806962
No point to it actually. Don't need to set a trash can on fire to know it'll stink like shit.
>>
>>1807030
I think it's mostly because you know you'd be exposed to opinions contrary to your own
>>
>>1806880
What does /n/ think about New Urbanism?
>>
>>1807667
>mixed-use residential and office has its parking requirement reduced by a factor of 1.4
Seems pretty cool to me.
>>
>>1807667
What I know about it I like.
>the natural town and city were destroyed by the modernist/ funcionalist/ brutalist planners of post war europe
>trying to artifically replan what grew organically before
It sounds like a daunting task that could go awry.
Do you recommend any books or vids? I read Jan Gehl's "Life Between Buildings" recently and liked it a lot, maybe cause it underlined and supported my prejudices.
>>
>>1807667
>>1807675
>>1807712
thank you for actually discussing about planning, and not screeching about muh /pol/
>>
>>1807743
"Planning" encompasses more than transportation and is inherently wrapped in public policy, and really does belong on /pol/ or another board.
>>
>>1807744
>implying you can discuss anything on /pol/ in a civil manner
we need a architecture&planning board.
>>
>>1806928
Where I live, there are two kinds of shared walkway apartments, courtyard and garden. Garden better matches what's in your pic.

They're almost always two stories, but arranged pairwise. Two fronts facing each other w/ thin green strip in between, two backs facing each other w/ thick green strip, repeat. Each green strip has a concrete path down the middle.
It's a little strange, that each front porch is ~10-12ft from the opposite one, but it seems to work well. I imagine some mailman came up with the design to minimize his amount of walking. On-street parking only.

Courtyard apartments are almost always four stories, with a more 'communal' lawn (not supposed to leave your personal belongings out there). It's pretty common for them to be U-shaped, with a third run of apartments on the alley side. Sometimes there's a strip of parking off the alley, but they're assigned spaces ($$ added to the rent).
>>
>/n/ - apartments & lawns
>>
>>1807754
OMG you're right!
We should have another thead about "Conrail: what went wrong".
>>
>>1807756
Trains are transportation
>>
Is there a list of model codes anywhere?
>SmartCode
>International Zoning Code
>A few country-wide codes listed here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoning#By_country
Anything else?
>>
>>1808041
*model zoning codes
>>
>>1806880
why do jannies always shoah /upg/, we are a persecuted minority thread on this board oy vey.
>>
>/n/ - zoning
>>
>>1808054
trains are technology, so it should be on /g/
people walk in buildings, so it belong on /n/
>>
There's a real weird disconnect between urban planning, what's "good" and what's "bad". They'll cry foul at highly planned subdivisions, celebrate largely unplanned European cities, and then think that more planning is the answer.
>>
>>1808509
My man, that's what happens when you drink too much of the juice
>>
>>1807760
BRB starting a new thread "Middle Atlantic: Fallen Flags, Part XNVIGGIEIR, Why do all modern liveries suck so hard? Edition"
>>
>>
>>1808520
Yeah, that is transportation. Land use planning and zoning isn't.
>>
>>1808547
i don't see that many trans people here.
>>
>>1806880
What could the US do to modernize its cities drastically
>>
>>1808648
tsar bomba
>>
>>1808648
Building a fast, comfortable, clean, and safe rail link between downtown, the local universities, and the airport would go a long way toward opening people up to the idea of public transit.
>>
urban planning is more political than related to trains and planes and bikes, no?
>>
>>1811348
True, transportation is only a small subset of urban planning, most of which is irrelevant to /n/.
The first thing these urban planning threads should do is convincingly explain why housing (stationary objects) is relevant to transportation (the act of moving between places).
>>
>>1811391
planning isn't just housing, it also encompasses road layout, train routes, etc. which are /n/ related
>>
>>1811829
but housing isn't /n/
>>
>>1811829
Food isn’t just cooking. It also encompasses being converted from chemical to kinetic energy when walking which is /n/ related. Hot dog general when
>>
>>1811348
yes but good luck discussing urban planning on the politics board
>>
>>1811841
These threads are all /pol/ tier arguing anyways, they would be right at home.
>>
File: kowloon.jpg (99 KB, 720x472)
99 KB
99 KB JPG
Who here Kowloon Maxing?
>>
Bros is it possible to make a kino urban/suburban society that consist of dome houses?
Or are commieblocks the peak of architecture and planning?
>>
>>1812054
domes are fucking stupid, you lose a ton of space
>>
File: 1650702413113.jpg (408 KB, 1280x960)
408 KB
408 KB JPG
>>1812056
So that's it? Soulless block houses are the peak of it? Hive houses are the end of it all?
Bros not like this...
>>
>>1812054
Ulam's packing conjecture
:(

I don't wanna live in the cube
>>
I think this new “do nothing” janny is worse than the corona “delete and ban at random” janny. How does this thread still exist?
>>
ban cars from urban environments and bulldoze the suburbs back into farmland and orchards. turn inner city highways into greenbelts and light rail. problem solved.
>rural good
>urban good
>suburb GARBAGE
>sfh GARBAGE
>spaghetti intersections GARBAGE
>parking lot GARBAGE
cars have no place in a city
>>1806943
>he doesn't enjoy triggering boomer cagebrains and meth addict trailer trash on /pol/ with radical urbanism
>>
>>1812089
Go back to your train thread, grandpa
The hypothetical fate of Milwaukee Road isn't going to shitpost itself
>>
>>1808509
>more red tape, worse results
if you hired a janitor to clean your building, and the more the janitor worked the dirtier it got, you would fire the janitor.
>>
>>1807745
and a separate cycling board. I want to talk about riding my road bike fast, for fun, without underage communists who hate cars because they can't afford one telling me I should have bought a rusty 90s MTB with a front rack and zip tied a shopping basket to it.
>>
>>1812265
desu I have a fast road bike too but the 90s mtb meme is good for shopping etc and cars really are bad (t. 2 car household but feel bad about it)
>>
>>1812267
>cars really are bad
they are but they can also be useful, ironically for transportation especially if you live in a rural area where there's simply never going to be "muh light rail gay space communism". it just feels like there's a lot of "the fox and the grapes" going on.
>>
>>1812273
no one ever makes an argument against cars in a rural setting and yet pro-car posters are constantly constructing that man of straw
>>
>>1808648
Any place where there are row homes or single family homes allow building of small 3-4 story apartment buildings.
>>
>>1812286
Those pro car posters also fail to recognize that, even in America, 80% of people are not rural (urban), and the majority of the rural people are a fake-rural actually suburbanite.

If we could get infrastructure that encourages even 40% of urbanites (the 80% one) to not drive, that would do a lot to clear up traffic, reduce noise pollution, reduce infrastructure maintenance costs (car wear and tear is horrible for roads), and improve rain drainage (by getting rid of parking lots). Currently, 87% of Americans commute by single-passenger vehicle. The minimum goal I set would reduce that to 68% or less (assuming all of the 20% of “rural” people drive).

I also like continuous off-road pathways as a runner to train longer continuous distances. So I’m going to favor car reduction excessively.
>>
>>1812273
You don’t even need to live in a rural area. Plain and simply, I’d rather be able to cheaply own a car than not, no matter where I live.
>>
>>1812273
Rural areas used to have train services you know
>>
>>1808509
>largely unplanned European cities
The most celebrated European cities are Dutch cities, which underwent large transportation planning, and Gridcelona, literally urban planning: the city. Sometimes Paris, a city remodeled in the 19th century by urban planning.
>>
File: suraj.png (2.45 MB, 1284x1578)
2.45 MB
2.45 MB PNG
Anyone here aware of Suraj Patel? He’s a YIMBY candidate running for congressional office. Looks like his policies would really help lower housing costs in Manhattan.

>“I’m proudly a YIMBY. I always have been. I know that that moment has come to some extent.” Patel said.

What do you think /n/? Will you be voting for him in the upcoming election?
>>
File: 1200x675.jpg (187 KB, 1200x675)
187 KB
187 KB JPG
>>1812309
There are housing densities where everyone cheaply owning a car not only becomes pointless but downright hindering to mobility and life quality, as counterintuitive as it sounds. Unfortunately people have to be stopped by regulation from creating these environments because they always blame everyone else, never themselves.
>>
>>1812386
>pajet
Probably good policies, but wouldn't he do more immediate good if he were to run for a city office?
>>
>>1812391
And there are a lot of people that live in areas where it’s basically impossible for them to own a car, hindering their mobility and life quality. What’s your point?
>>
>>1812397
I was just pointing out how flawed your thinking was in your previous post.
>I’d rather be able to cheaply own a car than not, no matter where I live.
Is bullshit because it leads to bullshit. If you want to cheaply own a car pick a place where it's - if not useful - at least not harmful. You're not entitled to cheap car ownership "no matter where you live".
>>
>>1812402
And you’re also not entitled to expensive transit wherever you live either. I think we’re in agreement, anon.
>>
>>1812403
Are you accusing me of claiming I was?
>>
>>1812394
City office is low hanging fruit. Suraj doesn’t want to deal with bureaucratic bullshit all day, he’s going to use NY as an example of why YIMBYism works, to the whole country.
>>
>>1812386
you are fucking pathetic if you would ever would vote for a pajeet invader for anything in your life. import the third world, become the third world.
>>
>>1806890
Transportation has as much to do with where the roads are laid as it does with the vehicle driven on them.
>>
>>1812391
>italy
you're_opinion_recycle_bin.png
>>
>>1812331
exactly cunt. used to.
>>
>>1812758
they can have it again
>>
>>1812759
>damn, I should sell my car because someone on the internet who watches you tube videos says the railway, 20 miles away, which closed in 1965 (because *checks notes* it was mostly freight anyway which had dried up by the 1940s apart from a few coal trains) and has since been repurposed as a cycle path will be reopened just like magic for an extremely impoverished area of maybe 15 people per square kilometre!
>>
>>1806890
everything about city design is also transporation design, thats just a fact. are you going to design your city with walkable neighborhoods or have roads path through every street
>>
Guess the city
Hint: Obesity
>>
>>1812859
San Antonio?
>>
>>1812858
Urban planning also consists of many things that are not transportation related, such as building designs, population density, and policies; it is a political process after all.
Saying that urban planning is /n/ because some aspects of it involve transportation is as retarded as saying roads are /an/ because roads link up with zoos.
>>
>>1812859
>texas flag
well, at least they didn't knock the church down to build a parking lagoon, i guess.
>>
>>1812860
>filename
Yes I guessed correctly. I am a genius in remembering fat cities.
>>
>>1812861
not that anon but since this thread is on /n/ it'll obviously be about the /n/ aspect of urban planning
and others have already mentioned that /pol/ is not a place to have a civil discussion on this kind of topic
(this thread would have been shit up by /pol/ retardation or simply ignored and archived in a few minutes)
>>
Suburbs will go down in history as the single most destructive form of urban planning ever conceived.
>>
>>1812951
There are literally “urban planning threads” just like this one that exist purely to discuss whether Soviet housing is aesthetic. It’s just not /n/. Go away.
>>
>>1812969
you can't only talk about transportation without talking about urbanism, these are subjects that overlap a lot even if sometimes it feels a bit off-topic
this thread isn't about whether Soviet housing is aesthetic or not
and anyway there is no other board on which to talk about it
>>
>>1806952
>>1807030
Watch your mouth or I will bring /pol/ to you.
>>
>>1812975
>these threads are just for the transportation side of it
That isn’t true at all! Look at the threads, they’re about architecture aesthetics
>yes well we can’t be expected to just talk about the transportation side of it tee hee
Fucking tranny tier thin-end-of-the-wedgeism
>>
>>1812991
uwah u got me (゚∀゚)
to clarify myself /n/-related urbanism is still urbanism, to talk about how to get from A to B and make it an appreciable trip you have to discuss not-so-/n/-related urbanism stuff
still, what about this?
>there is no other board on which to talk about it
>>
>>1812992
There’s no board to talk about the best intestinal parasite either but I don’t discuss it on here. No one wants retarded upper middle class children who think they’re poor on this board. One of the internet communists claimed trade unions were right wing yesterday. What is wrong with town planning enthusiasts
>>
>>1812993
>There’s no board to talk about the best intestinal parasite either but I don’t discuss it on here.
you're right, but as I said urbanism is /n/-related
>No one wants retarded upper middle class children who think they’re poor on this board.
no one said that?
>One of the internet communists claimed trade unions were right wing yesterday. What is wrong with town planning enthusiasts
are you talking about something on youtube?
if so they're free to talk about anything they want I guess, even though it's a bit weird
>>
>>1812951
>it'll obviously be about the /n/ aspect of urban planning
You cannot tell me that with a straight face when this thread has gone on for 2 weeks and almost 100 posts without talking about transportation.
The only times when transportation is referred to are when there is an argument about whether or not these threads are /n/, which is evidently not the case.
>>
>>1812995
>I said urbanism is /n/-related
And you've already replied to my explanation as to why it isn't, yet here you are not even acknowledging it.
>are you talking about something on youtube?
He's talking about this argument >>1812236 >>1812237 on the other non-transport related thread.
>>
>>1813034
it would have been /n/-related if someone had not claimed that urban planning is /pol/-tier content
>>1813038
ppl derailing threads with Soviet architecture appreciation posts is one thing, /upg/ is another
and uh >>1812237 didn't claim that trade unions are right wing, just complaining about "muh leftists" complaints
it is the other who makes a false accusation

i'll sage this post and future ones cuz it's a bit off topic, sorry
>>
>>1813046
>it would have been /n/-related if someone had not claimed that urban planning is /pol/-tier content
You expect the people who believe this general is off-topic to make it on-topic for you, are you retarded?
The only people who should be doing that are those who would like to see this general succeed, but they're not, because even they know that urban planning is not /n/.
>>
>>1813118
>You expect the people who believe this general is off-topic to make it on-topic for you, are you retarded?
I may be retarded but I didn't say they would, just that if they hadn't it wouldn't be so off-topic
no need to be mean though
>The only people who should be doing that are those who would like to see this general succeed, but they're not, because even they know that urban planning is not /n/.
I tried to explain my pov, but no one answered it (it was only complaints about soviet architecture appreciation posts)
you're right though I should instead correctly contribute but I'm not really knowledgeable on this subject and I don't want to say dumb things (even if I surely did lol)

maybe this thread will settle the debate and the next one (if there'll be one) will hopefully be on-topic, with a little explanation in OP text
>>
>>1813147
ugh, that was a bit presumptuous of me to say "my pov", others have also said similar things, sorry
>>
>>1806880
What the fuck!??!?

I just saw this, a new master plan for liberty STATE PARK in Jersey City was unveiled
>>
>>1813202
Urban planning has everything to do with transportation. Look at all those parking spaces, for a city that is famous for destroying them and going very urban.
The boomers behind this will not bring back the car centric thinking into the mainstream.
>>
>>1813199
>a few walking trails around small sections of grass
>multiple giant parking lots
>8 (eight) football fields
>6 lane motorway

now imagine if all that space was simply...a park.
>>
Will American urban planning ever get better?
t. Living in the dystopian nightmare that is the West Coast rental market
>>
>>1813202
>>1813218
/n/ has had regular /upg/ since at least 2016, newfriend.

>>1813199
Hello, where is the public transport?
>>
>>1813317
>/n/ has had regular /upg/ since at least 2016, newfriend.
No, they've been intermittent at best
>>
>>1807675
The year of our lord 2022 and still having parking requirements. What backwards town do you live in?
>>
>>1813318
I kept up a /upg/ almost continuously from 2016-2019 while I was in planning school. I haven't posted as much since but I still frequently see them. I also see babies like you complaining about petty stuff like this.

Land use and transportation are inextricably linked.
>>
>>1812765
>what is a government
just reopen the lines and buy new ones
>>
Is this the thread where I talk about what coarseness the sand in the cement I use should be? People ride bikes on cement sometimes.
>>
>>1813399
Yeah, I like to collect animal excrement from the wild and wheelbarrow them back to my basement for closer inspection, this thread is perfect for transportation-related topics like that.
>>
File: 1108C1.jpg (140 KB, 658x439)
140 KB
140 KB JPG
IMO the ideal city would be hyperdense structures surrounded by parks and farming land connected to other such structures by a network of HSR.
>>
>>1813432
>>1813461
meds
>>
>>1813451
This. Wilderness within walking distance, with all the amenities of a big city.
>>
>>1813451
why the big thing in the middle though
>>
>>1813199
why are there so many soccer fields?
>>
File: .jpg (7 KB, 310x320)
7 KB
7 KB JPG
>>1813323
Then cry about it lmao
You bitching about it here is completely inconsequential, urban planning has been a tolerated related topic for years
Like how /v/ allows for the discussion of "gaming culture" and not just strictly video games, urbanism and transportation are strongly related to each other and it should be expected to come up inevitably.

Like, you can't talk about cars and leave out the roads they run on, or talk about trains without their tracks, anon.
Quit being an autist.
>>
>>1813801
>/pol/kun is a cager
holy lmao
>>
>>1813899
>urban planning has been a tolerated related topic for years
No it hasn't

>Like, you can't talk about cars and leave out the roads they run on, or talk about trains without their tracks, anon.
Yeah, and those are transportation
Which is why an acceptable thread would be about TRANSPORTATION PLANNING, which is not the same thing as "urban planning"
>>
>>1813451
>>1813497
Those massive buildings would still require a lot of people moving, there's really no benefit to that over just making it a small city of skyscrapers.
>>
>>1813910
>TRANSPORTATION PLANNING, which is not the same thing as "urban planning"
Transportation planning is broader than urban planning, but urban planning is almost entirely transportation planning
>>
>>1814044
>Transportation planning is broader than urban planning,
I don't care, it's transportation

>but urban planning is almost entirely transportation planning
Nope
>>
>all these seeth
no matter how much you seeth this general will live on.
>>
To what extend could electric autonomous and coordinated car sharing service operated on a ride hailing basis eliminate many of issues of modern car-centric infrastructure and suburban development, and what are the problems which such a system that would make transit oriented, mixed use development still preferable (besides such autonomous cars still being likely decades away)?
My list of problems so far is this:
>many cars are actually used for storage (in the sense of a mobile locker) so you would actually still need parking when people leave things inside the car to do something else
>the waiting and recharging spots for idling cars would need to be nearby (aka even more parking) to keep travel distances to passengers short
>demand isn't constant, meaning many cars would sit idle outside of commuting hours and big events instead of rushing to pick up their next passenger(s)
>a large supply would be needed for a constant supply and short waiting times
>much of the noise and pollution of cars arises from tire wear
>much of the capacity disadvantage of cars compared to buses, trains and trams, arises from their very geometry (the car itself plus safety clearances around it) and even small cars would most likely mean much space being wasted
I'm wondering about this because it feels like such an idea would come up sooner or later when discussing the problems of cars and car-centric development with tech-bros and defenders of suburbia.
>>
>>1815492
>To what extend could electric autonomous and coordinated car sharing service operated
Stopped reading there, because this part:
>autonomous and coordinated
Is a tech boy fantasy.
>>
>>1806880
can we get some janitorial service in here please?
>>
>All the seething

Urban planning is the number one factor that decides if your daily transportation will be efficient or not
This thread is not only /n/ relevant, it's the most important /n/ thread
>>
File: you.png (151 KB, 680x545)
151 KB
151 KB PNG
>>1815854
>>>gb2/pol/
>>
>>1813251
>imagine if all that space was simply...a park
I agree with you, but I don't think most urban people want "parks", they want "features". There's a new park I ride by, that I think is pretty depressing.
Some of it's standard stuff. Walking loop, set of bathrooms, water fountains, etc. The playground area is a "natural" one, so no toy sets, but boulders to climb on, a giant tree trunk, sand pit, etc. Pretty cool, kids like it. But it's next to a huge parking lot/strip that takes up a bit more than 1/3 of the land.

When I ride by, the kids will be playing, generally enjoying themselves. And all of the parents will be sitting in their parked vehicles, engine idling, ac on, looking down at their phones execept for the occasional upward glance. It's wild.

I didn't attend any of the planning meetings for this park (nowhere near my neighborhood), but it's easy to imagine that what got built is exactly what was asked for, ie mostly a parking lot.

>>1815879
Dear /n/ arbiter,
Are "20 posts bitching about what is, or isn't transportation" considered tranportation?
Inquiring minds must know.
>>
>>1815892
Are 20 shitposts bitching about bitching considered transportation?
>>
>>1812054
Commie blocks are terrible, but they could be good with a lot of extra work. First, build the apartments in a ring around the city block. The center of this block is only accessible to residents: fill this space with a small park, playground, storage, parking, or something else. On the ground floor of the blocks, facing outside, are various shops, accessible to anybody. In very tall structures, some of the lower floors in the buildings could be offices. Ideally, the whole structure is small enough that you could know most of the other residents and therefore trust your kids to play in the courtyard without risk.
>>
File: 1477511876657.jpg (10 KB, 214x250)
10 KB
10 KB JPG
>>1807057
NTA but I love nothing more than being called a tranny for trying to discuss something other than the latest schizoshit or r/t_d tier recycled memes.
>>
>20 posts were purged
based janny.
>>
thoughts on 15-minutes cities?
>>1815961
i do not care.
>>
>>1812876
>>1812859
What you're seeing is the former Joske's department store that managed to buy up the entire block to expand, except for one holdout. It has nothing to do with urban planning or cars for that matter. If you think the surrounding building is a parking garage, get your eyes checked and stop letting cars live rent free in your head.
>>
Housing is never going to get cheaper in this country until we reform our retarded zoning laws.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/06/zoning-housing-affordability-nimby-parking-houston/661289/
>>
>>1816392
Zoning is a small part of the problem but the problem won't improve by getting rid of it. Pricing of raw materials, hidden taxes by permits, institutional investors, and a bunch of other reasons that weren't around 20, 30, 40 years ago when zoning was still big.

Also, no one in their right mind, on any side of the political spectrum should say "Our city should be more like Houston".
>>
File: rows.jpg (486 KB, 2048x1365)
486 KB
486 KB JPG
bros why can't we just level boomer McMansions and other boomer suburban hells and build pic related again?
>single family home
>walkable
>simple design
Seriously what are the drawbacks? Why does no one build row houses anymore?
>>
File: 2022-06-23.jpg (1.18 MB, 1920x2400)
1.18 MB
1.18 MB JPG
>>1816443
>>1816443
The city I currently live in has a bunch of old row houses like this.

Common complaints:
Loud ass neighbors
Limited windows/natural lighting
Small or non-existent yards
Limited parking

There are a few sections that have been rebuilt with modern versions, broadly in the same style to 'blend in' with neighboring ones. Top pic is the front, bottom is around the back.
Despite technical improvements (insulation, etc), everyone considers them less appealing.
Is it possible for mass development to shake the soulless, cookie cutter look? Post examples if you know some.
>>
>>1816447
Seems like the worst of a house combined with the worst of an apartment. Not dense enough for transit to work very well, but dense enough to create more car traffic. :/
>>
File: 2022-06-23.jpg (1.73 MB, 1920x2400)
1.73 MB
1.73 MB JPG
The city where I went to university was instead packed to the brim with duplexes. Most pre-1950s neighborhoods were 7/10 duplexes, 2/10 single family houses, 1/10 fourplexes (? square brick building with two upper, two lower apartments).

Lots were quite narrow, ~10ft wall to wall. Tiny front yard, rear yard is same footprint as the house plus a bit. Hardly any driveways, instead a mix of alleyway-adjacent and on-street parking.
There was still the possibility of having a loud neighbor, etc. But having 2x the amount of windows was so nice. Not choosing between window closed or traffic noise, fresh air that's not exhaust, etc.
It felt like the right mix.
>>
>>1816453
Works if you get a neighbor you really like, but oftentimes turns into a Mexican standoff over the shared spaces. And again, kind of the worst of both worlds.
>>
>>1816455
You don't have to "really like", or even "like" your neighbors. As long as they're not dickheads.
>oftentimes turns into a Mexican standoff
That's never been my experience.
>worst of both worlds
Works pretty well for transit. Blocks are generally rectangles, ~3:1 ratio, the alleys bisecting them lengthwise.
Like nearly everywhere else, the streetcar system was ripped out, so it's busses nowadays. Stops are every other avenue (long dimension), and every four streets (short dimension). Worst case scenario, you walk a third of a mile.
I've never lived anywhere else where people actually use the busses. Not just college kids, but people going to work, etc.
>>
What's the possibility that, after our inevitable earthquake + fire, cities like Los Angeles and San Francisco can be rebuilt into more efficient locations? Emminent domain and other similar measures seem much more palatable and easier to use when the homes have already been destroyed by nature and I'm sure the insurance companies declare bankruptcy so a lot isn't going to be rebuilt as it was.
>>
>>1816438
>small part

It's a pretty fucking huge part, kid. Not being allowed to build most types of housing by law, will inherently cause a shortage.
If you think anything else you're delusional.

>>1816443
They're outlawed by zoning, sadly.
>>
>>1815911
I like this idea. Stores located on the upper floors of the tower would make it even better.
>>
>>1816621
The tower formerly known as the John Hancock center has a grocery store within the tower for residents to use, pretty cool actually.
>>
>>1813451
Yes
>>
Based jannies.

Minneapolis just had their 2040 plan that eliminated single family zoning hit back with a lawsuit which sucks. It was sued by the audobon society on the basis that increased density would be worse environmentaly than building single family homes in the country which makes no sense. The triplex legislation didn't transform housing construction but the combination of allowing dense housing near transit was a really great improvement.

The mayor also just vetoed 24/7 bus lanes on one of the busiest transit corridors. Doesn't feel great. The mayor didn't want to have bus only lanes at times when buses don't run which is.... from 1AM-4AM daily. Are the places you live in very supportive of transit priority improvements?
>>
>>1816674
i mean allowing for hundreds of thousands of people to move in would probably cause a ton of trafic and therefore emissions so theyre probably right
>>
>>1816710
Minneapolis is almost entirely built out already. The idea that suddenly hundreds of thousands of people would move in by replacing single family homes with triplexes is silly. In most cases the economics just don't make any sense. Buy a $400k home, demolish it for $100k, build a new triplex for $1 million, just to rent out three units means it effectively will only happen rarely.
>>
>>1816581
Zoning has been around for decades and only in the last 15-20 years housing prices (outside of places like, say, San Francisco) have been completely fucked. Even in the last five years, Houston home values have increased almost 50% in value. That's a HUGE increase, and nothing about their zoning has changed. Unless there's been some massive zoning rules since 2005 done, zoning is not a significant factor in home prices.

My hometown had pretty strict zoning rules in terms of where residential and commercial could be and townhomes, while not common, still get built every few years.
>>
>>1806880
Parkstrips and seminomad storages
Yurt docks
>>
>>1816819
Dallas housing market WILL crash once everyone realizes they’re car dependent.
>>
>>1816961
Car-dependent, yes. Longest light rail system in the US, yes. And they keep adding to it.
>>
Bamp for the sake of keeping urban planning in the UP general
>>
>>1816674
I just read up on it. They haven't eliminated the bill. Just halted it until it has been reviewed for it's environmental impact. I say in this light it's actually not too bad.
>>
>>1812859
I like to think the central station of San Antonio would share similar architectural characteristics with the courthouse.
>>
File: 1501438839275.gif (1.96 MB, 200x190)
1.96 MB
1.96 MB GIF
>>1816961
>y-yeah, car dependency means that it will collapse and everyone will flee back toward the mass transit meccas...any day now
>>
>>1817671
This unironically will happen as soon as the people who live in those places find out they’re car dependent.
>>
File: 1650046500024.png (102 KB, 289x231)
102 KB
102 KB PNG
>>1812859
>filename
c'mon now
>>
File: 1646084458882.jpg (561 KB, 2026x2865)
561 KB
561 KB JPG
>>1808648
In order of cost/effort:

More buses and bus stops. Cheap, almost no construction work needed, and provides a substitute for poor commuters.

Upzoning land near existing transit stops. Cheap for government, privately funded construction work, increases transit ridership and housing availability while reducing overall traffic.

Protected bike lanes and free public bike racks.
Not too expensive if the land is free, requires some public construction, allows people to make short trips by bike and mitigates the last mile problem of inadequate public transit systems.

Dedicated bus lanes. Costs more, needs construction, will be resisted by normies who only see fewer car lanes and buses zooming by while they're stuck in traffic. These give people who can afford a car reasons to ride buses, reducing overall traffic.

Expanded light rail. Allows suburbanites to use public transit and reduces highway traffic but costs a ton unless the government already has the line.

metro expansion/central hub station:
Transition built up urban areas away from car traffic, needs expensive tunneling, allows intercity rail to make sense.

intercity HSR:
Super expensive, reduces long range car trips, only makes sense if both cities have good public transit.
>>
>>1817788
Development of Houston, Dallas, and the Sunbelt took off in the 1960s as "car-dependent" areas and it was a known fact. Even the Arab Oil Embargo didn't slow them down.
>>
>>1816674
Just goes to show you how retarded NIMBYs are. Increased density would have been the best way to preserve the environment of Minnesota.
>>
>>1812265
Lol yes, please make a /fred/ containment board
>>
>>1812265
Wish this existed. Closest thing is /sp/cyc/
>>
>>1813320
as opposed to having what exactly?
>>
File: EPCOT.jpg (123 KB, 1024x768)
123 KB
123 KB JPG
>>1806880
Walt Disney's EPCOT city had some great ideas.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLCHg9mUBag
>>
>>1819253
>most walkable neighborhood is disneyland
absolute state of mutts.
>>
>>1819253
Did it, or is it just a completely planned version of everything wrong with suburbia?

>no middle density, just dense commercial and sparse residential
>no mixed zoning, everything is in its own belt
>indoor megamall that simulates an outdoor walkable town center
>not suited for getting around on foot, still have to rely on motor vehicles except this time it's a monorail for in-town trips and cars for out of town trips
>>
File: despairsemi.png (433 KB, 890x653)
433 KB
433 KB PNG
>tfw build better cities in my spare time in city builders than my own fucking government

It's not even hard, you literally start with the public transport in the planning
>>
>>1820166
>anime poster
>is retarded
Checks out
>>
>>1820415
>t. city employee
>>1820166
your not retarded
>>
>>1820415
Centralizing our cities around cars and only cars is a disaster. Planning miles of single family zoning only in spindly streets is criminal.

A human's most cost effective mode of transportation are their feet but for some reason we build everything designed around travelling for miles in a car.
>>
>>1820435
>A human's most cost effective mode of transportation are their feet but for some reason we build everything designed around travelling for miles in a car.
Because that's the way the modern supply chain works. Things are created in factories or grown all over the world, stored in massive warehouses, and then sent out to make modern life possible. You can have a potemkin village of a """human-sized development""" but unless you want to go back to the Dark Ages or live in the woods like Uncle Ted, that's just the way things are.

>>1820166
No, you figure out where people are coming and going. In city builders, leisure travel doesn't happen (all work-home-work, without even groceries), mass transit is always preferred by design (filled up to the max), and specific travel patterns are completely glossed over.
>>
>>1820447
The Netherlands and Tokyo disagree.
>>
>>1820457
Well, for whatever reason, the Netherlands and Tokyo have longer commute times than freeway-based cities, so there’s a problem right there.
>>
>>1820572
But that's just commute, as in home to work. It doesn't account for any local travelling they do. It also speaks nothing of how they could fill the train ride being productive than staring at a road nor the lack of noise and air pollution they would be subject to. But is it worse in the one specific way you measured? Yes.
>>
>>1820585
Not that anon, and this isn't a pointed response, but I agree: it is hard to quantify.
I switched jobs earlier this year, and there is no grocery store "on the way home from work". Previously, I didn't realize how convenient it was.

So now I spend some of my (driving) time thinking about my, sort of "total commute". Not just back and forth from work, but the grocery store (weekly), but also the bank, post office, etc (not as often). I sitll go to the same ones, it's just a bit more driving that used to not exist.

Thinking about the new job, I didn't realize I would have an increased "total commute". But a week into it--there was no doubt.
>>
are houses with inner courtyard( surrounded on all 4 sides) even possible with the current us zoning code?
>>
>>1821675
probably not, due to setbacks and lot coverage. You'd probably need to sacrifice floorspace
>>
>>1821700
>imagine wasting all these space because set back
>>
>>1821675
I don’t think a zoning law, but a fire code. I’m not an expert, but an enclosed courtyard could create an obstacle in escaping a building.
>>
>>1821724
>he doesn't want tree-lined streets
We're not all soulless bug people, anon.
>>
>>1822303
ah yes american suburbs are a prime example of tree-lined streets.
>>
bump
>>
>>1816450
it's perfectly dense enough for transit (especially combined with apartments) this argument is so weird, you don't need a 30 story skyscraper in tokyo to have transit be viable.
>>
>>1826122
6 storey buildings are ideal, anything taller than that for residential should be considered a crime against humanity.
>>
>>1816447
>Loud ass neighbors
yet another benefit of diversity!
>>
>>1826199
concrete walls and this is no longer a problem
>>
>>1826420
they'll continue blasting their beaner music on the street after midnight
>>
File: chen think.png (18 KB, 112x112)
18 KB
18 KB PNG
Question:
How much was the Population Bomb overpopulation scare of the 60s and 70s responsible for the proliferation of detached suburban living and land development?
I know it sounds silly, but looking back on media, news, and books from that period, it really is understated now just how big of an issue this was considered at the time, on par with how Climate Change is seen currently if not more.
>>
File: 20220513_195428.jpg (2.71 MB, 1500x2000)
2.71 MB
2.71 MB JPG
>>1822303
I live in one of the original Levittowns (PA) where each property had 2 - 3 trees planted just at the edge bordering the sidewalk/road.
What ended happening was people would higher these scam "tree services" to "top" or chop down their trees out of fears that branches would fall on their houses/insurance companies placing retarded price hikes based on how close to the house or how big a tree is.

So you just have shittons of instances like pic related where the tree service butchers these trees intended to provide shade until it look it came straight from a post-apocalyptic wasteland and is unable to meaningfully provide any cover from the sun.
>>
Reminder that our entire physiology is based on walking around everywhere and that all the 'Americans are fat' jokes would end tomorrow if they only embraced this reality.
>>
>>1826874
My father always hated how the tree services would butcher trees in town.
>>
Is there a reason beyond lobbying that most city centres don't have trams? Are they a viable replacement for cars and buses?
>>
>>1812403
>And you’re also not entitled to expensive transit wherever you live either

No way of avoiding this. Doesn't matter if you want cars or trains or cycling/walking, in any urban area you have to decide what transport infrastructure to build on the finite land available. That means some modes of transport getting billions of subsidybux at the expense of others. Roads, rail lines, cycle paths and pedestrianisation, all the same story.
>>
>>1828682
The subjective perception of trams as something obsolete and disruptive for traffic. Although those are just derivatives from the lobbying.
So no.
>>
>>1828682
At least in historic centers in European cities you tend to run into space issues since streets are so narrow and you usually have tons of pedestrians.
Trams work best when they have a separated lane.
>>
>>1807675
>parking minimums
dropped
>>
>>1808509
>largely unplanned European cities
These older cities grew based on demand, not by planning 100 square miles of single-family housing. When they needed more housing, shops, whatever, they built it on the edge of existing development. If you like the natural, unplanned look of cities that were built in-situ rather than planned years ahead of their actual construction, then go for it. I don't see anything inherently wrong with planning a space ahead of time, though.
>>
>>1813251
>>1813892
>why are there so many soccer fields?
Basically money laundering. Governments like to build big parks with lots of unnecessary amenities and fields to make it look like they're doing something that contributes to the local quality of life (look, so many places for you to play soccer!). In reality they're just using up tax dollars to build something that can't really be denied by any of the taxpayers because "muh kids".
>>
>>1816447
>Loud ass neighbors
Don't understand why we can't just insulate harder if that's an issue.
>>
>>1828716
They’re modern construction, and ever since the balloon construction method was invented in the 1970s, using real material (that would insulate) would be too expensive comparatively. This is why a lot of modern suburb houses get called “matchbox houses” or “tinder houses”; they are made cheaply out of cheap materials and as little material as possible. Increasingly, houses have been designed to be disposable after 15-20 years. Nippon already does this, but to an extreme, which is why they produce more construction waste per capita than any where else. People only want new houses, so they tear down and throw away the old ones. And if you’re going to do that, why build well in the first place?
>>
File: 1656190625774.png (269 KB, 655x599)
269 KB
269 KB PNG
how do i become a modern day Haussmann
>>
>>1828872
The closest thing was Robert Moses, and since him cities have evolved defense mechanisms against getting anything at all built anywhere.
If you want to execute your masterplanned utopian vision, your best bet might be starting fresh in one of those third world countries that allows charter cities and then soliciting investment from crypto billionaires, if the market ever recovers.
>>
>>1828929
all moses did was HIGHWAYS HIGHWAYS HIGHWAYS, Haussmann did much more by mandating the style of architecture, street layout, and parks.
>>
>>1828872
encourage gentrification, abolish rent control everywhere, nuke public housing, and deport all the spics
>>
>>1806880
>school far away from the lake
Smart way to avoid teenage pregnancies' but I'm sure the creek offers some protection from view
>>
>>1812092
>too dumb to realize bots and shills run /pol/
>>
>>1828966
>all moses did was HIGHWAYS HIGHWAYS HIGHWAYS
even a quick glance on Wikipedia says he built swimming pools and parks, sorry your anti-car-addled brain can't think of itself or do your own research
>>
>>1828966
I'm talking about the consolidation of power in the hands of one man to execute on his own vision. The specifics of that vision don't much matter; because of Robert Moses and mid-century urban renewal projects, nothing can get done in an existing community without 30 years of environmental studies and community engagement.
>>
>>1828968
>abolish rent control
just abolish rent
>>
I hate cigarettes imagine if Walt had lived another 20 years what kind of amazing urban planning we would have got and right in the middle of Florida
>>
>>1817560
san antonio has the best downtown architecture of any texas city, its not saying much but its true. the sprawl outside of the urban core is a nightmare but downtown is alright.
>>
>>1812331
That's because trains were the only choice for transportation prior to WWll. Cars were expensive and travel was slow in the time before interstate hiways.
>>
>>1816447
That shits nightmare fuel. Commie block, but done 'Murikun style.
>>
So yoy guys want walkability in the US but how can we have that with these urban achievers? No meme answers this is a real problem
>>
>>1831912
I don't know how much of a meme answer this is, but you literally only need to roll back pro crime policy to quell the crime.
Stop and frisk
long sentences for """"small"""" crimes and reoffenders
executions for murderers and rapists
>>
>>1831973
But that's racist
>>
>>1831912
Safety in numbers I would think. Something like this seems much less likely to happen if there are more regular people around that might intervene. Also, like others said more policing.
>>
>>1832288
Yeah, no.
https://twitter.com/williama_33/status/1552002990357241862?s=21&t=CD-a4gpjM58r4k69hBDicA
>>
File: satoudiscovered.png (250 KB, 442x478)
250 KB
250 KB PNG
>>1831912
Project I'm working on is kind of related to a part of this. The idea is to have a green-way that serves as a bike and walk path. Not only does it provide a safe area of travel for active modes of transportation, but it serves as a recreational area for urban communities where access to parks is limited. There have been plenty of studies showing that greenery and parks reduce stress levels and reduce crime rates. Pic Related
>>
bump
>>
>>1832444
>There have been plenty of studies showing that greenery and parks reduce stress levels and reduce crime rates

Notice the trees and grass in that webm? The social norms of urban youth won't disappear because you plant some greenery. The only response is to move to an area with safer demographics, and discourage transit that would bring in cultural enrichment. Unironically this is the biggest obstacle facing urbanism and you can't even name it, but good luck with your project lel
>>
File: charles-manson.gif (874 KB, 220x229)
874 KB
874 KB GIF
>>1836288
>Unironically this is the biggest obstacle facing urbanism
Urbanism isn't sustainable for economic/political reasons relating to corrupt bureaucracies. Even Europeans in cities will be squeezed next winter.
>cultural enrichment.
Yeah who would have thought assassinating the leadership of the civil rights movement would turn into gang warfare? Reminds me of certain agent provocateur FEDS among the right wing extremists?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO
>Beginning in 1969, leaders of the Black Panther Party were targeted by the COINTELPRO and "neutralized" by being assassinated, imprisoned, publicly humiliated or falsely charged with crimes.
If you think it was only the black panthers then you're naive.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCKNg630qa4
>Krayzie Bone From the Legendary Hip Hop Group Bone Thugs & Harmony stopped by the Hip Hop Uncensored Podcast to exposed the record industry. In this video Krayzie Bone Breaks Down The Music industries connection to the private prison industry.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXFvuJjCbQQ
>Freeway Rick Ross Interview About CIA Involvement (in crack cocaine)



Delete Post: [File Only] Style:
[Disable Mobile View / Use Desktop Site]

[Enable Mobile View / Use Mobile Site]

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective parties. Images uploaded are the responsibility of the Poster. Comments are owned by the Poster.