Vivaldi Editionhttps://youtu.be/yaO7OL-O00AThis thread is for the discussion of music in the Western classical tradition.>How do I get into classical?This link has resources including audio courses, textbooks and selections of recordings to help you start to understand and appreciate classical music:https://pastebin.com/NBEp2VFhPrevious Thread:>>107213004
>>107250690first for being flutebrohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSMW8pw2yMo
! ㄱ --_-https://youtu.be/-vyrd56F8pI
>>107250829A shame the recorder was thrashed by being forced into children's education. It was a good idea on paper at least.
>>107251045who are you quoting?
>classical music is boring
Walther (formerly Vivaldi)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkKweNnkHfY
>I enjoy classical music
>Vivaldi is good
>Vivaldi wrote the same concerto 500 times
free sex at sex.com
>born>writes shit tons of music including some of the most beautiful, singing melodies of all time>refuses to elaborate>dies at 31nothing personal, Beethoven
>>107252435>[R.] comes to the subject of Nietzsche, who, out of sheer malice toward him, distorts the passage he wrote in his Beethoven about the way B. listened to folk melodies, and he did it just in order to denigrate R., "ignoring the fact that Beethoven was the greatest melodist who ever lived. The way he took a folk tune and gave it back to the people, transfigured–it was like the condescension of a god, like the unknown maiden appearing to the shepherd. And to rank him on that account somewhere below Schubert! What Schubert was, B. had long known all about. Disgraceful—and so stupid!">In the evening [R.] plays and sings An die entfernte Geliebte [Beethoven, Op. 98] to us, greatly moving us with it. "The whole of Schubert can be found in this," he says, and that brings him on to Nietzsche's maliciousness (about Schubert and Beeth.) and the whole dismal experience!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7IUtUsfARA&t=7932slol whats up with these niggas wtf is the title
>>107252435Kind of a surreal feeling knowing I am 31 and have accomplished literally nothing with my life. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BeKiPHu1XbU
>>107253775Keats died at 24 and is remembered as one of, if not, the greatest English Romantic poets.
>>107253775bruckner didn’t start becoming a composer until he was in his late 30’s.
>>107253775Van Gogh started painting at 27.
I've spent over 10 hours recording prescreening shit and I barely have a passable take for 2 of 5 piecesNGMI
I don't like the finale to Gotterdammerung.
>>107256121I still have to watch/listen to that one, but I have really high hopes because I've heard the leitmotifs. I hope I won't be disappointed.
>>107256121I like Act 3 quite a bit until Brunnhilde decides to sing for 20 minutes straight.
>>107256194youtube comment sections really are a world of their own
>>107256194Man I haven't seen this image in years
>>107256204They certainly are.
Who's /feelingscarlatti/ today?
>>107256194YouTube comments are the worst thing about the Internet. Worse than ISIS videos, child porn and pop-up ads.
>>107256168For many people it's their favourite, but the story is the least strong in the Ring and I think Wagner tried to overcompensate for that with the music, which can make it feel disconnected from the action.
>>107252435>refuses to elaborateWhat do you mean?
>>107256194I judge my friends (and my own) taste in music on the quality of the youtube comments.
Just what the blazes is going on in Max Reger's "Fantasie and Fugue on BACH"? It's not like you can even hear melody or any melodic lines as everything is mishmashed together in such clouded harmony. Apparently tonal, yes, no, who the heck knows? Who knows what the beat even is? It's like the music evokes fog blending into a blizzard with occasional lightning, cyclones and earthquakes thrown in. The chromatic fugue, at least initially, takes us back to the Reger we normally know, but then heads into to those humungous blurred sound walls (wave after wave of 50-note chords...seemingly at least). One wonders what Reger's esthetics at this point are? But I could imagine that in a dimly lit cathedral this would probably be as uncanny as hell. Is this music beautiful, grotesque, ugly, all or none of the above? What's more it doesn't sound like stereotyped avant-garde but rather schizo or psychotic late romantic music, like if the composer composed this with a 5 pound tumor pressing into his brain but not impairing him severely.
>>107256732sounds like a good ass piece, any recommended recordings?
Is it wrong if you've never listened to any of the entry-level artists any genre wise but are listening to newer stuff and something people would consider either "more complex" or "avant-garde"?For example, I never listened to Mozart, Brahms, Tchaikovsky, Mahler, the list goes on... but I listen to Morton Feldman, Karlheinz Stockhausen, Horatiu Radulescu, John Cage, etc.Am I missing out? Or is it good to skip all the entry-level things because they're outdated and simple compared to newer artists?
>>107256960No one listens to John Cage. You've outed yourself as a spook
>>107256960this has to be bait
>>107256957Bernhard Schneider, on youtube
>>107257044>on youtubeI have standards thank you.
>>107257146>I refuse to listen to something good because ???
>>107257353Because youtube is gay. Give me an actual album.
>>107257034It's an old'ish pasta. Been here quite a few times.
My Deezer Hi-Fi trial is ending in less than 2 weeks and I'm downloading over 1TB of classical music in FLAC using Deemix B-)
>>107256221yeah, I'm feeling Scarlatti todaythe other Scarlatti thoughhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsM5mGbO7ds
Which pieces convey excruciating pain of the soul?
>>107261614The entire catalogue of Swedish composer Allan Pettersson
>>107256194Classical music being exposed to people outside of aristocratic circles has been the greatest mistake.
>>107261742Do aristocrats frequent 4chan?
>>107261792Aristocrats of the soul, regardless of their material conditions.
>>107261683I was thinking of something more on the line of Erbarme Dich
>>107261807So then classical music has always been exposed to "people outside of [metaphysically] aristocratic circles," no?
>>107261614Gesange der fruhe
>>107261857I was talking about 4chan patricians. The Maistre guy is a different anon.
>>107261825Well, I like XX century music and Pettersson's music is one of the most depressing, soul-crushing stuff I have ever heard.
>>107261792Of course not. Only losers browse and post in 4chan>>107261807Megacringe, I was referring to actual aristocrats.
>>107256194saw this comment today while listening to Beethoven's fifth
>>107262047fuck forgot the damn picture
>>107257052awooooooica haha i woof like the beginning
>>107262047>actually listening to the 5thwhat did he mean by this
>>107262084>top X lists>peoples' favorite anythingreddit
>>107262825Beethoven's fifth is one of the greatest symphonies ever written. The fact that it is so "popular" (not really) doesn't eliminate one tiny bit of how masterfully written it is.
>>107261614Myaskovsky's second cello sonata
>>107261742Listening to classical makes me feel so self conscious and pretentious. I can barely stomach it because I'm paralyzed by the fear of coming off as a pseud putting on airs. Midwit dilemma. Fuck.
>>107263097This plus Symphonies No.3, 4, 13 and symphonic poems silence and alastorhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sbbx3rDM8zo
>>107263066Idk bro i wouldnt be able to tolerate the first movement after hearing it so many fuckin times but more power to ya
>>107263098Are you American?
>>107263098what kind of opinion is this meant to be? foolish moron>>107263335foolish moron>>107262060foolish moron
>>107263519>foolish moronYes, and damn proud of it, you dilettante
>>107263556autistic foolish moron
>>107263594seethe and cope
>>107263659sickeningly autistic foolish moron
>>107263688consider yourself sneeded and feeded
I'm reading a book about Wagner and I'm going to see Walküre in December, but other than the Tristan and Tannhauser openers I haven't heard or seen anything. Is there a recording (film or album) that I should go to for a proper starter pack? Cheers lads
>>107263703incomprehensibly sickening autistic foolish moron
What are the best classical pieces written or arranged for electric guitar? Can be pieces where it's a solo instrument or symphonic work where it only plays a small role and anything in between.
>>107263718i don't think you should prepare by listening to a recording, experience it fresh when you go to see it liveotherwise you're going to be horribly disappointed with how bad Wagernian singing has become
>>107263811Guitar is barely a classical instrument, let alone electric guitar
>>107263834What makes an instrument a classical instrument?
>>107263894Intruments that are used in a classical context: wooden string instruments, metal/wooden woodwinds, percussion, piano, etc. Electric versions of classical instruments aren't used at all in a classical context but in popular ones
>>107263928The piano was deemed the death of classical music when it was invented.
>>107263950And Beethoven, Wagner and Debussy were seen as terrible composers, the decadence of music and bla bla bla, tell me more
>>107263834It's definitely not common, but I don't see any reason you couldn't compose classical music for electric guitar.Steve Reich famously wrote electric counterpoint for electric guitar.Bryce Dessner wrote some classical music with electric guitarhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXMnCi7yFvwIt's not great but I don't think it's terrible either. If there's something to dislike about it I don't think it's the electric guitar.
>>107263894An instrument is a classical instrument if there's a sizeable body of work composed for it. Almost nobody composed for electric guitar.
>>107263996Your argument just comes down to "classical instruments are whatever is used today for classical music", which is not a valid definition because it's not static.
>>107264056Do you think violins today are the same as the designs of the XVIII are the same? That before the cello came much after the viola da gamba? The use of instruments in classical music changes over time.
Mozart's Piano Concerto no. 20 is so good bros
>>107263452yes. white american.
>>107265224it's important I specify that I'm a *real* american, as there are those who reside here and hold citizenship that I don't consider americans. There's a vein of anti-intellectualism here, and conspicuously being into classical music is the domain of university educated NPR listening shitlib undesirables
>>107263718make sure you get your booster by then anon
>>107265307shitlibs are more into post-african repetitions these days
>>107250690I hate Mozart, I was driving around today listening to the classical station, and was thinking what the fuck is this saccharine Disney shit. It was Mozart. Awful
>>107265664Yeah yeahHopefully Valkyrie is decently performed, disappointing to hear Wagner singers have declined
>>107264022>Steve Reich famously wrote electric counterpoint for electric guitar.>Bryce Dessner wrote some classical music with electric guitarAnd both are shit, so…?
>>107265993>And both are shit, so…?I think that's a bit hyperbolic, but theoretically good classical music with electric guitar should exist by now.
>>107266062And practically speaking it doesn't. Your point being?
>>107250690What's your opinion on Mendelssohn's 5th Symphony? I like it.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AqdcnNYROLo&ab_channel=Addaick
>>107266080>Your point being?I haven't heard much of it and I'd like to hear more before deciding that it can't be done well.
I love all three movements of Beethoven's 9th symphony.
>>107266731Agreed. Fuck the finale.
>>107266731Agreed. Fuck the adagio.
>>107261614Just listen to Tristan und Isolde already, especially act three.
>>107261886Never got into Schumann, what's the best recording of this song cycle?
>>107263718The Jahrhundertring is easily the best filmed, even if I dislike its reggietheatre. It still has many good singers left over from the silver age of Wagner singing, unlike today which has very little as far as singing is concerned. Plus there's just no other filmed production which has such a high standard for stage directions and visuals.. even if I do disagree with its interpretation. Not sure if it would be best for you to be familiar with the best recordings since it might ruin the new singers, but this is a cool historical artefact:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YC6f8FbnVMQ
>>107263718also Ryder has some great paintings of Wagner's dramas.
>>107267371it's not a song cyclehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weJcyE1AWes
Post top 5 string quartet cycles5. Bartok4. Haydn3. Shostakovich2. Beethoven1. SchoenbergHonourable mention to Elliot Carter.
Is this good?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PsHtqVTJ_6k
has anyone here actually sat down and listened to the st matthew passion in its entirety
>>107268702yes. don't waste your time
>>107268702no. waste your time
>>107268746>>107268938the duality of tran
>>107268702I read Matthew while I listen to that piece a lot
Very cool performance but uhhh why the hell is this bowie-looking nigga putting his hand on my face?https://youtu.be/PQ9gHYiFQLQ
>>107270033he looks Greek
>tfw there are people who have fapped to a Monteverdi CD
>>107268702yes and it split my life in 2, time before hearing st matthew passion in its entirety and time after. proper religious experience, like hearing heaven for the first time, witnessing a mountain higher than you could ever imagine. or as i like to call it, the summit of all expression. this only applies to richters and mendelbergs version btw, everyone else just doesn't get it
>>107270332i fap while listening to classical sometimes, just as background noise ya know
Bach should only be played on a digital harpsichord with dynamics.
has anyone here actually sat down and listened to the parsifal opera in its entirety
>>107271751yes. i may or may not have fallen asleep midway through the second act and woken up when parsifal starts screaming about the king's wound or whatever
Rachy Concerto 2 without orchestrahttps://youtu.be/ufb2TrR3UAo
>And it seems to me that a country that can take a character as funny as Kundry seriously, this woman who sleeps for aeons and is only woken up by this horrible chord, a country that can seriously believe in anything like Parsifal without laughing, was bound to get into serious trouble.Uhhh Wagnerbros, Germanbros??? Why did the best composer of our time composer meant by this?
>>107271939His just jealous because he knows Wagner was right about Jews.Like seriously, who actually thinks a story being mythological and unrealistic is a criticism?
>>107271939nigga is named aids, who cares what he saids
>>107272082there’s something insanely funny about how grotesque and crude this hanging trannie soijak meme is
>basically calls the germans stupid>each year we still see german Orchestras shilling his musicCHAD
>>107267494>Shostakovich>Mozart not number 1>Mozart not even on the listFurther proof.
>>107271751yes and it split my life in 2, time before hearing parsifal in its entirety and time after. proper religious experience, like hearing heaven for the first time, witnessing a mountain higher than you could ever imagine. or as i like to call it, the summit of all expression. this only applies to knappertsbuschs and furtwanglers version btw, everyone else just doesn't get it
>yes and it split my life in 2, time before hearing parsifal in its entirety and time after. proper religious experience, like hearing heaven for the first time, witnessing a mountain higher than you could ever imagine. or as i like to call it, the summit of all expression. this only applies to knappertsbuschs and furtwanglers version btw, everyone else just doesn't get it
>>107272413Why would a tranny draw the tranny icon with shoulders like that?
Scarlatti wrote the same sonata 555 times
>>107267371It's for solo piano & Pollini's my fav recording
I watched Swan Lake last night and it was the most beautiful thing I've ever seen. How do I get into ballet bros?
>>107250690thoughts on this piece?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4pVRyg8lXo
>>107274539as much of an image of a slacker and savant he gives off to the public, the dude has insane talent and must have studied and practiced music theory tons as a kid. that piece is sophisticated, he knows what he is doing
>>107274539>>107274595weak bait mate
>>107274673im not OP spacker
Schubert's choral works are underratedhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kyvg5EduHVA
>>107274510>rips off Lohengrin
>>107274777aren't they universally praised?
What's the equivalent of Trout Mask Replica in classical music?
>>107274929If you're asking for weird avant garde stuff, I mean, there's so much. There's like hundreds of Trout Mask Replicas in classical music.
>>107274902It doesn't seem to me, it's always just the lieder, chamber music and the symphonies that get mentioned. Also, they aren't much recorded or performed as far as I can see.
>>107274539Aphex Twin is great but only when he produces ambient and acid, his piano pieces (and this piano cover of a non-piano piece) are boring garbage if you've listened to 5 minutes of classical music in your life. Even Debussy's throwaway pieces (or let's say "deep cuts" of his opus), for example, are more interesting and better than Avril 14th.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JriUc3eRGvY
>>107274595It's a pretty known fact that this dude just fucks around and makes anything from total garbage to great tracks.
I see this orchestra is all-menhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUm-VfeCFBIWas this common back then? Or a choice by Fürtwangler?It's refreshing to be honest, I don't know why anyone would want the soulless gender to play anything.
>>107275083So based!! Right fellas????
>>107275093Give me the name of single good female composer
>>107275083It was more common back then. Women are very often competent performers at the very least, though. I can understand the discrimination insofar as composers are concerned, but great female composers have been around forever.>>107275156Boulanger left some good pieces and probably would have been a great composer had she not died so soon. Ruth Crawford Seeger is probably the best one
>>107275156What does this have to do with anything bros??
>>107275193>but great female composers have been around forever.I only know Hildegaard.
>>107275406I meant performers.
Vivaldi is literally the Kenny G of classical.
>>107275431I don't think the best women are on the same level of skill as the best men in performing, but sure there have been a lot of great female performers especially of piano.
>>107275971Opera is the exceptionhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WA8Z5whuaIo
I have a real hard time paying attention to classical so as to know the themes being presented and how they develop. For instance I am listening to an 8 minute long Mozart movement and am 5 minutes in, and just realized I wasn't paying any attention for the past 2 minutes. For some reason it just doesn't catch my interest and my mind always deviates. I can't focus on it.
>>107277021Building memory retention of types of things, rather than particulars, is what takes time. You'll get there.Retards can memorize entire plays with practice.
>>107277072>Building memory retention of types of things, rather than particularsUh can you repeat that
Which musicians are the most buff? Drummers? Tuba players?
>>107263718Die Walkure is the second opera in the ring. Try and find either the 1976 Boulez or 1991 Barenboim video recording of the first opera Das Rheingold. Also are you seeing the ENO?
>>107277101Once you learn how to memorise musical pieces, you'll be able to do it much easier.
I've listened to and enjoyed Bartok's Hungarian Sketches twice now. What is the next piece by him I should listen to? Nothing too harsh please.
>>107277183I can already very easily memorize pieces I play. I just can't focus on pieces I'm listening to and not playing.
https://youtu.be/CmnGOxvRr1wBiber violin sonatas are peak for me
>>107277236piano concerto 3
>>107277296can someone rec some other very spare abstract stuff like this
>>107277244Oh, well just force yourself to pay attention. Duh.Or just listen to a piece when you have the utmost curiosity/desire to do so.
>>107277429>Oh, well just force yourself to pay attention. Duh.That's what I'm trying to do, but I can't.
>>107277492Why not?Besides, as I said you can just listen to pieces that you know will retain your attention (do any?).
>>107277731>Why not?That's what I'm trying to figure out...I guess I just don't like music, I don't know. I always thought I did, but I can't appreciate most of it.
>>107274595>>107274595>and must have studied and practiced music theory tons as a kidImagine being this out of touch. He literally just fucks around with stuff until he likes the sound of it. Most of it is natural curiosity and insane creativity.
a glass of beerto grease the wheels of creativityand decrease my rigid sensibilitiesso the notes can flow without fear~
https://youtu.be/i9jhxOwcaw0?t=32i like the carol of the bells influence
>>107277539Trout Mask Replica is fun, it's original, Schoenberg is just a meme.
trout ass replica
>>107277236Concerto for Orchestra
>>107278660in the butt
gay nigga thread
mods raped my grandma
>>107275156Amy Beach is actually good. I've never tolerated any other woman's music, though. She was tradpilled and pretty, may have something to do with it.
>>107281315i wouldnt trust a girl named amy bitch
>>107265692Saccharine Disney shit. My thoughts exactly. I fucking detest Mozart.
>>107253775Why do you care about accomplishing things? I used to feel this way, I just decided to stop caring and lead a modest life. I am not happy, but I am not sad. I am content.
>>107277236Divertimento, Rhapsodies for violin and piano, violin concerto (2nd)
new NBS just droppedhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3QWxjD2qBAc
What's up with Hurwitz shilling firetruck orchestrators like Koechlin? Any good stuff from fin de siecle-period France beyond Ravel and Debussy? Dukas, Franck, Saint-Saens, Poulenc?
>>107270593This is literally the most disrespectful thing you could possibly do to the music of the old masters
>>107256431He wrote very little journal entries and had few friends
>>107282891Those are pretty much everybody's thoughts who doesn't (yet) understand much about music.
>>107284318Haha imagine being content with your life. So pathetic>>107282891I thought Mozart was overrated at first. Once you understand classical music, you'll at least understand why he's so worshipped
>>107283745Koechlin is not firetruck, but anyway, check out Fauré
>>107284345Imagine giving up on being happy to be "content" instead because you gave up on accomplishing anything.Utterly pathetic.
>>107284426You can be happy with absolutely nothing. You can be happy and be starving and dying in a gutter. It's not about what you have accomplished. It's about enjoying living itself.
>>107281315Can you recommend some pieces?
>>107283286>>107284345>>107284439POV: you have no testosterone
>>107284474It goes back to the parable of Prometheus rolling a rock over the cliff. Happiness comes from within, not from what you have. I pity the narrow and superficial look you have towards life
>>107284474>prometheus>rolling a rock over a cliffThis fucking website
>>107284510lmao this has to be bait
>>107284523Fuck I replied to the wrong post now I'm the idiot
>>107284510*rock up a hill
>>107282891>>107284474Go to bed Ives you're more interesting than good.
>>107285340what does low T have to do with charles ives
>>107265692>>107282891Mozart is praised for (among other things) his use of form for the development of themesThe problem is his themes sounds fucking awful
>>107285354>Americans have a fascination for tinkerers in the basement, and that's exactly what Ives was. He had some great ideas, but they are almost always poorly executed. He was an incomplete composer, his temperament marred by an unrelenting machismo, and he refused to allow any tenderness into his music for fear of showing an emotion that was supposedly ''feminine.'' You also find this in his writings - he called Mozart a ''sissy'' and said that Chopin wore a skirt.
>>107285485never been a fan of ives but sounds like he had high T.
What's /classical/'s opinion on Franck's symphony in D minor? Just recently heard it live and I found I liked it a lot more than the last time I heard it.
>Based>never been a fan of ives but sounds like he had high T.>sounds based
>>107277783Just take it easy and force yourself.
>>107286093im literally sneed in real life
niggas really be playing polyphony on violins lmao
>>107284307Ok, whatever. I've gotten my way around hundreds of hours of the old master's music in recent years, and I'm still not partial Mozart. At what point will I appreciate Mozart? I have no formal training in music, is that what I need to understand, the technical side? I didn't go for piano lessons as a kid, guess I'll never be an aristocrat of the spirit.
>>107284465I recommend Joanne Polk's recordings.https://youtu.be/Vsh5zC30G30
>>107287109I though that simply listening made me an aristocrat of the spirit.
>>107287109Mozart is the weakest of the big three, maybe you just don't like him
>>107287780ive always felt mozart is superior to b even though i like b more personally
I need a french chubby soprano gf that sings Monteverdihttps://youtu.be/5m1RXqw0ZoM
>>107287859both b's are a lot better than mozart
>>107250690im really into strauss and vivaldi. i like the dance aspects of the former and the liveliness of the four seasons. that's about all the classical I like, have tried others with no luck. any reccs?
>>107288097Same. I can listen to Vivaldi concertos and Strauss waltzes endlessly. The best Vivaldi interpreters are I Musici, get their two volume Vivaldi Edition.https://youtu.be/n64t2NoRl4w
>>107288143will do, any suggestions for strauss? i love him but most collections dont have the Egyptian march for whatever reason
>>107288097name 100 Vivaldi concerti
why is the finale always the most uninteresting movement in a piece
>>107270593i think that every single time and im like eh whatever>>107288343we got bots on /classical/ now or something
>>107284246this is what i meant to respond to
How many hours of music has Bach composed?
>>107288097i think you'll like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLp2aGalGlU
>>107287890this. mozart is too basic
>>107289349if you're barely musically educated you know it's the complete opposite. mozart's originality is without comparison, just as with beethoven or bach. their achievements are entirely unique. and if you can't recognise this then you simply haven't studied music enough or buried deep into mozart's works.
>retard: mozart is the greatest!>midwit: mozart is basic and cliche to like>genius: mozart is the greatest!
Trve Ascendent mvsikhttps://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fVyZZ0D7l50
>>107289404Mozart is 3rd greatest at the absolute best
VarèseBoulez or Chailly?
>tfw no qt fortepiano gfhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5iFqmQFQbs
>retard Mozart underraters unable to appreciate his subtlety againSad!
>>107285485Based femboy Chopin
What's /classical/'s favorite leitmotif?
Bach and Schubert for sacred worksMozart and Verdi for operaBach and Mozart for piano piecesBeethoven and Haydn for orchestral piecesMozart and Haydn for quartets
>>107291752>Verdi for opera>Mozart and Haydn for quartetsWagner is essential for opera just as Beethoven is essential for string quartets.
Should I listen to Vivaldi's Gloria in D major, or a contemporary piece?
>>107287109What of Mozart have you listened to?
>>107291771Wagner's operas are an overbloated mess and beethoven's quartets would bs nothimg without mozart and haydn
>mozart isn't complex and experimen-https://youtu.be/VarJ-MbdgHgModernist bros... why is he playing our music centuries ahead of time... and why is he doing it better than us??????
>>107291946>Wagner's operas are an overbloated messYou're only showing you don't know anything about his operas. 'Bloated' is a nice term to use for Wagner when you want to avoid talking about his value.>would be nothing without mozart and haydnWell duhh since Haydn practically invented the string quartet. It doesn't change the value of Beethoven's quartets.
How's Mozart's use of rhythm?
>>107291977exception to the rule
>>107292301https://youtu.be/aXL2qftWZAoANTI-MOZART BROS WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS
>>107285994https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ego2qZH250Ythe faster the better
Haydn is definitely shitA real composer like Mahler or Bruckner got it all out in 9 symphonies, but this Haydn tried 104 times and if you add them all up it's still just superficial jokey stuff.
>>107293020That's just typical of the period and its forms, it's the same with Mozart. Romantic (especially late) composers put in all their originality into single and more formally unique works. But that's not to say either are better, just different.
>>107293055Yes, typical of the period. Because this is pre-Romantic music composed for the upper class. There is no 'edginess' of the suffering of the common man, no hardship, no poetic struggle. This was before 'art' for your contemplation existed. This is music paid for by kings.This is music for entertaining the court, and to keep the king's cello-playing nephew busy (or whatever). Of course it's well-crafted, just as the clothing was the finest, and the food served by the finest chefs. The best music that money can buy, and a good, lucrative gig for Haydn. $$$$$Of course, from a purely technical standpoint, the music is a delight, and are perfect studies in tonality. One must get involved on a purely sensual, musical level, enjoying the sounds, and perhaps appreciating the harmonic progressions and deviations ans returns to the home key; the delightfully balanced phrasing.Pure ear candy, but not much fodder for the soul that wishes to be challenged or tested. No angst or personal involvement, no imaginary drama being unfolded in musical gestures, like the stabbings of Beethoven, or the harmonic angst and turmoil of Mahler. That all came later, when they called it "art" and it was at least free enough from the royal commercial pressure-cooker to become actual personal expression, a.k.a."art."
>>107292513How was he so perfect
>>107292224Typical classical era blocky snoozefest
>>107293092It's amazingly short sighted to not understand that what Mozart and Bach and all the great ones did in their forms and times is what makes them great.Read Wagner.
>>107289202probably something like 60
>>107277130Yeah ENO. No idea why they're staging Walküre first
>>107291019i guess some of us consider women that appear to be 11 year old chinese boys cuteanon out of all women you could have posted playing a fortepiano to call cute why would you choose this one
Redpill me on Rautavaard. Based or degenerate? His harp concerto sounds pretty good, I liked those subtle Herrmann-like trumpets in the third movement. But the rest of his works gives me very fixed feelings, it's mostly some shit full of dissonances, with Soldier's Mass being the peak of this pile of shit. Or am I wrong and his other works are deserving a second listening?