[a / b / c / d / e / f / g / gif / h / hr / k / m / o / p / r / s / t / u / v / vg / vm / vmg / vr / vrpg / vst / w / wg] [i / ic] [r9k / s4s / vip / qa] [cm / hm / lgbt / y] [3 / aco / adv / an / asp / bant / biz / cgl / ck / co / diy / fa / fit / gd / hc / his / int / jp / lit / mlp / mu / n / news / out / po / pol / qst / sci / soc / sp / tg / toy / trv / tv / vp / wsg / wsr / x] [Settings] [Search] [Mobile] [Home]
Board
Settings Mobile Home
/m/ - Mecha

[Advertise on 4chan]


Thread archived.
You cannot reply anymore.


[Advertise on 4chan]


File: 1608886666767.jpg (538 KB, 1234x700)
538 KB
538 KB JPG
Why did mecha not make it big in the west?
>>
>>19262989
But it did, just not in the same way Japan did.
>>
>>19262989
>please ignore the transformers toys in every major western retailer
>>
>>19262989
Westerners like real robot
>>
>>19263002
>west gets confused by the robot needing a pilot
>japan gets confused by the robot not needing a pilot
Why is this?
>>
>>19262989
Because the west are military aggressors who needs to brainwash their kids with realistic depictions of war made entertainment (COD/Battlefield etc).
>>
>>19262989
It was subverted by capeshit and simultaneously snubbed by a star trek dominated sci-fi fandom that to this day, still dismiss it as unrealistic despite star trek just being a less colorful star wars with just as much space wizard magic nonsense.
>>
File: 135.png (124 KB, 680x680)
124 KB
124 KB PNG
>>19263018
>robot
To be fair a robot by definition should be autonomous, so transformers are a kind of robot, but calling a gundam robot isn't correct because they're basically vehicles, you don't call your car a robot just because it has automatic transmission.
>>
File: 1572774987482.jpg (62 KB, 675x1024)
62 KB
62 KB JPG
>>19262989
most investers don't think their is any point when you will be blow out of the water by Japanese mecha like gundam, and anytime weston mecha becomes a thing it's...
>mecha vs kaijus
or
>the iron giant ripoff number 23332
>>
>>19263127
>you don't call your car a robot just because it has automatic transmission.
Speak for yourself. My trucks onboard computer robot is my waifu. She always warns me if theres ice or tire pressure is too low.
>>
>>19262989
Define "west", several European and South American countries had major mecha booms back in the day.
>>
>>19263150
yes
>>
>>19263135
>Tetsujin ripoff number 23332

Fixed
>>
>>19262989
No marketing, lack of promotional material, unable to push violent media for children.
>>
File: 1560220822883.jpg (38 KB, 639x502)
38 KB
38 KB JPG
>>19263166
>Tetsujin
i didn't think anyone would get it so i picked iron giant.
>>
>>19263127
Japs call piloted giant robots robots. I'll go with what they call it over your tv tropes nerd-fetish -for-pointless-categorisation autism.
>>
File: gw-store-shot-wal-hor.jpg (59 KB, 740x480)
59 KB
59 KB JPG
>>19262989
>>
>>19263181
There's a generational difference there. The Japanese don't universally agree on what a "robot" is.
>>
>>19263135
>the iron giant ripoff number 23332
can't think of any examples of this at all other than MAYBE Big Guy and Rusty. Remocon robots are super rare, both in Japan and elsewhere
>>
File: 609404._SX1280_QL80_TTD_.jpg (329 KB, 1280x1716)
329 KB
329 KB JPG
>>19263237
rock & stone, cadet Yu, this.
>>
Teenage Mecha Ninja Turtles
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijgRyNeeF5I
>>
File: robot.png (969 KB, 2122x1890)
969 KB
969 KB PNG
>>
>>19263150
>Define "west"
The definition has always been USA and USA vassals.
>>
>>19262989
/m/ was huge in the US in the 70s-80s.
>>
>>19263281
>>19263215
>>
>>19262989
If by the west you mean anglophone countries, it's because anime became really popular when the golden age of mecha was already over.
>>
>>19263281
just say usa then
>>
>>19263181
Agreed.
>>
File: MLAIOS.png (698 KB, 1280x441)
698 KB
698 KB PNG
>>19262989
Several Japanese properties were imported, localized, and mutated in the west (or USA at least) which have from that point on essentially cornered and dominated the market as per >>19263002. Transformers, Power Rangers, and to a lesser degree Voltron are the full extent of giant robots in the eye of an average American, barring a relatively stereotypical and generic idea of Gundam. They have also completely colored the perception of the concept in fiction, that is, that it is solely done in certain ways (e.g. monster v. robot seems much more common than robot v. robot), that it is solely children's entertainment without much potential for merit beyond that, and that giant robots have very little place in fiction overall as opposed to the usual wizards, superheroes, spaceships, and variants thereof, except as jobbers.


This in turn has led to a certain perception in the western masses that "realism" is much lacking from giant robot fiction as per >>19263004, nevermind that "realism" with a concept like giant robots is rather nebulous and primarily aesthetic at best and in spite of other successful science fiction franchises being similarly improbable. This has led to a peculiar phenomenon of westerners talking up some giant robots (e.g. Battletech, Titanfall), but owing to the popular perceptions caused by the aforementioned mutant imports and lack of overall interest, these properties typically do not actually gain much recognition save amongst people who like giant robots anyway. There are periodic attempts of course to create media which simply does its own thing, but this is if anything even less successful most of the time.

Overall, I think the west also has a very different approach to technology in general. If you ask your average person to think "better robot" they inevitably think Terminator or The Matrix- the first impulse is fear as opposed to admiration, wonder, or hope for robots improving and uplifting life as we know it.
>>
File: b0650008.png (182 KB, 470x519)
182 KB
182 KB PNG
Because the heart of mecha requires a heart of sincerity and a willingness to embrace camp and goofiness. And the west is all about irony or not caring. We openly mock schmaltz, feel we have to subvert morals and make a show about how above our media we are. It's really quite sad.
>>
>>19263705
>>19263705
>>19263705

I wrote that wall of text but forgot this, this is a MAJOR fucking deal. People don't like being completely honest or wearing their heart on their sleeves in the west, and to enjoy mecha you have to be willing to be very straightforward and able to embrace that what you're doing is kind of ridiculous, which is exactly what makes it great. If modern superhero movies are any indication people love when shit is sarcastic, ironic, and never really straightforward about what it is.
>>
>>19263705
At one point SF in the west actually had that with Pulp SF, but lost it. I blame Campbell and the Futurians.
>>
>>19263716
>>19263705
I disagree. Westerners love sincerity and camp. Show someone Adam West Batman and he probably won't be able to help but smile. It's less that they can't embrace it and more that the people running western media companies are incapable of sincerity. The only time they feel any passion is when they're being upset. These kind of people aren't capable of generating robot fiction so they don't even try.
>>
>>19263787
They're going to smile, but if you ask them about it there will probably be an unhealthily high number telling you they like it ironically.
>>
File: outzoomers.jpg (58 KB, 630x1200)
58 KB
58 KB JPG
Get out zoomers
>>
>>19263922
Considering the movie's reception and the response to the sequel(s?) I'd say this is more of a case in point to the OP than anything.
>>
>>19263688

Adding to that is the lack of toyetic merchandising. Mecha like model cars is meant to be back with heavy model merchandise lines like Transformers but more emphasis on building model kits. I can't say any mecha series we made over here consider making models for their mechs. It is also why companies like TT can make a bunch of anime without worrying being a flop because their main selling line is the toys and models
>>
>>19263867
>probably be an unhealthily high number telling you they like it ironically.
I'm still not convinced this is a real thing that happens.
>>
>>19263922
The fucking robot falling into the crowded stands was amazing
>>
>>19262989
Niggawut. I've never met a Gen Xer that doesn't nostalgiafag over Robotech and Transformers. Same for millenials and Gundam Wing
>>
>>19263688
>Overall, I think the west also has a very different approach to technology in general. If you ask your average person to think "better robot" they inevitably think Terminator or The Matrix- the first impulse is fear as opposed to admiration, wonder, or hope for robots improving and uplifting life as we know it.
This right here. I have an associate's in automation, basically means nothing but gets me jobs. Had one where I was putting together robot systems that did Kevin Bacon's job in Footloose, palletizing. Family gathering comes around, ask what I'm doing now, say build robots, and no shit, they go "They're not bad robots, are they?"
Like yeah they stole the job from some 5 mexicans but those mexicans might not have ruined backs at age 45 now
>>
>>19264039
Said Mexicans may not have the skills to do anything but manual labor. And don't give me that retraining bullshit either, a lot of people simply can't do that. It's the catch-22 of automation, sadly, and I hope figure out some way to adjust.
>>
>>19262989
>Why did mecha not make it big in the west?
It was big. Look at the Gundam Wing boom in the 1990s.

And stuff like Big-O. Or even Transformers exploding in popularity in the 2000s.

The issue is that Modern Japan doesn't know how to make Mecha anime that appeals to the west anymore. It's too otaku and niche with their story and references. Too many

They should have looked at Gundam Wing and said "okay why does everyone love this particular Gundam?" then replicated that in other anime and sold it to the west.
>>
>>19263705
>>19263716
I only like mecha because of the robots/mechs. Cool machines.
>>
>>19264102
>The issue is that Modern Japan doesn't know how to make Mecha anime anymore.
FTFY
>>
File: 1610158932139.jpg (16 KB, 326x315)
16 KB
16 KB JPG
Mecha's always been popular with western people that liked anime.

>waking up super early to watch Astro Boy
>watching transformers on the weekends
>renting the Transformers movie every weekend for a month
>finding Robot Jox at the video rental place
>fuckin power rangers and not being able to get toys ever and it starting the ball rolling
>samurai pizza cats
>beetleborgs
>VR troopers
>Beast fuckin Wars
>staying up super late to watch gundam wing airing for the first time
>big guy and rusty
>escaflowne on the weekends
>playing MechWarrior 3 until your disc drive failed
>those obscure Cable TV networks that'd air sorts of good shit like Betterman and Macross
>going to your buddy's house with good cable to watch Big O and FLCL
>watching Robot Wars reruns
>getting off dial up and learning about Kazaa and Limewire
>Masterchef being a big deal for a while


I mean, it was big enough to get Big O s2 funded.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGY9AOiNtcg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8BGINS86ok
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLKYOSiW7U4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ae-Pl-Q34ng

>>19264102
>The issue is that Modern Japan doesn't know how to make Mecha anime...anymore

You got that right fren.
>>
>>19264240
I think people make the mistake of taking mecha's current lack of popularity and applying it to the big anime boom of the 90's and 2000's. Shit Gundam Wing, and sci-fi in general, fucking made Toonami.
>>
>>19264244
zoomers. amirite.

Looking at a niche in a (once) niche and wondering why it's not big.

Look at modern tools and trucks. They're selling fuckin transformers
>>
>>19264264
Shit I say that as one. My cousin who was and still is a giant nerd for DBZ had Journey to Jaburo, and this is around the time that Gundam's popularity in the West was finally dying out a bit.
>Look at modern tools and trucks. They're selling fuckin transformers
You're not wrong man. And I for one welcome it.
>>
File: unknown.png (721 KB, 1023x682)
721 KB
721 KB PNG
>>
>>19264274
>black South Africans
Explain further.
>>
File: Shaka-Zulu-Screenshot.jpg (15 KB, 365x273)
15 KB
15 KB JPG
>>19264277
Apparently they funded the production of a questionable TV miniseries despite apartheid sanctions on SA
>>
>>19264294
I was half-expecting something like they've been smuggling black orphans out of SA to put them to work in diamond mines or some shit. This is Harmony Gold after all, nothing's off the table insanity wise.
>>
>>19263135
I hate gen:lock, the writing is so reddit; the characters have no personality. They just talk about pop sci and how brown/gay they are.

I hated mecha until I saw NGE, War in The Pocket, and IBO.
>>
File: mazinger goes to spain.jpg (241 KB, 640x425)
241 KB
241 KB JPG
>>19262989
Many mecha shows became popular during the heydays of the genre. Pic related is an example but there's also Grendizer/Goldorak in France or the legendary Festival de robots. I'm sure The Red Baron aired in many different countries

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y23vtOF0bxw
https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2vws8e

Maybe it's just that nips got tired of the mecha genre and anime itself is an old fad
>>
>>19264307
I forget if it's just some HG staff or HG proper but they also were connected to some crap mummy movie
>>
>>19263018
>[laughs in Braves]

>>19263281
Western Europe isn't "the west"?
>>
>>19263226
>Remote operation makes it a robot
Holy shit somebody shoot this guy
>>
>>19264524
>I hate gen:lock, the writing is so reddit; the characters have no personality. They just talk about pop sci and how brown/gay they are.
Welcome to American-made mecha. This shit has infected Transformers too. Pop culture references and what sexuality they are. The last good mecha made by Americans was Pacific Rim.

At least Japan keeps that shit out of mecha for the most part.
>>
>>19265020
>The last good mecha made by Americans was Pacific Rim.
Which is funny because it was made by a Mexican.
>>
>>19262989
Transformers?

Zoids were also pretty big.

Lots of games like armored core, battle tech e.t.c.
>>
>>19263787
>Show someone Adam West Batman and he probably won't be able to help but smile.

You're missing the point. While they may laugh AT Batman they're not laughing WITH Batman. They'll laugh and get a chuckle over it. But they're not taking it seriously. And yes I realize asking people to take camp seriously is a weird statement. It makes it come off like I'm saying go edgy Dark Knight but I'm not and I really don;t know how to describe it what you want is that spot between serious and goofy. It can be different for different series but basically you want to ask people to take some crazy with some amount of genuine effort or concern. Or rather the material should take itself seriously regardless of the intended tone.

It's a bit hard to really articulate, but look at Inspectors and the new Voltron show. Inspectors pokes all kinds of fun, makes all kinds of fourth wall gags and references and the like and while it can be "tongue in cheek" it's also not selling itself short. It embraces itself openly and just goes wild. New Voltron though often felt like it was embarrassed of itself. It tried to be LOL WACKY at the wrong times for some reason and would constantly make fun of the old shows expense in a mocking not celebratory way.
>>
>>19264102
>more shitshows like Wing

No thanks. They loved Wing because it was their first.
>>
File: 12309.jpg (246 KB, 774x1000)
246 KB
246 KB JPG
>>19262989
Goldorak (Grendizer) were huge in my country (France), as well as a couple of sentai shows. For some reasons other mecha shows were not broadcasted. The generation that followed up had Saint Seiya and Dragon Ball instead of mecha stuff.
>>
File: RealisticGenerals.jpg (64 KB, 700x375)
64 KB
64 KB JPG
>>19263038
>realistic
>>
File: too much anime.jpg (63 KB, 409x520)
63 KB
63 KB JPG
>>19263705
>>
>itt /m/ pretends to understand people
>>
File: image0-209.jpg (489 KB, 933x1567)
489 KB
489 KB JPG
people think cartoons and giant robots are for kids and thus it never is made seriously

The west, specially the US has this conception that cartoons and animation are specifically either for kids or adult comedies.

making a cartoon aimed at adults or young adults that isnt explicitly a dark ironic comedy is absurdly rare specially considering how expensive animation is.
>>
File: helen-lovejoy.jpg (67 KB, 580x480)
67 KB
67 KB JPG
>>19265513
>people think cartoons and giant robots are for kids and thus it never is made seriously
Giant robots are for kids. Even Gundam 0079. It's just that nips don't have this puritan mindset about children's fragile minds
>>
>>19265513
>1/43
This part really sent my sides to orbit.
>>
>>19263688
>hope for robots improving and uplifting life as we know it

That's just because Japan is aging and historically dislike foreigners being brought in as labor.
>>
File: ;_;.jpg (218 KB, 1600x900)
218 KB
218 KB JPG
There were some good western mecha here and there, for example pic related. I doubt anyone on /m/ or /v/ ever heard of this game though.
>>
>>19266736
You don't even know what game this is.
>>
>>19262989

>transformers
>battletech
>titanfall
>pacific rim (1)

ok retard
>>
>>19264075
The point is, I wasn't making T1000s like they assumed automatically.
>>
>>19266724
Titanfall had a fun campaign shame the online was ruined by almost non existent balancing
>>
Giant robots were pretty popular during the fifties with the atomic age and space race stuff. But mecha in the west (mostly north america) just tends to be a trendy, pan in the flash sort of thing.
>>
>>19266749
Transformers is the only big name franchise there. Hell the last one bombed.
>>
>>19265253
Or know jackshit about cartoons, anime, etc.

>>19266749
Or Voltron, Gigantor, etc. Or even Japanese mecha making it huge in the west without butcher adaptions, like Gundam being huge on cartoon network. Mecha isn't as popular as some other niches, but it's a stretch to say it failed becuase stuff like ExoSquad and Megas got canceled.
>>
>>19266749
>pacific rim (1)
>(1)
>>
>>19265145
Wing was so gold. It was released in an era when western action cartoons were trash; protags were goody two shoes who injured villains who only destroyed property. Gundam Wing was none of that, this scene was so awesome ten year olds
https://youtu.be/V4U4FkGe3Sw

In western cartoons, guys would just simp for their love interest while being repeatedly rejected. In Wing however, CHAD! The women loved it too.
>>
>>19265051
>>19263787
>>19263867
>>19263716
>>19263705
Have you guys considered that some people ACTUALLY just don't like the bullshit anime usually pulls? The stupid character archetypes? The needless sexualization? The garish designs of the main mech? Why is it so hard to accept there is a niche that wants the mecha action, but without all the dumb bullshit surrounding it? We live over in Armored Core, etc, visit our threads sometime. I would LOVE a mecha anime that had the almost trying-too-hard sincerity of Ace Combat writing with some sword clashes in addition to missile spam.
>>
>>19266966
>I would LOVE a mecha anime that had the almost trying-too-hard sincerity of Ace Combat writing
We need more military anime with Ace Combat writing in general. Although I might be biased as AC4 influenced my tastes a lot.
>>
>>19266724
>>19266740
>>
>>19266978
>move at the speed of senior citizens
What mecha have they been watching?
>>
>>19266983
I think this was actually really important to keep this mantra in the studio during development. They didn't want them to be focused on MechWarrior, which might have been many devs' only exposure to mecha.
>>
>>19266986
Considering battletech was all that was mentioned probably. Just seems odd that armored core wouldn't be known to someone making a game with mechs.
>>
>>19266978
I honestly think this is what killed the game for me they really couldnt decide if they wanted it to be a mech game or a cod clone so we got some lame halfway between that ended up being an unbalanced mess
>>
>>19266983
I get that Dev's are coached by PR/Marketing people into saying horribly stupid things (like the one time an RPG dev said 'oh we never wanted to make turn based RPGs in the first place, the technology has just finally caught up') but man they didn't think this through.

All they had to do was say
>This isn't like battletech
but instead ended up alienating some of the very people they needed to advertise the game to. Granted they kept this guy quiet when Titanfall 2 came out.
>>
>>19266978
Is there ever going to be one time where Titanfall is brought up and this goddamn interview isn't posted?
>>
>>19266978
This will never not be fucking hilarious.
>>
>>19266994
These are literally ex-CoD devs, here, c'mon.
>>
>>19266966
I don't personally play or really care for video games, and I understand and accept your position, but I think it's very telling that one of the most popular and active western robot properties is Transformers while for example Titanfall is basically dead in the water.
>>
File: v2.jpg (9 KB, 600x315)
9 KB
9 KB JPG
>>19267174
Have you considered that many might not even be aware that non-goofy robots are a thing? Armored Core and Titanfall both have really high skill floors and are thus pleb filters, plus people don't really like scifi in general. My first anime was fucking Blassreiter. I watched Darker than Black after that. If I had started with something like, say, Fullmetal Alchemist or anything with that sort of tone, I'd have dropped it and never looked back. Blassreiter told a completely fucking BONKERS story but played itself completely straight the entire way. It's a better story for that than if it had really indulged in fanservice (Amanda being walking J cups excluded), stopped to have gags, had more more toyetic designs than it already did, made a big show of transformations, etc. I am SO FUCKING SICK of the stupid bullshit I have to put up with for a few good mecha moments in almost everything they put out. Is it any wonder the average person who can get behind subtitles, is into scifi, is willing to give anime a chance, is turned off by the bullshit the industry puts out on average unless they are VERY carefully guided in and their "tolerance" for this shit is built up?
>>
>>19266842
Bumblebee wasn’t a huge success but it did make a profit and cyberverse was a huge success with kids apparently
>>
>>19267184
I get the impression you have put yourself in a niche of a niche, and are looking for something you are not going to get for a long time.
>>
>>19267208
Believe me I am VERY aware of this and cherish what little scratches this itch.
>>
>>19267215
Anon, I'm not going to write any more on this, but to be totally honest, I think you not only put yourself in a position where you will always suffer, but furthermore, where you deny yourself pleasure owing to your tastes. You have my condolences.
>>
>>19267227
I still WATCH a lot of mecha stuff, anon, I just frown and am irritated when the cool plot diverts to the bathhouse scene. I like to strictly divorce my porn and my normal stories.
>>
>>19267184
>patlabor 2: the movie sequel never ever
>>
>>19267184
The people who don't like that will never like it and are better served getting into other things, and the people who do like it are the audience. You're the kind of guy who goes fishing but hopes he doesn't catch anything because he doesn't like dealing with fish. I think maybe you should just not fish.
>>
>>19267230
I'm not him but you just sound extremely haughty.
Your type isn't new either. There is always another 2serious4anime baby who will go at length about the tasteless qualities of anime and funnily enough their 'first anime' is always something similar to what you stated.
Get over yourself or don't.
>Is it any wonder the average person
Because they are the average person. That is such a nothing sentiment. You could substitute anime for literally anything that isn't pop culture.
>>19267230
You keep bringing up 'bathhouse scenes' and the like which seems you imply you only watch 'new' anime. As in nothing pre 90s.
>>
>>19267354
as a guy who watched blassreiter the entire thing is shockingly devoid of fanservice
>>
File: Spider. Peni Parker.jpg (566 KB, 1448x2048)
566 KB
566 KB JPG
>>19262989
>>
>>19267744
this shit was a fun comic book read.
>>
>>19267044
I would have posted it if someone else hadn't
>>
>>19262989
>Why did mecha not make it big in the west?

I think it is because Western movies are about celebrities first, and TV can't afford Mecha.

Mecha is very popular outside of TV and Film, like wargames and vidya, with and without overt Japanese inspiration and tropes. Take 40K for example.
>>
>>19267766
They're very rarely the focus though. I'm still beyond pissed that a game which is essentially Mechwarrior 40k exists, but it's just a rail shooter mobile game. A surprisingly decent rail shooter mobile game, but still.
>>
>>19266997
>>This isn't like battletech
It isn't like *Mechwarrior*. Mechs in Battletech lore and the board game are actually more Japanese mecha inspired in their behavior than the Mechwarrior games lead people to believe. They're not lumbering tanks that awkwardly swivel around, they're giant humanoids that run and slide and punch and kick and move their arms to fire off to the side. In the lore, mechwarriors have to wear neurohelmets in order to connect to the systems of the mech and it becomes an extension of their body; most functions are accessed through joysticks and pedals and panel buttons, but many things are done through thought and a lot of sensor data is sent directly to the mechwarrior's brain so they can "feel" the inputs and react instantly to things as if the mech itself is their own body. It's just that "giant walking tank" was a lot easier to simulate on old PCs and around that time tank games were very popular so they took a lot of inspiration from that.

Sorry for the rant, it just always bugs me that Mechwarriorfags with no other experience in Battletech as a whole try to apply the "realistic walking tank" model to all of Battletech when that's purely a quirk of the video games. Titanfall is actually much more like real Battletech than Mechwarrior is in some ways and I wish more people recognized that.
>>
>>19267766
>TV can't afford Mecha.
somewhat this TV show can only do space ships.
>>
>>19266978
I just read the actual ad and now I'm mad that they actually do say Battletech and "speed of senior citizens with a walker" in the same sentence, I assumed they said the second part but didn't call out Battletech by name. Bitch, the Locust WALKS at highway speeds and turns on a fucking dime. It would run laps around Titanfall mechs for days.
>>
File: RCO009_1471066819.jpg (1.14 MB, 2048x1590)
1.14 MB
1.14 MB JPG
both marvel and Indie comics have tried making mecha comics but they sell like shit and are always overshadowed by superhero comics.
>>
File: eva-1.png (592 KB, 800x600)
592 KB
592 KB PNG
>>19267184
This is why I find so laughably when evafags worrying about normies jumping in mass to their secret club for Netflix. Don't get me wrong, I fucking love Eva but these guys are completely disconnected from reality. For starters, eva is old and normies don't like to watch old shit. They like to watch new shit pretending to be old shit, see Stranger Things. And that's the less of the problems. As you say, Eva is full of anime tropes, embracing them and mocking them at the same time, some would say deconstructing them but a normie without experience on anime beyond Pokemon and DBZ only see cringe nerd shit about some jap wimp being the chosen one to save the world and finding himself surrounded by pretty girls (even anti-American because the US army isn't saving the day). Why would a normie watch NGE? The giant robots? That shit is appealing to kids and nerds but the kids won't watch an old show and they're kinda alienated from Netflix cartoons (see dyke-ra). The only audience left are nerds, mainly the nostalgic nerds that watched NGE when they were on highschool or college and they don't remember much about the show except Shinji was a wimp and x was the best girl. It's nostalgia fuel, like most shit Netflix has on its catalogue.

Finally it really disgust me this bullshit of keeping the fandom as a fruity little club. This is why George Lucas claimed you can't have success without the 13 years old girl demographic. Nerds are regressive, they want to be left alone in their batcave where they can't be judged by wanting to fuck a 12 years old girl. K-shit took the 13 years old girl demographic, essentially crippling the anime market on the overseas
>>
>>19267960
Wonder the reason. Comic fans not liking change?
>>
>>19267973
Dont forget the later half of the series is pure normalfag repellent. Especially the original ending.
>>
>>19267977
>Comic fans not liking change?
i think so.
>>
>>19267977
I think it has to do with the fact that western comics are hell to get into and those mechs look like fucking shit
>>
>>19267989
True but for reaching the second half, they need to watch the first half first and that just won't happen. Weebs did it back in the late 90s and early-to-mids 2000s because Eva has mechas and pretty girls. They never liked the rest
>>
>>19268004
Yeah just an observation that there are multiple stopgaps on the road to getting into eva. I do wonder how a telegraphed release of Gundam Wing on netflix would go.
>>
>>19267973
Are you from an alternate universe where Eva isn't babby's first 'deep' anime for a lot of people?
>>
>>19267977
Comics fans =/= giant robot fans
>>
>>19268020
It's babby's first deep anime for people who already have an interest in anime, not babby's first deep anime for normies who think anime is maybe okay but giant robots are lame.
>>
>>19263281
*Israel vassals
>>
>>19267866
>Sorry for the rant, it just always bugs me that Mechwarriorfags with no other experience in Battletech as a whole try to apply the "realistic walking tank" model to all of Battletech when that's purely a quirk of the video games. Titanfall is actually much more like real Battletech than Mechwarrior is in some ways and I wish more people recognized that.

Sure, but then you take a look at designs like the iconic Timberwolf and it's hard to imagine it going prone, climbing etc. I wished the system could account for more of the diversity in shape and actuation, especially in the games. Also, the MWO matches always progress from cover sniping at max range to a cavalry charge then brawl, so piloting and manoeuvring doesn't really get a chance to shine. All this because the sims can't accept the fact that LRMs are not meant to lock on like AMRAAMs.
>>
>>19267973
>As you say, Eva is full of anime tropes, embracing them and mocking them at the same time, some would say deconstructing them but a normie without experience on anime beyond Pokemon and DBZ only see cringe nerd shit about some jap wimp being the chosen one to save the world and finding himself surrounded by pretty girls (even anti-American because the US army isn't saving the day). Why would a normie watch NGE? The giant robots? That shit is appealing to kids and nerds but the kids won't watch an old show and they're kinda alienated from Netflix cartoons (see dyke-ra). The only audience left are nerds, mainly the nostalgic nerds that watched NGE when they were on highschool or college and they don't remember much about the show except Shinji was a wimp and x was the best girl. It's nostalgia fuel, like most shit Netflix has on its catalogue.

Funny thing is, because it was my first Anime outside morning cartoons so I didn't know they were tropes, I thought it was innovative.
>>
File: BgxzYhc.jpg (79 KB, 640x480)
79 KB
79 KB JPG
>>19262989
west doesn't understand man's romance
>>
>>19267977
I like mecha for the mecha designs themselves.
My main problem with ALL Western mecha is that they look like figurative or sometimes even literal garbage. I can only take so much of the "walking tank" archetype, the headless mis-proportioned ASIMO knockoff, or the blatant "legally distinct" swipe of a superior Japanese design
>>
>>19266966
well you do realize that mecha anime is quite rare and in between, so it has quite the variety
you wouldn't call patlabor and getter robo the same with all usual "anime bullshit"?
west is just obsessed over being "grown up".
robots are "toys" therefore "for kids", as well as cartoons aka anime
sure, you might dislike some regular tropes, but that's not the same as pulling whole genre under the bus.
>>
>>19268096
Creativity isnt a strong suit off the west when large sums of money are involved. Not enough passion. Theres a reason Pacific Rim stood out.
>>
>>19268096
Just fanwanking but westerners see technology as a big other, just like nature. Their conception of man is as an exceptional being created by god. There's a "pure" previous state when man lived in harmony with nature and god but it was taken away for evil/civilization/technology/whatever. Even after the death of god and Darwin, westerners can't separate for centuries of tradition so they're kinda schizophrenic right now. Asians conceive man as part of nature. He's one of the many living things, all part of the same essence. We're on the same cycle of reincarnation. Things may change their form but remain the same and not in the western's hyperindividualistic concept of eternal life but more as an essence passing through time (Buddhism doesn't have the concept of soul) and the truth changing for the time and place but still being the same truth (multiple Buddhas and Boddhitsavas). Under that perspective, technology is just another change, not necesarilly good but neither necesarilly evil. Things remain the same, even if they change on the surface. When Mamoru Oshii was asked why westerners like Ghost in the Shell so much compared to the nips, he said nips can accept the idea of having a computer on the brain but westerners are fucking terrified of that
>>
>>19266978
>Titans are not mechs
>Mechs are for nerds
>Titans are better than silly mechs
>We don't want nerds, we want the Cawwa Dooty audience
>>
>>19268157
Well they were CoD devs so I'd imagine EA wanted that money.
>>
>>19268130
>>19268121
>>19268096
I think this also ties into
>>19265051

Americans in particular either have to have it 100% "realistic" and srs bzns, otherwise they will get embarrassed to be seen liking it. OR it can be a complete parody, tongue in cheek, "so bad it's good" thing they can like "ironically" to give them plausible deniability to sincerely liking anything. They are very concerned about their public image and how the media they consume and enjoy affects it. Americans do not want to be seen as children, though they truly are.
>>
>>19268121
>Creativity isnt a strong suit off the west when large sums of money are involved.
This applies to anything ever across the entirety of the planet. It's just that the Japanese entertainment industry, for whatever reason, seems more willing to let creators go wild from time to time. Though I'd argue a lot of anime and LN's are just as creatively bankrupt as some of the shit that gets airtime on American television.
>>
>>19268171
>a lot of anime and LN's are just as creatively bankrupt as some of the shit that gets airtime on American television.

I'd say most. We have distance and language as a filter.
>>
>>19268171
This is true, the issue is not about money or corporations, the issue is that there is a severe lack of any Western artist who likes mecha enough to get good at designing any. The sheer number of mecha fans in Japan give a much better chance for more of them to also be good artists and bring more variety to potential designs.
>>
>>19268163
With the first Titanfall I feel like EA thought just the gameplay alone would have been enough to sell the game, but it just wasn't. It just doesn't have much in way of content, and this was also back during the season pass era of triple A gaming. Hell even considering the way EA treated the sequel with it's launch window, that game actually has a small playerbase left, whereas the first game is essentially dead. If you can't even get a game of Team Deathmatch, you know shit's bad.
>>
I see the pseuds and /int/ rejects are out in force today.
>>
>>19268183
And very rarely do those western designers with passion make it big(compared to others), Pacific Rim and Battletech aren't what you would call mainstream darlings.
>>
>>19268192
What a useful contribution. Why don't you flex some of those brain cells you're bragging about for us and show us all how much smarter you are than us psueds?
>>
>>19268055
>Sure, but then you take a look at designs like the iconic Timberwolf and it's hard to imagine it going prone, climbing etc. I wished the system could account for more of the diversity in shape and actuation
For the board game it depends how deep you go into the rules. The base rules do prevent the Timberwolf from taking certain actions due to a lack of hands, for example. All mechs can still go prone, so yeah some designs kind of stretch the imagination there, but Battletech is full of special optional official rules you can dig into if you want. For example, design quirks exist which do things like treat the Timberwolf's head as having less hit points than written because its head isn't really separate from its center torso, or other mechs who have quirks that prevent torso twists because their hips aren't clear enough to twist right.

>MWO matches always progress from cover sniping at max range to a cavalry charge then brawl, so piloting and manoeuvring doesn't really get a chance to shine.
Yeah, that's a big problem for sure. A lot of the Mechwarrior games can end up just devolving into circle-strafe DPS matches which is disappointing as an adaptation of a system that puts so much emphasis on piloting skill via pilot skill rolls, stabilizing on rubble with the risk of falling, skidding and sliding on pavement, melee combat, using movement to manage hit chances, etc. The mechs could be a lot more interesting to pilot but they're kind of just stuck in the slow tank DPS style. It's also really disappointing because light mechs get fucked over in a system like that because the heavy and assault mechs can just nuke them when ideally they should be incredibly difficult to hit at full speed and be able to use that to great effect.

>All this because the sims can't accept the fact that LRMs are not meant to lock on like AMRAAMs.
They really should have a way looser/weaker lock-on mechanism instead of a hard tracking lock-on, that would help.
>>
>>19268198
I wonder if Death Stranding's balancing and terrain navigation mechanics would be better suited for a mech game
>>
>>19263127
>you don't call your car a robot just because it has automatic transmission.
You don't, because you think of the car as independent of the robotics.
My thermostat is a robot, but if I call everything a robot, that is a robot, then a lot of sentences become vague, and require more pointless words.
Cars and thermostats are robots, we just have other names to refer to them by, for ease of regular communication.
>>
>>19268196
As if whinging about Americans for billionth time and invoking Buddhism and Nietzsche for some fucking reason is anymore intellectually stimulating.
>>
>>19268205
Having to balance your machine the middle of combat would be pretty rad I think. Especially if the balance takes into account the way weight is distributed. Say you have a heavy cannon on one side with a small machine gun on the other, and this causes your mech to be more likely to lose balance.
>>
>>19263180
>iron giant
No one saw Iron Giant. It bombed, and only saw life in some home sales and youtube video essays.
>>
>>19268205
Oh, now there's a neat idea. I'd love to see a mech sim that tried stuff like that.
>>
>>19268215
>No one saw Iron Giant.
>he doesn't remember when it was on Cartoon Network seemingly almost daily for years
>>
>>19268208
A car and a thermostat literally do not fit the definition of a robot. Shut the fuck up forever.
>>19268215
It still made 30 mil and still sees a fuck ton of airtime on TV. Now I'm sure the number of people who watched to completion is a bit low but come on now.
>>
>>19263266
I would watch this.
>>
>>19263787
I would kill for a 66 or a Brave And The Bold style Batman right now.
>>
>>19268209
So you got nothing?
>>
File: 5572.jpg (48 KB, 640x480)
48 KB
48 KB JPG
>>19268213
>>19268220
Didn't Steel Battalion do this?
>>
>>19268229
>A car and a thermostat literally do not fit the definition of a robot. Shut the fuck up forever.
Sure they do. A thermostat has just one task. While a car has a million tasks. Just different complexities.
>>
>>19268166
Accurate post
t. American
>>
>>19268248
Actually yes, and it is at least partially in agreement specifically about America's realtionship with camp and such. We really do seem to have some kind of problem with sincerity in media, at least when said media is inherently silly. I mean it's even bled into the MCU, with all the quips and shit. I do believe that this plays a part in why mecha just doesn't grab American audiences. Plus the love of sci-fi that the 50's-80's had has been gone for a while, people don't have as much hope for the future as they once did.
>>
>>19268251
Cars aren't capable of performing their actions without constant input of somekind though. And it's mostly mechanical, with some computer assistance. Meanwhile the thermostat in and of itself is not a robot, it's a computer which as used as the control unit for your A/C system. Funnily enough, you could argue that system is a robot.
>>
>>19268260
Well when the only recent exposure to technology is an iPhone with nothing new except a higher price tag every year, there's nothing to really stimulate the imagination.

Consumer grade technology has plateaued for a while now, and there are no grand visions or plans for the future anymore
>>
>>19268250
I think it did. I never played it, but I recall people referencing that and I know its controller had 3 pedals so it could definitely facilitate that. That game was something else, I really wish I could play it without spending like $1000 buying the controller, and old Xbox, and a large enough CRT TV.
>>
>>19268283
>there are no grand visions or plans for the future anymore
Well, there are... it's just that they all involve Orwellian nightmares that sometimes even make normies uneasy, as opposed to the freedom promised by the invention of space travel, the internet, etc.
>>
File: metal-wolf-chaos.jpg (234 KB, 1200x800)
234 KB
234 KB JPG
Still wonder why it took as long as it did to get this ported to the states.
>>
>>19268260
MCU is symptomatic of the problem inherent to American media overall of a problem with sincerity about silliness, but if you look closely it was manifesting itself in other ways long before the MCU as we know it became popular.
>>
>>19268278
>Cars aren't capable of performing their actions without constant input of somekind though.
Yes they do, you can even resume cruise control, while at a low speed, and the car will return to that speed on its own and shift gears for you. In a few years, we won't even be touching the steering wheel, just putting a location into the gps.
Glad we agreed that the thermostat is also a robot, that goes by a different name.
>>
>>19268166
>Americans in particular either have to have it 100% "realistic" and srs bzns, otherwise they will get embarrassed to be seen liking it. OR it can be a complete parody, tongue in cheek, "so bad it's good" thing they can like "ironically" to give them plausible deniability to sincerely liking anything. They are very concerned about their public image and how the media they consume and enjoy affects it. Americans do not want to be seen as children, though they truly are.

A lot of this is about appealing to women. Women love marvel capeshit so men can amass funkopops and maybe still land a 5 or 6. Liking mecha is female repellent
>>
>>19268295
9/11
>>
>>19267960
Sentinels look like shit so no wonder.
>>19267354
First thing that came to mind, Argevollen stuck out as an example of "this seems neat" only to be muddied by it. I can also complain about Tekkaman Blade being made worse by constant stock footage transformations, the tranny being overly exuberant and annoying in that unique Japanese way, the animation quality bei bgg seriously hurt by having to stick to a standard cour length of about 50 episodes and thus all the awful filler before Tekkaman Axe, which ate up the money leading to the awful execution of the final confrontation with Evil being a slideshow, etc. It's not hard to find examples.
>>
>>19268296
The MCU is dependant on a symbiotic relationship with the Disney media empire, the Disney social media department and monopolistic practices on theaters though. It didn't just happen
>>
>>19268166
I have this experience a lot with my brother. There's a lot of silly shit or "bad movies" that I genuinely enjoy. When I tell him I liked something like that he'll literally just deny it.
>No, you didn't.
>You mean it's so bad it's good?
>You mean you liked it in an ironic way?
>It's a bad movie, how could you possibly like it?
And so on. It's actually really, really frustrating and he's not the only one who thinks that way, it's definitely something ingrained into American culture and it's not good.
>>
The first full-length anime series I watched was Ideon, on Youtube, just because I wanted to know all the context of that gif of the small girl getting her head lasered off.
>>
>>19268370
I know, I'm just saying it represents a lot of problems both with American media as a while whilst also embodying the weird hypocrisy inherent to the media landscape as we know it.
>>
>>19268166
Again, have you guys REALLY just not considered that that's not what everyone is looking for all the time? I loved Band of Brothers. Why can't I have OYW band of brothers, disregarding the grasping claw of Bandai over what is and is not allowed for Gundam? I also enjoyed Gun X Sword because it overcame and embraced its stupid bullshit, but I find it extremely annoying that I don't have a choice and can only have stuff. You can make an incredibly trope filled, bog standard story, commander sacfificing himself in a last stand, last minute secret prototype or unlocked capability for the final confrontation, etc, I love that shit, just fucking don't put a 14 year old in the cockpit, don't have the bridge bunnies fit your standard tsundere, socialite, etc archetypes, so on. Play it straight for a change.
>>
>>19268384
I have the same disagreements with my gf and any other normalfag

They cannot look past production values and see a genuine effort of the creators, they can't appreciate craftsmanship and creativity if it isn't hollywood-polished and heavily promoted. This is where the mecha genre lives, in that odd space where most of it is low value and low budget, but high effort and high passion.
>>
>>19268401
Who the fuck are you even talking to? Nobody here is the head of an anime studio, we don't make the shit.

I like robots, I don't care about your gay bromance war stories and fanservice doesn't bother me as long as there is a cool robot to look at.
>>
>>19262989
>Why did mecha not make it big in the west?
America didn't get nuked. They have a different relationship with technology.
>>
>>19268171
Maybe the fact that there's so much self published work in japan has something to do with it. Look at how many anime are adaptations of some guy's literary passion project and its fair to see why most of them are lazy power fantasies with the odd completely out there idea.
>>
>>19263127
The original Gundam had a learning computer and could operate autonomously.
>>
>>19268508
I'm not sure I would go that far, it was never explained exactly what "learning computer" even meant, and the only time it moved autonomously seems like Amuro simply programmed it to continue walking forward and shoot up at the very obvious place Char was camping
>>
>>19268511
Isn't that robot level functionality though?
>>
>>19268516
I don't consider a wind-up toy to be a robot. It should be able to make a decision without any human input, I don't see that. ALICE is a robot because it controls itself. Wing Zero stands up and moves without Heero's input, which makes it a robot (which is terrifying)

But maybe I'm wrong and Amuro didn't give it a basic script to follow and the Gundam just walked off and did its thing while he was taking a leak
>>
>>19268529
You know all robots are programmed and follow scripts and routines, right? I don't see why true AI functionality is required for something to be considered a robot.
>>
>>19268568
For myself, there is a minimum of complexity required before I consider a machine to be autonomous. Again, is a wind up toy a robot? It can walk forward and move its limbs, but to me that's not enough.
>>
>>19266983
>What mecha have they been watching?

Their frame of reference is Battletech. The tabletop and PC games, and maybe its poor animated series. Basically that is the full publicly established scope of the mech genre as done by the US. (And even that still stole a buttload of designs from the Japanese. But nobody's supposed to bring that up, because it's a no-no place to touch.)

It's indicative of the general problem that Japan has with bringing over its mecha shows to the west: a preconception problem.


It's not just the "cartoons are for kids" stigma. The other end of the spectrum has people that actually *want* flashy and over-the-top, but still think mecha isn't like that - because they've got stuff like Battletech on the brain.
>>
>>19268301
You're a fucking moron. Cars and thermostats are not robots, they do not meet any of the criteria to be robots, because they are a motor vehicle and a simple computer that is part of a larger system. They are not robots you fucking moron.
>>
>>19268592
>is a wind up toy a robot?
Maybe not, but a toy that you program with a set of routines to perform specific actions in specific orders definitely is. Is autopilot on a plane not autonomous because it follows specific parameters and doesn't learn or act with free will?
>>
>>19268592
Most real life robots aren't fully autonomous. It's not specifically necessary to fit the term.
>>
>>19268620
adj.
Not controlled by others or by outside forces; independent.
adj.
Independent in mind or judgment; self-directed.

A plane's autopilot still needs input and supervision by the two human pilots, and cannot actually make decisions or directions.
>>
>>19268638
Why are you using adjective definitions to back up your point when we're talking about a noun?
>>
>>19268644
That's the definition of autonomous. I asked if airplanes on autopilot are autonomous.
>>
>>19268657
I see. Misunderstanding on my part.
>>
File: 1257897329719.jpg (72 KB, 501x633)
72 KB
72 KB JPG
>>19262989
Westerned believe that PEOPLE win war and mecha are merely bigger but expendable gun.
Even in their Air Force propaganda it's all about the pilot.
Japan accepted the power of TECHNOLOGY. Even if the pilot is rather important, the machine is just as well.

Then there's Hollywood stupid "test public", the kind who supposedly need the pilot visible or they don't know it's a person, or need to see the overpaid actor lips moving or it's not engaging
>>
File: Waterfail.webm (3 MB, 800x450)
3 MB
3 MB WEBM
>>19268205
I had that very discussion with anon a week or two ago. Posted this webm.
Death Stranging gameplay is rather old school. It's not physics, it's the hard way of decomposing the movement so that every loadout have a dynamic that make sense.
But when you played the vehicle it was honestly a disaster. Really telling you "Stop driving! Star Walking!".

It can work for humanoid design, with a proper setting to justify it.
But we won't go anywhere if we can't get proper physics for non-humanoid mecha.

I want to pilot Metal Gear REX or RAY with a proper physics or any design made by Yoji Shinkawa
>>
>>19268671
Same reason they have to find an excuse for capes to keep taking their masks off as often as possible, people want to see celebrity faces
>>
>>19268694
I really liked the controls and feel of piloting Rex in MGS4
>>
>>19268301
Robot imply the ability to take decision without human intervention.
Self-driving car can count as robot but maintaining cruise-control is not taking decision.
>>
>>19268699
>people want to see celebrity faces
I'll never understand this mentality. Seeing recognizable celebrity faces or hearing celebrity voices is more likely to take me out of the story and reduce my enjoyment. Judge Dredd is a great example of a movie that was greatly improved by the main actor's face not being visible the entire time.
>>
>>19268729
Celebrity worship has been ingrained into the American psyche by generations of hollywood propaganda.
>>
>>19268705
How do you feel about calling factory machines that replace humans "robots"? Like those arms that work the line and do stuff people would normally do with their hands? Are they autonomous and are they robots? They don't make decisions, they only follow explicit programming routines put in by humans and have no ability to deviate from those, even down to error correction or emergency procedures; all pre-programmed. Does that disqualify them from being either of those things?
>>
>>19268757
Right, those are machines but I don't think they qualify as robots, despite the common label. I think the idea of a robot is too far advanced for what we can yet do, but the word became synonymous with any machine that is not a vehicle.
>>
>>19268729
You like that because you're a fan of the original Judge Dredd but most of this shit is not aimed at fans anon its aimed at casuals and people who are only surface level familiar with the original material
>>
>>19266966
There is no needless sexualization in mecha anime. All sexualized depictions of women greatly enchance the viewing experience.
>>
>>19268765
It's even true of things I'm not familiar with ahead of time, or original screenplays, or anything. Once a celebrity is too recognizable it becomes hard to see them AS that character. Will Ferrel will always just be Will Ferrel, Tom Cruise is just Tom Cruise, and so on. It makes the story harder to connect with and become immersed in. The less familiar I am with the actors, the better, imo.
>>
>>19268705
>Robot imply the ability to take decision without human intervention.

It literally implies the opposite. Robot comes from slavic language and means slave labor: do what you're told and nothing more.
>>
>>19268729
>>19268748
You guys can't talk because the waifu faggotry toward VAs on the anime fandom. They're essentially idols these days, that's why they're called seiyuu idols, with the same non-sensical bullshit of preserving a purity image. And to make it even worse, they all sound the same because VAs are forced to speak in a predisposed cutesy highpitched tone for women or the neutered harem lead or fujobait seme for men.
>>
>>19268800
I was not implying Japan was any better off. I'm not a Jap, so I don't speak on Jap matters
>>
>>19268800
I'm not Japanese and I don't keep track of any anime VAs. I'm not in tune with that because I don't live there.
>>
>>19268800
>American feels like any negative observation of his country must be countered with lashing out at some other unrelated country
>>
>>19268800
tu quoque
>>
File: 1309502344636.gif (23 KB, 722x438)
23 KB
23 KB GIF
>>19268757
How do you feel about calling factory machines that replace humans "robots"?
Clearly robot since they are a whole system with both sensor and actuators, they will only act if things match the parameters, or stop when it doesn't.

The opposite would be an automaton, doing the move but not meant to have any feedback trigger go or stop mechanism.

>>19268762
Despite the abuse of language, Machine do become robot when sensors and alternate choice sequence appear.
You can build a robot without electronic, it's just pitifully simple

>>19268789
And slave do the task autonomously.
It's the difference between say, a waterwheels that can't help itself from rolling, and the 'robot' who take decision so it worth smoothly and don't don't break if there's a flood.
>>
>>19268800
Criticizing legitimate domestic culture problems does not equate to excusing foreign cultures for theirs. Whataboutism is no help here in any case
>>
>>19268821
>>19268832
Not an American. In fact, I hate them and I hate celebrity worship in general. More like another weeb pointing out weeb hypocrisy
>>
>>19267973
I wish I lived in your bubble, dude. Eva is literally a middleschooler's first anime. I see a lot of people say that /m/ is out of touch but this nigga is living in an alternate reality where evangelion is niche and EoE never happened and Rahxephon took off instead.
>>
File: forever, forever.jpg (9 KB, 160x263)
9 KB
9 KB JPG
>>19268844
I may be a little shocking to you but you're not a teenager anymore and we're not in the late 90s or the 2000s for that matter. Only because middle-schoolers from your generation were interested in this "satanic" cartoon doesn't mean the tastes and trends stayed the same for 20 years
>>
>>19268835
I'm an American, but it's still a tu quoque deal, no? VA nonsense may be nonsense, but nowhere was it ever said that one was better than another, and my country does have a bad celeb obsession that has, in relevance to the topic, contributes to mecha media getting shafted.
>>
>>19268849
I'm gonna be honest, I don't know how the fuck do I even reply to this post. Anon were you in prison for the last 15 years? Or stranded on an island in the middle of the pacific? You're trying to imply that tastes chane from generation to generation but Americans still absolutely love star wars and marvel superheroes. Boomers liked evangelion, millenials did too and gen Z does as well. Everyone with at least a slight interest into anime has at least heard the name.
>>
>>19268867
>Everyone with at least a slight interest into anime has at least heard the name.
Not him and this was like, 10 years ago but I once knew a girl in hs who was a massive weeb who had somehow never heard of eva before. Her taste in anime was also predictably garbage.
>>
>>19268867
>Everyone with at least a slight interest into anime has at least heard the name.
Not him but, that was more or less his point, they known "get in the robot shinji!", some other memes and that the end was a bunch of nonsense, they don't have an interest beyond that
>>
>>19268850
>my country does have a bad celeb obsession that has, in relevance to the topic, contributes to mecha media getting shafted.
Yeah that's bullshit, I don't buy that at all. Do you know how many cut-in shots there are of the pilots in all forms of mecha media? That has nothing to do with it in America, mecha's lack of popularity is mostly a problem of pre-conceived notions about shows that focus on them, in addition to a distaste for sincere campiness.
>>
File: Eva appeal.jpg (148 KB, 496x1108)
148 KB
148 KB JPG
>>19268933
The Eva overseas fandom is overwhelming male. There's no inceptive for women to watch eva, it looks like another cringe boys cartoon. Women hating Shinji doesn't help and the promise of yaoi for one episode only near the end isn't enough for more female weebs
>>
>>19266966
This. Gib real robot anime pls.
>>
>>19268982
what if i told you the majority of people i know irl who enjoy it to the point of actually talking about it or owning merch are women or gay?
>>
>>19269435
I'd assume you're posting from the SEA or maybe Europe
>>
i feel like gundam not coming to the west in its entirety, and I mean as a franchise (show, toys and gunpla), during the 80s, made it hard for mecha to dig in the heels of children's fav shows. Of course we do have stuff like voltron and robotech, but if you told kid me that instead of an action figure I could have a mecha from a show that I could watch on tv, and I could build it myself, I'd take it in a heartbeat. I really do think the "DIY" aspect of gunpla makes it a step above other toys, similar to lego.
>>
>>19269618
canada. generally if hetero dudes are into anime, they find the appeal they want in other shows. there are far less homo shows than eva when it comes to whatever they want: pseudo-intellectual bullshit, mecha, teen drama, or just generally oddity. straights still like and watch it, but people who put it as their favourite? women and gays
>>
>>19269784
or maybe they just say it's their favorite cause that way they gain attention from you.
because all they carve for is attention, not hobby.
hobby is the means of gaining attention
>>
>>19269790
>women trying to gain the attention of some mecha nerd who posts in a Bangladeshi dildoforging group chat
Funny joke.
>>
>>19269807
yes and?
one nerd, then another nerd, then few dozens more and that's all it takes to feel good about themselves.
plenty worth it to half heartedly watch some shows and buy some plastic
>>
>>19269810
Why fake it to watch robot cartoons when you pick something infinitely more accessible?
>>
>>19269856
because it's easier to gain attention that way?
There is separate thread about vtubers and people going crazy just cause they mentioned some mecha show in one way or another. It really doesn't take much for people to start worship someone.

Mecha is niche as fuck in west, so people who like it are extra gullible and easy target to exploit, while other less niche and more accessible hobbies have already some competition for that level of attention.
>>
>>19269876
Anon that's just typical v-tuber autism. But you're getting really close to 'no one genuinely likes anything, it's all for attention' territory.
>>
>>19269940
nah, I didn't mean in general that women or anyone else can't just like things.
it was more to response to that other anon which claims that women and gays are avid mecha fans with "favorites", as if these are main western mecha "fanbase".
I won't judge his social circles, but whenever I see people yell strongly about what their favorite things on the left and the right - that for me looks just attention whoring and demand for validation of opinion, instead of actually enjoying the hobby.
Sure, people can like things in different ways, but when talk goes about specific groups which adore attention and thrive on it - I think it's safe bet that majority of that interest in mecha doesn't come from a good place.
>>
>>19269967
It kinda depends on if they like the usual 'I don't like mecha but' shows like, and only talk about them. Though even that is a very rough metric to use.
>>
>>19269976
dunno, maybe
even if they genuinely like mecha, they probably just more noticeable that general audience because they love to shout about their hobbies on left and right even without need of attention.
While majority is usually just content with having hobby and won't say much unless asked directly. It's a hobby which combines pretty well with solitude.
>>
>>19268800
Except that no one on /m/ does that. It's fucking Japanese anime fans that are so obsessed with VAs and idols they fucking hound them. Worst people on /m/ do is go "oh, yeah Atsuko Tanaka sounds cool", ffs.
>>
>>19266966
>Needless seuxalisation

Fuck off, prude.
>>
>>19267973
This post is so uninformed, /a/ and /tv/ are plagued with "woah I just finished eva and omg it's the best thing ever what should I watch now?!?!" posters, and yes those count as normies, I'm not one to gatekeep so I don't mind it, I just wish they'd stop pretending to be oldfags or know about eva just because they watched a youtube video "explaining eva and all the super hidden and deep lore", hell I know girls from my uni have seen it in netflix and when the discussion came up they said something along the lines of "yeah it's supposed to be the best anime ever, it's so good and complicated you can't even understand it, you have to watch so many youtube videos to do so! omg I love evanJellyon!".
And don't forget about the zoomer "being straight in 2021 is soooo weird like omg" demographic.
>>
>>19262989
You mean other than toeizinger in Spain and Italy and transformers in anglo countries? No idea.
>>
File: 1605039285525.jpg (149 KB, 492x368)
149 KB
149 KB JPG
>>19268166
My parents still rewatch old spongebob and ren and stimpy occasionally cause they liked it when they watched it with me when I was a kid. But I'm the only one whose a manchild cause I watch "stupid anime shit". Then again they still think anime, and by association mecha anime, is exactly like Astroboy and Speed Racer, annoying loud garbage. I think most Gen X and older Millennial Americans think like this. Then again im just projecting my parents and uncles mindsets to everyone else their age. Americans don't like fun goofy stuff already, but anime just had a rough start for so long that its got a stigma like nothing else here. Nowhere near as bad sure, but still prevelant.
>>
gobots
>>
>>19270135
>Except that no one on /m/ does that.
oh boy, you've never seen Bubblegum Crisis with /m/ then
>>
>>19270152
Honestly at least here in Italy this is something of the past. Young people don't know anything about these old animes that were popular here and have at most a very vague image of what they are. Old people are mostly nostalgic about the songs and their childhood, only a niche is a "fan".
>>
>>19270156
Hey at least one of your parents didn't call anime the devil. I'm not even entirely certain they realize Gundam is Japanese. Shit makes me my anime consumption like it's a drug habit or some shit. It's bled into video games too.
>>
>>19262989
I guess, chicks don't dig giant robots after all.
>>
>>19270236
I know for a fact that people here in South America know and watched Mazinger, Astroboy and even Lupin, but I don't think that at the time it was marketed as "anime", it was probably seen as just japanese scifi cartoon, or maybe not even that, but I guess not having your own supply of national cartoons helps removing the stigma of foreign animation, does it really make a difference if it comes from Japan or the US? As long as kids like it and it's not satanic, right?.
But yes, I haven't met any 40+ years old people that are fans of anime or any of the shows broadcasted back in the day, I do however know that Ghibli is extremely popular in that demographic, I guess having Spirited Away in the early 2000's helped exposing people to their studio. And newer generations are overexposed to seasonal crap and the usual "must watch classics" like Bebop or Eva, so there isn't a bond between old anime enthusiasts that remember watching it back in the 70's and newer generations, probably because they didn't bother releasing VHS of the shows, it was all just broadcasted on tv.
>>
File: not zeta.jpg (172 KB, 723x508)
172 KB
172 KB JPG
>>19267960
>Indie comics
do USAfags still make sci-fi comics, i only see Europe sci-fi fantasy comics selling somewhat well in shops?
>>
File: bread.jpg (29 KB, 480x360)
29 KB
29 KB JPG
>>19262989
One thing I don't get after skimming through this thread is the whole idea people are propagating that Mecha was big in the US at one point in the 80s/90s

>Voltron
Is definitely an icon of the 80s much like He-Man or GI-Joe, but every attempt to revitalize the series has failed to get any recognition among the general audience asides from Legendary Defender, which dialed down the giant robots fighting aspect of the original down in favor of having general space adventure show
>Transformers
G1's popularity died down after 1986 and never reached the highs of the 84/85 seasons until a decade later when they tried doing something new with Beast Wars.
>Power Rangers
The Power Rangers boom was only for MMPR (Primarily just the first season, and to a lesser extent the second/third), and by the time Zeo had come out the spark was gone. This is also in part why you see MMPR getting milked the most in merch and comics and such, since to them Mighty Morphin' IS Power Rangers
>Gundam
Wing was the only Gundam that Toonami aired that got any real popularity with general audiences in the early 00s, and every attempt they made to get audiences interested in UC stuff constantly failed due to external reasons (lol 9/11). The only other show that came close in terms of popularity was G Gundam and that got burned out due to a flood of merch.

That was it during those 20 years. You may have had some other mecha shows here and there like Robotech, Exo-Squad, and even Evangelion to a degree, but they never reached the levels of popularity the above four did during the 80s/90s.

Also note that not a single one of those 4 shows were 100% American-made, be it dubbing Japanese animation (Voltron, Gundam), Taking japanese footage and splicing it together with newly filmed/written scenes with american actors (Power Rangers) or taking Japanese figure designs and making up a backstory for them (Transformers). Most American creators can't wrap their head around the appeal of mecha.
>>
>>19270532
I think power rangers actively damaged mecha, actually. Something as awful as the average sentai show ruins the ability to look at something like a Wanzer with admiration.
>>
>>19270532
The point of mentioning some of those earlier isn't that they were popular, but that heedless of popularity they shaped popular conceptions of mecha which have in part prevented it from ever being taken seriously by large audiences and at the same time have dominated what little open market there is for mecha.
>>
>>19270655
the funny because this is what boomers bring up, power rangers and Sailor Moon to mock anime as a" haha this is what weebs like!"
>>
>>19270670
Are they wrong, really? Look at the backlash I receive here: "No, you just don't want to ADMIT you like the silliness mixed in!" No, I just genuinely don't.
>>
>>19270532
Stuff like this happens in every one of these threads about mecha's lack of popularity. Lots of projection, assumption, and straight up pulling things of their ass.
>>19270655
What awful bait. Especially because MMPR basically nothing in common beyond suit footage with the original sentai.
>>19270831
Anon I'm pretty sure the people who have engaged you are calling you a faggot for your attitude about your taste(which you are). You're fishing for something that doesn't exist and keep wondering why you're disappointed.
>>
>>19270831
You aren't being castigated for "not liking silliness", you're being castigated for putting yourself in a position where you will almost always lose and then complaining about it.
>>
>>19270655
super robots and kaiju were things before real robots really made it. sentai is based a lot on the super robot and kaiju genres. real robots also kind of come from the same place, but to say that their existence "damages" more serious looking mech shows is dumb. the realistic mecha needs to do something to stand out and define itself more.
>>
>>19264524
>I hated mecha until I saw NGE, War in The Pocket, and IBO.
What were you exposed to previously? what did you like/dislike (trying to study non-fans and how they became fans)
>>
>>19268529
I work in robotics. You are an idiot.
>>
>>19268638
You do know a robot is any machine which replaces human effort and can make decisions.

Even if the decision is incredibly granular and is made up of the components of the machine (eg: fly-by-wire) that's still robotics you moron.

I swear to christ you idiots are the one thing in my field I still cannot stand.

>>19268638
LMAO NO IT DOESN'T. HUMANS ARE THERE LITERALLY JUST FOR LEGAL AND INSURANCE PURPOSES. UNMANNED VEHICLES WHICH MAKE THEIR OWN DECISIONS ARE CONSTANTLY FLOWN AND HAVE BEEN SINCE THE 1980'S.
>>
>>19268783 [subjective opinion]
>>
>>19268849
>>19267973
Everybody knows Eva, fap to the doujins but very few people remember it outside of clips and memes, or have even watched it.
>>
>>19268205
Already working on it. You can't move quickly without balancing into the motion and it makes changing direction quickly hard unless you are really skilled. If you fuck it up, you topple.

In the air, balancing into movement cuts down on aerodynamic drag. Balancing against applies breaking force.

Leaning against certain movements will improve your turn-speed both on the ground and in the air.

Prototype currently works as a combination of gyroscope controls and analogue left trigger, but also works fine based on last direction left stick was maxed in. Also works with twinstick, with the left thumbstick on the left stick being move if the mainstick is balance or vice-verca, without need for analogue trigger input to apply balancer.
>>
>>19272665
I'll have you know that only humanoid robots with true AI like Sonny from the classic 2004 Will Smith movie I, Robot can be called robots! I don't care what your degrees or expertise in the field say!
>>
>>19272665
So a thermostat technically is a robot then?
>>
>>19270499
Uprising killed Pacific Rim and the comics, titanfall has been overshadowed by apex legends and they never sold any comics.
>>
>>19272883
>titanfall has been overshadowed by apex legends
For some reason this sentence made me imagine a battle royale game with mechs and now I'm sad that doesn't exist.
>>
>>19272869
No, amplifying human effort is defined as some form of movement and the manipulation of one's environment. A thermostat doesn't meet those terms.
>>
>>19272905
i.....fuck it would be cool
>>
generally the west doesn't realize the need for recognizable and distinct silhouettes. so many western mechs' silhouettes just look like a pile of boxes. it is a very important aspect to mecha design that i think is overlooked
>>
>>19273534
We got garbage like Bayformers because of exactly the opposite in design philosophy where every design starts off as a "unique silhouette".
>>
File: 1529780479804.png (362 KB, 500x683)
362 KB
362 KB PNG
>>19262989

Here, have some old copypasta from 2019 to explain it. Just sub in other companies for non-Gundam mecha.

Also, Americans in particular have trouble reconciling giant robots with gritty anything. All of us burgerlanders on here are exceptions.
>>
File: Heavy_Gear_II_cover.png (257 KB, 280x341)
257 KB
257 KB PNG
>>19262989
I guess because Power Armor is already the western sci-fi flex.
>>
File: download.png (168 KB, 489x275)
168 KB
168 KB PNG
>>19273994
those aren't recognizable silhouettes though. they all look like they could be homer's attempt at building the barbeque.
>>
>>19273994
Not sure how you came to that conclusion. Bayformers is shit for so many other reasons, including a mess of horrible design decisions. Recognizable silhouettes are not the problem.
>>
>>19274000
Gears aren't powered armor, they're VOTOMS-sized. But if you really want to talk about powered armor, I'll never stop unironically believing that Iron Man 1 is the best mecha movie America has ever produced. It's too bad that most of its best qualities didn't get inherited by its sequels or the rest of the MCU. Iron Man 1 wasn't even all that quippy; its humor was mainly physical.
>>
>>19274526
What's so good about the first Iron Man? I never got the hype.
>>
>>19274535
It established how mecha would be introduced into a setting that initially looks the same as the real world, and it goes into detail about how Tony solves engineering problems and gradually refines his technology. It was the best attempt at making powered armor look realistic since MADOX-01.
>>
File: Crashandburn.gif (726 KB, 500x329)
726 KB
726 KB GIF
>>19263922
>>
>>19268250
Something like that. Driving like an asshole or go too fast over rough terrain, turn too fast and the recoil on certain weapons could tip you over.
>>
>>19266724
>>19266978
It's just cod reskin.
>>
>>19273996
>Here, have some old copypasta from 2019 to explain it. Just sub in other companies for non-Gundam mecha.
>MFW I was saying that shit for YEARS before that.

Japanese Media Companies Cannot Into International Business has been a thing since the early 2000s bro. I'm surprised it took so long to get meme'd.
>>
File: 1382922681019.jpg (519 KB, 1000x1541)
519 KB
519 KB JPG
>>19274526
>I'll never stop unironically believing that Iron Man 1 is the best mecha movie America has ever produced
>>19274570
>It was the best attempt at making powered armor look realistic since MADOX-01.

You really have an abysmally low starting point. Even for America, even limited to movie.
Iron Man is the CGI equivalent of a high budget power ranger suit. Talking of realism is delusional and insulting for all the designs who actually put effort into having physical mass, visible power source and actuator.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j51DfrLHUek
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWH2w-LUVc0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1HU4zo-rks
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2_K97t5EA4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xz_HOkA1RwU

other design
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4QghULoUfE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gzT41a3PHE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiNVjkJDsqI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6ttDZFmGqg
>>
>>19275371
not him but are you a newtype?
>>
File: 1411646145772.jpg (145 KB, 768x1024)
145 KB
145 KB JPG
>>19275405
I probably fit the autistic requirement.
>>
>>19274945
>Mid-2000s

Try forever. Japanese companies have never really been great at promoting their own products abroad without foreign companies or subsidaries serving as middlemen and the amount of fuck ups and sheer 'We don't care' during the 70s, 80s and 90s was extraordinary. It's amazing that they ever acheived any success at all.
>>
>>19275371
The AMP suits from Avatar and the power loader from Aliens suffer from the problem of wanting to see the actors' faces mentioned in >>19268699. That's excusable because they're repurposed construction equipment, but you can't use that argument to justify the Jackets from Edge of Tomorrow. Pacific Rim and Robot Jox are about GIANT robots, so you can't compare them to powered armor. I'll admit that I do like the way Blomkamp depicts exoskeletons in District 9 and Elysium.

The real closest analogy in Japanese media to the depiction of powered armor in Iron Man 1 is Bubblegum Crisis:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t86sKsR4pnk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THs_4BOWqG0
>>
>>19275371
Hey now, the early IM designs in the movies have the cauldrons, backpack, "boots" etc to give off an armor feeling, it's the later ones that get skimpier.
>>
>>19275496
The later Iron Man suits (by the time of Infinity War) were nanotech-based.
>>
>>19275423
fuck i miss killzone
>>
>>19275515
I've seen a series with so much lore built up for it only to never use it as anything but background info.
>>
>>19275486
Alien power loader was utilitarian.
AMP suit could at least pretend to be utilitarian repurposed for mercenary.
Edge of Tomorrow/Elysium are just armor tweaks away.
Not to forget Starship Trooper.

>the best mecha movie America has ever produced
Limiting the goalpost now to power armor only is pointless.

Nothing justified calling IM anything near realistic if you care about the value of the word.
Even Bubblegum Crisis high heels suit put effort into making their suit take space, have mass, have limited gadget, limited ability, plus the other AD police mooks. The level is pretty low and IM is still not worth comparing.

>>19275496
The very first one fit, the second is just a super hero suit slightly more bulky than usual. The rest are just an example of why supergenius tech with magical power source are hard to keep interesting or balanced.
>>
>>19275486
>you can't use that argument to justify the Jackets from Edge of Tomorrow
what fucking argument? it's an exoskeleton, not a medieval armor
>>
>>19275611
Since Jackets are military rather than civilian, they should have provided more protection for the operator.
>>
>>19275621
There's no point in giving them more protection, it'd slow them down and not provide anything useful against the enemy.
>>
>>19275621
With those enemy one hit will kill them. They only needed protection against shrapnel and the power to carry the weapons.



Delete Post: [File Only] Style:
[Disable Mobile View / Use Desktop Site]

[Enable Mobile View / Use Mobile Site]

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective parties. Images uploaded are the responsibility of the Poster. Comments are owned by the Poster.