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Passion Narratives edition

old thread >>19739151
>>
Jay Dyer's Bible lectures seem really good I think. He has a lot of knowledge on these topics.
>>
>>19747885
What did you type in these threads?
>>
>>19747906
Jay Dyer is widely considered a clown and an extremist. Even Jordan Peterson is better at exegesis.
>>
>>19747907
Just basic bitch questions. I should have said 'lurk' desu.
>>
>LARP thread
>first post is about generic leftcath #69
lmfao
>>
Don’t tell them you are Christian. Such will now be understood as heresy. They shall know ye are Christians through your very being. Jesus said, “But thou when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy doore, pray to thy father which is in secret, and thy father which seeth in secret, shall reward thee openly.” (Matt. 6:6) Verily I say unto you, the same principle shall be applied to all parts of faith. Too blatant it is to tout faith publicly. It is obscene to flout God in empty words. God is only properly respected when he rests at the foundation of our being, em’nating thru the nervous system. It is here when God is properly understood that mention of his name becomes false. This is because necessity for invocation of his name implies a discontinuity between God & oneself, it implies one is not: “Be yee therefore perfect, euen as your father, which is in heauen, is perfect.” (Matt. 5:48) This must completely be done.

& at the same time, one should never assert one has attained perfection. Such would be deep blasphemy. One only holds perfection a possibility. As for one’s attainment of said perfection, such a judgment is reserved only for the conscience of God. God understood as the judgment of history. How one is regarded after one’s death in the collective imagination of humanity. One’s standing there approximates the judgement of God.

It is an approximation of his judgment because that verdict will only be settled completely when the Kingdom of God has arrived & we live with God. For now we are subject to a purgation period, an apocalypse that is history. This process ends when history ends & that end is the descent of God in the fulness of times only possible when man with the assistance of God has fully wrestled the wheat from the chaff. When humanity is then at its most polar is when all the materials are finally ready for transmutation. This ultimate alchemical act will be done & the very definition of God, Man, World, indeed all definitions, will be completely transvaluated into their true forms, into a complete rational oneness.

So don’t tell them you are Christian. From now on proselytize thru your mere existence. Let pure grace emanate from God thru you into the world, liquefying the benighted mists.
>>
>>19747933
>leftcath
Jay Dyer is neither left wing nor catholic, unless you mean catholic in the Orthodox, non-Roman sense of the word
>>
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>>19747920
>Jordan Peterson
I have no interest in Luciferian, gnostic, Freemason interpretations of the Bible, thank you very much!!
>>
>>19747920
>extremist
?????????
>>
Post verses.

25 But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Ye know that the princes of the Gentiles exercise dominion over them, and they that are great exercise authority upon them.

26 But it shall not be so among you: but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister;

27 And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant:

28 Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

(Matthew 20)
>>
>>19747952
>meme labels
Clean your room.
>>
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>>19747964
Post a real translation

>But Jesus called them over and said to them: "You know that the leaders of the other nations lord it over them, and that their great men impose top-down authority on them.

>But it isn't to be that way among you. Instead, whoever among you wants to be great is to be the attendant of the rest of you,

>And whoever wants to be first among you is to be the slave of the rest of you.

>In the same way, the son of mankind didn't come to have attendants but to be an attendant, and to give his life as the price of setting many other people free."
>>
Jesus Christ

To utter his name is to be overwhelmed.
>>
>>19747952
>>19747967
Why are you bringing up a psychologist who has said himself that he doesn't believe in Christ in a literal sense and instead only sees it all as metaphors and symbolism to help you live a so-called "better life"? What does that have to do with Christianity?
>>
>>19747987
t. 2 month convert
>>
>>19747987
>said to them: "You know that the leaders of the other nations lord it over them
Sounds like it was written by someone from California. Never post this Big Bang Theory translation again.
>>
>>19747901
>>19747907
Are Jews allowed in these threads? We read the Bible too.
>>
>>19748010
Do you believe in Jesus Christ as the Son of God, the Second Person of the Holy Trinity, the Logos, and that He incarnated with human nature to recapitulate the fallen world and save us from our sins and that He rose from the dead?
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>>19747978
>After the battle [of Mount Tabor], Napoleon slept at the convent in nearby Nazareth, where he was shown the supposed bedchamber of the Virgin Mary. When the prior also pointed out a broken black marble pillar and told his staff, ‘in the gravest manner possible’, that it had been split by the Angel Gabriel when he ‘came to announce to the Virgin her glorious and holy destination’, some of the officers burst out laughing, but as one of them recorded, ‘General Bonaparte, looking severely at us, made us resume our gravity.’
>>
The RSV, NRSV and "NRSVue" are done by the National Council of Churches which is part of the World Council of Churches. It has been confirmed that during the early 80s the president was a KGB agent from the Russian "Orthodox™" "Church". There are other Russian "Orthodox™" that have been or are suspected KGB. There is no telling who else of such types were/are involved in the NCC/WCC.

The Catholics let a Russian "Orthodox™" KGB agent provide input into Vatican II. He died right in front of the Pope who prayed over him, then that Pope died not long after (John Paul I if I recall properly).

None of these institutions should be trusted. Stay vigilant against antiChrist.
>>
>>19748027
No. I do not believe that Christ was the son of G-d, or that he was G-d. I do not believe in the trinity, and I don't believe that all Christians do either. I do not believe in individual salvation, or in original sin. I do not believe the Messiah will be the son of G-d, he will be the son of man, and will be blessed by the Lord and the Angels from birth. I do not believe that the Messiah will be the son of a virgin, I believe the Messiah will be the son of a barren woman made fruitful by the blessings of the Lord.
>>
>>19748075
take your meds
>>
>>19748084
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikodim_(Rotov)
>>
>>19748082
Well you are wrong and your Talmud is a Satanic book. Also the Old Testament phrophecises the coming of Christ. Christ fullfilled what the Old Testament foreshadowed.
What you believe is quite simply FALSE!
>>
To those who are converts or went through an atheist period: what book began the process of your turn or returning to the faith? For me it was the collected poems of Gerard Manley Hopkins.
>>
>>19748075
How come you don't mention the CIA's involvement in the Vatican as well
>>
>>19748010
Jews are allowed.
Post good jewish translations
>>
Retarded fundamentalist protestants ruin every thread as soon as it starts.
>>
https://youtu.be/MTTFwZb3o68
https://youtu.be/MTTFwZb3o68
https://youtu.be/MTTFwZb3o68
>>
>>19748119
its literally only the same one guy every time
>>
>>19747998
>>
>tfw English Catholic who cannot deny the aeshetic superiority of the KJV to the DRV.
>>
>>19748112
>why wasn't your quickly typed, concise, yet info packed post more comprehensive
Also the ESV is based on, and mostly identical to the RSV. There's just so much to be known.
>>
>>19748005
>>19748009
>le old words makes it right!
Second Commandment.
>>
Jews are welcome, but I hope you come to accept Christ :)
>>
>>19748131
Robert Barron is a Jesuit and a liberal who supports the Luciferian theory of evolution and a non-literal interpretation of creation in Genesis. I stand by what I said.
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>>19748136
You are making an idol of your retarded modern speech. The KJV is perfectly understandable to anyone who makes a modicum of effort.
>>
>>19748141
Oh and also I read that Robert Barron supports LGBT priests.
Antichrist false prophets.
>>
>>19748141
What denomination do you belong to?
>>
>>19748103
Honestly it was the experience of the Mass. I started re-attending daily Mass in college because I lived very close to a church which had daily Mass, Adoration, and Confession. Experiencing the liturgy was more influential than any book.

I understand now why people used to want to live in walking distance of their parish church. The church really can become the center of your life: daily Mass, bells for the Angelus, Friday Benediction, Saturday Adoration, small group discussions, weekly Rosary meetings. Every Christian should make it a priority to live very close to a church which is active.
>>
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>>19748157
Well I go to Baptist church with my parents but I have learned a lot about Orthodoxy and I think they make good points but I am unable to go to an Orthodox church.
Also in regards to Robert Barron I think he supports the covid vaccines as well, which are clearly a preparation for the mark of the beast.
>>
>>19748131
Looks like some antichrist-type stuff. Has JP confessed the faith? Or does he just think the Bible is "interesting" and "powerful"?
>>
>>19748141
>>19748152
Do you even know what a Jesuit is? he is a diocesan priest.

Also evolution is completely compatible with Christianity. Read Teilhard de Chardin.
>>
>>19748174
>evolution is completely compatible with Christianity.
Evolution would mean there was death before Adam and Eve sinned. That is totally wrong. God did not create death. Death is a consequence of the fall.
>>
>>19748164
>covid vaccines
>clearly a preparation for the mark of the beast
©ringe
Stop listening to the YT Orthodox LARPers.
>>
>>19748099
Who are you to tell me my beliefs are false? You are just a man, you cannot tell me what is true or false.
>>
I love Christ and God, yet am terribly scared of hell. I volunteer at a local Christian institution and try to live as Christian a life as possible. Can I go to hell for going to the wrong Church, truly?
>>
>>19748164
>>19748173
you really know nothing about the faith or orthodoxy (and I say that as a Catholic). You're a LARPing fundamentalist baptist who is throwing around typical Protestant meme buzzwords (Luciferian, antichrist, false prophet, Jesuit, etc.). You actually look really stupid. In a previous thread you said you were a NEET in his 20s with Asperger's who can't leave the house without his parents permission.

Please, stop shitting up the thread. What you're posting is antithetical to anyone who understands Orthodoxy. You are a living version of the "19 year old ortholarper" meme.
>>
I'm going to obtain a physical Bible so I can read away from screens. Is KJVER valid? I like that it modernizes verb forms but the text looks cluttered with lots of underlines and boxes and definitions. Or should I not bother and just get a Cambridge press KJV?
>>
>>19748196
Church Bible Publishers reference KJB.
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>>19748191
Why could you not answer the question about JP confessing faith in Jesus Christ? Really looks to me like some grifter-type business trying to make a buck off "intellectuals" and spiritually-starved people.
>>
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As far as the Bible goes is there anything really left to add with the countless pieces of work out there already?

What can a person in 2022 add to the commentary that the church fathers haven't already said in one form or another?
>>
>>19748180
None of the denominations outside of fundamentalist, KJV-only Reformed Evangelical American Baptists hold to creation literal-ism. You know that right? Faith and reason are not incompatible.

Read Fides et Ratio
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>>19748191
>You're a LARPing fundamentalist baptist who is throwing around typical Protestant meme buzzwords (Luciferian, antichrist, false prophet, Jesuit, etc.)
I'm saying what I have learned from Orthodox Christians. The Baptists at the church that I go to with my parents, they are nice people and everything but they don't really talk about this stuff. I think most of them actually got the vaccine.
>>
>>19748208
I'm not a JP fan totally myself and I don't think he is a Christian, but he's done wonders for promoting Biblical interpretation in the public consciousness of young people. I agree he is a grifter at times but doesn't invalidate the good stuff he's done.

What that book argues is that JP's lectures on the bible are a precursor to young people engaging in actual biblical exegesis.
>>
>>19748211
Father Seraphim Rose strongly denied evolution. So do lots of others.
>>
I remember seeing some Protestant books conciliating the Big Bang with a Maximus the Confessor type Logos vision of the universe, the covers were just non-descript galaxies, that looked interesting. Does anyone know what author I'm talking about?
>>
>>19748216
Dude, you really need to stop watching Jay Dyer. He is an EXTREME minority in his views in orthodoxy. Youtube is not real life.

I highly recommend you actually attend a OCA or Antiochian church service. you're in for a culture shock.
>>
>>19748211
>no need to actually believe the Bible
Begone, Satan.
>>
>>19748224
Seraphim Rose is not a mainstream theologian in Orthodoxy, at all.
Dude was an ex-hippie convert who used to be obsessed with smoking weed and Taoism. Additionally he struggled with homosexual desire his whole life.

You really need to stop taking meme figures as mainstream.
>>
My father has started coming to Church with me. I began to speak of my faith with no embarassment or inention of conversion. It has been 3 years, but he says that it feels good.
>>
>>19748235
>calling Christians you disagree with Satanic
what is your actual problem? do you really think faith and reason are opposed?

I'm not even sure why I'm responding to you, you're obviously a LARPer who has zero idea about the Church's intellectual tradition.
>>
>>19748241
Blessed
>>
>>19748238
Kinda strange how that works. Everyone on /lit/ knows who Seraphim Rose is, but nobody in real life knows who he is. Probably most Orthodox don't know who he is either.
Same could be said for a lot of authors we talk about.
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>>19748010
Only if you convert and accept Jesus as The Messiah
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>>19748238
I know all that but why are you holding his sins that he repented from against him? He turned away from homosexualism and he talked about how evil those things are. It's not like he, as a monk in the church, was saying that actually it's fine to be gay. He was the opposite of that. He warned against those evils.
>>
>>19748241
Blessed. I started going to Temple with my Grandfather two years ago. One of the best decisions I ever made.
>>
>>19748242
>intellectual tradition
Not Scripture
Not Gospel
>>
>>19748249
See >>19748082
>>
>>19748255
Yeah and see >>19748249
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>>19748141
>>19748152
learn to read
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>>19748256
See >>19748255
>>
>>19748190
If you have the intention to truly seek the truth, of course not. Knock and the door will be opened to you.

>>19748196
Thomas Nelson publishes a super cheap paperback NKJV. looks nice, and is easy to read.

>>19748226
are you talking of books like Ilia Delio?

>>19748241
that's a very positive step. what denomination do you attend?
>>
>>19748262
See again >>19748256
>>
>>19748263
>Thomas Nelson
I don't buy books printed in China, thanks.
>>
>>19748263
>that's a very positive step. what denomination do you attend?
High Church Anglican.
>>
>>19748227
There are others I learn from besides Jay such as Father Spyridon Bailey, Father Peter Heers, Father Deacon Dr. Ananias, COTEL, David, Nicodemos Hagiorite, and Gregory Decapolite. They all teach me these same things.
>>
>>19748255
Do not listen to the fundie idiot. you are more than welcome Jewish bro.
You might be interested in reading stuff by Simone Weil.

>>19748246
People on 4chan are drawn to extremism in all forms.

>>19748251
You do realize the Church has always taught that it's fine to be gay? the problem is homosexual activity. then again, the church condemns all forms of disordered sexual activity.

I can tell you're a southern baptist extremist because you're an ignorant bigot. lurk more.
>>
>>19748297
>David
Jay's friend? He's a moron who teaches that it's ridiculous to care for people outside of those you know or are close to.
>>
>>19748297
oh and I forgot Father Josiah Trenham and sometimes I watch Jonathan Pageau as well.
Also I have been reading Saint Maximus the Confessor's book.
>>
>>19748297
You call yourself Orthodox? pick up a book on systemic theology instead of pissing away your time watching Orthodox memesters who are obviously rotting your brain.
>>
How close are the EO and RC churches to reuniting really?
A post in the last thread made it seem like they were very close, but are there more differences besides that of papal authority, especially those of doctrine, that would need to be resolved?
Also, what would they call themselves if it did happen?
>>
>>19748322
The EO isn't even united with itself.
>>
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>>19748322
As I understand it there are many other issues in addition to Rome's papalism, such as absolute divine simplicity vs the essence energy distinction, the filioque, Thomism vs Palamism, priests and marriage, beards, ecumenism, liberalism, and so on
>>
>>19748340
>beards
Stop posting already. You're so ignorant it's painful.
>>
>>19748332
I don't watch pornography, I don't use social media besides youtube and 4chan, I don't listen to rap, I know that I am not in the Church and not baptized, and so on, I won't bother addressing all of these
>>
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>>19748263
I am leaning towards Cambridge Concord or Cameo type on the basis of their type face. It doesn't have a super clean digital aesthetic which looks nice to my eyes. Pic related where more digital-type looking font is on the right.
>>
You are reading the KJV, right anon?
>>
>>19748302
>You do realize the Church has always taught that it's fine to be gay? the problem is homosexual activity. then again, the church condemns all forms of disordered sexual activity.
>I can tell you're a southern baptist extremist because you're an ignorant bigot. lurk more.
Is this bait
>>
>>19748360
>he's not baptized and he's not a Christian but he's telling other people what is and isn't heretic, what to believe and what not to believe, and what is and isn't "correct"
>he has no formal education or catechesis besides youtube
>he has never actually even been to a Divine Liturgy
>he speaks in zoomer meme buzzwords
>he pretends he is in any position at all to tell any actual Christians about anything
>>
>>19748393
homosexual desire =/= homosexual activity
same way desire to masturbate =/= masturbating
>>
>>19748399
Well then you are only agreeing with my point that Father Seraphim Rose was right in warning against homosexual practices
>>
>>19748399
Sinful thoughts are okay? What?
>>
>>19748302
First you welcome a Jew who does not believe in Jesus Christ, and then you condemn a "bigot" for not supporting homosexuality.
What is your motive here
>>
>>19748410
You can't control every thought or desire that comes into your head. Involuntary or passing thoughts and desires are not sinful, all the Fathers have taught this.
>>
>>19748410
temptation is not a sin
acting on it is
>>
>>19748418
The Son of Man did not come to save the righteous, but sinners.
There is a difference between unchosen homosexual orientation and actively pursued homosexual actions.
Same way as pedophelia or necrophilia - some people are born with those desires, they can't control it. That's their cross to bear. They are under the same obligation not to act on them

Same with you: you are born, evidently, with the desire to malign, slander, and attack. That's part of your (and my) sinful nature. Doesn't mean you have to act on those natural disorders desires, of course.

Only the active choice can be a sin.
>>
>>19748410
The fact that this is surprising to you shows how little you know about Christianity. Learn before you moralize and condemn

The measure by which you measure will be measured out to you.
>>
>>19748418
So are you really a homosexual then if you have involuntary or passing homo thoughts? What makes someone homosexual? You made it sound like it's fine to have homosexual fantasies.
>>
>>19748407
"Seraphim Rose" is not unique in his acknowledge, as has been Church teaching for 2000 years, that homosexual actions, not desires, are sinful.

Where he is unique (and batshit insane) is thinking that UFO demons have taken over the Catholic Church and the pope is a UFO demon antichrist (not joking about that btw).

That's why he gets rightly mocked here.
>>
>>19748427
You just said nothing while I was asked for them to clarify why they meant.
>>
>>19748428
Entertaining thoughts and fantasies continuously =/= having involuntary passing thoughts and desires.

Some people are obviously born gay. Look at gay voice, gay face, gay gestures - it's related to testosterone exposure in the womb. It is not their choice, it is their cross to bear.

You are an example of why Christians need proper catechesis.
>>
>>19748435

>>19748425
>>19748422
>>19748420
>>19748437
>>
>>19748431
Why are you taking his words out of context? Do you not understand his point about how UFOs are a demonic deception to lure people into a secular worldview
>>
>>19748361
Left by a mile. The lack of line-matching and all that ghosting on the right is disgusting, and that's without evening discussing the layout or typeface.
>>
>>19748431
>UFO demons haven't taken over the Catholic Church
>>
Go back to >>>/his/
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>>19747940
>dont tell them you’re Christian
But Jesus tells us to be a witnesses of Him to others.
>>
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The hatred and vitriol against Father Seraphim Rose only makes me think even more that he was right.
>>
>>19748235
>Earth is 6000 years old
Kys
>>
>>19748440

>>>/x/
>>
>>19748437
It's ok we are on the same page. I mistakenly thought you meant originally it's ok to indulge in homosexual thoughts as long as you didn't act on them.
>>
>>19748449
>People are mocking an extremist nutjob for being an extremist nutjob
>t-that means he's right!!!
>>
>>19748453
>>19748458
What do you actually believe
>>
>>19748450
>God couldn't make it really fast then set it to normal speed
Lrn2 not be an atheist.
>>
i am a high church anglican who refers to both the KJB and the DRB. what is the definitive orthodox bible?
>>
>>19748466
Whichever one your local church uses during service
>>
>>19748453
>>19748458
You want to be a Christian but at the same time you want to have a "safe", not too radical, not too bold position so that you don't look like a "crazy nutjob" in the eyes of the world.
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>>19748466
They don't have one. The EO don't care about non ethnics.
>>
>>19748466
The Patriarchal Text and the Septuagint.
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>>19748468
we do not use anything other than the kjb
i am wondering what is the definitive orthodox bible.
>>
>>19748477
*or a respected english version
>>
In your attempts to make Christianity more palatable to the world, you end up defeating the purpose of Christianity.
If you throw out the bold and the strong like Father Seraphim Rose, who exactly do you prefer?
Joel Olsteen?
Gay liberal tik tok preachers?
What is the non-cringe, reasonable, sane Christianity to you?
>>
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>>19748460
step 1. I don't get my dogma from Youtube videos, Christian "meme" charts and Jay Dyer discord LARP groups.

step 2. I actually have been formed through Christian education since middle school and through college, have been a practicing Catholic, and have actually studied theology at the university level and not through youtube meme compilations.

step 3. I read actual theology books and not meme radicals like Seraphim Rose

start with CS Lewis' religious books. read an actual theology book on Christianity. pic related.
>>
>>19748477
>>19748481
"Definitive" Orthodox Bible would be as >>19748472 said
As far as an English version, really anything with the Deuterocanonical books included is fine, lots of parishes use lots of different Bibles
Orthodox don't really autism out over translations like Protestants do for the most part, anything that contains all of our books is fine
>>
>>19748492
>meme meme meme
>larp larp larp
This is the person accusing me of using buzzwords.
>>
>>19748487
my sane christianity is that which meets the strong and healthy as well as the weak
such that our articulation of the living waters is so pure that all realise it is life
baptism being the following of life in its true immensity
>>
>>19748487
Why is there a need for celebrities? The greatest Christians I have known were completely unknown to the world.
>>
>>19748469
If you actually gave a fuck about counterculture Christianity you would

"Go, sell what you have, and give to the poor; then come, follow me.” (Mark 10:21)

instead of being a LARPing hypocrite blasphemous memer who slanders fellow Christians, spews bullshit about "luceriferians" and "antichrist popes" while not even being baptized.
>>
>>19748496
They have a very weak vocabulary for someone claiming to be so well-read.
>>
>>19748487
Christianity is not a race to be the edgiest. gb2 /pol/
>>
>>19748494
thank you for your reply. what do you believe to be a beautiful translation? or one for a novice?
>>
Using the words "meme" or "larp" in these threads should result in a ban.
I am so tired of it.
>>
>>19748302
>you are more than welcome Jewish bro.
If he denies the Son he also denies The Father. He is no brother of mine.
>>
>>19748516
I like the EOB New Testament a lot, it reads very nicely and is based off of the Patriarchal Text
I also enjoy the Douay and the Knox translations, as well as the Third Millennium Bible
>>
>>19748496
>>19748522
>>19748524

see
>>19748504
>>
>>19748513
You misunderstand his point. He is arguing to not try to be edgy, but to not make some version of Christianity that is more suitable to more worldly people who want to have their sin celebrated and justified...
>>
>>19748477
The KJV, NKJV, and the RSV (preferably the Oxford Annotated as it has all the Orthodox books on top of the deuterocanonical ones) are all acceptable; the NRSV is condemned. The Douay-Rheims isn't preferred, but it's also not discouraged, as the Vulgate is a pre-schism source and the DR is just a translation of that source. The EOB NT is also fine as it's an English translation of the Patriarchal Text of 1904, which is the official Greek Orthodox NT text.
t. EO
>>
>>19748524

>"Stop judging, that you may not be judged. 2 For as you judge, so will you be judged, and the measure with which you measure will be measured out to you. 3 Why do you notice the splinter in your brother’s eye, but do not perceive the wooden beam in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me remove that splinter from your eye,’ while the wooden beam is in your eye? 5 You hypocrite, remove the wooden beam from your eye first; then you will see clearly to remove the splinter from your brother’s eye."
>>
Five years ago I had a period of gay sex and indulgence in cocaine. I still lust over the male form. I have spent the last few months praying for forgiveness. Is celibacy my best option?
>>
>>19748528
How is that a valid reply? The jewish man is not christian to begin with. You are quoting the scriptures to justify yourself. You are a coward that hides behind the Holy scriptures.
Your attitude is that one of a pharisee and you are wolf in sheep's clothing.
>>19748535
And The Bible also taught us about fair judgment, was not The good thief right by calling the mockery of the bad thief in the cross?
Hypocrite
>>
>>19748533
Thank you my brother.
>>
>>19748532
False dichotomy.

Calling the Pope the Luciferean UFO Antichrist, as you and your beloved Rose did, is the same side of the coin as going around as a gay drag queen in a kids' library.

There's a middle ground between "of the world" and retarded LARPing edginess.
>>
>>19748537
it's your only biblical option unless you want to marry a woman
>>
>>19748537
Yes, all people are called to celibacy outside of marriage. What denomination are you?

>>19748540
If I have not Charity...
read paul.
>>
>>19748540
You're not even a baptized Christian.
>>
>>19748545
I find women to be beautiful, but they do not excite me. Celibacy may be the answer.
>>
>>19748549
I'm a Catholic. Could I become a monk, or is homosexuality too debased a state? My priest recommends that I find a girl, yet I feel that it would be horrid to force my degeneracy upon somone.
>>
>>19748567
>Could I become a monk
nobody on the internet can answer this for you
>>
>>19748549
Some were convinced by what he said, but others would not believe. 25 They disagreed among themselves and began to leave after Paul had made this final statement: “The Holy Spirit spoke the truth to your ancestors when he said through Isaiah the prophet:

26
“‘Go to this people and say,
“You will be ever hearing but never understanding;
you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.”
27
For this people’s heart has become calloused;
they hardly hear with their ears,
and they have closed their eyes.
Otherwise they might see with their eyes,
hear with their ears,
understand with their hearts
and turn, and I would heal them.’
Acts 29

I'm well aware of Saint Paul of Tarsus and he did talked about the jews that rejected The Messiah. You go against The Church, you support a man that rejects The Son and also rejects The Father. You are a heretic.
>>19748554
Baptized Catholic. Try again.
>>
It was Bishop Barron who introduced me to the fatih, what should I be suspicious of in regards to his teachings?
>>
>>19748567
I don't think a monastery would accept you. That's not to say anything against you, but more so a comment on the nature of monasteries.
>>
>>19748573
>nobody on the internet can answer this for you
true, my real question is: can I avoid hell? I am terrified.
>>
>>19748589
Yes, repent.
>>
>>19748589
Of course
>>
>>19748567
How often are you going to confession? are you participating in mass often? do you have a community of fellow catholics around you?

If you don't like women, don't force it. Homosexuality active action in your past is usually a disqualification from the priesthood but do you really think that's your vocation?
>>
>>19748585
Not even the trappists?
>>
It is impossible for there to be death before Adam and Eve sinned.
That rules out evolution and a non-literal interpretation of Genesis.
>>
>>19748579
>he's now larping as a Catholic when he previously said he was a baptist, then unbaptized, then internet Ortholarper, then etc.

Abba Moses the Black
>The monk must die to his neighbor and never judge him at all, in any way whatever.

Abba Joseph
>If you want to find rest here below, and hereafter, in all circumstances say ‘Who am I?’ and do not judge anyone.

Abba Macarius
>Correct and judge justly those who are subject to you, but judge no one else.

I'm sure you know better than the Desert Fathers though, right?
>>
>>19748581
The Catholic ones.
>>
>>19748600
are you called to monasticism or do you just feel desire to flee the world and your history of sin? are you living in a state of grace? are you keeping a daily prayer rule? are you participating in mass often? have you spoken with a diocesan vocations director?
>>
>>19748581
Actual Catholic here

Absolutely nothing, he is completely orthodox, contrary to what Taylor Marshall screams about.

Read "And now I see .... A theology of transformation". Truly a wonderful book of his.
>>
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>>19748622
You keep making assumptions to justify yourself. There's only venom in your words. I'm a catholic man, and if you don't believing it's true does not change that fact.
>I'm sure you know better than the Desert Fathers though, right?
Oh but I know someone that knows more than me, pic related.
Unlike you I don't hide behind the Holy men that preached The word of God. You are an arrogant person that spews venom just like a snake, heretic.
>>
>>19748631
I feel called, my question is more about eligibility. I do not want to profane this approach.
>>
>>19748622
>abba this abba that

call no man father
>>
>>19748643
I have a question for you.
Did this verse apply to all instances where one might call another man by the name or title of "father?"
Is calling your own father by that name wrong?
>>
>>19748640
>>19748643
I thought you were a Catholic, oh wait, a Baptist, oh wait, unbaptized, oh wait, an OrthoCoomer, oh wait
Lying is a sin, you know that right?
If you were actually a Catholic and not a simpleton fundamentalist you'd know about the priest acting in persona christi. ofc im sure that's too big of a concept for you to understand, so I'll move on.

I don't give a fuck about jews or their talmudic practices. I know the story, guess what? God wins. The wind blows where it will. Jews could take over the world for all I care, guess what? The resurrection still happened. God's kingdom is not of this world. Why fight for this world? who gives a shit about le jews.
>>
>>19748649
Read the chapter. What subject was He on?
>>
>>19748649
He's a protestant fundamentalist, do not ask him for Biblical interpretation.
>>
>>19748669
I'm not either of those but why do you think you're only talking with one person?
>>
>>19748669
mary worshipper moment
>>
>>19748642
Speak with a diocesan vocations director. Likely the next step is to get off of 4chan. If you're honest and open with them they'll be more than willing to help you discern what next.
>>
>>19748677
keep thinking about jews all day, it's concerning.
>>
>>19748669
>I thought you were a Catholic, oh wait, a Baptist, oh wait, unbaptized, oh wait, an OrthoCoomer, oh wait
Keep making assumptions, that still not change the fact I'm a catholic man. Unless you are confusing me with someone else during this discussion (which most likely you are)
>Lying is a sin, you know that right?
Arrogance too. There's no lie in my words, but there's arrogance in yours.
>who gives a shit about le jews.
Clear Saint John Chrysostom and Saint Paul

You are an arrogant heretic trying to appear smarter than what he actually is.
>>
>>19748677
>mary
Ishtar
>>
>>19748682
realistically, what are you gonna do about jews? genocide them? cry all day about them? The Christian is not of this world. Who cares who the president is, who cares if there's jews ruling media or whatever, is that a surprise to you that the world is corrupted? is it a surprise to you that Christendom is fundamentally an anti-christian idea? The Jews can convert or not, that's God's will, not mine.

Read Julian of Norwich. Jesus says that all shall be well. Until then, might as welcome those around us with Christian charity.

>that is le slave morality!
yes. and?
>>
>>19748297
>>19748310
Based
>>
>>19748694
You keep getting further and further from the discussion while you also keep making more and more [false] assumptions.
The moment you lose control you try to establish your own set of rules.
You an arrogant heretic.
>that is le slave morality!
Look at this, this is the monument of your debacle. Once again making false assumptions, trying to put words in the mouth of others.
>>
>>19748466
Yes the Septuagint
>>
>>19748694
You are an arrogant heretic*
My bad
>>
>>19748703
>>19748711
I am a heretic because I'm suggesting exercising Christian charity is the best idea?
>>
>>19748721
Once again, you make false assumptions to turn yourself into the victim.
Your arrogance has no limits, the only thing closer to the size of your pride is your hypocrisy.
>>
>>19748725
As much as I love your grandiose condemnation, and it is quite amusing, I'll remind you that this is the Bible thread. Do you have anything to contribute to the topic at hand?
>>
>>19748731
>As much as I love your grandiose condemnation, and it is quite amusing
I don't and the fact you find it amusing is quite ridicule.
>I'll remind you that this is the Bible thread
Maybe you should remind yourself that first. Be the change you want in this world.
I will repeat myself "The moment you lose control you try to establish your own set of rules."
You can't concede, for your arrogance and pride are bigger than your humility.
I will give you the last word you want so much, I will not reply to you after this; but I will clarify myself right now, my silence is not approval of any of your words, not before this post and not after this post.
>>
>>19748756
Please, open a straw farm, your strawmen constructions keep getting better and better!
>>
Anons of this thread, do you personally think the so-called End Times are near?
Do you ascribe any significance to the establishment of the state of Israel in 1948, or to current events?
Just curious.
>>
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Where are my fellow Puritans at?
I am having trouble deciding between the names Fear-God and If-Jesus-Christ-had-not-died-for-thee-thou-hadst-been-damned for my firstborn son. How did you decide?
>>
>>19748813
Unironically choose one of those options as a middle name
>>
>>19748794
The "end times" are probably "near" and my own assumption is that it's likely tied to the culmination of Babylon which is the creation of and interfacing with an AI god.

I'm sure there is some significance to the establishment of Israel but I do not know what it is or will be, in the sense implied.
>>
>>19748794
I think it's a lot easier now to imagine how certain things would be feasible with recent technology advancements. I feel like the beginning of the end is approaching, but at the same time we don't really have to guess at these things.
>>
>>19748826
I will do it. Hortatory names are one of coolest things the Puritans did. It should never have fallen out of use.
>tfw I was never named "Search-the-Scriptures"
>>
>>19748794
Honestly, no. Not in our lifetimes. It will have something to do with technology and the Third Temple. The Mark of the Beast may be some neuralink type device but it's hard to guess. Of course, we know neither the day nor the hour.
>>
>>19748924
>Third Temple
This is the Body of Christ.
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>>19748927
I meant the Jews trying to rebuild the Temple on the Temple Mount.
>>
>>19748924
>"That little bit of light — that little bit of light, wherever it is found, can dispel the darkness and illuminate a path forward. And whether it’s in the Temple in Jerusalem or a temple of our democracy, nothing broken or profaned is beyond repair. Nothing. We can always build back better or perhaps build back brighter."

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/speeches-remarks/2021/12/01/remarks-by-president-biden-during-a-menorah-lighting-in-celebration-of-hanukkah/
>>
>>19747920
hes a scum bag, anon.
>>
>>19748310
You do realize the anti christ is working through you right? You warlock scum.
>>
I could be wrong, but isn't there something about the Jewish deadline for their "messiah" being in the 2200s? So, just 200 years until they realize it actually was Jesus and they missed him?
>>
Unironically I am very attracted to the spirituality of groups like the Quakers and the Bruderhof, especially the communal lay living and simple vocal prayer. How I do incorporate some of their spiritual practices into traditional liturgical Christianity?
>>
>reading nietzsche beyond good and evil
>realize ive been doing this stuff for most of my life
>this shit makes more sense and seems more practical than the bible
>>
>>19749191
didnt finish before i accidentally hit post. anyways, how should i feel about this?
>>
>>19749197
Are you able to debunk the Gospel? If not, then why does it matter if it doesn't make sense to you or if isn't practical for you if it's the truth?
>>
>>19749235
i mean youre not able to prove the bible is the word of god without using circular reasoning. just saying.
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>>19748980
>I am very attracted to the spirituality of groups like the Quakers
last time I looked up Quakers they had been taken over by troons
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>>19748980
>>19749258
yeah quakers are completely pozzed now, like literally pozzed, not even christian usually anymore just universalists, if anything it makes their historical theology look worse if that's the end result
>>
>>19749247
I'm talking historically, not logically. Can you debunk the historical events of the Gospel?
>>
>>19749367
well that isnt really what your original post referred to lol
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>>19749491
So can you find evidence that it didn't happen?
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>>19749294
I will never understand how you're supposed to act as a Christian about certain modern problems.
>Millions of Muslims pretend they don't want to chop your heads off as they peacefully invade your country
>Oh yeah! Welcome! Welcome!
>Gays pretend they don't want to subvert your church, which they hate
>Welcome! Welcome!
Do you just passively accept it? Do you gatekeep at the cost of sacrificing your love for others? How do you protect yourself from hostile action without compromising on your values?
>>
>>19749367
no but you said "gospel" not "historical events"
>>
>>19749812
Referring to the first four books in the new testament.
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>>19749512
thats not how logic works.

the burden of proof falls on the person making the positive assertion. so when someone (person a) says "the bible is the written word of god" and someone (person b) retorts "saying prove it". its literally the job of person a to provide proof of their claim. which none has been produced for said point as far as we know.

now if person a says "well you can't prove that the bible ISNT the written word of god". this become an issue of evidence of absence vs absence of evidence. in this case person a is favored because reasons
>>
>>19749824
>>19749827
see my next post. fuck i actually got that wrong. absence of evidence doesnt support a negative claim so i dont have to 'disprove it'
>>
>>19749656
Well first of all let's put the "welcome the stranger" verses in context.
>Ex. 22:20-21 Whoever sacrifices to any god, other than the Lord alone, shall be devoted to destruction. You shall not wrong a sojourner or oppress him, for you were sojourners in the land of Egypt.
>Lev. 18:26 But you shall keep my statutes and my rules and do none of these abominations, either the native or the stranger who sojourns among you ...
>Lev. 20:1-2 The Lord spoke to Moses, saying, “Say to the people of Israel, Any one of the people of Israel or of the strangers who sojourn in Israel who gives any of his children to Molech shall surely be put to death. The people of the land shall stone him with stones."
Is that sufficient to resolve the issue? Moving on the homosexuality, you cannot compromise the truth. And you are not loving someone by affirming and facilitating their self-destruction. Those who are in sin must be called to repentance, and if they will not repent they are to be excommunicated in the hope that he will realize his error.
>1 Cor. 5:1, 4-5 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father's wife. ... When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord.
>>
>>19749656
muslims are actually pretty based, sure they are worshipping a false god but they are way better than athiests
>>
>>19749833
I think you're confused. I'm saying the events of the first four books of the new testament are historical in nature. If you can't find any positive evidence that contradicts it, then you can either accept that it's historical fact or you decide to believe it never happened even though evidence suggests the contrary. So if you have no reason to believe it didn't happen, then you would acknowledge the divinity of Christ and accept everything he said as true regardless of what you personally want to believe.
>>
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Orthodox Saint Maximus the Hut Burner. He lived on Mt. Athos as a monk and would build a hut, live in it for a while, then burn it down and build a new hut somewhere else. Eventually someone talked to him and found out that he was not mentally ill but was just acting like it to hide how holy he was. So they told him to stop burning huts down and he went to live in a cave and was seen flying at one point.
>>
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Orthodox St. Xenia of St. Petersburg. When her husband died she began wandering around dressed in her husband's clothes and told everyone that she was her husband. Eventually someone talked to her and found out that she too was not mentally ill but was just pretending to hide how holy she was. She followed Christ by spending the rest of her life under the guise of a mentally ill homeless person and is thus celebrated to this day.
>>
>>19749891
>>19749910
Makes sense to me.
>try and be an ascetic monk
>faggots here about how ascetic you are and keep trying to hang out with you
>start larping as an insane homeless person
>everyone fucks off
>>
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Orthodox St. Stefan Milutin, King of Serbia. He divorced three wives and then married the 5-year old daughter of the Byzantine emperor. He deflowered her so forcefully that she was rendered infertile. He also built many churches and monasteries and is thus honored to this day especially among the holy Serbian people.
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>>19749888
well im still on the old testament so i dont know any specifics. that said im pretty theres a lot of room for separating what is and isnt believable.
>>
>>19749919
Yes, you understand. In Holy Orthodoxy we understand that the way to piety is actually to do sinful things and lie but only if it's pretending.
>>
>>19749656
>Do you just passively accept it?
yeah that's the christian way
that's why so many christian nations have fallen
>>
>>19749656
>Will they convert?
Accept with open arms
>Will they repent?
Accept with open arms

Will either not do it?
You are to love others, but not give way to iniquity. So be against it.

On another note, i wonder how the Christian and Muslim relations worked in the olde times. Everyone kinda let each other walk around the holy lands.
>>
>>19749850
Yes, this would be pretty clear on its own, but what about people who tell you that they are totally, absolutely driven by faith and have the best intentions? Possibly the one true anachronism about Christian teaching, something I can also see in the Bible itself, is that everyone is just so sincere and straightforward. Even the Pharisees in their own way, do not act very intelligently in their subterfuge. Things are so infinitely more complex today because the art of lying has progressed immensely and Christian thought is not equipped to deal with the craftiness of hostile agents.
>>
>>19750017
Rom. 16:17-18 17 I appeal to you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and create obstacles contrary to the doctrine that you have been taught; avoid them. For such persons do not serve our Lord Christ, but their own appetites, and by smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive.

Eph. 5:3, 5-6 But sexual immorality and all impurity or covetousness must not even be named among you, as is proper among saints. ... For you may be sure of this, that everyone who is sexually immoral or impure, or who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.

2 Tim. 4:3-4 For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.

Matt. 10:16-18 Behold, I am sending you out as sheep in the midst of wolves, so be wise as serpents and innocent as doves. Beware of men, for they will deliver you over to courts and flog you in their synagogues, and you will be dragged before governors and kings for my sake, to bear witness before them and the Gentiles.
>>
>>19750037
Thanks verseposter. Best replies of the thread.
>>
>>19750037
Always amazes me how every question has an answer in the Bible.
>>
>>19750037
>so be wise as serpents and innocent as doves
I'm the anon you replied to. Thanks, this really says everything. It's really true that there's an answer to everything in the Scriptures.
>>
>>19748027
What does it even mean to be the "son" of God if you are in fact the same in terms of monotheism. The Trinity seems like a hack to resolve political differences in the third century.
>>
>>19748131
JP refuses to profess a belief in God. He simply says your life will be more satisfying IF you believe in God (even pretend to) and do not question it. For example, asking whether God exists or not is damaging to your psyche - we should all just shut up and do what we are told and believe in Christianity. Women especially should just shut up and do what they are told.

No one takes him seriously. As with almost all pop religious you-tubers (WLC, etc), he REFUSES to declare any formal denomination or belief.
>>
>>19750069
For one it means that interpersonal communion, relationships such as father/son, are fundamental aspects of reality that derive from God and aren't artifacts of creatures.
>>
>>19750069
Jay Dyer explains the Trinity very well. It solves the age old philosophical question of unity vs multiplicity. The Trinity is three distinct Persons who share one essence.
>>
>>19748131
I don't like this wishy washy psychology self help crap. He is just making it about himself. It is phoney baloney.
>>
>>19750083
>Women especially should just shut up and do what they are told.
This is true and Paul says this.
I agree with the rest of your post however.
>>
>>19748449
i love rose but your reasoning is beyond retarded
try to think for yourself rather than doing so out of some sort of rebellious nature
>>
Why do Christians on /lit/ have such a pro-evolution, anti-literalist bias
>>
>>19750388
Just stop. Stop trying to look "measured" to appease the liberals. Stop watering down everything.
>>
How did Jesus walk on water, it wasn’t an allegory or metaphor, it was literal

How did he do it?
>>
>>19750421
He is God.
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>>19750408
How does a stick morph into a snake?
>>
>>19750428
You’ve convinced me
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>>19750429
You come to discuss a religion and you are shocked that mystical, supernatural things happen? Why even come to this thread then?
>>
>>19750428
My uncle says god speaks to everybody in different ways, with David it was through the clouds, with Saul it was the air/music, with Moses it was through fire, that I have to find him on my own

But I can’t overcome the things like walking on water or inanimate objects morphing into to a living thing in the matter of a minute
>>
>>19748302
>>19748420
Yes but how does it then follow that you should identify yourself by your temptation? If you put Christ before you and abandon sexual immorality then there should be no reason to identify as gay, it would be like me identifying as a masturbator for my past sins.

Of course we are called to repentance, and should recognize our own sinful natures for what they are in confession to our Father, but certainly there isn't any case to declare such things in a public forum?

Why should past sins (and thus temptations) dictate any of our relations or comings and goings? That's what you imply when you claim the church should accept gay identity. A man who is prone to murder does not introduce himself to others as a murderer, and a man who is prone to steal does not address himself as a thief. These are titles to be known and judged by our Lord Jesus Christ, not by our neighbors.
>>
>>19748425
>people can be born pedophilic or necrophilic
You misunderstand the nature of sexual immorality; pedophilia and necrophilia are gross, abhorrent distortions of nature, no one is born with such tastes, rather they are led into them by incremental depravity (which is made all too convenient and accessible today thanks to pornography). It is impossible for someone to have a necrophilic nature without them having acted on their sexual desires prior, and such in an abominable manner. You can say that someone may be born with the inclination for lust, and thus sexual immorality, but to concede that pedophilia and necrophilia are simply different flavors of sin reveals a severe misunderstanding of morality and of the human condition.
>>
>>19748612
True, "survival of the fittest" relies on our sinful nature, and thus couldn't have been a driving force for creation.
>>
>>19747901
The Spiritual Gifts.
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>>19750409
repent
>>
>>19750083
>Women especially should just shut up and do what they are told.
as opposed to doing what megacorporations tell them?
>>
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dont worry anons! your faith will be rewarded! keep believing and when you get to heaven, all your misery on this earth won't matter any more!
is what i would say to a bunch of slaves to keep them happy enough so that they spend their lives toiling away for my benefit

keep up the good work!
>>
How does it work with other churches? Assuming Trinitarian. Do you sign yourself? Do you consider it a holy place even if you do not take communion in it?
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>>19750459
Sounds like you are fucked, then.
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>>19750707
t. vile kike
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>>19749891
>>19749910
>>19749921
>>19749919
>>19749928
"Orthodox™", the pioneers and patron saints of only pretending to be retarded. No wonder they became so popular with 4chaners.
>no no, senpai, we are only like this to hide our holiness in humility
nb4 "yes" meme
No, you just desperately need actual Christ. Go to a legitimately Christian church, which isn't going to be a source for pride feeding/fulfillment.
>>
>>19748567
Never, ever marry a woman as a homosexual.
>>
>>19750806
Look at that fucking idiot, holds nothing but a couple notions about a couple pieces of scripture in his head and thinks he can lead a church. One of my friends some sort of idiot protestant said he was baptized by his father and I laughed out loud. Not baptized at all then.
>>
Is the NIV a good version to read if I haven't read the whole Bible before?
>>
>>19750836
From the verses i read of it searching online for verses, it's clear enough.
>>
>>19750830
>hands in serious need of prayer typed this
>>
What about ESV?
>>
>>19750953
Heard it's bad. Don't.
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>>19750922
protestants lead people to hell, anon.
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>>19747920
He's a crypto-Satanist, but using "extremist" unironically as insult makes you a faggot.
>>
>>19750836
>>19750953
These are "fine" up to a point and one can even perfectly well get the most essential essentials from them. I advise "graduating" to the King James Bible ASAP for the most full form of Scripture, however. There are occasional differences in word translations that hold great profundities. The "flawed" word translations in it here and there are negligible ("unicorn" for one horned beasts like rhinoceros is not doctrinally critical like the serpent in Eden *not* being a beast of the field). There are other issues with the NIV/ESV/etc. but they are still sound for by far the most part. It's far better to read what you have immediate access to or can readily understand than to not be reading it at all.
>>
>>19750830
>One of my friends some sort of idiot protestant said he was baptized by his father and I laughed out loud. Not baptized at all then.

CCC 1256 The ordinary ministers of Baptism are the bishop and priest and, in the Latin Church, also the deacon. In case of necessity, any person, even someone not baptized, can baptize, if he has the required intention. the intention required is to will to do what the Church does when she baptizes, and to apply the Trinitarian baptismal formula. the Church finds the reason for this possibility in the universal saving will of God and the necessity of Baptism for salvation.

CCC 818 "However, one cannot charge with the sin of the separation those who at present are born into these communities [that resulted from such separation] and in them are brought up in the faith of Christ, and the Catholic Church accepts them with respect and affection as brothers .... All who have been justified by faith in Baptism are incorporated into Christ; they therefore have a right to be called Christians, and with good reason are accepted as brothers in the Lord by the children of the Catholic Church."
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>>19751002
CCC 819 "Furthermore, many elements of sanctification and of truth" are found outside the visible confines of the Catholic Church: "the written Word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope, and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, as well as visible elements." Christ's Spirit uses these Churches and ecclesial communities as means of salvation, whose power derives from the fullness of grace and truth that Christ has entrusted to the Catholic Church. All these blessings come from Christ and lead to him, and are in themselves calls to "Catholic unity."
>>
>>19750953
It's one of the best modern English translations.
>>19750963
>Heard
No reason given, surprise.
>>
>>19750953
Here's a thorough evaluation of it by the way
http://www.bible-researcher.com/esv.html
>As modern versions go, the ESV should be counted as one of the best for use in teaching ministry. It is more literal than the NIV, and so it is largely free of the problems that come with the use of so-called “dynamic equivalence” versions; but it is not so severely literal that ordinary readers will struggle to understand it. Its English recalls the classic diction of the KJV, and so it has some literary power (this is not unimportant in a Bible version). Its handling of the Old Testament is agreeable to conservative principles of interpretation. As a revision of the RSV, it is much better than the NRSV in several ways. However, there are some weaknesses in it. We have noticed the bad influence of the NIV in several places.
>>
>he worships king jimbo's "translation" which talks about unicorns and steals from the vulgate

OH NONONONONO
>>
>>19750953
ESV Study Bible has helped me a lot personally (on my way to Orthodoxy).
>>
>>19751181
Looks like it didn't help you enough then
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>>19749191
The Gospel is a stumbling block to the Greeks and the Jews
>>19749294
you can be Christian and universalist. https://afkimel.wordpress.com/
>>19749656
sounds like you're confusing Christianity and /pol/ism.
>turn the other cheek
>judge not, lest you be judged
"b-but that's not based and redpilled like me!" - take it up with Jesus, not me
>>19749891
>>19749910
>>19749921
are they canonized by the Magisterium? if not, not saints then.
>>19750069
Son of God/Son of Man is a messianic title in the line of David.
>>19750083
>>19750338
You understand nothing about JP, Paul, or his proclamations on women. pick up some academic biblical commentaries and get back to me.
>>19750408
evolution is not incompatible with Christianity. you really think God stop creating in 7 days? lol. look up continuing creation. What do you think the New Jerusalem is? stop being a fundamentalist baptist, it's sad
>>19750459
who exactly is your uncle? what authority does he have to teach?
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>>19751248
The tradcath shitposter is a univeralist, what a shock.
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>>19750459
Created things follow their natural laws (eg gravity, Newton's laws). In our everyday life these appear to be fixed and things behave very predictably, hence it is surprising when we hear that a man long ago walked on water. But being created, there is not only natural law, but a will behind the law. Via this will any miracle is possible, such as in the case of Jesus walking on water and calming the storm. Being God who created them according to His own will, he can manipulate them, whether for himself or others (eg the parting of the Red Sea, turning a staff into a snake)
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>>19750557
>>19750557
>no one is born with such tastes
sorry that it offends your pearl clutching, grandma-level sensibilities but science (and divinely ordained physical reality) says you're wrong.
Identifying as "gay" or "pedo" or whatever is different - if I have passing thoughts about murder, does that make me a murderer? of course not.
I agree that "gay identity" is a modern distortion, but that reality is some people have gay desires consistently. so long as they don't act on it, they're welcome in the Church, as with all the other sinners.
>>19750589
read fides et ratio. of course, you won't, as usual. stick with Jay Dyer the magical OrthoLARPer
>>19750806
protestant church design is truly bland and sad. looks like a municipal government building.
>>19750836
yes. keep in mind it is not a literal word for word translation.
>>19750953
Reformed bias in translation. See R. Grant Jones' comparisons with the ESV to the RSV/NRSV. Translation was not done in good faith.
>>19750830
any baptism done in the trinitarian formula is licit
>>19751181
esv study bible is heavily biased towards piper/mcarthur-style reformed commentaries. avoid.
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>>19751259
take it up with Gregory of Nyssa, not me
but I'm sure you know better than the Church Fathers right?
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>>19751259
Imagine thinking im tradcath btw, lol.
I support the suppression of the trindintine mass.
if the actual post-concillar documents were followed, the mass of st. paul vi would already incorporation latin and traditional liturgical elements.
luckily we're seeing a reform movement trending towards that.
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>>19751286
How about you follow this then?
>>19751053
>>19751066
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>>19751259
read von balthasar's "dare we hope all men be saved".
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>>19751292
how about you read the whole post before you respond?
any baptism done in the trinitarian formula is licit, I said that. of course I agree with the CCC
>>
Universalism is an untenable position for a Christian.
>>
>>19751280
>>19751293
Dare we hope that you will quote a magisterial ruling on the matter?
>>
You seething angry protties realize that there's more than one Catholic who posts in this thread right?
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>>19751295
All you stated is that the person was baptized by his father. You stated nothing about the formula. I assume you are backtracking now and did not know that anyone can baptize.
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>>19751302
Why do you insist on ruining this thread?
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>>19751301
>magesterial
it's called the Magisterium, prottie.

>>19751299
to answer both of you, affirmative universalism (aka we KNOW that all people will be saved) is a heresy. HOPING that all people will be saved is not a heresy.

btw - other non heresies that point towards non-affirmative universalism: conditional annihilation, descent into hell = gates unlocked theory, christian metempsychosis, "age of ages" translation of "eternal" theory, and post-time christus victor theory.

pick up a theology book.
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>>19751317
>n-no I have to spew my King Jimmy Only heresy without being challenged!
sorry for holding you to a standard of logic.

>>19751312
>y-you didn't know anyone can baptize.
it's taught in 4th grade CCD class anyone can baptize licitly in an emergency. look into thomistic intent vs. form
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>>19751320
>it's called the Magisterium, prottie.
Your English is terrible as well, another shock.
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>>19751325
>it's taught in 4th grade CCD class anyone can baptize licitly in an emergency. look into thomistic intent vs. form
So what is your complaint about your "friend"'s baptism? In what sense is he not baptized? Again you've stated nothing about the formula being wrong.
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>>19751327
ya ad hom?

>>19751329
it wasn't me who objected to the baptism. you realize the dude who posted that is not the same poster as me right?
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>>19751336
>it wasn't me who objected to the baptism. you realize the dude who posted that is not the same poster as me right?
Then why are you arguing with me with you agree with my quotation of the catechism and have zero insight on the situation in question?
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>>19751339
I'm not arguing with you bro, I responded to the dude who objected to the baptism, not you.

take some ashwaghanda.
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>>19751186
This, it has utterly failed to prevent them from being fooled by Satan into crypto Ishtar worship.
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>>19751277
Protestant church design is the Body of Christ, not some earthly structure. Enjoy making idols of your institution and it's physical buildings rather than the actual glory of the LORD God Almighty and His ekklesia, materialist.
>>
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Average Protestant service.
>>
which gnostic gospels are worth reading
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>>19751359
The visible church is the Church invisible.
Where the Eucharist is, there the Church is.
but by all means, keep Christian rocking!
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>>19751367
None, they were not included in the Canon for a reason.
>>
>sexual intercourse in marriage is actually a sin since the beginning of in-vitro fertilization
since there is no need to copulate to create children you should not use this flawed method - if sexual intercourse in a marriage were totally fine the conception of jesus would not have been called "immaculate"
also aquinas and augustine of hippo told us that only virgins will gain 100% of the reward in heaven

Talk to me about what that anon said
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>>19751377
The Catholic dogma of immaculate conception is actually about Mary being conceived without original sin.
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>>19751377
>in-vitro fertilization
grave sin. read Humanae Vitae
Sexual intercourse is divinely ordained. Read Paul - they will be saved thru childbearing. Read song of songs.

God's love was more eros than agape.
in the greek:
"in the beginning was the word. and the word was TOWARDS god [trinitarian creative eros] and the word was god."
>>
>>19751377
>also aquinas and augustine of hippo told us that only virgins will gain 100% of the reward in heaven
Can you give me an exact percentage? What does this reward look like for non-virgins?
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>>19751363
Weird how I've been Protestant for 5 decades and been to many, many churches, none of which resemble that in the least.
>>19751368
You obviously believe that whatever you see on TV and the Internet is representative of most of actual reality. Protip, big cities only occupy a very tiny relative portion of the land, and us ruralites think almost everyone in them are retards who should be gassed.
>>
>>19751363
much better than the snoozefest that mass is
t. former catholic school girl (srs)
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>>19751386
not church teaching.
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>>19751363
Don't throw stones when you live in a glass house
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YL9tmkBS9K0
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>>19751377
it did a bad job greentexting

everything apart from "Talk to me about what that anon said" belongs to a random anon
>>
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I hate discussing Christianity on 4chan.
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>>19751388
>it has to be entertaining!
seek modafinil.
>>19751387
>w-well my church isn't like that! it only uses Hillsong music 50% of the time!
>us ruralites are le primitive!
that's why you shop at walmart right?
>>19751391
it's called the Catholic Charismatic Renewal and it's not problem so long as the Eucharist is licitly celebrated. there's a time for gregorian chant and there's a time for the CCR. it's not either/or, reducionist.
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>>19751408
>it's called the Catholic Charismatic Renewal and it's not problem so long as the Eucharist is licitly celebrated.
Lol you are a fucking joke dude. Holy shit.
>>
>>19751400
go back to your /pol/ hugbox
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>>19751410
try presenting an argument next time instead of seething
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>>19751411
You really don't see a problem with the quality of discussion in these threads?
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>>19751414
I'd rather laugh at you. Everything you say is fucking retarded.
>>
>read I Peter 4
>the Gospel will be preached go the dead
>whoa, that's pretty crazy, but it makes sense since everyone comes back to life before the Judgement, maybe they can repent then, which is why Paul's description of determinism and God causing people to sin and become objects of wrath isn't as bad as it seems.
>read my ESV Stdy Bible notes
>"This is 100% not what it means, it's about people who heard the Gospel and since died."
>Look up passage
>Most commentary is "it's definitely talking about people who are dead hearing the Gospel while dead." Orthodox and Caths say "of course, we said this." But even Evangelical commentaries say "yeah, it is weird but one passage seeming contradictory doesn't refute doctrine." ESV note appears to be hardline doctrine informed commentary.
>Look at references ESV has for why it has to be what it says it is.
>They are other unclear passages people disagree on.
>Find out Evangelical translations even insert the word "now" to make it "now dead," even though it isn't there in English to make their point.

I wish study Bibles would note when there is wide disagreement. The ESV also has a whole section on why the Apocrypha isn't Canon but it musters all the evidence for their rejection and includes no counter evidence and appears to being straight up dishonest on scholarly opinion about the Jews having a closed Canon by the time of Christ.

Now I feel like I can't trust any of it. I guess study Bibles need to be taken as "this is what this sect says."

I really want the Ancient Faith study Bible, which is all notes from Church Fathers, but apparently that is also highly selective, just not covering quotes that disagree with Church doctrine instead of explaining why they thought X and why the editors don't. Super frustrating.
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>>19751418
respond to this guy about that >>19751421

not me.
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>>19751426
Seething tard
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>>19751424
The ESV has a heavily Reformed Evangelical bias. That's been mentioned consistently in these threads and there's a lot of criticism of the ESV online for exactly that.

Believe it or not, pick up an academic Biblical commentary like the Oxford. You're going to get the most objective, least Evangelical-tinted commentary.
>>
>>19751431
Still waiting for your argument. You're the guy who is a rural primitive yet shops at Walmart and uses 4chan right? Or are you the one commenting about glass houses.

Ironic, isn't it...
>>
>>19751384
>>in-vitro fertilization

what if we change it to Intrauterine Insemination
>>
>>19751424
>but it makes sense since everyone comes back to life before the Judgement
The error you made was here, because only the elect are resurrected to eternal life.
>>
>>19751447
>Tard babble
I am laughing dude
>>
New thread

>>19751466
>>19751466
>>19751466
>>
>>19751452
It is very explicit in ALL people being ressurected for judgement in Rev 20.

>11 Then I saw a great white throne(AJ) and him who was seated on it. The earth and the heavens fled from his presence,(AK) and there was no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, great and small,(AL) standing before the throne, and books were opened.(AM) Another book was opened, which is the book of life.(AN) The dead were judged(AO) according to what they had done(AP) as recorded in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades(AQ) gave up the dead(AR) that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done.(AS) 14 Then death(AT) and Hades(AU) were thrown into the lake of fire.(AV) The lake of fire is the second death.(AW) 15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life(AX) was thrown into the lake of fire.


>Every person
>The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them

This is also a controversial passage because people are judged by their works. And indeed, it takes a pretty convoluted reading to come up with "the other books are the works books, the Book of Life is based on faith alone."

Jesus himself mentions varying degrees of punishment and reward in the Gospels based on deeds, so this shouldn't be surprising.

Some of the interpretations get wonky though. Like, works are used to judge extra benefits in Heaven, so God cares about them, but then human action is irrelevant to God on other matters? It's contradictory, but it makes sense that it is because "saved by faith alone" is different from Paul's justification by faith, and proceeds from deductive logic about an omnipotent God.

This passage is probably part of what made the early Reformation want to kick Revelations out of the Bible (James too). Then the peasants began doing proto-comminism and justifying the end of serfdom, and they reversed on removing parts of the Bible since then people can justify anything.
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>>19751447
>rural
The ruralite here, I'm not them, nor the ones quoted in >>19751426. Enjoy being a schizo who sees me reflected everywhere like a carnival house of mirrors. Rent free.
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>>19747940
good post.
>Let pure grace emanate from God thru you into the world, liquefying the benighted mists
lovely
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>>19751797
Thank you
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>>19750037
Beautiful
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>>19751277
>>19751442
>esv study bible is heavily biased
And? All Bible commentary is biased in one way or the other, even the Oxford. I have found great information in the study Bible that no other commentary provided, and none of it was about interconfessional contention.
I think it's plain stupid to dismiss solid work of Bible scholars because of its confessional bias. I also read the writings of Catholic Saints, whom I do not revere as Saints myself, because they often have valuable or inspiring things to say.



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