hedonism/ˈhiːd(ə)nJz(ə)m,ˈhɛːd(ə)nJz(ə)m/nounthe pursuit of pleasure; sensual self-indulgence.We all do things we think (or know) will give us bigger pleasure than any other alternative - meaning, we're all hedonistic.The monk hides in solitude because that gives him peace, thus pleasure, thus hedonism; the hoe fucks, because that gives pleasure to the hoe, thus hedonism; the bookworm reads books, because books give the bookworm pleasure, thus hedonism; the NEETer NEETs because NEETing gives the NEETer pleasure, thus hedonism; the drug abuser abuses drugs, because abusing drugs gives the drug abuser pleasure, thus hedonism...I could go on forever, but I think faggots like you faggots get my point
What’s the point of humanity surviving thus far?
>>17626629>We all do things we think (or know) will give us bigger pleasure than any other alternativeProve it.
>>17626629Not wrong but I think that you can make comparisons between different kinds of hedonism and make judgements about them. Some of them give you pleasure in the short term but destroy you in the long term.
>>17626629Anhedonia says hello.
>>17626644Oragasms>>17626651I gave you 3 trillion examples, I don't think I need to "prove" anything else>>17626658Fair
>>17626684You’re making a universal statement on the nature of humanity. Listing existentials does not prove this universal. Why must humans necessarily try to act in ways that maximize their pleasure? Additionally, doesn’t the statement that all humans try to maximize their pleasure imply that anything which does not attempt to maximize its pleasure is not human?
>>17626741Well I suppose this whole debate comes down to sheer definitions of words ' but, I would argue that yes, anything that doesn't attempt to maximize its pleasure is not human An example: suicidal person taking their life because they don't want to feel like shit anymore. They're not really pleasuring themselves by committing suicide, however, they're tehnically increasing their pleasure by cutting all sources of pain away, thus hedonism, acting in a way that will maxime pleasure (or minimize pain and suffering, in thus case)
>>17626807Another anon mentioned anhedonia. If a person cannot experience pleasure but chooses to commit some action rather than another, then aren’t they necessarily using some metric other than pleasure to choose which action to commit? Wouldn’t this mean that, since they cannot choose to commit acts based on the amount of pleasure they provide (as they cannot experience pleasure, and therefore must be using some other metric to make choices, as each choice provides them with the same lack of pleasure), anhedonic individuals are not human?
>>17626629Arguing for or against hedonism is all just a logical fallacy. You're always begging the question. A hedonist will say "why is hedonism the best approach to life? Because it provides the most happiness and happiness is the most important thing." Any counter arguments just beg a different question. "Why is the pursuit of virtue the best way to live your life? Because virtue is the most important thing, thus to pursue it is the best way to live your life." Just find an approach to life that FEELS right anon :)
>>17626882OP isn’t trying to argue whether or not people ought to be hedonists, he’s arguing that people naturally are hedonists.
>>17626846Anhedonic individuals are sick, they're not healthy "humans". Luckily for them, anhedonia can be cured. For the time they have anhedonia though, 1. They're not healthy, they're sick and 2. Their sickness has blocked their core human characteristic - purist of pleasureSo, I guess by what I said thus far, people with anhedonia aren't healthy human beings, or human beings at all - they have the characteristics that better fit empty philosophical zombies than actual healthy human beings
>>17626919This anon gets it
>>17626807So it’s impossible for a human to believe that by committing suicide they would minimize suffering and effectively maximize pleasure, but instead choose to keep living despite the fact that they believe that living will cause them more suffering? Why is this impossible? If you just say that they can’t choose to keep living because they’re human and humans must choose to maximize their pleasure, then it seems like you just assume that humans try to maximize their pleasure axiomatically.
>>17626629Hedonism is not at the core of man's heart – survivalism is.
>>17626629Why aren't you overdosing on heroin at this very moment?
>>17626629>The monk hides in solitude because that gives him peace, thus pleasure, thus hedonismidiot retard
>>17626995I litereally am uuuuaAAAGH
>>17626629You don't need a ontological justification for any action you part take in.
>>17626979>but instead choose to keep living despite the fact that they believe that living will cause them more sufferingPleasure doesn't have to come in the short term, long term pleasure exists. Hedonisms definition doesn't rule out long term pleasure>then it seems like you just assume that humans try to maximize their pleasure axiomatically.Yes
>>17626629Because when you attach yourself to objects of pleasure you also increase your own suffering so you're actually pursuing both.Pleasure is ephemeral. You never have it because you always want it, no matter what you do you're chasing the ghost of pleasure and never being fulfilled leads to great depression and suffering.Hence why suicide and depression is so high in countries with very good living standards.
What about charity and altruism?Yes, giving to others can feel good, but there is a net loss of pleasure overall, as you could be happier with wealth.What about altruism like you see in the movies where someone sacrifices themselves for the greater good of humanity? In that instance they serve some ideal.What about Christian Monks who forego everything to submit to the Lord, it is hardly the most attractive hedonistic life style, but I suppose one could argue that they do that for greater reward in heaven which can be seen as hedonistic.
>>17626629Impulses build nothing (and lead to mental instability)Struggle and the pursuit of meaning, not hapiness, is what makes us human and alive
>>17627279>you could be happier with wealth.Disagree, research shows that increase in wealth over a certain level, doesn't increase happiness.
>>17626807First of all the term psychological hedonism seems to better cover your opinions.Second if you simply define pleasure as any mental state that is desirable and suffering as mental state that is not desirable, I believe psychological hedonism applies to all sentient creatures, including anhedonic individuals.