In a scale from Maxine weygand to George Patton. How good/bad is Gral potato?
>>58332776George Patton was not a good general. He was a grandstanding retard and had he been allowed to call the shots rather than Ike all of western Europe would've been conquered by the Soviet Union.
>>58332776>On a scale from a poor officer to a mediocre officerUnless everything that’s happened so far has been a fluke, I’d say he’s surpassed both of them by a wide margin
>>58332776Pershing>Verification not required
>>58332776why are you putting patton as your top example? I'm not exactly a Patton hater but surely you can come up with a less controversial standard
Probably the greatest commander since ww2 honestly. Though this is more because the wars post ww2 have either been blowouts, very short or ww1 reloaded >inb4 SchwarzkopfHe didn't do anything impressive. A monkey could've beaten Iraq, they had no chance
>>58332862>>58334307He might end up there with Giap or whoever the guy was that won the Vietnam war for the commies. Hard to think of anyone else in a century who's played a bad hand as well as potato has.
>>58332776I'm just stating this factually; the war isn't over. There's plenty of time for fuckups or miracles.
>>58332776It should be Weygand to Wellington.I put him at Slim, which is pretty high up. He pulled a similar feat, rebuilding a broken army, and leading it to victory.
Rommel.Can deal with the enemy with inferior forces because he knows their tactics but would be in trouble if they adapted.
>>58334307>He didn't do anything impressive. A monkey could've beaten Iraq, they had no chanceOperations like that are very hard to coordinate. The fact that everything went the way it did is a great credit to him. Honestly, the 2003 invasion was much harder because it was done with far fewer troops and materiel.
Russian internet is 500 percent convinced he's dead.
>>58334460Russian internet was also 500 percent convinced they were a peer to the US.
So sad that he's no longer with us :(
He seems good:1. Deliberately try to defend within the cities to deny Russia logistics hubs (Kharkiv, Chernihiv, Sumy) during the initial invasion. 2. Protected Kyiv to avoid a collapse in morale.3. Targeted Russian logistics to neuter powerful enemy formations (Kyiv, Kharkiv)4. Uses his terrain whenever possible. (Siverskyi Donets river, heights around Bakhmut, supplies to Kherson, wetlands north of Kyiv to constrain Russians)5. Withdraws troops and avoid long battles where Russia can bring its strengths to bear (Sievierodonetsk + Lysychansk).6. Rotates and trains units as much as possible. (Bakhmut, Kherson)7. Focused on re-creating a powerful manoeuvre force rather than simply fight with meat waves of conscripted soldiers. 8. Uses misdirection and creates strategic dilemmas for Russia (Kharkiv into the Kherson offensive, Flanking attacks around Bakhmut, invasion of Belgorod)9. Doesn't allow Russia to dictate tempo. Focused on rebuilding trained forces rather than attempt another offensive after Kherson.10. Employs deep strikes to challenge Russian planning and keep them from concentrating anti-air.(Helicopter attack on Belgorod, hitting Crimea with long range missiles, suicide drone boats, long range drone strikes on Kremlin and oil refineries)11. Uses unconventional and asymmetric attacks to disrupt the enemy (Attack into Belgorod, drone bombers, use of saboteurs, shelling Snake Island with artillery on a barge, car bombing collaborators, raids across Dnipro, etc..)12. Kept morale high with constant public interactions, awarding of medals, visits to frontline, interviews with reporters, etc. I know of no complaints about his command style that have reached the public13. Shut down negative messaging around difficult defense of Bakhmut when challenged by naysayers. Proven right. 14. Fired some commanders with unsatisfactory performance early in the warWhat is there to complain about? Maybe the cut off troops in Mariupol?
>>58334460I don't understand why they lie about something that can easily be proven as such. It has to be for internal propaganda right?
>>58334323Lol, not Giap. He beat the Japs, French, U.S, Chinks, and Khmers. He's the best general of the 20th century outside of the World Wars. I'd say this Ukie lad is more on par with Issam Zahreddine, the Syrian General that won the war for Assad when he held out in Deir-ez Zor.
>>58334608or they were trying to get him to expose himself/his location by filming a proof of life video.
>>58334608>I don't understand why they lie about something that can easily be provenFrog and the Scorpion, anon.
>>58332776He's the only general that's actually had to do his job in the past 70 years.I'd say he's doing pretty well.
>>58334460Is this going to be like Paul is Dead but for coping vatniks instead of hopes suffering mental degradation from LSD abuse?
>>58334659>hopesHippies, you drunk retarded Google phoneI know i should have gotten the fucking Samsung
>>58332776>Patton>goodI swear the more I learned about Patton, the more overrated he seems.
>>58334307I like potato, irak 1991 was in a class of its own. The amount of coordination needed was insane
>>58334620Thats an interesting comparison, I hadnt heard of that guy before. Thanks anon. Tho who knows, maybe if Russia starts shit again after losing now the iron potato can work on getting as many wins as Giap lol.
>>58334525This is true and extremly sad
>>58334692He's the MacArthur of Europe but more based lol
>>58334703I like the comparison because he fought in similar circumstances with similar aid coming in, but instead from Russia as opposed to the West. Read about the dude, he was a super badass holding an unsupported city in the middle of the Syrian Desert for over 3 years against ISIS.
>>58334594They managed to get a bunch of the troops out alive from mariupol.
>>58334340Field Marshal Slim was who I was thinking of as well.I was thinking of Imphal during the recent hard fighting. They were fighting over a tennis court for three months. At one point the Japs decided to attack the tennis court wearing tennis shoes. To move quietly apparently but I prefer to think they didn't want to disrespect the playing surface in a disgracefu manner.
>>58334763Or perhaps as part of a slightly optimistic ruse.>Harro, don't mind us, just popped over to work on my serve.
>>58334323>or whoever the guy was that won the Vietnam war for the commies.I guess Dương Văn Minh is the closest to fit that bill
>>58334755oh look it's an /sg/ simp
>>58334791Nah, Giap is the man credited with winning the Vietnam War for the North.
>>58334324Yeah, and that is what makes propaganda such a big part of war.If history is still in contention, propaganda can shape perception, which affects the final outcome of the war.
>>58334947Which is why this board attracts so many professional propagandists, as war is an extension of politics, with bullets instead of ballots.
>>58334971No, politics is an extension of war, like all things.>War was always here.” “This is the nature of war, whose stake is at once the game and the authority and the justification.” “War is god.” “War is the ultimate game because war is at last a forcing of the unity of existence.
>>58332776If the counter-offensive is even a mild operational success he will be the undisputed best officer of the 21st century.
>>58334729Returned safely inside ass along with the ass under their own power.
>>58334802Fuck off lad. This isn't even related to Russia . Zahreddine was regardless of wo he foought for was probably my pick for best 21st century general until Ukraine happened. Just because you don't like the side he fought for doesn't invalidate his achievements, no different than any other military leader. If Russia had somebody like him in charge of Ukraine they would have wiped the floor with the Ukies in a week. But they don't, and never will, because the Russian military is the most paper of paper tigers and has been for the entire duration of its history.
>>58335321>the Russian military is the most paper of paper tigers and has been for the entire duration of its history.Hord my beel
>>58334594i believe mariupol encirclement happened because they refused to pull back when ordered (if my memory doesn't fail me), and by the time they understood that generals actually know what they're talking about, it was too lateso i'd rank the defense of mariupol as "making most out of bad situation", since ukies managed to leverage it to stabilize frontline
>>58336899I think a little insubordination coupled with the fact that azovstal is essentially an impregnable fortress was probably why they stayed back
>>58336899>>58336922IMO it was a Vukovar situation.They knew they couldn't hold the city so they decided to make the Russians pay for it and also keep a lot of their units tied down.
>>58336801Agreed. Which is why I laugh at vatniggers/lefties/isolationist conservatives who tell me to be scared of the two.
>>58334763>They were fighting over a tennis court for three monthsIt was a specific bungalowThey were measuring the gains in terms of the front lawn, the house, the tennis court, etcBakhmut tier lol
>>58336922True. Prokopenko was pretty much in charge when it came down to Azovstal, a very based man.
>>58335321>comparing a full scale war in a major country, with a 2000 km fronline with sandnigger skirmishes in a desert with 0 implications for the worldYou are a certified idiot
>>58334608My best guess is that he was working in an undisclosed location to coordinate efforts and when the Russians noted that nobody had seen him in for a few weeks they threw out the "we got him with a rocket strike" story so that -- in the slim chance that he actually WAS dead for whatever reason -- they could "take credit". The whole thing reeks of desperation for any win, any good news at all, much like crowing over taking over nine months and heavy casualties to bomb a small city into rubble and "claim" it. >>58334624> Frog and the Scorpion, anon.Yeah, that's also a compelling theory. A culture of pathological lying.
>>58334692Patton and Chester Nimitz were both authentic headcases, and from what I've read the U.S. wasn't alone in hand-waving away crazy behavior from key decision-makers . WWII must have been a weird era when the brass were willing to write off batshit insane commanders as "eccentric, but high-functioning" and promote them to highest ranks of command.
Remember not to discount the fact that he has access to NATO maphacks and the finest glownigger intelligence the world has to offer
>>58340485Cry me a river pidor
>>58339460>isolationist conservativesTrump was pretty emphatic on the need to deal with China. He was pretty emphatic on the need for NATO to arm up in case Putin got froggy too, actually.
>>58340594DeSantis 24 baby
>>58334307Maybe they've been blowouts because the generals actually knew what they were doing?
>>58332776He reminds me very much of Slim, in that he's very down to earth and very much a soldier's soldier. In the same way that Slim did he's taken a demoralised and broken army and relentlessly built it up into a world class killing machine. There isn't really any paradigm breaking moves, just a religious application of what you might consider basic principles, troop welfare, intelligence, etc.Like Giap broke paradigms because he thought about problems differently to other generals. Like his solution to Dien Bein Phu was to have siege artillery pieces broken down and carried by hand through jungles before digging them into the hillsides facing the french camp. A solution that would never have occurred to the French generals he was opposing, so they were utterly unprepared for it.We're not really seeing those kind of moves from the Ukrainian army, although on a smaller level we're seeing a good deal of clever innovation. What we are seeing is just a really really good attention to detail. He even looks a bit like Slim.
>>58340485>Unrelated picture about the ATF>Crying about NATOYep, that's a Russian shill trying to plant the idea in anon's head that supporting Ukraine is somehow the same as supporting the ATF.Do Russians really believe this dumb shit works?
>>58332776In a scale from Maxine weygand to George Patton. How dead is Gral potato?
>>58334608>I don't understand why they lie about something that can easily be proven as suchAnon, vatniks do not exist within the realm of reason. They are delusional, unironically. Most are completely unhinged on top of that.
>>58340594The only way forward was the creation of a defensive alliance against China and the only way forward was regional economic integration against China and Trump killed that path.
>>58332776He looks so comfy. I hope he becomes seen by historians as the great general, because we need more chill generals.
>>58332776Patton was a fascist too so I guess it fits.