is it really that hard to isolate the frequency of a hobby drone signal?
14.8 nautical miles with no hennessy:
>>58320733If you want to jam your own communications, then go for it. Drone jammers do not care if its friend or foe.
No, but if you fly one very high, you can drop it with gravity, or its munitions. And you can fly it across oceans and control it across the globe with satellite connection. We have drones that can cross the ocean, so it is not unreasonable to assume that we can build an intercontinental ballistic drone weapon, swarms of quadrotors or plane missile drones. Even ones with tactical nuclear payloads.
>>58320794> communicating on the same wavelength as a hobby drone simply switch freq
>>58320803If you set the coords and set it to fly by wire, like a computer guided missile, you are good to go.
>>58320822Even if it gets jammed, it's locked in its target like a missile and will strike it.
>>58320733>the frequencythere is no "the frequency" in most modern communications protocols you fucking retard. nobody aside from air traffic control does AM anymore.>hard to isolatedepends on what it's using. the protocols using free frequency bands like 2.4GHz are inherently designed to be very resilient to crowded channels because they have to contend with a bajillion other emitters. DJI apparently uses an 802.11 (i.e. wifi) based UDP protocol, which means they basically have to live with constant jamming when operating in any remotely civilized area.
>>58320803>so it is not unreasonable to assumewhat are BATTERIES you double niggeryes it's unreasonable to assume a quadrotor will ever cross an ocean, it can't even cross a medium sized town.
>>58320907> there is no "the frequency"> using free frequency bands like 2.4GHzbruh...
>>58321007You'd be surprised anon, OFDM is surprisingly resilient. Have a look at how P25 does it, they have long range real time radio comms and probably half of their bandwidth goes to error correction codes.
>>58321051thanks, will look into this no cap
>>58320733This is wrong place to ask any kind of tech related questions.
>>58321088Eh it's about 50/50 you get some jacknut who actually knows what he's doing vs the most of the "bro I'm too busy working on coding to answer questions but I have time to leave a passive aggressive comment like a woman" tards on /g/.
>>58321088>>58321200never been to g no cap but this is more of a doctrine/EW questiont. OP
>>58320733Anything that transmits will probably have an FCC id. You can look up what frequency it transmits at.>hint: it's 2.4ghz
>>58322715why hasnt Russia done that then no cap?
>>58322914Great question. My first thought was anti-radiation missiles, but I don't actually know.
>>58322914It takes a metric fuckton of power the larger an are you want to jam.
>>58320733What did he say?
>>58320733Everyone developed portable drone jammers after Syria, but the first year of Ukraine showed that they're a terrible idea in a real war because the other side can easily pinpoint the signal and drop artillery on you.
Yes
Yeah, you need a lot of power to generate a signal strong enough to jam a drone, and if the drone is flying close to the ground it'll be able to fly "under" the jamming signal unless its very close to the jammer
>>58321007>frequency bandsdo you understand what a "band" is, retard?
>>58322914because 2.4GHz is a free frequency band, which means everybody and their mother is already shouting at the top of their lungs in there, examples being wifi, bluetooth etc signals. so every comms system designed to operate in this band is basically hardened against jamming even if it's just a civilian device. you can of course overwhelm them but it takes an unreasonable amount of power, at which point the enemy might just start targeting your jammers shining bright like the sun.
>>58321200most of the script kiddies don't know shit about electronics eitherper-poster you can probably find the most electrical engineers on /sci/, but a faster board like /k/ is as good as any because you'll get replies faster. just need to filter out the retards.
To be clear, the suicide drone videos you see posted here aren't using the Wifi bands, they're using I think the 433Mhz band, because its easier to get long-range communication on it than on the 2.4Ghz bands.Still easy to jam, and in the case of the video feed it's analog so it doesn't have any sort of jamming resilience the way the Wifi-band communication stuff does.
Okay but riddle me this. Is it possible to carry a jamming signal remotely via a laser so that the source appears to be the projected location and the area of effect is relatively limited?Failing that, are there any downsides to simply restricting jamming broadcast angles so that they create aerial firewalls that cannot be easily located and struck by artillery?
>>58326067You're talking about creating very narrow focused RF jamming signals directed towards the drones, but such that they can't be detected from other directions and used for counter-battery.It's possible TO AN EXTENT to create directional signals like that, but it depends on the frequency of the signal. Millimeter wave signals are all very directional (which is why it's such a big headache using them in 5G). Wifi can be directional, but to a lesser extent.The bigger issue is that if you have a directional jammer, where do you point it? The advantage of omnidirectional jamming is that you don't need to know where the enemy drones are, if you make the jammer directional then you have to point it in the right direction first, which means locating the drones, which opens up the whole other issue of having to put up anti-drone radar (which ISN'T directional)
>>58326088>The bigger issue is that if you have a directional jammer, where do you point it? You're thinking too small scale. Think a fortress wall but up in the sky. Angled at like say, 70 degrees outward. Most drones have shitty glide ratios so the depth of the aerial firewall shouldn't need to be too long to ensure they don't escape from momentum. Actually would the signals even be able to pass through the interference wall?
>>58326229>Actually would the signals even be able to pass through the interference wall?Yes. Interference is a phenomenon that occurs at the receiver (drone) when multiple signals are received on the same frequency band and overlap, it doesn't involve radio waves hitting and bouncing off of one another in the air.It *could* be done that way, but it would require you to basically put up the equivalent of a cell phone network worth of jamming towers around the territory you're trying to wall off. Plausible for a DMZ, not viable for an active battlefield.
>>583209321. No need to use such hateful language2. International drone strikes are already real3. Global satellite communications enable thisYou know those little quadrotor drones are not the only types of drones, but their long range capabilities are already proven, even recently with the incident at the military parade.
>>58326259Which is why you have anti-drone defenses in high security areas, beyond just jammers. You can just shoot them out of the sky as well.
>>58326259Okay good, I was remembering correctly. I didn't begrudgingly force my way through a network communications graduate class for nothing.It's be really cool to see pop-up invisible fortress walls of jamming. That shit feels like practically tron levels of futuristic warfare.
>>58326268Yeah, you'd have a combination of anti-drone systems at specified high security areas. Anti-drone radar, anti-drone microphones, anti-drone cameras, drone jammers, drone net guns, drone gun-guns, anti-drone drones, the list goes on.Expensive, time-consuming to set up and operate, not portable. GI Joe isn't going to be lugging that stuff around on his back.
Considering how retarded all the nuke radars were during the cold war i wonder if the new drone era will prompt russia and other first world countries to create a new kind of wall to stop drones. A jamming wall similar to the blackwall in cyberpunk 2077 that instead of keeping AI's out of the network keeps drones from corssing borders.
>>58326349>A jamming wall similar to the blackwall in cyberpunk 2077 that instead of keeping AI's out of the network keeps drones from corssing borders.I want it so bad.And special glasses that let you visualize the amount of electric noise. So we can see these glorious cyber walls.
>>58326395We're still a couple of years away from AR goggles that do that, but low-cost RF tech is progressing in leaps and bounds. If you're interested in playing around with the technology, I recommend pic relatedhttps://wetoolshop.com/en-ie/products/new-portapack-h2-and-hackrf-one-sdr-software-defined-radio-1mhz-6ghz-assembled-with-antennas-built-in-rechargeable-batteryportable software-defined radio that can visualise RF intereference on difference frequencies as a spectrum analyser. It's also a transmitter, so you can transmit low-power jamming signals yourself (in minecraft, of course).
>>58326015/diy/ has an electronics thread /ohm/ and a ham radio thread /ham/, g is basically computers
>>58326857>/diy/ has an electronics thread /ohm/ and a ham radio thread /ham/, g is basically computers>g is basically computersAs an actual computer engineer, I have to protest. g doesn't know shit about computers. They're like the kid in class that tries to use windows restore points to recover deleted files after circle jerking about their new AHK script they're using because they couldn't figure out how to use cheat engine to hax the score of the flash game they were playing.
>>58326980Well plenty of them know more about Linux and bash than me, friendly gay lesbian transgender thread has helped me countless times, outside specialty threads like that there is a lot of cruft and gamers
>>58325438fascinating, thanks
A little bit off-topic, but...>What can you do for drone counter measures, so far?And>In theory, would some "EMP Gun" be a viable thing to "shoot down" drones on the battlefield?
Drone fag hereAnons are correct 2.4GHz is what most over the counter RC stuff uses. To a lesser extent 900 MHz. Some of the more high end long range stuff uses 900 MHz. 5.8 GHz is mostly used for video feed but is shorter range. Long range setups use 900 MHz for control signal and 2.4 GHz for video.These same 3 bands are used for all kinds of civilian use. Old school cordless phones ften used 900 MHz. Older wifi is 2.4 GHz and newer wifi is 5.8 GHz. These bands are pretty much open to civilian use.
Most people don't even know that there are new laws in the USA saying that all RC control signals for aircraft over 250 grams must have the GPS location of the pilot encoded in the signal. Your controller basically needs to tell the authorities where you are standing so they can come arrest you if you are fucking around with a drone.Goes into effect in September.
>>58331857how does this affect homebuilt drones made from aliexpress parts?
>>58331213been tested/implemented, i think they suffer from range issues and have unintended secondary targets
>>58334264As I understand it if the drone is over 250g it must comply.
>>58320733the problem with jamming is that you need power and it jams a lot of bandwidth. We used jammers in OIF, they were powered by vehicles. You have to have power generation in remote areas to use them. You cant just run a jammer all the time. Frequency detection would be more valuable than jammers. If you combined frequency detection with specific bandwidth jamming then it could be effective but honestly that basic level of technology is basically over the head of an average soldier. Even american soldiers didnt understand how the mice system worked, you only knew to turn it on. Sometimes IEDs would still hit you so there was no way of knowing if they worked.
>>58335049So not at all?Buy individual components from China and assemble drone, that's how the best drones are currently made by hobbyists
>>58320822To specify, they usual use a mix of inertial navigation systems, ground-looking radar, and Digital Scene Matching And Correlation (DSMAC)
>>58320907>which means they basically have to live with constant jammingSure, but those transmitters also have very (legally) limited power output. I don't know much about radio but I'd imagine a dedicated transmitter could put out order(s) of magnitude more power(assuming there's no legal holdup...)
>>58320907>>58321051Modern EW gear should have no problem jamming some 100-200 MHz of the band to fuck with commercial ISM shit, and to nitpick OFDM and other non-frequency hopping techniques have a definite centre frequency, they are just more resilient to narrow bands being occupied.
Well, they operate on relatively common communications frequencies, so jamming the entire band for them 1) broadcasts your jammer's location clearly2) jams a bunch of other stuff too.
