war is art

Are they drawing fire or distracting with the M113s? I can't tell if they're firing the HMGs on top.

This is a war crime. Literally American - ISIS tactic.

>>57531961
>flock of m113s grazing in the wild
Magnificent.

>>57531961
Who is using the M113s here?

>>57531961
Arma 3 footage

These aren't M113s

>>57532166
Correct, those are ACV-AAPC.

If m113s are approaching, backing away, approaching like predators coming towards a wounded animal towards you, you know you fucked up.

>>57531961
It’s just crazy to see coordinated action like this on the one hand and total mindless bumrushing in platoon/ company column on the other hand.

HD
https://files.catbox.moe/1m9hiw.mp4

>>57532443
The southern attacks that fucked up a couple days back looked better than most uke successes I've seen.

I'd say the Nato-trained counter offensive forces aren't taking anywhere near the casualties. The guys that having been holding the line without that training must have trouble keeping their jaws off the ground.

>>57531961
Well, well, looks like Turkey has been providing more than they've announced

God I can't wait to the Bradleys in action alongside Leos

Is this a standard IFV tactic? Move forward fire then back up and repeat?

>>57531961
>>57532443
That looks more like training. And yes, if this is the tactic of Ukraine soldiers than Wagner is fucked if they dont have artsy support (they probably dont have or 3 hours later) or mines and anti-tank bazookas!

>>57532630
Dutch and belgian m113s can look like that.

>>57532932
>if this is the tactic of Ukraine soldiers than Wagner is fucked
What, driving up and down in a straight line repeatedly?

>>57533005
Yep. Think about it. Wagner will have almost no experience of an opposition with a decent reverse gear, and the training to use it.

>>57532424
Why do they maneuver back and forth like that?

>>57532858
Western vehicles can actually reverse at speed, so probing back and forth is somewhat viable as opposed to just sitting there and being zero'd in.

>>57533048
you haven't answer the question u nigger

>>57533064
He did answer your question you double nigger, but let me spell it out in more simple terms:

>Russian guy no have smart boomstick
>Russian boomstick only simple fire in straight line
>Only hit guy who stay still
>Ukraine vehicle move back and forth so russian boomstick no hit him
>Other vehicle too slow for this and get hit by russian boomstick

>>57531961
aren't these YPR 765 (considering the turrent configuration)

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>>57531961
>Do you ever see a bunch of walzing M113 in a combat situation not in exercises?

Pretty much almost every few months here in the Philippines lmao.

>>57533092
to add to this, the reason they move back and forth is because there's no room to move more while staying useful in combat

>>57533092
he didn't answer that you triplenigger
>>57533127
thanks, see >>57533092 that wasn't that hard

>>57533121
is that 20mm on lead vehicle?

>>57533121
How do Flips never run out of dirka-dirka-dirk-allahs and commies to shoot?

>>57533144
They're renewable resource

>>57533045
Fucks around with wire guided and non-guided at rockets, aiming them becomes this pain in the ass, and when you have the thermals on your apc, someone popping up to aim for longer means you fuck them up and know where to suppress with your browning.

There's another reason though, which is way more obvious given how this looks.
If they move like that, with an amorphic cluster that might be one corner of the field at one moment, then all over the field, then another, what are you telling arty, who have barely any shells? Or more specifically, you have been given explicit instructions *not* to tell arty unless the target is valuable enough. This would be a situation where you would need initiative and trust to adapt and call in arty, but doctrine won't allow it. Really it does come down to that reverse gear, and Ukes knowing when RF are really low on shells. I mean you saw it, suddenly the apcs are 200 meters in front of infantry and letting rip with brownings at the tree line, but you didn't know they were all going to end up there.

>>57533045
Uhh to not get hit by missiles, arty or drones?

>>57533165
Thanks, I always seen m113 like battle taxis, less as fire support platform , and even less as something that will hang around on battlefield supporting infantry.

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>>57533144
Corruption my guy. No matter how many battles the AFP wins nor how many Ceasefires and Pardons we grant, as long as local officials and elites keep fucking the poors in the ass, someone somewhere is gonna take up a gun vs. the gubmint.

>>57532858
>move in, unload rounds
>back away, reload
>friends move in
>cycle repeats
That's my guess

>>57533144
tribalism that runs on the genes

>>57531961
randomly driving around on some poor farmers field and shooting at trees is now considered peak military tactics
this war really brings out the worst on all sides

>>57533210
Firstly, you you are the guy who keeps on saying "Battle taxi" on here, reality does have to take precedence, and there is literally no way of stopping soldiers from modifying their apc to be able to provide some fire support. Then factor in Ukes will push whatever the fuck they have to the front. That completely fragged m113 you have likely seen in both Uke and RF footage? I strongly suspect that it's the Azov one that pushed too far forwards in a recon mission. m113 in a recon mission. That's the kinda shit that happens.

Secondly, the m113s shown here are generations adapted from the originals, and have turrets, thermals/day/night sights and the like. Their gear systems, motors and handling is massively improved. In short, they're designed to be fire support, or very light versions of IFVs. The West thinks it's own decisions in this regard are a bit stupid, which makes them feel better about donating the things in the first place, and then the ukes take them, do the training and work Kadivka into a smoking crater and then they pull this shit.

It's not *just* Nato training though. They have had to figure this shit out and get the timing right by trial and error, and I would be really surprised it it wasn't very very bespoke. It seems there's almost a muscle-memory involved in the defence of Bakhmut. When we get all the details, there will be all that indescribable craft-shit missing.

>>57533718
>you are the guy who keeps on saying "Battle taxi
I didn't say they are I said I think they are only once.

>>57532472
>I can actually see the HMGs firing in this one
Thanks anon

>>57533121
>>57533214
Fuck man, my gramps and his wife got killed in the Philippines. Took a decade of her family's hard to work to get the guy on a trial just because he had a relative in the police.

What a fucking shitshow.

>>57533121
crazy how only like 6% of the country is Muslim, but they have terrorist groups that are able to take entire cities

>>57533736
Yeah, there's a poster with a reoccurring pattern of speech which goes a little like "Oh no, that new vehicle couldn't be *that* useful to Ukraine, or at least not in the front, they're not designed for it!" and if the subject matter is m113s they will talk about 'battle taxis' and 'not enough armour' and 'they may have tracks but because there's a single bit of footage of a Uke driving one out of a hole badly they aren't any good for mud season"

They said very similar things about the Bushmaster when it was announced Australia was providing them, "Obviously they can't be used in offensive actions or in the front at all!"
Of course, as soon as a Ukrainian got behind the wheel of one and saw it's range, they could hear nothing but the neighs and whinnys of ten thousand Don in their ears.

So yeah, carefully choose your memetics.

>>57533810
The 6% is not evenly spread out. So its 6% total but in some regions (islands) its like 90%.

>>57533832
this board is too paranoid about fucking vatniggers and that paranoia is ruing this board then vatniggers themselves

>>57533849
>that paranoia is ruing this board then vatniggers themselves
this paranoia this ruining this board more than vatniggers themselves.

>>57533832
the US seriously needs to double-down on the light armored vehicles we've sent. Sending another 300 M113s, 200 M117s, 90 Strikers, and 1800 Humvees couldn't hurt our own military capabilities right?

>>57533137
>Looks just because you're uneducated and don't know what zero'ing is doesn't mean it wasn't explained to you.
You can make inferences from such statements if you weren't a 80iq mongoloid.

>>57533832
second of all considering how lightly armored Gavins are, this back and fourth moving and taking unnecessary risk on open field just to cover infantry with .50 cals is stupid in my book.

>>57533885
lmao keep projecting your mutt IQ on others

>>57533869
Nobody wants them to get complacent. Everyone wants to avoid the typical client state thing, that infected Syrians in 2013, KMT Chinese in 1943, and arguably Iraqis in the 2010s, wherein they stockpile huge amounts of weapons, never learn to use them right, get routed and then have all those weapons captured by the enemy

not to mention selling them off, because there's so much they won't miss one or two, right? hence overall, better to give it to them slowly, train them to use it properly, and keep em grateful

>>57533900
Not stupid when you don't have anything else so you need that ersatz IFV; also if it stops the enemy from shooting at your troops with machine-guns, it works

>>57533930
>Not stupid
the least bad option in plethora of other bad options?

>>57533958
Yeah, exactly lol
Of course everyone wishes they have something like a Bradley
or better still, a squadron of F-15s on call with eight JDAMs apiece
But needs must when the devil drives, and war is inherently risky

The not-M113s should at least resist 12.7mm fire, and keep the enemy heads down beating up the treeline with their own MGs. You just have to hope nobody can get a bead in the midst of all that with an ATGM

>>57533900
As I said, reality must take precedence. People fight with what they have. Covering fire with brownings which is taking the enemy's attention away from troopers is great as long as you're trained in how to properly do that.

I'd say we are looking at what that "Push" was at Bakhmut.

>>57533849
Actually I just find regular military enthusiasts to be bloody annoying. I don't consider that person to be part of 'hybrid warfare', I consider them very likely to have a similar diagnosis to myself.

>>57532288
Turkey plays both sides but I seriously doubt they sent those. They look like YPR-765.

>>57533869
Yes. However I daresay the way things have been done, we the observer don't have a good sense of just what the materiel aide has actually done for the 'second army'.

The big indicator that in actually fact second army was good to go once the first batch of big toys had been delivered was the news that "The TDF was on it's way to being fully mechanised". In other words, by and large, the TDF were going to get the Warsaw pact shit, and everyone else was getting Western, except where the TDF had excelled itself and those battalions got attached to brigades.

That's a bit of a "Oh fuck" moment, isn't it? Doesn't that suggest that maybe the figures we have seen in materiel aide don't reflect reality very well, and there has been (as well there should) lots of sleight of hand tricks going on.

>>57531961
tiktoker tactics

>>57533777
You migrated or expat baby?

>>57533869
The US doesn't want Ukraine to win the war quickly. I say this as someone who wants Ukraine to win too.

>large group of M113s engaged in legitimate combat maneuvers on the plains of the former USSR blasting away at Russian soldiers
I can't be the only one that had a big grin on their face finally getting to see our old Cold War junk fulfilling its purpose over 30 years after the Cold War ended

>>57534307
anon, everyone's just waiting to watch Ukies LARP "Gunner HEAT" for real

>>57534175
I'm unrelated to the Philippines, granny died in her 40s so gramps got remarried with a Philippino and moved there so she could be with her family.

>>57534231
I agree with you. This war is about inflicting as a much damage to Russians as possible, not about Ukraine winning.

>>57534307
>ended

It never ended, we just had an interlude.

>>57534307
I'm not gonna be satisfied until I see some Bradley's mowing down vatniks en masse

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>>57531961
Okay so out of curiosity, if the context is actually correct, why isn't Wanger using a ton of artillery on them? I mean even if they're low on shells, this amount of APCs has gotta be a high-value target to use the shells they have left on

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>>57536365
Pay attention anon

>>57531961
Are the Ukies aware that the M113s have aluminum armor? I guess they don't have other options.

>>57532858
Literally nigger-isis tier. evil hapsburg caracole/drive-by tactics!!!

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That's cool footage, but without a clear understanding of the tactical situation it's kind meaningless.
This could be them looking for an opening or maybe it's a demonstration to distract from another maneuver or some kind of recon by fire? Or all of these together.

>>57536365
prigozin got ghosted by russian high command so now his soldiers are getting ghosted in the field by the artillery

>>57536365
It probably takes hours from a call for fire to the actual rounds start falling, they are only good at massed pre-planned artillery fire.

>>57536521
well the other alternative is unsupported human waves like wager does so your choice

>>57536521
Dont get hit is a viable tactic in combat.
Hence the jockeying back and forth.

wild right?

>>57531961
>M113
Faggot, kill yourself

>>57536907
YPR-765 is literally is a M113 variant anon chill out

>>57532630
I believe they are Dutch YPRs.

>>57533142
It’s a 25mm.

>>57537117
vgh, glorious Pinoy Bradley

>>57536365
Pay attention to the thread. Every word. Kadivka.

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>>57531961
I need more /k/ino like this

>>57537093
>>57537105
Isn't the YPR a AIFV variant?

>>57534307
As long as the Chinese are red, the cold War ain't done yet

>>57533563
Ah the old cav archer AOE2 move. Classic

>>57539433
Which is derived from the m113. AIFV is a US development, with Turkish input, then adopted by various countries who put their own spin on it.

As you can imagine, we have what we *think* we're looking at, and what we *think* are the origins of that thing according to records, but any one of the nations involved in the development of the platform could be responsible for these modifications.

Also honestly it's more likely to straight up be Dutch/Belgian configuration.

I didn't know they had provided ones with the autocannon though (I swear it was actually 20mm)

Weird that Russia publicly said they wanted to negotiate right before western trained and equipped soldiers come out.

>>57539433
Yes it is. I believe the ones the Ukies are using were donated by the Dutch.
>>57539645
It’s a Oerlikon KBA-B02 autocannon which is 25mm.

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>>57539645
>>57539734
I mean, as far as I know the AIFV is as derived from the M113 as the Bradley is, they were both born out of the same design process and demands for a IFV with the M113 as a starting point for the project.

>>57539784
Picrel is a classic remake of Viet Nam gun truck versions by some contractors with a couple of damaged vehicles to work with. Also not a bad idea since it elevates the unarmored M113 floor.

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>>57533121
look at that bad girl with the autocannon, damn

is it an IFV conversion a recon vehicle conversion with no transport capabilities

>>57539784
i love this little nigga like you wouldn't believe

>>57534525
Gramps was a typical desperate loser. Flips marry for money for their parasite relatives. Many such cases but Russians are worse.

>>57534020
>>57532288
PI M113A1s arent M113s to you? seems needlessly autistic

>>57536521
The armor works on fragments. It's not an IFV.

>>57539645
They're all US hulls originally but there is so little left it doesn't matter much.

>>57536365
>this amount of APCs has gotta be a high-value target
they have been given thousands of M113s like this anon, killing even 10 here would not put a serious dent in their ability to combat deploy them for like a year at least - and any losses they face would probably get replaced
if anything the crew would be higher value, but considering the length of training they give these guys and the fact that nothing russia does can remove experienced trainers from the process (because they are british, german etc.) russia can gain nothing strategically from taking these dudes out - theyre fucked either way

>>57536521
thats steel laminate spaced armour anon but sure

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>>57533210

>>57533121
The turret looks like it's worth more than the Gavin under it

>>57533810
quite the warning, isn't it

>>57539784
>When you can see the distinct M113 outline
>It also looks like a MRAP
>Realizing M113s are smaller than MRAPs
It feels like I'm close to a mindbreak guys

>>57536521
Yes. and? The point is it still resists MG fire regardless of what it's made of

>>57539734
I thought the YPRs donated were armed wih MGs only

>>57533018
>>57532932
Counterpoint: russoids can't shoot on-target anyway.

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>>57531961
By the South Vietnamese in 1973.
Here's a scan I took from a book I own.

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>>57542861

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>>57539906
PI M113A1 was pretty different to the later AIFV. It still had the normal M113 layout and was basically just an automotive improvement to the earlier XM765, and had windowed firing ports and shit.
It was more similar to the Italian VCC-1 than AIFV

>>57542627
Fair, this is why having them exposed for longer is the bigger deal.

>>57542861
>>57542866
>>57543164

How many fucking m113 threads turn up, then this thread happens and suddenly we get some real shit. I've never seen these renders before, thanks.

>>57536365
Here>>57543121
Pigger got smoked.

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>>57531961
"walzing"

>>57543212
Shit they can't even edit their garbage convincingly.

>>57543212
Welcome to recce.

why no kornet storm like we in syria?

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Its a crime the west sent those shitboxes for anything but casevac/supply runs well behind the lines.

>>57543359
SIRS DO NOT REDEEM

>>57543359
Kek, piggies literally sizzling.

>57543426
>/pol/troons have woken up and begun chimping
there goes the board

>>57543429
How is that funny? Both sides are circle jerking about deaths as if their team is scoring a goal.
Have some fucking decency. This shit war has to end one way or the other.

>>57543450
Good argument

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>>57543472
Sorry but I don't argue with brown subhumans

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>>57543457
Good thing i am not on any "team", i am here to laugh at slavic goyim getting roasted for their jewish elite. Hell my company is a subcontractor for the defense industry so i am actually benefitting from the money laundery scheme the dems have cooked up with this war. Honk honk motherfucker.

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>>57543444

>>57532858
Not an ifv

>>57544059
>muh battle taxi

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>>57532166
>>57532288
>>57534020
the one closest to the camera is definitely a Turkish FNSS ACV-19
look at the angled panel on the sides after the turret. perfect match.

>>57540045
they will never be gavin

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>>57544059
>AIFV
>not and IFV
how dumb can you be

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>>57543189
I posted the ARVN scans in at least one other thread, but got no (You)'s, so felt discouraged. Glad to have provided something on interest.

>>57545000
nice trips bro. I always heard the ARVN was shit. Did they get better by the end or were these like lucky wins?

>>57545000
Using M113s in the high intensity armored combat of 1972 and 1975 must have been real intense.

>>57531961
video is down. Anyone got a mirror?

>>57545965
nvm, found
>>57532472

>>57543359
That's a lot more survivors than i expected from a hit that bad

I wonder if BMPs have awful survivability simply because they're so small you can't get out after a hit

>>57547373
well, survivors and "survivors", it's very apparent by the gait of their feet who's relatively intact and whose will be brought back on stretchers

>>57545727
ARVN had good soldiers here and there, the rangers in particular were famously good. They also had one very hypercompetent officer Ngô Quang Trưởng who is a good read. ARVN was best with american air support behind them, and once the US stopped providing it they fell apart.

>>57532472
seems like they died from atgm or artillery strikes
https://files.catbox.moe/0ey98j.mp4

>>57547673
Holy shit thats one well cooked pig.

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>>57547673
>the absolute state of ukrainian offensives
LMAO

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>>57545727
PAVN and the VC were exhausted with depleted manpower and equipment after the heavy casualties of the Easter Offensive of '72. ARVN was able to put pressure on them in the beginning because of this.
As another anon mentioned, ARVN rangers were also very competent.

>>57533144
you say that like its a bad thing