[a / b / c / d / e / f / g / gif / h / hr / k / m / o / p / r / s / t / u / v / vg / vm / vmg / vr / vrpg / vst / w / wg] [i / ic] [r9k / s4s / vip / qa] [cm / hm / lgbt / y] [3 / aco / adv / an / bant / biz / cgl / ck / co / diy / fa / fit / gd / hc / his / int / jp / lit / mlp / mu / n / news / out / po / pol / pw / qst / sci / soc / sp / tg / toy / trv / tv / vp / vt / wsg / wsr / x / xs] [Settings] [Search] [Mobile] [Home]
Board
Settings Mobile Home
/k/ - Weapons


Thread archived.
You cannot reply anymore.




File: hqdefault (1).jpg (29 KB, 480x360)
29 KB
29 KB JPG
The Bear Menace cannot be overstated. Grizzly and black bears roam the countryside with impunity, seeking whom they may devour. As such, traditional methods of dealing with them might not work as well as expected. Clearly, a firearm of some sort is needed, but what?

This thread will attempt to break this down into 3 categories.
#1 outfitting a 12 gauge shotgun to kill bear
#2 retrofitting an exisiting rifle to kill bear
#3 creating a new purpose built bear rifle.
>>
My dick.
>>
File: LH12HF-6.jpg (1.43 MB, 1200x900)
1.43 MB
1.43 MB JPG
>>54146888
Also, checked.

As far as number 1, it would seem to me some kind of repeater, an autoloader, a pump, even a lever action might not be terrible. For me personally, I don't want to have to actuate the firearm between shots, and feel a bolt being slammed around by hot gasses has just a good of chance if not more than me trying to work the action.

I'm partial to the lynx 12. It's an AK pattern shotgun with an adjustable gas system and takes saiga mags out of the box. I'd like to add a muzzle brake and recoil reducing stock to make this thing a dedicated slug blaster.
>>
File: 712244.jpg (35 KB, 480x360)
35 KB
35 KB JPG
>>54146900
Gee Bill, TWO sets of digits?

But what to feed the shotgun? Slugs. Not buckshot, slugs. Not foster slugs either. They need to be purpose built brenneke dangerous game slugs, or some other kind of purpose built dangerous game slug. Dixie slugs, is, to my knowledge, out of business. Brenneke is the only company that makes a slug you can readily purchase that makes a useful dangerous game slug.
>>
>>54146888
I miss when Colbert was funny
>>
>>54146956
Me too. Me too.
>>
>>54146888
As for number 2 and 3, the best calibers to use appear to be in the low 40s. They have better sectional density and penetration. Now, I have heard sectional density is an obsolete way to grade penetration, and while that may be true of more modern spitzer rounds, it does a perfectly adequate job of describing the behavior of round and flat nosed projectiles. Different considerations are needed for converting a rifle vs building a rifle.
>>
File: ll08uh113ri61.jpg (59 KB, 640x480)
59 KB
59 KB JPG
>>54147024
When converting a rifle, one needs a round that is of the correct length, it cannot be much longer, but also within the pressure confines of the rifle. Thus, good candidate rifles are ww2/cold war era battle rifles, with chunky steel receivers and good steel. Good cartridges would be 458 win mag, 416 taylor, 404 jeffrey, 416 ruger, and the 416 remington magnum.

Good rifles would be the M1 garand, the svt-40, the fn-49, potentially, the hakim, and the browning bar.

Please please please try to list other rifles that would be good for conversion.

How about an H&R superautomatic?
Or a yugo m76?
>>
>>54146956
Ye. A better time. I miss old Jon Stewart too, took shots at everyone, didn’t matter what side you were on.
Now it’s just dreck :(
>>
>>54146956
>>54146973
>>54147218
Libcuck here. We all do
>you will never ever enjoy Jon Stewart daily show, Colbert Report, and Mad TV
>never ever again
>>
File: 1635512420860.jpg (95 KB, 770x600)
95 KB
95 KB JPG
>>54146956
>when Colbert was funny
>before John Stuart was jewish
>>
10mm
>>
File: 1363920914821.jpg (73 KB, 746x514)
73 KB
73 KB JPG
>>54146888
But why? Most of this board are cityfags and suburbanites. Bears are friends.
>>
File: 40 1.jpg (52 KB, 1024x768)
52 KB
52 KB JPG
>>54147247
Jimmy Kimmel used to be funny too. If I were to tell you, I used to watch Jimmy Kimmel's show, would you believe me?

And now, girls jumping on trampolines. Vanessa was best girl.

Moving on. It seems the 3006 and 762x54 actions can handle 458 win mag and 416 taylor rounds. Can the 8mm also handle them?
>>
File: BC_BAR-600x450.jpg (20 KB, 600x450)
20 KB
20 KB JPG
>>54147285
Women are insufferable fools who demand to go outside, yet never take precautions or show proper respect, just silly gestures. If you wish to keep your woman safe, you will slaughter things before they reach her.

Also, to go fishing.
>>
File: IMG_20220623_073039.jpg (418 KB, 1318x1248)
418 KB
418 KB JPG
I can only assume that peppy 45 colt will take down a bear. In the left case is a 255gr swc loaded to >1200fps. The one on the right a 250gr lfn loaded with a casefull of pyrodex P and zooms along around 1100fps. I've read on forums that 900fps for 45cal is needed to hunt big NA game
>>
>>54147218
Doesn't he have a new show?
>>
>>54147344
I imagine this would be much better than a standard handgun, but why not get a dedicated longarm? Should there be a #4 section, handguns?

I imagine a hardcast swc at those specs wouldn't be terrible. I'd still want o beef it up to 454 specs. This thread is bear stoppers, not simply hunting them. More of a last minute defensive oh shit moment.
>>
>>54146888
I feed Colbert to the bears as a peace offering
>>
>>54147477
That would work if not for the fact that Bears do not know the concept of peace and are godless killing machines.
>>
There's a book on this about handguns etc. Basically, most attacks are close range and happen fast.
Sights that allow for rapid target acquisition at close range are optimal. Irons or red dot, no magnification.

Ability to get hits on target accurately and quickly are most important, so reliable repeaters or semi autos are the ticket.

Slugs for shotguns are better, but buckshot within 5 yards will work. Adequate penetration to the CNS is the only thing that will immediately stop the threat/bear. Buckshot is just .33 cal soft lead bbs, and they lose energy quickly due to lack of mass and composition/shape.

For rifle rounds, flatnose and either hardcast or solids can penetrate clear through the SOB. Now rifles usually have lots of velocity, so heavy rounds will have lots of momentum and penetrate well. That said, soft points or hollow points (even fmjs) can lack penetration on certain shots (glancing skull/shoulder) whereas the solids or hardcast with a flat nose will tend to crush bone instead of glancing off.

For ops questions
1. Pump action 12ga with slugs and a red dot or fast and comfy irons will smoke them. Must have a stock, shockwaves are a meme. Don't believe me? Go shoot both for speed and accuracy at the shooting range at 5 yards and compare results.

2. A reliable semi auto in 7mm mag, 300 win mag, 30-06, or any .30 cal going over 2500fps with some quality bullets. If dedicated for bear defense, I'd get some heavy for caliber hardcast or solids, but heavy for caliber hunting ammo that isn't super soft for expansion will do. Again, red dot or fast iron sights.
(Any rifle you can shoot fast and accurate will do, so bolts, pumps, and levers are fine too)

3. Now, if I made the perfect bear defense rifle for myself, it would be a semi auto .300 win mag likely an ar-10 style since that exists, a red dot and a 20-25 round mag. Probably 16" or 18" barrel to keep it maneuverable in the woods.
>>
>>54146888
>>54148222
checkd out this link: https://www.ammoland.com/2021/06/handgun-or-pistol-against-bear-attacks-104-cases-97-effective/
>>
>>54148799
It seem the handgun is effective in mostly scaring bears or shooting smallish black bears. A few cases of lucky hits on a brown. I think a more reliable stopper is needed. The bare bear minimum should start around 44 mag, maybe a stout 45 lc, but I'd feel safer around 454. None seem particularly pleasant to shoot. None of these have particularly great sectional density. I wonder if there is a round that does have this, or if one could be created. It would need to be longer.
>>
File: 404 Jeffery 077.jpg (2.07 MB, 2592x1944)
2.07 MB
2.07 MB JPG
>>54148222
Why a pump over say an autoloader? I do not think buckshot is ever acceptable for bears. I think only purpose built dangerous game slugs are. From what I can gather, one wants to destroy the shoulder, to physically cripple the bear.
For rifles, you'll need a large area, round or flat nose bullets, but no spitzer things. No spitzer rounds. I do not want a rifle that exceeds 2500 fps. Rifle rounds do funny things at 2500 fps plus, and I would rather the rounds not do funny things, like tumble, or yaw, or fragment. So good solid rifle bullets at 2500 fps or less, with a minimum of around 300 grains.
>>
File: P1010326.jpg (38 KB, 800x600)
38 KB
38 KB JPG
>>54152435
It seems revolver rounds like the 357 can get some decent sectional density at 180-200 grains, and the 44 magnum can at 350+ grains.
picrel is a 405 grain 44 magnum.
>>
>>54146888
Fuck that faggot colbert.
>>
>>54147391
It's a shitshow and it's just a literal boomer trying to be hip with the leftist trends, he has literally shit talked about white people as a whole when he had that nigger faggot cory booker on and even the nigger had to correct Jon about not all white people are evil.
>>
>>54154214
yeah but he hated bears, and so he fits the thread. he was playing a character. the character of steven colbert was much more likable than steven colbert.
>>
>>54154257
>Cory Booker had to tell Jon not all white people are evil
Do people just break with age? Am I going to get that way?
>>
>>54146910
Yeah everyone knows that "regular" slugs won't kill an animal routinely stopped with 9mm. If it don't gotta bear on th' box, it'll bounce right off.

Fuckin retard.
>>
>>54154542
>Yeah everyone knows that "regular" slugs won't kill an animal routinely stopped with 9mm. If it don't gotta bear on th' box, it'll bounce right off.
This, but unironically.
>>
>>54154542
"regular" slugs
can you show me a "regular" slug?
is it made by the "regular" corporation?
get the fuck out of here zoomer.
you know nothing faggot.
>>
>>54148222
>Slugs for shotguns are better, but buckshot within 5 yards will work. Adequate penetration to the CNS is the only thing that will immediately stop the threat/bear. Buckshot is just .33 cal soft lead bbs, and they lose energy quickly due to lack of mass and composition/shape.
Pistols have a success rate against grizzly of over 95%
>>
>>54154567
they define success as scaring it off. I define success as dropping the bear. If the bear is capable of running away, it has not dropped.
>>
>>54152549
Yeah you definitely need a round capable of dropping an elephant to have any chance of killing a bear, but you don't want to go over mach two, because that's sorcery and it's scary.
>>
>>54154558
>Brenneke is the ONLY company that makes a useful dangerous game slug!
Actual faggotry.
>>
>>54154593
World record Kodiak was once taken with a 22lr.
>>
>>54154619
list them.

>>54154598
2400 fps is perfect.
>>
>>54154593
Successful defense is *literally* just the prevention of a successful attack.
>>
>>54154642
>2400 fps is perfect
Yeah if you punched a full sized rifle round through a bear's chest at mach three it'd probably do nothing but make him angry.
>>
>>54154642
>list them
Every single solid metal slug on the market is sufficient for bear when fired with a reasonable charge.
>>
File: cc4.jpg (84 KB, 680x649)
84 KB
84 KB JPG
>>54154660
if extra speed is unnecessary and just makes the round want to break apart, why use it? I just want to shatter shoulders and make good solid holes.

>>54154643
why not say blanks are effective then, if all you're going for is a psychological effect? you know what I think? picrel.
>>
>>54146888
You’re carrying around rifles when all you need is a pistol for the job.
>>
>>54154706
>every single metal slug
>can't list just one
just a single item currently in stock.
>>
>>54147344
Regular old plinking rounds will drop them
Bears are not magical tanks
>>
>>54154730
OP here:
there is one other dangerous game slug I've seen, don't know how effective it is, but it is usually found unloaded. not to be a debbie downer, but I'm not loading my own ammo.
>>
>>54154714
>why not say blanks are effective then
Do Blanks have a 97% success rate ?
>>
>>54154714
Blanks are.
One of the most common deterrents after pepper spray.
>>
File: large_126_26b-250-cb.jpg (22 KB, 250x375)
22 KB
22 KB JPG
>>54154925
apparently, according to this guy
>>54154945

I think we should all agree on the 460sw, because it has about the best sectional density you can get from a handgun. 360 grains of hardcast hell at 1900 fps. Not bad at all for a pistol. Maybe up to 2300 fps for some long barreled nonsense. Now that's rifle territory.
>>
>>54154989
>apparently, according to this guy
What?
>>
>>54154997
well, maybe not the 97 percent part, but, are blanks highly effective?
the next post is you saying how effective they are.
it's just funny to me.
>>
>>54154714
Do you think Blanks and 9mm have the same success rate? Do you think they have the same chance of killing a bear?

9mm copper solids will punch a hole through a bear's head, or his chest, or anything they happen to hit. Bones are not bulletproof.

I defy you to show me any test suggesting that any bone in a Bear's body wouldn't shatter when hit with a 9mm copper solid.
>>
>>54155036
That's someone else. I've never suggested using blanks, I just challenged the comparison to pistol rounds and said that a success rate is a success rate.
>>
>>54155050
copper solids might be a game changer. bronze might be even niftier, but the brady bill banned those. sorry. even a real high antimony hardcast might be nifty.

I nominate you to test your idea. you have my full permission.
>>
>>54155161
>Make bullets out of aluminum bronze
>Just looks like brass but way, way harder and stronger.

Might be fun.
>>
>>54155247
tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, and depleted uranium are banned. aluminum copper may or may not be legal. I'd be very interested to see in how it performs though.
>>
>>54155247
>>54155313
ATF apparently gets really butt hurt about this stuff in small to intermediate calibers; they won't let you make brass ammo in .223 for example. Hardcast lead and solid copper are still legal however.
>>
>>54155313
Aluminum should make a fantastic bullet core material, it's criminally under used because "huh huh weak and light" when it's high strength and massive theoretical speed at given pressure could make it as good as steel for AP, if not better, and we don't have any idea how hard you can push it before it starts to shatter in soft tissue.
>>
>>54148222 (me)
>>54148799
>>54154567
I am not bashing handguns for bear defense. They are wildly successful and much more convenient to always carry and have ready. I was saying there is a book mainly about handguns for bear defense. The focus is on shot placement and adequate penetration, which 9mm can do for crying out loud. Extra mass on the bullet will aid when certain shot angles would deflect or slow lighter bullets. Any handgun ammo should be hard cast or solids, and flat nose.

That said, I'm all for handguns for bear defense. Rifles and shotguns are superior for a variety of reasons, but all are capable of doing the job. Like I said, there is already a book on it and people like Steve Nelson have said their piece on the topic so I don't feel the need to go over all the reasons why handguns are fine, and bigger isn't always better, etc.
>>
>>54147247
There used to be a time when the Republicans were where the Democrats are now in terms of cultural and political dominance yet being total faggots about it and choosing the worse routes possible.
>>
https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_list&c=177
>>
For all the theoretical tough guys who don't shoot, claiming huge single or double action revolvers are better than a 44 mag DA revolver or a 10mm semi auto here's a video from a jow blow showing what you will likely encounter. https://youtu.be/wW4UPeZkGyM

Essentially, shot placement is the name of the game and if you can shoot a hand cannon accurately go ahead and gamble on a perfect first shot. In some scenarios you might have time and distance and in other you might not. Either way, practice with what you use and know your limits.
>>
>>54155805
I'm increasingly of the opinion the handgun is what you use at arm's length when the bear has taken away your shotgun, if you still have arms.

>>54155547
A handgun is much much better than not having a gun at all. I'd still rather a shotgun or rifle. If I know I'm in grizzly country, why not bring one? Idk, saw this roadsign outside of missoula: you're in grizzly country, watch out! My thoughts: why not be prepared?
>>
>>54155567
Eh we've been fucked since the 60s, our enemies were just making good TV so we all ignored that they were taking everything over and happily gave them money to fund our own hell with.
>>
Eek is thread is in danger of dying. Let's play a game. Which ww2 or cold war era battle rifle would you cannibalize to create a big 5 safari rifle? Which rifle, and which round?
>>
>>54156354
You are correct that rifles and shotguns are more capable tools for bear defense. That said, a handgun will stay on your person when you go to the bathroom, walk away from camp, hike long distances, etc. If you wanna carry a rifle/shotgun power to you, but most people won't, whereas a handgun is convenient to always have at the ready. Even if your shotgun is in camp, getting to it and having rounds on target in less than 3-5 seconds at all times is unlikely. I live in, hike, hunt, and frequent grizzly country. I know people who've died and others who've survived in the local area. I learn lessons from the successes and mistakes made before me.
>>
>>54158696
BAR in .416 Rigby.
>>
>>54152549
With older cartridges like 45-70 you are spot on. A 180gr copper hunting bullet from a .300 win mag at 2960fps will put a grizzly's dick in the dirt with good shot placement. Even hitting a shoulder or non CNS spot can have devastating damage to muscle fibers and bone structure. Been done before, and copper will not lose mass due to fragmentation like traditional soft point lead hunting rounds will with such velocity.
>>
>>54154567
When I said slugs for shotguns are better, I meant compared to other shotgun ammo types like buckshot etc. Not "better" than pistols, although I would argue most people can shoot a shotgun more accurately under stress than a handgun. I agree that handguns are fully capable tools for large mammal defense like grizz and moose
>>
File: 1637431541469.jpg (144 KB, 1440x816)
144 KB
144 KB JPG
A sturdy stock is an essential component of any anti-bear firearm.
>>
>>54147344
>250gr lfn loaded with a casefull of pyrodex P and zooms along at 1100fps
You can push a bit more performance out of the BP loads. 40gr of 3F Swiss under a 255gr FNRP gets me 1250 out of a 4 3/4 barrel.
>>
>>54146888
Use to love that guy but saw what he said how the riots were peaceful but the capital was fucked up.

Wish the george floyd like protest happen around his neighborhood.
>>
>>54146888
Even just a 9mm or 5.56 AR is more than enough for black bears.
Grizzlies you may prefer a little more punch, but they have been killed by .22 long, so idk.
>>
>>54146910
None of the Breneke shells are water proofed, FYI.
>>
>>54146910
Those brewery slugs suck, because any amount of water and they're paper weights.
Cast haddcast double pumpkin balls nigga, each one's nearly 1oz
>>
>>54147234
You can't even watch all the old episodes of mad TV.
>>
>>54152435
Nigger, just a few years ago a man killed a Grizzly bear that attacked him with a microcompact 9mm.
Bella twin killed the world record Grizzly with .22long, soft lead round nose which is lighter and slower than .22LR
>>
>>54154125
180gr 357 is somewhat easy to find, 200gr factory loads aren't.
>>
>>54154542
To be fair, a standard foster slug is soft lead and has shit sectional density, but would still probably do fine on bears.
>>
>>54159087
Well killing one when you have the drop on it like belladonna twin is one thing. Killing one that has the drop on you before it kills or seriously wounds you is entirely another. In beladonna twins case, she was picking berries with her brother or something, and they heard the bear coming so they hid. When it came close to them she decided it would kill them when it noticed them so she shot it behind the ear. When it dropped she emptied her rifle into it's skull at point blank range. If a grizz is charging you that's a different story and you want a cartridge that penetrates deep to destroy the CNS primarily. If you can disable weight bearing bone then that will afford you more time to hit the CNS with followup shots or flee. Remember that grizzlies have a phlegmatic nervous system. You can destroy their heart and they can have 15-20 seconds to kill you before they realize they are dead.
>>
>>54159126
they self censored old episodes of MST3000 because of the jokes. For a while you could still stream them as TV-MA or NC17, but then they started scrubbing them out of existence. All because they fat shamed or said something is retarded. Now they remake them with nu-humor.
>>
>>54154789
The only issue with "standard" slugs is that theybare soft lead and not hardcast.
Brenneke being heavier and hot loaded doesn't have anything to do with it, just cast your own 1oz with hardcast lead and you're GTG.
>>
>>54159177
Bella twin* sorry I'm a retard with names but I always forget a face
>>
>>54155050
>9mm copper solids will punch a hole through a bear's head, or his chest, or anything they happen to hit. Bones are not bulletproof.
Soflt lead .22 will also.
>>
>>54159195
Straight on yes, but not reliably when you deal with real world angles and account for the hair, hyde, and flesh.
>>
>>54159241
No, .22lr will pinch through a living grizzlies skull no problem.
The problem is if you miss the braincase, .22 doesn't get very deep into a bears torso from the front angle.
>>
>>54159126
Jesus Christ it's going to be impossible to convince people what the world was like when I was born.
>>
File: bearsfearmewomenwantme.jpg (102 KB, 880x660)
102 KB
102 KB JPG
OP is big gay
>>
>>54146888
>>54161502
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qUUSvlmK474

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2SDelAH3LdM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XfJNFnxuc68
>>
>>54161502
the bear is incapable of fear, only animalistic rage. nice try.

>>54161585
>ball bearings
>marbles
no

>>54159183
the whole point is I don't want to cast my own, or load my own. also, fosters are more hollow toward the base, but I agree the main strength is in the bullet metal mix and the fact that it is hot loaded.

>>54159177
this is why I look for things that can disable shoulders

>>54159164
I have read it will not

>>54159156
noted

>>54159120
>>54159109
>doesn't work when wet

This is a real bite in the shorts. It rains. There are rivers. Sometimes I trip. This is really not good. Can they be made waterproof?

>>54158966
this idea of super hard copper being used might have merit, as I've mentioned earlier. I carry copper in my 32. it's a game changer.

>>54158939
It seems a back up is necessary. I know I don't like to keep my guns in the range of toilet spray.

>>54158947
have you ever seen a mag conversion for one? it seems the conversion are done on pre mk II models, and the dbm version is a mk iii with an alloy receiver. all the conversions had a steel receiver. is this necessary?

captcha owoah
>>
>>54161703
>no
That ball bearing will beat the fuck out of any lead slug.
>>
>>54161727
won't it also beat the fuck out of my barrel?
>>
>>54161753
Did you watch the video
>>
>>54161768
yes. I saw him shoot a phonebook a few times. I didn't get to look down the bore of his shotgun
>>
>>54161768
>>54161783
also, I've seen some great shit from taofledermaus. I'd love to have access to that polymer/tungsten composite slug. that shit was awesome. the truth is though, I'm looking for off the shell slugs that I can use, that won't destroy my barrel. I won't even use relatively mild steel shot, much less a damned hardened steel ball bearing. even for regular steel shot, you need a special wad to prevent damage. ball bearings just scream trouble to me.
>>
>>54147344
Hard Cast bullets of sufficient hardness pretty much zip through anything at low to mid speeds.
At higher speeds the bullet experience more resistance from the target animal's body, thereby using more energy initially, and will experience shallower penetration.
Still very likely to go through at any speed.
>>
>>54147344
Also, use a bullet with a bigger meplat, so you have a larger wound channel.
>>
>>54161783
>>54161848
He puts it in a shot cup, which prevents contact with the barrel when he doesn't just use a smoothbore. There's no rifling to damage in a smoothbore.

He's fired them a hundred times and there's never been a problem.
>>
i'm not afraid of bears i'm afraid of walking in the woods and hearing a
>CLUNK
>>
>>54159126
>>54161443
>>54159182
save what you can, friends
bumping because apparently this talk on bullets is being asked again
>>
File: b91.gif (1.11 MB, 400x400)
1.11 MB
1.11 MB GIF
>>54146888
Big Horn Armory .500SW lever gat.
Also, chkd
>>
>>54162396
is that a trap closing on your foot?
>>
>>54166320
>not the superior Model 90 in 460S&W
Would love to have one, but a $3000+ gun isn't in the cards right now.
>>
>>54167891
I def feel that. Being a poorfag sucks. What about .350 Legend in an AR? I know it should work on black bears, but not sure about brown.
>>
>>54168186
It would do fine in both.
300 blk would be fine for both, if you're super worried about brown, go with 450 bushmaster/458 socom
>>
>>54168186
Is the plan defense or hunting?
If a 350 Legend can feed hard cast wad cutters then I'd use those.
>>
>>54168186
>>54168217
>knowingly taking a rifle without using 300+ grain rounds
why?
>>
>>54147218
I think in 2008 Stewart and all of his fake newsmen and Bush and all of his neocons should all just have been raptured up together into a pocket dimension where they could replay their drama endlessly and appear to us as a new constellation in the sky. Then the rest of us could just turn the page on that whole era.

>>54154499
Norm didn't.
>>
>>54146888
Repost on the value of penetration:

The bear had a thick layer of fat, which acted as an armor of a sort. Two of the +P .45 hollow-point bullets were recovered under the hide, in the fat. Several hits were in the top and side of the neck going down toward the shoulders. Tyler believes the .45 bullets had not penetrated into the chest cavity

https://www.ammoland.com/2022/01/wyoming-bear-attack-on-elk-hunters-september-2021/#axzz7XB2UO7YP
>>
>>54169097
Hard cast is the way to go.
>>
>>54169097
> .45 +p can penetrate the fat of a bear
Bull shit.
>>
>>54169690
That was the (hollow) point - it went under the skin and got lodged in the fat. .45 guy was only valued as a distraction.
>>
>>54169690
>>54170014
how do you think a hardcast round would have performed? I imagine better, but the idea of using a 45 with its terrible sectional density does not inspire confidence. I keep regular old fmjs in mine. Not anticipating using it on bear.
>>
>>54170287
Undoubtedly better.
Sectional density is a number on paper. Real world results are what matters and you wouldn't catch that hard cast bullet in 32 inches of gellatin.
The numbers don't tell you Brinell hardness, whether the bullet was designed to expand or not. Construction, construction, construction.
>>
>>54169690
More bears have reliably died to 9mm than anything
>>
>>54170754
No.
>>
File: Threatdown Projection.jpg (259 KB, 780x837)
259 KB
259 KB JPG
>>54146888
>>
>>54170855
At least we don't have drop bears.
>>
File: x0vjs.jpg (8 KB, 205x246)
8 KB
8 KB JPG
>NOOOOOO YOU CANT POST PROOF THAT HANDGUNS ARE 97% EFFECTIVE AND 22LONG CAN EVEN TAKE DOWN A BEAR I HAVE TO AUTISTICALLY SPECULATE ABOUT EXOTIC ROUNDS AND SPREAD FUDD LORE!!!!
>>
>>54173310
>noisemakers and using a 22
gtfo out of this thread degenerate
you're bear food.
>>
>>54173495
recent events have renewed the importance of this thread. bearscension must be achieved
>>
>>54170014
>>54170287
It must have been a manufacturing error or some shit, the worst 45ACP in the world is still going to get more than a couple of inches of penetration, that's absurd.
>>
>>54146900
>Chinese saiga clone
Lmfao enjoy getting mauled when it jams
>>
>>54174479
norinco makes excellent aks. what are you smoking? I'd trust a norinco over a saiga. I said it. I'm a norinco fanboy. The damned things just work.
>>
>>54174444
and this is the realization that women in the west and outside of la are way easier. there. the whole reason for these series of threads is coomerism.
>>
>>54146900
even as a kalashnikov fanboy I can't sanction this shit. enjoy never getting through a full mag.
the only kalash shotgun worth a shit is the molot.
>>
File: big woke bitch.jpg (131 KB, 1242x1757)
131 KB
131 KB JPG
>>54147391
it's on some apple platform, so you know it's already gonna be fucked. every time he opens his mouth the only thing you can hear is honking. pic rel
>>
>>54147488
>godless killing machines.
that's it. that's the solution. we must become the bears.
>>
>>54148222
AKM with the third hole and some buffalo bore pissin' hawt boomer bullshit round that may or may not explode if you look at it wrong.
>>
>>54154787
they're not magical, you're right. fur, flesh, sinew, and bone can stop a round before it ever gets to anything that'll cause a mechanical stop, however.
>>
>>54146888
Black bears aren't a menace you towny cidiot. Sure they can snack on a person at whim. They leave without much provocation usually unless you shoot them then they'll try to finish you off if you don't stop them after you shot them. Just try to scare them off first they'll kinda take scorn a lot better than bullets. Hurting their feelings works a lot better than trying to hurt them physically because they take that a lot more personally.
>>
>>54173310
>I know, I'll just use my Olympian target shooting skills with this single shot .22 short derringer to shoot the bear directly in the eyeball while he's charging me from 30 feet away
>>
>>54174474
Not necessarily.
More likely what happened is the bullet the mfg used in the ammo was made to expand correctly within a certain velocity range. The +P loading probably exceeded that range resulting in over expansion and deformation causing shallow penetration.
Use hard cast with a wide meplat.
>>
>>54176115
kek
>>
>>54147115
boy if you butcher a m76 i will skin you alive
>>
File: download (3).jpg (7 KB, 277x182)
7 KB
7 KB JPG
>>54179545
I'd get a new one made from that ohio company. it'd need a new barrel anyway.

you okay man? I also wouldn't convert a garand unless it was a post ww2 model, and any svt I modified would need to be in rough shape. relax.

why all these feels though for an AK? if you want an m76, just buy one. it's not like it's super rare like a dragunov.

>imagines a dragunov in a 416 ruger
interdesting
>>
>>54179696
these threads need a list of potential smiths. McCann is effectively no more. Fulton was mentioned. LBR only does m14s to my knowledge. I wonder if midwest ordnance still does any gunsmithing? Just be funny about magazine conversions. That gets them all riled up.
Fulton is currently in the lead.
>>
>>54180011
>>54179696
further looking into this, what makes a good garand? I've heard of leaded receivers, and how the korean era receivers are the strongest. I've also seen some decent mid 40s models refurbished by the cmp.

It is my opinion, instead of butchering pristine ww2 model garands, only refurbished and korean era garands should be considered for conversion. I still want to keep the upper handguards, original safeties, and bayonet lugs. Perhaps even, when a new gas block is needed, due to the increase in barrel diameter, there could be a new bayonet lug for a new style of bayonet? are bayonet a good idea or bad idea for a bear rifle?

Obviously, a plug type bayonet is useless, but these massive flanges on the guard though. Should keep a critter from advancing on you despite being speared.
>>
>>54175862
Even 9mm will shatter a bear's bones or punch through his body if you use solid ammunition.
>>
>>54181832
but will it really?
>>
>>54184455
... Yes?
>>
>>54185806
Oh. Okay.
>>
If you're doing something outside where you're far enough into the woods to be concerned about being attacked by a grizzly, you aren't going to hike a fucking rifle or shotgun with you up into the mountains. This has been a solved problem for forever. Carry a Glock 20 or a Glock 40 with any full power non hollow point load. Stop trying to be hipsters.
>>
>>54186333
>hipsters
you're the hipster
you remind me of one of those appalachia trail people
>lol wut do you need a gun for
there's a handful of areas grizzlies go in this country. if I have to (let's face it, montana is fucking awesome, there is no have to, I want to -how many states allow you to carry while drunk, in a bar, or ride around with a loaded rifle... at 80 mph no less) be there, I'm taking a longarm. it's a stubbornness you wouldn't understand.
also, people have been hiking in the mountains with a rifle for hundreds of years. you're just a fag. no really. do you wear bright clothes when you hike? I bet you do. have fun with the gentry.

>>54186255
that wasn't me.

I watched a few videos. It seems 9mm loaded with a good hardcast gives you a fighting chance. the story I saw took 5 shots to drop the bear.

The other video we watched suggests you'll not have much time(the bear sled video). Will you have enough time to fire 5 shots? Will each good hit slow it down? Idk. But better a 9mm with hardcast than not.
>>
>>54186333
>you aren't going to hike a fucking rifle or shotgun with you up into the mountains.
What? Why not? That's basically the only time I would be carrying a long arm.
>>
>>54186770
>the story I saw took 5 shots to drop the bear.
>The other video we watched suggests you'll not have much time(the bear sled video). Will you have enough time to fire 5 shots?
There are individual cases of people fighting through four shots of basically everything
>>
>>54186333
Not only that, but Grizzlies barely exist in the lower 48, they have a very small range.
>>
>>54187408
you must understand, eastern washington, northrn idaho, and western montana, has the best cake around.

>>54187341
clearly more videos are needed. I know what I'm doing this afternoon.

>>54187322
I know, what, would I carry one with me around town?
>>
>>54146888
Semi auto .308

Inb4 coping bitch shouldered borelets



Delete Post: [File Only] Style:
[Disable Mobile View / Use Desktop Site]

[Enable Mobile View / Use Mobile Site]

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective parties. Images uploaded are the responsibility of the Poster. Comments are owned by the Poster.