I have a handgun and a shotgun with intentions to acquire a rifle for SHTF scenarios (George Floyd suburb here). Im not extremely knowledgeable on rifles but from what Ive been reading, pricing of the round aside Im thinking an SBR in 300 Blackout is the way to go for urban and suburban warfare. The ability to penetrate objects like vehicles, trash can barricades and shitty pantifa makeshift strongholds is far more valuable than the extra range you get from 556. You will not be shooting 500 yards in an urban battle....at least I wont be. I get the idea that 556 is so prevalent that after a hypothetical SHTF war you could scoop up plenty of your enemie’s unused rounds. But Im more concerned about winning the SHTF battle than what comes after it. I think 300 AAC gives an edge towards winning the city battle. I also think an SBR/AR pistol which saves on space and weight is better suited for sub/urban SHTF. And it seems like 300 AAC is built for SBRs. Lastly dear anons of /k/, is there a clear winner between the 300 Blackout SBRs of Windham Weaponry, CMMG, and Springfield Armory? All three are in the same price range and seem quality.
>>47362354differences in barrier penetration probably won't be big enough to matter, most rifle rounds will do finenot that you can buy any ammo now anyway
>>47362354300 blackout doesn't make sense without a suppressor. It's designed for the ability to use subsonic rounds in a short-barreled suppressed gun with an AR magwell for indoor raids, but switch in emergency to supers if you take contact coming off the objective. For a generic civilian suburbanite who doesn't have NFA items, 556 is simply better.
300 AAC is a joke. With lighter bullets it's just a whimpy 30-30 but with expensive ammo you can't find anywhere. In subsonic loadings it's a useless hole puncher like a .32ACP. If you want a subsonic rifle for suppressor use get something like a .44MAG like the Ruger 77/44 and get it threaded and use it with heavy WFN bullets. That's the only way you're going to cram respectable killing power and penetration into less than 1000 fps. Otherwise just stick to 5.56 and stop wasting your time with minutia.
>>47362413I did see its ideal for a suppressor.
>>47362425Isnt 300 AAC power on par with 556 in short range? Typically the disparity comes in at longer ranges.
>>47362499A pointy .30 caliber bullet going 1000 fps is going to be like a fucking icepick wound.
>>47362354300 blackout is snake oil and you shit stains suck it right from the tap.
>>47362602T. listens to memes
>subsonic rifle roundMight as well carry a PCC or just a glock 22
Nothing but complete retards in this thread.You can either shoot 300blk supers and have way more energy than 556, or you can shoot solid copper expanding subs that easily and consistently take down medium sized game without raping your ears.You can shoot both in a compact SBR that is easy to maneuver in buildings or vehicles. When suppressed, particularly with a silent captured spring, you’ve got a movie quiet gun that is ideal for urban combat.The only reason to choose 556 is because of armored targets or cost/availability.
>>47362602found the faggot without a suppressed SBR
>>47363968You are correct. I do not enjoy long afternoons keyholing.
>>47362354The only advantage is if you’re running it suppressed
>not taking the final black pill and using 7.62x39 "commie" rounds to kill commies
>>47362354Theres no point in using .300blk without a suppressor. Just get an AK or something chambered in 7.62x39, its cheaper and more common, and I heard somewhere that the velocity is less effected by shorter barrel lengths.
>>47362425>hole puncherIsn't the entire point of firearms to punch holes in people?
>>47363929>The only reason to choose 556 is because of armored targets or cost/availability.If armor isn't a factor, a PCC could do anything you just described 10X better than anything in 300BLK.
>>47362354Boolit Penetration isnt going to be a big enough difference. Antifa literally use trash can lids as shields and hit people with skateboards. You’ll be fine.
>>47364486Small-caliber rifles rely on extreme impact velocity and rapid expansion/fragmentation/tumbling to create shockwaves that stretch tissues beyond their elasticity limit and shred them. This is how little .30 bullets leave baseball-sized exit wounds in deer. Dropping the velocity down to friggin handgun velocities with the same bullet is a grievous mistake. You may as well use arrows with field points. "Energy" becomes completely irrelevant when there is no mechanism for that energy to do anything. A sharpened piece of rebar at 1000 fps would have the energy of an elephant gun but all it would do is poke a tiny hole in a guy and then he will kill you and recover in the hospital.
>>47362354Is .300 BLK a 7.62×39 tier icepick machine or does it frag?
>>47362354>>47362413100% correct. Zero reason to say more on 300blk. You can get urban 5.56 loads that minimize overpenetration & shit like Mk318 if you're worried about the Payday 2 gang building light cover fortifications the next house over.
>>47362354ak in 7.62x39
>>47364820Lehigh defense subsonic loads will expand and wreck shit
>>47362354it won't matter much at all. .300 BO makes sense for suppressor guys and reloaders. If you're not one of those guys, there's no sense in paying a premium. Either will do.Same with the "pistol" vs "rifle". For practical applications it won't matter much. If you really want a "not an SBR but really sorta an sbr" you can play that game but I expect those guys to take some heat coming up in the next 4 years. Relax, you're hitting the point of diminishing returns in your research.
>>47362354>You will not be shooting 500 yards in an urban battle....at least I wont beYou're not going to be shooting anything, tough guy.
>>47364924this, they're a buck or a buck twenty just for the projectile but their performance is very impressive. nasty, nasty bullets. imagine having this tangled up in your shoulder meat or the tendons in your leg
300 Body Odour always struck me as a perfect candidate for the old wooden nose trick. Wonder why nobody's bothered?
>>47370219Yeah, if the person shooting at me could actually hit me with it, they're inaccurate as shit, kek.
>>47362354What made you think 300blk is better for penetration?
>>47364924Can confirm. Have shot pest animals with them, the petals expand to about .75 inches. Don't listen to people calling subsonic 300 blackout an icepick. With the right rounds, they're very effective. Obviously less "knock down" power then supers, but they will drop whatever they hit, fairly quickly, if placed correctly.Supers inside 200 yards are devastating. Whether they're more or less effective than 5.56 fired from the same barrel length, I can't say. But they will do the job.
>>47362354>Lastly dear anons of /k/, is there a clear winner between the 300 Blackout SBRs of Windham Weaponry, CMMG, and Springfield Armory? All three are in the same price range and seem quality.Probably not, although I lean toward CMMG because reasons. The real issue you might run into is quality control. Whenever demand far outstrips supply, QC takes a hit. I'd build my own rifle if I were you. 8.5" or longer (I've had issues with 7.5" barrels when running unsupressed) Ballistic Advantage barrel and bolt (or Criterion if you have the money), full auto carrier, H2 or H3 buffer, adjustable gas block (I usually go with Superlative Arms), 7075-T6 forged upper and free float handguard. Good to go.
>>47371463Bullshit. They're plenty accurate for the distance they're effective at (inside 150 yards).
>>47371931110gr Barnes TAC-TX from 8.5" barrel at 30 yards.
>>47362413>nearly same ballistics as 7.62x39 and .30-30>but no, 300blk magically needs a supressor and those dontGet fuuuuuucked
>>47362425>same ballistics as 7.62x39>retains energy better than. 30-30>gambit iv bullet ranges in the most popular rifle bullet size>in an AR platform>but no suggests a shitty meme gun in .44 mag, whichbis 3x the price, garbage SD, and retains energy for shit, cant even go through soft armorThe absolute state of fudds on /k/
>>47362602Is 7.62x39 snake oil?>>47362804>only listens to memes
>>47362804>300 blk is only sub sonicSo those 150grainers going over 2000fps are what?
>>47364162Except >the cheapest ARs are half the price of the cheapest AKs. And run better>300 blk is easier to find better bullets for infinitely easier to reload, more weight options>7.62x39s velocity is fucked by short barrels>only cheap AK ammo is dogshit
>>47372510Nice shot man. Those Barnes bullets are great. I've used em on porcupines, but never deer. Glad to see they do the trick.
>>47362425>a whimpy 30-30 isnt enough to put someone down.
>>47364820Fragmentation doesnt matter, read up on wounding factors retard.>>47364899>pay 3x the price for an inferior gun, so you can save $0.02cpr when you buy bimetal steelcase garbage
>>47372510NO! YOU CANT PPST POCS USING 300 MEMEOUTBUY AN AK THATS GARBAGE INSTEAD!
You'd be better off with a 20" AR or .308 BR, and a Suppressed .22. If you want one cartridge to kinda do everything well I guess .300 BO is OK.
>>47372554I decided to stop hunting with my 336, because a 16" AR in 300blk gets similar performance (and superior performance past 100yds or so) and is 2" shorter than the 336, lighter, semi auto and detachable box.The anti 300blk shills are slavboos sad that 300blk is killing the AK market even faster.Hence why most of them say to get an AK
>>47372605Except for the fact that .300 BO hasn't existed for purchase in a Year for any price, and 7.62x39 is still under .50 CPR.
I have a 300 blk with 18" barrel, no supressor or plans to buy one.Seethe faggots, seethe
>>47372634>garbage 7.62x39 that would be retarded to hunt wi tr h and illegal to hunt with I'm my stateI'm fine, and dont dictate all my purchase decisions on a once every 4 years at most phenomenon.
>>47372745You really are a kid aren't you? I hate to tell you that panics are very common, and .300 BO is usually one of the first things to go and get very expensive. This particular panic is as bad as its ever been since 1994 (at least) in terms of severity and duration, but to pretend this is an uncommon occurrence speaks to your lack of experience.Also 8m3 is as good as most if not all .300 BO, but both are caliberettes and you should just skip all that shit and get a .308/7.62NATO.
>>47372558>>pay 3x the price for an inferior gun, so you can save $0.02cpr when you buy bimetal steelcase garbage7.62x39 is like half price. the ammo savings alone will pay for the AK rife in just 2-3000 rounds
>>473727908m3 is garbage, nice cope though.
>>47372803Lol, after 3000 rds if that bimetal junk you'll need a new barrel, which means a new AK.
Why do people forget/think that 300 can only run suppressed? Shoot out of a 16in ar pistol and you get comparable velocities and punch as 7.62... if you’re shooting super sonic
>>47372857As 7.62x39, not x51 or x63.>>47372840 I'm not coping, I shoot 7.62 real fuckin' NATO and 5.56, not memeout or 7.62 Commie.
>>47372857>>47372870As for why, thats what it was designed to do. It was designed to replace 9mm SMGs for suppressed work, then be equivalent to 7.62x39 with just a mag change to Supersonic.I mean its OK, but nothing earth shattering.
>>47362354If you're new to shooting, get an AR-15.It's the stock standard rifle, it gives you serious power from day one, you're going to find it easier learning when you have the same gun as everyone else at the range.Don't get something weird or expensive.When you're comfortable with an AR-15 you will have a decent idea about what you prefer and can just trade it in.>penetrationA 5.56 will penetrate most things (apart from cement walls and car engine blocks) and hitting your target is more important.It's actually really important NOT to penetrate things willy-nilly because your 300BLK will pass through the person you shoot, the house behind them, a garage door and kill the neighbors dog or something>Ammo5.56 is what you want.The main advantage is simply because it's cheap- and that means more practice.>SBR/AR pistolThese exist for legal reasons, you really want a regular stock and a regular barrelStart simple, practice a lot, worry about all the other stuff only when you can actually hit a target at 100 yards and use your weapon effectively
>>4737273518" barrel seems like overkill for that round, to be honest. But you do you man.
300blk is far from a meme and offers distinct advantages and novel capabilities that other calibers do not. You can run an AR15 with all of the ergonomic benefits of platform, while running a much shorter barrel (6-9" or so depending on priorities). Supers absolutely perform well ballistically inside of 250m or so, and subs do just fine within 100m.You can swap from subs to supers with just the change of a magazine, and the ONLY part that is different from a standard AR15 is the barrel. >>47363929+1>>47364079>>47364162Not true at all. Even unsuppressed a 300blk firing supers can be made into a smaller package (6-9" barrel) than a 5.56 AR and get superior if not the same terminal ballistics. 300blk supers perform superior to 7.62x39" when it comes to short barrels. >less affected by shorter barrel lengthsFalse. 300blk out of a 9" barrel is superior to 7.62x39" out of a 9" barrel. Also AK ergos and controls suck for actually running a gun. >>47371931From the same barrel lengths for barrel lengths below 11" or so, 300blk supers BTFO 5.56
>>47372857300BO achieves complete burn in 9 inches, friend. It's literally the perfect AR pistol round, suppressed or not.
>>47373834LOL BARFCOM loves 300 Meme.
>>47373798This.>I want a short barreled AR because reasonsOk, do you want to use 5.56 at half its potential or 300Blk at full potential?
>>47373783Your scope is on backwards fren
>>47362354SBR is expensive and so is 300blk.Probably better off with an ar10 in .308 or a basic .556.
>>47364486Clint from thunder ranch said it best>pistols will put holes in people, rifles will shoot holes through people, but a shotgun, within its range, will plaster a guys guts to the wall.
>>47364820I shot a buck with 300 blackout and it put it down hard. Did so much damage the front left shoulder was completely fucked. Had to give it to my dog it was so bloodshot
>>47372947this. Dont be a tacticool hipster
>>47373783Out of containment. Good info though. How would it compare to, say .45acp? Just from a performance standard, given that there’s already a lot going for 300BLK from the fact that it’s ar ergos. Torn between the two.
>>47377899300blk supers shit all over 45 ACP300blk subs are perhaps a bit worse than 45 ACP in terms of terminal ballistics, but not by much, especially with good quality expanding subs, and the superior ergos and reduced cost of a 300blk AR vs some 45 ACP PCC plus the ability to rock 300blk supers IMO makes it so that the 300blk pulls ahead strongly of any 45 ACP option.
>>47378095That’s about in-line with what I was thinking. .45 seems like a nice dedicated suppressor build up until you have to deal with the pcc building bit of it
Both have pros and cons, for me it boils down to it being way easier to get a hold of 5.56 in a SHTF scenario.
>>47372498>plenty accurate>under 150 ydkek
>>47362525Can confirm. Took 4 hits of 300 BLK to stop this shit sack.
>>47364718A 125gr bullet does 2000+ from .300 blackout. A 124gr 9mm is lucky to break 1500. You are flat out wrong.
>>473801034 hits? lol. Replace that with a single .308 hunting round and you'd blow it in half.
>>47362413>300 blackout doesn't make sense without a suppressor.Nonsense. The supers give you the same energy as 5.56, with roughly 4" shorter barrel.Even if you don't or can't get a muffler, .300 offers a benefit, though it comes at double the ammunition cost. And nothing's stopping you from keeping some subs, a solvent trap, and a drill around in case shit really hits the fan.
>>47381335Not the person you're respond to, but what is a sub? Just so I know not to buy one.
>>47362354if you want penetration get 308
>>47362354>I have a handgun and a shotgun with intentions to acquire a rifle for SHTF scenarios (George Floyd suburb here). Im not extremely knowledgeable on rifles but from what Ive been reading, pricing of the round aside Im thinking an SBR in 300 Blackout is the way to go for urban and suburban warfare.>The ability to penetrate objects like vehicles, trash can barricades and shitty pantifa makeshift strongholds is far more valuable than the extra range you get from 556. You will not be shooting 500 yards in an urban battle....at least I wont be.>I get the idea that 556 is so prevalent that after a hypothetical SHTF war you could scoop up plenty of your enemie’s unused rounds. But Im more concerned about winning the SHTF battle than what comes after it. I think 300 AAC gives an edge towards winning the city battle.>I also think an SBR/AR pistol which saves on space and weight is better suited for sub/urban SHTF. And it seems like 300 AAC is built for SBRs.>Lastly dear anons of /k/, is there a clear winner between the 300 Blackout SBRs of Windham Weaponry, CMMG, and Springfield Armory? All three are in the same price range and seem quality.Very well thought out OP. I don't disagree with your points. I'd consider going that route if I didn't have any firearms.
300BLK causes so much seething because of its superiority. Theres not a single person in this thread that can show a ballistics chart showing how 5.56 is better than .300BLK in a barrel under 12 inches.
>>47372521>costs 3x as much as x39.Just use x39 or 5.56. .300 is a meme round that only makes sense when suppressed.
>>47381443>has to qualify his statement with "under 12 inches" to win argument.
>>47378260>45 seems like a nice dedicated suppressor buildEh, most .45s are going to be blowback, which means more recoil. There is CMMG's radial delay, and I think you can get DI .45, but it's hardly common.
>>47381364not him but it's short for submarine gun, it means a rifle with the shoulder thing that goes up, because they have those tiny hallways in a submarine and a shorter gun is easier to handle
>>47381364Subsonic/supersonic. .300 comes in both, you can tell by looking at bullet weight. Heavier means slower.
If I don't care about suppressors then should I get 6.5 grendel instead?
>>473815986.5 Grendel is actually an improvement on 7.62x39, so yes.
>>473815986.5 grendel is superior to 300memeout in pretty much any situation 2bh
300 memeout is a worse version of 7.62x39. Buy a WBP or a Zastava AK, some kind of optic and mount (avoid dustcover mounts except for the Polish made ones that are sometimes packaged with WBPs), find a way to attach a light.This and a shotgun are the best urban environment weapons, although if I lived in the suburbs the lack of capacity would be concerning.
>>47381843If you're dead set on shooting 7.62x39, you can get an AR15 in it, and not have a shitty gun.
>>47381512That was the entire point of inventing 300BLK, you fucking retard
>>47381843AKs are garbage rods that aren't even worth the shitty round that they shoot
>>47380067>within the range of nearly all combat encounters>same as 7.62x39>somehow this is laughable
>>47381598Yes. If it was starting from scratch and didn’t have an ammo stockpile I’d go 6.5 for ARs. You should get a 5.56 first if you won’t already just because of ammo and parts compatibility
>>47381527That was pretty much the point. Up until you get into the actual details of putting together a .45, it seems like a good idea. Standard ar parts allow you to more fine tune the gun versus swapping out just the bolt/buffer weights.