ITT, we discuss alternative operating systems to Windows, Mac and Linux as well homebrew projects and operating system development.Check out our wiki: https://wiki.installgentoo.com/wiki//aosg/_Alternative_Operating_System_GeneralPrevious thread: >>91043406Some projects anons where interested in previous threads:Some anons discussed the pros and cons of UNIX and VAX/VMS.https://amigaos.net/
First for Solaris
>>91065915based and oraclepilledISOcels BTFO
>>91065915Sun's out.
>>91065939I get the funny joke but Solaris has always had bootable mediums physical or digital for their clients.
Ah fuck, I forgot the title again...
>>91066272It's okay anon, you can make it right in the next thread
wasn't Google in talks to buy Sun? or was it some other company?
I wish I had an hp9000
>>91066371Thank you, I am going to.
>>91065939crack-addict ISOlet cope lol
>>91066391Oracle bought sun in 2014 or 2010. I was doing a 3piece in the middle of nevada at the time. Couldn't believe the news. Couldn't believe no one cared. Couldn't believe the CO didn't know that some of the software to control the portals in and out of our facility were UNIX based.
>>91066102is that your actual sun anon? I'll post mine if you post yours. Has barebones software and only Solaris 8 might downgrade to 7 since it theoretically would be easier to use. I think the PSU on my SUn 5 is on the fritz.
>>91066689Ah I wish it was, they've always had a weird elusive quality to me ever since I saw one as a kid when the university we lived near had an open house. Hope you have fun tinkering with yours though, sucks about the psu.
>>91066675yeah, it was clear that Sun was sucked into a blackhole at that point.F
>>91065915Do you think Illumos will survive longer than Solaris?
>>91067921Oracle has soft EoL'ed Solaris. it's ogre
>>91067933So 2034 is definitely the end? Even though they ported it to x86?
>>91068136there's no dev team, only a security patch skeleton crew. they'll push out updates, but who's going to write kernel drivers for new hardware? ironically they could backport from illumos perhaps
>>91066837>>91067921>>91068136There is barely a Solaris 11. There is no Solaris 12. Tribblix..SunOS....IllumOS... someone might pick up their pieces. But as anon said; it is all ogre now.You know whom to blame.
From last thread:>>91058931>It's obvious that VMS has no merits over Unix.Right. Now please explain why.
>>91065889Anyone use Zephyr, FreeRTOS, or RTEMS? Any opinions on why you would choose one over the other?
>>91065889do any of you have a license key for QNX 6.5?
what's Drew's os called again? Helios is the microkernel
>>91065889Still haven't heard a technical reason why VMS is so much better than Unix.
>>91069887A saner file structure. Not that shit with /usr /usr/bin and so on.
>>91069387XKC2-KXSX-JYTM-0H4V-AMB3
>>91070925thanks man
I know this is the alternative os general but I was wondering if there was any article/book that compare how different kernels work? NT, in particular, sounds interesting since I'm mostly familiar with linux, and I'm curious about how they differ. Also, I'd guess the amiga didn't really have what we would call a kernel, right? >>91070042Wut? Am I mixing things up, or wasn't VMS's file structure completely horrible? Especially for network drives or mounting remote disks?
>>91071051AmigaOS had a microkernelhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exec_(Amiga)
>>91071051You want something on kernel architecture? As in microkernels, monolithic, exokernels, client-server kernels? Or just comparisons between Unix, Linux, Windows and various other OSes?
>>91068627Nobody in this thread has enough os theory background to understand the reasons VMS was fundamentally superior to contemporary unix
>>91073630Help us mere mortals understand, oh grand master Yogay
https://sizeof.cat/links/#osdevpreterhumangentoomen libraryIAl2googlen00b
>>91073793No. Read books about the two and compare. You guys either dropped out of college or went to one of the UC's if you expect to be spoonfed information this hard.
>>91073907>make an statement>asked to defend it>WTF NO U R 2 DUMBits a forum we come here for discussion, jackass.
>>91071051Picrel. Start reading the parts that interest you.
>>91070042That's just superficial, Unix can be adapted to a saner directory structure and keep its legendary kernel and userland.
really cool idea, reminds me somewhat of Infernohttp://phantomos.org/
>>91074975menuet and kali are boring but very cool on paper
>>91065889SerenityOS is where it is at. Windows UI + posix api. Best of the both worlds.
>>91075234>no iso
>>91075085>and keep its legendary kernel and userland.Legendary for sucking, you mean.
>>91075317In what way is VMS superior?
>>91075337Asynchronous I/O and better process creation. Commands are all consistent and make sense instead of each one having separate rules and options.
>>91075368better how?and name 3 commands for example
>>91075234Any UI can become Windows UI, it's just a freaking UI, stop acting like it's 99.99% of the OS. What type of scheduler does it use? What algorithm?How does it implement context switching?Does it have inter-process communication? What type? Is it async or sync?How are the tables for handling processes implemented? Dual, similar to UNIX (process table and user table)?How does it fork processes? Unix-like with t_fork() and fork() or Linux-like with clone()?I could ask 1000 questions and the answer would still be: but it has a Windows UI.So yeah.All hail Windows UI.
>>91075393Are there any applications for Kolibri? Like a browser, email client, office?Also what's better, Kolibri or Menuet? Which one has more features or is more actively developed?Are they used in production or is it just a hobby project?
>>91075411As a user-land programmer I give nearly zero fucks about that shit.It works. It looks good.That's enough.
>>91075521Yes but we're talking about operating systems here, not userspace programs. I think there is a Filezilla thread up.
>>91075368Unix has async IO: https://man7.org/linux/man-pages/man7/aio.7.htmlAnd fork()/exec() are the gold standard for process management.
>>91075521>It works.lmao
>>91075740You are a pseud if you're not baiting holy shit that's gotta be one of the dumbest posts I've read here and that's really saying something
>>91075516>browser, email client, office?Usable ones or toys?
>>91074975>dissapoint'dWhy? Both it and Zeal OS are in the FAQ.
>>91075453>Are there any applications for Kolibri? Like a browser, email client, office?Sure, check out yourself in your browser:https://copy.sh/v86/?profile=kolibrios
>>91075800I literally just want ONE technical advantage of VMS's kernel over Unix. Async IO is not one and neither is not having fork (because you can implement other process creation styles with fork, but the opposite is harder.)
>>91073907>>91073630>OpenVMS>License: Proprietaryinto the trash
>>91072189Comparisons between existing kernels would be awesome.
>>91078478Sad but true. Same for OS/2 and QNX. The EU needs to make a law forcing all companies to publish under AGPL.
>>91078478Feel free to restart FreeVMS.
The FAQ is rather large by now but we need a few more things. We are short on good (and free) documents, anyone got some recommendations?
>>91080636I was thinking about making a dedicated page for different types of kernels and consolidating the section for post archives into another dedicated page. The books section could use some entries as well.
Has anyone attempted making an IRIX clone?
>>91081185You mean the GUI part? That desktop is widely used in Linux distros.Otherwise I dont know what you mean.
>>91080636Computer Architecture: A Quantitative Approach, by John L. Hennessy and David A. PattersonComputer Systems: A Programmer's Perspective, 2nd ed., by Randal E. Bryant and David R. O'HallaronComputer Networks, 5th ed., by Andrew S. Tanenbaum and David J. WetherallComputer Networking: A Top-Down Approach, 6th ed., by James F. Kurose, Keith W. RossThe Open Book: A Practical Perspective on OSI, by Marshall T. RoseTCP/IP Illustrated, by Gary R. Wright, Kevin R. Fall and W. Richard StevensUSB: The Universal Serial Bus, by Benjamin David LuntModern Operating Systems, 3rd ed., by Andrew S. TanenbaumOperating System Concepts, by Avi Silberschatz, Peter Baer Galvin and Greg Gagne Operating systems: Internals and Design Principles, 7th ed., by William Stallings MMURTL V1.0, by Richard A. Burgess (A MUST HAVE)Project Oberon: The Design of an Operating System and Compiler, by Niklaus Wirth and Jürg Gutknecht The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System, by Marshall Kirk McKusick, George V. Neville-Neil and Robert N.M. Watson Windows Internals, 6th ed., by Mark Russinovich, David A. Solomon and Alex Ionescu C: A Reference Manual, 5th ed., by Samuel P. Harbison III and Guy L. Steele Jr. The C Programming Language, 2nd ed., by Brian W. Kernighan and Dennis M. Ritchie (THE GODS THEMSELVES)Learning the bash Shell, 3rd ed., by Cameron Newham and Bill Rosenblatt Managing Projects with GNU Make, 3rd ed., by Robert Mecklenburg Introduction to the Theory of Computation, by Michael Sipser The Language of Machines: An Introduction to Computability and Formal Languages, by Robert W Floyd and Richard Beigel Advanced Programming in the UNIX Environment, 3rd ed., by Stephen A. Rago and W. Richard Stevens UNIX Network Programming, by Andrew M. Rudoff, Bill Fenner, and W. Richard Stevens Graphics Programming Black Book, by Michael AbrashProgrammer's Guide to the EGA, VGA, and Super VGA Cards, by Richard F. FerraroThat's what I used, anyway.
>>91082372Some more bits:The OpenGL Programming Guide: The Official Guide to Learning OpenGL Version 3.0 and 3.1, 7th ed. by Dave ShreinerARM Assembly Language: Fundamentals and Techniques by William HohlMIPS RISC Architecture by Gerry Kane, 2nd ed.Assembly Language Step by Step: Programming with Linux by Jeff Duntemann
>>91082372And of course:The little book about OS development, by Erik Helin, Adam Renberg https://littleosbook.github.io
>>91082303I mean functionality-wise. Can you emulate IRIX at a decent speed now? I just want to play with the tech demos that have fascinated me for years.
>>91075316stop this meme they both have images
ding dong bing bong up
>>91082882where
https://wiki.osdev.org/Creating_an_Operating_System
Bump
>>91065889there are two BSDs currently trying to remake the mac OS experienceHelloSystemAnd RavynOS(which i think is also trying to implement cocoa support)
>>91087074I've tried helloSystem, but I didn't know about ravynOS, thanks for that. Can't wait to see how they both develop in the future.
>>91087515while hello system uses some existing code from projects like lxqt ravyn basically made everything from scratch.
>>91087515>ravynOShow unfortunate
>>91087770>boundary pusherkek
>>91080744We also need a section on micro kernels.
>>91088086nice digits
>>91087770i-is she an actual biological girl?
>>91088679I’ve seen actual women who look just like that, so I think so. Doesn’t trip my man detector.
>>91065915I've had the pleasure of dealing with Oracle systems for the last 6 years. Minuscule to some but holy fuck if I had to use an Oracle OS I would jump off a bridge.
>>91089265What's your opinion on Illumos?
>>91082372>Computer Architecture: A Quantitative Approach, by John L. Hennessy and David A. PattersonThis, and a third of that list do not seem related to operating systems, or do they?
>>91087579i thought ravyn was based on hello
>helloSystem 0.8 Released As macOS Inspired FreeBSD Desktop OShttps://www.phoronix.com/news/helloSystem-0.8-Released>Following the demise of PC-BSD/TrueOS, the most compelling BSD-based desktop operating system with a pleasant out-of-the-box user experience is helloSystem. The helloSystem OS has been aiming to be the macOS of the BSDs and for the past few years has been building a macOS-inspired desktop atop FreeBSD. Out today is helloSystem 0.8 as their newest version built atop FreeBSD 13.1.
Anyone here tried Fuchsia? After so much hoopla, things got rather quiet.
>>91092637It's made by Google so it's shelved before it even started.
>>91092637it's still being updated, last release was 2 weeks ago. for the life of me, I can't figure out what their goal for it is. anyway, they have build instructions on their sitehttps://fuchsia.dev/fuchsia-src/get-startedit runs on x86-64 so you can run it in a VM. they say it supports NUC, so any PC that's got all intel hardware (nic,chipset,wifi) should work too. I might give it a spin later
What's a good os if I just want to make and use chunky text based applications.
>>91093674MS-DOS
>>91093667Does it have RISC-V support? Google started talking about that ISA recently.
>>91094357x86-64 and arm only right now
>>91093667>it runs on x86-64 so you can run it in a VMgot a link to ISO?
>>91094478dahliaOS is a downstream of Fuschia and they have an iso. Fuschia devs themselves don't.
>>91092637Why did they make their own micro kernel rather than reusing an existing one?
>>91095427its google. they just do it, half ass it and kill it
>>91095427It's not that original. The design is ripped straight from Mach.
>>91094541thanks. ISOlet toy OSes are very common these days
Has anyone got any testimonies about what the early 2000's amiga team was doing? I've read stuff about it on Wouter's webpage and I wish it got released.>>91092637Apparently the team was gutted after the recent layoffs.This is a good thing though. Fuchsia's main party trick was that it's designed to load all userland applications from the network like you would a webpage.>>91095427Zircon is a modified version of LittleKernel.
>>91082372>not a single NT or VMS bookWhy are you intentionally limiting the scope of your knowledge?
>>91096384>Has anyone got any testimonies about what the early 2000's amiga team was doing?oh god, I remember reading all the rumors about how how the "new" amiga was going to be transmeta based with a state of the art glaze3d gpu. it's weird knowing that Acer owns all the Amiga IP now.
>>91096384I'm glad that Fuchsia is dead
>>91082372Here's some more brah:Computer Systems: A Programmer's Perspective 3e by BryantOperating Systems Three Easy Pieces by Arpaci-DusseauWindows Kernel Programming by Pavel YossifovichWindows 10 System Programming parts I and II by Pavel Yossifovich
>>91082372>That's what I used, anyway.Used, in what way? What did you build?
>>91097507This
>>91098273This raises expectations even further...
>>91098273Just open source it anonOr do you want it to end up like SkyOS?
>>91098394what happened to skyos
>>91098394Maybe, fren. Maybe.Doing OSdev on Macbook M1 is "fun", Parallels to the rescue.
>>91075546For me, an operating system defines the way you interact with the PC.UI/UX are the most important part because it directly interfaces with the person.
>>91099507Agreed. The operating system is an extension of the soul.
>>91077019>KolibriWhat about MenuetOS? Seems more advanced, with 64bit support even
>>91099914Both are listed in the FAQ:https://wiki.installgentoo.com/wiki//aosg/_Alternative_Operating_System_GeneralKolibri is a fork of MenuetOS. Are yo sure MenuetOS is more advanced?
>>91100075>Kolibri is a fork of MenuetOS. Are yo sure MenuetOS is more advanced?It got closed source>Menuet64 is released under License and Menuet32 under GPL. >license1) Free for personal and educational use.2) Contact menuetos.net for commercial use.3) Redistribution, reverse engineering, disassembly or decompilation prohibited without permission from the copyright holders.
>>91100075Actually I'm not sure, just saw that it's 64 bit and made by the original dev, while Kolibri is a Russian fork of an old 32 bit version of Menuet. But actually Kolibri seems to be a "community" project so maybe it is better
>>91100216it is just a continuation of the last glp version, >>91100154
>>91097038>Windows Internals, 6th ed., by Mark Russinovich, David A. Solomon and Alex Ionescu
>>91100321So what's the point of Menuet being proprietary? Who would have a commercial interest in it?
>>91100960He probably wants to sell the source code.I have no idea what practical use Menuet would have though.
>>91098677Have you imbued your OS with cyberpunk qualities? I had a look at your other projects.
>>91101016Menuet (and Kolibri) is wrought in hand crafted assembly and is therefore compact and blindingly fast. Even on the emulator, it is far faster than the other OS choices provided.It might be that it has a market niche in embedded systems.
>>91100553>not a single VMS bookWhy are you intentionally limiting the scope of your knowledge?
>>91065889>https://amigaos.net/what in the operating fuck of a system is this? gives me the vibe of Chinese edgy advertising. >our features>we have included tools that are made by somebody else>we have rebranded already existing technologies>little to no contribution to loader, linker, system library, abi and kernel. >now, we call it an OSI don't fucking understand the point.
bump
>>91065889All I know is I wish Project Monterey succeeded. Sadly it collapsed and the official UNIX's market lead died with it. For reference, Project Monterey was a project lead by IBM & SCO to combine all the official UNIXes (at the time including UNIXware 7, AIX, Solaris, HP-UX, IRIX, ULTRIX/True64/DEC OSF/1 and BSD) but it collapsed due to disagreements in direction, inability to agree on licensing terms (most of them wanted to keep their secrets and control over exclusive software), the proprietary nature of their platforms (SPARC, PA-RISC, etc.) and the emergence of the fucking awful Itanium causing HP, DEC/Compaq and SGI to drop out early. Oh what could have been.
MorphOS for x86 NEVER EVER.I just want a Amiga-like OS anons that works on modern hardware.
>>91101017Not as much as I would like.
>>91089484>IllumosNever used it anon, won't even pretend like I know the ins and outs of. I've dealt with specifically Oracle based applications that custom fit (specifically identity management based) and they blow donkey dick without constant love and care.
>>91106870I thought they were working on a x86 port
>>91101060seems like the exact wrong arch for embedded.
>>91106870x86 and 64-bit and FOSS license and MorphOS would be the KING of Amiga-like OSs...
>>91105959i'm convinced itanium was an inside job
>>91109623It's funny how after Itanium, they learned to love x86. They've tried to kill it more times than their competitors and it's still alive and kicking
>>91108495There is plenty of x86 and x64 in embedded machines, mostly where power requirements are not an issue.
>>91109623It was murder. Alpha, PA-RISC, and MIPS workstations - all destroyed.I start to think the only hope we had for real, Unix workstations was for them to adopt amd64 fast while still retaining the quality of engineering that makes a workstation a workstation.
>>91110668>It was murder. Alpha, PA-RISC, and MIPS workstations - all destroyedZoomer here. What happened
>>91111405Intel promoted Itanium, a hyper complex VLIW chip, as the successor of all previous chips. The ide was good but the compiler writers made promises they failed to deliver, so only one of three instruction slots were filled. That failure alone reduced performance to a third. That also caused a 3x bloat that killed cache performance. And cache hinting probably never worked righht either.So yes, it murdered the competition, but it also hurt Intel.
Did people really use OpenVMS as a workstation? There's ZERO software for it. No browser, no email client nothing. Even as a server there's no software except for some Apache port. I don't even think you can install mail server software...
>>91112595Software used to be portable. Even the lumbering Firefox once ran on OpenVMS. I myself still use HP-UX, on the workstation I took home after I retired. I have had to replace much of the local software with software running on a Raspberry Pi via X forwarding, but at least it's well integrated with the OS and the CDE desktop I find so productive.
>>91113554>Software used to be portableAnd then what happened?>CDE desktop I find so productiveWhy not run it on Linux or *BSD?
>>91113554Nice, fren
>>91112595I wonder if there will be more software ports now that OpenVMS runs on x86 and is free for hobbyists
>>91098677How do you do so much work on such a tiny screen?
>>91115210Tiny? It's a Macbook Pro M1, just wanted to show the output of the Parallels VM and some of the code structure inside Sublime Text.When I started working on the OS I wanted to do all the work on a Nokia Booklet 3g which is a 11inch netbook but the fact that I had to export the iso so i can import in on another computer in another VM kinda bummed me. But I did write the initial bootloader and the current two-stage bootloader and did most of the structural designs and documentation on the said Nokia laptop, so can't complain.
>>91114959I doubt it. ZOOMIES have never heard of it
I've just started writing my own OS. Influences are VMS and System V Unix, and a bit of NT.
>>91117591>VMSInfluence, in what way?
>>91108295This was my understanding as well.
>>91118351I have put these VMS features into my design draft:- Lookaside Lists: small caches of objects available for allocating from even from interrupt context.- Fork procedures: way for interrupt handlers to queue work to be done when the system is running at a lower priority.- I/O request packets: provides an explicit stack system so that I/O can be done asynchronously easily.- Lockmanager: Monitors tasks to detect deadlocks and resolves them by ending the offending task.- Scheduler that boosts priorities but never reduces priorities below the level an application requested- Demand paged virtual memory.Realizing even two or three of these features would make my OS sophisticated and capable. I will realize them all.
>>91119124NTA, but Any news on that?
>>91120234>- Lockmanager: Monitors tasks to detect deadlocks and resolves them by ending the offending task.Umm, isn't this considered a REALLY hard issue? And did VMS really overcome deadlocks?
>>91120410http://neilrieck.net/docs/openvms_notes_DLM.htmlThis writeup details its uses. It is no panacaea but it can help sometimes.
Has anyone tried using AROS? Is it usable in any way? It's been around since 1995
>>91121189Nope
>>91098273Looks amazing!
>>91120234i already did all this
>>91128002Hoshi?
>>91128002where ISO?
I tried 9front in a VM. Wtf? It's just so terminal window and that's it. There's not even an application launcher. Surely nobody actually uses this as their main system? Is it all an elaborate troll?
>>91129102>DUDE i just LOVE the trial and error of the terminal, it's so EFFICIENT and makes me feel like I'm in one of my LUKE SMITH VIDEOS. You should totally come on down to my pubnix, it's got EXPOSED POSIX C source code and everything, we can crack open a man page or three and get crazy watching some suckless programs compile!
>>91128002I have NEVER seen any OS (that isn't a professionally created OS) other than VMS that implements these.
>>91130443What's so special about these things?t. techlet
>>91065889Anyone's got the OpenVMS x86 ISO yet?
How do I run AmigaOS 4.1 in qemu on x86?Where to find the ISO? What else do I need, some kind of boot.img?
>>91131395Lookaside lists enable core logic of interrupts to be quickly run in interrupt context without having to enqueue (as e.g. Linux would) a so-called "softIRQ". Fork procedures provide a way for you to enqueue work from an interrupt which is unsuitable for running in interrupt context but which still needs to be done expeditiously. These two features provide improved responsiveness and reduce the risks of, for example, packets being dropped. Thus your networking can reach higher speeds.I/O request packets allow an asynchronous system of I/O. Linux is fundamentally synchronous. They have artificial, fake "asynchrononus" I/O which is done by spawning a kernel thread. It's an ugly thing.The lockmanager can turn deadlocks that would otherwise be fatal to everyone involved into something fatal to at most one of the processes involved.The scheduler provides good responsiveness and makes interactive programs much less likely to suffer from any delays.Finally, the demand paged virtual memory in VMS is considerably more sophisticated than in Linux. Linux becomes unusably slow when it uses swap heavily. VMS does not.
>>91131524you need to use UAE for Amiga.
bumpy
>>91132529There is surprisingly little about Amiga on the Wiki. Could you add some info?
>>91133824Seconded. I'd love to learn more about it
>>91133824this is still a very young general, we need to ask ourselves what is needed on the wiki, and the ones which know need to provide.
>>91135247The FAQ is still constantly edited by several people so I guess we just have to provide information here in this thread.
>>91128855no that guy is a larper who thinks he's cool because he wrote a pretty window system that probably redraws the entire screen every frame
>>91136587OK, so which is it then?
>>91136587nta but i'd ask you to link anything. if you got nuffin, you speak nuffin, nigger.
>>91136587Nice, I could just insult you but that would be a waste of my time.Instead, how about I explain for the others that are interested in the inner workings, that when a window (or any window control/widget actually) does something and needs an update, that window control posts an IPC message to the window compositor (called Akimitsu) and the compositor does the dirty deed of updating the surface just for that respective control (and all of its children controls, obviously) and nothing else.Your idea sounds like huge fun but I think it's source might reside in some heavy alcohol or drugs consumption.Or you might be retarded.
>>91136878where ISO?
>>91136936Sent you a pm, isolet.
>>91136878>says won't insult>insults anywayhoshihaters btfo
>>91136954Yeah, still a nothingburger then
>>91136587So your OS and its window system are so much better? I never realized.Explain to me how, since you're apparently the Linus Torvalds of the thread.
I've been wanting a modern Amiga for 20 years. They were too expensive in my teens (when they were only a few hundred quid), and they're too expensive now I'm an adult (almost a thousand pounds at this point), and it seems there's no systems in stock anywhere anymore even if I did have the money for them. Sucks.
>>91137718What's the point of having one nowadays? What's the appeal?
>>91136878>compositoryeah thats all i need to hear to know youre a larper>>91137489i am smarter than linus torvalds
>>91137947Compositors are the modern way to do window management. Wayland is one, Xorg was not. Even Windows' window manager (Explorer) is a compositor nowadays, along with macOS's window manager (aqua). Are you stuck in 80s Unix days?>i am smarter than linus torvaldsNo, you are not smarter than a programming God. Do you even know anything about operating systems? Man implemented a whole kernel. That's a bootloader, a physical memory manager, a virtual memory manager, GDT, IDT, PIT, PIC, system calls, all of it. Hardly anyone can match that record.
>>91138662idk what to tell you, im doing a better job by myself than he did before he got so many nerds to help him
>>91139664And in what way is your OS better than Linux?Linux was already a fully-featured Unix-Like kernel by 0.01!
>>91139753My OS has a weeaboo theme
SnowdropOS written in Assemblerhttp://sebastianmihai.com/snowdrop/
>>91131743Do you know where I could read more about why linux paging is slow?
>>91131743And how does NT handle those in comparison?
>>91140266roughly the same in fundamentals, and better in details
>>91140266The basic difference is that Linux grabs pages and stops the whole system once it's paged them out (Because you don't know how many processes are trying to use that page.) VAX/VMS and WinNT instead have the Balance Set Manager which works on a per-task basis. It monitors processes to keep a sensible limit on how many pages they can have in-memory at once, adapting so that programs which need a lot of memory can get it, but always making sure it's not at the expense of other programs. And when a process tries to break its fair limits, it can only get a new page by paging out another. Since this is done per-process, you don't need to stop the whole system to do it, and processes all get a fair share. That's why you can still use Windows when it's having to page a lot, meanwhile Linux grinds to a halt. This is calling local page replacement and it rationalizes the whole system of paging so that it follows the same principles as, for example, scheduling does.
>>91140096>SnowdropOSAdded.I had expected more RISC-V OS in assembly but so far it is hype only.
>>91066675The world truly never recovered from this. Larry bought it and Sun was setting.
>>91140865Linux paging doesn't behave like that.
>>91142850Yes it does. Believe me when I say I know Linux inside out. It's trash.
>>91140563Makes sense, thanks anon>>91140865 would you say there are upsides to the way linux does it? What's the reasoning behind they way they implemented it? And is NT better designed than VMS? I'd assume so considering the history behind NT, but I sadly don't know a lot about NT. I'm a lot more familiar with the way the linux kernel works, but imo the linux "monoculture" makes it harder to know what has been done better by other kernels. Even NT has a lot less mindshare, and articles and textbooks written about it.
>>91140096wer ISO?
>>91146337Check your spam folder
>>91146337http://sebastianmihai.com/downloads/snowdrop/snowdrop.iso
>>91147826kekthis shit's got soul
>>91146337Why iso when you can have a floppy image?
>>91150166I'll send you my floppy image
>>91150166My Macbook Pro M2 doesn't have a floppy drive
>>91140563Why hasn't Linux caught up with this? The OOM killer has been a prblem for decades.
Thoughts on Genode? It seems to quite advanced but I don't understand how to use it.
Bump the most interesting thread on this mongolian basket-weaving forum. I'd give gold but I don't have any.
>>91151711so? you're not booting it with anything besides macos anyways
>>91150166>>91151555>>91151711>>91156444Over half of recent posts are dubs/tripsThis thread is blessed
>>91154638Seems advanced and interesting but also slow moving.
>>91157746yeah somehow they're even porting it to the pinephone, i dont get why, do they think they can succeed where even gnu/linux failed?
>>91158416Best mobile OS was blackberry 10 thoughever
I'm going to implement /bin/laden in my OS and you can't stop me.
>>91160077>>91157245Even more dubs
>>91150166based
>>91158416Genode seems to be driven by intellectual pursuits rather than product releases, so they might even port it to Amiga.
>>91162816Do the developers not get paid?
>>91153445When you build on a soft foundation, it is very hard to fix that fundamental mistake. Especially when you have invited men from every corporation under the sun to set up shop, each of them adding a gaudy extension to the house which only makes it the more complicated. In fact, the thing would've collapsed years ago, but the corporate men sent in their armies of labourers to build crude pillars to prevent the whole rotten thing from tumbling down, and to patch up the cracks which appear daily.So Linux is able to survive because it has the endless attention of those who depend on it. This prevents it from collapsing. It does not address the fundamental problems, so it continues to suffer in such areas.
>>91162934Good question. I had a look and it seems Genode Labs is owned by ots founders, but nowhere did I find anything about funding.
>>91164497https://www.genode-labs.com/news/2021-07-23research grants and sale of custom special-purpose genode-based OSs i guess
>>91159459I believe that was powered by QNX, which was pretty good.
>>91068162I doubt they could have competed with Linux/Redhat even without Oracle.
>>91165294I thought opensolaris was quite popular around 2010
>>91165574nta but i tried and actually liked it way more than the linux distros i tried. didn't support some hardware shit tho.
>>91165574But was it popular for web/hyperscale shit? Classical servers have become pretty much irrelevant funding wise. The software based instant fail over redundant architectures build on top of Linux have made stuff like XFS entirely redundant, an overcomplicated headache for higher level solutions. I think the CDDL patent friendliness was also a downfall, who the hell wants to deal with a codebase where parts of the code can't be customized without taking a patent license?
>>91165574it was but even the later Illumos/OpenIndiana/etc. forks are still really terrible with hardware support. I couldn't get the latest OI to boot in a VM whereas the previous version worked fine with same settings.
What are you working with, osdev bros? Maybe some memory management nasties? Maybe PML4? Maybe scheduler algo? Maybe implementing NTFS? XHCI? Or just some plain PCI funsies?
>>91167042>Maybe some memory management nasties?Always>Maybe PML4?Not an issue>Maybe scheduler algo?Never FIFO, always priority.>Maybe implementing NTFS?Best joke ever, nobody sane does that.>XHCI?I take it back, this is the best joke.>Or just some plain PCI funsies?Done in the winter of 2009, was a good winter.
>No TempleOSngmi
>>91169690Lots of larpers pretend to run it but it works great on bare metal.
