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When you look at the upper-middle class professionals (e.g. doctors, lawyers, academics, bankers) who actually engage in some sort of physical activity, it seems like they drift towards endurance sports (e.g. long-distance running, cycling, triathlons) over strength/combat sports (e.g. powerlifting, bodybuilding, strongman, boxing).

What is the reason for this? I have never really understood why someone would devote 10-20 hours of their week to running, when you could devote a fraction of that time to lifting and get far better returns on your investment - i.e. being jacked will objectively improve your life in the sense that people will treat you better. But with running... what do you get by the end of it? Good cardiovascular health? That can be achieved without subjecting yourself to absurdly long endurance events.

Is it a class thing? Is being jacked seen as primitive/unnecessary in the higher echelons of society? Whereas physical dominance is more necessary for men who are lower down on the social ladder?
>>
>>62683924
they are smart and understand that looking lean is way more attractive than looking like a fat, gay, retarded, chinese powershitter, and they realize that being attractive gets you pretty far in life.
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>>62683924
they need to be good at running away
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>>62683952
But most endurance runners have absolutely zero upper body mass, which just makes them look frail and weak. Being lean is good for aesthetics, but only if you actually have some muscle mass. Otherwise you just look like anorexic.
>>
As a lawyer, I can tell you that it's hard to get suits that fit right if you're jacked. You pretty much have to have a tailor anyway if you are in a suit every day, but tailors just have thread and needle, they don't have wands.

Other than that, I can't explain it except to say that when you get older one muscle takes priority over all of them: the heart. Without it, the others can't/don't exist.
>>
>>62683924
Because having a high tier cardiovascular capacity is more useful in their fast paced lives than be able to lift heavy objects.
>>
Not necessarily true. I know a lot of surgeons who lift and are pretty jacked. They all also do cardio too though.

Pic related is a head and neck oncologic surgeon I know
>>
>>62683924
it's just culture
lifting is associated with lower class, construction worker types, "rough" dudes.
Whereas endurance sports are not, and are more prevalent in european culture, like cycling and skiing, which is often seen as effeminate by lower class men, but classy by the upper class.
Of course this hasn't always been a thing. In many ancient civilizations, weightlifting was considered virtuous.
>>
>>62683992
Oh, also I'll add that running, cycling, and swimming are great to destress and unwind. Lifting weights is also, to a lesser degree. But I can't imagine combat sports, boxing and powershidding is destressing.
>>
>>62684019
>But I can't imagine combat sports, boxing is destressing.
it absolutely is
>>
>>62684016
the fuck is going on with this
neck/head combo?
>>
>>62683924
>heart health
vs
>muscles
>lean
vs
>bloat
>>62683983
The only endurance athletes that look like that are extremely serious ones or professional athletes. Your average joe doing endurance as a hobby isn't going to go skeley mode.
>>
>>62683924
>
Is it a class thing? Is being jacked seen as primitive/unnecessary in the higher echelons of society? Whereas physical dominance is more necessary for men who are lower down on the social ladder?
The state of /fit
>>
>>62684016
The stereotype of an orthopedic surgeon is that they're a dumb jock who is always talking about how much he can bench. Don't know how much truth there is to that.
>>
>>62684043
wth he looks gross af .
>>
>>62683952
Long distance running doesn't make you look lean, it makes you look skinny fat. I knew a guy who ran 12-15km every morning, looked like someone who gets no exercise whatsoever but doesn't overeat either.
>>
>>62683983
you don't understand how normal people think. normies would call that guy ripped because of the minuscule amount of muscle definition in his arms. do you really think people care about "upper body mass"? you sound like mac from always sunny.
looking lean is just more attractive, even if you do look emaciated. you can wear skinny pants and tight t shirts, which are in style. you can wear skinny suits, which are in style. looking leaner makes you look taller in a way, which is in style.
also what >>62684057 said, most people who "do" endurance sports just ride a bike a couple times a week at most, they're not constantly training for competitions
>>
>>62684074
its true, if you look at the resident page for johns hopkins ortho for example 80% of their residents played a college sport or something

t. med student
>>
>>62684064
I actually think it's an interesting question, but then again I'm on the spectrum.
>>
>>62684085
post body
>>
>>62683952
Hell yeah brother sounds gay
>>
>>62683992
Unless you're fat as shit you the best body you could hope to achieve natty is 4.
You can definitely find a suit for number 4. And if you truly have a white collar profession and doing well in your career you should be able to get it tailored
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>>62684116
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>>62684089
ok use whatever description of their physique you want, but it's probably more attractive than looking like a powershitter
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>>62683924

because when you become an adult the idea of stepping into a gym with a bunch of losers who didn't go to college and cant hold down a stable relationship is repulsive. after 30 years old you should never step foot in a gym again. plus get outside and you get fresh air and dont need to deal with your wife nagging you.

On the other hand endurance sports have an incredibly high ceiling and gains are measured in speed not the weight you can lift once or twice.

Cycling is a whole nother breed, because of the fact you can go racing, and risk life and limb while playing strategic games to try to get a good finish. all while riding 30 mph inches from others. no strength based competition has that any here close.
>>
>>62684179
Perhaps, but why go for either of those shitty physiques? Swallow your pride and incorporate advanced calisthenics into your workouts. That is the only way to get that ripped, "lean" look.
>>
Because most white-collar men dislike ( or perhaps fear) direct confrontation. To work in the white collar fields, you need an obedient and submissive personality to endure the daily task. And that affects the mindset.

Getting into strength/combat sports mean one will face direct confrontations from other men. The mog vs mogged, win vs lose .... trait of strength/combat sport is much more visible and clear than in endurance sport.

And this happens everywhere, especially in Asia. Many doctors, lawyers and college professors friends of mine here, if they are into sports, usually try biking, long distance running and hiking. Some tried lifting for a few months then given up.
>>
>>62684219
>after 30 years old you should never step foot in a gym again

Leave
>>
>>62684090
>>62684090
"Lean" simply means "low levels of body fat". A 6'0" can be 10% body fat at 130lbs with virtually no muscle, or he can be 10% at 180lbs with broad shoulders, pecs, developed arms, abs, and muscular legs. The latter guy will look 10x better in clothing.
>>
>>62684247
Oh yeah theres definitely NO direct confrontation here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOgn36rVhc4&ab_channel=NorCalCycling

In fact in any type of competitive session. and I got damn guarantee that most endurance athletes will sign up for 5K's 10Ks Marathons, and cycling events in higher numbers than any strength trainer event. Endurance sports youre right next to your competition and you can see them gaining ground on you. its literally pretornatural.

Most strength training is literally just a sole person lifting heavy things in front of a mirror, never once competing hand to hand.
>>
Enduring low-moderate level suffering for long stretches is directly applicable to office work.
>>
>>62684219
Pro cyclists literally look like concentration camp victims. I have no idea why any man would want to look like this.
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>>62684296
serious question: are you gay? how do you know if that guy is more attractive than some skinny looking shithead? being attractive as a man means being attractive to women, and women aren't as into muscles as the autists on this board.
>>
>>62684345
He can put down more power in 30s than you ever will on just squating.
>>
>>62684329
kek
>>
>>62684308
I am from Asia and English is not my native so what I said can be misunderstood.

My point about direct confrontation is about the confrontation that affects one's social status.

All men compete with each other because of human nature. And in a lifting gym, you can clearly spot the stronger lifter, the better body, the bigger body ... etc. Similarly, in an MMA ring, between two guys, there is always a winner fighter and a loser fighter. And there is always an audience at the gym or at an MMA ring. And all of that directly affects the social hierarchy.

But this is not clear and visible in the endurance sports like running, biking ... The mog or be mogged problem is not so visible and brutal in these sports.
>>
>>62684308
this guy speaks the truth.
t, rooner who sees how autistic other rooners get even during training.
>>
>>62684355
I started lifting at 6'0", 125lbs, and I was literally invisible to women at that point. Nothing about my body said "I'm a man". After 3-4 years of lifting, I'm a fairly lean 190bs, and I have a lot more success with girls now, as well as relatively frequent compliments from guys. No girl wants to be with a guy who weighs the same/less than her.
>>
>>62684345
>>62684361
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VO7VMmSHCo&t=1s
>>
>>62684345
>I have no idea why any man would want to look like this.
That's the difference between athletes and body dysmorphia suffers like yourself.
Froome and others look like that not because they want but because it's what it takes to excel at their sports. Having extra upper body mass is totally retarded for a cyclist.
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>>62684361
I doubt that guy could squat 340. And I will always physique-mog into oblivion, regardless.
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>>62684141
Yes, you can find a suit. That's not the point. The point is that when you are jacked, simple things like the sleeves of a suit are tight on you.

You clearly don't wear suits, so you should just refrain from speaking. It's so much ignorant blather. Your speculation is not better than my first-hand experience.
>>
>>62684458
stats? Do you roid?
>>
>>62684390
Clearly somebody who has never ran or biked.

I do both regularly, and it's easy as day to tell who's faster than you. go to a running track, or just watch other dudes form, somebody might be moving quick but with shit form and looks like they are falling apart. another dude might be cruising at my tempo pace and looks like he's out for a daily stroll. I live in a big city and in the park loop on my bike, im panting at 170 bpm and dudes are cruising at 25 mph on their easy ride, putting out 300 watts. not to mention all the Kit and gear one-upsmanship
>>
>>62684396
>>62684396
ok, fair point, but maybe you were also just a nerd 3-4 years ago
>No girl wants to be with a guy who weighs the same/less than her.
fat girls need love too anon
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>>62684458
wow you really are a brainlet.
>>
>>62684493
>im panting at 170 bpm
do you mean your heart rate?

im new to cycling, mostly using spin bikes at the gym rn because im scared to bike in NYC and get hit by a car.

I hit 10 miles in 28 minutes for a record the other day but my heart rate is like around 180 avg when I do that which I think is too high

any advice on getting faster while going at a lower heart rate? Should I train at threshold or aerobic capacity like under 160bpm?
>>
>>62684458
And he vo2max mogs you like you're a small insect.
>>
>>62684296
is that pietro boselli? what's up with his leg in that pic?
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>>62684493
>>62684514
This was my ride today
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>>62684493
I run 3 times a week for cardio. Already have run 2 half-marathon, but not anymore. I bike occasionally for fun.

I just speak my opinion on the topic, consider that Im from Asia with a white collar background. And in Asia, the social stigma about white collar vs blue collar is much more severe than in the West.
>>
>>62684518
>sup babe, wanna see my huge vo2max?
>>
>>62684518
Probably, but who cares though? The type of fitness that cycling and running gives you offers you basically no benefits in every-day life. Whereas having a good physique makes you look better, will make easier for you to attract girls (and enable you access to higher quality girls) and will lead to you getting more respect from men. You would think that status-conscious strivers in the professional class would pick up on this.
>>
>>62684514

NYC Anon too. get a bike and come out to Central Park and Prospect Park, and then get shamed because some dude in his 50's is passing you on harlem hill without breaking a sweat, or a dude on a fixe with birkenstocks passes you on the manhattan bridge climb.

but for practical advice, it depends on your goal. if you're trying to race crits you want to be an all rounder. so you need to have a decent sprint, a pretty good 5 min power (300 W at least) , and strong aerobic base. polarized training is the way to go. you want 2-3 hard days where your working your anerobic system at like 180 bpm. then the rest fill with volume at zone 2, so like 150 bpm. I race crits and I ride around 8 hours a week, and about 130 miles. don't know what my FTP is im too poor for that shit. but Id guess its around 240-250 and I weigh in at 178.
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>>62684564
>The type of fitness that cycling and running gives you offers you basically no benefits in every-day life.
Lmao this nigger is retarded.
>>
>>62684564
too bad you'll get winded walking up a flight of stairs.
>>
>>62684577
can I get a decent entry level bike for like 500 or should I save up more
>>
>>62684602
On craigs or FB marketplace, you can probably although with covid its kinda hard. I picked up a Cannondale CAAD 10 for about $800 in feb. look for Giant, Cannondale, Specilized Allez, Fuji . there might be some around $500
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>>62684624
ok thanks bro. Theres a trek store near my apartment I was gonna check out but thats probably out of my budget since its all new stuff
>>
>>62684564
>The type of fitness that cycling and running gives you offers you basically no benefits in every-day life.
it's like a billion more times more beneficial than lifting weights
it literally keeps you alive

maybe the reason white collar workers are more into cardio is because they value their lives more and want to live longer
>>
>>62683924
it relates to the "ideal" white collar work ethic to relentlessly grind away on some bullshit task. If you tell someone you are knocking out a century ride this weekend you are also telling them you are a better professional worker than they are.
>>
>>62683924
>option A: be healthy and in shape from CASUAL cardio
>option B: struggle to climb up stairs as a natty weightsharter who doesn't even look good because he's natty and who has to dedicate his meals and sleep schedule to this lifestyle
>option C: become a roid tranny and die of a heart attack before your comfy white collar retirement
>>
Lmfao nobody here has a clue about what they are talking about
>>
>>62684355
>"women call each other hot all the time. Why are they all so gay?"
>>
>>62684633
This makes no sense. Weight-training is a very good for your health, provided you aren't taking it to the extremes (i.e. using a lot of drugs and getting up to a very high bodyweight), but that's not going to happen for 95% of lifters, especially natties. It's also almost impossible to build an appreciable amount of muscle mass and strength without simultaneously developing a decent level of cardiovascular endurance. And it's not as if you can't add in a few treadmill/stationary bike sessions for 10-30 minutes each week, if that's something you want to focus on.
>>
>>62684692
all women are bi retard
>>
>>62684458
Based, good work anon
>>
>>62684650
ah yes the three body types. Thin, obese and bodybuilder
>>
>>62684650
Runners and cyclists aren't "in-shape" from a physique perspective, though, they look like malnourished prisoners of war. Unless your definition of "in-shape" is just "not fat".

And the idea that a natural lifter with a good amount of muscle and a low body fat is going to have any issues walking up some stairs is just a cope. That sort of thing only applies to 250-300lbs guys on a shit load of drugs. As I said above, what's to stop someone who's primary focus is their physique/strength from doing a couple of cardio sessions per week, too? That's pretty normal.
>>
>>62684074
Yep, hospital stereotypes are true. Ortho people are jocks, neuro people are tweaky, etc.
>>
>>62684546
Interesting, thanks for your perspective anon.
>>
Real answer is time, accessibility, and access to equipment.

Lower classes do not have the time to train for endurance sports, nor would they ever know how to. Going in to the gym and doing some bro curls is easy, we've all seen it on TV.

They also don't have the environment to train. Running around in the hood or urban areas isn't great, there's no pools, and forget being able to afford a bike.

Contrast to football, basketball, or track, where all you need is a ball and some space
>>
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Fit white collar professionals also enjoy outdoot sports such as mountaineering, trail running and winter sports (skiing of all kinds, snowboarding). Guess what's required for all of them? Low intensity steady state cardio with the occasional strength training required; Training for the New Alpinism emphasizes building an aerobic base rather than looking jacked for example. For outdoor pursuits like that how you look is secondary to how you perform.
>>
>>62684564
>will lead to you getting more respect from men
Ironically it doesn't work this way, youll intimidate other men who have more power than you and they won't promote you. Also your view on "every day benefit" is vain. You just want to look good for others, being a good cyclist has many benefits from cardio health to also a social environment to meet others
>>
>>62684016
Wtf is wrong with this guy’s body?
>>
I work in boutique corporate shit. Big dollars at the top level (not me)

It all starts from wanting to run a marathon as a dick measuring contest. These dudes want to demonstrate mental fortitude and running a marathon or doing a triathlon is seen as the pinnacle of this for normies. You can also train alone which helps if you have a busy schedule.

Then they have to keep pushing for the next big event because it's not enough just running a marathon anymore, gotta go longer (or triathlon).

Then they turn 50 and their knees are fucked so they buy a $15K bike and get it that way. Hence next dick measuring contest of having the best bike and gear. A fresh set of rapha kit will set you back a few grand. My bosses front wheel is worth more than my whole bike.

I bought a bike so I could train with the senior managers and get time with the CEO. Lost 10kg and got my good boy mental fortitude points.

Cycling's pretty cool imo anyway.
>>
>>62684219
>and risk life and limb while playing strategic games to try to get a good finish. all while riding 30 mph inches from others. no strength based competition has that any here close.
Can you tell me about these strategic games they play in cycling? I heard about it but never understood it. I like playing strategy games and i like running, would i like cycling as it combines both cardio and strategy? yeah stupid question but you get what i am asking i hope
>>
Here's why, in no particular order
>Big muscles + high(ish) bodyfat makes you look brutish and clothes won't fit you properly, especially if you have a 'burly' frame to begin with. It's also true that looking intimidating to other men is not necessarily good in corporate.
>Cardio can be done in complete solitude in ways lifting can't. Most white collar guys just want an hour a day to themselves.
>It's easier to arrange social events around endurance activities
>It's easier to flex with equipment ($200 lifting shoes vs. $5000 bicycle)

I used to work blue collar jobs in the past and to those guys lifting and team sports were much more common.
>>
>>62683924
>i.e. being jacked will objectively improve your life in the sense that people will treat you better.

>once again, another person on f/it/ who is incapable of understanding that some people do activities for their own enjoyment, not based on how others will view them for doing it

/fit/ is the most insecure website on the entire internet
>>
>>62684154
chestlet
>>
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>>62683924
I do both but recently got into running.
Bros the difference in mental health is extreme, 90percent of shit that used to upset me I now look at coldly. Difficult family shit becomes a dream.
>>
It's the fashion. These types are obedient drones all holding the same "opinions".
>>
>>62683924
Not everyone is into being jacked. I lift three times a week and run two times a week. I also go ride a bike or hike s mountain every Saturday. Endurance sports are kinda more rewarding in general feeling good. I actually workout only to not look like a total skinny weakfag. I prefer endu/cardio stuff.
>>
>>62684089
> it makes you look skinny fat
No
>>
The same reason wealthy men prefer thin, small boobed women. It sends a message about their values and social class
>>
>>62685487
posture
>>
>>62683924

Better for health and longevity, more cerebral, does more to improve mental toughness than lifting.
>>
>>62684493
but aren't all these tells completely ruined by the fact that you don't know when somebody left the house? if somebody is cruising past you with ease it could mean that they're fitter than you but it could also mean they just started and you're on the last third of your run. this includes form. lots of people have good form when they're warming up but at the finish line they "fall apart".
>>
>>62684089

/fit/ has body dysmorphia, it’s no secret. That guy probably looked great.
>>
>>62684089
>I knew a guy
Opinion discarded. Next thing you are telling me is that you lost five pounds on keto from you two hundred pound frame in a month.
>>
>>62684564

Based retard poster. It’s almost impressive to say that many wrong things consecutively without stumbling on at least one correct point.
>>
>>62684699
>It's also almost impossible to build an appreciable amount of muscle mass and strength without simultaneously developing a decent level of cardiovascular endurance.

Never seen any compelling evidence for this. You might improve some metrics of heart fitness by a fraction of a percent, and it’s significant relative to someone who sat on ass. But that’s like saying hills sprints and deadlifts both give you a decent amount of leg strength.
>>
>>62683924

People who have their brain "on" all day want to just zone out during pt. Endurance sports allow that. Heavy lifting and sports require you to be in the moment.
>>
>>62685414
Is cycling the best form of cardio?
T. new to this shit
>>
>>62684564
>will make easier for you to attract girls (and enable you access to higher quality girls

Spotted the virgin. Woman don't work like that retard. They don't care about your twisted dysmorphic body appreciation scale. They care about status much more than biceps. And being the best in the world (Froome was in his prime) is gonna get a girtl wetter than your better-than-average-Joe physique. Granted you don't look bad, but you overestimate your appeal.
>>
Theyre also cucks
They want blue collar powerlifting chads to rail their wives while they jerk off
>>
>>62684016
Is that doorbrah lol
>>
>cycling
>endurance over strength
wrong
just turn it all the way up and pedal as hard as possible in shorter intervals
>t. big ass quads
>>
>>62688533
no, swimming is
>>
>>62684564
it will make you more attractive to dumb sloots for sure. but that also signals to others in the professional world that you have an ape brain and can't hold down a stable relationship because you're just trying to chase young hot tail. nobody respects that when you get into serious roles, they want somebody dependable and disciplined with maturity to handle complex and long term projects.
>>
>>62683952
Long distance running won't make you look good, or even lean, if that's all you're doing though.
>>
>>62684090
>normies would call that guy ripped because of the minuscule amount of muscle definition in his arms
I like how /fit/ tries to simultaneously push that normies will think this guy is ripped and be impressed by the slightest bit of muscle, AND at the same time think guys like the Rock and prime Arnold are natty. So which is it you retards?
>b-but /fit/ isn't one person though!!!
It might as well be, because it's curious how I never see these 2 camps arguing with each other while they both happily argue with everyone else.
>>
>>62684219
>stepping into a gym with a bunch of losers
As opposed to you, a loser who never stepped into one to begin with?
>>
>>62688467
>cardiovascular health doesn't have any benefits
Seriously what compels someone to produce such statement?
>>
>>62688533
No.
swimming>running>rowing>cycling
>>
>>62683924
most people dont know how to lift to get big. most are concerned about not getting fat rather than getting on muscle. and so their idea of staying in shaoe is running or cardio
>>
White collar dorks don't know how to get jacked. My relative runs a civil engineer form and did cardio like mad until I talked to him about lifting and now he loves lifting.
>>
>>62683924
longevity

turns out white collar professionals are good at planning for the future
>>
>>62683924
It's the sense of fullfillment from gains and endorphins. Pure and simple.

>t.20-25miles per week.
>>
>>62684518
He would be really good at running away from me, alpha af
>>
>>62684564
You have infuriated the people in this thread who don’t lift lmao
>>
>>62690054
Cope. Based Froomey is jewing the juden out of 5M $hekels a year, he's not the running away type.
>>
>>62684219
Where did all these copes come from ?
>>
I work as an engineer (EIT, not PE) and do marathon running. I also lift, but actually go to running events. Endurance sports are a great excuse to socialize (running groups are the most open and welcoming people out there), but also give you enough time to just be in your own head (3-4 hours of running just let’s you think, and people aren’t talking to you). The endorphins feel good, as well. It’s a great excuse to travel (oh, let me do this marathon in DC, it sounds fun and I’ll take a few days off of work). Cardio is the best thing for longevity (some of those 60 and 70 year old you see just are so energetic; it’s crazy). It’s easy to compete in (there is probably a 5k near you this weekend you can race in). It lets you continue to eat similar foods as you did in college, except losing weight instead of gaining 15 lbs. The big limiting factor is money ($1000+/year on race entries, clothes , and shoes, then you have hotel and travel expenses, and you daily calorie expenditure can easily get 4000+), but white collar job, you might as well have fun with your money.
>>
>>62689142
>>62689883
Why is swimming the best form of cardio
>>
It is simply harder to get under a bar and lift heavy weights than it is to do endurance exercises.

Yes endurance is mentally tough but by definition the effort is submaximal and conditioning is an acute adaptation that can be gained relatively quickly.
>>
>>62690153
It’s extremely easy on the joints, forces proper and steady breathing, involves the most energy per unit distance, and uses the entire body’s musculature.
>>
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>>62683924
>>62683952
>>62683971
it's literally an escape and meditation. cerebral jobs clog the brain with shit, you need some way to process it or even shut it off and just do.
If you're a fast food slob like yourself, you get this every lunch rush.
If you're a lawyer, not so many opportunities to meditate and do.
>>
>>62688493
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCXppbxif0Y

https://startingstrength.com/article/heavy-lifting-and-heart-health#:~:text=Based%20on%20that%20understanding%2C%20the,heart's%20ability%20to%20pump%20harder.
>>
Probably because lifting weights is the shittest tier exercise possible and does not make you healthy
>>
>>62690184
And you don't sweat like a pig.
I was surprised how much it tires me out and yet how comfy I'm in the water.
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>>62683924
Because it's easier to compete in. Goal driven individuals NEED a "light at the end of the tunnel", some sort of race/competition. No proper adult wants to lift just to "look better"... and compare the number of powerlifting comps to running/tri races you have locally.
>>
>>62690445
Sweating is good for you and feels good. Part of the reason the sauna is good for you. You also sweat in the water, but the water washes it off.
>>
Lifting hasn't become a mainstream hobby until fairly recently, before that it was seen as something for roided bodybuilders and fatass powerlifters. A lot of the middle aged professionals were growing up in the 70s and 80s when it was still pretty niche. Endurance fitness (running, etc) is also the epitome of normie culture, which is why most commercial gyms dedicate half the floor to cardio equipment

>>62684564
White collar professionals don't need to lift for pussy, they're already top 10% in income.
>>
>>62690824
I forgot to add that you'll probably see more white collar professionals lifting in the coming decades as people who grew up with social media enter the prime of their careers
>>
>>62689782
I've said it time and time again bro, /fit/ is literally the dumbest board on 4chan.
>>
>>62683924
White collar usually means higher education and better medicine, which means they've been inundated with advice to focus on heart health for years. It's just kind of how it is.

On top of that, though, here's an extra variable no one is mentioning. Getting buff takes real dedication. You gotta be on it every day for years before it starts to show. Contrast that with cardio - you can go from couch to 5k in a month, right? No need to be dedicated, you just pick it up and put it down as schedule demands. Fall off the wagon for a few months? No big deal, go for 3 runs and you'll be back to where you were.
>>
>>62690031
gotta pump those numbers up those are rookie numbers.

I was running 50 miles a week during marathon training.

all these gymlets are afraid of going outside for more than 10 minutes.
>>
>>62683924
Because endurance sports are generally better for overall fitness than strength/combat sports.
>>
>>62684074
My uncle quarter squatted 625 and is an orthopedic surgeon but he’s really smart too
>>
>>62684089
Long distance runner here, this is 100% true
Fuck running
>>
>>62691070
combat sports are endurance sports brainlet

boxing is one of the most aerobically demanding sports in existence
>>
>>62691014
Ran 65 miles last week, running is fucking gay and retarded and makes you skinny fat
>>
>>62691070
Since when? You don't actually think that you're just being a faggot who will not post body.
>>
I was sick of having to think about getting enough calories to keep getting gains and was sick of spending 1-2 hours inside a dreary room surrounded by vain simpletons staring at themselves in the mirror with shitty pop music blaring out of the speakers and worst of all overhearing mind numbing conversations. And steroid users repulse me with their simultaneous insecurity and warped estimations of themselves.

Post run high is real and feels incredible. You get to sweat and be outside and you just feel better throughout the day. Lifting is good for you but I can't believe anything compares to a strong healthy heart and lungs. Plus there are so many goals to work towards. I love rooning lads, the world is my gym. You should give it a go and we can have more generals
>>
>>62690888
Checked and correct.
>>
>>62691192
>wall of text to call lifters insecure
Lol. Post body, sickly retard.
>>
>>62685939
watch norcal cycling on youtube, he talks through his races and what going through his head
>>
>>62684594
Buncha retards in this thread completely forgot you can do cardio and lift.
Seems like a bunch of limp wristed, pencil necked faggots who ride a bike came here to complain
>>
>>62691387
What do you expect from a /pol/ infested board where benching 2pl8 is considered making it
>>
>>62688540
more cope in this thread. women will literally drop all plans they had to come to your house and suck your dick and ask for more if you have a body like >>62684458
>>
>>62684090
>you can wear skinny pants and tight t shirts, which are in style
You are a boomer, these are not in style
>>
>>62691423
>these are not in style
maybe if you're under 20. no one else is wearing that loose shit
>>
>>62684074
Orthos are very much jocks. I'm a paramedic and when going through clinicals we had to do OR. All of the surgery suites had music playing, selected by the surgeon. Most of them had something relaxing, maybe classical, sometimes classic rock. The orthos always had hilarious shit like trap rap or heavy metal. I'll never forget when they were bringing in an ~80 yr old pt to the OR for a knee replacement and "Kill you" by eminem started playing before she was sedated.
>>
>>62691387
>The type of fitness that cycling and running gives you offers you basically no benefits in every-day life
this is the guy you're defending
>>
>>62691006
haha you definitely do not partake in cardiovascular fitness anon

rich people do endurance sports because of the status it entails. I can't afford to ride a pedal bicycle that costs as much as my used car for several hours I should be spending making money.
>>
>>62691525
imagine being so braindead you cant read between the lines
>>
>dyels larping as crypto millionaires: the thread
>>
>>62683924
There's no real social benefit to looking jacked when you are married and rich.

Endurance sports give all the same health benefits and are more social. Going for a long bike ride with a couple friends sounds like a nice day desu. I gotta get into cycling one day.
>>
>>62683924
like most people, they dont necessarily want to look good, they just dont want to be fat. Add to this that most "cant find time" to exercise in the first place, and so the proportion of people who is only seen doing cardio increases.
it isnt necessarily a class thing, you can see that a majority of women and a lot of men who go to the gym end up on the treadmill or bikes, and maybe the man will do bicep curls because thats what he thinks will make him look good.
>>
>>62691656
>All the same health benefits.
Not even close. You and every other casual just accepts this and none of you have any idea.
>>
>>62691014
>gotta pump those numbers up those are rookie numbers.
I hear ya. Would love to get back to my 6min/miles but my Ranger days are behind me. My goal is to return to my old unit standard:
-Load carrier w/45lb plate
-12 miles/ 150 mins.
My body really doesnt enjoy that type of grind anymore. My mind and intestinal fortitude say othwrwise tho.

>t.42yr old
Sua Sponte.
>>
>>62683924
>When you look at the upper-middle class professionals (e.g. doctors, lawyers, academics, bankers) who actually engage in some sort of physical activity, it seems like they drift towards endurance sports (e.g. long-distance running, cycling, triathlons) over strength/combat sports (e.g. powerlifting, bodybuilding, strongman, boxing).
As a banker who lifts and boxes, I think this assumption is probably wrong. However I have found that cardio seems to be better for mental gains, so maybe that’s it.
>>
>>62691561
That's just rich people. There's a ton of middle class white collar workers out there.
>>
>>62691965
>However I have found that cardio seems to be better for mental gains
elaborate on this experience if you can.
>>
>>62684247
This is actually the most salient point in this thread. Nothing strikes fear into the heart of a wagie than being mogged *outside* the workplace. Because their entire mindset is that all the shit they eat from their boss is justified because of the respect their job gives them outside the office. Take that away from a man and he absolutely loses his shit. That's also why hard labourers might beat their wives every week, but white collar workers suddenly snap and set their house on fire with the wife and kids inside.
>>
>>62691192
You have to go back
>>
>>62683924
it's a class thing

also
>he doesn't know about endorphins
i do agree it's retarded to spend 10 hours doing that shit though.
>>
>>62686100
what exercises to improve them?
>>
>>62683924
Asceticism. Protestant ethics etc.
They show they can take pain and hardship.
>>
>>62684577
Stop riding around on the roads with your gay faggot bike you gay office faggot before I run you over with my car.
>>
>>62684564
Lmao the skinny dudes are getting way too pissed about this
>>
>>62690445
Same for me. I overheat quickly.
>>
>>62691656
>There's no real social benefit to looking jacked when you are married and rich.
I’ll treat my wife like a queen. She gets to feast her eyes on this beatiful piece of man flesh.
>>
>>62684511
>fat girls need love too anon
Don't date girls you can't OHP
>>
>>62684247
>>62692478
>A-actually me working a shitty job is a sign of strong willpower and indepency!
Blue collar poorfag cope.
>>
>>62689883
Swimming is nice because it includes upper body, but its also requires a lot of technique, you should take lessons before trying to swim for cardio. Cycling and running are easier to just do.
>>
>>62694081
maybe the most based piece of practical advice I have ever heard on this message board
>>
>>62683924

>when you could devote a fraction of that time to lifting and get far better returns on your investment

No. Natural lifting is the WORST return on investment for your time. If you lift weights to look good and you are natural you are a literal mongoloid. You spend 10 hours a week eating autistic food to look skinnyfat.
>>
>>62683924
I am actually qualified to answer this because I have an elite job.

At a certain level, your job isn't just something you wage at for tendies and weed; it is a career that you put a lot of pride and consideration into. A top-tier, mentally demanding job requires you to optimize for performance. Think of the average wageslave like a guy who plays golf on the weekends and a doctor/banker/lawyer like someone on the PGA Pro Tour. It's an entirely different approach to life.

If you want to be at the top of a competitive field, it takes *relentless* focus and prioritization. Weightlifting is hard. It stresses the body significantly more than cardiovascular training. I find that in my peak busy season at work, I actually have to scale down my weights 20-30% just because I'm subjecting my mind to so much stress. I don't have the CNS bandwidth to lift heavy weights and maintain elite performance at work.

Also, running, triathlons and cycling all have a showy and competitive aspect that definitely resonates with these guys. But primarily it is about conserving mental energy by doing less of the most grueling, taxing workouts and focusing on things that generate more endorphins with less stress.
>>
>all these pretentious answers from cardiopussies
You get to burn a lot of calories over a long period of time while your brain is turned off. Simple as.
>>
>>62684577
i miss harlem hill
>>
>>62694818
That's what I thought too.
It takes fucking effort to lift past novice stage: planning, rest, food... It becomes a lifestyle. I knew a few generals in my life as an example for an elite job, and who the fuck has time for that anymore? At best they train a bit so they pass the pt tests. Training costs the one thing rich people lack, and that's time.
>>
>>62683924
it requires less equipment
has less chance of dramatic injury
its often more sustainable (with their life style)

Being light on your feet via mass cardio is far more helpful at that stage of life, esp if kids are in the equation. But it's not like these guys don't use weights, they just don't sperg out about 4 pl8 DL.
>>
>>62683924
>stupid generalizations
Who the fuck cares why they do it? Just do what you like to do.
Lifting for looks? Looks are feminine trait you fucking faggot. If you're not lifting primarily to get freaky strong you're NGMI. Skinny runners will MOG you simply by virtue of their actual accomplishments.
>>
Imagine a white collar powershitter lmao
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>>62695935
why imagine?
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>>62694818
imagine working so hard that it affects your lifts. i hope you actually make good money anon
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>>62684650
Or y'know lift weights and do actually fun cardio
>>
successful fit people like to roon that's correct. also tennis, golf,
surfing and such. and they used to do team sports back then and now they are all looking down on loser sports fans = average people
>>
>>62696091
kek

Taleb views traders such as himself as blue collar though, even though he is a math phd
>>
>>62684219
>dont need to deal with your wife nagging you
i would rather live like a Diogenes than have to experience something like that.
>>
>>62694101
idgaf about the money
>>
>>62690824
I'm pulling six figures and am relatively functioning adult, but get no pussy. I would however never lifted just to get one.
>>
>>62684564
Holy fuck, why so many negative replies? Is it a samefag? This isn't the /fit/ I knew, keep on liftin brother
>>
Why not do both?

I lift heavy 3 days a week, and bike 12-25 miles 7 days per week due to boredom and nice weather. Ironically I haven’t done any exercise today since I’m trying to eat a tiny bit less and didn’t recover well after boxing last night. I’m technically bulking though so I make sure I’m eating enough to actually put on muscle.

I do a boxing class twice a week on lifting days.

t. eat 3700-4200kcals per day
>>
>>62694818
/thread
>>
>>62684016
I can’t trust a neck surgeon without a neck. Next thing you know your neck is gone
>>
>>62683924
not a doctor but a med student. it's cuz we have a penchant for pain.
>>
>>62694818
>Weightlifting is hard. It stresses the body significantly more than cardiovascular training.
Powerlifting fanfiction
>>
>>62684016
He must drown in all the pussy
>>
>>62693617
This man is so unfit he can't transport himself without the help of an engine powered by dinosaur fuel.
>>
>>62695020

it's really one of the best little climbs in the world. so much competition.
>>
>>62683952
This
>>
>>62683924
Why do blue-collar wagecucks tend to do strength sports over endurance sports?

When you look at the lower-middle class losers (e.g. tradesmen, fast food workers, NEETs, ) who actually engage in some sort of physical activity, it seems like they drift towards strength/combat sports (e.g. powerlifting, bodybuilding, strongman, boxing) over endurance sports (e.g. long-distance running, cycling, triathlons).

What is the reason for this? I have never really understood why someone would devote 3-5 hours of their week to lifting, when you could devote your free time to running and get far better returns on your investment - i.e. having a high VO2max will objectively improve your life in the sense that you will get good cardiovascular health. But with lifting... what do you get by the end of it? People will treat you better? That can be achieved without subjecting yourself to absurdly strenuous training.

Is it a class thing? Is physical dominance necessary for men who are lower down on the social ladder? Whereas being jacked is seen as primitive/unnecessary in the higher echelons of society?
>>
>>62684459
Just cut the sleeves off the suit. EZ fix.
>>
>>62683924
Running is more complex than that. I don't want to write an essay, but here's a couple things to consider. There's a halo effect to being a good runner, because non-runners think it's torture or that they're just physically incapable of doing it. And white collar jobs are social, so people around you will find out about your hobbies and judge you by them. Some might respect you for lifting as well, but it's different. If you tell someone you're in the 1000 lbs club they'll say, "Wow you're strong." If you tell someone you ran a 3 hour marathon they'll say, "Wow you're fucking insane." The other thing about being swole is that some will just judge you for being vain. Fat people/SJWs/etc all exist in white collar jobs and sometimes they're even writing your performance review. Not that I think I've ever met anyone who's scared to lift for fear of reprisal, but it's useful to understand the environment.

Biking is an almost opposite situation, where instead of having to be capable of doing it you just have to be capable of affording it. It's also highly social, instead of grunting in a gym for a couple hours on a Sunday you can go on a beautiful ride through the mountains with friends.
>>
>>62699449
>> The other thing about being swole is that some will just judge you for being vain. Fat people/SJWs/etc all exist in white collar jobs and sometimes they're even writing your performance review. Not that I think I've ever met anyone who's scared to lift for fear of reprisal, but it's useful to understand the environment.

This is an excellent point. NOBODY ever gets judged by work superiors for cycling or running a comical amount, but there is absolutely a negative reaction on occasion to huge lifter bros. Imagine if your yoked and some DYEL is your boss and he secretly seethes at your body or the female attention you receive. You don't want that in a professional enviroment
>>
>>62683924
Leanness is more sought after or coveted in those professions than "brutish" strength and muscles. Thats it.
>>
I think they are attracted to the mental aspect of endurance sports as well as cardiovascular benefits and weight loss.
>>
I think you are all overthinking it.

Running and cycling are normie exercises. Normies who have good jobs are more likely to exercise as well.
>>
>>62699545
cycling is not normie and it has a pretty high barrier of entry

matter of fact lifting is way more normie
>>
>>62699545
Okay Mr. Neurodivergent, if lifting is some kind of floor-shitting truNEET secret club then riddle me this. Why is it I see thots every day lifting at the gym? Why is it that I haven't seen a single thot at the 400m track that's a 5 minute walk away?
>>
>>62691446
>I'll never forget when they were bringing in an ~80 yr old pt to the OR for a knee replacement and "Kill you" by eminem started playing before she was sedated.

Topkek I have new respect for based orthopedic surgeons and now I'm wondering what the Jew who repaired my Achilles tendon had on his playlist.
>>
>>62690184
The only benefit swimming has over other sports is how easy it is on the joints and the lack of sweatiness. The whole "uses the entire body's musculature" is very overrated IMO, you will get more back and shoulder gains from a half year of lifting than you would from a decade of swimming. Running/jogging is the king of heart health and calories burned per minute. I love swimming and its the only form of cardio I will do, but I think it's glamourized too much mostly because elite swimmers have great bodies and how exhausted the average non-swimmer gets while swimming since they are extremely inefficient moving through water.
>>
>>62690184
>It’s extremely easy on the joints,
Implodes your shoulders just like running explodes your knees

>forces proper and steady breathing,
There's nothing proper or steady about forcing yourself into hypoxia to only breath every 3/5/7 strokes

>involves the most energy per unit distance,
And the lowest distance per time

>and uses the entire body’s musculature.
Walking also does, no one cares
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>>62684016
No way that my man here is a head & neck oncologic surgeon, that is the funniest thing i
I have seen all day
>>
>>62684016
when you need to put your job title as in your nickname in social media...
>>
>>62700539
well his instagram is mostly professional stuff like videos of his procedures etc
>>
>>62683924
They're effeminate
>>
>>62700653
Case and point. Look at this >>62683992
loser using literally the same argument of "I don't want to get big" as an excuse to not have a basic level of muscle mass and strength
>>
>>62683924
I think it’s about a more ascetic aesthetic, self denial and controlling your emotions and all of that. Screaming and throwing weight around seems like too much emotion for some of these people.

Of course, it could always just be fashion, which is to say they do the one thing because lower class people do the other thing, without much other reason to it.
>>
this thread is full of lookist scum
lifting for women = you are not going to make it
>>
>>62700653
Says the insecure beta who thinks big muscles to pick up women laughing at you with my girl rn
>>
>>62683924
In my experience, running has more benefits for the brain than lifting does, though I do both.

Also, being big and muscular is considered lower class by the upper class.
It's something that grunts who carry your furniture are supposed to do.
I don't agree with it, but that's how it's viewed.
>>
>>62699226
>>62683924
I work in a lumberyard, it's supposed to be a self service forklift operator job but it really isn't. So essentially I'm lifting heavy lumber for most of the day, as such weightlifting definitely helped me alot especially when I first started. Primarily because, well I already lift weights as a hobby. All the walking around everyday at work kills my legs (about 7-10 miles a day) so squats are much harder but my overhead press and overall grip strength has gone up greatly. Half the guys that I work with lift as well
>>
>>62694101
Nice try faggot, I'm a freelance codemonkey.
>>
>>62684219
>dont need to deal with your wife nagging you.
No wonder you're coping so hard
>>
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something something
sciency comment referencing study on rats that shows activity enhances brain function and cardio beats resistance training due to intensity and duration
something something

didn't save the paper, must have been more than a year ago that people spammed it here to BTFO meatheads
>>
>>62683924
It’s mostly cope/ the way they grew up. You had to get a top 1% lsat to get into my law school if you weren’t a nigger and my classmates reflected that. It takes a lot of studying to make it these days and for whatever reason the studious intelligent phenotype generally does not seem to be well suited to building muscle. This is compounded by the fact that most of them spent their school years actually studying and not playing sports/lifting. But they do tend to have persistent, hard working personalities and this can lend itself quite well to success in endurance sports regardless of natural talent
>>
>>62690184
Feel like the joint think is kind of a meme, at least for shoulders. There’s no impact which is great but plenty of swimmers have fucked up shoulders and the last time I had a bad shoulder is when I swam a lot. Hurt the worst during breaststroke for some reason
>>
>>62699854
>And the lowest distance per time
what does distance matter when you're not trying to go anywhere in particular
>>
>>62683924
I cycle to show off my tight, cute butt in my skin suite to make females horny and make straight dudes seethe. Besides, cycling fast is fun and being in nature surrounded with green plants and cute animals is really relaxing on the mind.
>>
gyms are pretty shitty environments to be in
endurance sports lets you get out in nature, which if you're in a boring office job thats what you dream about a lot
>>
>>62683924
because endurance sports are easier and require far less discipline
>>
>>62702639
You never touched a bike, ever.
Why don't you join the TDF then, retard?
>>
>>62694818
>maintain elite performance at work.

Maintain elite performance pushing paper like a gay nigger cattle wagie while your boss commands you around, am I right?
>>
>>62702627
Spoken like a gay nerd. Cope more you weak white nigger.
>>
>>62703392
Making dudes seethe is fun, tihi!
>>
>>62702639

On what world does a sport requiring hours of uninterrupted focus require more discipline than a sport requiring less than 60 seconds of focus at a time?
>>
>>62689183
>in the real world, the frail cyclist gets the girl.
>>
>>62684219
+1
>>
>>62699449
>There's a halo effect to being a good runner,
no there is not. lmao. There is an actual halo effect to having some muscle and being jacked
>>
>>62699498
>Imagine if your yoked and some DYEL is your boss and he secretly seethes at your body or the female attention you receive. You don't want that in a professional enviroment
DING DING DING!!!
>>
>>62702639
Then why do 90% of /fit/izens cry how difficult and boring cardio is?
>>
>>62683924
Because they are psychos and you can’t strength train 4 hours a day unless you roid.
A lot of these guys are workaholics. The whole point is to spend more time doing bullshit so endurance sports are perfect. You think their time in the office is productive? They could literally work 30% as long as they do and achieve the exact same results but they are psychos who can’t sit still with themselves for even a moment so they make everything take 4x as long with constant meetings, presentations, emails, and busy work that accomplishes nothing.
They are like hamsters. They need to spin the wheel or they spaz and start ripping their hair out. You should feel bad for these people because there are demons nipping at their heels all day every day. When they go on vacation they don’t even relax for a moment. They make sure each trip has a massive itinerary and try to maximize all the tourist traps they can in a week. They are ticking boxes and marking off achievements even on vacation.
>>
>>62684057
>Your average joe doing endurance as a hobby isn't going to go skeley mode.
The average Joe’s that run in my town look like they literally never worked out in their life. Running miles and miles does nothing for your aesthetics. Most of them have pot bellies and are skinnyfat even running at a decent pace for 5 miles a day.
The human body is just too efficient at running. Any fat boomer can train for and run a marathon in like 6 months.
>>
>>62684247
>>62692478
>Because most white-collar men dislike ( or perhaps fear) direct confrontation. To work in the white collar fields, you need an obedient and submissive personality to endure the daily task. And that affects the mindset.
Retard alert.

Half of my jobs is bullying suppliers and twisting their arms. Being professionally confrontational is the name of the game in modern America.
>>
>>62684074
It’s true. Most go into it because they’re basically never dealing with sick patients. It’s more like carpentry than medicine. Cut here, saw there, screw there, fixed. None of this managing medications, diagnosing obscure illnesses, blood work etc. they leave that to the hospitalists.
>>
>>62684329
Lmao never considered that
>>
>>62684564
Lol you absolutely demolished the cardiolets look at all the (You)’s
>>
>>62704687
We simply acknowledge that for the vast majority of posters here, excessive cario(more than 3 45 min sessions a week) is a complete waste of time.
We want to look good and be healthy. Once you go past 3 sessions of around 45 min you see rapidly diminishing returns in terms of cardio health. Yeah if you train a lot harder you can increase your vO2Max or whatever but it’s not really gonna help you live any longer, just be better at certain endurance based sports for a while while you’re young.
Since we aren’t trying to be competitive 10k runners, there is no point. 3 days a week, 45 minutes. That’s the limit that most people here will ever need to accomplish their goals.
>>
>>62704828
>hospitalist diagnosing rare illnesses
This isn’t House. They either diagnose common illnesses like diabetes or misdiagnose a rare illness as something else 90% of the time
>>
>>62704758
Accurate take
>>
>>62683992
Kubo, please
>>
>>62691446
man i havent heard that song in ages.
im playing it now lol thanks for your comment
"BITCH IM GONNA KILL YOU!" lmao
>>
>>62691446
after listening to it for 20 seconds i turned it off realizing why i dont listen to nigger rap anymore.
still got a laugh out of it though
>>
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>>62684403
Kinda irrelevant since Robert Förstemann is a sprinter not a long distance cyclists. and if you've ever seen a sprinter their fucking quads are insanely big.

>pic related
>>
>>62692691
my father is the guy who spends 10 hours doing that shit.
all my life it was him working as an md in the er and then cycling for many hours.
he wouldnt listen to anything while cycling either.
imagine how much idle time is wasted in this effort over the course of 2 to 3 decades.
it really boggles the mind and i do not want to replicate that with my own family.
was he a provider? yes.
strong father figure? no.
everything is relative but my assessment is correct.
>>
>>62707809
Robert is an ACTUAL genetic freak, he has that myostatin inhibitor or whatever the fuck it's called gene. he's far bigger than every other athlete doing the same or similar things. normal people don't get like that from doing what he does.
>>
>>62683952
Boom. Effective bait was very effective.
>>
>>62696254
poor sucker probably works 40 to 80 hours a week and then needs extra hours mindlessly cycling which bumps the total hour expenditure up to perhaps 100 hours a week.
this is the life my father lived and i want know part of it.
>>
>>62699449
i think this comment is the most valuable of this thread.
in a world of dyel upper class swpl types you put off the message that you are not one of them.
not exactly... but you get what i mean.
tragic that this is the case but i believe you are correct in your assessment.
>>
>>62699498
this
>>
>>62703937
this
>>
>>62688493
>Never seen any compelling evidence for this.
You've fucking proved it there with that statement. Good work anon. Anything else you don't know about that doesn't exist?
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>>62688540
Spotted the virgin who's never had a mire.
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>>62684458
I'm not even gay and I'm turned on.
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>>62707933
*no
whoops
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>>62685823
Your job sounds fucked.
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>>62691446
>"Kill you" by eminem started playing before she was sedated.
Keked hard
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>>62683924
I work in banking/high finance (not on the street but with them on a daily basis).

I lift 3-5 days a week and try do do some form of cardio once during the work week and cycling on the weekends.
I dont do cycling for the sport, I just like to bike around my area and see new things. Its a great way to unwind.
Also a lot of people i know on the street are regular gymrats (lots of former d1 athletes).
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>>62699498
If your job forces you be disgusting and have poor health then it's time to quit. Also, if you play it right being jacked works to advantage as you are contrast. When you're jacked and super refined in manner then it makes you positively standout and halo out.
>>
I think it’s pretty simple. White collar jobs have you inside all day so you want to get outside for your workout. You’re also generally dealing with long term goals and tasks. Lots of slow building and knocking things away piece by piece. Take that mindset and you can be a decent distance runner or biker.
Throw in the bad knees so they have to go all in on bikes. They can nerd out on a 5-10k bike instead of spending 50-100k on a sports car. It’s attainable to anyone with a family and other expenses. Lots to talk about with other white collar bikers
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>>62684247
>t. unemployed dyel hamplanet from mommy's basement
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>>62683924
>it seems like they drift towards endurance sports (e.g. long-distance running, cycling, triathlons)
Progress can be tracked very easily with those. You don't have to worry much about the form. Improved running time is just an improved running time. It's different when you load up weights and end up doing lifts with worse form. Powerlifting isn't as clear if you're doing it on your own.
That and also added factor of it being meditative. You can "clear your head" more easily with cardio. At least that's what I've found.

>I have never really understood why someone would devote 10-20 hours of their week to running, when you could devote a fraction of that time to lifting and get far better returns on your investment
They may just be interesting in running. I don't think aesthetics are the point in cardio sports. They can help with maintaining weight and health, but that's about it. Swimming can help more with looking more aesthetic, but only if you supplement it with other dryland exercise. Considering how much you need to swim to get those results, I don't think body is a goal with swimmers either.

>i.e. being jacked will objectively improve your life in the sense that people will treat you better
That doesn't have to be the case. There are plenty of "upper-middle class professionals" that get treated well due to their career position. Regardless of whether they are jacked or not.

>Good cardiovascular health? That can be achieved without subjecting yourself to absurdly long endurance events.
It's more of a byproduct if you're looking at long-distance regular runners.

>Is being jacked seen as primitive/unnecessary in the higher echelons of society?
It's seen as "not necessary".

>Whereas physical dominance is more necessary for men who are lower down on the social ladder?
Maybe, I wouldn't make it such a class thing though. If you have access to gyms and sports clubs, you can do whatever you want.

>>62683995
Pretty much.
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>>62699763
>The whole "uses the entire body's musculature" is very overrated IMO
There's no other form of cardio that will have you work against such resistance with your full body.
The point is not in gains. It's in being able to move through the water smoothly and quickly.

>I think it's glamourized too much mostly because elite swimmers have great bodies
It's not as glamorised in my country. People often take it up because it's easy to be lazy in the water and not do the work. Most people swim with poor form because it takes time to get the technique right, let alone add stamina and cardio so that you can make a real workout out of swimming.
It's my favourite sport though.
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>>62683924
It's 100% a class thing. It's a way to cement group cohesion between upper middle class suburbanites.
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simple : people who lift have something to prove, mainly working class males who are very horny.


if you are in a good job then this is completely unnecessary. your status is in your job. people of the higher classes value intellect not being jacked.
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smartest man in america is a lifter

>During elementary school, Langan repeatedly skipped grades, and was bullied by his peers. He claims to have been beaten by his stepfather, Jack Langan, who denies this.[1][4] At age 12, Langan began weight training, which he says was motivated by the desire to fight back against bullies.[3][7]:92 He eventually ejected his stepfather from the household.[3][7]:92
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>>62684541
Thats insanely high heart-rate for cycling unless you went really hard.
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>>62702639
Endurance sports are a lot more masochistic than lifting or explosive training.
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>>62709546
>There's no other form of cardio that will have you work against such resistance with your full body.
rowing
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>>62684089
Man, I know a guy who is a full on rooner. He roons and he roons, 15km apparently but he´s skinnyfat af and he struggles with women constantly. His Tinder dates always go to shit, sometimes because his housemate cucks him. He brings girls back to his house and his ripped, charismatic housemate charms his dates and makes him seethe. It´s sitcom shit.

Unadulterated rooning is something I can´t get on board with. I am all for endurance but a man needs muscle.
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I'm a relative oldfag (33) in a white collar profession (healthcare/tech).

As you get older, bodybuilding/strength sports don't really pay off in your lifestyle. You're not attracting people based on your physique.

Having a good career, interesting hobbies, dressing well go a lot farther than having sub 14% bodyfat (also as you get older, keeping the weight off gets more difficult, so its effort vs. gain).

Now, both bi and single after getting divorced, so it's nice to be /fit/ to get girls and twinks off of dating apps, but if i was in a long term monogamous partnership, the amount of work to stay super /fit/ just isn't really worth it, so people get into other stuff (Squash, biking, running etc.)
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>>62711258
wow a literal faggot
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>>62702639
Lifting: move weights up and down for 20 seconds, rest five minutes, do that 3 times a week
Endurance: bike/run your ass off for 15+ hours a week, including tough intervals that make you beg for mercy
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>Many people find lifting to be boring compared to outdoor cardio
>Lifting is associated with dumb meatheads
>Lifting is about focus while cardio is about turning off your mind
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>>62684074
orthos are dog cunts suffering from debilitating god complexes
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>>62683924
>Is being jacked seen as primitive/unnecessary in the higher echelons of society
Yes, there's an element of that. Being big signals being "tough" whereas being lean signals health/longevity/discipline.

Also endurance sports are better for thinking and solving stress.
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>>62711258
38 year old divorced bifag here lol, but yeah this is right. Except your competition also diminishes as you age, half of the guys who were chads in their 20s are now fat. So you don't need to be super /fit/ to be above average.
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>>62683924
The aesthetics of endurance sports are more elegant. Swimming, tennis, cycling are a few examples I can think of off the top of my head.
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Low testosterone cuckolds. They just don't have the competitive instinct to want to be masculine
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>>62699763
This. Swimmers don't hsve great bodies because they swim. Wide shoulderd lanklets are good at swimming and make it far in the sport. That's the ideal in females eyes
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>>62699763
>you will get more back and shoulder gains from a half year of lifting than you would from a decade of swimming.
Yes, but swimming isn't really about "gains", it's about endurance.





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