Let me start, saying this guy wasn't Magneto was retarded
Saying he was magneto was retarded because we had an issue from his pov and he was nothing like a crazy terrorist that morrison thought magneto was
>>122179886Didn't it not make sense for him to be Magneto in the first place?
>>122179934But Magneto is a crazy terrorist
>>122179886To this day I'm convinced that retcon and House of M was motivated more by Quesada being butthurt over Morrison leaving to go back to DC and the rocky relationship Morrison had with Marvel (he'd turn in scripts for New X-Men as last minute as he could get away with to avoid editorial mucking things up). His reasoning for doing it (too many mutants, I don't like mutants as an easy origin for powers) has always been the flimsiest of his three genies.
>>122179934Magneto was literally a crazy terrorist at the time. People who say "Magneto wouldn't do that shit in Planet X" ignore how Magneto acted just prior to Planet X. Remember the shit he tried to pull in Fatal Attractions and Magneto War? Magneto wasn't this nice, kind, old man in the 90s, he was back to being his old genocidal self due to the popularity of the cartoon. Morrison just built off that in a natural way, Magneto was already angry during this period and having 16 million Genoshans die at the hands of a Trask Sentinel wouldn't cheer him up. Not to mention that Planet X was designed to this grand Magneto story. This was supposed to be his last hurrah of villainy. Taking this away from him means that Magneto was been relatively heroic for the last 20ish years. Also Xorn is a literal fucking star, he shouldn't look like Magneto when he takes off his helmet. It doesn't any sense for him to be Xorn since Xorn doesn't have a face, he wouldn't be even similar to Magneto in appearance. Despite the hackery of Bendis, he gave the best Xorneto retcon. He said that Magneto truly died in Genosha and Wanda subconsiously ressurected him, thus explaining his decaying mental state. The Xorn twins are just creations of Wanda's reality altering as a possible attempt to fix the mistakes of zombie Magneto in Planet X
>>122179886it never made any fucking sense for him to be Magneto in the first place. How does his powers give him ANY of Xorn's abilities? Morrison's an idiot>>122180093Morrison never understood the X-Men, hell he never understood Marvel at all, or probably he just didn't want to. Quesada probably is to blame somewhat for the X-Men run, it's likely he just didn't like Morrison as a person, their personalities seem like they would clash.
>>122180093Having a large mutant population was actually pretty interesting because it may have allowed us to see mutant sub culture. We saw that mutant bands, clothes, reality shows, etc all existed and it was interesting to see mutants become this slightly more explored and realistic minority group with their own lives. House of M took that away and gave us the Decimation era(which I love), but I still wish we got to see more of the culture of mutants before they regulated to just being guys with powers again. Quesada was definitely afraid of the growth of mutants and the decline of humanity so he got rid of them, he was the X-Men's most dangerous Sentinel
>>122180249Xorn barely used his power and there's always an explanation on why he did, Morrison had always planned on Xorn being Magneto. >Xorn's solar controlMagneto's manipulation of the electromagnetic spectrum>Xorn's healing of X-MenMagneto didn't heal them, he just crushed the metallic nanosentinels that were killing them>Xorn's healing of Xavier's spineMagneto was simply glueing the fractured spine together using the nanosentinels>Xorn's star faceMagneto's manipulation of energy
Here's another rage-inducing, retarded retcon
So Morrison has no plans to go one more time with Marvel?
>>122180608He really disliked the Marvel editors, he maybe would have stayed had they not breathed down his neck all the time. I feel like Mandrakk was probably based on Quesada
>>122180496And likely a permanent one.
>>122179886Xorn being Magneto was the absolute worst dumbfuck twist in the first place. At least a retcon let them salvage a decent character.
>>122180996no, the retcon turned it from "this is sorta dumb" to "how the fuck does this even work, who are these people, what is even going on"
Let's continue, saying Moira's a mutant is retarded, it totally destroyed the point of this character
>>122180290It wrecked X-Men as a superhero book, made most of their villains no longer work as villains, something Morrison's Magneto story is explicitly about, and turned the franchise into something less commercial and with less mass appeal. Pushed to it's natural ends, it also unbalances the entire rest of Marvel in a way the other books can't ignore, and the people writing Spider-Man, Hulk, Avengers, etc shouldn't be getting forced to play along with something the X-books are doing that destroys any pretence at Marvel Earth resembling real Earth. Morrison himself didn't really explore any of his ideas in detail, he just kept saying "mutant culture" was a thing.Quesada wasn't wrong, but his solutions as to how to fix things was retarded, and the X-books have been equally retarded in treating the Morrison status quo as the goal they want to get back to, rather than a mistake they need to forget.
>>122180496>Here's another rage-inducing, retarded retconThat's actually the undoing of a retcon that had lasted for years despite never doing any good.
>>122180228No he wasn't, literally week after the reveal you have Excalibur issue written by Claremont disputing that. also tl;dr
> claremont and the x-office spend decades growing magneto and making him a complex anti-villain to having some redemption> morrison: LUL HE'S CRAZY TERRORIST AND FLIPS THE POLES AND GIVES JEAN A STROKEliterally the worst thing morrison ever did on the run, makes it an irredeemable run
>>122180398literally in the first appearance of xorn, he opens the masks and emits a massive blast. Explain that faggot
>>122180996/thread, we can go now, nothing to see here
>>122181288you have 4chan on orgy island, Erik?
>>122181270I came to the conclusion that morrison was never good. I've re-read his Animal Man and Doom Patrol and he kinda ruined both characters to the point that they are either unusable, or became a very niche characters that cannot sell no matter what
>>122181275It was a cum blast, Magneto did nofap for years to prepare this one.
>>122181329yeah, since holocaust
>>122181321are the cuckoos free?
>>122181391they always are, but be careful, they might mindfuck you real hard
>>122181405no pain no gain
>>122181301morrison was good, it's just that his x-run is very overrated and morrison-isms don't really fit the x-world> 2ndary mutations/cat beast cheapens concept of mutation. complete genetic dice roll. can have godlike abilities like storm or be useless morlock faggot. have to write tragic characters like rogue who can't touch or nightcrawler who has both a cool powerset but born to look like a demon> NOT ANY MORE, WRITERS CAN INVENT SECONDARY ASSPULLS LUL> magneto stuff, see other post> cassandra nova bullshit. the x-men through sheer dumb luck have their adventures with the shi'ar and xavier beds lilandra, and they have the occasional space adventures> NOT ANY MORE, XAVIER HAD AN EVIL SHI'AR PARASITE THAT HE KILLED IN THE WOMB. THE UNIVERSE IS SMALLER NOW> captain america's creation cast a gigantic shadow on the world and other nations tried their own program to replicate their own version of it but different, such as canada> NOT ANY MORE, IT'S ALL UNDER THE WEAPON PLUS PROGRAM AND WOLVERINE IS JUST ATTEMPT # 9 AT CAP. YOUR UNIVERSE IS SMALLER NOW> mutants are the future and homo sapiens superior will soon become dominant on earth. all marvel futures acknowledge this> NOT ANY MORE, GENOSHAN GENOCIDE. also, 16 million mutants can't take down a fucking 3 headed sentinel> influence still felt as bendis NO MORE MUTANTS again after the x-office just recovers from it> the multiple world-saving x-men can't stop a fucking student protest and kid omega> john sublime is a fucking sentient bacteria from billions of years ago. somehow magneto becomes addicted to drugs because plot> scott cheats on emma because asspull out of characterization, which didn't need to happen> jean and wolverine don't realize asteroid fucking m, their oldest foe's famous base> jean becomes god tier phoenix, magneto still manages to kill her with an emp to her brain> somehow allows wolverine close enough to decapitate him
>>122180929Eventually, in a decade or so, the current regime/writers will be supplanted with fans of the Dadneto era, and they in turn will one day be supplanted by fans of the current status-quo.
>>122179934>we had an issue from his povIt was an issue where he recounted a story to Xavier. It was probably all bullshit.
Has he ever had meaningful interaction with High Evolutionary in any backstories? Currently his characterization seems unswayed by the current retcon that Wanda The Pretender is not his daughter anymore. Pietro too.
It's not one of the big ones but it still pissed me the hell off
>>122181484The worst part about secondary mutations is their reasons for existing are wanting to radically alter the design of Beast for no good reason and Morrison being denied the use of Colossus so he replaced him with Emma Frost of all people.>>122182666Did any of that actually make it into wider canon or is it just some trivia-tier shit that no one cares enough about to retcon?
>>122182713>Did any of that actually make it into wider canonIt did. Her mother being a Kree is canon even though it's liquid bullshit.The editorial mandate hurts: Carol can't have gotten her powers from a man, of course...
>>122182894She didn't get her powers from a man, she got them from the Psyche-Magnitron.
>>122182935ssshhh, anon, this is culture war
>>122180496>No familyWhat about Polaris?
>>122182977Strictly speaking it was an interaction between the Psyche-Magnitron, Mar-Vell, and the Nega Bands.
>>122183021Also a retcon, amazingly.
>>122182935No. The psyche-magnitron just wrote Mar-Vell's DNA and memories into hers. Remember it could only manifest Kree technology, not create super-humans, and that she had his memories.The Nega-Bands, yes, those were Kree technology (something people tend to forget, I think) and their power was also imprinted on her (another thing people either don't remember or forget: the Nega-Bands get their power from starlight... so that is where she gets hers, too).But in the final analysis she got the powers because Yon-Rogg abducted her to draw Mar-Vell to him for his revenge - and because Mar-Vell held her in his arms to save her when the Magnitron blew. It's all very masculine.>>122182977A war I did not start and have no wish to fight in.
>>122183031The X Office: Not Even Once
>>122179886The original story of Aunt May passing away and revealing she always knew Peter was Spiderman instead being some actress or something.
>>122182455>fans of the current status-quo.So...sociopaths?
>>1221826661. Asexual doesn't mean aromantic2. That retcon was more hilarious and pointless than bad.
>>122183083>1. Asexual doesn't mean aromanticpossibly, but she still would not fuck him
>>122183086>but she still would not fuck himIt's like you've never met another sentient being. Of course she would. Asexual also doesn't mean incapable of boning. Plenty of asexuals had kids.
>>122183115so what, asexual just means "does not like to get laid more than once every other year?"
>>122183083Are you seriously arguing that this idiotic comic is not that bad, anon?
>>122181301Maybe you just have shit taste.
>>122183021Polaris needs to have her killing her parents be retconned. Mutant power manifestations being deadly is stupid.>>122183130Asexual means lack of sexual attraction and/or sex drive. It doesn't mean you have no functioning sex organs or are incapable of saying yes to a partner.
>>122183141Carol needs the Rogue Treatment again, god
Lockjaw not being an Inhuman.
>>122183207>In Thing #3, writer John Byrne had Lockjaw himself reveal he possesses the ability to talk, as well as the fact that he's an Inhuman whose appearance was deformed to that of a dog due to exposure to Terrigen Mists. Apparently, many people at Marvel hated the idea, and said revelation was retconned in X-Factor #71, when Quicksilver disclosed to Multiple Man that the instance of the revelation was a prank meant for The Thing carried out by Karnak and Gorgon, who used the dog's antenna as a high-powered transmitter to make it seem as if he talked.
>>122183041I think if I ever got any clout at Marvel I'd retcon Polaris into not being a mutant and see if anyone notices.
>>122183238The X-Office didn't even notice they've got Broo running around on Krakoa even though that makes literally no sense.
>>122183203That was retcon in the first place and undone in just f ew years. >this is a dog and everyone treats him as such>actually it's a guy who can talk nobody ever acknowledged itIt was dumb, triton already served as the downside of terrigen character and nobody even used in the first appearances lockjaw had before it got retconned. As dumb as karnak ventriloquism is, lockjaw just not feeling like talking is worst.
>>122180228>Despite the hackery of Bendis, he gave the best Xorneto retcon. He said that Magneto truly died in Genosha and Wanda subconsiously ressurected him, thus explaining his decaying mental state. The Xorn twins are just creations of Wanda's reality altering as a possible attempt to fix the mistakes of zombie Magneto in Planet XThe fact that you think this is good is really telling about your taste.
>>122183257Retcons have to counter established information. Dogs can't teleport and shitty Inhuman forms are a fucking thing. A twist isn't a fucking retcon.
>>122181242>despite never doing any good.t.dumb wandafag
>>122181301Morrison's doom patrol was just goodHis Animal Man did a great job establishing the character but the ending everyone jerks off is fucking shit and sucks hard. It's literally all hype and build up to end on a wet fart. Moore he ain't, that's for sure. Still better than Gaiman at least
How many first species has Marvel had already? Cosmology retcons are bad and they just need to fucking stop. Fuck's sake there are two different groups of beings called Gardeners that seed life throughout the universe cause Marvel are both unimaginative and forgetful.
>>122183232That's a good retcon since it's fucking stupid.
>>122183275It goes against the fact that they say he is a dog and treat him like a dog. >Dogs can't teleport The inhumans are known for their gentic experimentation. They made the alpha primitives, terrigen, and clone bodies that your mind can transfer into upon death. Making a dog teleport isn't a high bar.
>>122183324>Making a dog teleport isn't a high bar.Then why don't all Inhumans have teleporting dogs? That shit's useful as fuck.
>>122183346Cause the royal family suck and don't want to give everyone teleporting dogs for that reason
>>122183257>Karnak's idea of a prank is to force someone doubt their assumptions of realityThat sounds completely in character. >>122183250The best part is that it wouldn't even contradict her own history. Polaris doesn't naturally have superpowers.
>>122183115because asexuality doesn't exist.
>>122183346Lockjaw is the sci-fi equivalent of an expensive purebred. He's basically a one-off vanity piece for the royal family.
>>122183303This one is infuriatingNot only does it take away the point that he was a decent guy down on his luck who broke due to tragedy, it also takes away the uncertainty about the story itself.3 jokers was the worst fucking idea.
>>122183346>have a secret city>giving people a means to escape and blow your coverNah
>>122180228>he was back to being his old genocidal self due to the popularity of the cartoon.No, he was back to his old genocidal self the second Claremont left the X-Books.
>>122183275The big thing is how they treated him. They don't treat rest of those freaks any less than Inhuman. Besides iirc they had already established that freaky inhuman civilian thing humans are the weird ones when bruce banner came to town.
>>122183303i don't really mind this one, it doesn't really change anything
>>122183284>>122180496>Rage inducing retarded retconPeople who are "Angry" at this are always people who see Pietro and Wanda as accessories to Magneto and see this Retcon as an attack on him.The reality is the relationship did nothing, Eric didn't give a shit about either of them unless he needed stuff to do.
>>122183357>Polaris doesn't naturally have superpowers.Because she was depowered during M-Day and repowered by Apoc's technology?Because she's died and been rezzed in X-Factor already, so she should have her original powerset back.
>>122183388>Not only does it take away the point that he was a decent guy down on his luck who broke due to tragedy,bruce knowing joker's name was before doesn't mean much when joker is just joker after his accident.having three of them is retarded, but i get the idea of trying to explain the changes in personality
X-gene carriers aren't mutants and the Phoenix is Thor's mother. Marvel doubled up on stupid mutant retcons recently.
>>122183500Actually they've done the main mutants aren't mutants thing TWICE now counting Ultimate Marvel. I don't know who keeps suggesting this bullshit at Marvel but doing so should be a fireable offense.
Were the Inhuman, magic mutant, Deviant Skrulls a retcon? I feel like this had to conflict with something.
>>122183500>Phoenix is Thor's motherAARON!But seriously, what the fuck? I know the story is still going on but it makes zero sense. Was this why that Empyre tie in with Gaea was canned? It's just so dumb dumb.
>>122183548I'm not sure if it conflicts with something but they have way too much shit going on.
>>122183469No, in Polaris' origin story she is given superpowers by the Genetic Amplifier due to having a dormant X-gene. It'd be a simple matter of saying that she never had an X-gene and the Genetic Amplifier gave her powers. It'd also fit neatly because Magneto has long since canonically possessed the tech to artificially induce superpowers and mutations. It could also be used to explain why Polaris has had three powersets over her existence.
>>122183608>Three PowersetsI only know the magnetism, what others?
>>122180290>>122181223the easy solution is to have a 100-200 thousand mutants world wide. That would be around 10000 mutants in the USA.Enough to establish a subculture and make them a realistic minority group, but small enough that most people can go their entire lives without ever meeting a mutant, so books can ignore mutants if they want to.
>>122183629Phallic Gigantism and Testicular Fortitude
>>122183631>Enough to establish a subcultureM8, that's only a couple hundred mutants in NYC.
>>122181301Morrison focuses too much on writing characters as symbols, and on his meta narrative. So villains must be absolute evil, heroes are absolute good, characters are not real characters, they aren't defined by their personality or stories, thus they can't have the complexities of real people, but are defined by what he wants them to represent and symbolize
>>122181484Don't forget the phoenix corps.What the fuck is that.Why would you turn a mystical-transcendent concept into a police academy/nova corps ripoff>can have godlike abilities like storm or be useless morlock faggotThis is one thing that I've always disliked about the x-men. Mutations that make you deformed or weaker than normal already exist in the real world, we call those people diabled and don't build giant robots to genocide them. It's a pointless addiction to the x-mythos.
>>122183083retconning the normal person who acquires special abilities to being special all along and inheriting powers from their great parents is always bad.Well there might be some exceptions but it's extremely rare
>>122183822I just found it funny cause the whole issue read like the writer just found out Superman is an alien and wanted to do the same thing with Carol.
>>122183747Uh, the disabled HAVE faced evil genocide operations IRL, m8.
>>122183500x-gene was dumb to begin with, this is just the natural conclusion of that dumb retcon.Mutants are mutants because they have mutations. Plural, all new and different, not all the same and identical.
>>122183876>Mutants are mutants because they have mutationsThat was never the Marvel definition of mutant and plenty of mutates have mutations, e.g. Spider-Man.
>>122183666>that's only a couple hundred mutants in NYC.Mutants can move to another city and live together. They can form neighborhoods, they can have special bars. It's enough to establish the social aspect, especially since they are going to become more in the future, and everyone knows that
>>122183894>Mutants can move to another city and live togetherWhich defeats the entire fucking purpose of the fucking franchise.The point is supposed to be about gaining acceptance in a world that hates and fears them, NOT FUCKING CITY BUILDING.Every god damn time the franchise focuses on city building, mutants get genocided cause they forgot to fix the whole hates and fears thing.
>>122183861yes, HAVE, in the past, in specific cultures, it's not their eternal status quo.But that wasn't the point. The point is that you don't need a magical x-gene that gives you the power of being deformed. If you want to write a story about disabled people and their hardships write a story about disabled people and their hardships. A story about a bunch of powerful and beautiful "mutants" being sad because a bunch of deformed ans useless "mutants" were killed is jsut silly.
>>122183629After she got her powers stolen by Zaladane (who could stand to show up again and get revamped) she got your standard brick powerset, then later also had emotion manipulation powers.>>122183631>>122183666They should take a page from real world transsexuals. Disproportionately large online and media presence when in reality you're highly unlikely to run across one in your day to day life.>>122183747That's an issue with how being a mutant is handled by the writers. Pretty much everyone boils down to two or three positions on the subject rather than there being a variety and nuance of opinion from both mutants and humans.
>>122183889>That was never the Marvel definition of mutantthat was the definition before the x-gene retcon.Those born with mutations were mutant, those who acquired them later in life were mutates.The x-gene thing was added later and it makes no sense. They are not mutants to begin with, and how does the same gene gives different powers to different people?It also leads to all sort of problems when you start thinking about it. Did the x-gene always exist? Or do people magically all acquire the mutations called x-gene?The current bullshit was the natural conclusion for the introduction of the x-gene.
>>122183923I agree with the fundamental premise that mutations should bare minimum be more useful than not, but I'm fine with them being horrifying in some cases. That you get powers that would keep you alive doesn't mean those powers have to look pretty. An example of a Morlock done right is Marrow.
>>122183915that's why I said there should be only a few thousands of them in the whole of the USA. Not enough to city build, at most they can make a small town, and obviously not everyone will go to live together. A few hundred thousands globally is a good balance to have stories about social aspect, and at the same time not have the mutants completely change the face of the world>gaining acceptance in a world that hates and fears themYou can't really do that if there's only a handful of mutants. And if there's millions of them then they're big enough to city build and make their own nations and don't need to seek acceptance.
>>122183856It's like they decided that Carol should be Marvel's WW, Superman, and Aquaman at the same time.>>122183915It's not city-building, it's a natural outcome of banding together. Though my biggest issue with it is that being a mutant isn't like being gay or of a certain ethnicity, there isn't any singular unifying concept to rally around because the X-gene expresses differently. Mutant would simply be catch-all categorization for several defined subgroups.
>>122183937>They should take a page from real world transsexuals.No they shouldn't . Making mutants a stand in for any specifc minority doesn't work.Mutants represents more generally the concept of diversity and change. It can be adapted to speak about any minority, be it transexxuals, or disabled, or oppressed religious minority, just like billionaires or oppressive minority like in a, apartheid state. But that in different stories. Making the concept itself a stand in for a specific group removes all their potential.But sure, internet allows small groups to contact each other over great distances and create online subcultures.
>>122183608>she is given superpowers by the Genetic Amplifier due to having a dormant X-geneSo it's kind of like how Sage can activate people's X-Gene?
>>122183747>Why would you turn a mystical-transcendent concept into a police academy/nova corps ripoffWhat do you think the nova corps is?
>>122184041I don't understand how you managed to both miss and get what I was going for at the same time. I don't mean make mutants a stand in for transsexuals, I mean have them mirror the actual prevalence of transsexuals compared to how much notice they get within public discourse.
>>122183955>that was the definition before the x-gene retcon.No, no it wasn't.>Those born with mutations were mutant, those who acquired them later in life were mutates.That directly contradicts what you just said. It also contradicts Marvel history since not all mutates have genetic changes and not all mutants got their powers from genetic mutations (you can also get shit like hereditary magical conditions and shit). ALSO also x-gene mutants generally got their powers AT PUBERTY in the first place.ALSO ALSO, mutants are born with the x-gene so I don't even know what you're bitching about. X-gene actually conformed more with that definition of mutants than the original idea which was that atomic testing was turning people into mutants by increasing atmospheric radiation.>Did the x-gene always exist?No. It was introduced by Celestials.>Or do people magically all acquire the mutations called x-gene?I don't even know what you're saying here, but you get your x-gene from one or both parents.>The current bullshit was the natural conclusion for the introduction of the x-gene.Fuck all about introducing the x-gene required making x-genes the DEFAULT. That was fucking stupid and shits all over X-Men lore from top to bottom. No future of humanity, they're actually being outbred. And they can't even honestly call themselves mutants. Homo sapiens is the mutant strain. Evolutionaries and their conflict with the Neos gets fucked too.
>>122183971I mean think about it. There's some guy with dwarfism who receives disability and the pity if not the sympathy of his parents and his community. And another guy with dwarfism due to the x-gene who is abandoned by his parents shunned by his community, has giant robots trying to kill him and a bald guy trying to get him to an orgy island.It's hilariously dumb.
>>122184043Sorta. Modern X-stories tend to gloss over the fact that Mags is a fairly accomplished mad scientist. He's not Sinister-tier or anything, but he's shown a decent level of competency when it comes to genetic alteration and manipulation.
>>122183997>And if there's millions of them then they're big enough to city build and make their own nations and don't need to seek acceptance.But as demonstrated by the repeated genocides, that's a shitty idea.>You can't really do that if there's only a handful of mutants.Which is why only having a handful of mutants is ALSO a shitty idea.It's like you don't understand the point of the franchise. If you just wanted to do stories about people with superpowers, there's a fucking ton of those already.>>122184005>It's not city-building, it's a natural outcome of banding together.Plenty of subgroups in the real world have larger populations than mutants in Marvel and don't try to start their own island nation, m8. Banding together doesn't fucking require secession from one or more countries. It's unnatural as fuck. Nations arise from geographic and cultural ties and political or religious turmoil, none of fucking which applies to mutants, which exist across the fucking globe and have no unifying culture, religion, or political organization until writers started to have them start trying to make those out of pure contrivance instead of natural occurrence.
>>122184118>I mean have them mirror the actual prevalence of transsexuals compared to how much notice they get within public discourse.That's about 46 million worldwide. That's like triple the largest mutant population Marvel's ever had.
>>122184131>No, no it wasn't.yes it was.>hat directly contradicts what you just said. No it doesn't. Mutants were born with a mutation, mutates were mutated later in life.> ALSO ALSO, mutants are born with the x-gene so I don't even know what you're bitching aboutThe existence of the x-gene was a retcon. Before that they were people born with mutations, that generally acquired powers at birth.> X-gene actually conformed more with that definition of mutants No, the x-gene makes much less sense than actual mutations.>No. It was introduced by Celestials.Are you dumb or what? Are you autistic? I'm asking because you're taking things too literally. And the x-gene being introduced by celestials is simply the answer to the question I asked.>Or do people magically all acquire the mutations called x-gene?I'm showing you the path that lead to the current situations. Once writers started asking themselves the question I wrote, they came up with the answers you wrote.>Fuck all about introducing the x-gene required making x-genes the DEFAULT. That was fucking stupid and shits all over X-Men lore from top to bottom. No future of humanity, they're actually being outbred. And they can't even honestly call themselves mutants. Homo sapiens is the mutant strain. Evolutionaries and their conflict with the Neos gets fucked too.Nope If the x-gene was introduced by space aliens millions of years ago, at this point all humans should have it through interbreeding. Then the only logical solution for why only a few have them is that humans mutated and lost the x-gene.
>>122184149It's less dumb when you realize the guy with dwarfism via x-gene is much more likely to father a chick that can toss continents around with her mind.Inactive x-genes exist, obviously, but Marvel's never really been clear on how prevalent they are, and IIRC Sentinels were designed to hunt them down too and writers just forgot all the time.
>>122184213I didn't say anything about secession, just that subcultures inevitably arise out of distinct groups in proximity. I then went on to point out that their shouldn't be a unified "mutant" subculture. To make a comparison, people talk about queer culture, but there is no overarching queer culture. There are a bunch of subcultures centered around queerness but at the end of the day the only time a poor gay man and a rich lesbian are going to share the same cultural space is at a pride parade.
>>122184270>Before that they were people born with mutations, that generally acquired powers at birth.No. It was a puberty thing in the first place and still is to this day. From birth is by far the exception. Do you even read comics? It doesn't sound like you read comics.>If the x-gene was introduced by space aliens millions of years ago, at this point all humans should have it through interbreeding.That's not how genes work you fucking idiot.
>>122184260Back when Morrison killed Genosha the mutant population was given as 32 million worldwide. That would put them at 0.5% of the population given the real world population figure at the time. >>122184318Actually he's not more likely at all. In fact, there are only handful of mutants who have mutant parents or mutant children.
>>122181484>THE UNIVERSE IS SMALLER NOWAre you new to capeshit? Marvel and DC makes retcons like that literally every fucking wednesday of the week. In one story DC has Superboy Prime PUNCHING REALITY so hard that it creates retcons.>also, 16 million mutants can't take down a fucking 3 headed sentinelThe majority of mutants don't have offensive superpowers, they are just total freakshows like Beak or Glob Herman where they are half chicken or their skin is made out of transparent wax. And they are just trying to get through life one day at a time.>somehow magneto becomes addicted to drugs because plotMagneto was wheelchair bound at the time due to Wolverine severing his spine one or two runs before, and he just had his island dumped on by a super sentinel. He needed something to boost his power.>scott cheats on emma because asspull out of characterizationScott and Jeans relation was always stupid (remember when he had a fling with Psylocke, and basically everything related to Madelyne Prior who Scott literally ran out on despite having a child together). And Scott getting together with Emma was the best thing that came out of the whole thing, even Jean sort of admits it in the ending ("Go and live Scott, all I ever did was die on you").>jean and wolverine don't realize asteroid fucking mIt's not like they lived there for months, it's not a stretch that they didn't have the layout of an entire asteroid base memorized.>magneto still manages to kill her with an emp to her brainGod powers don't help you if you can't focus your thoughts.>somehow allows wolverine close enough to decapitate himHe was literally making a monologue about wanting to get killed because it will immortalize him.
>>122183166>It doesn't mean you have no functioning sex organs or are incapable of saying yes to a partner.No, it just means you wouldn't say yes because you'd be completely disinterested.
>>122184337Your original proposal was>Mutants can move to another city and live together. They can form neighborhoods, they can have special bars.And you somehow think giving mutants a population .025%-.05% the size of the LGBT community will fucking facilitate that without the entire country's if not planet's population of mutants fucking off to the same location.That's not a subculture. That's a secession.
>>122184562>.025%-.05% the size of the LGBT community will fucking facilitate thatit will make it possible.>without the entire country's if not planet's population of mutants fucking off to the same location.There's no need for that. There are subcultures smaller than that and they still work. Some mutants will be more isolated, some will be in contact with other mutants and will be in a subculture, in either case they will have to interact and integrate with society.
>>122184430>Actually he's not more likely at all.By virtue of having a confirmed x-gene, he is.>In fact, there are only handful of mutants who have mutant parents or mutant children.All mutants have parents that carried the x-gene. It jus wasn't active. Epigenetics is a fun concept you should learn about.
>>122183861>Uh, the disabled HAVE faced evil genocide operations IRL, m8.Yeah, Spartans threw them off a cliff as babies so they don't have to suffer growing up as retards and second class citizens.Imagine how much better our current society would be if that became a thing.
>>122184559>No, it just means you wouldn't say yes because you'd be completely disinterested.This may in fact shock you, but people have sex with other people because they like the person romantically even when they don't like them sexually.>>122184600>There are subcultures smaller than that and they still work.When your population gets that fucking low subcultures don't pop up just cause of how damn hard it is to meet other people with whom you share a fucking connection. As I previously stated, that's only a few hundred people in NEW YORK CITY. Two mutants would be lucky if they ever meet a mutant they aren't related to in their entire fucking life.You're kidding yourself if you think global subcultures that small exist across.
>>122184576eat a dick mate.
>>122184318>IIRC Sentinels were designed to hunt them down too and writers just forgot all the time.They didn't forget, Sentinels just decided since it's so common in humans, it would be simpler to just take over humanity in general. and then we got Days of Future Past.
>>122184689if that guy isn't Reed he's dead
>>122180012This was discussed in a thread from a day or two ago but the short version is that the reveal only makes sense if you assume that Magneto was 100% committed to the Xorn character 24/7 to the point that his own internal monologues shown to the audience are also in character.Someone did make a good point about how that since his plan involved him infiltrating and tricking the 2 most powerful psychics on the planet it's entirely believable that he would have to be 24/7 dedicated to it even when it's illogical to do so, however to a reader the lack of any foreshadowing of this at all still makes the reveal nonsensical
>>122184604>All mutants have parents that carried the x-gene.Not according to current X-Men continuity. Humans don't have the X-gene, period.>>122184660That's actually not true.
>>122184360>No. It was a puberty thing in the first place and still is to this day.>No. It was a puberty thing in the first place and still is to this day.It seems you are very thick and take things too literally and focus on irrelevant details, so I'm going to be very precise on how I speak from now on so maybe even you can understand.Mutants were those that were born with the mutations that would later on give them power. They already had the potential for those power at birth, but they would, generally, activate at puberty. Mutates instead were born normal humans but their DNA was mutated later in life.Mutant= born with a mutation, Mutate= received a mutation later in life.IRL they would both be called mutants, but it's comics so I'll give mutates a pass.>That's not how genes work you fucking idiot.That's exactly how genes work.The last common ancestor of all humans lived about 100,000 years ago, which means all genes that they had will have passed on to all humans alive today. Unless a mutation caused people to lose those genes. If people had x-genes earlier than 100,000 years ago then all humans alive today should have them. If some humans don't have them then they must have lost them through a mutation.But there's no need to go that far.This explains it rather simply, even you could understand.https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/article/charlemagnes-dna-and-our-universal-royaltyBut the gist of it is>The most recent common ancestor of every European today (except for recent immigrants to the Continent) was someone who lived in Europe in the surprisingly recent past—only about 600 years ago.So, if there were people with x-genes 600 years ago in europe and they passed on their genes by this point all europeans should have x-genes.And the same goes for other races.The only way to explain why x-gene carriers are a minority is that the x-gene is recessive and humans mutated to lose the x-gene.
>>122184682a few hundred people are enough to meet and create a subculture.You're getting angry but the matter of fact is that subcultures with even fewer people already exist.
>>122184838The actual explanation is that the X-gene is comic book bullshit science and trying to ground it in real world genetics is kind of silly considering we're talking about a gene that lets people control the weather.
>>122183431It doesn't but also Bruce knowing the Joker's true identity beforehand makes this particular story pointless in retrospect.
>>122184500Glob Herman's powers are more useful than you'd think what with the whole his outsides are completely inedible, most of him is fairly invulnerable and immune to pain since its just regeneratory wax, and he can light chunks of himself on fire and throw it at people if he wants. He can also tank impacts like a motherfucker. Dude's ugly, not useless.Beak meanwhile can fly and has claws and bird vision.>>122184740>Sentinels just decided since it's so common in humans, it would be simpler to just take over humanity in general. and then we got Days of Future Past.And then the idea was never brought up again despite all the later times Sentinels came up. Any time there's a Sentinel designed to hunt X-gene carriers it should just be murdering random civilians left and right if the x-gene is that common. Dark future Sentinels are too trigger happy and present Sentinels aren't trigger happy enough.>>122184820>Humans don't have the X-gene, period.I think you're thinking of humans hit with the M-Day depowering, not humans generally, since that wouldn't make fucking sense. The X-gene doesn't fucking come from nowhere and Marvel literally just went through the trouble of saying Celestials made all humans x-gene carriers in another fucking book millions of years ago to explain where all the modern carriers got their shit. What in the fuck would be the fucking point in doing that if most modern mutants just spawned randomly?
>>122184838>The last common ancestor of all humans lived about 100,000 years ago, which means all genes that they had will have passed on to all humans alive today.But all humans alive today don't have ALL that ancestors genes.As I stated, you don't seem to have a firm grasp of genetics. The Y chromosome is old as dirt but obviously not all humans have Y chromosomes. A gene being old doesn't mean it's ubiquitous.
>>122184860>a few hundred people are enough to meet and create a subculture.No.>You're getting angry but the matter of fact is that subcultures with even fewer people already exist.Through fucking recruitment or breeding, not randomly distributed minute sections of the population coincidentally meeting each other and building a community out of something they have in common but developed independently. Fuck's sake you have to be able to find other people you have shit in common with to be able to form a subculture with them.
>>122184924I don't know why you're so attached to the x-gene.>is comic book bullshit science and trying to ground it in real world genetics It's not real world genetics though, it's basic mathematical statistics. Of course mutations and genes can't give powers in real life. But if you assume superpowers can exist, then the original explanation for mutants made sense, while the x-gene doesn't, and the current explanations of x-gene carriers being the baseline and humans the mutation makes sense again.
>>122185056>and the current explanations of x-gene carriers being the baseline and humans the mutation makes sense again.In no universe does>small ancient population of x-gene carriers becomes small current population of x-gene carriersMake less sense than>everyone had mutant powers but then the x-gene died out through random mutations and epigenetic deactivations until only a small population was left
>>122184993>But all humans alive today don't have ALL that ancestors genes.because of mutations that caused people to lose those genes.Which brings us back to the point in question. If the x-gene is present in all races, and has existed in humans for more than a few hundred years, then the only explanation for why many humans don't have it is that it's recessive and they lost it through mutation.
>>122185123>In no universe doesit does in a universe where you understand basic math.A small population remains a small population if they don't interbreed with other populations. If they start breeding with them and it goes on long enough then all their descendants should inherit their genes. Unless those are recessive, or they are lost through mutation.>small ancient population of x-gene carriers becomes small current population of x-gene carriersThis makes no sense at all, zero sense, especially when they've existed since the beginning of humanity and are spread through all races and continents. Again, reread the link I posted here>>122184838>https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/article/charlemagnes-dna-and-our-universal-royalty
>>122184936Actually the people hit by M-day were explicitly stated to still have x-genes, just inert ones. It's why Krakoa can give them their powers back. Also Genosha represented a full half of the total mutant population, and had the Acolytes and leftover supertech and military equipment from the Genoshans. The notion that they couldn't defeat one extra large Sentinel, and were completely blindsided by it, is bullshit.
>>122185129>because of mutations that caused people to lose those genes.Actually it's cause you only pass on half your genes to your offspring, dipshit. Humans don't reproduce through cloning. Literally all you need are some people to not have it on half their chromosomes and it won't be universally expressed. If everyone on earth had brown hair and some people had genes for blond hair, you'd still see blonds pop up in the next generation.And originally not everyone had an x-gene when they were introduced to humanity. That's a recent, stupid, change. SOME humans got x-genes and SOME humans retained them into the modern day.
>>122185224You're a fucking idiot.See>>122185272
>>122183232>KarnakI can see that being his sense of humour. Gorgon probably joined in for the kicks.
>>122179934The story is bullshit narrated by Xorn with no evidence it happened. The run has hints to Xorn being Magneo with metal bending passed off as super strength, nano sentinel removal and other stuff. Quentin's scenes with Xorn are big hints.Xorn is supposed to represent a kinder Claremont Magneto. Morrison Magneto was a response to Genosha and also under the influence of Sublime/Kick just like Beast in the last arc.
>>122185239>It's why Krakoa can give them their powers back.Krakoa can't give them their powers back, which is why they have to get murdered to be repowered. The reincarnation bullshit allows for physical alteration.You've got this completely backwards.
>>122185320They don't reincarnate, they're given clone bodies. If their x-gene was gone they couldn't get their powers back.
>>122185381The x-gene is being added back into their bodies during the cloning process, m8.
>>122185421If their x-genes were gone they wouldn't have anything to add back. Decimation affected everything related to the X-gene, down to MGH.
>>122184936>Glob Herman's powers are more useful than you'd think what with the whole his outsides are completely inedible, most of him is fairly invulnerable and immune to pain since its just regeneratory wax, and he can light chunks of himself on fire and throw it at people if he wants. He can also tank impacts like a motherfucker. Dude's ugly, not useless.>Beak meanwhile can fly and has claws and bird vision.Okay, now explain how their powers are useful against a mountain sized super sentinel that can wipe clean an entire island nation in 15 minutes..
>>122185535>If their x-genes were gone they wouldn't have anything to add back.They're adding the x-gene back.Fuck's sake, M-Day wiping out x-genes has been canon for years. That's why people depowered on M-Day weren't repowered by the Phoenix.
>>122185645>Okay, now explain how their powers are useful against a mountain sized super sentinel that can wipe clean an entire island nation in 15 minutes..Beak could play spotter for evacuations and glob could smear chunks of his flesh on external sensors to blind it.
>>122185647Then how are the adding the x-gene back if the x-gene is gone?>>122185645The Wild Sentinel was literally built out of scrap. And again, you're ignoring the presence of the Acolytes.
>>122185239>The notion that they couldn't defeat one extra large Sentinel, and were completely blindsided by it, is bullshitFrom what I remember the entire Genosha genocide scene was done in like, half hour tops. Magneto himself couldn't do shit because the first thing he saw after the sentinel made landfall, was a giant chuck of debris flying in his face.I'm confident if they were warned in advanced and had prep time, they could fight back, but the idea is that they got blitzkrieged by a killer robot five times the size of Godzilla.
>>122185719>Beak could play spotter for evacuations and glob could smear chunks of his flesh on external sensors to blind it.Beak is super fragile and would die from the flying debris or by getting trampled, and Glob wouldn't be able to reach those sensors (assuming he too isn't crushed by debris the minute the thing makes landfall).I mean just consider that this thing appears and instantly knocks down half a dozen skyscrapers. That alone would create so much panic, confusion, and collateral, that it would be impossible to mount a concentrated response. And for all we know it could have had internal sensors to identify and target the most powerful obstacles - the acolytes could have been the 2nd targets; we know that Magneto was knocked out immediately.You are assuming that every mutant is a trained fighter like the x-men or have near identical powers like the green lantern corps. They aren't. Most of them are shit like porcupine boy or a quadriplegic having an astral projection affair with another guy over the street without his wife knowing. Or a hairdresser who is half lizard. The acolytes could fight but they can hardly take down a Mechagodzilla.
The most retarded part is that Xorn let Prof X read his mind and he couldn't tell it was Magneto.
>>122185798Going by the actual art in the issue the damn thing was half the size of Genosha. Really it's just ludicrous that at no point did anyone notice the robot the size of a couple of city blocks travelling across two oceans before it made landfall. More pertinently, the Wild Sentinel wasn't built in some supertech base by a Master Mold using the latest cutting edge comic SCIENCE!, it was kludged together out of a Bolivian garbage dump.
>>122185795>The Wild Sentinel was literally built out of scrapthe wild sentinels were literally the product of some weird machine super evolution
>>122183346Agon, Black Bolt's father, specially created Lockjaw. And he was some kind of fucked-up mad scientist.
What's weird was that every thing leading up to planet x was good then the reveal happens and it falls very flat. The world is plunged into another appocalypes future that needs to be fixed. And Jean dies in the process. Then you have Wheadons run which has them ditch the cool as hell jackets and for the old costumes. Even beast looks different. Now I know that the jackets come back in whdeons run when Scott can see without his optic blast but it's not the same..
>>122186172The raw material for the Wild Sentinel was sourced from scavenged material.
>>122183361How so? I mean it would ipso facto have to.>>122183592>they have way too much shit going onNnno.Humans are babies by comparison and live on one shitty planet. Skrulls, as intelligent beings, have been around for millions of years and they inhabit an entire galaxy. If anything they have too LITTLE going on.>>122186147>it was kludged together out of a Bolivian garbage dumpThe technology evolved. And yes, the raw materials were whatever it could find, but god knows what a thinking machine left to its own devices comes up with, technology-wise
>>122186147>Really it's just ludicrous that at no point did anyone notice the robot the size of a couple of city blocks travelling across two oceans before it made landfall.Either it had super robot anti radar stealth fields (built in a BOLIVIAN CAVE), or many nations detected it but after they've seen that it's going to Genosha, they just decided to sit back and watch it take out the single biggest threat to status quo on the planet.That and to detect that shit you would've needed space tech, especially since it was flying over the oceans and possibly the antarctic (depending on trajectory). We don't know if Genosha has defense satellites or orbital monitoring in place. And if it was travelling supersonic then not much shit you could do to stop it either.
>>122183303So what actually happened in 3 Jokers? Was there ever a point to it?
>>122186445>So what actually happened in 3 Jokers?Turns out you can 'make' a Joker by exposing a suitable subject - read: anybody - to the chemical bath the original fell intoThe three Jokers do this to a bunch of people to create the 'perfect Joker'Two of the Jokers are killed (I think Jason kills the one that killed him once) and Batman reveals at the end he has known the identity of "the" Joker (the guy from 'The Killing Joke') for years, and that his wife is still alive.>Was there ever a point to it?Of course not. DC and Marvel are completely fucked.
>>122186718So basically anyone can become a joker and once again, they made Killing Joke Joker the main Joker?
>>122183238Polaris probably won the vote to be on the main X-Men team.>>122183307A lot, I think now it's just best to say "one of the first" rather than the first
>>122183303>>122183388>>122183485Let's be honest, if they ever give the Joker a real name, they will always pick Jack Napier.
>>122187006It will be Arthur Fleck for (((synergy)))
>>122183997>And if there's millions of them then they're big enough to city build and make their own nations and don't need to seek acceptance.what? But there are minorities that number in the millions in the US, just take the US about 5% of people identify as LGBTQ which means about 16 million in the US. Why can't there be a similar amount of mutants?
>>122187006>>122187027It's times like this that I almost like Scott Snyder's "The Pale Man" shit because it kept Joker explictly dehumanised.
One of the weird things about Planet X that gets overlooked is Toad. Morrison has him as a lackey to Magneto, and while he is known best for being Magneto's stooge, in the comics he'd actually turned on Magneto back in the 60's and ditched him, and Marvel had actually stayed consistent on that. Toad went a good three and a half decades having nothing to do with Magneto until he suddenly turned up as his minion with no explanation in Planet X.
>>122185795>Then how are the adding the x-gene back if the x-gene is gone?Same way they're adding in the rest of the genetic info. The five are doing it.
>>122186429genosha having no defense system makes no sense either to be fair
>>122184604>All mutants have parents that carried the x-gene.no they don't, not at all. What happens is>fetus has a mutation and develops an X-gene>X-Gene is inactive>puberty hits and the X-gene activates>mutants develops superpowers.
>>122187132Joker showing up to a police station and ninja murdering like 20 cops was fucking retarded.
>>122183548Doesn't Blackbolt also dick-down that one?
>>122186147The sentinels are bullshit themselves. They are built essentially out of scraps by a normal human genius, and have the power to adapt and nulify almost every superpower.By comparison people like Stark Doom or RIIICHAAAARDS, or even Magneto and Xavier, should have made superpowers redudant decades ago.But that's cape comics for you.
>>122179886Its forgivable because the very first appearance of xorn, they said there were two. Rule of comic books, nobody is dead til you see the body.
>>122187296Yeah. Yeah. I'm just sick of people trying to make him a person instead of an idea.
>>122186718wouldnt that make the movie harley a joker then?
>Colossus dies a noble death sacrificing himself to eliminate the virus that had killed his sister>Whedon brings him back purely because he's a Kitty/Piotr shipper
>>122181484Now I believe the genocide happened, but I don't know. 16 Million seems like an awful lot...
>>122187422>brought back just 'cuz season villain MIGHT need inside info on the team and wasn't going to kidnap a weaker member or student for reasonsalso leads into>Kitty can survive inside objects indefinitely while phased and in space etc>Magneto can sense and pull objects literal light years away from earth to himself but wasn't assed to stop the thing in the first placeWhedon was always a hack.
>>122187422that whole virus thing was bullshit, from killing illyana to start with to killng colossus at the end.Killing characters in this kind of never ending series is always a shitty thing and should be done rarely and sparingly.
>>122187422From what I've heard Marvel was the one who told him to dig up Colossus.
>>122187223Sinister is the one who has all the DNA catalogue. But it was Wanda's reality warping that erased the X-Gene, and not just from existing mutants, she erased the possibility of it arising again. No new mutants born, Forge even probed the future and there were no longer any mutants in the future. This also means that people WITH the active x-gene couldn't pass it on to their children. Only when Hope was born was the reality warping broke and fetus's could mutate the X-gene once again were mutants able to repopulate the world.
>>122187422eh, he was going to be brought back eventually anyway, it was a good story beat. And Kitty was shot off planet in exchange for having Piotr back, so I'm totally ok with this exchange.
>>122187533>>Magneto can sense and pull objects literal light years away from earth to himself but wasn't assed to stop the thing in the first placethat wasn't Whedon. Wasn't it Mike Carey? He's no hack
>>122187533>>Kitty can survive inside objects indefinitely while phased and in space etc1. the bullet was magic, it had Doc Strange and other major mages of Earth all put in a trance until Spider-man slapped them awake.2. you can argue that due to the bullet travelling at near light speed and having large enough mass to cause gravitational distortions on its path, it affected the flow of time Planet of the Apes style, so the xyz months/years Kitty spent fused to it was just a few minutes from her point of view.>Magneto can sense and pull objects literal light years away from earth to himself but wasn't assed to stop the thing in the first placeI have nothing about this one, but was it still Whedon who wrote those issues of x-men? they happened in the normal ongoing, not in Astonishing.
>>122187259>genosha having no defense system makes no sense either to be fairThey don't because the place is populated by 16 million mutants, and their king can literally fly into another continent and drop a bus on you with a thought, or reverse the magnetic poles which would fuck up the entire planet. And also because they are insanely arrogant and think the future belongs to them in a few generations.
>>122183034marvells powers never came from his dna. They came from the negabands. Negabands help you channel you psionic powers. Effectively meaning they only helped awaken Carol's psionic powers. Plus the abduction aspect isn't retconned out still.
>>122184131Yeah it kinda was.Xavier's dad worked at a nuclear plant which is what he ascribed his powers to.Sunfire had his powers because of hiroshima nagasaki
>>122186718>his wife is still aliveso err... halucination?also kid joker when?
>>122179886>>122183558>>122183500I hate everything Jason Aaron has done to Avengers lore.
>>122182666What's even dumber is that they made this Kree mother retcon just before the Captain Marvel movie came out. People assumed that Marvel was just trying to match with what the movie was going to do, but nope, the movie had her be a human who got her powers from Mar-Vell just like in the original comics, Mar-Vell's gender swap was the only difference. So they made things more needlessly confusing and complicated for potential new readers for no reason.
>>122186827Yup.>>122187006If they ever give him a canon name I hope it turns out to be Bruce Wayne. "Like the millionaire? Any relation?" "Nope. it's just one of those things">>122187402Technically yes.Oh, the chemical bath also makes it impossible to identify a subject because it destroys their fingerprints and messes with their DNA.God almighty
>>122188034Kree are also more long-lived and three times as strong as humans. She got that from him (along with his memories and, ipso facto, any abilities he did not get from the bands). She retained her hybrid physiology even after Rogue sucked out her super-powers.>>122190076He's a fucking hack retard and his work will serve as an eternal mark of shame.Also, Thanos was born about 200 years BC and a million years ago the Celestials hadn't even visited Earth yet
>>122180290Convince me that 'mutant subculture' isn't boring.
>>122180398>Magneto was simply glueing the fractured spine together using the nanosentinelsGood job the X-Men don't have any doctors or advanced medical scanners to identify things like this.
>>122181242The relation, okay, but they were ALWAYS mutants.
>>122183043Her de-ageing annoys me almost as much.
>>122183406He was still leader of the X-Men in AoA, so the idea of a good Mags wasn't ENTIRELY abandoned.
>>122183608>It'd be a simple matter of saying that she never had an X-gene and the Genetic Amplifier gave her powesNooooo. It'd be another example of 'Hey, that mutant who's had issues of things like losing her powers, being posessed, having a possible connection to Magneto, has somehow NEVER had her DNA looked at by Beast or anyone, ever'.
>>122184430Lots of mutants who have kids have mutant kids. Mystique, Seb Shaw, Cyke, Wolverine, Magneto, Apocalypse, Banshee...
>>122185239But didn't Beast in Endangered Species find that even most DEAD mutants had lost their X genes? He couldn't have found out they were just depowered.
>>122181484Thanks for summarizing, bothered me too.
>>122187283>has a mutation and develops an X-geneBut X genes didn't come about spontaneously. Celestial introduced them.
>>122187325Supervillains, and high tech organisations, come up with power nullifiers all the time. And Doom just recently created his own version of Sentinels.
>>122180290>We saw that mutant bands, clothes, reality shows, etc all existed and it was interesting to see mutants become this slightly more explored and realistic minority group with their own lives.This is why I absolutely loved X-Staix plus I liked seeing Morrisons Wolverine and Professor X appear in Mike Alred style.
I might be alone in this but making the celestials responsible for most of the shit in the universe sucks. It flies in the face of mutants being natural or how regular people get super powers. It really shrunk the universe by making a bunch alien races that were created before them are just their experiments. Not to mention it practically stole them from the Eternals and made the Eternals less unique.
>>122183631This would be better than what they've been doing for the last 20 years, but honestly, even the "subculture" and "realistic minority group" are a mistake because once they started attempting that, it appears to be impossible to stop the X-Men writers from having them embracing the same us against them racial solidarity viewpoints that used to be reserved for their enemies.
>>122181223>It wrecked X-Men as a superhero bookIt was the most interesting the X-Men had been since the height of Claremont's run and nothing since has been anywhere near as interesting. I really wonder what Carey could've done with the Morrison set up or on something like Academy X since he seemed to like the students a lot.
>>122193366>He was still leader of the X-Men in AoA, so the idea of a good Mags wasn't ENTIRELY abandoned.The whole point of that was to show how different characters' lives could have been if the course of history was changed. AoA had Magneto, Sabretooth and Exodus as heroes, Beast, Havok, and Domino as villains, plus characters who were dead in 616 being alive. Magneto and Sabretooth were popular in AoA, so they followed it up by making them both amnesiacs with a fresh start offering the possibility of redemption, but Creed turned out to be faking, and Joseph turned out to be Magneto's clone. The best solution would have been to keep him around for people who want a good Magneto.
>>122183631A million or so is better. I do say they could've introduced the growth better, IMO Lobdell's return should've been about the increase in the mutant population to set up Morrison's/Casey's stuff instead of Eve of Destruction. It would've been the best way to close out his era of the X-Men and pave the way for the future.
>>122183266He never said it was good. He just said it was the best one. By dropping "hackery" he's implying that it's shit, just not as shit as the other options.
>>122180228>Taking this away from him means that Magneto was been relatively heroic for the last 20ish years.The problem was that the comics didn't focus on the things he did in Fatal Attractions or the Magneto War, and how many people would have died, so Morrison's Magneto literally holocausting humans crossed a line he hadn't been treated as having previously crossed, even if more people probably died in those earlier stories. The scale of fan backlash to it is what has caused over 15 years of Magneto as an antihero and ally of the X-Men. Morrison's attack on the idea of Magneto as a hero caused much more of it than we ever had before.
>>122195556He's suggesting reducing Wanda to a plot device for X-Men stories, as if that's ever been a good idea that worked out well.
>>122179934And that one Xorn issue was one of my favorites. But it completely invalidates the idea of it being Magneto. Instead of "IT WAS ME ALL ALONG!", there should have been some reveal that Magneto had replaced that Xorn halfway through the series.It wasn't a twist ending. It was just poorly set up and was in direct conflict with all the character development Magneto had gone through in the 20 years before.I swear the only people who defend it are people who hadn't read any X-Men prior to it, the same way Morrison hadn't read anything since Steranko was on the title.
>>122193141>The relation, okay, but they were ALWAYS mutants.While this is true, if not for the Magneto retcon, Wanda being a mutant would be as important as Whirlwind being a mutant, it's just an explanation for why they have powers, and it wouldn't particularly matter if the explanation was something else instead. Being a mutant has become a a metaphor for other things, and Wanda as a character doesn't really have anything to do with any of that. It's more complicated for Pietro because he was in X-Factor several times.
>>122180093>three geniesWhat are the other two?
>>122183500>phoenix is thor's momhonest question. is this bait?