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Previous thread: >>10501599
>Event's closed, COVID.
>The CosplayClues brand has been brought back from the dead under new ownership.
>Event refund policies: is the law just a suggestion?
>Bootleg talk: Sellers versus Events edition.
>New EU import rules. In short, you now pay VAT on everything. PostNL administrative fee starts at €4, stores can process VAT directly in which case there is no administrative fee. Belgium has fucked up higher administrative fees. F in chat for our Plopkoek friends.
>TomoCon, TomoMarket, TomoShills, TomoHaters, TomoTrolls, TomoAssumptions, TomoMinistryOfTruth, TomoTrashtalk, TomoMudfights, TomoWhataboutisms, TomoTired.
>I am so TomoTired.
>Abunai volunteer horror stories.

Every event still left uncancelled for 2021:
>Evangelion 3.0 + 1.01 Thrice Upon a Time (August 13, Amazon Prime and Nyaa): The end of the rebuild of the evangelion for all things coloured neon.
>TomoCon (August 7 & 8, Oss): A (hopefully) TinyTomo-like market edition.
>Elfia Arcen (September 18 & 19, Arcen): An outdoor fantasy fair in the castle gardens in Arcen.
>Heroes MIA NL (October 16 & 17, Gorinchem): Heroes third(?) attempt at their first Dutch anime convention.
>Heroes DCC (November 20 & 21, Utrecht): It's Dutch Comic Con, you know the drill.
>Animecon Christmas (December 11 & 12, Rijswijk): A Christmass themed Animecon edition.
>Midwinterfair (December 11 & 12, Alphen a/d Rijn): A fantasy fair in Archeon.
Did I miss any event? Feel free to post them. Because that sure is more interesting than the usual crap.

Links and advice:
>POSTS MADE IN DUTCH ARE AGAINST SITE-WIDE RULES AND WILL BE DELETED!
>As a Soldier, hitting a teammate with the Disciplinary Action will increase both your and your teammate's speed dramatically for a few seconds! Use it on slower classes like other Soldiers and Heavies in order to reach the front lines faster!
>Site nobody uses and I keep forgetting to cancel the domain for: https://dutchgulls.nl
>Discord: https://discord.gg/QAYNyfY
>>
Is Elfia Arcen even still on the table after the flooding of Limburg?
>>
Well, I've missed an event:
>Elfia Fairy Nights (August 28th, Haarzuilens), a costume walk in the gardens of Castle De Haar. No stages and no stands except for food and drinks.
Also, here's a link to the spreadsheet of events for 2021. I figured this would be a way more convenient way to keep track of things with the constant changes due to COVID. Turns out I only shared it on Discord, whoops...
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1TIKki73xQLEvoA49UYf4ywitW0WJm8ib4bf1wToE_3s/edit?usp=sharing

>>10651388
The castle gardens are open for visitors as we speak so I guess the damage (if any) was held to a minimum. But as always, keep an eye out for any updates through their site, socials and email if you intend on going. The future is annoyingly unpredictable as it is.
>>
>>10651383
>As a Soldier, hitting a teammate with the Disciplinary Action will increase both your and your teammate's speed dramatically for a few seconds! Use it on slower classes like other Soldiers and Heavies in order to reach the front lines faster!

You're just tempting me to play TF2 with you OP, aren't you? It's actually my go-to melee weapon in casual.
Thanks for the recap and the new thread btw. Got really tired of all the Tomodiscussions last thread. See you guys in 6 months when something will actually happen (hopefully).
>>
>>10651399
Elfia Fairy Nights has happened a little while ago.
Can really recommend it to people if they want to go. You'll see much more of the place then with the festival as well, and you'll walk like in a rail-road RPG game.
>>
>>10651383
is cosplay even a thing anymore?
>>
>>10651417
>Got really tired of all the Tomodiscussions last thread

Don't mention it! You're summoning the deamons again!
>>
>>10651671
If you start, you'll reap the consequences...
>>
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Certain organizers WILL use places like this to (indirectly) advertise or defend their business practices. Everyone being anonymous makes this the perfect place to do so. The difference is that here, they cannot delete posts and replies they don't like. Reminder:
>Do not argue with Tomo apologists
>Do not reply to Tomo apologists
>Support conventions and events that you enjoy
>Support your favorite artists and vendors outside of just conventions
No vendor or artist is depending on a single event-organizer, and there's plenty of ways to support them outside of these conventions. Don't fall for it.
>>
>>10651774
Tomo is not dashcon... Not even close
>>
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>>10651671
Tomo, TomoFair, TomoCon, TomoParty, TomoPlay, TomoBeatz, TomoCheese, TomoCake, TomoRamen, TomoKroket, TomoPizza, TomoMovie, TomoAnime, TomoGame, TomoCola, TomoEnd

Let's call this the TomoDutchThread
>>
>>10651797
Or as the Dutch say "Gekoloniseerd"
>>
>>10651802
Even better, "GeTomoniseerd"
>>
>>10651804
>Even better, "GeTomoniseerd"
As in Lobotomized!
>>
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>>10651797
Yes, keep bringing up Tomo here, even negative advertisement is advertisement.... LOL
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>>10651797
Let's talk about dead cons instead. They're dead anyway so it's not like you will offend them.
Yaycon is still in a limbo, there was chibicon and also tsunacon.
Remember tsunacon?
>>
>>10651839
chibicon anyone? Still a fun con, was this staff member that the equipment renters wanted to put under the tarmac, fun times
>>
>>10651839
>>10651840
I remember during one tsunacon edition there was only one food stand selling overpriced ramen. At late afternoon everyone was grumpy waiting for hours in the line or walking in the snow and ill fitting cosplay to the nearest fast food.
Good times. Wait no, it was awful!
>>
>>10651839
I miss dressing up as Ace Attorney characters every year.
>>
>>10651843
Awful and awesome :)
>>
What's the general opinion on the organization of DCC/facts/Made in Asia? I've been a few times and it seemed alright, extremely busy though
>>
>>10651919
Mia is always overcrowded...
>>
>>10651919
DCC: you have to pay for everything, overcrowded and the dealerroom is full of bootlegs.
>>
>>10651919
DCC: Fun festival/convention, but a ton of bootlegging, but overall a fun place to hang out at.
Facts: Never been there before yet, but they never can deliver the offers they give on their website. A lot of famous people invited, but in the end just a handful of people are there.
Made in Asia: Very crowded as a person says, it's like a huge exercise hall filled with stuff to do. No idea how the bootlegging is there, but I think they do checks every often, from what I heard.
>>
>>10652036
DCC, MIA and Facts are organised by Easyfairs Netherlands. And if they turn a blind eye towards bootlegs at DCC then I don't have much hope for the other two.
>>
>>10651919
I can't speak for FACTS or MIA, but to me DCC is acceptable for the type of event it is. Them strictly being a commercial geek culture event does mean a lot of the cosiness and for-the-visitors sensation found at other events goes missing. Instead it's more about the sponsors, large names and dealers, with "to do" content and quality of these events taking the backseat. This difference in focus and nature does open the door to have way larger events, offering (arguably) better competition prices, arranging celebrity guests and gaining a way wider audience. There's a market for everything and clearly DCC clearly found theirs.

As for the organisation themselves, I would prefer if they'd be more involved with the community. Things like the "Sandbagger Saga" comes to mind, along with the "Photographer vs Cosplayer" case and how for the longest time they refused to give credit for any of the material they use as promotional content. The community is your life and income, so why not have their backs? Keeping a better eye out at unwanted (sexual) behaviour and taking reports thereof more seriously would be greatly appreciated too. Bootlegs also aren't uncommon which a shame with the massive audience at their events. Small innocent items sure, but at least try to combat the few scumbags selling knock-offs pretending them to be the official release full price and all.

Finally I did notice the entrance fees have been creeping up over time. Currently it's at €28 total for an 8 hour event which starts to feel a bit steep. But this also raises an interesting question: Is DCC just overpriced or are other events simply charging too little?

tl;dr: DCC is great if you prefer buying over doing stuff.
>>
>>10652083
DCC probably need the budget to get artists to their event. However, it feels like they're overpricing a lot. Seeing how some other well-hated conventions and festivals can do the same for 1/3rd of the price DCC is asking for, says a lot to be honest, plus they get even more people... It's weird...
>>
>>10652165
Do you think that the Jaarbeurs is cheap as a venue? I don't.
>>
>>10652190
It's 23k per hall per 4 hours
>>
>>10652209
>It's 23k per hall per 4 hours
I guess that you could hire that Motorcross venue for less than 10% of that and you will have it for the whole weekend.
>>
>>10652209
Given the halls they are going to use in november this could add up to about half a million.
>>
>>10652446
Yeah, that's why you need massive amounts of visitors, milk sponsorships (Netflix, fox, Nintendo etc), milk dealers and have your visitors pay for any extras (competitions, autographs, ghost carnival)
>>
https://www.nu.nl/muziek/6148697/eendaagse-festivals-vanaf-14-augustus-alleen-mogelijk-voor-750-bezoekers-in-open-lucht.html?redirect=1
>>
>>10654169
This has an impact for all events except one. They are a "market/gathering/family affair/whatever the name says as long as we can bend the rules"
>>
>>10654204
>This has an impact for all events except one. They are a "market/gathering/family affair/whatever the name says as long as we can bend the rules"
The most recent permit I could find was issued by the city council of Oss.

Oss, Aengelbertlaan 60
TomoCon - Japanse Markt 2020 - versie 2
Evenementenvergunning verleend
Kenmerk: 49724

Take note, that was last year. Perhaps Tomoshill could provide us with a more recent number because 49724 points to last year.
>>
>>10652083
>Is DCC just overpriced or are other events simply charging too little?
I'd say the second. It's no secret most Dutch conventions run on tight budgets and play expert level financial Jenga to make things happen. Prices have barely gone up despite inflation and higher tax rates on tickets. There's only so much you can cut and restructure before you do more harm than good. Even something as small as €5 more for a weekend ticket would probably go them a long way.
>>
>>10651383
Tomo a shit. Actual crybabies in their organizing unit, literally set at a trashdump. Why even bother? It's just for those people that just want attention for their cosplay. There was never a reason to go, there is no reason to go and there will never be a reason to go. With current cockbig-19 surges it will be a hazard aswell.
>>
>>10654319
We have been summoned again.
TomoBeginning, Tomo, TomoFair, TomoCon, TomoParty, TomoPlay, TomoBeatz, TomoCheese, TomoCake, TomoRamen, TomoKroket, TomoPizza, TomoMovie, TomoAnime, TomoGame, TomoCola, TomoManga, TomoDishwasher, TomoFries, TomoMonitor, TomoMore, TomoPhone, TomoTablet, TomoCeption, TomoTomo, TomoPC, TomoYolo, TomoAirfryer, TomoFlag, TomoTV, TomoNews, TomoFantasyFair, TomoEnd
>>
>>10654346
ok shill
>>
The guys running the Tomo foundation have their own seperate company to run the activities at their cons, and also have their own seperate company selling merchandise as the "main sponsor" of their cons. It's no wonder they go to such lengths to organize these things. They make a ton of cash doing so.

>use the non-profit foundation to set up the con and get a bunch of volunteers
>then hire your own activity business with the money from entry/vendor tickets
>then give your merch business the best vendor spot and make it the "main sponsor" for free
>all this while still enjoying all the tax benefits of being a non-profit foundation

I would find it impressive from a business perspective but their horrible PR management really takes a big dump on it all. People say "Go to these cons and support your favorite dealers/artists" but don't realize the people supported are mostly just the Tomo organizers themselves.
>>
>>10654319
Yah, cause you're the prime example of every person that visits Tomo...
Please, do us a favor, and shut up, cause you're pretty much triggering the trolls here, if you haven't noticed...
>>
>>10654352
Of course they do, it would be hard to just run the whole event only on tickets... Or they have to make the tickets more expansive for other costs. The reason why Abunai and Animecon aren't doing that, is because they just put all the needed money (and more, cause they will always make some room for unforeseen expanses) inside the ticket cost, making it very expansive in the first place. They are not monopolizing their own food stand with other food stands, so I honestly do not see the point why this should be a issue. Also, I doubt they would be "rich" with their food-stand, that's like a nice fantasy.
>>
>>10654368
>>10654352
Oh, I forgot, they also sell of course the stalls on their dealer-room, for a extreme high price (Abunai and Animecon), cause that's also where the most income comes from. There is a reason also that Animecon is able to rent artists to come from Japan to play in the Netherlands, and more such things.
>>
>>10654364
let's talk about more interesting cons in that case, because that will prevent them from being in here and shilling.
>>
>>10654368
There's no way they'd use the revenue of their own businesses to make the entry to the con cheaper, lmao. The vendors are paying the expenses. Prices are really close between the cons, which makes Tomo really expensive in comparison (the venues are smaller, there's less special guests, there's less activities compared to all their competitors = less expenses)

If you really think these guys are using their for-profit business revenue to pay for the non-profit foundation's costs, you must be delusional. There's a reason they just give tickets away for free - anyone who comes in will probably spend money at one of their other businesses.
>>
>>10654410
>If you really think these guys are using their for-profit business revenue to pay for the non-profit foundation's costs, you must be delusional. There's a reason they just give tickets away for free - anyone who comes in will probably spend money at one of their other businesses.
Seeing the usual jokes about "Why don't you have free Tomo-ticket yet?" makes you wonder who is actually still paying for entrance to Tomo.
>>
>>10654410
>>10654554
I would like to see some of those claims you people bringing up. As far as I'm aware, Abunai en Animecon are giving away tickets left and right just as much, so I'm kind of confused why you think Tomo would be the only one doing that, that's just retarded.
Of course most of their budget comes from the vendors, obviously, but do you really think they would have a huge revenue from their own food stall ? Honestly, they won't. It's a extra budget income for Tomo to organize things, buy in equipment (yes, Tomo has their own tech equipment, where Animecon en Abunai are just renting it, which costs more in the longer run as well).
It's kind of awkward you guys think so simple-minded everytime...
>>
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>>10654558
>I would like to see some of those claims you people bringing up. As far as I'm aware, Abunai en Animecon are giving away tickets left and right just as much, so I'm kind of confused why you think Tomo would be the only one doing that, that's just retarded.
>Of course most of their budget comes from the vendors, obviously, but do you really think they would have a huge revenue from their own food stall ? Honestly, they won't. It's a extra budget income for Tomo to organize things, buy in equipment (yes, Tomo has their own tech equipment, where Animecon en Abunai are just renting it, which costs more in the longer run as well).
>It's kind of awkward you guys think so simple-minded everytime...
Says the Tomoshill.
>>
>>10654562
Yes, because having criticism about the way you guys put another convention in a corner = tomoshill.
Again, you're a simple minded personality, but I can guess you're looking for your same species here on 4chan, then you're on the right place to be a total douchbag :)
>>
>>10654558
>As far as I'm aware, Abunai en Animecon are giving away tickets left and right just as much
Got anything to support this claim? Because I don't see them handing out free tickets at the RDC stand nor offering "buy one get one free" deals.
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>>10654573
This is 4-chan, what do you expect, pink fluffy unicorns dancing on rainbows?
>>
>>10654575
That's simple, they don't openly hand out tickets. Tomo is open and public about it, says enough what kind of sneaky tricks they do to hand out free tickets. If you believe they don't, then you have no idea at all what is happening behind the back at conventions...
>>
>>10654577
That's actually a awesome music video though, so freaking cute... <3
>>
>>10654558
Wait, they also have their own foodstall? Holy shit, that's even worse. I was talking about Red Dot Commerce("head sponsor" and sells figs) and GameRoomS(event organizer). If they also have a foodstall, they're competing at every single part of their events with the people who hire their stands.

>I would like to see some claims
Look at their website. Also pay attention next time you go there. It's not hard to see their businesses being given the spotlight.
>Abunai and Animecon do the same
No they don't. Even if they did, it isn't an argument for justifying these kinds of dickish business practices.
>you're all just simple-minded!
Shit like this doesn't make your point any better dude.
>>
>>10654582
In other words, bullshit without any proof and the classic "just believe me, I'm an expert". Got it.
>>
>>10654585
>they also have their own foodstall?
They have that for years now... ?

>I was talking about Red Dot Commerce
Head sponsor seems to be fine, what's wrong with that ? Animecon had Sportgames also as sponsor, as they get that DDR stuff for almost free... while others had to pay hefty amount to rent them...

>and GameRoomS(event organizer)
I think they started out as a other brand name, until the handling of deals was done eventually by Tomo. I can remember someone mentioned that GameRoomS got fucked over by Abunai by violating the contract Abunai signed... ?

>If they also have a foodstall, they're competing at every single part of their events with the people who hire their stands.
Not really, it's just fastfood snacks, while all other stands that I've seen, sold mostly Japanese related foods, crepes and such, which they don't do...

>Look at their website. Also pay attention next time you go there. It's not hard to see their businesses being given the spotlight.
I was more pointing out the claims about Tomo "lying" or such, which they don't. In fact, Tomo is pretty open and public about their conduct, which I mentioned the other keep a lot of their stuff behind closed doors. Also, I checked their website, they have a lot of non-Tomo stuff there in the pictures and information. Of course you would advertise your own products, it would be stupid not to ? But getting profit with fastfood, maybe, but is that wrong ? Not really, at least they will have a budget for issues that could happen at any time, like a pandemic that mess up all your conventions and fairs.....

>No they don't. Even if they did, it isn't an argument for justifying these kinds of dickish business practices.
Bullshit, I've been given free access and other people as well. That they aren't openly saying "hey, here are free tickets" on their conventions and website and facebook, doesn't mean they don't... It's also awkward when you think they don't.
>>
>>10654588
>In other words, bullshit without any proof and the classic "just believe me, I'm an expert". Got it.

In other words, just because you don't know about it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen...
>>
>>10654590
Then provide proof instead of meaningless words.
>>
>>10654589
Nobody said anything about lying. You're missing the point and making up strawman arguments. Read >>10654352 again, the point is that they have their non-profit foundation structured in such a way that the majority of the revenue of the conventions flows to for-profit businesses which they also own. This is why they try so hard to organize something despite the covid regulations and the negative PR: They make heaps of money doing so.

They are their own "sponsor". They are their own activities organizer. This is literally presented as such on their website.
>>
>>10654597
>they have their non-profit foundation structured in such a way that the majority of the revenue of the conventions flows to for-profit businesses
Unless their non-profit foundation is actually not a foundation at all. You see the construction you describe is not allowed by Tax laws in the Netherlands or Europe for that matter.
>>
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>>10654604
Really makes you think.
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>>10654608
Check the KVK then.
Tomo is non profit, however reddot is for-profit. Reddot can sell a lot on tomo's events. That's it! That's all! And MGC/Whoops had the same construction.
The market in Dordrecht / special edition had the same construction. It's pretty common practice!
>>
>>10654608
>Really makes you think.
The foundation hires said the company for services and work to be done for the foundation, that is perfectly legal, but it becomes shady when the owner are actually one and the same person, the tax office would then for example like to know how much has been paid for those services and work.

If a certain type of work would normally pay €30,- an hour (including taxes) but Tomo pays €300,- an hour then the Tax office likes to have a word with you.

The same goes for volunteers that work for a foundation, yes they are allowed to be paid but within margins, a maximum of €150,- (or equivalent in goods like food, shirts and tickets) a month or €1500,- per year. The amount of hours is then also a thing, €30,- for an hour of work is then way to much and therefore it could have been done by a hired employee is their reasoning. So if you pay someone €1500,- for a whole year then it should be expected that this persoon spend at least about a 150 hours (12.5 hours per month) for that foundation, your mileage may vary and tax office will have the last word on this and not the foundation nor the company.

And Tomo is not an anbi organisation, they have to pay taxes and VAT.
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>>10654612
>And Tomo is not an anbi organisation, they have to pay taxes and VAT.
>>
>this entire elaborate business structure of a con that tries to ignore covid rules and deletes negative comments
>all it does is fill the pockets of the organizers
>"but it's legal though!" ITT
>>
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Can we talk about something that isn't tomo for once?

How about maids? everyone likes maids right?
Maid cafes at conventions? which one is your favorite, what is your ideal type of maid cafe, should a maid cafe try to open in the Netherlands outside of conventions?
>>
>>10654593
Reading is it seems not your strongest feature...
>>
>>10654597
>Nobody said anything about lying.
That is because the post here is deleted... How convenient..

>You're missing the point and making up strawman arguments.
Like most of the people here are doing about Tomo ?

>again, the point is that they have their non-profit foundation structured in such a way that the majority of the revenue of the conventions flows to for-profit businesses which they also own.
Most of the vendors are there "for profit" as well. I'm pretty sure that their foodstall isn't being used to generate profit. Animecon en Abunai also have a stash of money in case shit hits the fan, and it would if people would have noticed they aren't paying up all the expenses as they should, compared to Animecon who does, since the founder has connections.

>This is why they try so hard to organize something despite the covid regulations and the negative PR: They make heaps of money doing so.
What, they are rich because of their fastfood stall ? Haven't you noticed that most, if not all equipment, is of themselves, and not rented by some 3rd party ? Equipment and everything around the event, costs money. Even renting the stalls where vendors sell their shit, nothing is for free. They asking like a miniscule amount for a ticket, and you claim they are rich ? No, I'm not buying it...

>They are their own "sponsor". They are their own activities organizer. This is literally presented as such on their website.
As far as I know, Red Dot is not owned by Tomo...
>>
>>10654617
And discussion clearly isn't yours if you have to resort to unhinged claims and attacking on the person.
>>
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>>10654615
>They are making profit !
>But how come they are non-profit registered...
>They must be illegal! HURRDURR !
>>
>>10654619
Yes, because all your claims have so much truth to it, well, only in your own imagination. Keep on trying though, maybe you need to scream harder.
>>
>>10654621
Newsflash, you're not talking to just one person.
>>
>>10654622
Oh no! Yeah... who cares....
Have fun with this pointless and useless finger-pointing and grabbing claims out of your ass.
>>
>>10654623
I'll leave that to you because clearly you're better suited to do so :^)
>>
>>10654624
I'm sure you aren't adult enough to accept that most of the claims are just completely and utter bullshit. I'm not surprised, at all.
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>discussion about tomoshit again
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>>10654626
>>
>>10654625
Because you're so adult? You can't even have a normal discussion, refuse to back your claims and have to resort to attacking others on the person. Even when given the choice for a serious discussion and to proof your claims to someone who is open to it you choose to throw a tantrum. Get real...
>>
>>10654629
Claims for what, that they aren't "for profit"? There is no need to search for me, it's online accessible on the KvK and what not. What else would you like to know ?
>>
>>10654633
The claim of every event handing out free tickets left and right as much as Tomo. That's where we started and so far it's been nothing but "just believe me", "you just don't know the truth" and personal attacks.
>>
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Please, end it already.
I don't care what is up with tomo this time I don't want to see another thread reach bump limit with almost every post being nothing but "no u!".
>>
>>10654637
>The claim of every event handing out free tickets left and right as much as Tomo.
They do behind the back. It's pretty widely known that friends of friends of friends, and people who ask, will get a ticket left and right. Do I have evidence? I do know a few people who often get a couple of tickets given for free by the organization, but of course they wouldn't openly tell everybody they are... ? Honestly, I think Tomo openly showing they are giving out free tickets (well, technically they are not free, if you know how the free-tickets are), is more of a better approach then doing it sneakily behind the back, but now you have something to hit it with a stick, don't you.. ;)

>That's where we started and so far it's been nothing but "just believe me", "you just don't know the truth" and personal attacks.
Yah, just like all of 4chan does when someone has a different opinion. Right back at ya.
Also, you guys haven't shown anything that Tomo is just purely for profit, which the whole discussion was also about.
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>>10654618
You're ignoring half the points again, dude. At least now I know these posts defending Tomo are the one same guy. Are you that guy that admit to being a volunteer for them in the previous thread?

>most of the vendors are there "for profit"
...Which they have to pay a hefty amount for (about equal to their competitors despite being much smaller), and then also have to compete with Red Dot Commerce which is the "sponsor" of their own event and who gets the best stand locations for free etc.

>they are rich becaue of their fastfood stall? Haven't you noticed that most, if not all equipment, is of themselves?
It's not just their fast food stall, there's GameRooms/Red Dot/etc. This was already mentioned here >>10654585 .It's important that you know the difference between "they own the equipment" and "they own another company, which owns the equipment". GameRooms being a seperate company means they can rent their own equipment and reap the profits while still running Tomo as a seperate non-profit foundation.

>They asking like a miniscule amount for a ticket, and you claim they are rich?
Nobody said they are rich. Read >>10654410 again dude. Customers coming in for free = higher profit for Red Dot/their food stand/GameRooms etc. while also justifying the hefty price they ask other vendors.

>As far as I know, Red Dot is not owned by Tomo...
The owner of Red Dot literally admits to it in the Tomo "about us" >>10654608
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>>10654641
>nd then also have to compete with Red Dot Commerce which is the "sponsor" of their own event and who gets the best stand locations for free etc.
Just like Abunai! with their main sponsor, and Animecon with their main sponsor. Sponsors just get always a bit better stuff then non-sponsors, that's obvious..

>It's not just their fast food stall, there's GameRooms/Red Dot/etc.
I see where the confusion is coming. There are 2 organizations linked to Tomo, but the one is for non-profit, and the other is for-profit. You can find that online by just searching. GameRoomS is linked to Stichting Tomocon, which is a registered KvK organization.. So what is your point with this ?

>Nobody said they are rich. Read >>10654410 again dude. Customers coming in for free = higher profit for Red Dot/their food stand/GameRooms etc. while also justifying the hefty price they ask other vendors.
Well, it's pretty much made clear you guys think they are rich or something, which they clearly aren't.

>The owner of Red Dot literally admits to it in the Tomo "about us" >>10654608
This "Dave" is not the "owner" of Tomo... How did you came up with that ? Online simply googling showed it is owned by Mark...
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>>10654633
>Claims for what, that they aren't "for profit"?
Non-profit organisation has no legal status in the Netherlands. All organisations (even ANBI) are allowed to make profit as long as that profit is reinvested in the organisation or used to finance the next edition of a festival in this case, all under scrutiny by the tax office.

If you can do it without a profit or a loss, so much the better but it is not a necessity, profit may be made, just be careful where this profit ends up because the tax inspector might get some ideas and tax you accordingly.

It is not about having money but where it comes from or where it is going to.
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>>10654645
That's a good point, thanks for explaining.
I think as someone mentioned, we should lay down the Tomo talk, unless the kids still want to be hard headed and continue the whole claims and bullshit remarks :)
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>>10654644
>This "Dave" is not the "owner" of Tomo... How did you came up with that ?
You legally need 3 people to start a non-profit foundation. One of these 3 owns Red Dot.

>sponsors just get always a bit better stuff
The owners of tomo ARE THEIR OWN SPONSOR. Red Dot is owned by the Tomo organizers. That's the whole point.

>>10654645
Yeah exactly, thanks for clarifying.
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This discussion makes me curious, what is required to start your own convention?
Could in theory three random people here start their own organization and con? How difficult will it be to start a new Dutch con in this day and age?
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>>10654648
I think you just need to hire a venue and clear it with the local city hall and you're good to go. Probably takes a ton of planning and logistics if you don't want to end up like dashcon though.
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>>10654650
So I could even hold a block party and call it a convention?
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>>10654640
I'll throw you a bone and take those "few people you know" as the truth. But this still doesn't come close to handing out free tickets or discount vouchers to everyone who buys something at a RDC stand or fills in a survey. Like that the original claim that Animecon and Abunai are giving out just as many free tickets as Tomo doesn't hold up. Keep in mind I'm not saying they aren't giving out any free tickets because, well, they are.

And yes, I am aware the "buy one get on free" deal is pure marketing nonsense. The ticket prices were simply doubled when that deal got put in place at TomoFair. I have to admit it was a smart move from their side. It makes it more likely for people to introduce new visitors to their events with that free ticket. It also means you can claim you "sold" more tickets, which makes the event seem more interesting to dealers and worth the price even if not all of them get used.

>Also, you guys haven't shown anything that Tomo is just purely for profit, which the whole discussion was also about.
And that's not /our/ discussion. Different people, different talks. This place isn't some hivemind.
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>>10654651
Probably? "Convention" is just a label, isn't it? I think there's laws against just organizing/selling things on the streets in most places though, so you'd need a permit for sure.
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>>10654648
Yes you can. Just start an organization (can both be a for-profit company or foundation) then negotiate a venue, get some sponsors and dealers (this can even be yourself) and get going!

Of course you do need to do all the paperwork and run the event, but anyone can do it.
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>>10654616
>How about maids? everyone likes maids right?
>Maid cafes at conventions? which one is your favorite, what is your ideal type of maid cafe, should a maid cafe try to open in the Netherlands outside of conventions?
To me maid cafes should be mostly about the gimmick and experience they offer. Basically it's you and your group being the honoured guests, while maids and butlers serve and entertain you. I don't feel like any of the current maid cafes really gets it right. Sparkling Potpourri came close at some point but only during slow hours when things are more relaxed and even then their food and drinks are quite bad to put it softly.

Inspired by the image you posted (cyber maid best maid), one thing I would love to see at a Dutch maid cafe is for each member to play a more defined character. Even something basic as having each maid and butler follow a different character trope with fitting changes to their outfit would add a lot. Have that strict older leader, the tsundere who hates being assigned to baka you, the clumsy ditz who playfully messes up orders, the idol who believes she's super famous, the shy one who writes notes, a gull who shits on your plate, pecks your face and caws... Well, perhaps not that last one. But I do believe it would add a lot to the gimmick which is now mostly just everyone playing the same role. Also with each maid offering a different experience it gives customers a reason to come back which is nice. Then again I know how tiring it gets to play a character all day so maybe that's a bit too much to ask.
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>>10654651
>So I could even hold a block party and call it a convention?
Yes, however organizing as a foundation comes with fiscal and likely financial perks.
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>>10654660
I also think the experience is important about maid cafes, but I wonder if going the Akiba maid route would be too extreme for the average con goer. Image the maids going all "moe moe kyun" when serving you food, that would make one awkward experience.
More different character archetypes sounds nice and makes the maids a bit more than just girls dressing up, but I doubt the average cosplayer has the acting skills to pull it off. I wonder how many are able to understand when a maid is just being tsundere and not bad costumer service.
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>>10654648
>This discussion makes me curious, what is required to start your own convention?
For starters a plan to work base things on as size and content changes everything that follows.

Next is money that one is willing to invest and potentially lose. Starting a foundation (somewhat optional), venue, permits (if necessary), BUMA if you play any music, equipment (ie stage, music, tables, chairs etc), compensation for event holders and volunteers, internet domain and hosting, software licenses, event security, first aid, promotion and such all costs money and a lot has to be paid before you see any income. And even then there's no guarantee they'll break even after the fact.

Finally it comes down to gathering the right people to get aboard. Choices are especially limited if nobody gets paid but if possible those with motivation, prior experience or a willingness to learn are what one wants. Gather enough people to cover the basic positions, don't be afraid to say no and never take in an "idea person". Having a few friends is fine, but I wouldn't go with an entire friend group as organising requires a different dynamic not everyone can handle. Besides I doubt all of them would be useful anyway.

>Could in theory three random people here start their own organization and con?
As long as they do their research, gather the funds and put in enough effort, definitely!

>How difficult will it be to start a new Dutch con in this day and age?
Post-COVID it shouldn't be too hard as long as the plans are realistic. Start small, aim for natural growth so your crew can learn without mistakes being the end of the world and build yourself a reputation. But now really isn't the right time to launch a new event. There's just too much uncertainty and risk involved which ruins the odds of that much needed initial success.

Also do note I am probably still oversimplifying.
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>>10654701
>Also do note I am probably still oversimplifying.
To put it mildly.

Working with volunteers for example comes with their own set of regulations and laws. You want to sell tickets, and the administration behind that has to adhere to privacy regulations and laws. Tax laws, have your financial administration up to date in case your foundation goes belly up, it could answer that very important question who is responsible and if you are to blame or just the foundation as a legal person.

Other questions, sponsors, donors or subsidy? ANBI of SBBI status (not very likely)? But it is worth it to look into it. Register your foundation at the Chamber of Commerce (KvK) and the founding of a foundation requires a notarial deed/will.
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>>10654952
>To put it mildly
I mean I've never been one for legal and finances. Get the right person for the job, right?

Also here's some more items that come to mind now that we're at it. I'm not looking to explain everything or make a full list, just want to give people an idea how much work goes into a (large) convention. There's marketing if you actually want any visitors, lots of networking, arranging dealers, artists, food as well as event content, writing contracts, finding volunteers and training them (ie stewards), making rosters and build plans, finalize the programming and visitor information on time for print, continuously answering visitor questions on socials and email. Also want to cry? Have some COVID guidelines! They change every few weeks so happy planning.

Moving on to the execution you have all the logistics involved which can be a headache on its own, building up the convention, instructing volunteers so everything gets done on time, making sure event rooms/areas are set up for each event, dealing with incidents which will happen no matter what, ensure your special guests are happy, stuffing your face with taiyaki, realise you forgot to arrange a taiyaki stand, weep in despair while Komm Susser Tod plays as life has no meaning without taiyaki.

But life goes on and so do you, because now the convention is over and it's time to tear the place down, deal with things like trash disposal and storage, ensuring all bills are paid and volunteers thanked and compensated. Go home and sleep, ask visitors for feedback and perhaps react to make them feel heard. Also keep an eye out for unnoticed incidents and take action when necessary, not everything gets reported after all. Evaluate things internally, make plans for improvement and relax until the circus starts all over again for next year's edition.

TL;DR: (large) conventions are a lot of work to pull off.
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It is pretty much like running a company given the amount work and money involved in anything the size of Abunai, Animecon and bigger!
>>
I guess that explains why no one tries to become the next big weekend con or why so many cons end after only one edition.
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>>10655237
>I guess that explains why no one tries to become the next big weekend con or why so many cons end after only one edition.
And that is not only limited to amateurs with a passion for cosplay and anime & manga. Y'all remember Epicon? That was from a firm with a lot of money behind it, but with lousy planning, no real contact whatsoever with the target audience. It was an epic lesson on how not to.

Start small, the first Animecon in 1999 had only 250 visitors and crew milling around.
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>>10655380
Nonsense, I'm sure that promised second edition from when Epicon split up western and eastern content will happen any day now. All it takes is for the organiser to come back after fleeing the country with all their money, finally paying the models and crew and whatnot.
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>>10655237
I mean why start your own event with that goal to begin with? Most conventions start as friend and group gatherings that, often jokingly, grow into something bigger over time. To them it's a fun passion project, not a race to be king of the hill where numbers and profits are all that counts.

A lot of event plans never go come to fruition, others were never intended to be reoccurring. From the ones who do make it past a few editions many quickly fall apart for different reasons. Poor decision making, ignoring the community, lack of direction, in-fighting, staff members leaving with no replacements in sight, failing to transition from a group of friends to a structured organisation; we've seen it all. Even the largest conventions aren't immune, growth always comes with risk and in the end everyone involved is only human.

I just hope everyone regains their motivation once things get back to normal. It's been forever since that wave of new events popping up everywhere. Seeing something fresh is definitely welcome at this point.
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In the meanwhile I am getting reports from people visiting Dokomi having a good time while wearing masks and keeping their distances.
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Tomo and angry facebook posters, ban, ban and ... ban
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>>10656738
What do you expect when you're being toxic... Just ignore them if you don't like em...
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>>10656745
>Paying visitors leaving bad reviews and complaints after being disappointed from an event that did not deliver on its content
>The same visitors reposting said reviews and complaints because Tomo keeps deleting everything
>ur being toxic!!!1!
This is going to be a fun week.
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>>10656781
Yes because you got a market as explained, but still pretending it was unexpected... wait a minute....
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>>10656818
>Yes because you got a market as explained, but still pretending it was unexpected... wait a minute....
Knock it off, this edition was never worth the 20 euros entrance fee.
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>>10656818
I didn't get anything because I didn't go nor am I posting on their Facebook. All I'm doing is watching the start of a fire which feels especially nice after a thread full of defending this shitshow. But whatever helps you cope. Just ignore anyone with criticism if you don't like them, right?

>>10656821
I feel bad for those who bought their ticket with the promise of a full event. Instead all they got was a small market that judging from what I've seen so far barely delivered. They didn't get refunds or compensation, only a message telling them "just sell your ticket if you want to go". But they were later explained they would get a market so surely it must be fine!
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Any photographs from Tomo this weekend?
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>>10656845
>I feel bad for those who bought their ticket with the promise of a full event.
Which they consciously voted for themselves and a full event was never promised, nor could you expect that with covid restrictions.
That you expected a full event is your brainfart.
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>>10656821
If you bought the ticket on time, it wouldn't be 20 euro's, so that means you just bought the too late. That's YOUR mistake.
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>>10656891
>Which they consciously voted for themselves and a full event was never promised, nor could you expect that with covid restrictions.
>That you expected a full event is your brainfart.

>This is going to be a fun week.

And so it begins
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>>10656891
hi tomo staff
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>>10651383
I'll give you guys the big juice
Tomo left anigenda
They left because you need to be a non-profit to be member of Anigenda, and obviously tomo is slowly going for-profit.
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>>10656891
Tomo themselves originally advertised TomoCon as a full-sized event. This means full programming, location and all. Those who bought into it back then did so with the expectation of that promised content being delivered. What they received instead was a different event which only shared the original name. To blame people for actually trusting Tomo's words doesn't change a thing about the facts. But it's good to see we both agree you can't trust a word coming from the folk over at Tomo.

As for the poll you mentioned, the answer wasn't unanimous thus a portion still got fucked. They did not agree to the large proposed changes which voids their purchase, making them entitled to a refund or compensation which Tomo refused. I also have my doubts on how well informed people were regarding the consequences of their choice. Perhaps the poll invite message explained things, but the poll result announcement stating "we will now look at what will be possible on the selected date" brings me severe doubt. Hopefully someone reading this can clear that up for the sake of conversation.

But let's end on a positive note. Because despite all the doubts and lack of information, they seem to have a good job with upholding COVID guidelines. From what I've seen so far stands were well spread and distancing was being maintained. So kudos for that, such a shame dealers had to leave early due to poor weather conditions.

>>10656907
>That's YOUR mistake.
While I don't appreciate the buyer blaming, I have to agree that buying a €20 ticket for a lousy market that isn't worth it is pretty silly.
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>>10656938
02dyt
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>>10656938

Tomo has truly mastered the art of tard wrangling and is now trying to monetize on all the tomotards they have wrangled over the years. Pretty based, would do the same.
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>>10656891
Erm, no, it doesn't work like that. If a part of the program is canceled, there should be adequate compensation. Usually this is done by adding items of nearly equal value or format. Otherwise, a full compensation should be offered. That is what the law says at least.
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>>10656953
I would agree if tomotards actually existed. Average age at tomo stays 13 years because everyone over the age of 15 moves on to actual cons.
Reminder that one of the main organisers has never watched an anime or read a manga in his life and seemingly for no reason joined this "teen focussed" con.

Can't wait until they start a furry con too
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>>10656955
>the year is 2025
>Tomocon (TM) has just opened their Tomo zoo (TM) furry con
>The benevolent overlords at TomoCorp (TM) see the profitability of a zoo and sells entrance tickets to unsuspecting norman families
>The profits are reinvested into the new and improved TomoCon (TM) where instead of a empty field with some stalls it is now a significantly larger empty field
>There is enough empty field for each TomoTard (TM) to graze freely in order to dodge the downright extortionist TomoFoodstall (TM)

Tomo will be a farming company and it will be glorious. Pic related: The future tomo congoer grazing the Tomo fields (TM).
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>>10656955
>Can't wait until they start a furry con too
I can see it now: TomoYiff, the stickiest get-together since the crew visited to the local sauna. Experience our new TomoTaste menu selling cans of Bonzo, Catisfactions treats and the finest bird seed. Enjoy our live reading of the Lusty Argonian Maid, our judged fashion show and the Howl at the Moon karaoke. Visit the dealer room to find only the finest adult diapers mursuit cleaning supplies and ball gags for those bad bad pets that won't listen. Games we have plenty, including fetch and a laser dot. And then when night falls, it's time to get close and personal at TomoBeats: Dark (18+). TomoYiff, see you soon!

All jokes aside, do we have even a furry convention in the Netherlands? Surely there should be enough of them in NL, Flanders and the border region of Germany to hold an event.

>>10656959
This truly is the best timeline! We will finally have a place where we can dump all the thots wearing cow bikinis. Even better, there already is a barn near Amsterdam that has all the experience and equipment needed to take good care of them. With Tomo's reach combined with their hucow skills they will be unstoppable!

(Also looked up sauce, it's Uba, aka Milk Money)
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>>10656907
>If you bought the ticket on time, it wouldn't be 20 euro's, so that means you just bought the too late. That's YOUR mistake.
Blame the customer, such a classic! And such a stupid one!
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>>10657082
Oh no. I don't blame the customer. There is real criticism to be had! They only had 2 weeks to reschedule the event so the organization was pure chaos. On Sunday there was no gameroom due to tents being blown away and it looked like they fucked up transportation of stuff since every 20 min a car with trailer was driving up and down the enterance.

See what I'm doing here? I'm addressing the actual flaws rather than bitch about expectations which are completely unrealistic during COVID or bitch about blatent lies.
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>>10657095
>If you bought the ticket on time, it wouldn't be 20 euro's, so that means you just bought the too late. That's YOUR mistake.

There where two acquisitions in that line, you should buy on time and you should lower you expectations. And then you said it is my fault.
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>>10657106
>>If you bought the ticket on time, it wouldn't be 20 euro's.

While true, I never said this, so you're misquoting, or youre mistaking me for someone else.

My point is that if you voted for the continuation of tomo despite covid (93% did do) from that point on it's not realistic to expect a full convention, so that criticism goes out the window. Instead you should criticize what was there, because even under these extenuating circumstances there were some fuck ups.

Criticize what was there and poorly executed rather than "what could've been"
>>
Looking at the mess this is something that the Tomo foundation should have been avoiding as the plaque. But they did not and are now blaming their visitors for high expectations and with excuses that they could not organize the convention in two weeks time?
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>>10657124
Expecting a full animecon-like event under current COVID-restrictions is unreasonable and you know that.

However, I am of the opinion it could've been better had it been given more time.
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>>10656944
>I also have my doubts on how well informed people were regarding the consequences of their choice. Perhaps the poll invite message explained things, but the poll result announcement stating "we will now look at what will be possible on the selected date" brings me severe doubt.
That would explain a thing or two about why people were disappointed with what they ended up getting. Imagine ordering a fancy steak at a restaurant and the waiter asking you if you want it at 6pm or 7pm. You say 6pm and 6pm sharp the waiter brings you an apple, only then explaining he asked because the kitchen doesn't open until 6:30. And if that wasn't bad enough the apple turns out to be sour and you still get charged for that fancy steak. Looks like that's pretty much what happened here.
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>>10657132
Let me fix that:
>Waiter tells you "we're not allowed to bring steaks before 7 p.m. do you want to wait until 7 p.m. or do you want an apple now?"
>Guest: Don't care, I'm starving! Just give me something now!"

Complaining about the apple being sour is valid!
Complaining about not getting your steak is hypocrisy.
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>>10657135
That only applies IF the customer was informed about no steaks being available nor what other dishes would be. But the customer wasn't so the point still stands.
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>>10657138
If the government bans steaks, you are informed.
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>>10657143
And if the restaurant keeps steak on their menu despite a national ban and pretends they can give a customer steak while they ask them when they want their steak, only to afterwards deliver an apple while charging for the steak the restaurant is at fault for deceiving their customer.

Which brings us back to the original post, were people properly noticed about the consequences of their vote or not?
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>>10656265
Yeah it was fun, and everybody wore masks and they were really strict about it. Keeping distance, not really though.
>>10657128
And yet Dokomi managed to do it in exactly the same weekend, 30 minutes from the Dutch border.
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>>10656955
Such nonsense. The problem with tomo is precisely that we'll established community members keep attending the con because it's relatively cheap and easy. Tomo wouldn't be such a hot topic of only the bottom tier of the community attended.
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>>10657153
>And yet Dokomi managed to do it in exactly the same weekend, 30 minutes from the Dutch border

Different country, different rules.
Oh and no complaints of bootleg there huh?
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>>10657157
Good thing the coronavirus is kind enough to obey each country's different laws. It's also funny how they didn't even scan test result QR codes. Could've easily just copied somebody else's and just change the name.
Also, you can't buy bootleg at cons if you just don't buy anything at cons.
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>>10657157
>Oh and no complaints of bootleg there huh?
Here, you dropped this. You might want to put it away before people call you out.
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>>10656938
I heard the staff made fun of Tomo being non-professional. Nothing such thing was said, so nice way of taking shit out of your ass... Also, it was all about the bootleg issue, which went into bullying in anigenda....
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>>10657166
Nope they left anigenda because anigenda persues different goals from tomo. Anigenda has a meeting every month where they discuss how to "best suit the community" etc. Tomo doesn't want that, they just want a light-hearted low-barrier-to-entry cheap event for everyone. They hate the competitive atmosphere of abunai and animecon, which is why they deliberately don't have a cosplay competition, but a cosplay catwalk to which everyone can attend. Hell, they don't even appeal primarily to cosplayers. It's fine if cosplayers come, but it's not the main purpose. Tomo doesn't fit in anigenda, so they went out!
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>>10657172
>Nope they left anigenda because anigenda persues different goals from tomo.
That's also their good right... ?

>Anigenda has a meeting every month where they discuss how to "best suit the community" etc. Tomo doesn't want that, they just want a light-hearted low-barrier-to-entry cheap event for everyone.
That's a little hard in the corner there, Tomo has also the visitor in mind, it might be your own views how they come over, but just thinking it, doesn't make it true...

>They hate the competitive atmosphere of abunai and animecon, which is why they deliberately don't have a cosplay competition, but a cosplay catwalk to which everyone can attend.
I'm not surprised, how Abunai violated a contract they signed with Tomo... Trust is far to find with Abunai, and Animecon, well, they have a beef with Tomo for a long while too, but for their own opinions that do not correspondent with the way Tomo is branding themselves.
Also, I don't see the problem, they like to be a open atmosphere more then a little group of pre-selected cosplay groups or solo acts... ?

>Hell, they don't even appeal primarily to cosplayers.
I beg your pardon, but their cosplay workshop is a hot item on their events...

>It's fine if cosplayers come, but it's not the main purpose. Tomo doesn't fit in anigenda, so they went out!
They went out cause the rest was pushing Tomo in a corner for their choices... Nothing more and nothing less.
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>>10657174
Accusing someone of lies, based on biased assumptions made in a split second rather than checking the facts.

How do I know that? This response came in a mere 30 seconds after I posted my explanation, not enough time to even check anything. So you're just shallow!
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Enough apologist discussion, where are the pictures of the event?
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>>10657172
This is bullshit, anigenda has like 2 meetings a year at most. You also seem to imply that Abunai and Animecon mainly focus on cosplay? To me, it seems like their audience is anime fans and gamers instead. Otherwise, why have events like DDR and visual novel playthroughs.
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>>10657220
Abunai and Animecon have these cosplay competitions, because they want to make a whole competition out of it. On a negative side of this, the whole cosplay competition corner there becomes a elitist community, and you can already smell that on FB pretty much, where cosplayers and cosplay groups left and right attack each other... It's disgusting really..
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>>10657232
Cosplaygroups attacking each other? Do you still live in 2016??? Cosplaygroups barely exist anymore. The only group that 'somewhat' exists is Prism. There are some duo's left but those are wallflowers that prefer to focus on cosplay rather than Drama.

I do however agree that the compo community feels elitist. As there is only 5 people competing on the higher level in the whole country if not less. And I predict that it will become even less, as people are more interested in their Social Media prescence than showing off actual well rounded skillsets within Cosplay.
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Reminder:
>>10651774
There's at least 3 apologists here. One of them even argues with the other 2 for some reason. Don't reply - They won't let you "win" any argument. It's like falling for bait at this point.
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>>10657175
Obvious bias is obvious
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So, anyone got photos from Dokomi?
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>>10657278
You mean, you're points are being dunked into a hole, put on fire, and people that argue with nonsense reasons are digging along, while on fire... Yes, yes that is called "loosing a discussion". There is no reason to win a discussion, when talking to braincell-less people.
>>
>>10657304
Yes, because pointing out your flawed points, makes you biased... The logics ! holy shit !
>>
Is anyone else familiar with the Narcissist Prayer? I'm bringing it up because I'm starting to notice a pattern with the defence tactics being used in the current and previous thread. For those unfamiliar:

That didn't happen: denial and history rewriting.
And if it did, it wasn't that bad: minimisation.
And if it was, that's not a big deal: gaslighting and more history rewriting.
And if it is, that's not my fault: blame shifting.
And if it was, I didn't mean it: playing the victim and avoiding responsibility.
And if I did, you deserved it: projection, more blame shifting and insults.

Everything gets blamed on something or someone else. Event got cancelled, it's the community's fault for being mean to us. You voted, so it's your fault shit wasn't well organised. You bought late, your mistake you overspend. You complained thus are toxic and your ban was justified. Past happenings such as the mail send to dealers bragging about bypassing regulations last year get denied from ever happening. Others happenings get altered such as when they claimed to be the first field lab event or making things sound fine because someone else has done a similar thing. The moment a discussion is heading towards defeat or valid points are being raised they either go ignored out because there is no way to fight it or immediately gets followed up by attacks on the person. Trying to sidetrack discussions by trying to shift to another subject isn't uncommon either. Playing the victim isn't uncommon either, either after the fact like when tomo got cancelled last year or preemptively
with the bootleg remark. But the most noteworthy thing of all is what >>10657278 also noticed: not ONCE did they admit defeat or the making of any mistakes.

I've got to say, the mind games some insecure narcissists are willing to play just to avoid the truth and realisation they aren't perfect truly is astonishing.
>>
>>10657357
>Everything gets blamed on something or someone else.
That's pretty much a description of humankind... Welcome...

>Event got cancelled, it's the community's fault for being mean to us.
If some people in the community starts with death threats, it's not a question about being mean, that's just being a total douchbag.

>You voted, so it's your fault shit wasn't well organised.
What do you mean with that, the Tomo event went pretty smooth, except for the storm that happened on saturday...

>You bought late, your mistake you overspend.
That's more of a "duh". If you go and buy last minute, of course the ticket will be more expansive... That's with like all conventions...

>You complained thus are toxic and your ban was justified.
If you complain just because you're bored, falls under being toxic and salty. It's getting annoying when you're complaining with nothing then a "I don't like you guys, so you must suck!" kind of attitudes..

>Past happenings such as the mail send to dealers bragging about bypassing regulations last year get denied from ever happening.
No idea what that was about, but, what ?

>Others happenings get altered such as when they claimed to be the first field lab event or making things sound fine because someone else has done a similar thing.
They technically were the first one who did a convention in the middle of a pandemic, so yeah, unless you got a example which convention did it earlier ?

>The moment a discussion is heading towards defeat or valid points are being raised they either go ignored out because there is no way to fight it or immediately gets followed up by attacks on the person.
You mean when valid points are given why someone's hate towards Tomo is either unfair or invalid, and suddenly the whole discussion dies down, cause there is nothing else to kick against ? Quiet funny yes.
>>
>>10657357
>Trying to sidetrack discussions by trying to shift to another subject isn't uncommon either.
Both parties do that, in order to stop the useless discussion of who is at fault, when nobody is at fault. Well, except for the person openly saying on FB that he/she/it contact the government about Tomo's event, and how bad it is, and that they should take action on it. I wonder what kind of action, as they follow the rules as depicted by the government in the first place... Cringe worthy very much...

>Playing the victim isn't uncommon either, either after the fact like when tomo got cancelled last year or preemptively with the bootleg remark.
Yes because it's always fun to get death threats or violent responses from people who don't even buy or bought a ticket in the first place... Seriously now.. ?
As for the bootleg remark, it's still not lawfully allowed to kick randomly or threaten product sellers, cause of a suspicion of selling bootleg. Oh btw, this has been discussed with various lawyers, and it's just bad practice to decide as a staff member, without any good knowledge if something is bootleg or not, to decide to kick some off based on suspicions. Only the Customs are pretty much lawfully allowed to decide if something is bootleg, or not. Even "house rules" aren't enough to kick vendors off. Anyway, go ask a random lawyer, and be amazed.

>But the most noteworthy thing of all is what >>10657278 also noticed: not ONCE did they admit defeat or the making of any mistakes.
You mean the kids that keep attacking Tomo left and right for bullshit reasons ? Or do you mean Tomo who hasn't done anything wrong ? I'm still waiting for any evidence that they are doing wrong, only "suspicions" and "from hear-say". It's like a Johnny Depp vs Amber Heard kind of shit: just keep screaming until the wrong becomes a right somehow for no apparent reason. I guess that's what you like ?
>>
>>10657357
>I've got to say, the mind games some insecure narcissists are willing to play just to avoid the truth and realisation they aren't perfect truly is astonishing.
You're talking now about the philosophy of 4chan itself... I think you never have meet a narcissist before, but I did, and 4chan is one huge narcissistic environment, welcome I guess... ?
>>
>>10657444
>>10657457
>That's pretty much a description of humankind... Welcome...
Minimisation

>If some people in the community starts with death threats, it's not a question about being mean, that's just being a total douchbag.
Playing the victim

>What do you mean with that, the Tomo event went pretty smooth, except for the storm that happened on saturday...
Denial

>That's more of a "duh". If you go and buy last minute, of course the ticket will be more expansive... That's with like all conventions...
Blame shifting

>If you complain just because you're bored, falls under being toxic and salty. It's getting annoying when you're complaining with nothing then a "I don't like you guys, so you must suck!" kind of attitudes..
Projection and blame shifting

>They technically were the first one who did a convention in the middle of a pandemic, so yeah, unless you got a example which convention did it earlier ?
Gaslighting and rewriting history

>You mean when valid points are given why someone's hate towards Tomo is either unfair or invalid, and suddenly the whole discussion dies down, cause there is nothing else to kick against ? Quiet funny yes.
Denial and gaslighting

>Both parties do that, in order to stop the useless discussion of who is at fault, when nobody is at fault.
Minimisation

>Cringe worthy very much...
Projection plus ad hominem

>Yes because it's always fun to get death threats or violent responses from people who don't even buy or bought a ticket in the first place... Seriously now.. ?
Playing the victim and rewriting history

>As for the bootleg remark, it's still not lawfully allowed to kick randomly or threaten product sellers, cause of a suspicion of selling bootleg.
Change of subject, argument was victim playing with he dokomi post.

>You mean the kids that keep attacking Tomo left and right for bullshit reasons ? Or do you mean Tomo who hasn't done anything wrong ?
Projection and denial.

Thanks for proving my point.
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>>10657493
>Thanks for proving my point.
You mean the point you're not making, cause you're trying to downplay everything, everybody is saying ?
Everything you just responded to, has 1) no point, 2) no reason other then trying to downplay other people, and 3) putting others in a corner because you are not agreeing.

You're basically trying to gaslight the discussion, because you don't like the end result. That's my point, have a nice day :)
>>
>>10657493
my conclusion is that you are trying to dodge all the points the person made,by attacking the person. you have not responded to any of his remarks at all,other then to categorize his response, but totally not responding on the remarks. that makes you a asshole.
>>
>>10657654
And yet this nothingness got you triggered to the point of making 4 posts :^)

>>10657665
I am definitely an asshole but I also don't mind admitting whenever I'm wrong or fucked something up. Congratulations, now we've both identified our true nature.
>>
>>10657689
It did, I do honestly find the response interesting nevertheless, but it's so off-topic, since you're trying to categorize a response, rather then responding to it in a whole. In the end, your response does nothing to the conversation.
>>
At least the hilariously bad English in this thread is keeping me entertained lmao
>>
>>10657724
It wouldn't be cringe worthy, if you didn't use the word "lmao" in that sentence.
>>
>>10657725
Let's use XD instead
>>
>>10657457
>As for the bootleg remark, it's still not lawfully allowed to kick randomly or threaten product sellers, cause of a suspicion of selling bootleg. Oh btw, this has been discussed with various lawyers, and it's just bad practice to decide as a staff member, without any good knowledge if something is bootleg or not, to decide to kick some off based on suspicions. Only the Customs are pretty much lawfully allowed to decide if something is bootleg, or not. Even "house rules" aren't enough to kick vendors off. Anyway, go ask a random lawyer, and be amazed.

Hey, TomoMark,
It has been proven in the previous thread that you are wrong on this part. It has been proven in other treads that you are wrong on this part. It has been proven in court that you are wrong on this part. It has been discussed in lengthy theses that you are wrong on this part.
What makes it more unbelievable, is that you say you have discussed it with several lawyers. Right, like all lawyers know about copyright legislation. And that they are willing to teach you without any monetary incentive.

You arse blowing smoke out of your arse and it is clear to see for all.
>>
>>10657654
>>10657697
Different anon, but allow me. I left out the bits I can't judge on.

>That's pretty much a description of humankind... Welcome...
Double minimisation. First by justifying actions by claiming everyone does it, then by falsely claiming essentially nobody is capable of reflecting or willing to take responsibility for their actions.

>If some people in the community starts with death threats, it's not a question about being mean, that's just being a total douchbag.
Playing victim and generalisation. One alleged death threat doesn't mean everyone who raised criticism or doubts supports them nor does it void their opinions. Also an attack on person to discredit them.

>That's more of a "duh". If you go and buy last minute, of course the ticket will be more expansive... That's with like all conventions...
Minimisation and blame shifting. Again justifying something because everyone does it, then shifting the blame for overpaying by being late. Also does this mean you agree charging €20 was too much? Because that raises the question of why to even charge that much in the first place.

>If you complain just because you're bored, falls under being toxic and salty. It's getting annoying when you're complaining with nothing then a "I don't like you guys, so you must suck!" kind of attitudes..
Projection and blame shifting. People got banned and ignored even on their FB for raising valid criticism and concerns before and in the present. Projecting the image of them all being bored toxic haters, thus justifying the response. Blame shifting by making it sound it's their fault for complaining in the first place.

>They technically were the first one who did a convention in the middle of a pandemic, so yeah, unless you got a example which convention did it earlier ?
Gaslighting and rewriting history. Originally it wasn't a field lab. Then we had a hard unproven claim of it being one, and now it's going with the technically route.

Cont
>>
>>10657755
>>10657654
>>10657697
>You mean when valid points are given why someone's hate towards Tomo is either unfair or invalid, and suddenly the whole discussion dies down, cause there is nothing else to kick against ? Quiet funny yes.
Denial and gaslighting. Denying even the slightest possibility of any criticism or feedback being valid. Gaslighting by making it sound you never ignored anything and instead the other party is doing the one ignoring.

>Both parties do that, in order to stop the useless discussion of who is at fault, when nobody is at fault.
Minimisation and projection. Again, justifying actions by claiming everyone does it. Projection by using an assumption on ones motivation.

>Cringe worthy very much...
Projection through an attack on the person for calling them cringy because you disagree on their actions.

>Yes because it's always fun to get death threats or violent responses from people who don't even buy or bought a ticket in the first place... Seriously now.. ?
See previous victim playing as it applies here too. Also since when is buying a ticket required to raise points regarding the safety of a non essential market during a pandemic lockdown?

>As for the bootleg remark, it's still not lawfully allowed to kick randomly or threaten product sellers, cause of a suspicion of selling bootleg.
As >>10657493 mentioned that was about the "unfair y no bootleg callout!" in the Dokomi post. That's victim playing and a whataboutism by directly calling out unfairness about a different subject. As for laws, I'm not a lawyer so I'm not going to argue with that.

>You mean the kids that keep attacking Tomo left and right for bullshit reasons ? Or do you mean Tomo who hasn't done anything wrong ?
Projection and denial. Again denying tomo can do anything wrong, projection by calling the other party kids to make them sound less credible.

At first I thought this was just Anon dropping a meme as bait but damn...
>>
>>10657740
>Hey, TomoMark,
Not even close, Mark doesn't bother with kids here, since it's a pointless discussion most of the time, but I don't mind if you keep believing this is Mark.

>It has been proven in the previous thread that you are wrong on this part.
There was nothing proven, it was actually proven that random people saying otherwise compared to a lawyer who says it is true, so not sure if you overlooked that completely...

>It has been proven in other treads that you are wrong on this part.
What part, that the customs are the only lawful organization that can decide if something is bootleg ? If you still do not believe this, contact any lawyer about licenses and copyright knowledge, see how long it takes for your brain to understand I was right.

>It has been proven in court that you are wrong on this part.
If you would paste a SOURCE of this so-called court case, which there isn't, that would be nice. As long as you do not post any of the source you're talking about, I would say this is a blatant lie.

>It has been discussed in lengthy theses that you are wrong on this part.
You mean the people who kept screaming that customs are not the lawful organization, and who haven't proven anything or shown any source whatsoever ? Yeah...

>What makes it more unbelievable, is that you say you have discussed it with several lawyers.
I haven't seen anything from anybody else who as shown a direct source from a lawyer either, so what gives, right.

>Right, like all lawyers know about copyright legislation.
Okay, it's clear you have no idea how a lawyers firm works. There are lawyers who specialize themselves in various subjects, and one of them is copyright-law.

>And that they are willing to teach you without any monetary incentive.
You do know there are organizations, that if you pay a yearly fee, they will help you look up things, right ? It seems you need to still learn a lot.

Have a nice day kid.
>>
>>10657755
>First by justifying actions by claiming everyone does it, then by falsely claiming essentially nobody is capable of reflecting or willing to take responsibility for their actions.
It's pretty much a description of everybody, it's not rocket-science...

>One alleged death threat doesn't mean everyone who raised criticism or doubts supports them nor does it void their opinions.
That is literally downplaying death threats. One death threat is one too many already.
There is no problem if you don't agree with Tomo, but death threats and threatening with violence, that's going over a certain line of acceptance.

>Also does this mean you agree charging €20 was too much?
Well, if you know that the changes from a convention to a market, on a different place, with a lot of equipment that needs to be arranged, costs money, then yes it's justified. If you have bought a ticket a long while ago, you would have paid a acceptable amount. As I said, Abunai en Animecon does the same, you don't hear anybody screaming hell and death about it, do you ? So Tomo does it, and suddenly it's a horror ? Come on...

>People got banned and ignored even on their FB for raising valid criticism and concerns before and in the present.
They got banned and blocked, simply because people became obnoxious, and a lot of those people didn't even buy a ticket or attended it, so why bother ? It's like someone from America telling me as a Dutch guy how to live my life ? Seriously ?

>Originally it wasn't a field lab.
No shit, but it was a nice thing to put themselves on the news.

>Then we had a hard unproven claim of it being one, and now it's going with the technically route.
It was not a field lab, but could be seen as one, as Tomo was the first one, in the middle of the pandemic, organizing such a thing at that time. Was it a "planned" field lab ? No, but people seen it as one. And to be honest, who gives a damn, I don't...
>>
>>10657757
>Denying even the slightest possibility of any criticism or feedback being valid.
Oh there has been not only denying, as you claim, but also explanations for certain choices. That they aren't the answers you and others like to see, is just your own denial.

>Again, justifying actions by claiming everyone does it.
Well, I think you have not understand the concept of a anonymous message board then I guess, which is yours and other people's flaw for not seeing that.

>Projection through an attack on the person for calling them cringy because you disagree on their actions.
Wait, now "I" am attacking on the person, when you and others have been constantly doing that over and over ? You guys keep trying to reflect the personal attacks when you're called back on that. That's could a double reflection technique.

>Also since when is buying a ticket required to raise points regarding the safety of a non essential market during a pandemic lockdown?
Raise points != Death Threats and threatening with violence.
I think you're skipping over a lot of the points here...

>Again denying tomo can do anything wrong, projection by calling the other party kids to make them sound less credible.
I call the critter based on their behavior on 4chan, and that comes close to being a kid. Not sure if you noticed, but I never said Tomo cannot do anything wrong. The things Tomo did is, as far as I am aware, correctly handled.

As for a fun fact, some person called the fire department because Tomo was being unsafe, and when they came, Tomo received a thumbs up how well they had their stuff done. So yeah, it seems 4chan is behind a lot of gaslighting...
>>
>>10657758
>>10657757
>>10657755
>>10657740
So one of you guys called me on personal attacking, but that's exactly what you all are doing right now.
Go think about that for a bit, before you start blurting further here, but I'm guessing the accusations and smart-ass wall of texts will come again, showing how wrong I am. Classic 4chan behavior. Have a nice day :)
>>
>>10657764
>It was not a field lab, but could be seen as one
I am not a formula 1 driver, but I have a drivers license so I could be seen as one!
>>
>>10657773
>I am not a formula 1 driver, but I have a drivers license so I could drive it with some practice
Fixed it for you. You are literally comparing apples with pears, but hey, whatever floats your boat.
>>
It was never a fieldlab experiment, don't even compare it to one!
>>
>>10657764
>It's pretty much a description of everybody, it's not rocket-science...
Let's just keep it at us having different views on the world and the people in it.

>That is literally downplaying death threats. One death threat is one too many already.
>There is no problem if you don't agree with Tomo, but death threats and threatening with violence, that's going over a certain line of acceptance.
I agree, death threats are way over the line and I strongly suggest taking legal action against them. Not once did I downplay them. All I said was that post was making it sound as if anyone who complains condones threats which isn't correct.

>Well, if you know that the changes from a convention to a market, on a different place, with a lot of equipment that needs to be arranged, costs money, then yes it's justified. If (...) amount. As I said, Abunai en Animecon does the same, you don't hear anybody screaming hell and death about it, do you ? So Tomo does it, and suddenly it's a horror ?
So you disagree on the price being too high and that's fine. Nice attempt at playing the victim and downplaying with another whataboutism. But for what it's worth to me both events mentioned are still worth it at their door price.

>They got banned and blocked, simply because people became obnoxious, and a lot of those people didn't even buy a ticket or attended it, so why bother ? It's like someone from America telling me as a Dutch guy how to live my life ? Seriously ?
Not a word on the raised criticism not being valid, so does that mean you consider criticism as a whole to be obnoxious? Because if so that's one of the reasons for shit constantly hitting the fan. People don't feel heard or taken seriously by the organisers!

>No shit, but it was a nice thing to put themselves on the news.
>Then we had a hard unproven claim of it being one, and now it's going with the technically route.
In other words, it was a lie which has now been exposed. Glad we can put that behind us now.
>>
>>10657785
>>10657757
>Oh there has been not only denying, as you claim, but also explanations for certain choices. That they aren't the answers you and others like to see, is just your own denial.
Some explanations may have been given, but the original response was formulated to indicate otherwise. Also don't bring assumptions as facts.

>Well, I think you have not understand the concept of a anonymous message board then I guess, which is yours and other people's flaw for not seeing that.
How does understanding an imageboard have anything to do with justifying your actions by claiming it's okay "because everyone does it"? Weird personal attack...

>Wait, now "I" am attacking on the person, when you and others have been constantly doing that over and over ? You guys keep trying to reflect the personal attacks when you're called back on that. That's could a double reflection technique.
Well yes, you are presenting one's actions as "cringe" just to discredit it. That's not a real reason now is it? And once again, we get an everyone does it non-argument. Wonderful.

>Raise points != Death Threats and threatening with violence.
>I think you're skipping over a lot of the points here...
See previous post

>Again denying tomo can do anything wrong, projection by calling the other party kids to make them sound less credible.
>I call the critter based on their behaviour on 4chan, and that comes close to being a kid. Not sure if you noticed, but I never said Tomo cannot do anything wrong. The things Tomo did is, as far as I am aware, correctly handled.
In other words, in your world view Tomo has not once done anything that could be considered wrong. Let's keep that at different worldviews too then.

>Some person called the fire department because Tomo was being unsafe (...) it seems 4chan is behind a lot of gaslighting...
That is assuming 4chan as a group was behind the call and supported the action. Bold claim right there.

See, we can have a civilized talk if we want to.
>>
>>10657758

>Not even close, Mark doesn't bother with kids here, since it's a pointless discussion most of the time, but I don't mind if you keep believing this is Mark.
Well, that is a roundabout admission.

>There was nothing proven, it was actually proven that random people saying otherwise compared to a lawyer who says it is true,
Court cases and theses, the actual law. Sounds a lot better than a mysterious lawyer. But I guess this is the same lawyer that said you don't have to give the option of a refund if the festival is drastically altered.

>What part, that the customs are the only lawful organization that can decide if something is bootleg?

Any party can inform an intermediary of illegal activities. The intermediary is forced to act. Check that with your imaginary lawyer.

>If you would paste a SOURCE of this so-called court case, which there isn't, that would be nice. As long as you do not post any of the source you're talking about, I would say this is a blatant lie.
Case C-494/15, Tommy Hilfiger Licensing LLC v. Delta Center, ECLI:EU:C:2016:528."


>Sauce
Again: C.J. Angelopoulos, European intermediary liability in copyright: A tort-based analysis,

>I haven't seen anything from anybody else who as shown a direct source from a lawyer either, so what gives, right.
Seriously, how many sources do you need

>Okay, it's clear you have no idea how a lawyers firm works. There are lawyers who specialize themselves in various subjects, and one of them is copyright-law.
Erm, no, you claimed to have called multiple lawyers. You pay for all of those?

>You do know there are organizations, that if you pay a yearly fee, they will help you look up things, right ? It seems you need to still learn a lot.
Again, you paid all of those?
>Have a nice day kid.
Here is a tip you need to practice: Drugs is bad, mkay? Don't do drugs. It makes you say weird thing, mkay?
>>
>>10657785
>Not a word on the raised criticism not being valid, so does that mean you consider criticism as a whole to be obnoxious? Because if so that's one of the reasons for shit constantly hitting the fan. People don't feel heard or taken seriously by the organisers!
Criticism is never wrong, but it's going a bit overboard when the same people keep on screaming about something they are not attending, or planning to come to at all. Again. criticism and having a opinion is not a bad thing, but when you keep obnoxiously nagging the people about it, when the staff has accepted their critisicm as their own opinion, then yes, it becomes very, very obnoxious and annoying. A lot of the things said (criticism) has been taken note of, as far as I hear from the staff, but of course it's not like they should change everything, because someone has their own opinion about something.

>In other words, it was a lie which has now been exposed.
I wonder though, the wording "field lab", where was this said if I may ask, cause I do remember it was being talked about on 4chan, but I cannot find anything stating about a field lab on Tomo's sites, facebook and other sources. You have perhaps a source where it was stated by Tomo staff that it was a field lab ? Would be much appreciated. If there is no source available, then I'm not sure why we are talking about a field lab, without any sources backing it up.
>>
>>10657786
>Also don't bring assumptions as facts.
So far I have only seen assumptions about everything yet, there has been no sources given, no examples where it was verified that the assumptions were verified, or "from hear-and-saying" doesn't count as any evidence or sources. Just my 2 cents here.

>How does understanding an imageboard have anything to do with justifying your actions by claiming it's okay "because everyone does it"?
Is this still about the entrance price ? Tomo is one of the cheapest conventions and/or fairs available. Abunai! or Animecon you pay like 60 to 70 euro for a ticket, which is outrageous expansive for any student alone. What do you get back for that money ? The same stuff year after year, and the same equipment that is getting worse and worse they use. They spend most of that money for expansive artists, which is pretty much a wrong priority. Just saying.

>Well yes, you are presenting one's actions as "cringe" just to discredit it.
I guess everything else that was said to me in the first response doesn't fall under personal attacks ? Right, so when I defend myself, then you can simply turn the tables and say "Oh no you attack me !" while forgetting that I've been attacked in the first place... Right...

>In other words, in your world view Tomo has not once done anything that could be considered wrong.
Correct, and this is my opinion. If you think they did something "wrong", that is your opinion, and I would gladly respect it. However, that doesn't mean I would change my mind, purely based on your opinion without facts and/or sources, which, as I said before, has still not been given since this day forward.

>That is assuming 4chan as a group was behind the call and supported the action. Bold claim right there.
It was being discussed on 4chan by the person who did that, so what do you expect where the finger is pointing to.. ?

Continue>>>
>>
>>10657786
>That is assuming 4chan as a group was behind the call and supported the action. Bold claim right there.
Also, I've found some FB people communicating with various organizations in the government and such, who are pretty sure active on 4chan as well, who have tried to sabotage Tomo by pretending it was unsafe and shit, so you tell me if it's a bold claim or not right now ;)
>>
>>10657798
>I wonder though, the wording "field lab", where was this said if I may ask, cause I do remember it was being talked about on 4chan, but I cannot find anything stating about a field lab on Tomo's sites, facebook and other sources. You have perhaps a source where it was stated by Tomo staff that it was a field lab ? Would be much appreciated. If there is no source available, then I'm not sure why we are talking about a field lab, without any sources backing it up.

Previous thread!

>Anonymous 05/21/21(Fri)12:18:31 No.10616503▶
>>10616501
>Not sugarcoating it.
>The major of Zwolle wanted it to continue so they could see how to organize a covid-proof event. It was basically a fieldlab before that existed.
>>
>>10657786
>See, we can have a civilized talk if we want to.
If there is no personal attacks going left and right, it's always possible to have a civilized talk, but some anonymous people here like to talk shit, but indeed, this is a better conversation so far
>>
>>10625627
>They weren't, it was the first "field lab" with full permission from the government. They weren't circumventing any rules! they even arranged entrance testing, but didn't want to communicate it to avoid conspiracy crazy people from nagging online. It was only when the police called that some people wanted to go there to protest when it was cancelled.
It wasn't worth it.

>Don't suddenly claim they're "circumventing the rules" when you don't know the full story.
>>
>>10657805
Read carefully what it says:

>It was basically a fieldlab before that existed.
"basically" doesn't mean they have stated it was a fieldlab. Again, if you read it, it says they are saying that it "felt" like a fieldlab, but it was not official communicated as that, so again, no sources and just someone sprouting that word.
>>
>They weren't, it was the first "field lab" with full permission from the government.
>>
>>10657809
Any website URL where Tomo has stated this? I'm pretty sure it's nowhere stated it was a fieldlab. Anybody could have said that.
>>
>>10657810
They didn't publicly announce it because conspiracy crazy people would poop all over Facebook when they'd find out there would be enterance covid testing.

So no official public press release, you'd have to take someone's word for it.
>>
What a lovely piece of rewriting history!
>>
>>10657813
Please show me the original statement... oh you don't have it ? /sad
>>
>>10657813
I've seen the documents, you'll have to take my word for it.
>>
>>10657818
>Please show me the original statement... oh you don't have it ? /sad

>>They weren't, it was the first "field lab" with full permission from the government.

Somebody said this in the previous thread, a tomoshill or perhaps not, we will never know. However with a decent PR in your foundation these rumors would have been dealt with rather quickly.
>>
>>10657813
It's not rewriting of history, it's an unreliable source. This doesn't mean it isn't true, it means you "don't know" but you could always call the municipality of Zwolle to check it if you have any doubts
>>
>>10657821
Yeahhh, no.
>>
>>10657822
"Somebody said" is what I've seen too much here. If you claim something, and have no source, other then "my friend, of his friend, that knows someone", is no evidence or credible, at all.
>>
>>10657821
>I've seen the documents, you'll have to take my word for it.
>>10657830
>"Somebody said" is what I've seen too much here. If you claim something, and have no source, other then "my friend, of his friend, that knows someone", is no evidence or credible, at all.
>>
>>10657843
So the burden of proof is back with the Tomo shills, either those documents exist or they don't because of the claim:
> I've seen the documents, you'll have to take my word for it.
And since I am not taking his word for it.
>If you claim something, and have no source, other then "my friend, of his friend, that knows someone", is no evidence or credible, at all.
So we have to assume that they don't exist because they can't be shown, well that would not fly in a court of law, so why would it fly here. In other words, being a fieldlab or whatever you may call it is probably a lie to, just like a bunch of other claims made by Tomo shills.
>>
>>10658066
>In other words, being a fieldlab or whatever you may call it is probably a lie to
May I remind you that somebody in 4chan said this, without any source or claim that it was? All I read was that they said "basically", which doesn't mean it is. Tomo shill ? Doubt it. People make up stuff all the time here.
>>
>>10658105
>May I remind you
Yes you may, however why should I believe you? This is 4chan after all.
>>
>>10658112
With a simple fact that somebody else already copy/pasted that which YOU copy/pasted as well.
If you don't believe it, then I would suggest you investigate it yourself. If you don't, then why should we believe you ?
>>
>>10657333
Sadly no but I hope everyone had a good time.
>>
>>10657340
I'm not the one that posted the original post, you assuming that shows how badly you wanna ""win"" which is pathetic. I just point out dogshit arguments when I see them :D.
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>>10658250
>I'm not the one that posted the original post, you assuming that shows how badly you wanna ""win"" which is pathetic.

>Let's talk shit, linking to someone elses post, and when they reply, I can tell them "Ha! I wasn't the original one that posted so you must suck!"-response ! Yeah ! That'll show him !

( う-´)づ︻̵̵̿── \(˚˚”)/
>>
>>10658253
Talk shit? I made a small comment pointing out a bias, if that's all it takes to get you riled up I don't understand what you're doing in this thread.
>>
>>10658256
I was making a point, but it flew over your head. Riling up ? You need to do much more for that to happen lol.
>>
>>10657159
Weird, I was definitely QR checked a few times and was almost denied entry on sunday because my test was expiring in 15 minutes. Had to get a new test in Germany. Same happened to my friends. Maybe you just got lucky?
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>>10658277
You didn't make a point at all kek
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>>10658567
You did neither, topkek
>>
70 minutes of Tomocon report https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5W6vd3KMYBM
>>
>>10658635
Fun, a person with his own opinion, trying to portrait it as a "truth" about Tomocon raging about how he got ripped off, for something he did himself. I need popcorn for this.
>>
>>10658592
I didn't try to though
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>>10658672
Literally just sharing his experience, but somehow he's painting his opinion as the truth? For something ""he did himself""? Doubt yiou even watched the video
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>>10658635
It's so Dutch. I love it
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>>10658635
Holy shit this guy is amazing
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>>10658635
TomoHobo for new Pope!
>>
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>>10658672
>Fun, a person with his own opinion, trying to portrait it as a "truth" about Tomocon raging about how he got ripped off, for something he did himself. I need popcorn for this
So clearly it is not the truth then? Or is it?

Tomocon also posted a video about Tomo 2021, the drone shot is maybe something that they should cut out, because it painfully clear that for 20 euro's this pretty meager. And comments are off so you haters can not spoil their little party.
>>
>>10658635
it's TomoHans
>>
who were these artists?
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>>10658707
Rebelke illustrations
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>>10658674
You would be surprised...
I actually laughed at his "and that music, it was so loud, it wasn't even Japanese!", but I was actually listening to the music, it was partly Japanese and partly not, but it was definitely Japanese.
So, truth ? Nahh, this guy didn't even notice the music was Japanese, says enough...
>>
Please, please, please stop replying to this one guy defending tomo. You can clearly tell it's just one dude by the way he posts. And he's not gonna budge no matter how stupid it gets.
>>
>>10658686
Again, if you didn't buy a ticket for Tomo in the first place, and come at the entrance, and buy a ticket there, of course it will be more expansive.
Tomo had to change their whole planning for this place, and that costed a lot of money. The location is not cheap.
>>
>>10658739
>Please, please, please stop replying to these tomo haters attacking tomo. You can clearly tell it's just stupid people by the way they posts. And they're not gonna budge no matter how retarded it gets.

Fixed.
>>
Although, the video this weirdo made was fun, I do agree the storm made Tomocon crap.
If saturday wasn't such a storm-drama, the sunday would have a lot of vendors selling things and such, but alas, weather does what weather wants to do. If tents break up and get destroyed, that's sad, but reality is that Tomo couldn't know it would get that bad around that time. People already tried to fix their tents properly, but the storm was pretty rough, and literally destroyed some tents...

Anyway, the hate about not enough to do, is kind of disappointing, but the dude was literally shit talking about some of the cooler things at Tomo, like the fighting part, the cosplay workshop was pretty nice, and there were like 10+ vendors in each tent. The guy pretended it was much less, which is kind of a blatant lie too.
>>
>>10658718
thankee!
>>
What a bunch of sugar coating people here.
>>
>>10658763
It's just one guy every time.
>>
>>10658769
keep on talking about tomo and you will keep triggering him
>>
>>10658741
they SCRAPPED their planning. huge difference. renting a hill is cheaper than an actual building with flushing toilets. 20 EUR was super expensive for what they offered kekw. get realistic.
>>
>>10658880
So you think, just by scrapping, Tomo would have a bigger budget ? They had to cancel a pre-planned location, which still costs money to cancel. You cannot just say to a building organizer "yah we cancel it, so we no pay, okay?", that's not how it works.
The place they organize it, is still expansive, either way or another. The tents are not cheap to rent either, and with the damage they had with the storm on the saturday, doesn't make it any better. They need some lay-way to be able to deal with the damages and any other unforeseen costs. This is organizing 101 stuff right there...
>>
>>10658892
This is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. It was a horrific con, just because they had to pay up behind the scenes to scrap their original plan doesn't mean it's suddenly forgiven. Credit to organizers where it's due, but any and all criticism is shoved aside in favor of pretending the event organizers worked their ass off trying to make this the most enjoyable con ever, and they simply did not.

They knew what they were selling was hot garbage, especially for its pricing. It doesn't matter if it's because of covid, or the weather. What matters is that they, as a business, should've looked at these circumstances beforehand and decide if it was still fair to even present this event, they did not.
>>
>>10658892
Canceling the event does not have to cost much. You just need a good relationship with your partners, including the venue.
They retaher see you survive and come back as a partner year after year, than push you and sour the relationship. Of course, you needs nice, respectfull and professional communication then, and so far we have seen very little of that.
Just yesterday I saw a post from one of the main members saying that if you did not get the tickets for 5 euro's, you should not come, laughing at those who did.

Comment has since then be deleted I noticed.
>>
>>10658892
Not talking about budget. Im talking about the 20 EUR. That was the price for a ticket for their event before they had to scrap their program. So the price should also be lowered.
Or can I sell you a pc with missing parts? Hi i had to scrap some parts due to delivery problems all of a sudden but its still the full original price.

Makes no sense.
>>
>>10658737
Ah yes, this guy stated only hearing non-japanese music, when in reality, there was BOTH non-japanese AND japanese music! He lied to us all!
>>
>>10658904
>Ah yes, this guy stated only hearing non-japanese music, when in reality, there was BOTH non-japanese AND japanese music! He lied to us all!
They where there for only 70 minutes.
>>
>>10658905
I never said his entire video was filled with "the truth about Tomocon". I just think that pointing out that he was 'wrong' about the fucking music is just about the least concerning thing in there.
>>
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>>10658686
>Drone shot
Wait for real?! Their venue falls under a strict no-fly zone. The air space belongs to Volkel air base and is used as an approach route as well as a low altitude practice zone. We're talking F16 fighter jets, heavy cargo planes, NATO aircraft and a lifeliner (traumaheli) for Volkel, as well as the occasional Apaches and Chinooks flying low on route to and from Gilze-Rijen. Nothing is allowed to be flown inside the red zone between ground and 3000ft with drones explicitly being marked as prohibited. The blue zone has the same restrictions, usually only in place during week days.

Seriously these guys are extremely lucky they haven't been caught (yet) or worse, caused an incident. These fines are hefty complete with confiscation of equipment. I guess anyone could visit the ILT site and (anonymously) report the violation considering Tomo uploaded their own evidence.
>>
>>10658939
>Wait for real?!
The more reason for tomo to edit scene out of that video.
>>
>>10658939
I checked both the DJI map and the map you're referring to. Probably the guy who recorded it, checked only the DJI flight map, which doesn't say you aren't allowed to fly there.
>>
>>10658979
Guess that's their bad for checking some third party map instead of the one from the government.
>>
>>10659037
But, if you watch the footage, it's from the end where it's allowed to fly, which is on the motocross side, so I suspect that the people about it, wouldn't make a issue out of this. Though, I know who made the footage, I'll let him know to not go only with the DJI mapping.
>>
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Acon has reworked their website
https://animecon.nl/regular/en/

They will start selling tickets for their Christmas special on October the first, Saturday comes at 25 euros, Sunday at 22 euros and a weekend ticket at 42 euros (just 21 euros per day).
>>
>>10659884
Nobody cares
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>>10659884
i would rather go to a elfia winter fest.
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>>10659884
Hopefully broodfrabriek is a better venue than ahoy.
Looks like both major cons will be in winter this year. I wonder how that will turn out. Why is winter usually so devoid of conventions? Back when tsunacon was still a thing it was pretty much the winter con and nichicon was in winter one edition, but besides that most cons are in the summer.
>>
>>10659884
Looking forward to this one. First real one in a long time (that isn't Normie Con or Empty Parking Lot Con).
>>
>>10660603
>Hopefully broodfrabriek is a better venue than ahoy.
Well for starters it's not Rotterdam Zuid en second the Plaspoelpolder is an industrial area away from Rijswijk City Centre yet still pretty close to the station, about a 10-15 minute walk.
>>
2 upcoming conventions in Belgium:
- comic con Brussels 30+31 oktober
- FACTS (Gent) 6-7 november

come visit us, please bring girlz
>>
>>10660648
I don't usually visit comic cons but FACTS sounds interesting.
How are the conventions over there my mega mindy matey?
>>
>>10659884
There's no information yet on what kind of measures will be in place with regards to masks, social distancing etc. so that's a pass for me.
>>
>>10660603
What I’ve seen of Broodfabriek from other events that I’ve been to there, it’s pretty large, but I’ve only seen the two main area’s. I assume that they have smaller rooms as well where workshops could be held. The atmosphere is pretty nice, it definitely is very ‘gezellig’ but it also feels kinda old to me. Really hope that there’s more to it than the two big halls I’ve seen so far.
>>
>>10659884
It's about time we got a decent anime event to attend again. December is still some time away which in these constantly changing times makes it insanely tricky to organise anything large. Hopefully when the ticket sales start in October we'll also have a better grasp on what COVID measures will likely (still) be in effect by December and how that affects the content and execution. I'll probably pick up a Saturday ticket myself, worst case it will just be refunded in the case of a cancellation or postponement.

With that said I am keeping my expectations lowered. Not just for Animecon Xmas, but for all events. I doubt things will immediately be back to pre-COVID standards. With all the financial and motivational losses it's likely events will play things safe. Less risk taking, more cutting corners and some content. A necessary evil until things are truly back to normal if you will.
>>
>>10660660
>There's no information yet on what kind of measures will be in place with regards to masks, social distancing etc. so that's a pass for me.
It's about 4 months from now, nobody knows what is up with Covid by then?! For all that matters we could be in a new superduper lockdown.
>>
>>10660656
it's a long running con (one of the biggest in the benelux). It was bought by easyfairs, so think dutch comic con

It used to be great, but it's a lot more commercial now (so the smaller sellers don't attend anymore). It's still worth the visit imho. Curious to see how they handle the rona
>>
>>10660717
Exactly. That's why I don't want to buy a ticket.
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>>10660656
It's the same as Dutch Comic Con, only in Belgium. It's nice that it's always busy and has a lot of entry-level newcomers. Bad side is that there's pretty much no bootleg prevention, and it's very commercialized (so not much small scale events). If you can deal with those things you'll have a nice time, otherwise you'll have more fun at things like animecon/abunai
>>
Elfia managed to adjust their content so it can still take place this year. Ticket sales starts today at 1 and will be limited to just 1000 additional tickets on top of the ones previously bought and kept.
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>>10661548
Looks like there are still sunday tickets left. Is it worth going there? Arcen is quite a long distance for me.
>>
>>10665952
Elfia and Castlefest are always worth it.
Been to the Elfia Nights before, and it was pretty good, even though it wasn't really an festival.





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