[a / b / c / d / e / f / g / gif / h / hr / k / m / o / p / r / s / t / u / v / vg / vm / vmg / vr / vrpg / vst / w / wg] [i / ic] [r9k / s4s / vip / qa] [cm / hm / lgbt / y] [3 / aco / adv / an / bant / biz / cgl / ck / co / diy / fa / fit / gd / hc / his / int / jp / lit / mlp / mu / n / news / out / po / pol / pw / qst / sci / soc / sp / tg / toy / trv / tv / vp / vt / wsg / wsr / x / xs] [Settings] [Search] [Mobile] [Home]
Board
Settings Mobile Home
/an/ - Animals & Nature


Thread archived.
You cannot reply anymore.


[Advertise on 4chan]


File: images (58).jpg (25 KB, 554x554)
25 KB
25 KB JPG
Is there a bigger cope for dog breeds?
Useful intelligence in dogs is about how much they obey, they're not going to do your math homework.
If they don't obey, they're useless.
>>
>>4363861
>this breed is intelligent, but it's stubborn and doesn't obey
Literally me
>>
>>4363861
I think it's based on how stubborn and independent the dog can be? Some breeders historically wanted more independent breeds so they didn't have to worry about them as much.
>>
File: 20221019_195923.jpg (256 KB, 975x1539)
256 KB
256 KB JPG
So what happens to the dog when you withhold food whenever it refuses to obey? Will it use its intellect to generate calories out of thin air? Hmm? I'm sure living on its own poo until it shits grey, nutrient free sludge will only sustain it for so long. Will it use its above average intelligence to mcguyver its way out of a metal box? Hmm??
>>
>>4363896
>mcguyver its way out of a metal box
Mine has done this and also with the windows
>>
My dog is a companion animal
I have no interest in training him other than essential manners and safety
I dont want a dog that needs instructions to do basic everyday life tasks
I want a dog with a good personality who can figure shit out and be left to his own devices sometimes without having a neurotic meltdown because i didnt give him enough commands to obey
>>
>>4363861
Sorry what do you need your dog to be a slave for? Do you herd livestock for a living? Are you a soldier or a cop who uses a dog as a living weapon? No? Then fugeddabout it. Intelligence without obedience is personality, and a companion animal can benefit from the ability to figure shit out without the form of canine OCD that makes a border collie do the same thing over and over again without pay, or without the form of canine eating disorder that makes a lab obey again and again and again as long as they can expect food somewhat.

>>4363896
>Will it use its above average intelligence to mcguyver its way out of a metal box?
They will, and they will also leap the fence when you want to try making them obey, and if you try and break their spirit they just become aggressive or totally shut down and you either give up or give them up. And then you blame the dog, instead of your own low-quality character and small penis. Not many people try this because they aren't stupud, but I recall some animal abuse cases in scotland where untrained herders were starved, and then beaten to death and thrown in fields by frustrated highland hicks, in a stunning display of exactly why the english conquered them.
>>
>>4363896
someone here adopted a husky from an abusive owner that just sat in a corner all day and didn't interact with him.

that.
>>
>>4363861
They DO obey but you need to use a cooperative and encouraging training method instead of the standard ME ALPHA MALE AND ME HAVE FOOD YOU NO OBEY ME HAVE CONSEQUENCES caveman method because their stubborness is the manifestation of sentience. You need empathy and theory of mind to train these breeds, which most dog owners lack. You need to be able to have a thoughtful answer to why the dog isn't listening to you without going to BECAUSE THEY ARENT RESPECTING ME AS THE ALPHA MALE. If the average dogfag was a fully developed human being with a strong ego and a secure sense of masculinity, most dogs wouldn't have to be mentally ill animals bred to be natural slaves. The chuchki people could get regular ass huskies to herd reindeer and have perfect recall, meanwhile americans can't get them to stop screaming. Seems like the owner, not the breed.
>>
>>4363861
Specific working dogs are bread to be left alone and to make their own decisions. Livestock guardian dogs especially. They are just not breed to be kept as pets. That doesn't render them as bad dogs though.
>>
>>4364025
I have a ladder and refuse to climb up. I prefer to stay down here and sob shit all day like a halfwit nitfuck knowitall fag. I can easily impress my fag friends with my dumbass mindset because they don't know better. Why climb a ladder of self improvement and build on my dogs confidence if it takes hard work and effort. Better stay low down dumb.
>>
>>4363896
No, mine figured out how to open the fridge door and get food.
>>
>>4364032
>they just become aggressive or totally shut down and you either give up or give them up
So its a life in a cage in an unlit corner of the basement then. Not to worry though, I'll still feed it the bare minimum to stay alive. Maybe once every few days would do the trick. After all it can drink its piss and eat its poop if its so smart.
>>
>>4364138
>>4364090
This guy has issues. Severe issues.

You are doing nothing but impressing fag friends by making every dog into a circus animal that does arbitrary tricks. God, I fucking hate dog "people".

You have the personality type of a soviet dictator and the testicular fortitude, charisma, and intelligence of a libleft garbage-kicker, so you stick to playing stalin with a dumb animal. Basically, you
1: Treat dogs like people
2: Have views on people that are certifiably insane.
3: Are incapable of feeling fulfilled in a relationship with anything resembling equality.
Unironically authoritarians, zoophiles, and pedophiles have a lot in common.

I believe that a dog that has to work HAS to work, so you get a dog BRED to work, and it will WANT to work. These dogs have a form of mental illness, similar to OCD, and even if they do not work they NEED to "work" to be happy. But if your dog's job is just being a companion, that is irrelevant, and you should apply the same reasoning as owning a herding dog:
Your dog WILL DO what it was BRED TO DO and forcing it to do anything else is stupid. A collie or german shepherd NEEDS to follow orders daily to be happy. An Akita NEEDS you to to be an ambivalent and steady companion to be happy.

Remember:
Capitalism is freedom of cooperation and everyone can find a way not to starve
Communism is forced labor and at scale everyone starves sooner or later
>>
>>4364148
>this guy has issues
it's unironically caused by circumcision. the loss of choice that early in life makes them hate other things having choice. it's why most people with that attitude is american and their working culture is completely and utterly fucked and based on testing peoples character by demanding subservience, and then you go to anywhere in europe and cashiers in walmart are allowed to request stools.
>>
>>4364149
its true most authoritarian shitholes are ruled by the circumcised, like the middle east, and (((bolshevik))) russia, but surely that has nothing to do with someone fantasizing about leaving an akita in a cage with no food or water because it didn't sit on his whim. that's exactly what a nasty little jew would do but surely you jest?
>>
>>4364148
he's not just insane but a retard
>get dog that's smart but doesn't worship people
>treat it like shit for not obeying
>treat it like shit some more hoping it decides to worship you
>it doesn't
>blame the dog
end result: resources invested, no benefit.

this doesn't even work on people. historically it ends in the wannabe "alpha" being murdered, because he's actually a natural born beta, and the guy who kills/ousts him becomes the real alpha male and everyone loves him. this holds true in politics, gangs, groups of friends, militaries, etc. even the most violent dominant men command respect by giving respect and working together with people. did every great general beat every last soldier until they joined him? no, he worked together and they felt that they would achieve greatness together. when a man follows another man he does it because he feels like it is what he wants to do. violence can maintain respect when it wavers but doesn't create it. trying to force respect just sets you up to become the ousted faggot beta that never deserved to lead. but it's a dog so it'll just bite you and get put down, while you get bit and waste your time and money.
>>
>>4364148
Damn I can't even read the amount of crap you talk. What a nut nutfuck you are.
>>
>>4364173
>Damn I can't read
We know, dawg.
>>
>>4363861
>dog is dumb because it doesn't want to listen to some idiot human
double cope on your part
>>
>>4364090
I dont understand the point youre trying to make here
Is the dog that doesnt want to do a bunch of faggot tricks because of say so and treats the one not climbing the ladder?
Who climbs ladders for no good reason besides children?
The smart disobedient dog will climb the ladder when no one is looking to eat all the food you bought to impress your friends when you show off your lame ladder tricks
>>
File: SNAP2617.jpg (202 KB, 1500x1000)
202 KB
202 KB JPG
>>4363861
>Is there a bigger cope
"My dog obeys so it's smart"

Pic related has poor recall response for come/come here. That's because I tried fading out the treat. That might work on a dumb dog, but with her, fading out the treat means you're lying to her. She's smart, you can't trick her like that, especially not twice. Doing multiple things in sequence (especially fun ones like jumping up and barking) works a lot better and is the only thing close to fading out rewards that works. Because you're not really fading out the reward, doing the additional fun tricks is the reward.
>inb4 punishment
Tried it. Does the opposite of what you want.
>clicker training
Tried it. Does not work at all.

She has 100% recall for the word "cheese".
>>
>>4364344
Huskies are literally autistic.
>>
Akitas are simply too Smart for most people.
>>
>>4364344
Have you tried giving her the ultimate treat?
>>
>>4364512
The forbidden snack...
>>
I agree with OP btw. Dogs are animals that have to obey otherwise they're useless
>>
>>4366607
Most dogs are useless even if they obey

Unless helping you forget your small penis is a use now
>>
>>4364053
I agree with you 100%
I also find a lot of the "reward based" clicker training kind of rote memorization to be very boring in practice
It is neat to see a dog respond to a million and one commands flawlessly but i would never want my dog to be a programmed computer like that
I much prefer kind of a free spirited wild card dog who pushes boundaries while also understanding them
My last dog was a miniature pinscherish rescue mutt and he was pretty cheeky and bad but also the smartest dog ever
He tricked my gf and i when we went to the beach one day by going deep into the water and acting like he suddenly loved swimming
When we got far enough out he suddenly bolted back to shore and devoured all the meat from our picnic sandwiches
I SWEAR he planned the whole scheme

These dogs also have an uncanny empathy about them
Like i get up at 4am most days and if im up but pretending to sleep my dog 100% knows and is bouncing all over my body and in my face but of im actually asleep he lets me sleep untill 11 or 12
Hes only ever actually woken me up once and it was because he had bad diarrhea
>>
>>4366607
Dogs are not mobile furniture. They are not possessions to be programmed to fit your lifestyle. They are sentient beings that exist very close to our own plane of being. Each is different and each needs something different. You build a relationship with them and, as the more conscious and dominant species, your responsibility is to allow them to be what they are within the restrictions of having to live among people. "Obey" should be limited to what keeps them from harm and the minimum requirements to live comfortably with humans (ie: don't crap in the house, don't eat the cat).
>>
>>4366985
Sounds kinda shit reading it, but yeah that's how I feel too
>>
>>4363861
That is not how useful the dog is for you. That is a warning, not only it will not obey but also will plot to overthrow your rule.



[Advertise on 4chan]

Delete Post: [File Only] Style:
[Disable Mobile View / Use Desktop Site]

[Enable Mobile View / Use Mobile Site]

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective parties. Images uploaded are the responsibility of the Poster. Comments are owned by the Poster.