Anyone else pissed on how Sony keeps betraying the console that made them?Such an iconic system and yet this is the treatment its getting!!!
>>5186543Just emulate, lmao.
>>5186543They're a company.You think they care about anything but aking money at least least effort possible?Or that they have feelings towards their customers?They're all the same.
It's a quick cash grab thrown together with the most easily accessible resources.You can kinda already play PSX games on like fifty devices anyway.
Not saying anyone here is doing this specifically but it's baffling to see the Internet get up in arms about le input lag memes on the PS1 Classic because some faggy site reported they felt lag but conveniently didn't specify which TV they were using.I won't defend the game selection, lack of shaders, or lack of Dualshock because all of those things are shit, but input lag? come on now.
>>5186576It's hard to make money with a shitty product.
>>5186543They don't give a fuck about you. Or your gaystation lovin friends.
>>5186618Depends on your audience.
HAS IT BEENHACKEDYET?
has any reviewer determined if the controllers work with windows?
>>5186618Remember Ronco? They pulled it off for a few decades.
>>5186552The console they are launching is literally an emulator. I think i read somewhere that the source code it's actually form a Mobile emulator.
>>5186543You may not agree with the game selection but there are others that love it. Different tastes DO exist.
>>5186815If it is an emulator it would be the one in their xperia play cellphone or the PSP. No way it is the ps2/ps3 emulator.
>>5186610People felt lag because they were playing the 50Hz version while being accustomed for the 60Hz. It's not actually confirmed whether there's actual input delay with the emulation. It cannot possibly be worse than what the PS3 had, though.
>>5187108Rumor states it is PCSX ReARMed. We shall see.
>>5186815It's a branch of PCSX-R, an open-source emulator (and while it's an avangarde project which introduced great features, it's not the best in terms of accuracy).>>5187108>No way it is the ps2PS2 didn't emulate the PS1.
>>5186543Shit man, just hook it up to your computer and upload the PSX ROMs. Same thing with the NES and SNES classic.
>>5187110It's no rumour. Go watch the GB quick look.
No one cares about this except bandwagoners who can't stand the thought of anything other than an HDMI cable for their "retro" game systems to show their fellow hipster friends. There is no excuse for wanting to pay $100 for an emubox PS1 emulator with first gen controllers when you can get a working and probably modchipped PS1 for $20, SCART for $20ish or official S-Video cables for $10, a power cord for $5, and two dual shock controllers for $30. You can even throw in a Gameshark for another $20, or the mouse controller for $15-20. So instead of getting an emubox with 20 games and two controllers, you could have had the real system with two better controllers, all cables, and a Gameshark or the mouse for the same price.
>>5187128Do they actually show that is what it is? I shall return.
They really should've made this the PSTV in a new shell with the games it comes with and a simple interface to buy Classics off of PSN. Dumb move desu.
>>5186543>anyone else an angsty little faggotYes. Not me. But many others are.
>>5187115pcsxr is pretty good imo, the only problems i think it has imo are sound problem inconsistencies. i think its a unique emulator though
>>5187115PS3 and PSP did.
>>5187639Who was arguing that?
>>5187506>simple interface to buy Classics off of PSN.I'm honestly surprised this wasn't implemented, or at least some simple way to add Classics you've already bought to it.
>>5187727Go back to 4chan, faggot.
>>5186576I'd still say there are some companies that have a bit honor in the the products and history that they have, I'd say that nintendo for example at least got the emulation right for their mini, if they rip you off they do it with style
I'm very lucky to own all the PS1 games I would ever want featured in a mini-console. Plus, I can emulate them all to get the highest possible graphical output. This novelty would have been the perfect opportunity to feature the games that cost an arm and a leg to track down like Symphony of the Night and Klonoa and Marvel vs Capcom. It just seems really out of touch and arrogant. It's also very clear how much Nintendo is concerned with delivering a quality product.
>>5187919>>5187920This is the only PAL PSX game worth owning.
>>5186618Wrong. Nostalgia sells on its own and companies consistently prove that they don't need to put in any effort at all. Just look at Pokémon Let's Go - it's a $60 Switch remake of Pokémon Yellow that has the same graphics as the 3DS games while actually removing features from the game it's remaking (Like the Safari Zone). If you have an established fanbase you can sell literally anything to them and make money because hardcore fans have no standards.
>>5187948That's just Nintendo. Nintendo could defecate into a box and nintendrónes would buy it.
>>5186618Say that to Apple.
>>5186543Who the fuck cares? Sony was always a shitty company that just happened to get some great games on it's systems. You expect way too much from a corporation.
>>5187497>get psio>wait a year until it ships>cut traces>solder shityeap.
>>5186543I wish they had added the texture smoothening feature of the PS2 and PS3. And I get that they have to spend fuckloads in licenses to get use of games like FFVII, but I would have liked to also see Sony properties like Legend of Dragoon as well as oddities like Raystorm, Castlevania SOTN, a TR game, and MDK.Legend of Dragoon is one of the best JRPGs of that gen and Sony owns it wholly so it costs them nothing to use it, yet they left it out. I don't get it.
Perhaps this needs to be seen to be believed.
>>5188220Does it necessarily mean that they use the whole PCSX and not just some of its parts?
>>5187934>what is vib ribbon
>>5188240It seems unlikely to me that they spent any time finetuning the emulation given how barebones the whole package is.
>>5187115>PS2 didn't emulate the PS1.It semi-did actually.
>>5186610>lack of DualshockI still don't get this complaint.If the included games were different maybe, but rumble's a meme, 3/4 of these titles don't support sticks, and the ones that do aren't greatly improved by their use.
>>5188348People where pissed about it not being a dualshock when the thing was announced because they knew that it would limit the games that would be on it. People are probably still pissed for the same reason. If it had been a dualshock then they might have had better games than the shit they actually included. It's just one issue among many that points to the whole thing being a lazy cash grab.
>>5186815>Mobile emulator.no, it's one of the best (but not the best) psx emulators>>5187108no it isn't and you niggers still can't say why those are better than an open source emulatordid the psp have savestates?anyway nobody should buy this shit, sony is cheaping too much no putting dualshocks on a $100 emulator, it should try harder next time
>>5186576Asians can't feel
>PCSX>PAL versionsI don't understand how they fucked up this badly, it probably would have been cheaper to just throw PSTV parts preloaded with NTSC PS1 classics into a new shell with a new GUI.
Whats the problem with PAL games?
>can't play crash bandicoot on ps1 classic>can play it and nearly every other ps1 game on my hacked snes classicI see no reason to spend $100 for this piece of shit.
>>5186576>They're a company.>You think they care about anything but aking moneyredpilled
>>5189093You mean besides obvious 50 Hz?
>>5188297Fat models of the PS2 pretty much wholly run PS1 in hardware rather than emulation. It has a genuine MIPS 3000A CPU on-board, and the PS2's GPU is directly compatible with the PS1 GPU.
>>5189093>>518933950hz isnt the issue. its the companies making lazy ports and not correcting the speed of the games to compensate. luckily not an issue anymorethat being said some pal games are easier to emulator for that reason and i assume that would be why they got included.also tekken was the game reviewers where complaining about, which while i cant confirm the pal release is slower than the ntsc release. tekken as always felt like it was laggy and like it played underwater.also anyone know if the usb controllers are getting sold separately?
>>5189306You can tell following these threads who is economically illiterate when they honestly believe because you can buy some guy’s ratty, worn out used playstation for $20 off craigslist that somehow sourcing parts and manufacturing a brand new console should be cheaper than that. Yes Sony might be padding the cost a bit compared to the Nintendo minis but until I see what $$$ Square and Konami demanded for just the FF7 and MGS licenses alone I won’t judge them. I’ve also seen Sony advertising this thing hard on TV and what not which shows they are NOT treating this as some afterthought, when did you ever see a TV ad for the NES mini? If anything they’re trying TOO hard when Nintendo relied on word-of-mouth.
It doesn't come with the power cable.Just let that sink in, they were too fucking cheap to include it.
Watching Sony shit in their most loyal followers' mouths so much, there's a weird "can't-look-away" quality to it.
>>5187920>>5187938>>5188036 Please do not bully me. I have to live in a PAL region. What's your excuse for getting PAL games in the PS Classic?
>>5189416To be fair you can actually get them at dollar stores now. It's not 2006 anymore.
>>5186618The Nintendo Game Cube, Wii, Wii U, and Switch would like to have a word with you.
>>5187163>hipstersNo, this is for normies. Angry hipster will go on gook cartoon forums and post things like "No one cares about this except bandwagoners who can't stand the thought of anything other than an HDMI cable for their "retro" game systems to show their fellow hipster friends. There is no excuse for wanting to pay $100 for an emubox PS1 emulator with first gen controllers when you can get a working and probably modchipped PS1 for $20, SCART for $20ish or official S-Video cables for $10, a power cord for $5, and two dual shock controllers for $30. You can even throw in a Gameshark for another $20, or the mouse controller for $15-20. So instead of getting an emubox with 20 games and two controllers, you could have had the real system with two better controllers, all cables, and a Gameshark or the mouse for the same price."
>>5187919>It's also very clear how much Nintendo is concerned with delivering a quality product.Explain every console after the N64 then.
>>5188962>no, it's one of the best (but not the best) psx emulatorsWell, technically. PCSX is the emu, PCSX-ReARMed is the version optimised for ARM (Mobile) architectures
>>5189561How were those consoles not a quality product? The Gamecube was impressively compact, had reasonably good performance for its time, and was physically durable.The Wii was aesthetic in its stand, came with innovative features like motion controls which were poorly implemented in many games but some games did use it properly (Metroid Prime 3, etc). Unlike the 360 it actually came with built in wi-fi which is pretty good for the time.Wii U I agree was a bit dodgy but technically speaking it's not as bad as many people make out. At its time of release it was literally the most power-efficient home gaming device on the market, which obviously many people didn't give a shit about, but Nintendo assumed would be something energy-conscious Japanese players would like.Switch has kinda dodgy build quality but the mobile graphics are pretty good. Nintendo went with the best solution available on the market. I know a lot of people were bitching that they didn't go with the Tegra version 2 chip but at that time it was only available for cars not for mobile devices.
>>5186815Aren't all "classic" console editions just emulators and roms? The NES classic isn't running original hardware is it?
>>5189561 Are you suggesting post-N64 consoles were shoddy? Where would you like me to begin? I think this guy has justified the Gamecube: >>5189571 And I don't really need to justify the DS as that was also an amazing leap forward for handheld gaming. Perhaps you want me to justify the Wii? A Blue Ocean console that seemed a lot more stable than its contemporaries plagued with the red ring of death or difficult-to-develop-for Cell technology. Maybe you want me to justify the WiiU? A poorly timed console that was hurt by the adoption of smart phones and the introduction of the iPad but the only console of this generation that has embedded social features that actually got used and were enjoyable to use.
>No Parappa the Rapper>No Symphony of the Night>No Ape Escape...>...because there's no Dualshock>No Tomb Raider>No Gran Turismo>No Silent Hill>No Parasite Eve>No Tony Hawk's Pro Skater>NO CRASH BANDICOOT>NOT EVEN CRASH TEAM RACING>NO SPYRO THE DRAGON EITHER>PAL VERSIONS IN AN NTSC COUNTRY>EMULATION QUALITY IS FUCKING SHIT BECAUSE THE THING TOO DAMN WEAKAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
>>5189572It's running a first party emulator. It isn't a recoded Snes9x
>>5190794I seriously don't understand why they didn't include SotN. That and Darkstalkers is the only reason I even got a PS1. Also, where the fuck are the good fighting games?
>>5190875 Konami blue balled them. Contra isn't on the NES Classic either.
>>5189571>>5189643Yeah Nintendo was garbage from the GC on. Each of these consoles offered the least amount of exclusives due to Nintendos hostility to third party developers, leading to them having the smallest libraries of their generation. Especially if you didn't want to buy the same tired IPs rehashed yet again. The GameCube lacked the software features that Sony and Microsoft had, I mean they didn't even put in online functionality - they expected individual publishers to pick up the slack and set it up themselves! Classic Nintendo developer hostility.The Wii was a system sold on a gimmick. Not only was it the weakest graphically of its generation, it had the worst home media interface (like GameCube), the worst online out of the three consoles, and sold on the whole waggle stick gimmick. The WiiU was a mess from start to finish. There's a 2000 word limit on posts, so I'll just summarize by saying there's a reason it was panned by almost everyone but the most diehard Nintendo fanboys. A lot of people didn't even realize it was a separate console from the originals wii, but that's more of a marketing issue than anything.And that brings us to the Switch. A console that innovates nothing - it tries to move units based on a gimmick. Pretty much having an iPad with 720p you can take in public. That's it. No exciting new IPs or anything of that nature. It's Nintendo being lazy and resting on their laurels, if a new company tried to float the Switch you know it would have failed. Nostalgia is the only thing keeping this company alive, not innovation.
>>5190794>PAL VERSIONS IN AN NTSC COUNTRYy tho who decided this
>>5190901>release something for only the most autistic of collectors>do the one thing that would set off their autism like no tomorrow It's like watching a trainwreck in slow motion
>>5187948>If you have an established fanbase you can sell literally anything to them and make money because hardcore fans have no standards.The hardcore fans have standards. Look at how hard /vp/ is shitting on Let's Go. It's dumb hipsters that never cared about the product until it became cool to nostalgiafag over it that have no standards.
>>5189560>being so angry you post the equivalent of "NO U!"You /v/irgins enjoy your subpar shit.
>>5191116PLGEP is a lot of fun though, shame about the lack of post game content and bugged online.
>>5189554t. buttblasted segafag.
>>5190896>The Wii was a system sold on a gimmickNot really, it was genuinely trying to make gaming more accessible and also experiment with better control methods. The Wii Remote worked well for shooters.>Not only was it the weakest graphically of its generationIt was cheaper though, and had perfect backwards compatibility>it had the worst home media interfaceBoth the Wii and 360 used DVDs. Actually the Wii DVDs stored more data because the 360 DVDs had some kind of shitty security system which consumed a lot of disk space.
>>5186618This is a really ironic statement on a videogame forum.>>5189554 This but unironically
>>5189561After the SNES, you mean.>>5190875Buy the remake. :^)
>>5186797Seconded. Could be a decent gamepad for emulation.
>>5190794A lot of these are because of recent or planned remakes at the time of development.
>>5190794>>EMULATION QUALITY IS FUCKING SHIT BECAUSE THE THING TOO DAMN WEAKI don't understand how this is a thing. I can run about 75% of PS1 games perfectly on this. Are you telling me the PS1 classic is weaker than the SNES classic? How did they fuck it up so bad?
they really could have shipped it with DS3s instead of making replica PS1 controllers.
>>5192264Or at least offer compatibility. Wouldn't have taken much effort to stick a bluetooth receiver in there.>but muh accuracyThat was thrown out the window when they used PCSX.
>>5190794>wanting Parappa on a HD screen, through this emulator, probably @50hzYou've got some weird desires, anon.
>Vib-Ribbon is only available in 50hz in English because it never released in US.
>>5192321How much effort would it take to repack the European ISO in NTSC-J at 60hz?
I'm not even sure of the point of one of these. PS2 and PS3 run Playstation 1 games directly off the disks and I'm pretty sure all these games can be downloaded off the Sony store.This isn't like Nintendo, where they refuse to sell their old games in bundles like say, Sega does.
>Twisted Metal 1 chosen over Twisted Metal 2 for "nostalgia">Meanwhile they included Tekken 3, which isn't on the PS Store due to the Gon character licensing, yet it's on here; not a complaint but it supplements the above>Couldn't be bothered to pay Activision for Crash and/or Spyro licenses to include at least one of the games>Some games are 50Hz PAL versions to compensate for the system's performance>No power adapter included; Nintendo does the same but they expect you to have a 5V 2A USB AC adapter already, I guess>Controllers are probably non-standard USB HIDs and would require drivers to work elsewhere>Refactored open source emulator chosen when they could have used their existing closed-source emulation software from the PS Vita or PSP even, which can handle most if not all PS1 titles>Inexpensive, poor-performing system-on-a-chip chosen instead of refactoring the PS Vita's hardware and reusing the already-developed emulation software>Super Puzzle Fighter II probably chosen as fillerThe list can go on; is there legitimately any reason to purchase this other than consumer loyalist reasons and "nostalgia"?
Japan gets the best version, besides having better games, they probably have NTSC-J version of Tekken 3 and Resident Evil.
>>5192371>is there legitimately any reason to purchase this other than consumer loyalist reasons and "nostalgia"?no, every mini console is only good as a present for a kid but this one is too expensiveanyway except the lineup this console is as bad as a SNES mini, your pic is not retro and your list is shit:- opensource emulator is better than proprietary and you listed the problem twice- the SoC is at least powerful as the SNES mini (probably more as snes mini cannot emulate every psx game)- I don't get how the inclusion of tekken 3 is bad, who cares about PS store? do you really pay for digital copies?- PAL games have increased resolution, I need a source about NTSC ones requiring less powerful hardware- at least controllers are USB and not some snowflake standard and the driver (if needed) will be included in linux in not time, I don't care about wincucks
>>5192456>PAL games have increased resolutionThey do not. PAL, the video standard, has higher resolution. Means nothing if the video game assets were not designed for it, which they certainly weren't in any game developed in Japan or America.
The irony is, people will just mod it like the PS1.
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2018-playstation-mini-teardown>1gb of memory >16gbs of flash storage
>>5190794>EMULATION QUALITY IS FUCKING SHIT BECAUSE THE THING TOO DAMN WEAKfrom what I have read the hardware is fine, they just screwed up the emulation.
>>5192456seems like mainly for the cute case and being able to buy a brand new boxed ps1. You can get a ps3 for the same price. From the videos I saw there was extra slow down in RR type 4 that wasn't a severe on a real ps1 but it could be because a crt makes it look smoother.
Its good enough for casuals, which is the target demo
>>5192458>Means nothing if the video game assets were not designed for it, which they certainly weren't in any game developed in Japan or America.Games like Crash Bandicoot use a higher resolution in PAL territories though and they were USA produced.
>>5193068They obviously want us to hack it and add games on it.
>No complete collection of Net Yaroze games as a bonus titleThe entire thing seems totally half-arsed, incredibly disappointing.
>>5192371Parasite Eve being Jap exclusive is annoying as well, seems like a missed opportunity to give it to PAL audiences that missed out a la FF3/6 on the SNES classic.
>>5194091Normies don't even know what the fuck a Net Yaroze is.
>>5186543Even Nintendo went out of their way and released a finished version of Star Fox 2 on their SNES Mini
>>5186797a ds4 is cheaper than wasting 100 bucks on this PoS for just the controller
>>5194106Yeah they do. They know it as that rare, blue PSX that's worth thousands of dollars.
The DF Retro video breakdown of this thing is brutal as fuck.What were they thinking? (I know, making a quick buck leeching off Nintendo's new fad)
>>5190903>implying you need to be autistic to feel the PAL slow down and added frame judder caused by the shitty emu>implying the use of PAL games is only flaws to set off autists
>>5186543>Keeps betraying the console that made themPS4 is literally the only Sony console unable to play PS1 games. The PS1 Classic sucks, but let's not pretend they have some sort of long history neglecting the PS1.
>>5194437I braced for the worst. I wasn't disappointed.>Meditek SOC>50hz games chosen because emulator can't run them at 60fps/30fps>50hz games running at 60hz anyway, causing frame stuttering everywhere>Doesn't matter because 60hz games suffer slowdown too>GTA literally runs at 10fps>Inaccurate sound emulation>Visual glitches caused by other emulation inaccuracies>Locked 720p>Forced dither filter that adds blur on every single gameAnd Sony have the nerve to charge way more for this than either Nintendo microconsole.
>>5194437Just watched it. lol. Seems like a bad day for GayStation friends.https://youtu.be/UU0dn9pRKuw
>>5186576>Or that they have feelings towards their >customers?>They're all the same.Sony has that extra bit of sheer incompetence and overt psychopathy going.
>>5189554Wtf the GameCube was good
I think the most confusing part here is that Sony's already released a tiny home console that plays PlayStation games flawlessly.It's the PS TV, and it's almost five years old by now. It also came bundled with a superior DS3.Surely they could've just repurposed that shit, instead of producing new hardware that doesn't work right at all?
>>5190901Boomer nip salarymen who've never played a videogame in their lives
>>5195945The GameCube was the worst choice of it's generation nintoddler. We genuinely pitied GameCube kids growing up. I'd rather stick with a N64 than deal with the half assed cash ins on that failed console.
>>5196029That would actually take more effort because they would have to dummy out all of the code involving non-PSX games, config etc. The mini though, is like "slap freeware binaries and ISOs onto a chip and go eat lunch" kind of cheap
>>5187919At least you have Skullmonkeys.
>>5196029They made the PS TV to get rid of the Vita parts they had when they realized it was a faillure. Why would they produce more now?Don't expect quality from Sony, they're in for the money nowadays and the PS4's success showed that they were "right".
>>5196134>Boomer nip salarymenThey've relocalized their videogame activities in fucking California.
OK so what people don't like about the playstation classic is the limited amount of games on it, the fact there's no AC adapter included, the kinds of games that are included, the fact it runs on an emulator so it's more or less something you pay for that you might as well can download for free and you have to rely on something else to add other games and all in all, it's more or less a novelty or something to scalp/hoard/show off or whatever?OK but what makes that different from say the NES and SNES Classic? What does that make it different from the Commodore mini that also got released a while ago? And while we're at it, even the aforementioned examples I just mentioned came in existence MUCH later than those cheap Megadrives and Atari things they've sold in stores for ages. In short, why is everybody on the internet so mad about the playstation classic if all those bad things were just as much a problem as with earlier releases? And I don't mean just on this board but everywhere like on other sites. If anything the playstation classic gives you USB port controllers, something you don't get with comparable things. I don't know about you but if I could choose between controllers with USB or with Wiimote ports I'd know what I'd pick.All of that being said, I personally think all those miniature consoles are dumb and unnecessary to people who've been into /vr/ for longer than a year but I just find it hypocritical that people shit on the playstation one while the rest of them have got the same problems, if not even more and people barely say anything about it (well except here on /vr/ of course).
>>5196464Classic mini consoles are useless, but at least the Nintendo ones are quality products while the PS is complete garbo.See, it wasn't hard.
>>5196464one of the few intelligent post, thank youthe problem of this board is being full of nintendo babbies like this one >>5196471 thinking an overpriced and underpowered arm soc (hint: raspberry pi is way better in every way but I'm sure nintoddlers think it's shit) is a "quality product">all those miniature consoles are dumb and unnecessary/thread
>>5196464apparently the emulation is fucking garbage too, also the nonsensical inclusion of pal versions
At least the controllers work on Windows 10
>>5196485not everybody speaks american
https://twitter.com/emuonpspfor the curious
>>5196561That's not an excuse, the PAL versions are inferior mechanically. Read the thread before commenting next time.
>>5196483Look at the emulation quality, you fucking mongoloid.Anyone using "nintendo babbies" as a grown-up man has probably massive mental deficiencies and shouldn't be allowed on this image board.
>>5196464>OK but what makes that different from say the NES and SNES Classic?NES/SNES Classic had a better selection of games, better emulation, and the proper controllers.
>>5186543Did anyone disassemble it? Any links?
>>5196657https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=ja&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Femuonpsp.net%2Fthis site has some more info, apparently it's running Android
>>5196561Well they should have made own version for germany, france, spain and italy that has those shitty pal versions.
>>5196471If they're both useless then what the hell does it matter how well it's made? I could have a ton of ashtrays made of different materials but they're all just as useless to me regardless of how well they're built because I don't even smoke.If all those miniature consoles are useless than it doesn't matter how or from what it's made, as long as it's useless it's useless to get it anyway.>>5196642>better selection of gamesthat's subjective and you know it>better emulationNintendo has never been picky about emulation, see the VC releases and the GBA releases of several NES and SNES games and even then I doubt it's even remotely comparable to say Nintendulator or Higan>the proper controllersI'm sorry but I don't see what you're getting at here. You can easily play the vast majority of PSX games on an original playstation controller. It's like saying the NES Classic was incomplete because it didn't come with the Zapper or that the SNES one needed to have the mouse. Most games don't even need the sticks on the dualshock controller and the few that do are easily playable on emulators and original playstations - not counting re-releases on digital stores.So tell me, how is the playstation classic worse than those other two again?>>5196652Oh look, another youtube video where they complain about the playstation classic. And what do you know, it's from that guy who people know as that guy who plays DOS games on anything he can think of while occasionally doing Duke Nukem impersonations. Fuck off with your youtube shilling.
>>5196747>that's subjective and you know itNobody fucking asked for Rainbow Six PS1 or the terrible localisation of Persona.>Nintendo has never been picky about emulationYes but they've upped their game for the Classic with a new emuator that's much better than VC.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocGdWRF84Q0>the few that do are easily playable on emulators and original playstationsThat's a terrible argument.
>>5196747>the few that do are easily playable on emulators and original playstationsSo then why would I buy a Playstation Classic instead of just emulating?
>>5196483>>5196464>one of the few intelligent post, thank youGet back to plebbit samefaggot. You won't get upvotes for saying "thank you" to someone elses post here
>>5196764Thanks for pointing that out.
>>5186610Input lag is fucking game breaking you stupid fucking millennial cunt
>>5187109It has been mentioned by multiple sources
>>5196747>how is the playstation classic worse than those other two again?Mixing PAL versions with NTSC versionsInaccurate Sound EmulationForced filter with no image customization
>>5187510butt hurt gaystation loyalist
>>5190896>Call out obvious flaws on a shoddy Sony product >Buh buh buh Nintendo!Every time
>>5196783>making excuses for game breaking flawsBig sony dick all the way down your throat.
>>5196764>>5196770Only one of those was me. Also, isn't it ironic that you're accusing me of samfagging while you seem to do that yourself? Ah, the joy of projecting.
>>5187506This is what I thought they were doing, and the emulation would have actually been good
>>5194091Devil Dice is a Net Yaroze game and that's on the Japanese version
>>5196561I dare you to play the pal-version of Tekken 3, and then the ntsc-version.I DARE you, DOUBLE-DARE.
This thing is a dumpster fire.Digital Foundry absolutely destroys it.
Played it today.Had fun with it.
>>5196995>playWe all know the point of this thing is decoration. Emulation quality is irrelevant when you're just going to put it on a shelf and never turn it on again.
>>5197000I'll probably finish every game first and then put it on the shelf and maybe bring it down for some casual Tekken 3 play with anyone who comes over.
>>5197020They won't be your friends anymore when they have to play the PAL version
>>5186543Basically, you spent $130+ over a P&P console running on an emulator... How are the controllers? Can you easily hack the damn thing?
>>5190794>they included Metal Gear Solid>most of the meta fourth wall shit doesn't work correctly>any game Psycho Mantis would comment on is not on the collectionIt's like they went out of their way to make this as bad as possible.
>>5197071>Psycho can't make the "I'll move your controller" stuntyeah that is pretty bad actually
Please, wake me up when they hack this thing.
>>5196747S O N Y P O N Y
>>5197056Weirdly, my tv says it's a 60hz signal. Is it doing some sort of 25 frames interpolation?
>>5196673>apparently it's running Androidlol what a shit source, no way is running androidlinux probably, but no reason to use ART or Dalvik on this>>5196612>Look at the emulation quality, you fucking mongoloid.this one is more powerful and can without doubt run snes better than the snes classic, also with enough storage for the entire library of snes, nes, genesis e probably moreyou're still in time to learn how computers work, hint: is not magic>>5196764thanks for reminding me this place is full of faggots in denial
>>5196759which part of>those miniature consoles are uselessyou didn't understand?only idiots pay for emulation, you pay for the hardware and a raspberry is a better one
>>5197204>Weirdly, my tv says it's a 60hz signal. Is it doing some sort of 25 frames interpolation?Yes, and badly.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UU0dn9pRKuw&t=10m12sThrow your PissClassic in the trash.>>5197125You can get a RetroPie up and running at a cheaper price and with more games by the time this shit is "hacked".
>>5196751Nintendo's mini classic boxes are shit too.
>>5196471>at least the Nintendo ones are quality products>>5196642>better emulationEnjoy your noisy video output, anti-seizure filters, and sound latency.Every single official mini console is trash. Sony, Nintendo, or otherwise.
>>5197298Which part of >how is the playstation classic worse than those other two again?did you forget about
>>5197146not even an insult that works
>>5186543>Anyone else pissed on how Sony keeps betraying the console that made them?No, because I don't buy their games anymore.
>>5186543>the console that made them?How to spot a zoomer in one sentence. It was the Walkman that made Sony not the GayStation
>>5197754what the fuck
>>5197708emulation on x86 > emulation on raspberrypi > emulation on playstation classic > emulation on (s)nes miniis so difficult to understand?
>>5197787>emulation on playstation classic > emulation on (s)nes miniBut that's wrong you dolt
>>5197789can the snes emulate psx games better than the playstation?I don't think soI'm pretty sure the psx mini can emulate snes as good as a snes mini having more powerful hardware
>>5197791>can the snes emulate psx games better than the playstation?Is the SNES designed to emulate PSX?The SNES classic can actually emulate SNES well while the playstation classic fails to emulate PlayStation well.
>>5197793>Is the SNES designed to emulate PSX?nintendo just used the cheapest arm soc that could run snes decently, there is not designagain, learn how to computeyou're going to hack it anyway and run everything the hardware allowsnot being a brainlet is a prerequisite though
>>5197804If I want to play retro games on my TV, I would buy a pi.
>>5186543Even some more things why this shit sucks hard, if it is not public known yet:1. Couldn't power it over USB from my TV. So it need way more power than NES mini etc.2. For some reason doesn't seem to proper work over a HDMI-Switch, so a direct connection is better.3. It's known that the west version is mostly PAL, but Persona is not, mainly because it only was released in the US for English. But why not ship with both versions of the other games then. Memory isn't that fucking expensive.4. You can choose Japanese for menu etc. but of course no Japanese versions of the games.5. The graphics are ugly and not "PS1"-Standard-Style and the translations of the Menu like "Start" for game is in some language weird.6. ???7. Fuck this shit.Fuck you Sony.
>>5197808sure, that's my choice too, I'm just laughing at nintendo fans defending their "quality" productsI like nintendo games but the hypocrisy of using pirated roms while at the same time taking down sites hosting them is inexcusablebefore you smartasses say something smug: I already have all the rom sets I care about, but their behaviour is still disgusting and make things more difficult for kids that want to play some classics like I did back in the day
>>5197820OK but think about it from the consumer angle, not the hacker angle.
>>5197819>why not ship with both versions of the other games then.Apparently it doeshttps://twitter.com/Nibellion/status/1069873514512031744?s=19
>>5197741How to spot a hipster.If you can't fucking read the previous poster that clearly stated that he was pointing to the first CONSOLE, it also wasn't the fucking Walkman which Sony first made/became popular with, you retarded cunt.
>>5197825No it just means the emulator is basically is faking 60hz.There is no space for both ISOs of the game.
>>5197824fuck off corporate bootlicker>>5197821snes classic is the clear winner, cheaper, better games, better emulationI can't find a reason not to hack it or at least let a >friend do it
Pure proof that Sony never can into (Console) hardware, and always fucking stole ideas, tech and copied from others like the ADS mentally challenged kid in school.
>>5197838basednow go buy for the 47th time a super mario bros 3 ROM and remember that emulation is bad
>>5197846Dumb much, Sonytard?
>>5197848no u shill
>>5197848Dumb much, Nintentard?
>>5190794>EMULATION QUALITY IS FUCKING SHIT BECAUSE THE THING TOO DAMN WEAKSeems more like the ARM fork of the emulator is underdeveloped.Similar issues appear even on Nvidia Shield devices.
>>5197828Sorry but you’re dumb as fuck. The Walkman is undoubtedly what made Sony a household name in 1979; it’s what made them both financially (385 million sold) and in terms of global brand recognition. Fucking zoomers trying to act knowledgeable about shit that happened decades before they were even born makes my piss boil.
The DF retro video pretty much murdered any hopes of sony trying to do something useful.
WHY WEREN'T THE REUSING THE PSTV STUFF FFS REEEEEEEEEEEEEE I MAD
>>5197825>with BIOSwhat BIOS are they using? is that known already?
Looks like you guys got your scanlines.
>>5198174Overpaying Scalpers finally got features we've had for free since 2003THAT'S AMAZING
>>5198174Sony did not make that menu BTW, it was the original pcsx rearmed menu by Notaz. They did zero work so as a result they ‘forgot’ to remove it.
>>5198174>Load CD imagenow let's find out if this thing mounts USB drives and we're all set
>>5198186>>5198183Yeah, I know. They stumbled into including features they probably won't even publish in their manuals for fear of loading more images.
>>5187919PAL games look like cassette tapes
>>5186543Modern day Sony wouldn't care if the ps4 mini came out in the same condition.
>>5198449>https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2018-playstation-classic-reviewlink for cis https://archive.is/athY4>oofwhat's this supposed to mean?
>>5197838The PS5 is rumoured to be a Switch style "hybrid" too. Ever since the PS1 and it's SNES ripoff controller, Sony have always been riding Nintendo's coattails.
>>5198191Just super chunky jewel cases.
>>5197838>>5198608>I literally wasn't alive in the 90s and don't know why the PlayStation exists
>>5198625I was there anon. Doesn't change the fact the PlayStation is literally a cancelled SNES add-on, and the controller reflects that.
>>5197832The video output is 60hz on all games, it's more likely a framerate setting being messed with which is probably why it's so funky even when playing games that average 20fps because it's juggling different speeds a over the place
>>5186797Tried them on retropie.Works flawlessly.
>>5186543bought mine so i can take it apart and put a playstation tv in it instead
>>5196142worth it for metroid prime
>>5197808Fuck no, pi has like a minute boot up trying to emulate psx
>>5197819>complains about other languages>can't type in Englishhmmmm
>>5197838Wrong, extrapolation of an entire companies design philosophy from one product is a foolish jab, especially when their main competitor is a company that survives by milking manchildren of their tendy money by rehashing stage same 30 year old IPs year after year.Oh wait, you can buy a cardboard play set for $80.
All modern consoles are shit.Why do you think I'm here?
>>5198904Don't cheap out on SD cards then.Also with one minute loading times, I'm guessing you weren't around for the real PS1 then?
>>5198973That's not entirely true. From a /vr/ perspective, the Switch is basically a Neo Geo X that doesn't suck.
>>5199118Shut the fuck up, Nintendrone.
>>5199128I've been shilling the Vita pretty hard in the other thread anon, but you've got to give credit where credit is due. The Switch is the best console to (((legally))) play Neo Geo games on without remortgaging your house.http://www.hamster.co.jp/american_hamster/arcadearchives/switch/title_list_neogeo.htm>>5199131>Neo Turf Masters>Not RetroI thought summer ended months ago?
>>5199139He's talking of the switch you idiot. If you wanna discuss Neo Geo then post a Neo Geo image.
>>5186543Pissed off? I'm more pissed off at the retards that are buying this piece of shit. I couldn't care less about how the item itself is treated though. It's just a fucking 100 USD emulator.
>>5199115There are far better emulation options than a pi, using a pi is just the cheapest way to emulate. Not the fastest or the easiest.>>5199118"No!"
>>5198709>better medium>better controller>better games>better performance>better featuresit was a perfected snes>>5198904false, I'm using an usb hdd and it's actually faster than real hardware>>5198973you're retarded, ps2 and x360 are better than any retro trash
>>5199165I said MODERN consoles.Not old-but-not-retro consoles.
>>5199146But that is a Neo Geo image. This board is for retro games, not retro consoles you fucking autismo.
>>5199173still here you can't discuss the arguably best consolesI forgot the portables, gba/ds/psp, 90% of the good games cannot be discussed here
It’s been discovered that you can access the emulator settings by connecting a USB keyboard and pressing the escape key. You can add scan lines etc.https://youtu.be/yNtAUwz8fqw
>>5199192I believe there's a possibility they might allow the GBA at some point. I wouldn't hold your breath over the PS2 or beyond, though.
Most of the missing classic must have games are due to music licensing issues. It severely restricts the number of games that Sony could release with the mini console.
>>5198191They look awesome.
>>5199795kek like whatOnly tony hawk is classic were music is a issue
>>5199826Gran Turismo, wipeout and many others.
I'm not gonna buy the console because honestly it seems like it's a much better deal to buy a PS3 that can nicely emulate PS1 games, a PS Vita or a PSP, or heck, even a fucking budget smartphone can do good enough these days with a gamepad attached to it.I have a question though: Have they considered selling the gamepads separately? Did anyone try replacing the cord with some other microUSB to USB since it's literally that? How's it feel compared to the real deal?
>>5199876Well clearly I don't know how to count. Those are 3 questions.
>>5198174This is the laziest thing I've seen. It's like if Nintendo decided to put lakka with snes9x on a raspberry pi for the SNES mini, changed a few settings and called it a day. Absurd.
>>5199876You know the actual connection is just normal USB with some plastic crap around it, right? Only reason you'd need to replace it is if it's right next to another USB port with something plugged in
>>5199876>How's it feel compared to the real deal?Virtually the same, I have an original that is barely used because it was my "player 2" controller. I'd say personally the Classic's even better because the face buttons aren't as spongey as the original, you get a real tactile click when you depress them which for me feels better because you know when you've made an input whereas with the original I'd be pressing real hard at times for fear of not registering an input.
has anyone done input lag testing on this? i got rid of my rpi3 because everything felt shitty and laggy even when playing at 240p on a crt, was hoping some of these new miniature shits would be better
>>5189561N64 was even worse
>>5200209If you're too stupid adjust settings on an a pie to reduce input lag, don't bother with these shit mini consoles.>has anyone done input lag testing on this?Read thread and DF Retro/MLiG videos on them
Have people sorted out a way to put other games on it and use dualshock controllers with it yet?
>>5200352The supposed evidence tweet has been deleted but even if true it sounds like it was code found on the disc but doesn't mean the whole rom is in there. Might have been placeholders in case they did include those games.
>>5200329Give it 5 more day for hacking in more games, so far results seem to suggest it seems straight forward enough just working out the exact details of how it's programmed.Dualshock will need a lot more work to have working "analog" sticks. The real issue is just changing the emulation all together since it runs like trash and put in a new one that works which will take a bit longer.
>>5200364From what i've read the CPU is kind of trash but the GPU is kino, might be decent for running retroarch shaders that the PIs struggle with but this half the cost of a Nvidia Shield AND it comes with two controllers.
>>5200352>36 hidden games>on 16gb Internal flash memory
>>5200364Dual shock will never happen.>>5200352They’re not game files just headers. No actual game data.Sony is just desperate to sell this dumpster fire piece of crap to anyone stupid enough to buy it. People are canceling pre orders everywhere. My local best buy has a mountain of this garbage they will never sell.
>>5198174>accessing the menu only works with overpriced ricer-keyboardsAPEX KEK
>>5198191>virgin NTSC-cases>chad PAL-cases
>>5200402Good, hope to pick one up after new years clearances for $40-$50.
>>5189416It comes with the USB cable, just not the brick for some reason.
>>5190881>Contra isn't on the NES Classic either.Yeah, but Super C is, so that's close enough.
>>5190881Castlevania 1 and 2 are, and Super C
>produce half-assed me-too-product at stupidly high price>it's shit>people hack it apart, make it actually useful>suddenly sells like hot cake because reasons>???>profitI'd rather see this shit be ignored, tbqhfam.
>>5202115Too bad faggot we're riding this cute shitbox all the way
>>5202348It was, but it was turned into an official commercial release when sold at retail so it isn't homebrew anymore since it's officially licensed
>>5198174>change games to NTSC for 60hzCorrect me if I'm wrong, but on Playstation the framerate is determined by the software and not the hardware, so changing the emulator's region to the US wouldn't do anything to the framerate.
>>5202401Yes, but the PSC does 60hz video across all games anyway.
>>5202450Can you emulate any PAL release at 60hz on other emulators too? Do any of the games included with the classic have PAL optimized music?
>>5202469>Can you emulate any PAL release at 60hz on other emulators too?Sure but there's no real reason to unless it's the only official English release like Terranigma
>>520246960hz is just what speed the video signal refreshes it's image at. PAL games might hitch a little but will play almost exactly like they would over a 50hz signal.
>>5202494So my collection of PAL games is not useless if I just play them with an emulator or get a modded American PSX?
>>5202515In theory yes but they'll still play back slow, have letterboxing and might crash more often
Seeing as how it's easy to access the emulation menu, is it possible to just wipe the whole thing clean and replace the software with something like Retroarch?
the digital manuals have typos
>>5202630That's actually the Japanese translation, like Aerith.
>>5202630How is 32 old? Fuck whoever wrote that.
>>5202642Nah, Aeris has the correct spelling.
>>5202630>there's no bet:er pilot >>5202643Compared to the rest of the cast and every other Japanese RPG he's ancient. Even Cloud is old compared to other FFs who's heroes are in the 16-18 range
>>5202657That's a typo.
>>5189382>It has a genuine MIPS 3000A CPU on-boardSlims do too, the only difference is that it's embedded inside the PPC IOP.>and the PS2's GPU is directly compatible with the PS1 GPUWhere did you find this? PS1's GPU is emulated by EE, regardless of the model.
It's been officially hackedhttps://gamerant.com/playstation-classic-hack/Incidently I was able to pick one up for $50. Hope once the homebrewing gets going someone can come up with a better UI, maybe something that resembles the old demo discs.
>>5203474>and accidentally left in its public key.So they had a plan b all along.
>>5203514>release shitty product>leave it to modders to fixSony is trying to cut into Bethesda's market.
>expecting Sony to make good decisions
>console that relied on 3rd party releases I don't know what you guys expected from this
>>5203585I expected 60hz
>>5186610That's not even one of the main complaints against this turd. It's like you saw the reviews for the SNES mini and assumed the problems were the same with this thing.How do people even manage to become this stupid and lazy?
>>5186771>>5194376It has now.https://www.scenefolks.com/pages.php?page=4&id=71
>>5198625The playstation brand exists because Squaresoft absolutely needed to put FMV cutscenes in Final Faggotry VII.
>>5187948>If you have an established fanbase you can sell literally anything to them and make money because hardcore fans have no standards.I think people are slowly waking up from this because of the Activision Blizzard stock crash and the fallout that resulted (heh) from the botched release of Fallout 76.
>>5203682yes, yes, sweet delicious scalper-tears.
>>5186543>its okay when nintendo does ity'all collector cucks need to just suck it up and buy this thing like you did NES / SNES classic>implying it wasn't easy as fuck to emulate the entire nintendo library for a long time
>>5203474im going to wait till after christmas to get one, once they drop in price from the people with buyers remorse, and the dumb blacks thinking they got madden and basketball.
>>5190896Fuck take a shower man
>>5196787Retards who try to justify giving Nintendo money deserve to be shamed.>>5204290Seething NintenbabyPost your body you projecting neck beard
Hopefully they make dual shock controllers too.
Why no Amiga mini yet? It could be loaded with James Pond, World of Soccer '95, etc, etc.
Cheap and cynical as fuck.
>>5203457>the only difference is that it's embedded inside the PPC IOPThe PPC IOP is a MIPS emulator, the actual MIPS processor is not ‘inside’.>Where did you find this? PS1's GPU is emulated by EE, regardless of the model.No it is not. GS is quite obviously built on top of the original PS1 GPU design, the blending modes alone give it away.One of the differences are that every GS texture unit has a filtering unit built into it. This is why the PS2 has an option to bilinear filter PS1 games, because it was trivial to implement in hardware.
>>5205254>>the only difference is that it's embedded inside the PPC IOP>The PPC IOP is a MIPS emulator, the actual MIPS processor is not ‘inside’.It is. The MIPS core is physically present inside the PPC IOP.>>Where did you find this? PS1's GPU is emulated by EE, regardless of the model.>No it is not. GS is quite obviously built on top of the original PS1 GPU design, the blending modes alone give it away.That's a speculation on your side and not in line with what PS2 hackers say.
>>5205548>The MIPS core is physically present inside the PPC IOP.No it isn't you fucking moron. There would be no need for the PPC if they were still able to fabricate the MIPS. Your ASIC theory is ridiculous. >not in line with what PS2 hackers sayYou don't have a shred of actual evidence to support this, while my speculation is at least well grounded. The GS has many unusual characteristics/design choices that would simply not exist if it wasn't designed to also run PS1 software. To suggest otherwise requires good hard evidence, because the contrary would imply that Sony/Toshiba's engineers were complete idiots.
>>5190896>Each of these consoles offered the least amount of exclusives That's a funny way of looking at it. Who needs Nintendo exclusives like Super Smash Bros. Melee, Super Mario Sunshine, Zelda: Twilight Princess when you have a larger number of shitty PS2 shovelware exclusives? Focusing on online was a big mistake in 6th gen, as the dreamcast spectacularly showed. Claiming the Wii was just a gimmick, it's clear you're just trolling at this point, what a stupid and objectively wrong thing to say. Just to dismiss it all as being a "gimmick". And you may have some decent points about the Wii U and Switch which are probably actually bad (I don't own either) but you ruin it with your shit.
>>5205557>No it isn't you fucking moron. There would be no need for the PPC if they were still able to fabricate the MIPS. Your ASIC theory is ridiculous. http://psx-scene.com/forums/f19/deckard-ppc-iop-discussion-157416/#post1216607>So it turned-out the PPC-IOP is not at all what it was considered to be - a PPC core that emulates the MIPS-IOP and parts of its peripherals. The PPC-IOP actually *contains* a MIPS-IOP Core APU!>They simply integrated the MIPS-IOP in the PPC-IOP.https://assemblergames.com/threads/creating-ps2-multi-game-disc-with-ps1-titles.69153/page-2#post-971147>BTW, (not-so) recent discoveries in how DECKARD functions showed that DECKARD itself is neither emulating the actual IOP MIPS core nor the GTE core. Instead a dedicated APU is used, connected to the PPC core, that "emulates" the instructions in hardware. the DECKARD code only passes the instructions and data to itI would love to see you call him a fucking moron, it would've been really hilarious.>You don't have a shred of actual evidence to support thishttp://psx-scene.com/forums/f292/play-ps1-hdd-101757/#post961643>(After reseting the IOP into "PS1" mode and setting up the EE for the Playstation GPU emulation).>The EE is still active during PS1 mode. It handles GPU emulation (It's connected to the other end of the SIF2/GPU DMA channel).https://assemblergames.com/threads/psx-play-on-ps2-usb.50756/page-2#post-741796>The GPU emulation, on the other hand, is done in software with the EE. The GPU DMA channel is actually SIF2, so Sony had already designed this console with the idea of software GPU emulation in mind.https://assemblergames.com/threads/the-iop-on-the-scph-75000-and-newer.57048/#post-817813>like how the EE emulates the PS GPU while in PS mode (the IOP has the registers and DMA channel, but the "GPU" is actually the EE running PS1DRV)Mind calling him a fucking retard too while you'll be at it?
>>5205808>I would love to see you call him a fucking moron, it would've been really hilarious.Looks like you cherry picked or omitted this part though.>They simply integrated the MIPS-IOP in the PPC-IOP. But why?! Most likely the reason was in order to fix compatibility problems that had arisen in the previous IOP revisions in the SCPH-70000 models. That suggests that the earlier version of the PPC did not contain a MIPS core. But it still begs the question, if Sony could still fabricate the MIPS core, why did they use a PPC core and not just keep the slims consistent with the fat PS2s which just had a MIPS.The answer seems pretty obvious to me. The MIPS APU would not be a full implementation, but a cloned portion of the original MIPS pipeline (enough not to infringe MIPS’s patents and intellectual property) to handle some ops that the PPC was not accurately emulating in earlier iterations. So at best the PPC is still emulating, if only for some ops and not others.>Mind calling him a fucking retard too while you'll be at it?Careful that you don’t misinterpret the guesstimations of random forum posters. The reason EE would have to stay active in my GS model is because it has to act as a bus arbiter between the MIPS/PPE and GS.As far as the MIPS/PPE is aware, the EE *is* the GPU, because on a real PS1 the MIPS and the GPU are directly connected. In reality on the PS2, the EE in PS1 mode uses the GS like a co-processor (instructions sent to EE are simply forwarded to GS). Accordingly there is no inconsistency between what I am saying and what your posters say.The PS2 is incapable of displaying anything that is not in the VRAM which is not memory mapped or accessible to EE. Even in this “EE rasterises everything” theory, the EE would still need to forward the framebuffer to GS to copy into VRAM.At this point your theory becomes quite ridiculous. What is the point of Sony including the original PS1 CPU if GPU was going to be in software?
>>5205897>Looks like you cherry picked or omitted this part though.>>Most likely the reason was in order to fix compatibility problems that had arisen in the previous IOP revisions in the SCPH-70000 models. You just misinterpreted that part. Here, let me help you to spot the problem.>The PPC-IOP is present on the SCPH-75000 and newer.>Accordingly there is no inconsistency between what I am saying and what your posters say.Yeah, except the part where he (the creator of PS1VModeNeg among other things) mentioned multiple times that EE emulates the GPU.
>>5205946>The PPC-IOP is present on the SCPH-75000 and newer.So fucking what? That can just mean that the 70000 used a different chip to the 75000 which is exactly what he said. And then what IO chip did the SCPH-70000 use? The original MIPS or an earlier chip that attempts to emulate it?The question is still begged, why does the PPC exist if Sony could just fabricate the entire MIPS chip? It makes no sense whatsoever.>except the part where he (the creator of PS1VModeNeg among other things) mentioned multiple times that EE emulates the GPUYeah, and you're misinterpreting what they are saying (admittedly they are saying it very vaguely). The EE is emulating the PS1 GPU.... *as far as the MIPS/PPE is concerned* but not actually *rasterizing* PS1 games. That is to say, it is emulating the *identity* of the PS1 GPU rather than its actual functions.(cont)
(cont)Sorry for calling you a moron, but there are so many fucking reasons why "EE rasterizes PS1 games" is a dumb theory.1) Why did Sony include the original MIPS when GTE is a waste of silicon for IO and it was becoming an obsolete chip. It would have been cheaper/easier to just use some ARM for IO.If going by the software approach, EE would be perfect to emulate the CPU as well. EE has MIPS core to emulate PS1's MIPS, VU0 can emulate GTE, and VU1 can emulate GPU. But even by your theory Sony didn't do this.Instead, it makes more sense that as little software emulation as possible is used. Original PS1 MIPS + PS1 GPU derived GS + PS1 SPE derived PS2 SPE. 2) GS has loads of PS1 GPU like behavior. Its basically blending modes that behave exactly like PS1 + alpha blending. Its gouraud shading has the exact same perspective bug at extreme angles as PS1. Hell, even the mipmapping on GS determines mip levels in a strangely truncated way as if it was recovered from silicon cut out of the final PS1 GPU fabrication.3) If PS1 GPU is emulated by EE, why are enhancements only limited to texture filtering? Incidentally texture filtering is *the* easiest and most trivial enhancement to integrate into native hardware emulation as if it were run on GS...4) Does EE also emulate PS1 audio? I guess it probably does, ignoring the fact that the PS2's SPE is literally two PS1 SPEs + minor enhancements duct-taped together (much like GS is eight PS1 GPUs + enhancements duct-taped together). Oh wait, not using SPE when it's there would be fucking stupid.
>>5195945If you dont give a shit about Smash, then the GC was like some off-brand console you gave your little brother so he didnt fuck up your real one.The best games on GC were already on Dreamcast, Xbox or PS2. there was literally zero reason for the Cube to exist.they carried that on with every subsequent machine they made that wasn't a portable.
>>5205990>And then what IO chip did the SCPH-70000 use?The regular MIPS IOP, as seen in the previous revisions of the PS2.>That is to say, it is emulating the *identity* of the PS1 GPU rather than its actual functions.Mind explaining me how can one extract something like that from this sentence?>The GPU emulation, on the other hand, is done in software with the EE. The GPU DMA channel is actually SIF2, so Sony had already designed this console with the idea of software GPU emulation in mind.>>5205994>1) Why did Sony include the original MIPS when GTE is a waste of silicon for IO and it was becoming an obsolete chip.Full software emulation is buggy. See POPS, that one emulates the PS1 fully and its compatibility is garbage.>2) GS has loads of PS1 GPU like behavior.One reason could be that Toshiba is garbage at making GPUs. You might recall pre-release rumors about PS3 not having any GPU that were caused because Toshiba was tasked to create a GPU for it, however they couldn't make it in time. The other reason could be patenting issues with other 3D accelerator companies of its time holding key patents, such as 3dfx, Nvidia etc.>3) If PS1 GPU is emulated by EE, why are enhancements only limited to texture filtering?SCE was asked about this in the pre-release articles, with the answer being that even though they could include further enhancements, they don't want to introduce glitches and break compatibility with some software.>4) Does EE also emulate PS1 audio?Where did I mention audio? Ofc. it doesn't, not sure why do you even bring that up.
>>5190901PAL versions had the most localization option already built in maybe? That way they could use those versions and sell them to more regions
>>5206057>The regular MIPS IOP, as seen in the previous revisions of the PS2.Well that is strange indeed that he talked about the MIPS core being integrated into the PPC to improve compatibility because the SCPH-70000 ran PS1 games better than the SCPH-75000. Something doesn't add up here.>Mind explaining me how can one extract something like that from this sentence?It doesn't state what exactly is being emulated. They don't even know themselves or have evidence showing what is being emulated, other than some vague notions of EE being involved in PS1 backwards compatibility which is, of course, true.The fact that a different DMA channel (SIF2) is used for PS1 backwards compatibility than normal IO operation actually supports my theory because typically the IO processor would not have its commands directly interfaced straight into GS. If the IO processor was just trying to talk with EE as normal than the typical DMA channel SIF1 would have been adequate.>One reason could be that Toshiba is garbage at making GPUsExcept they had nothing to do with the PS1 GPU. Patent issues wouldn't explain also why the GS matches PS1 behavior in some things so very closely.>with the answer being that even though they could include further enhancements, they don't want to introduce glitches and break compatibility with some software.There are some enhancements that have only a low probability of breaking software like increasing resolution. Of course that would require extra hardware power which is not achievable if running without software emulation...>Ofc. it doesn'tWhy not? It makes little sense to me why GPU would be emulated but not SPU.
That seems to be a lot of discussion about a banned console you two got going there.
>>5206057>See POPS, that one emulates the PS1 fully and its compatibility is garbage.I should has also mentioned that probably says more about how easy it is to run PS1 GPU emulation on EE...MIPS IV architecture used in EE is backwards compatible with the MIPS I used in PS1's CPU so I doubt it is the CPU portion which is responsible for POPS sucking
>>5206106I don't think that's a problem, considering that it's about its backwards compatibility with PS1.
>>5206120...I'm keeping my eye on you guys.
>>5206090>Well that is strange indeed that he talked about the MIPS core being integrated into the PPC to improve compatibilityEvery PS2 has compatibility lists with patches required to work around emulation inaccuracies. Putting the MIPS core behind the PPC core allowed them to make more powerful patches.>The fact that a different DMA channel (SIF2) is used for PS1 backwards compatibilityhttps://assemblergames.com/threads/playstation-2-are-there-any-hardware-mysteries-left.62325/page-2#post-900291>So the SIF2 (DMA) registers are almost certainly not used from neither IOP nor EE side for PS1 GPU emulation>here are some enhancements that have only a low probability of breaking software like increasing resolutionAnd there have been talks about making a mod of PS1DRV to increase the resolution to 480p.>>5206115>MIPS IV architecture used in EE is backwards compatible with the MIPS II've seen this mentioned also in regards to POPS in PSP and how it's running the code natively. It's not, it's running a dynarec. Sure, you can run the code natively, however you'll run into timing as well as architecture issues. The IOP doesn't get underclocked in PS1 mode from 37.5 MHz to 33.8688 MHz just because they can.
>>5205792>Who needs Nintendo exclusives like Super Smash Bros. Melee, Super Mario Sunshine, Zelda: Twilight PrincessYou're trying to be ironic, but you're actually right. Those games are mediocre at best - but honestly mostly dogshit. That's EASILY the lowest point in the series for each of the examples you provided besides smash - which is an autism simulator.>durr I can clean up goop as mario, jelly much?Get real. RE4 was the best exclusive the Game Cube had and it got relreleased on other systems with more content because Game Cube couldn't move units.
>>5206210>Every PS2 has compatibility lists with patches required to work around emulation inaccuracies. Putting the MIPS core behind the PPC core allowed them to make more powerful patches.Except the MIPS end of things doesn't need patching because it's the original CPU. What needs patching is the GPU end of things (even if it was GS doing it because it's merely a subset of PS1 GPU rather than a copy of it). However, if the EE is rasterizing in software then there is no need for the PPC to be involved for patching, because the EE could do it.>So the SIF2 (DMA) registers are almost certainly not used from neither IOP nor EE side for PS1 GPU emulationWell whatever is the case, it's not typical I/O <-> EE communication.>And there have been talks about making a mod of PS1DRV to increase the resolution to 480p.That would just be a GS output hack like the existing "progressive scan" patches for PS2 games. Just like those patches, it wouldn't actually achieve *true* 480p but more of a linedoubling effect. Implementing real progressive scan was difficult on PS2 which is the reason many PS2 games didn't support it.>I've seen this mentioned also in regards to POPS in PSP and how it's running the code natively. It's notWhile this is true, there is still tremendous architectural compatibility. The instruction set can be mapped 1:1. The only thing major things that would need to be accounted for is timing and the different pipelining.
>>5206270>Except the MIPS end of things doesn't need patching because it's the original CPU.That has to interface with an inaccurate emulation of a GPU that sometimes returns garbage data or doesn't support various features.>That would just be a GS output hackNot true, it'd be an actual upscale.>like the existing "progressive scan" patches for PS2 games. Just like those patches, it wouldn't actually achieve *true* 480p but more of a linedoubling effect. Implementing real progressive scan was difficult on PS2 which is the reason many PS2 games didn't support it.That's entirely untrue. Many PS2 games rendered internally at resolutions such as 640x512, 512x512, 512x448 etc. (in some cases x511, x447 etc. to blur the image) with only a part of them doing the actual field rendering that results in line doubling if forced to output 480p. Those patches, and GSM, work properly simply because the entire frame is already rendered in the VRAM, but displayed in 2 passes. Not sure where did you get that progressive scan was difficult on PS2.>The only thing major things that would need to be accounted for is timing and the different pipelining.And yet Sony couldn't manage to do it properly. Damn, it's as if it's quite a challenge to do that. I'll msg him if he's willing to do a detailed writeup on how does the emulation work, both PS1DRV and POPS.
>>5186543>betrayingSony always have been cheap, manipulative twats. Their customers are usually on the low end of the IQ spectrum. Nothing has changed really. There is no betrayal. It's just business as usual for Sony; preying on the weak.
>>5206218>You're trying to be ironic, but you're actually right. Those games are mediocre at best - but honestly mostly dogshit. Conversation ends, go for a psych evaluation.
>>5206345>That has to interface with an inaccurate emulation of a GPU that sometimes returns garbage data or doesn't support various features.Except either way it's interfacing with EE which is running software that can itself interpret/modify anything that is being sent from I/O.>Not true, it'd be an actual upscale.So not native 480p then?>Not sure where did you get that progressive scan was difficult on PS2It's difficult on PS2 because for it not to look shitty your front buffer needs to have a horizontal resolution of 640, and neither the front or back buffers have to be field-rendered. VRAM space is very limited on PS2 which is why this did not often occur. PS2 developers did not implement progressive scan not because they were lazy fucks who needed their work completed by homebrew ROM hackers but because it was a genuine challenge.Many PS2 games that don't do the old field-rendering approach still sometimes alternate with an interlaced front buffer every other frame despite having a full size back buffer.The GS hacks are simply video output hacks that change how the existing framebuffers are displayed (e.g. eliminating double buffering) or line-double interlaced framebuffers which'll give you 480p but a trashy image. There are actual patches which hex edit the framebuffer resolutions but these don't usually work for obvious reasons.>And yet Sony couldn't manage to do it properlyIt's not that they couldn't manage to do it properly, but they wanted an entirely hardware based solution. MIPS + GS dumbed down to one pixel pipeline + SPU dumbed down to half of itself.
>>5186543Honestly, I don't get people who take this outrage so personally. Obviously, they had issues licensing the games, they even included code for Crash, Gran Turismo and Tomb Raider in the finished version. It's not their fault rights holders cockblocked them.
>>5207512I can't really blame the game companies for not wanting to be associated with the PSClassic. Why would you want Sony to show off a poorly-emulated copy of your game that runs badly?