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name one thing this man did wrong
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>>106861705
allowing dabid to butcher him in the show

also
>aagghh..
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>>106861705

>tfw it still hurts
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>>106861705
The King we needed, but didn't deserve
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>b-but m-muh killed his daughter!
Yeah pretty fucking based. He did what he had to do. Not his fault no one trusted his plan and left him
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>>106861705
I don't know but I always thought him actually winning and sitting on the throne in the end as undisputed king would have been the real curve ball for the series.

Pretty much everyone bets on Dany, Jon or even Tyrion ending up the ruler. Stannis was written off since book 2.
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>>106861705
Brutally murdered his young daughter
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>>106861705
He killed more Baratheons than any other house I think
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>>106862342
None?

>parents killed by storm
>brother killed by boar
>other brother killed by shadow baby
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cunnykiller
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He held the worst cookout ever
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>>106861705
>Get burdened with being the king of Westeros after your brother dies and you find out that his son is an incest bastard
>Everyone laughs at you when you shout that the throne is yours by right and just sides with your chad younger brother
>Kills your chad younger brother with magic
>March onto King's landing to claim your rightful throne, get pushed back by the Lannisters and Tyrells.
>Decide to instead go to the North and help the Night's Watch after seeing their call for help.
>Also get some Sellswords
>after defeating the wilding tribes, go down north to face down the Boltons
>Winter came
>Twenty goodmen fucked my shit up
>Shit is dire, desparate times means we need to use magic
>Sacrifice my only heir, my own daughter
>Expect it to help us but my sellswords and less loyal men desert me out of disgust.
>Decide to fight the Boltons anyway because that goddamn throne is rightfully mine, so I have to do my duty
>Fail
>get killed by Brienne

Stannis' quest could be a kino movie story of it's own to be honest.
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>>106861705
didn't embrace paganism
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>>106862401
>>Kills your chad younger brother with magic
In the show did Stannis outright order it? I know in the books it was Melly's own doing to prove her own prophecy true, while Stannis slept through the night having actually prepared for a stand-up battle (that he probably would have won).
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AAGGHHHH I'M SO SICK OF SCOTLAND
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>>106862507
He was the best part of that movie.
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>>106861705
Let a witch talk him into burning his own daughter alive.
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>>106862269
I'd bury my face so deep in that pussy it would take a crane to get it out.
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>>106862291
Je sacrificed the thing he loved the most in this world, arguably the only thing he loved, for his kingdom and his people. It makes him a great king.
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The thing I don't get is why fans blame him for Renly's death while completely overlooking that Renly did not profess Cersei's children to be born of incest at all and was just going to kill and usurp them.
And Renly planned to kill and usurp his older brother.

Stannis and Jon Arryn actually investigated the children, and Stannis is only doing what he is because he's convinced Robert's children are fakes and that the Lannisters have murdered the king. He has a just cause.

Renly just wants to be in charge, and if it means slaughtering his brother, nieces and nephews than so be it.

Is it just because Renly was gay that people like him?
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>>106862401
All stannis did wrong was not be Le Chosen One hero like Jon or Ebin Plot Armor Bad Guy like Ramsay. He was just a normal dude who kept getting cucked by things out of his control but never gave up in spite of that. Even though Ser Twenty Goodmen was far too OP, Stannis marching to his death with his loyal bros was utter K I N O
STANNIS NOT CONFIRMED DEAD BTW I literally will not care about anything said to the contrary
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>>106862622
Lol, he got tricked into doing so by a succubus witch and then suicided his entire army, dooming his kingdom and people.
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>>106862590
>>106862291
something something pic about differences between book and show something
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>>106862711
Yeah obviously it didn't work, his heart still was in the right place.
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Not using Warwolf on Winterfell
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>>106862711
>suicided his entire army
Literally anyone who wanted to leave left, and most of his army left. This is a huge plot point and is exactly WHY he gets btfo. Anyone who went into battle with him in the end went because they wanted to follow him.
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>>106862481
>"Make me another son"
He's in on it in the show, where Stannis and Mel's relationship is more ambiguous in the books.
I believe she stole his seed while he slept; it makes her parallel to the classic succubus much clearer.
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>>106861705
Dying. Only victory matters. He lost therefore he was wrong.
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how/why did they ruin his plot so much?

even his army. it's supposed to be a scratch force of those left loyal to him, no more than 800 heavy horse included. then in the show he has hordes of sellswords that desert (to where?) at the first sign of trouble.
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>>106862860
they're probably just going to go back to essos
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>>106862791
Was that trebuchet a real prop or just cgi?
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>>106862921
From where? The north apparently only has two ports, and no fleets to carry them. Plus if the snow is so bad Stannis can barely move forward, heading north will only make it wose.

It's seriously a dumb plot point in the show. Why even introduce the Iron Banks sellswords at all?
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>>106862681
I believe Stannis is alive in the books (hopefully) but he got written out the show because his actor and the writers didn't get on, Stephen DiLlane said something along the lines of "they couldnt explain what my character was thinking anymore, so i couldnt act anymore, they just wanted me to stand there and pull faces". Charles Dance had similar complaints.
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>>106862805
The fact that so many men left meant that he was incapable of inspiring confidence in his men and thus mean his is an incapable leader, as well as a child murderer.
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>>106863047
Makes sense.
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>>106862958
Don't question it too much. Season 5 is when the show started getting off the rails afterall. Literally the start of season 6 was Ellaria killing Doran even though that'd realistically start a Dornish civil war. And don't forget that fucking awful shitty king's moot where Euron basically said, "MUH BIG COCK" and that's how he won over the Ironborn.
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>>106863210
euron turned out to be absolutely based though
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>>106862625
is there anyone that actually likes renly? i mean readers, obviously in the story he's popular. but if youre reading the story or watching the show hes just a little twinky bitch that doesnt deserve anything
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>>106861773
press agh to aaagghh
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>>106863210
What happened to Dorne?

Everyone was cool with their prince being murdered?

And who is running it now?

>>106863235
He has loads of show fans and faggots that argue his case online (like on the ASOIAF forums).
The thing I don't get is every argument against Stannis's claim at the point they're rivals basically works against Renly too except even more.
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>>106862791

It annoys me how much rope is cut in tv shows and films. Nobody did that, it's a waste of rope
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>>106863312
Obviously when the sitting ruler dies, Dornish Law dictates that the rulers (dead) younger brother's paramour should take over, not any other Lord. That's why no other Dornish house has questioned the succession or even bothered to exist. Duh.
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>>106863312
>What happened to Dorne?
D&D don't give two shits about the little details such as that. They don't bother on touching on anything dornish except for the Martells and Sand Snakes.

>Everyone was cool with their prince being murdered?
Apparently so. Ellaria herself says that everyone was tired of him being "weak" and his own soldiers stood by and let him be murdered. Weird shit because in this case there'd be some type of Arab spring going on in Dorne already if they were that fed up, but like I said, Dumb and Dumber can't be bothered to put in more details about Dorne.

>And who is running it now?
Who knows? Dumb and Dumber certainly don't fucking care. If they were smart, they'd introduce the 2nd most powerful dornish family, the Yronwoods, and have them take over instead, especially after all the Sandsnakes got Euron'd.
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>>106862156
his whole thing is duty, he has a duty to protect her, he would never do that. bad writing
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>>106863365
a king might. politics is theatre. it doesn't have to be practical.
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>>106863554
Yeah, the show version is the exact opposite of the book Stannis.
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>>106862124

The king we deserved but didn't need
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>>106864754
>Didn't need
>At least Three characters in season 7 admit he was 100% right
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gentle reminder nobody liked stannis and if he wasnt obsessed with being king he wouldve abdicated and supported renly avoiding the war of the 5 kings which massacred westeros
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>>106865130

He is also mad.
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Believing a religion
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>>106865373
but he wasn't obsessed with being king. He was obsessed with following the law of succession. It was westeros, not nam- there are rules.
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>>106865373
I mean yeah, if you never fight for what's your or do your duty and just roll over then things will be different.

And if Renly hadn't been obsessed with being king and thinking it was a popularity contest then he would have been Stannis's heir and ended the war of the 5 kings.
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>>106865437
>there are rules

only guidelines, there is nothing to stop abdication

he is obsessed with being king thats why he used blood magic to kill people,he literally went beyond the wall to kill wildlings on the chance he might rally support for his throne
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>>106865614
b8 or stupid?
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>>106865637
nice argument
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>>106865373
there would have still been a war against the lannisters, dummy
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>>106861705
Nothing because everything he did was 100% justified

In the books of course
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>>106865649
he can't abdicate a throne that isn't his, dumbass.
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>>106865658
a short one, the alliance troops of renly robb and stannis winning easily
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>>106865649
my first thought when i saw your post.
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>>106865701
the lannisters are completely overpowered meme lords and it wouldn't have been short
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>>106863365
The people inside the castle surrendered, the king wanted his monstrosity of a trebuchet for fire for lulz.
It'd fire once and then be disassembled. So who the fuck cares about some rope.
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>>106865442
Basically this. Renly's obsession with being king is what killed the Baratheon cause.
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>order the murder of your brother
>sacrifice your daughter
>completely ignore the taboo of kin-slaying
>get absolutely ass fucked because of it

Stannis was a moron. He did EVERYTHING wrong. He didn't play the game, he just expected everything to fall in place for him. All of his battles involved him reaching out his hand and saying "give it to me" and he got denied each time because he's a dumbass.
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>>106865442
>And if Renly hadn't been obsessed with being king and thinking it was a popularity contest then he would have been Stannis's heir and ended the war of the 5 kings.
this
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>>106863509
>If they were smart, they'd introduce the 2nd most powerful dornish family, the Yronwoods, and have them take over instead
I'd rather it were the Manwoodys, the rightful lords of Dorne.
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>>106865794
>he just expected everything to fall in place
Not really, he worked really hard to get what was his.
You can disagree with showStannis and his deeds, but you don't need to utterly misread his character.
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>people actually think renlys alliances in highgarden wouldve continued with him backing stannis

kek
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>>106863225
Euron was absolutely miscast in the show, though.
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>>106863365
Lindy pls. its a cool trope
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>>106865843
>people think the ambitious Tyrells wouldn't have continued when their flower is a heartbeat away from being queen, like in canon

kek
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>>106865842
>Not really, he worked really hard to get what was his.

Bullshit, he didn't lift a fucking finger the entire time.
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>>106863312
Dorne arc getting aborted the way it did was probably the show's biggest mistake because there's CLEARLY something going on in the books with the whole conspiracy thing.
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>>106865884
wrong
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>>106865940
>Thinking Dabid and Dabid could write a good conspiracy.
Things getting cut out is better then D&D butchering what exists.
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>>106862291
He didn't murder he, he offered her to R'hllor
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aaaaghghghghbois get in here
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>>106865884
yeah. the tyrells would have turned against the baratheons if renly backed stannis because his wife is a florent and because they just wanted to use renly as a puppet.
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BRAVO DAVID AND DAN

CAN'T WAIT FOR LE EPIC FINALE WHERE KELLY C SLAYS ALL DUMB PROBLEMATIC MEN AND BECOMES KWEEEEEEEEEEEN
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>>106862845
must be a sound sleeper
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>>106866067
It'll be a sad day if that fat fuck GRRM dies and only resolution for the story ends up with whatever D&D come up with.
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>>106862845
>I believe she stole his seed while he slept

haha imagine if that happened to you haha I'd probably call the cops but only because I was raped not because I wanted to track her down hahaha
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>all these people in this thread denying the true king
Devan!
Light the pyre
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>>106865888

wrong
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>>106866193
>sad
you mean hillarious. That's exactly what that fat fuck deserves. Getting his legacy forever tainted because he was a lazy fat fuck who'd rather milk his fame than actually write.
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>>106866163
Stannis has difficulty sleeping and she brews potions to help him. It is a plot point in the books.
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>>106865940
The Dorne plot should have just been straight up cut. The show can't possibly be as complicated as the books, and the Iron Islands and Dorne need to be very simplified.
However, the Northern and Riverlands plotlines should have stayed the same.
I'm not sure about the Young Griff plotline, it might be necessary to the story it might not be.
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>>106865963
read the books :)

>>106866037
>puppet heir
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>>106866193
Gurm obviously doesn't give a fuck about this story anymore, I'm guessing their "consultation" with him about the story involves something like them calling him up and saying "Hey, what do you think of this retarded idea that is completely out of character that we have for next season?" and him shrugging and saying yeah sure, whatever, just make sure my next check is in the mail.
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>>106866291
varys plan makes zero sense without aegon. the show tried to dodge around it when dany confronted him, but everything varys has done just makes no fucking sense without aegon.
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>>106866307
Yeah, this. He just wants to write low-effort backstory about some Targaryen no-one cares about
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>>106866295
i have read the books
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>>106866277
The old Nyquil/Viagra cocktail, I know it well
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>>106866206
Well fuck, anon, what about Robb? There's no star-crossed love story in the books: Robb got viagra+roofied.
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>>106865763
So only white AMERICANS have white privilege then. Phew, good to know.
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>>106866337
Yeah I suppose. I sympathize with D&D, because its not possible to have a story as complicated as aFfC and aDwD in a TV Show format.
I would have kept kept the Northern and Riverlands plotlines the same. Kept the Young Griff plotline the same.
Dorne plotline goes out the window, and all it is is Doran backs Young Griff to get revenge on the Lannisters for Aegon's death. No need for the pointless Quentyn story and the pointless plotline with Myrcella and Darkstar.
Iron Islands I would have kept it pretty much the same as the show, except have Euron's character be more like it is in the books. No need to complicate the story with Victarian and Aeron. So basically Euron takes the Iron Islands, Theon and Asha are with Stannis. I'm guessing Theon is going to get executed, it wouldn't make sense for him not to be.
Sansa in the vale can just go away for an entire season (like Bran did), there isn't actually that much material in that plot. The show would probably end up being 9 full seasons with these changes
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>>106866365
And chose to marry his roofier like a dumbass
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>>106866037

Not really. They'd have just conspired to murder Stannis. They were still bound to Renly and an easy win with him would be a smoother option than tossing Renly aside, ending the marriage, pissing Loras off, and choosing to side with the Lannisters and go to actual war.

Use your brain.
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>>106866512
even if they axed all the dorne stuff in s5 and beyond, they would need probably 2 extra episodes per season to cover all that aegon stuff
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>>106861705
only good character on this shit show.
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>>106866638
Yeah I know, which as why I said they'd have to extend the show a season to make up for the more complicated Northern and Riverlands plots, as well as Young Griff's scenes
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>>106866356
doesn't seem like it
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>>106866620
>>106866620
wrong
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>>106866620
>>106866620
right
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>>106866660
tywin, roose, sandor, jaime, ned, bobby, jeor, alliser, tormund
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>>106866660
try again
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>>106863365
Yes, they did. Everybody did it. There are hundreds of literary and artistic references to it.

Stop getting your historical information from an autistic dance instructor who has never read a history book in his life
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so the fat old man is going to kill him in the books similar way?
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>>106866960
He's in a slightly different situation militarily and Brienne is nowhere near him, so if he'll die before Winterfell it will be in a different manner.
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>>106866960
no. brienne is in the riverlands, mel and shireen are at castle black. he will probably lose the battle and die, but not the same way.
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>>106862791
More effective than Melisandre ever was
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>>106867020
I think he'll go a bit further than the battle, the Alexander Nevsky flags are a bit blatant, but not much further.
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>>106862401
I'm sure the show explained it but I don't recall it very well. Why didn't sacrificing his daughter work? Didn't the magic lady tell him that by doing it he would win? She didn't seem to be bullshitting being she birthed the shadow baby and seemed to genuinely be able to speak to the lord of light or at least interpret shit correctly.
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he fucked a witch whore in an attempt to usurp the throne

fuck him and his flaming fag heart followers may they all burn in 7 hells
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>>106867516
shireen's sacrifice brought jon back from the dead, r'hllors master plan from the start was to get mel up there to bring jon back. that's why the snows melted.
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>>106862481
It happened almost exactly the same in book and show
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Fuck this nigga, my boy Young Griff is gonna execute those lannister rats and have 14yo Dany wet 24/7.
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>>106867516
The show explains nothing, just moves on. Half of her magic in charletanism; glamour, powders, hallucinagens. You can see how much of her visions are guesswork in her PoV chapters when Jon and Mance ask her specific questions.
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>>106867690
t. varys
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>>106867250
I don't understand why GRRM wrote the situation with Stannis' men and the northern mountain clansmen the way he did: Stannis' men are so desperate that they're dying like flies and cannibalizing each other, but the clansmen are happy as clams and laughing at the southerner's suffering.

I understand acclimatization, but the way that it's written the two forces are practically different species. Unless we're supposed to believe that northmen are literally evolved to handle the cold more than others.
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>>106867793
that's kind of a running thing in the series, northerners can handle the cold more than southerners.
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>>106867793
I don't know if it even snows in the Stormlands. Even in good woolen clothing, I would imagine having a hard time dropped into Siberia in the onset of winter without a proper sense of frost damage.
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>>106868172
it snows in the south but not often. it's kind of like rome, they almost never get snow there
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>>106867682
no it didn't



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