Do you personally like traditional tropes or new concepts to an old idea in your fantasy games?I personally like keeping things in the spirit of old legends and previous works. One feels connected to the past and distanced from the post modern nightmare of todays world. But I also like elf waifus
>>64578982You sound like the worst kind of pleb.
>>64579066Well you got me thereGo enjoy your sjw settings WotC pump out then
>>64578982You sound like the nobles kind of patrician.
>>64578982>But I also like elf waifusYep, pleb.
Tropes are best when they are used as a foundation and frame and not the structure. New takes with obvious roots are best, but both new interpretations and holding to historical “example” hold value depending on the end goals of the setting.
>>64578982>Do you personally like traditional tropes or new concepts to an old idea in your fantasy games?Yes
>>64578982I like finding the root of the tropes and using the root.Don't look at WotC look at Older D&D.Don't build on the older D&D, go to Tolkien. Don't copy Tolkien, copy Beowulf and the Norse and Celtic Myths.
>>64578982I do both. Some ideas are new, some are old. I find it best for players to have a generic/traditional core from which one can deviate in geographical terms and certain details, if they wish to.
>>64579111>SJW settings>posts Pokemon
Age and tradition are irrelevant>old bad new good>old good new badare for brainlet npcs
>>64584836Based anon, thigns should be judged on their own merits.
>>64584836That said - all waifubating is shit. Old and new.
>>64578982I don't really care. They either are very similar, or completly different things with a shared name. There is no fundamental reason why one would be better.
i swear to god i'm gonna fucking shank the next person that makes a setting with dnd races
>>64586074But what if its a Dnd setting?
>>64586036The ultimate shit taste
>>64578982Do what Warcraft did and include both
>>64578982In op pic case I'm all too happy with the new hot elf babe over a cool yet still just a dude old guy.
>>64578982Is that an actual concept art from WoW?
>>64578982The image is kinda irrelevant when WoW now has both nature worshiping barefoot druids and occult pagan savages.Both of which have access to the same set of skills.
Damn, druids are looking fine now, boy.
>>64587077Which is really stupid, because in-universe, Druidism is not just a generic term for nature magic, but a special school of magic that originated from the teachings of Cenarius.
>>64586171Especially if it’s a D&D setting.
>>64586074I'm afraid quite a few of these people are already dead, because they made settings with "D&D races" before D&D even existed.
>>64578982Getafix is a hack
>>64578982I don't give a fuck, it's all good.
>>64578982>One feels connected to the past>But I also like elf waifusRead sir launfal and do both. Elf waifus are a centuried tradition.
>>64587077>>64587193It's doubly weird and equally not so weird when you consider that the drust's version of druidism is pretty much death magic — the exact opposite of Cenarius' life magic. It even draws power from and influences the Shadowlands, which is also the opposite of the Emerald Dream. WoW is full of contradictions like this, and if anything, they've only expanded on this concept with recent expansions.
>>64587358It's an archetypal plot that exists in every culture>hero saves an "elf" girl, not knowing that she's an elf>she reveals herself as an elf and takes her saviour to her hidden realm in gratitude>the hero eats at feasts and dances in the elven kingdom>eventually, he feels homesick and goes back to his village>he finds unfamiliar people in his house who tell him that a person with his name lived in this house a century ago
>>64578982>Do you personally like traditional tropes or new concepts to an old idea in your fantasy games?I like to keep as close to the original mythological or folklore roots, rather than the tropes that were build upon them. As for the second (or third, even) generation of tropes in fantasy: as far as I'm concerned, they are mostly pure garbage. Tolkien's elves were kinda cool, Dn'D were shit, and WoW are so completely divorced of anything that made the original image interesting they actually make me want to puke.>>64587476Yes. Plus you also have stories of Fairies, Mermaids and Selkies, which are very similar in nature: usually a beautiful woman that is somehow tricked into becoming someone's wife, eventually the trickery is revealed and and the man is abandoned. Variations of these tales can be found from New Guinea past Japan to obviously some of the most popular western fairytales.
>>64587476That's not the plot of sir launfal, but yes that is also a thing.
No, because your image is bait and people who think it's anything but are retards.Dumbasses of the past had dumb bullshit. Melf's Acid Arrow is literally because the character was a male elf- hence the name. M Elf. The first cleric in D&D was specifically made to counter the a special snowflake custom PC- who was a playable vampire named Sir Fang. Believing that rose tinted glasses is anything but is just objectively wrong. You cherrypicked an old image from an old comic with some "Nufantasy" art to make it as abominable as possible and to support your made up mind ahead of time, and I won't tolerate it. Anyone can play that game, if they have the time and patience.Mind you, I'm not actually accusing you of this, but people on /tg/ do this shit a lot so you have to forgive people here if we're a little jumpy as a whole. Too much trolling and insincere bullshit does that to a community.
>>64587624Dear god you are an idiot.
>>64581783I would argue that Pokemon is the least political media I could possibly think of
>>64587607I've never heard of Sir Launfal, and I studied comparative mythology as a part of my anthropology course.
>>64587624This is a quality troll, I enjoyed it.
>>64587668That is because it's not really mythology, but a heroic medieval knight tale. You don't study alexandreids in comparative mythology either: there is a general unspoken implications that anthropology largely focuses on pre-literal or non-literal sources, and leave the rest to literary studies.
>>64584836Oh fuck off retard. Just because someone likes older depictions of certain fantasy concepts doesn't mean they're some paint-huffing grognard. Maybe some people just wish WoW and D&D didn't posion the well for fantasy and create a box that no one who plays either is willing to think outside of.
>>64587686Not sure if I agree, seeing how the oldest recorded mythological plots come from written sources, but it's probably true for the cultures that still exist nowadays.
>>64587693D&D is not a setting. At least say "Greyhawk" or "Forgotten Realms"
>>64587650>>64587685Not trolling, not memeing. Sorry if I'm the only person who dare stand up to the "old thing good, new thing bad" hivemind.
>>64587429I think that everything interesting in post-Metzen Warcraft is a happy coincidence. It's true because the interesting shit is always confined to small side plots, while the main attraction always sucks.
>>64587668Knight previously in high position feels rejected, leaves arthurs court, becomes destitute, gets taken in to Faerie by handmaidens, meets elf, marries her, goes back with fabulous gifts on the condition he not tell anyone about her, does his best for a while, gwen calls him a fag, gets mad and says he has an elf wife, theres a court case because he called the queen ugly, the he chooses the purer realm of faerie over arthurs court and enters in to it for good.Its cool that you studied anthropology anon, i have a bachelors in it myself, but you could have googled the name and spent two minutes reading a synopsis instead of making assumptions. Sorry if im being snarky but i was making an actual suggestion to OP that he explore some literature that might change how he looks at things and you make some incorrect assumptions about it in order to make your own point.>>64587686Yeah, not a lot of english language poetry in anthropology syllabi.
>>64587713>Not sure if I agree, seeing how the oldest recorded mythological plots come from written sourcesNot entirely true, most of the classic mythologies and even folklore can be actually traced all the way back to pre-literal eras.More importantly - while it's not something I personally agree, and it is something we are gradually driffting away (for better and worse), the traditional definition of anthropology is that it studies pre-literal or non-literal cultures - as the rest can be studied "more efficiently" by other studies, including sociology, history, literary studies etc...There is in general an actual problem with drawing the line between mythology and fiction literature, especially in western cultural perspective.
>>64578982I don't really understand the fascination with "accuracy". What do people hope to accomplish by looking at say a druid and going "This isn't what a druid was historically"?
>>64587811>There is in general an actual problem with drawing the line between mythology and fiction literature, especially in western cultural perspectiveIts nice to see someone else saying this i feel like im taking crazy pills.
>>64587783I have no point, I literally just said that I've never heard of it.
>>64587811I personally subscribe to the Finnish School view that postulates that mythology is nothing but an early genre of fiction in the first place.
>>64587856Sorry thought you and>>64587476>its an archetypal plotWere the same person.
>>64587873>>64587811I mean this is literally what it is."Facts" about gods and monsters and shit is just fiction but people think of it as more important because it's old.
>>64578982>I personally like keeping things in the spirit of old legends and previous works.I guess I do too. It's not a matter of accuracy, it's just that if you stray to far from the core of a concept you may as well just create something new.>post modern nightmare of todays worldThe world hasn't changed, anon. It was always a nightmare, we just broke the illusion that it was anything else.
>>64587845>Its nice to see someone else saying this i feel like im taking crazy pills.No, you are very, very right. This is an old left-over from late 19th century theory of both literature and culture, which was very... narrow-minded, entrenched in Enlightenment philosophy.Basically, the way we used to think about narrative cultural sources (and logic that we still to a degree adhere to, just as we still adhere to evolutionaristic understandings of culture) was like this:There are three major types of cultural narratives. Historical accounts (which are true and people believed them to be true, the same way we think about modern non-fiction history books), mythology/legends/folklore which was not true, but people used to think it's true, and fiction, which was not true and nobody thought of it to be true.It does not take a genius to realize how damn broken this logic is, though. The notion of something being "true" itself is laughably reductive, and the idea that people drew a clear line between "fiction" and "mythology/folklore" is also pretty damn naive: it's basically assumption that all people automatically think the same way as Enlightenment scholars did. It's a pretty major problem, both in anthropology and in literary sciences, and while it has been thankfully much contested among the academia, in broader public views it's still very deeply rooted. And it results in this undesirable logic, where people, even some scholars, still refuse to analyze sources such as heroic tales from 14th century because "those are fiction" while simulatenously happily analyzing urban legends in contemporary Japan - which is paradoxical as fucking hell.
>>64587890The main mistake people make is thinking that people actually believed their mythology. If actual early cultures studied in the modern period are anything to go by, no, they didn't, they used them as entertainment and identity markers. Mythology and religion are related, but entirely different things.
>>64587873>>64587890Actually, you have it PERFECTLY BACKWARDS. Fiction is a late transformation of mythology, not the other way around. I'd suggest starting with Eliade's Myth of Eternal Return or (if you are more hardcore) Lévi-Strauss'es account of mythology to understand where the problem lies. Or if you want to take the opposite direction, go read Tooby and Cosmidess and their "Does beauty evolve adapted minds", one of the best positivist-oriented explanation of fiction and proposed evolutionary perspective. >>64587890>"Facts" about gods and monsters and shit is just fiction but people think of it as more important because it's old.Again, other way around. Thinking in facts "Facts" are just more nunacned and narrowed subcategory of thinking in myths.
>>64587917This is all just... the literally opposite of truth. Fuck me, you really ARE doing the same mistake the god damn evolutionarists did one and a half century ago. Same idiotic ethnocentric logic.
>>64587917Right. Most stuff like ancient greek myths weren't ever meant to be believed to have happened. They were similes to explain how the world works, or to motivate a territorial claim, or to just tell a hot fapfic about Zeus fucking someone. Interestingly, Egyptian religion didn't really have "myths" at all, as it was mostly phenomenological. It consisted of series of explanations of how the world worked by describing the interactions of gods and goddesses and primal forces. It was an attempt to create a descriptive science for the larger patterns of the world, just without the tools to make it actual empirical. Then the greeks came over and started trying to reassemble and rewrite the stories the Egyptians told them into "proper" mythology and you got stuff like the Osiris and Isis myth which was prominent during the Ptolemaic era and beyond.
>>64581783>a world where only people who are gifted, or very dedicated get ahead >where children are expected to go out and triumph in the face of adversity>Where people live in largely confined citys and towns that are broadly self reliant >where the most famous people got to be famous through merit >where the government is made up of the most powerful>and the only other authority figures are police officers and STEM professionals m8 what about this is SJW? Every element I've listed is always portrayed positively as well, except in the Mew Project and even then Blaine isn't exactly a turbo villain or anything.
>>64578982>keeping things in the spirit of old legends and previous worksBest thing to do.
I prefer making up my own shit, steeped in classical myths, and not 20th century post middle ages cucked myths
There is objective truth and narrative truth. Both are true.T. Jordan PetersonAlso I really like having different traditions to draw upon when designing my characters. My druid was professionally/characteristicslly an ancient type druid (or more accurately an Asterix type druid). Culturally he was broadly Celtic, most evidently in having a moustache and collecting the heads of enemies as trophies and mechanically he was well... D&D 5e so basically World of Warcraft. So yeah I turn into what serves the party mechanically but I am also typecast as well as positively limited and with flair from the imho more interesting ancient druid and druidic culture.
Gary Gygax and Homer are no more right or wrong or more accurate or better than each other. They both made shit up, it doesn't matter which you prefer as long as you're having fun. Same is true of World of Warcraft vs Virgil or Dark Souls vs Dante.
>>64578982Elf waifus are an integral part of old legends and previous works. The idea that sex is evil is a product of the rotten, prudish Voctorian society.
>>64587995This is so fucking wrong... >ancient greek myths weren't ever meant to be believed to have happened. They were similes to explain how the world worksThese two are the SAME FUCKING THINGS in the mind of non-positivist culture. The line between "what really happened" and what is a "symbolic tale explaining a pattern" did not exist until fucking modern western mindset emerged in the first place. That is the whole fucking key to understand mythology:People did NOT FUCKING THINK in positivist fashion. That is an incredibly modern and new invention. People thought in symbols, and symbolical narratives were considered to be MORE TRUE than any "empiric truth" that you could record, because they reflected observations and experiences that were established by generations, rather than individuals, thus were "transcendent". Your empirical, sensory observations about the world were less likely to be reliable and relevant than wisdom collected over dozens of generations: that is what lended mythology it's credibility. Which was always fucking massive: until the secularist turn in the 19th century, we STILL obeyed mythological rationality more than any other. As for Egypt, I have no idea where you got that crap from, but I can guarantee to you that the story of "Osiris and Isis" (Actually Usir and Eset, most likely) has been the CORE of Egyptian dynastic mythology since AT DAMN LEAST fourth dynasty, probably much longer though. It's not exactly something popular only during the Ptolemaic dynasty.
>>64588060Homer actually compiled contemporary folk songs for his poems. You should be comparing him not to Gygax, but to Elias Lönnrot.
>>64588035Stopped reading because I mentioned one of the most important and infuential anthropologist of the entire history of the field? Really? >>64588038This is by no means Peterson's invention, though he did put it together really fucking well. Hell, I miss the time when he was known for particularly good mythological analysis and not some bullshit political controversies that will make everyone shit their pants or start trolling whenever his name is mentioned.
>>64579111>huuur duuir sjw
>>64588060>Gary Gygax and Homer are no more right or wrong or more accurate or better than each other.That is so laughably false and so laughably ignorant. The one ingredient you are absolutely fucking missing is relevance of the messages conveyed. "Homer" created a compilation of not only most important moral and model tales of his time, but also effectively ENCYCLOPEDIA of the entire world as it was known to him. It's a map of fucking universe as people understood it at the time, and it remained being used as such for upcoming thousand years. Hell, his stories resonated with people so well that even a completely different cultures two thousand years after him still re-corporated his stories into their own most important collections of works, that is how profoundly meaningful they were thought to be.Please tell me Gynax is doing the same fucking thing you idiot.
>>64587811>>64587845>>64587873>>64587890>>64587916>>64587917Cringe. You know fairies,dryads,gnomes and werewolves are actually real and exist, right? People believed in them for thousands of years and some in my country still do,they wouldn't make stories up about them if they didn't exist.
>>64588102Yep, important =/= good or correct. Sometimes it also means "harmful". Trofim Lysenko was the most important biologist in the Eastern Block and he single-handedly killed biology there. Structuralism is a poison to all social sciences that continues to impede progress there to this day.
>>64588133Apart from the obvious, that we're looking at a South American jungle dude sitting in a hut with a presumably revered corpse, do you have any idea the background of this image?
>>64588133>You know fairies,dryads,gnomes and werewolves are actually real and exist, right? People believed in them for thousands of years and some in my country still do,they wouldn't make stories up about them if they didn't exist.Excuse me, but what the fuck? This is the most half assed explanation I've ever heard.It's not even worthy of being a shitpost.
>>64578982>"Look, I posted it again!">and then the OP got many replies
>>64588133I doubt that anyone has ever believed in gnomes at any point, seeing how the term was coined by Paracelsus for his cosmological theory.
>>64588146Relative to evolutionarists or diffusionalists that predated him, he was a massive step forward. Structuralism is still absolutely vital stepping stone towards modern cognitive anthropology, largely respected by evolutionary psychology, not to mention heart of general linguistics. Sure, Lévi-Strauss has been in many ways outdated, but he was pretty much the last actual author of useful and comprehensive anthropological theory. We did not get a single better school since - just a handful of gifted, but dispersed and non-comprehensive people along the way. Structuralism was pretty much the last ATTEMPT AT PROGRESS while everything since has been nothing but dissolution. His insights into mythology and cognitive structure - even if very extreme and at times reductive in their own way - are still rarely matched. The only people who actually managed to exceed his work are people who build upon it, and those were largely people outside of traditional social studies. Which is very much the reason why social studies have been stuck in an absolute fucking rot in the past fifty years now.
>>64588038>There is objective truth and narrative truth. Both are true.Except that narrative truth is not, in fact, true.
>>64588532Just don't try to speak about stuff you have no fucking education or awareness about. It will save us all a fuckload of time. Just go talk and think about something you actually have at least SOME expertise about. Or something that does not require any.
>>64578982I lean old, but there's little to postmodernism as a movement you couldn't get out of ecclesiastes. You sound like the kind of person that fails to grasp deliberate ironies in a primary source. That or you accept reheated rehashes as the original variation on a given story.
>>64588648>I lean old, but there's little to postmodernism as a movement you couldn't get out of ecclesiastes.Well, epistemic scepticism isn't exactly a new invention, true. That said, I kind fail to understand how does this relate to anything said in this thread so far.
>>64588712In OP's post.>post modern nightmare of today's world
>>64588808Oh, you are right. I completely screened it out. Sorry.
>>64588545>muh narratives shape reality and contain deeper meanings!No, kill yourself, narratives do not contain truth. They contain values which can be presented as truth.
>>64580193Solid advice. Thanks!
>>64588839No worries it was minor. Just stood out to me because I'm kind of fascinated with the old world version of the sort of angst and dread op wants to escape. Wouldn't care to split that hair otherwise.
As long as you're having fun it doesn't matter.Asterix is a total piss take on the Roman era and it's fucking amazing anyway.
>>64588961I already told you: either go educate yourself on the subject, or just go get yourself involved with something you are educated in already. You are just wasting everyone's time here.
>OP's image>Talking about tradition and old legendsIf you really want something to think about:The modern concept of what magic is in modern fiction is removed from traditional storytelling around magic. Simply put, magic wasn't something people could do. At all. Magic was considered a physical part of certain living things. To do magic wasn't a problem of learning it. That's like saying you'll learn to breath underwater by observing fish. The closest you could get is making magical beings do their thing on your behalf. You convince them to do it for you somehow or even outright make a contract. There's also notions of alchemy. You aren't performing magic. You are harvesting physical things that have magic as part of them. In any case, magic was more a physical trait of a thing. The idea it being a skill or a system that can be exploited directly is.. a very modern idea. Even LotR reflects the more traditional view of magic. Wizards can do magic as part of their physical function. They don't learn it and can't teach it. If I'm not mistaken, the setting has it's share of mortals who have made deals with things that ARE magical and thus gain power that way. Such as necromancers. You don't have the power of unlife. You've convinced leftover spirits and made deals with shades and less savory things. I'm not exactly sure when the shift to magic as a learnable system began. Hell, we might have DnD to blame for it.
>>64589119Just saying, if literally the only reply you can produce is to brush someone off by claiming that any view other than yours must indicate a lack of knowledge, your opponent probably isn't the one that needs to return to the education system.I mean there are plenty of people that have criticized the concept of narrative truth. Bruner, for example.
>>64589211There were medieval systems of "learning" magic following various books, often reputed to contain the wisdom of the ancient. Lots of stuff with drawing symbols and icons and such. It wasn't even remotely what D&D magic is, but I suspect it was part of the inspiration.
>>64589222Can you actually reproduce the arguments? Give me the view of the argument >>64588038 presents: either the way Peterson presents it, or any of the other related theories. Just in the broadest strokes. Please go on. You can try and provide counterarguments too if you have space left.But unless you can actually fucking formulate those, you are a waste of time and space.
Blizzard has had a massive impact on what fantasy is, these days. People seem to want orcs to be noble warriors, goblins to be shortstack latinas, and everything's got to have some elaborate culture and backstory.Personally, when it comes to fantasy, that's kind of the 'turn the brain off' type of setting that caters to the part of your mind that was filled by Disney movies and bedtime stories in the past. It's the sort of setting that's approachable because of it's lack of a need to do any sort of homework or research. I WANT there to be black-hat, mindless villains to slay en-masse and gain XP from. I don't want there to be some sort of guilt trip for doing so. I want the equivalent of Doom demons to mow through, not some sob story about now orphaned goblin younglings that will starve without being tended to.
>>64589222Hell, just defining 'narrative truth' will often get you into arguments with people that propose narrative truth as something integral to reality. Is it the ability of narratives to produce something like fabula? Something more in line with correspondence theory? Compatibility and the production of metanarratives?You'll often get wildly different definitions, sometimes from the same person. The quote that started this, for example, is pulled from a guy that is famous for shifting his position and changing his own definitions when it suits him. Which is rather ironic considering his assertion that there are truths in narrative.
>>64589288I'm not so sure of what you are referencing specifically, but..Christian/Jewish myth has 'magic' that would fit in to that era and before it. Except it's still about the same sort of thing. You don't have magic. You are calling/referencing beings that can do those things. This includes both angels and demons. You could use a specific angel's name as part of a set of symbols and icons and that would call their power. It was a system in itself that worked that way. What a given call does depends on the angel's purpose, for instance. Demons are sketchier as fucking up will get you eaten. They are beings of law (being originally angels and still bound to the word of god) but won't hold back if you violate the contract. But again it's not you that gained magic. You are calling the favor of things that can do those things. I'm not sure if this system is what you mean, but it fits the bill.
>>64589295>People seem to want orcs to be noble warriors,Warcraft orcs are literally just a repeat of what Star Trek did with klingons. In the original series they were sneaky, underhanded asshole space imperialists who would do anything and everything to fuck you over. Then Roddenberry had a change of heart and with the Movies and especially TNG started turning them into the typical warrior culture obsessed with honor.Metzen probably likes Star Trek a lot because orcs in WC1-3 had the exact same development.
>>64578982>Do you personally like traditional tropes or new concepts to an old idea in your fantasy games?New concepts keep things interesting and are more representative of what fantasy is supposed to be: something that captures your imagination. Old concepts become worn out and tired and no longer require imagination and simply become boring. Morrowind would've never been created if people had just adhered to keeping things "in the spirit" of what came before and Morrowind by itself is superior to most established settings.
>>64589300For the last time. Nobody is even talking about narrative fucking truth. This is precisely the fucking problem. Reproduce the original argument, or shut the fuck up, nobody is interested in your bullshit ad hominems.
>>64589357>Warcraft orcs are literally just a repeat of what Star Trek did with klingons. In the original series they were sneaky, underhanded asshole space imperialists who would do anything and everything to fuck you over. Then Roddenberry had a change of heart and with the Movies and especially TNG started turning them into the typical warrior culture obsessed with honor.Eh, there was elements of the honor in the original series. They pretty consistently showed a respect for strength of will and a loathing of cowards, even if those cowards were not on their side.
>>64589355I know, all I'm saying is that they probably saw the surface image of old men waving their hands around and saying weird words to make things "Happen" and took that at the absolute most surface level they could.
>>64578982I'm really weirded out by why WoW druids are running around half-naked. At least wear a shirt and some shoes you fucking bimbo, you're gonna catch ringworm.
>>64588076Based and logicpilled.
>>64589295>people who like nuanced races that aren't a monolith and all behave like evil robots are just wanting to turn their brain off and enjoy the simplistic disney-esque experience >i don't want to think about the ramifications of killing sapient creatures en masse and simple want to fight single-minded automatons because i am intelligent and enlightened beyond the ken of these plebsYou sound dumb as fuck.
>>64589381>Nobody is even talking about narrative fucking truthUhhh...>There is objective truth and narrative truth. Both are true.Also, I'm not the original anon you were engaging with, but I think you might be kinda confused? Did you reply to the wrong post or something?
>>64589544>omes to fantasy, that's kind of the 'turn the brain off' type of setting that caters to the part of your mind that was filled by Disney movies and bedtime stories in the past. It's the sort of setting that's approachable because of it's lack of a need to do any sort of homework or research. I WANT there to be black-hat, mindless villains to slay en-masse and gain XP from. I don't want there to be some sort of guilt trip for doing so. I want the equivalent of Doom demons to mow through, not some sob story about now orphaned goblin younglings that will starve without being tended to.I reserve that for not-entry-level RPGs found next to funko pop figures.
Post examples of elf waifus in traditional works.
>>64589544>people who like nuanced races that aren't a monolith and all behave like evil robotsYou can have both. Or you can have nuanced non-robotic races that are still okay to mow through because they're assholes.
>>64589768The original post mis-represented Peterson's claim, and I missed that. For that, I apologise. Neither Peterson, nor any of the scholars that he builds upon (or any of the scholars that happen to arrive at the same conclusions independently) use the term "narrative truth". That term is associated with a very different school of philosophy in an entirely different field.
>>64589789The most common elf waifu doesn't really have a name. She's just a generalized otherworldly maiden that takes away somebody's son after falling in love with him because it's better to imagine that your son is married to an elf than that he's dead in a ditch somewhere.Browse through any Celtic or Nordic miscellany and you'll generally find multiple variations on the same theme.
>>64589381I'm afraid that I recognise this cunt. I refuse to believe that there's a second person on /tg/ that flies into such virulent hatred from such insignificant matters.
>>64588176The image is a meme but the question is a very interesting one that is core to building and understanding the genreits worth posting every now and again
>>64588130>I want current year American political arguments and narratives in my games! I kinda understand you, though. If you wanted to live through a post-apocalyptic setting, Hillary should have not only won, but fulfill her promise on starting WW3.
>>64589789Merline and Nimune from La Mort d'Arthur
>>64590034Since when did new concepts or takes become synonymous with American political arguments? Seriously, are you retarded?
>>64578982>Getafix/Panaramix>basically a cool french granddad who gives you superpowers>Stacked Night Elf druid>a perky elf druid with healing powers and animal sexWhy do you tear me apart
>>64589797>Or you can have nuanced non-robotic races that are still okay to mow through because they're assholes.Like humans, for example. If ever there was a race that deserved to be mowed through because they're assholes, it'd be humans. The worst atrocities fictional races commit against humans pale in comparison to what humans do to each other in real life.
>>64589789Arwen and Aragorn.
>>64590123Well, yeah. I wouldn't argue. I mean, the most popular antagonists in media are humans. Nobody thinks twice about shooting Nazis or nonspecific terrorist-looking motherfuckers.
>>64589797So close to the whole truth. You can also mow down enemies for your own reasons, and own the violence of it without expecting others to laud you for your heroics. Or you could do the nigh impossible thing, accepting that righteousness costs something non trivial. Basically anything but doing whatever is convenient and justifying it after the fact and crying that you didn't also get brownie points for it.
>>64590213Yeah, but my point is not all humans are assholes. Fictional races shouldn't all be assholes, either. You can have factions, bands, armies, whatever of fictional races, but the whole race being a bunch of evil assholes (barring supernatural creatures like demons) is bad writing.
>>64590248>but the whole race being a bunch of evil assholes (barring supernatural creatures like demons) is bad writing.You do realize that most non-human races are kinda supernatural by fucking definition, right? And no, it's not bad writing. If your settings require a clear antagonistic force, you can create it however you want, not every fucking fiction has to be speculative for fuck sake. It's a matter of excecution, and of having a fitting tone and structure of the tale, but not a bad thing in general. Tolkien's orks word brilliantly the way they are, in fact any attempt to make them more "interesting" are pretty much unabiguously fucking awful in comparison.
>>64589789Not literally called an elf (duh), but typologically an elf: Vasilisa the Wise, Slavic folklore.
>>64589295You should stick to war games if something as simple and inoffensive as good guy orcs and goblins triggers your delicate sensibilities. You aren't suited for RPGs if common story hooks like "not everyone that isn't human is evil" upsets you.
>>64590073The funny thing is that Panoramix is more likely to be a damsel in distress than the nelf waifu.
>>64590315>You do realize that most non-human races are kinda supernatural by fucking definition, right?Depends on the setting, actually. They can be the result of natural evolution. Besides, in most settings humans are also supernatural and the result of some divine magic shit, so what's your point?> And no, it's not bad writing.If they're sapient, yes it is.>If your settings require a clear antagonistic force, you can create it however you want,That's true. Your game, your rules. Doesn't mean your game is some literary masterpiece.>not every fucking fiction has to be speculative for fuck sake. It's a matter of excecution, and of having a fitting tone and structure of the tale, but not a bad thing in general. Just admit you want your power fantasy.>Tolkien's orks word brilliantly the way they are, in fact any attempt to make them more "interesting" are pretty much unabiguously fucking awful in comparison.Tolkien's orcs weren't a monolith and even he disliked the idea of them being pure evil. Besides, there have been orcs much more interesting than Tolkien's, just as there have been elves more interesting than his. Tolkien is not the end-all for fantasy, just because he was the first to write about elves and dwarves or what have you. Old things are not good just because they are old, anon.
>>64589295Name a better race to represent savage, but noble warriors. No furries. Goblins are just a much better, more flavourful Gnomes.>I WANT there to be black-hat, mindless villains to slay en-masse and gain XP from.And Warcraft offers a vast array of options, from the Old Gods to the Scourge.>I want the equivalent of Doom demons to mow throughBurning Legion it is.
>>64578982What kida fucking anatomy is that? Her legs are 70% of her height.
>>64590410>They can be the result of natural evolution.If you are involving actual fucking evolution in your fantasy settings you've most likely already completely fucked up and your settings are going to shit to begin with.>Besides, in most settings humans are also supernaturalHumans are natural in a real world, while elves and dwarves are supernatural because they exist outside of real of natural posibilities. The fact that you employ magic (a concept that actually does come from real-world practices) does not make HUMANS as a notion a supernatural one. >If they're sapient, yes it is.Again pointlessly forcing modern scientific notions where they don't belong. And no. Tolkien's Goblins are sapient, but yet they work as a purely antagonistic force. >Doesn't mean your game is some literary masterpiece.It's definitely more likely to become one if you follow mythological logic rather than force to mix fantasy with bad speculation and apply pure genre-fiction logic. >Just admit you want your power fantasy.That is literally the LAST thing I was ever interested in. I have no fucking clue what kind of utterly contrived reasoning brought you to this conclusion.>Tolkien's orcs weren't a monolith and even he disliked the idea of them being pure evil.Have you actually read his fucking works?>Besides, there have been orcs much more interesting than Tolkien's,Name them. >Tolkien is not the end-all for fantasyHe is one of the VERY FEW who managed to create fantasy without it being a shitty genre fiction. He is good because HE IS GOOD, not because he is old. Because unlike most of you fucks, he KNEW what is important and what is pointless. His understanding of actual mythology and proper epic tales was incredible, and that actually seeped into his work. That is why he stuck around and is still taken seriously even by people who don't fucking like fantasy otherwise.
>>64590549Apologise is now backpeddaling?
>>64588076I don't know that you're right but you're angry and speaking authoritatively so I'm gonna assume yes
>>64590248>Fictional races shouldn't all be assholes, either.Fiction doesn't really have hard rules like that.I find it funny that you say that whole races shouldn't be assholes, unless they're things like demons. Surely if demons are sapient the same rules you've set out apply?Generally I run demons closer to the Semitic conception of them, as powerful spirits that are not necessarily malevolent but are inhuman and amoral, and I run orcs as the mutant servants of an elder evil that are programmed to hate everything that isn't them. This isn't superior to doing orcs as noble savages or demons as pure elemental evil, nor is it inferior, it's just a consequence of how I've constructed my setting.
>>64590437>Name a better race to represent savage, but noble warriors.Elves. In fact, concept-stage night elves were better noble savages than WoW's orcs have ever been.Everything that made it into Warcraft is homogenized simplistic garbage.
>>64590627Nah man he apologized, I'm good.
>>64578982>be me>see a thread about historical and old school tropes and style vs contemporary tropes and style>neat, I like it when a setting borrows from history and the classics more than modern media.>SJWs>Hillary Clinton>Jordan Peterson>MFW
>>64590719Peterson is actually very relevant to the subject. It's such a shame that the overobsession with political bullshit overshadows actual academic contributions.
>>64590719Peterson is technically on-topic, even if I find him kind of basic and uninspired compared to people like Midgley.
so why are nelf druids such sluts? always barefoot and dressed in very skimpy gear
>>64586074>modern fantasy leans heavily on Tolkien>Tolkien shamelessly ripped off whatever he could from Norse mythologyYou've got a long line of people to stab if you want to get upset about elves and dwarves.
>>64590898>Hippies also were always barefoot and skimpy dressed.Take a hint.
>>64590944>Tolkien shamelessly ripped off whatever he could from Norse mythologyThis meme is parroted only by people who never fucking took a single minute to study Norse (or any Scandinavian or in fact European mythology) directly. It's frankly tiresome.
>>64586074You cant stop me from making a aetting with humans, the best dnd race.
>>64590898the Cenarion Circle is a male dominated organizationfemale nelf druids are the Warcraft equivalent of chicks that join the army so they'll be surrounded by lonely, horny guys
>>64590898Elf women are meant to be barefoot
>>64591046The Sentinels as military branch was dominated by female.Is that means that guys in Nelven military are cucks dominated by strong girls?
>>64590681Night Elves have been super lame ever since they adopted feminism and allowed women into the druid circle. The idea of male NElves being stoic mystic leaders that headed a house of huntress women was fucking awesome.
>>64591072Female NElves are huntresses but male NElves can turn into fucking bears and maul the shit out of their enemies.
>>64591072>Is that means that guys in Nelven military are cucks dominated by strong girls?yes
>>64591067Eugh their feet must be disgusting. Hard, leathery, filled with shit and smelly.
>>64591002The tale of Turin and Glaurung is Sigurd and Fafnir almost wholesale. Gandalf is a very heavy tribute to Odin the Grey Wanderer. Numenor was so much so Atlantis that its post-destruction name is Atalante. Beorn the Skin-changer is Bjorn the Man-bear from the saga of King Hrolf. The list goes on and on.
>>64591073>Night Elves have been super lame ever since they adopted feminism and allowed women into the druid circleWell they made all the star-themed spells druid stuff so anyone wanting to go Priestess of the Moon is kinda shit out of luck.
>>64590390Pax romana aint easy, its gotta be littered with the blood of celts. Tonaroblox is not my chieftian, he is gaul and probably celt too. Wine and Beef, not boars and mead ok? Glory to Rome
>>64591073I want GW to adopt this approach for the Lion Rangers.
>>64591072Dominated yesCucks noThey mate for life and have happy relationships, malfurian and tyrane (illdan is just jelly)
>>64591150That's what protective magic is for
>>64591155>Gandalf is a very heavy tribute to Odin the Grey WandererGandalf is also the name of an actual guy from Norse myth.
>>64580407There is no root trope that you will ever be able to find. Ancient people had no copyright laws, and they stole from each other with no shame or restraint. Just because it's the oldest version you've heard of, doesn't mean it's the original.
>>64591217As are almost, if not entirely, all the dwarven names.
>>64591223Everything boils down to a dude getting a boner for a girl or animal
>>64591155>Gandalf is a very heavy tribute to Odin the Grey Wanderer.Not Väinämöinen?
>>64578982I love how you think WOW is current and not close to twenty years old itself. Anyway, classic is a better style than WOW's art direction.
>>64591214Guess that this kind of magic is prefered rather by pic related and Belves.
>>64591245I was under the impression Tom Bombadil and/or the Ents were closer to Väinämöinen.
>>64587624>You cherrypicked an old image from an old comicCareful, those words are enough to start European wars. If you'd said it about duck comics we'd be in WW3 right now.
Imagine if the same waifu /vg/-feet-faggots didn't find this thread.
>>64591255Blood elves wear shoes most of the time. Nelves don't because they're closer to trolls. No clue why Nightborne are like 50% against shoes and 50% normal outfits.
>>64591155Where do I begin...The tale of a dragon and dragon slayer, or the image of an old fucking sage are not exactly fucking rare motifs in mythology. Atlantis is not even fucking Norse at fucking all. Every single culture has a variation of that tale too. The story of Beorn and the story of Bjorn from Hrolf are so incredibly different it's not even fucking funny. These relationships are so fucking superficial and poorly informed that it's not fucking funny. He took inspiration, mostly actually aesthetical and linguistic one, but the actual core of the stories are incredibly different.Have you even fucking READ the god damn story of Bjorn? And you might as well fucking argue that Bjorn and Beorn are both ripping off much older, actually likely indo-european myth of animal shapeshifter - the exact same that give birth to a werewolf fucking story for fuck sake. All of this is just fucking bullshit excuses why not to read either: Tolkien or fucking Norse mythology. Because unsubstiantied accusations will make you LOOK like you are informed, and that is clearly all you settle for.
>>64591262>Tom BombadilEh, I can see the similarity, but between Tom Bombadil and Gandalf it's definitely the latter >EntsI can't even see the similarity
>>64591302Upper class Nightborne are barefoot, the plebs wear shoes.
>>64591290>twn be a good duck tales game, tabletoo or vidyaAmerican here, do you guys have darkwing there or is it just Doland, his nephews and scrouge
>>64591318Warriors and mages usually go barefoot as well
>>64591318I mentioned it before. It seems like bare feet are some kind of status symbol, as high-ranked warriors,mages and hunters don't wear any footwear.As for Belves, apart from DA arts and dragons in disguise, there are (very) few barefoot elves, and many more in sandals.
>>64591356Darkwing made it over. So much so that Donald eventually also got a !Batman identity called "The Duck Avenger".
>>64591412It's created by italian author btw.
>>64591376That IS the upper class
>>64591356DD is more popular than Donald in my country.
>>64591412>eventuallySince '69, long before DW.
>>64591410I would speculate that bare feet help the nightborne channel their particular brands of magic, as most their warriors who don't wear shoes are some kind of spellblade things.Of course that falls apart when you consider the leader of the warrior cast in the Nighthold wears boots. But maybe she's just that special.
>>64591410>there are (very) few barefoot elvesPity
>>64591356>or is it just Doland, his nephews and scrougeohhow naive you are
>>64591469They drain magic from the ley lines in the earth, so sure.
>>64591484If Liadrin showed up in some new armor that left her feet bare she would be too sexual
>>64591533She should be With Sylvanas on the chopping block, she is now the poster girl of the Horde
Both those druids are lame. Beorn was the original druid.
>>64578982are you implying that only celts were druids?
>>64591484Remember about dragonesses in elven form. They apparently hate shoes.
>>64591580>Liadrin walks up in a bikini plate mog with bare feet>"I figured it was time for an upgrade with my new station"
>>64590898there aren't supposed to be female druids in warcraft
>>64591533>Would like to see how boots from her armor are falling apart, leaving her completely barefoot.
>>64591356DuckTales on the NES was the shit. Even if you've never heard of it, it's entirely possible you've heard its moon theme.
>>64591169>Night Elf Priest racial abilityMan I wish Blizzard wasn't terrible. They should have leaned into diversified racial classes.Like, for night elves star shards should have been a reskinned mindflay, and their healing abilities should have had a more silvery light. Trolls should have had half their skills renamed to be voodoo themed, etc.Fucking hacks.
Nah, the former discussion was much more interesting than this WoW-faggotry.
>>64591609Their clothes are manifestations of their shapeshifting so they probably just don't see the point of manifesting shoes or underwear as that one novel revealed
>>64591072>s that means that guys in Nelven military are cucks dominated by strong girls?It means that prior to WoW there were no men in the Sentinels, same as there were no women in the Cenarion Circle. NElf civilization was segregated by gender.
>>64591200So cozyId genocide every orc baby to protect them
>>64591533What if she was caught by Turalyon, imprisoned in the Stockades and forced to put on prison uniform that includes no footwear?
>>64591594A druid (Welsh: derwydd; Old Irish: druí; Scottish Gaelic: draoidh) was a member of the high-ranking professional class in ancient Celtic cultures. Druid is literally a celtic concept. Just like Haruspex is a Roman one, or Bārû were Mesopotamian, or Imam is an Islamic one.
>>64591750the word druid is celtic, but shamans and witch doctors and medicine men are the same thing anon.
Stop perving on her feet, degenerates. Lady Liadrin is cute and pure.
>>64591744Turalyon is a cuck who would rather execute her for "defiling" Light.
>>64591778>shamans in Warcraft are literally not the same thing
>>64591778>but shamans and witch doctors and medicine men are the same thing anon.The anthropologist in me is fighting a rage attack right now.No. They are not all the same.
>>64591779I want to massage her cute feet.
>>64591778Not really? Shamans and the North American medicine men are the same thing, but druids are not.
>>64591787Wouldn't it be much more punishing to humiliate her by forcing the proud elf to go barefoot in prison?
Duck tales > Astrix > anyother setting > blizzards ripoff lands
>>64591840It would be.But he is "Paragon of Justice" so instead of humiliating he is to provide swift death.Remember Tirion Fordring when he always promised swift death to Arthas if he surrenders?
>>64591779Well then stop talking about this dumbshit and go back to /vg/.
>>64591889nobody in their sane mind gives a fuck about the wow """setting""", we just fap to elf feet
>>64591939There is probably some /aco/ thread for you to fuck off to.
>>64592144OP hereThis thread was a mistake
>>64592344and yet you bumped it
>>64588155Idk it's just a cool picture>>64588159Stfu you scientism modernist retard, are you that much of a middle class liberal faggot that you don't know people still believe in the supernatural? Atheist scum>>64588184Except people have seen small bearded men with tall hats
>>64591512>fethry duck>disney invented the Ahego face before japan
>>64587999You forgot how every pokemon setting is also horrifyingly rife with corruption and organized crime.>"Oh but its okay since the organized crime is beaten by a 10yo just like real life"
>>64594487I mean a lot of them are para-military and religous groups
>>64578982>Do you personally like traditional tropes or new concepts to an old idea in your fantasy games?I have no idea why this degenerated into a shitstorm, it seems like a perfectly sensible question that doesn't imply either is better, since it's entirely about preference.Some people have grown tired of the classic stuff, others still enjoy it, neither are wrong.Did it happen because /tg/ has such a huge aversion to wow that they think the night elf image is "insulting" or something?
>>64595743Most people here are oversensitive to anything that implies there might be something more than their personal taste.But to be honest, the discussion at first was fairly fine. It was the fucking WoW fetish faggots that really harmed the thread.
>>64591939This is a lie. Warcraft's setting is pretty interesting, even if its plot is shitty.
>>64596234It's really not. It just causes the "Halo syndrome": it stuffs so much shit down your throat, and numbs any kind of expectations so low that your brain eventually becomes just content with "hey I recognize this" realization. It's a world-building equivalent of junkfood: completely unsubstantial, actually really shitty, but it does get your brain to respond vaguelly positively non the-less.
>>64596574This obviously comes from someone completely unfamiliar with the setting, to the point that this is my first and last (You).
>>64596730I'm hardly an expert, but I know enough to realize there is absolutely no substance to the settings. It's clichés and meaningless twists piled upon clichés and meaningless twists, all wrapped in one of the by-far most tasteless package I've seen in fantasy. People like it because if you can get someone to spend enough time getting to know the settings, they'll brain will eventually start rewarding the simple fact that the info is cross-referential - even when the relevance of the info itself becomes close to zero.
if tradition has it's own merits then it's alrightif new stuff has merits then it's alright but I'm not putting anything on a pedestal, go somewhere else for your biases
>>64588155>>64588133On the off-chance that you're still around and care, here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuquot_Whalers%27_ShrineIt's from the pacific northwest, rather than south america. The guy in the image is a Tlingit/English anthropologist re-enacting a Kwakwaka'wakw ceremony.
>>64589211Who ever first came up with the idea that you could write down a magic spell. You still had to be born with the gift, but all learning did was teach you how to use your gift.
>>6459024890% of the time fantasy races are expys for different human cultures. If the hobgoblins are nazi expys, and you don't think twice about mowing through nazis, you shouldn't think twice about mowing through hobgoblins.The reason all or most members of a specific race are often assholes is because there aren't multiple cultures within each race, each race embodies one culture unlike real world humans. We choose to emulate cultures we know something about, so a lot of times you have one race based on a "good" culture in the eyes of the writer, and another based on an "evil" culture in the eyes of the writer.
>>64589295Low effort, but lowkey based. Not every setting needs to be super complex, and I agree.
>>64591512>>64591532The Duck Universe has unironically one of the best lore of comicbook universeThe Life and Time of Scrooge McDuck (La Jeunesse de Picsou) is one of my favorite story arc
>>64605178Read the article. The man in the picture had Tlingit ancestry, he bought the shrine from a Vancouver tribe.
>>64587193As I understood it, that isn't the case. The Drust do their bat-shit crazy death magic. Trolls worship Gonk, who connects them to all kinds of nature-related and animal-related Loa. So on so forth, it just happens that ingame this is closest to druidism.
>>64607410Gonk specifically stole the secret of druidism from the Emerald Dream, which is the realm of Cenarius. So the Drust are the only real outliers who have nothing to do with druidism as it's understood in universe.
>>64584836/v/ in a nutshell
>>64601561>Kwakwaka'wakwIs that real human language?
>>64578982You are influenced too much by media.I've never had either of those in all my games I've ran.
>>64611252both are superior to d&d shit
>>64609937No it's Pac-Man language
>>64590034>but fulfill her promise on starting WW3Imagine being this delusional.
>>64594164>Except people have seen small bearded men with tall hatsYet no one has a picture of them.
>>64614721You're the delusional one. We're nearly on the precipice of a nuclear war even with Trump in office. We'd all be radioactive ash by now had Hillary won.
>>64591669It comes to mind just reading that sentence >>64591801You have to go back
WoWesque art is blatantly bad outside of WoW and people who like it should get some fucking taste
>>64591791they are? what is a druid? what is a shaman? or a witch doctor or a medicine man? they are spiritual positions in society akin to priest/priestess and even if they have different names and worship different gods with different traditions, they serve the same function.
>>64608133UBC (university of british columbia) has a museum of anthropology that is somewhat recognized and renowned. aboriginal studies is pretty big here.
>>64578982I've been playing TRPGS for my entire adult life. In that time I have never been able to find a group who does a "traditional" game (generally low-medium magic, most/all people are human, feels heavily like it takes from Euro folklore/Arthurian legends/Tolkien fantasy a lot, etc) as everyone has found them too boring and throws some wild hyper-stimulation of too much everything all at once at the table trying to make sure there's as many weird proper nouns and "in MY setting, [trope thing] is [popular flavor of the month]" to familiarize yourself with as possible every time you join a new adventure. They've all been saturated in novelty for novelty's sake and re-learning the wheel every five seconds.I would give both my legs to play at least one goddamned traditionally tropey game.
>>64591580>Postergirl of the collection of shamanistic freakshows is the hardcore light worshipping humanoidWhy is this allowed?
>>64579111how do i get a misty girlfriend
>>64620064Given she's fictional you just pretend, and hope the constant need for more detailed simulation doesn't lead to a psychotic breakdown where your unconscious starts controlling the willful illusion for you and you start disassociating when "she" becomes active and commits atrocities.
>>64580407This is how I like to approach things too. You can be inspired by an artist but you'll learn even more by looking up that artist's influences.>>64591223On the other hand RPGs often have bibliographies or else their genre is obvious enough to look up more for the sake of research. This is not a doctoral thesis.
>>64616974>outside of WoW
>>64624763Let me be explicit, WoW is not really that great eitherIt is american power fantasy wank art, and I find it pretty bottom tier
>>64624876I disagree. I'd take properly epic high fantasy art over "subtle" crap any day of the week. I don't give a shit if that puts me in opposition with 90% of /tg/, you're all contrarian fucks who hate fun.
>>64625039>hurrr if you don't like ugly, clownish, and basic fantasy art, you must be a contrarianWhatever you say, retardI actually enjoy Joe Madureira, because he is talented and have a really interesting take on his influences
>>64625111There's no principal difference between the styles of Joe Mad and Samwise, only a dumb contrarian would state otherwise.
>>64591233>not a dude having edgelord fantasies about besting forces of natureYou underestimate the ancients
>>64578982>Druids TodayFucking BASED
>>64625529Different technique, same style. What did you try to prove with that?
>>64578982Nelves are unironically better
Also, Wayne Reynolds. The man who defined the look of Pathfinder and also works in this style. Basically, this style is fucking awesome.
>>64625588You think the ancients were fundamentally different from the modern people in any way.
>>64578982But anon... fem night elfs can't be druids.
>>64578982>>64579111>>64589295>>64590329>>64590898>>64591067>>64591214>>64591255>>64591410>>64591484>>64591580>>64591779>>64592144>>64598646>>64613257>>64618835I came here for elven waifu tiddies and you have not disappointed
>>64629252Best druid and best girl.
>>64630509You are part of the problem. Fuck off to the porn boards.
>>64630944Lewd art is not incompatible with /tg/ discussions Quite the contrary
>>64631295Yeah, especially if the lewd art is dumped into every thread even flimsily related to the topic without the poster even thinking about adressing the actual topic.
>>64631295This one anon complaining is stulejarz who doesn't even fap to pics like this, because he has d20 instead of balls.
>>64587624Believing that anything made by D&D, even it's earliest forms, counts as old or traditional makes you the biggest of dumbasses.
>>64617523post a counter example then
>>64587811I don't think you can call it fiction if the people who made the story believed it was true or mostly true. Herodotus, the first historian, considered the whole troyan myth cycle to be history.
>>64632036Use the internet or check spoiler below"Stulejarz" is polish word for cuck
>>64589474All night elves go around half naked because they're partially inspired by the noble savage stereotypical native americans.
>>64632517Looks like someone hates "noble savage" trope so much, he finds it everywhere what he doesn't like...
>>64587665It’s a multiracial world of gender equality, which automatically makes it SJW, though.
>>64590410>there have been orcs much more interesting than Tolkien's, just as there have been elves more interesting than hisI agree for the orcs (they're not even supposed to be interesting) but the elves? You can not like them but what example do you have of more interesting elves that are post-tolkien?
>>64590944That's false. The unability to understand the difference between a shameless rip-off and a tastefully chosen inspiration is the reason pauldroncore took control of fantasy.
>>64594487If anything that only helps the case that it's not SJW.
>>64632653>multiracial gender equalitySo political, societal, and philosophical stances don't matter, as long as it has black titties in it, it's automatically SJW?I mean...no wonder people don't fucking take /pol/ seriously.Also you're wrong anyways the only actual equal opportunity in pokemon is directly tied to the league or organized crime, 99% of the trainer classes are split between genders based on societal expectations. When was the last time you saw a female Hiker buddy?
>>64632609But I like night elves
>>64591778>rabbis are the same as mullahs who are the same as pastors
>>64633774They technically believe in the same God. But try tell it to them.
>>64619921Shamans aren't priests though?
>>64633874It's complicated. Jews deny that Christians and Muslims believe in the same god as them.Christians think that they believe in the same god as Jews, but not the same as Muslims.Muslims agree that they all believe in the same god, but they think that Jews and Christians got the religion all wrong, especially Jews.
>>64633976But those three religions have the same root. They're just different in teachings and doctrines (i.e. muslims believe that there is nothing wrong in killing, and it's even recommended).
>>64632763>post-TolkienBut the best elves are Arthur Machen's The White People.
>>64632609Fuck you with your bitter assumptions. The noble savage stereotype is a thing, deal with it. And not only I like Night Elves but I also like american indian noble savages done well.
>>64634049Honestly even their teachings aren't that different.It's just the length of time they've been around and forced to adapt/change is different.Jews being somewhat insular have just had to adapt their religion to not piss off whoever is around them.Christians wanting to tell everyone that "Actually you're christian you just didn't know it." meant they had to adapt their religion to account for every fucking mythos they encountered throughout europe and africa.Muslims being somewhere between the two had to adapt their religion to account for loads of myths, but they've also been relatively confined from some of the greater intermingling that Christians did and never really had to worry about the boot as badly as jews have.So despite certain sections of the old teachings talk about how great it is to murder every single man, woman, and child who stands against you to ensure that no survivors are left for revenge, the religions now pretend that that's just old backwards talk that doesn't matter anymore. While the muslim world is still crossing that threshold of adjustment, some areas more willingly than others.
>>64634004They're not. They don't share the same place in society the priest does.
>>64633976>especially jewsBut judaism is closer to islam than christianity is?
>>64634136So...Muslims are so aggresive and invasive because they actually believe that every "infidel" exist only to kill them? This means that this is just big "kill them before they kill you" thrope?
>>64634442Shit person.Shit opinion.Shit everything.Eliminate yourself from existence, noldorturd.
>>64634462Yes. Islam didn't have the need to purge itself from semitic elements to cater to greeks and romans like christianity did.
>>64587193That's not even close to the truth. The Titans were employing the use of druidic teachings long before Cenarius even existed. Ever heard of Eonar?
>>64634417They are priests and nothing else. Stop projecting your WoW experience onto real life and read something.
>>64629252Overrated. Hamuul and Fandral will always be my favourite druids. Thisalee is just a sociopath with a loud mouth, so edgy fucks and horny nerds like her.