>What is Exalted?An epic high-flying role-playing game about reborn god-heroes in a world that turned on them.Start here: http://theonyxpath.com/category/worlds/exalted/>That sounds cool, how can I get into it?Read the 3e core book (link below). For mechanics of the old edition, play this tutorial: http://mengtzu.github.io/exalted/sakuya.htmlIt’ll get you familiar with most of the mechanics.>Gosh that was fun. How do I find a group?Roll20 and the Game Finder General here on /tg/.>Resources for Older Editionshttps://pastebin.com/BXSGuFdQResources for Third Edition>3E Core and Splatshttps://www.mediafire.com/folder/b54o6teut3fx6/Exalted_3e>Other Ex3 Resourceshttps://pastebin.com/fG1mLMdu>NPCshttps://pastebin.com/nSZLzXZ4Previous thread: >>64479996Lunars Kickstarter starts in a few days. Who's going to back for sure. who's certain to not back, who's going to wait and see what people think about the previews before deciding?
>>64531445I've got the Deluxe Core and Deluxe DB book currently kickstarted. I like collecting shit so I'll kick myself if I don't get the Deluxe edition for Lunars although I'm not terribly excited for them, just never been a big Lunars fan. I don't hate them, but they're just not my cup of tea. Depends on if they have a neat map or something, might want to pick those up because they're always great.
>>64531503I don't have any physical Exalted books, so I'll probably stick to a evel where I get the PDF for Lunars as well. I'm definitely going to back, though. I'm pretty excited to see Lunars.
>>64531445I’ll KS Lunars like I KSed everything else
>>64531445Unless something big happens I'll probably drop 30$ on it, if not just to make sure the other splats get out.
>>64531445What's the Threads favourite pice of Homebrew? Can be for anything and any Ed.
>>64531445I will but just the normal stuff. Whatever gets me the basic bitch pdf and any other things that get strapped on like usual. My current pay is that I can mostly afford to back the kickstarters to get the pdf and then have enough to get the physical when it eventually comes out.
>>64533964My memory is a bit fuzzy, but there was either a homebrew or a future official book planned for expanding on the bureaucracy system of Ex3. I'm personally hoping it's the latter, the system is very barebones right now and it makes it difficult to run mortal games.
>>64531445Don't back KS's. I'll buy a product when its out.
>>64536140It's the latter, coming with the ST Guide
>>64536140It isn't even a system which is what gets me. In a game with complex social, combat and crafting rules, the guidelines for long term projects (like say, that a shining golden king or elemental prince of the earth might use) is 'well just roll bureau and have the GM invent some impediments'.Even if it isn't perfect, I'd like a bit more than just that under the new dev team.
>>64536983That's also where the new crafting rules are, in the ST guide, right?
>>64538219I do feel like 3e dropped the ball on any abilities that weren't combat or social related. One of the things that really got me into exalted was the idea that abilities like lore, bureaucracy, survival, and linguistics were given equal weight with skills like melee or martial arts. It was never actually true that playing a wandering scholar was just as valid as playing a wandering swordsman, but Exalted supported it better than other systems. 3e feels like one step forward, two steps back from that ideal.
>>64538728I'm genuinely curious how, as as far as I can tell it's had better treatment of those utility skills then any other edition. Most not directly combat related abilities hovered around six charms and most of them weren't even related to the ability in question, they just did vaguely related cool things. The only big gap I'm seeing right now is a bureaucracy system, but no edition of the game had a system for that in the core.
>>64531445I'm considering getting the deluxe Lunars since they're my second-favorite splat. PDFs are fine for core and DB unless they eventually make a less pricey physical edition.
>>64531445>Lunars Kickstarter starts in a few days. Who's going to back for sure. who's certain to not back, who's going to wait and see what people think about the previews before deciding?I doubt it since it will most likely be more of the same. Stuffed with SJW shit, less fun stuff, added stupid shit, etc. 3e really has destroyed any interest I had in Exalted. Even though I have the old editions I just don't care. 3e and all the shit around has ruined Exalted for me. Its not like with Vampire where I can just brush off 5e. All I can do is hope for a good 4e down the line but that's so far away I doubt I will care. I wish I could back in time to better days.
>>64539794Are you the guy complaining about DBs every thread
>>64539823Nooooo. Don't give him an excuse to talk about his insecurities.
Saigoth is fantasy australia
>>64540102Yeah, pretty much. Including the rush to colonize it.
>>64540102are there fantasy boongs there?
>>64540102What the fuck is a Saigoth and why does it look so bad
>>64540102Dingos ate my lunar mate
>>64539823If someone brings it up I'll jump into the conversation but I generally don't start things. There's more than one person pissed off by the stupid shit in 3e
>>64540140I pasted it in there from another map because the west was boring
>>64540153So why don't you play Godbound or something?
>>64540153>There's more than one person pissed off by the stupid shit in 3eIs any of them possessed of their full mental faculties? Usually when people argue against "the stupid shit in 3e" it's pretty obvious that they aren't the sharpest tools in the shed. I''d be genuinely interested in discussing the perceived failings of 3E with someone capable of forming a cohernt argument, though.
>>64540248>>64540153I'm not entirely familiar with Exalted and what I do know is 2E, what did 3E change?
>>64540292Mechanically it got a whole lot better. Lore wise is a clusterfuck. Some really good ideas. Some really bad ideas. Basically a lot of people think you should run the game using 3e rules and then just use 1e lore. Maybe add on the new territories that was added in 3e as well.
>>64540292At the end of the day, not all that much. Lorewise, that is. Mechanically there are all kinds if changes that are pretty clearly for the better.
>>64540177Because I don't like it. I liked Exalted until 3e with its massive wait times and its negatives vastly outweighing its positives like sorcery. >>64540248I don't have the fucking energy to write out long posts explaining stuff and argue with people anymore. Its just repeating the same shit that's been argued dozens of times already by me and others.
>>64540417Indulge me with a bulletpoint list of contentions, I'm curious.
>>64540417>I don't have the fucking energy to write out long posts explaining stuff and argue with people anymore. Its just repeating the same shit that's been argued dozens of times already by me and others.Good.
>>64540292Lots of things, I think it would be shorter to say that it has not changed.Mechanically it is much better in almost every respect, if not all, although almost everyone thinks that Craft is terrible.The power imbalances between Exalted are much menroes so that now a group of dragon-Blooded are a credible threat to a Solar. Combat paranoia no longer exists and perfect defenses or attacks that still exist are usable only once per scene.The Dragon-Blooded charms are really good instead of feeling like Solar but worse.The combat both physical and social is much higher than previously.Martial Arts Terrestrial and celestial have been combined in a same level of power and the difference when practicing them is that certain charm are mejroes if they use Siderals or Solars or worse if they use Dragon-Blooded.In lore the opinions are much more divided but to me in general I like the changes, there are a few things that I do not like, but they are small details so I think it has come out massively and the new areas that have added are, in my opinion , very interesting.For example many people hate that mortals can not learn supernatural martial arts in 3E but in return they are able to use First Circle Sorcery something they were previously unable to do.The next to leave are Lunars and hopefully that will be the edition in which they have good rules and lore. What little is known so far is promising.
>>64540600I care more about the lore honestly. I heard power levels were flattened and the transhumanist/magitech/ancient wonders from the First Age got thrown out, and I always viewed that as the quintessential element that separated Exalted from any other wuxia setting.
>>64540360>Maybe add on the new territories that was added in 3e as well.Prasad is my jam and I want to toss a Wyld Hunt based on the Pandavas at my players at some point.
>>645406393e went towards 1e setting wise. The magitech theme is only a 2e thing. Ancient wonders are still in though. They are just magic instead of technological.
>>64540639The First Age and Magitech is still present, just not as heavily emphasized. Which I think is for the better, as Exalted went on Magitech was less 'a cool facet of the setting' and more 'the entire axis upon which the setting turns.'Power Armor and Warstriders are still things.
>>64540682>>64540694I always liked the magitech. The idea of the First Age as golden skyscrapers and flying cars made the base-setting of the Realm seem more post-apocalyptic, and the returning Solars more splendid in potential.Even if the splendors of the First Age never came up in play, I liked them as a setting piece.
>>64540731The thing is the magitech is heavily tied into the exalts themselves. The First Age may have been a technological golden era, but it was an era that relied entirely upon the exalted themselves. Very few artifacts can be used by mortals, and the ones that can such as the Gunzosha power armor come at a heavy price, draining the life of the mortal using it to roughly half of how long they would normally life.
>>64540731They're still a thing. Just not quite so ubiquitous this time around.
>>64540766Blegh.>>64540758Of course, thats why the Usurpation led to a collapse in the first place,
>>64540639>>64540731That has changed, I will try to explain it in the best way.Basically the First Age returns to be an epoch of which barely knows anything and very different from com ofue in past editions, is wrapped in myth and hardly knows what happened in it.As for magitech to be more similar to 1E than to 2E in that aspect.The wonders of the First Age are still present, including Warstriders, but they have adopted a focus on unique objects of wonder instead of mass and mass production, as well as making it more scarce in general. Now each artifact, Warstrider, flying city, etc ... It is something unique created in a traditional way probably of a unique method. Both Warstrider and other artifacts can have evocations that are exclusive charms of that object and make it different from all others of its kind (and the rules of tuning with artifacts have changed so there are fewer limitations depending on the magic metal used to create an artifact).The Sorcery Workings allow crearese kind of effects with long term work and like sorcery is divided between circles, floating cities, fear auras of Denadsor, enhance human, etc ... All this falls in Sorcerous Workings. That is divided into three circles like the conventional Sorcery, but an Exalted can use a superior circle that he can normally sweat in Workings with additional difficulties.In my opinion you can still create brilliant science fiction cities in 3E but in magitech lguar you will be through Sorcerous Workins. A unique work every time, craftsmanship on industrial production.You may want to look at the artifact book, Arms of the Choosen, it will give you a decent idea of how things are going now. Also, look for the Sorcerous Workings section in the corebook.
>>64540820I mean, all this stuff still has stats, so you can just use 2E Lore if you want.
>>64540639That's all true and that's one of the reasons why the third edition sucks.
>>64540886It's a question of aesthetic, not objective quality. I was getting pretty frustrated with how 2E kept on revealing malfunctioning magitech as the reason for anything weird, strange, or unusual in the setting.
>>64540493Oh fuck of you little shit. I swear these threads have gone downhill probably because so many people have given up and left.
>>64540919People on the discord have specifically mentioned they abandoned the /tg/ threads because they were sick of the same circular arguments over DBs, dude.
>>64540820It's half the reason the collapse happened, the other half being the invasion by the Raksha and the Great Contagion killing 90% of all life shortly after the Usurpation.
>>64540880>>64540834I'm tempted to agree with this guy.>>64540886Exalted without the post-apocalyptic magical lost golden age as a backdrop and setting element is mostly just Sun-themed Legends of Wulin. The whole fun is having your Circle shackle together a few fragments of the Glory That Was in a setting that kind of sucks for normal people. The bizarre decadence like slave races, the Daystar, armies of Warstriders, personal holodecks, and dinosaurs who piss hard drugs is the crazyawesome that sells Exalted.
>>64540600>but in return they are able to use First Circle Sorcery something they were previously unable to do.This is untrue. Mortals were perfectly capable of Terrestrial Circle Sorcery in 2e.
>>64540940>shortly after the Usurpation.The Great Contagion and the Balorian Crusade were what, 700 years after the Usurpation? Not shortly after it, at any rate.
>>64540973They were also capable of raising their essence up to 3, which was weird to say the least.
>>64540969>The bizarre decadence like slave racesStill in>the DaystarNow just a sun, instead of the Macross>armies of WarstridersStill in, just rarer>personal holodecksNo reason why those couldn't be in.>dinosaurs who piss hard drugsStill in.Honestly, I don't know why people are still baawing over Magitech. All that's happening is that Mount Metagalapa isn't an ancient First Age Warship or the reason why the Halta and Linowa are in a genocidal war wasn't just a First Age supersoldier program gone horribly wrong.
>>64541013Because crazy dumb shit IS Exalted, and watering it down or taking it out is like like taking sugar out of kids cereal, if you wanted wheat bran why the hell are you here?
>>64541047There's being over the top and then there's jumping the shark. I think the Daystar being a giant kung-fu robot powered by a Kukla level Fire Dragon crossed the thresold from 'fucking rad' to 'absolutely fucking retarded.'There's nothing wrong with adding a bit of gravitas to the situation, dawg.
>>64541013>>64540969As I said, instead of mass production it is more traditional, but it is still present. So magitech is still present, simply attenuated to lower levels so as not to saturate the environment.3E also seems to make a deliberate effort because behind everything there is not a Solar of the First Age, which I think is a good thing. Others exalted might create their own wonders and other things are simply ancient wonders that were created by gods, primordials or other strange sources.
>>64541074I like the Sun being a robot. It reminds me of Lordgenome.
>>64541098Eeeh, I liked the idea that the Solars of Old were just cranking out mecha in prayer-powered factories run by sorcerer-engineers weaponizing theology. In alot of fantasy games the question is asked 'why hasn't magic revolutionized medieval society?' and the answer is usually scarcity.I like the idea that in the First Age it did, and it was a glorious terror.
>>64541105It was silly and hard to take seriously. At some point, Exalted had become a wacky-ass parody of what 'over the top' means.
>>64541144We really don't know what the First Age is like, anymore. All we know is that less survived the First Age than 2E would have you think.
>>64541149I disagree. Or rather I agree but that was the POINT. The First Age Solars were absolute madmen who did things no sane or ethical person should ever do, because its stupid. Dinosaur piss cocaine is stupid. Turning religion into a contact sport is stupid. Making concumbine-spawning holodecks is stupid. Half the wonders of the First Age should terrify any decent person, because they're clearly deranged, fetish fuel, or both.Being over the top to the point of being asinine helps sell why the Dragonblooded and Kejak were so terrified of these golden jackasses.
>>64541144In 3E the First Age was very different from how in 2E I explain it in detail. The only sure thing is that there were many much different times, it was not dominated from beginning to end by Solar Deliberations. Apart from that, anything is possible, including a time full of magitech up with hundreds of warstriders running around there, with ships and flying cities and similar things. This period of magitech could have been, hypothetically, dominated by Siderals and Lunars instead of Solars. Ambiguity allows you to enter anything you want without contradicting anything and allows non-Solars to paint something when you find yourself a ruin of the First Age wonder.By the way I forgot to mention it but powerarmor also continues to exist in 3E., Including flying versions.
>>64541231But the thing about the Daystar is that the Solars, the absolute fucking madmen, had NOTHING to do with it. The sun was always just meant to be a transforming giant super robot, apparently that was just how the Sun was ALWAYS supposed to be.You understand why it's stupid now, right? Because the insanity wasn't imposed by a bunch of absolute lunatics, the insanity was the *absolute default.* Even before the Solars, the Sun was a super-robot. Apparently.It crosses the threshold from 'over the top and crazy' to 'wacky and goofy'
>>64541281As I said I give the Daystar specifically a pass because it reminds me of Gurren Lagann.
>>64541335Exalted is more than just a cheap Gurren Lagann parody
>>64540694Karvara is just an eva
>>64541231No, anon, that's a distorted view of the First Age that (in previous editions at least) was the peak of human civilization and everything that came later was objectively worse for mortals. This is the objective truth. The mortals who came later could only dream of a standard of living like they had in First Age.Siderals and Dragon-Blooded only moved against the Solars because of the prophecy that the Solars would destroy the world if they did not do something. If such a prophecy had not existed, I bet they would not have moved a finger against the Solars and would have continued to enjoy the benefits that First Age provided them and those that they, as privileged members of society, enjoyed.There was no element of morality or indignation in the acts of dragon-blooded or sidereals and the concern for ordinary humans was not a factor. It was because of the prophecy that they decided to act and without it they would not have moved a finger against the Solars because they were the beneficiaries of their government.In addition the usurpers also did their monstrous things later, extermination camps, sink entire continents, etc ...The Usurpation was not and never was, about morality, it was about survival and in some cases I suppose that the motivation took power from those who had it at that time.
>>64541353It's an EVA and the Numidium rolled into one, while still being interesting in its own right rather than a shallow parody.It's over the top, but it's not fucking retarded. Which is, I think, what 3E is shooting for.
>>64541389>It's an EVA and the Numidium rolled into onePeople say this but on the whole its EVA aspects massively outnumber the...what, two Numidium references it has?
>>64541380Just because the First Age was better for mortals doesn't mean the Solars weren't completely psychotic. We're talking about rulers who thought it was a great idea to allow the Wyld to unmake tens of millions of square miles of Creation and kill hundreds of millions of people all for the purposes of a military training exercise, and who would accuse random mortals of crimes they never committed so they could forge their souls into soulsteel.
>>64541380>t. Gold Faction>"The Solars did NOTHING wrong"
>>64541047>Because crazy dumb shit IS ExaltedNo, it isn't. T-Rexes in F-15's was only ever a meme that floated around, and never had any basis in the actual game itself. Not when there was five times the word count dedicated to things like how this or that cities government worked and the individual bit players in it's nobles trying to maneuver their way up then was ever spent on giant robot fights or anything like that.>>64540969I think you're getting a bit confused. That thing you described is still there, what people mean when they say magitech is 'less front and center' is more along the lines of Halta won't randomly have a fully functioning arsenal of one hundred implosion bows from thin air that 2e gave it.
>>64541431Its entire shtick is Anger and Solopsism. It can literally alter the fabric of reality around it.
>>64541493If you're going to use 3e lore then see >>64541254. We know barely anything about the First Age, it could have been a 1984-esque industrial hellscape for all we know.
>>64541527We have some notion of what it was like, via Arms of the Chosen. The First Age was a mess of juntas, warlords, and power blocs, rising and falling, rather than a continuous government from Merala onwards. Hell, it wasn't even always solely Solar dominated (though it frequently happened).
>>64541438Yes, Wyldhand, you always use that argument or at least whenever this issue comes up, someone always comes up talking about that. The Usurpators killed more people with their extermination camps and Saigoth, or at least the same amount.If we judge by number of dead then the Usurpers are worse because they loved more people or at least equal because they killed more or less the same amount of people.Nor is it true that all Solars were demented at that point, the Queen of Whitewall is a canonical example of First Age Solar totally sane and benevolent (and 1E if that matters).And that the Soalrs were demented at that point (many, not all) does not mean that what came after was an improvement for mortals, in fact, objectively, it was worse.The Usurpation was not caused by the indignation of the acts of the Soalres was by the prophecy, morality and atrocities of the Sollars, while undeniable were not what motivated the Usurpers to act and showed their actions were not better than the Suns . Later they created a worse world for mortals and that contained their own avoidable horrors, the difference is that they were different from those perpetrated by Solars, dying in an insane training exercise is to be as dead as to die in an absurd, avoidable and useless civil war of the shogunate. It is equally bad in both cases.Morality does not apply, Usurpation is by definition an area that is left ambiguous and gray, so that we discuss and have our own opinions there is no objectively right or wrong side.All this without saying that it was based on an inherently fallible and erroneous prophecy. As always the answer is the Great Curse ruin everything and it does not matter who is in charge.
>>64541678You seem to have responded to the wrong post, I never said what came after was better, nor have I stated that the Terrestrials weren't also tyrannical nutjobs, all I said was that the Solars were most definitely psychotic assholes given what we know they did according to 2e lore. Just because Hitler was a jackass that doesn't mean Stalin was a saint.
>>64541389Both are referred to as walking towers, both are anti-reality, and special importance is given to the skin/armour of both. In fairness, what else s there to Numidium? You can't exactly use Karvara to achieve CHIM or break time itself every time it's activated.IIRC, NUmidium is powered first by the Heart of Lorkhan and then the Mantella. These could be analogous to the Greater Hearthstone needed to power a Warstrider.
>>64541527This picture makes me wish Exalted had more pike formations.
>>64541457Your comment made me laugh but the truth is that the Soalrs did a lot of horrible things in the First Age (the vast majority of it because of the Great Curse).What I wanted to say is that those horrible things were not the reason for the Usurpation, the Usurpation was only produced by the Sidereal prophecy.What I mean by this is that if your prophecy had said that everything would go well forever and you would live in a perfect Golden Age forever, except when every two or three centuries some Solar would go crazy and kill a couple of tens of millions of humans, but apart from that everything would be fine I firmly believe that the Sdierales would have said "small sacrifices for the greater good" and would have been totally happy leaving things as they were because of the suffering of a handful of mortals (there were billions of human in the First Age, at least in previous editions) would have mattered a damn.Just as in the real world there is war, murder, suffering, abuse, brutality and injustice in huge quantities, but how much do we really care about it? Very little or almost nothing in most cases unless they directly affect us or our acquaintances and I believe that in Creation they would have done the same.But the prophecy told them about the end of the world and therefore affected them all, including Sdierals and therefore had to act in one way or another. It was not for morals, it was not for goodness, the Usurpation happened for survival.
>>64541457Gold Faction doesn't exist in 3E.
>>64541728That's exactly what I wanted to say, they were all terrible regardless of the type of Exalted they were. Some use First Age as a kind of justification to say that the Soalrs are the worst and terrible monsters while ignoring all the horrible things that everyone else has done and I do not like it. So whenever I see something that reminds me, I simply point out that all the Exlated, of all types have made their own mistakes and other abilities, the Solars are like everyone else in that aspect.
>>64541852It definitely still does but the factions are less at odds because there's still work to do.
>>64541852As far as I know the Factions exist in 3E but they are less rigid organizations and more loose philosophies. After all, until the Solar return, there seemed no reason to discuss who should govern the Creation when one of the options was basically nonexistent.If I understood the devs well, the resurgence of the Factions among the Siderals coincides with the return of the Solars, which is when the Golden Faction makes some sense when it becomes viable again and the Brocne Faction ceases to be the only option because it is the only one viable before that.On the other hand if the Lunars really matter in 3E then a Silver Faction should exist, it was in 2E even if it was only mentioned once in the whole line and if it does not exist at least there should be a very good reason for it.Before the return of the Solars, the confrontation between Factions was probably nothing more than philosophical discussions about whether things would be better or worse with Solars, basically irrelevant to day-to-day life. Now that they have returned they are a real option and therefore the Factions are something that suddenly matters.
>>64541960I think the reason for a lack of a Silver Faction is that they've been at war for so long there's bad blood around.
>>64542144Plus in 2E the Silver Faction was literally just THREE GUYS.Three people is not a Faction, dawg.
>>64542144It is possible, but even so a total and monolithic hatred seems unlikely, especially since the fight is between Dragon-Blooded and Lunars mainly and I like the idea of a Silver Faction. On the other hand in 3e it seems that the Lunars are the main cause of Sidereal, so maybe they kill each other in plain sight. But the Lunar book comes out soon and surely they touch the subject, so soon we will know the answer is something that they can not leave without mentioning.
>>64542174If it exists in 3E, I hope they are more numerous.
>>64542222It'll be hard to do, given that there are a hundred Sidereals at most at any given moment.
>>64542247The number of Sdierals is so small that the Brocne faction is probably 30 people and it is the biggest Faction. I do not remember if 2E gave specific numbers. But when you think about it, the number is really small.
>>64542174>>64542222I'd imagine the silver faction isn't it's own faction independent and opposed to the other two, but a subsection of both factions who figure that sometime, somewhere in the future, it would probably be a good idea to try and mend ties with the lunars. I mean up until recently they figured that how things are are just how things are going to be forever, so maybe some millennia down the line when all the old elders are dead they can try and bring them back on board
>>64542247Six dudes would be about one hundred percent more. Even ten wouldn't be bad.
>>64542326It could be considered to include the myriad gods that also support their goals.The relationship between Sidereals and gods is all kinds of fucked up, but at least for Silver and Gold sympathisers there's room for trust to build.
>>64542336Its less a faction and more a club that meets for lunches sometimes to bitch about their problems and get daytime drunk at a bar.A Bronze Rotary Club if you will
>>64544518>Exalted 1E: 2001>Guren Lagann: 2007Yeah.
>>64544564>2007I could have fucking sworn it was earlier than that, since that was late high school for me and I thought I recalled talking about it in even middle. But no I was wrong, and thus a faggot.
>>64543090I like to imagine that gold faction where seen as sort of mix of libertarians and carlists, a non viable party(Libertarians) faction with beliefs that really don't matter anymore but are still around with some attached beliefs un-related to the original purpose (Carlists). Until of course someone of the bloodline showed up glowing gold with a snake symbol on his flowing yellow cloak and suplexed a tank.that converts people to your team.
>>64540153Go back to SV with the rest of the can't let go's
>>64541380I maintain that not only was the usurpation moral, it was a moral nescesity.There is no greater poster-child for the ills of the first age than Salina. Now maybe you think hierarchies are a bad thing, maybe you think giving everyone access to magic is good. But that's neither here nor there. Salina, with the best of intentions, altered the fundamental nature of reality. A reality she did not - could not - fully understand. Who knows what the side-effects could have been? For that matter, who can say there were no side-effects - undetectable due to the fact that creation had been changed so it was always that way.Salina showed that Solars possessed both the power to alter the fundamental nature of creation and the hubristic will to do so. At which point, they became an existential threat - and the only way to ensure the safety and continuity of creation was to remove them from the equation.
>>64546152It follows from this, of course, that the usurpation did not go far enough. Any creature capable of initiating into the saphire circle of sorcery can perform workings which alter the metaphysics of all creation.However, a usurpation on this scale may prove impractical. Luckily, to initiate into the saphire circle one must first initiate into the emerald circle. Therefore, it is my belief, that the only upstanding action for the Sidereals to take is to systematically kill all sorcerors and work to supress all knowledge of sorcerous initiation.
>>64539794Why are you complaining about SJWs if you are playing exalted?
>>64546152>>64546282While I agree with the principles behind the usurpation, I disagree with the actions taken and your assertion at the end to kill sorcerers. The true problem with Creation is not that some people are too powerful and they misuse this power, the problem is that too many people are far too weak to resist the machinations of the powerful. Therefore, I maintain that we ought to not only spread sorcery into the hands and minds of every single mortal in Creation, but we ought to go even further and make it our long-term goal to ensure that every mortal is guaranteed to receive an exaltation.
>>64546484And thus Mage the Ascension was born.>>64546152The Solars rule the world and may do with it as they will. Why are the Primordials metaphysics sacred?
>>64531445>Lunars Kickstarter starts in a few daysToo late for me. Checked out, enjoying spending that money on hookers and blow. (But actually other games.)
>>64546639>The Primordials rule the world and may do with it as they will. Why are their creation's fee-fees sacred?
>>64546727It’s not a question of feeling. It’s a question of why the idea of altering reality is bad, as opposed to merely weighing the merits of particular changes.
>>64546763Just pointing out that your argument could be used in such a way. If you have no problem with Primordials doing as they please with their experiments and believe that it was well within their right to do so, then carry on. If you don't believe this, then fuck you and your hypocrisy.
>>64547115Neither the Primordials or the Solars should be unnecessarily cruel. The idea I was attacking was the idea that the Solars modifying Creation’s rules constitutes some kind of blasphemy or sacrilege or intolerable danger.
>>64547149>Who gets to decide what is cruel or not?>Whose point of view should take primacy?>Why should demigods bow to the whims of their objective lessers? >Why should creators have to keep their creation's feelings in mind or put them above theirs?>etc.It's all relative and Solars clearly established a precedent that higher beings can't be allowed to "do as they will" just by dint of being higher beings and capable of such. Neither Primordials nor Solars were allowed this freedom for long and when others felt it was becoming too dangerous for themselves, they banded together and toppled those above them.
What beats a dedicated soak build, if anything?I've run a couple of campaigns, and so far it seems like stacking up natural soak and resistance charms really beats other combat builds, mote for mote. It's not quite so dominant that I'd call it a problem, as it's not omni-capable, but I've struggled to present any kind of antagonist that actually appears threatening to a player who's character has Adamant Skin Technique and Invulnerable Skin of Bronze as a control spell.It feels cheap to keep having bad shit happen to the other party members just because this guy can't Defend Other.
>>64547278Such a philosophy is called Envy. The idea that power should be destroyed simply for being powerful would make the world a cold grey thing.
>>64546484>>64546639The Primordials at least has a more complete understanding of what they where doing. Though, in practice, this only allowed events like the three spheres cataclysm to transpire.The problem with altering the metaphysics of creation is that everyone dwells within creations. There's no telling what seemingly benign change would actually cause the whole edifice to come crashing down. Look once again to Salina, she wished to remove all hierarchies. And yet the principle of hierarchy was instrumental in creation. Who is to say that hierarchy isn't responsible for why rain must seek the ground, or why one moment must follow the next?Sorcerous workings often lead to unforseen circumstances, and when the target of those workings is the very fundamental underpinings of our relaity these dangers become intolerable. More so because the perpetrators may present their actions as no blasphemy or sacrilege, but as a kindness.The Solar, the Sorceror, need not be profane. Need not be cruel. Their actions may be, to them, a benefit to all creation. But it is such a delicate and fragile tapestry that seperates us from the formless wyld. That has, for untold generations, supported and given form to creation and all who dwell upon it. And you would let Sorcerors, once as mortal as anyone else with just as limited a view, twist and prod and tear at it. Why? Because in times gone by primordial hands spun it from the waters of primal chaos? Because that was the primordials "right"? A "right" which now belongs to the Solars?Now, tell me, when some sorceror plucks at the sting of this tapestry, when the whole edifice unwinds. When creation and all who dwell upon it come undone, will this moral "right" protect the people and their works? Will the knowledge that the end of all things wasn't wrought by the raksha or the undead but by those who hold the mandate of heaven serve as shield against the tide of destrutcion?
>>64547678>Look once again to Salina, she wished to remove all hierarchies.That's my girl.
>>64547678Yes. I affirm all these things. Let greatness be, though the Heavens fall.
>>64547678I, for one, am perfectly willing to risk the destruction of all Creation if it means that there is even a small possibility of a better life on the other side.
>>64547762>>64547834Sidereals have no higher or more noble calling than to safeguard creation and all who dwell within it. To risk everything, as if it were some game in the house of Plentimon, is to betray this sacred trust.If you would risk all Creation, you are a fool. If you can risk all Creation, you are a danger. The ability to do both does not make you a god-king, it merely proves you a dangerous fool.So affirm your belief in greatness. Affirm your truest desire to make a better world for everyone. Perhaps your optimism, your believe in something greater than yourself makes you the best of us. But it makes you no less a threat, and a threat to creation can not, must not be allowed to persist.And when the sun rises after your passing, creation will be no greater, no fuller - but it will be. And that must be a Sidereal's sole and guiding charge.
>>64548018That's why I like the Getimians better.
>>64540639>magitechonly as a distinct mechanical category, you can still have it as an aesthetic>ancient wondersmuch more focus on these and their stories. see evocations.>transhumanistnever really a big thing and some people have weird understanding of transhumanism.on the other hand look at all the thing you can do with sorcerous workings to transform yourself..
>>64541734>the Heart of Lorkhan>Greater HearthstoneI think the Heart is a bit more powerfull than just a heartstone maybe a 5 dot or even N/A artifact.
>>64548018>>64548051It is good that Creation is kept in the hands of the Solars then, and not in those of small men who would make the world small.
>>64548367You wanna make the world big, you gotta raise up the people that inhabit it. Only when every man is an ascended god-king will Creation see the fullness of its true potential.
>>64548382You'd think that but not.
>>64548421It is the height of petty greed to keep other people down for fear their empowerment will make you less special.
>>64548453You act as though people need to be kept down. They naturally suck. Hierarchy emerges through simple difference in ability which will always exist. Even if the Solars gave everyone Exaltations, their would simply form new hierarchies among Solar Humanity and we'd be back where we started in regards equality.
>>64548475True, hierarchies would still exist, but these would be more reflective of mankind's true potential. A Solar rules over mortals not because he is a good leader, but because of the immense power his exaltation gives him. Give every mortal a Solar exaltation however, and we shall see who is truly worthy to rise up to the top...
>>64548503The power gap would just form anew. Whats worse it might become a power gap based less on individual skill or merit and more on massed industry.
>>64548514Good. I prefer power gaps based on industry over this bullshit.
>>64548533>I prefer a world where power and decision-making is so diffused that individual accountability is impossible and the mob rules rather then any particular human being.Pfff yeah okay.
>>64548556Industrialized oppression may suck, but at least it's a collective suck. When a Solar genocides an entire race, it's because he decided to do it, and he is so powerful that his will alone can dictate the fate of entire nations. When Hitler decides to genocide an entire race, he has to convince the German people to go along with it, and they did. That's what it means to give everyone an exaltation. We will still be the terrible people that we are, but we will have no one but ourselves to blame for it this time.
>>64548589Thats a bad thing. I *like it* when tyranny is fixed by killing the tyrant. You can't do that if there's six hundred tyrants up for reelection every four to six years.
>>64548676You also can't do that when the tyrant can single handedly take on your entire peasant army, or speak a mere sentence and put them back under the thrall of his enchanting voice.
>>64548712You can if someone stronger punches him in the face.
>>64548721That's not a rebellion, that's two god-king tyrants fighting each other.
>>64548730And? The diffusion of power is the diffusion of accountability. No one's responsible and no one's to blame because 2000 people all contributed to the untraceable bad idea. The diffusion of power is the choice of passion over reason. Not merely because the masses are stupid but because the more people involved in a decision the less each person's motivations and rationale reaches the final verdict. Ultimately the question is whether you want a world where decisions are made by the powerful, humanized , 'rational' few or the weak, impersonal, passionate cogs. I personally retain my faith in the Solar aristocracy.My own views leak through somewhat but like half of this is LARPing as Gold Faction.
>>64548767>'rational' few>literally has a curse that forces them to behave irrationallyYou maybe be LARPing but that won't stop me from using my meta knowledge. Since the mob behaves irrationally, and the exalts behave irrationally on account of their curse and unreasonable amount of personal power, the best government would actually be an autocracy under a mortal. And, to be fair, we see an example of such a system in the Perfect of Paragon.
>>64548857Hmmm. Nah. The guy with mind control powers who invented T-Rex piss cocaine should be king. Again.
>>64548885Although they aren't exactly an example of benevolent rulership (being dedicated purely to profit and all) the Guild at least proves that you don't need to be powerful on a personal level to maintain a position of power over the world. Also how high were the writers when they made dinosaur piss cocaine?
>>64548911As I said here>>64541231Solars are glorious assholes. As I mentioned once in the Vs WoD thread, you're asking the people who, upon learning the precepts of proper combat, immediately broke physics so bar slides and buster swords were practical, to save the world for you.
>>64548945Truly, no setting makes you appreciate the fact that superheroes don't exist quite like Exalted.
>>64548965Thats because Solars are real heroes. Semidivine superhumans who accomplish great deeds through strength and cunning exploits. Not just 'oh this guy fought in a war or sold the most at the charity bakesale KAREN'
>>64548965>>64548945>>64548911>>64548885>>64548857One person is arguing for a distribution of power across society that's basically shaped like a flat line, everybody equally powerful. The other person is arguing for a flat line... with a small number of dots so high above that line they can't be touched. I think it's pretty apparent that the best thing would be a distribution shaped like a pyramid, with each successively higher level of the pyramid having the ability to make more important choices than the next, and having responsibility for those choices belonging solely to them, so there's still perceptible accountability. And I'm also pretty sure that this is the distribution humans are trying to get closer to all the time in real life, only as societies become more corrupt the pyramid's sides start curving inward and the shape becomes more and more pointy. And then the pyramid's base overthrows the peak, and the shape resets. If things go right, that is...The Incarnae even tried to use this model, somewhat. They put the DBs at the bottom, Lunars and Sidereals above them, and Solars at the top.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ViGdjc08Vt4
>>64549108A pyramid is fine...as long as you can ascend the pyramid. This caste bullshit needs to go, if you're an unfit Terrestrial then you should be able to have your exaltation ripped from you and handed to a suitable mortal.
>>64548018>>64546152>>64546282It is your opinion, for me there is nothing moral in the usurpation, it was made in response to a prophecy, not because of the actions of the Solars or the suffering they brought, but because of their consequences. Non-moral survival, as I see it.As for killing Sorcerers, that was never part of their plan or thought about it, because it's not about morality, nor about rewriting the rules of reality, which I'm sure the Siderals have also done. It's about the Soalrs going to destroy the world, nothing more and certainly they were not going to murder their own sorcerers in the process.As for the Siderals and defend the Creation, they serve the destiny, it is not a good or moral thing to keep the machinery in operation, they are not the good guys in history. One day a Sidereal can save someone's life because it is their destiny to live longer, the next day they can set fire to a city and kill all its inhabitants because the destiny decrees it or something much worse. There is nothing good or moral in your work, it is only maintenance of Destiny and Creation. Just as the Usurpation is not about morality it is about survival.
>>64540102>>64540140>>64540157Uh, anon, you do realize that Saigoth sank below the ocean, and its remains above the waves became that big Western archipelago that goes from Coral to Wavecrest, right?
>>64548857The Parangón is the worst of all the usable examples. He is literally the worst tyrant imaginable, as bad as any of the First Age, worse than most of them, and without great Curse to justify him. It is someone who literally steals the free will of the people to turn them into puppets with whom to do whatever they want, when they want, as they wish. Someone who is established would send the entire population of the city to die without hesitation if he thought that the profit is high enough. Using a Solar Artifact to obtain his dominion and immortality, in case it is not clear that he is a First Age tyrant in everything except in the absence of Solar exaltation and a Great Curse that at least explains his vile behavior. In fact I think that is the original intention of the character, put a First Age tyrant in everything but name in the Age of Sorrows and see how it fits.That is sensible and does not abuse its enormous power only means that it is intelligent, not that there is something admirable. The only reason why it seems sensible and reasonable is because the Age of Sorrows is so horrible and so bad for so many people that the worst kind of slavery imaginable sounds like a good alternative and that only because the Perfect takes a lot of effort to show the good (little) and hide the bad (almost everything) of your system. But he is an immortal tyrant and will arrive the day in which of contradictory orders by simple error and kill half a city or the day in which some eventuality will arise and send the whole population of the city to die to fulfill their objectives. It's just a matter of time, for me it's one of the most monstrous characters in all of Exalted.
>>64541380>iderals and Dragon-Blooded only moved against the Solars because of the prophecy that the Solars would destroy the world if they did not do something. If such a prophecy had not existed, I bet they would not have moved a finger against the Solars and would have continued to enjoy the benefits that First Age provided them and those that they, as privileged members of society, enjoyed.>>64549544>It is your opinion, for me there is nothing moral in the usurpation, it was made in response to a prophecy, not because of the actions of the Solars or the suffering they brought, but because of their consequences.Sidereals didn't just suddenly receive that prophecy out of nowhere. They specifically gathered to look into the future of things and ways of shaping that future, because it had become obvious that Solars were getting up to some scary shit and things were going seriously wrong as a result. As for the Dragon-Blooded, 1E's Aspect Books had at least one bit, IIRC written as a surviving piece of First Age correspondence bewteen two Dragon-Blooded, where a former Solar loyalist explained to a trusted friend that he had found out that there was truth to the terrible rumors told about Solars, and that he was going to join some kind of a revolutionary secret society because of this discovery. Outrage and horror at the crimes of Solars was definitely one of the motivations behind the Usurpation, at least on an individual scale, though the ultimate reason of course was survival.
>>64549715It is trivially easy to imagine a worse tyrant than the Perfect. There's no actual need to imagine, though, because there have been plenty of worse tyrants in the real world. There is some truly horrifying potential for abuse in Paragon's system, and giving anyone that kind of power is a terrible idea, but currently the problems with Paragon are potential more than actual.
>>64549715>mfw I would unironically sign up to live in ParagonSuch is the life of a monarchist. Hell I would do what was said without a pact.
>>64549866A normal monarch can not kill you with thought. It can not oblige you to do things beyond where its executors reach. The Paragon can tell someone to flay himself and set himself on fire and he would do it or send someone to the other end of Creation on a suicide mission to kill someone and they will have to do it whether they want to or not. In a conventional monarchy you can try to flee or kill / dethrone the tyrant. In Parangón it is impossible, there is no possibility of escape or rebellion, which in a tyranny of that kind are the only limitations of the tyrant.
>>64549975In practice, though, the Perfect does not do these things. He could, and that's a problem, but he doesn't. In practice, and in canon, Paragon is a safe, stable place to live in. That's nothing to scoff at in a world like the Creation. In practice Paragon's laws aren't stricter or punishments harsher than anywhere else, those laws are just better enforced than anywhere else. As is said in >>64549765, Paragon's system has serious issues, but they're currently potential rather than actual problems.
>>64549975So what you are saying it is my ideal Monarch
>>64549182You cannot ascend the pyramid IRL, humans are nothing but flesh robots, your ability is 100% determined by genetics and early childhood. If you are destined to be a sucker who lives in poverty and misery you better kill yourself because you cannot ever attain happiness. However there are a lot of social mechanisms put in place that prevent you form doing the rational thing as humans can only trully be happy if they are relatively better off than some sucker under them.
>>64550431>You cannot ascend the pyramidOh but you can descend. t. 4chan
>>64550431Effort and motivation definitely have a big impact on both academic performance and school performance, though. Getting along well with the right people can also affect your career quite a bit. As for the claim that "humans can only trully be happy if they are relatively better off than some sucker under them", there is definitely a correlation between happiness and how well-to-do you are compared to others. It's kind of retarded to try to present such a general trend as an absolute fact that applies to every individual case, though. People differ in their values and personalities, and while there are things that matter for pretty much everyone, there is no general formula for happiness that works for everyone.
>>64549866>Hell I would do what was said without a pact.I'm pretty sure that's what most rulers expect you to do. In real world, too, it is generally expected that people actually obey the law even if no magical mind control law enforcement is used.
>>64550759Would be an interesting question to ask though.>Why do you abide by the laws of this land?
>>64548503Anon, I'm not sure how to tell you this... but the majority of rulers in human history probably weren't the "truly worthy".
>>64550523That’s just system correcting itself by puting your in your place.Suicide is rational and nearly everyone should be doing it, most poeple are pretty miserable.
>>64546763Altering reality is fine. If reality is so sacred, why is altering it so easy? Sin is fake.
>>64548051Do we know anything substantial about the Getimians motives at this point? IIRC, we have like, 2 sentences/not much.Founded by a Sidereal who is rebelling against the faction is all I can recall off the top of my head. Something about wanting to not be dictated to by the Loom of Fate, and Getimians having either pattern spiders or their own mini-loom (which would either let them exist outside Fate or lets them write themselves Fate in how they want).I am the under the impression that we have so little information that a person could easily assume they represent some kind of new Gold Faction that hated the Usurpation. I doubt this is the case, but the fact that we know almost nothing shows how you almost have to build up "what a Getimian is" from the ground up. If there has been a new injection of information, say, from the Discord, please let me know!
>>64540969What's going on in this picture? Where's it from? I know it's FGO.
>>64551539>most poeple are pretty miserable.Do you have anything to back that claim up, anon? Most people I know have more good than bad going on in their lives. The bad parts suck, but it doesn't seem very rational at all to give up the good parts.
>>64551539I'm going to have to agree with >>64552737If you commit suicide, your life will only ever have been as good as it was when you killed yourself. True upward mobility is limited, but it is still quite possible to have a happy and comfortable life. Its just a matter of self discipline, setting achievable goals, and then working to reach them.
>>64553308So in the end you die tired chasing some bullshit goal?Fermi’s paradox, bitch! There are billions of Earthlike planets in this galaxy and we estimate that even at sublight speed it would take about 100 million years to colonize the entire galaxy. Where are they? The odds of us being the first ones considering the age and size of the galaxy is extremely low even a few million years old spacefaring civilization would be pretty damn noticeable. So where are they? What if, perhaps, they saw the futility of it all and ended it?
Planning on creating my first character, a Twilight caste sorcerer, what weapon styles would be good? Should I have them know a martial art at creation or learn it later with SXP (don't want to fall into the "squishy wizard" trap)? I hear Melee is good.
>>64554688Anon, none of that works as even a half-assed argument for why any human on this actual Earth, which is not actually a hellhole but at least in the West a pretty neat plce to live, should kill themselves. It makes no rational sense.
>>64554736Melee is a good, versatile choice. You can't really go wrong with that. MA Charms can be bought with Solar xp, which is usually an advantage, but as a sorcerer you're probably going to want to spend your SXP on spells. If there's no specific MA you want to learn, getting a decent Ability rating and a few Charms in Melee would be my advice.
>>64554736There're a couple of spells that go pretty well with melee, if you can spare the time to cast them. Wood Dragon's Claw for example. If you're playing 3e, the Metagaos one that gives you hand-fangs is neat.
>>64539794I don't know. When reviewing the KS transcript for OPP I thought the sidebar talking about Transgender and Otherkin Lunars was pretty well done.
Second edition turned exalted into a cartoon parody of itself and it will never recover. I understand the neverborn now.
>>64554688>So in the end you die tired chasing some bullshit goal?If you can't achieve it, then obviously you didn't set ACHIEVABLE goals. Like I fucking said you dense fucking toaster.
>>64547287"Gain x initiative each turn" charms
>>64546484There are three potential methods you could use to give everyone an exaltation:>you can take the essence from the gods and give it to the mortals>you can take essence from the Wyld and make it orderly and static like Creation's essence, then give it to the mortals>you can enforce a breeding program to ensure that only Terrestrial exalts have children with each other and only at the right times to produce Terrestrial exaltationsThe first one will take a lot of violence and coercion directed at the gods, the second one will probably require you to either be a very high essence level or have the help of a strong god or primordial, and the third one will take a very long time to accomplish.
>>64556413This shit is still going? When are threads going to be worth reading again, any ETA on that?
>>64556449ETA on that is: When Exigents comes out. Oh wait that might make the problem worse.
>>64556487It will, with 800 Celestial exaltations, 25,000 Terrestrial exaltations, 1,000 Alchemical exaltations, and gods know how many Exigent, Getiminian, and Liminal exaltations, it would appear the only thing truly stopping people from becoming an exalt is their own lack of ambition.
>>64556551If we go with the estimates for how many people were alive around the Bronze Ages (approximately 5 to 20 million, we'll go with 20 million to be on the safe side), and we go with the relatively safe assumption that there are roughly 50,000 exaltations worldwide, then that means there is a .25% chance of any person managing to exalt. Those are pretty good odds, especially since most people probably don't even try to obtain an exaltation.
>>64556874Devs already explicitly stated that Creation's population is about 500 million. And your line of reasoning is kind of dumb anyway since Creation has a much larger land surface area than Earth and previously had a massive population that was reduced by some near-apocalypses.>>64556551>1,000 Alchemical exaltationsThe fuck are you talking about, devs already said there'd be no Alchemical material because it requires its own setting, Autochthonia.
>>64557087>And previously had a massive population that was reduced by some near-apocalypses.Wouldn't this be an argument for a smaller population? It's not only a bronze age setting, it's a post-apocalyptic bronze age setting. That's not conducive to having a high population.
>>64557167The 500,000,000 is the smaller population.
>>64557200So I'm presuming they must've had trillions of people back in the First Age. Do we have a population estimate for that time?
>>64557087>The fuck are you talking about, devs already said there'd be no Alchemical material because it requires its own setting, Autochthonia.Which is a double-shame because 3e's Charm bloat is actually pretty in-theme for Alchemicals...
>>64557087>The fuck are you talking about, devs already said there'd be no Alchemical material because it requires its own setting, Autochthonia.Actually they said they wanted to integrate Alchemicals into Creation a bit more.
>>64557433That could be neat.Maybe there's a way to make Alchemicals Creation-side
>>64548965it's also inspired by various ancient legends, like Gilgamesh, who had a sword that weighed an absurd amount and was a big guy himself.
>roll20's 3e sheet doesn't include a roll for shit buttonMaking your own is trivial, but still. Also the charm page is retarded with each charm being this fat full width bar even when collapsed meaning you have to scroll to see all of your initial 15 charms even if you make your excellencies a single entry. It's probably better laid out than D&D 4e's half-assed powers page but still.
>>64559475>playing 3e on roll20
>>64559724I'm not but I did want to check its viability. I give it a 6/10.
>>64559831Still not, Lunars and Infernals aren't out yet.
>>64559831Out of curiosity do you play 1e or 2/2.5e and what changes do you make to make them better?
What is the best way to receive an exaltation anyways? If someone wanted to become an exalt because they were going to get isekai'd to Creation soon, and they came up to you asking for advice on how to get an exaltation, what would you tell them? What's the 5 step plan to becoming a god-king?
>>64560153There isn't one. The Terrestrial Exaltation is by blood and the Sidereal by Fate. The rest are governed by their respective patrons. Though I do seem to recall one particular Abyssal who walked up to a Deathlord and straight up demanded to be Chosen.
>>64560153If you got isekai's you're limited to Solar, Abyssal, Infernal, and Lunar and of those 4 only Solar has a chance of being something approximating a pleasant experience. That said you have to already be awesome to earn Solar exaltation so maybe one of the others would be a better choice.
>>64560153>Solars and LunarsIt's mostly a matter of appealing to their preferences by being sufficiently awesome or being sufficiently outcasted from society. >InfernalsThere are two methods of gaining an exaltation, the first is to be sufficiently oppressed and the second is to make a deal with demons. >AbyssalsYou won't know if you're chosen until right before you die, but you will only be chosen if you've worked around death before, such as at a graveyard or in a hospice. >Terrestrials and SiderealsFor Terrestrials, you are either born with the exaltation or you aren't, Terrestrials are basically the entitled blue bloods of exalted. Sidereals work in a similar manner, you are chosen by Fate which means you'll basically be an exalt from birth.>ExigentsYour best bet is to just walk up to a god and ask them for an exaltation, it is possible that they might say no or they might ask you to perform a task for them if you want to earn it. If they say no or the task isn't possible for you, do not fret, for there are countless numbers of gods and if you politely ask enough of them eventually one of them will say yes. >LiminalsYou cannot become a Liminal, Liminals are an entirely new person created from an attempt to resurrect the dead, so while you can create an exalt this way, you cannot become an exalt through this method.>GetiminiansThey have an unknown requirement for becoming an exalt, however it is unlikely that they work in the same manner as Sidereals so I would expect becoming a Getiminian to be something you can actually hope to achieve.
>>64560153Abyssal and Infernal are the only ones you'd really have any chance of getting, assuming a straight up "you're now in Creation" transfer.If you want to tie it into the setting though, then being a Sidereal all along (somehow trapped in a Wyld-world and now recovered), a Getimian (after being ripped from your rightful fate) or some kind of delusional Fae would all be appropriate.Or perhaps you could be pulled up from the Well of Udr - bloated with unfathomable pestilences - and raised as an Abyssal for shits and giggles.
>>645598313E is the only version of Exalted, including the myriad number of hacks or knockoffs like Godbound, that I would call legitimately good in any way.
>>64560153It blatantly doesn't work like that. You can't coerce or force that sort of thing, it's not a fancy blue ribbon that you earn by being the specialist around.
>>64560953You can certainly put yourself into a position to be more likely than average to get one, but yeah there's no surefire way to exalt.
>>64560953No, but that doesn't mean you can't obtain an exaltation through your actions. Exaltations are kind of like noble titles, it's very difficult for a peasant to obtain one and they don't hand them out like candy, but that doesn't mean it's impossible for a peasant to become a noble either. All you need to do is impress the right god, and next thing you know you'll be an exalt.
>>64561035Yes, but you have no real way of knowing what that situation is going to be given that it can range from punching real good to reflecting on your actions and changing your life to curing someone's disease >>64561102Oh yeah, that's all true. I'm just saying that given it's a living entity making personal judgement calls beholden to no one but themselves in terms of who is best suited to wield their powers it's unlikely someone in setting would make it a personal goal to try and get one. Strikes me a little to close to that one dumb DotFA city that solars built just to try and reverse engineer the process
>>64561909Fair enough, although given the immense benefits that come with an exaltation it's hard for me to imagine that there wouldn't be a few people running around trying to impress a minor god enough to receive and exaltation. It's kind of like how in Warhammer Fantasy's Brettonia you occasionally get a peasant who tries to find the Lady of the Lake, and occasionally he even succeeds, because fuck yeah I'm willing to risk my life if it means I might become a superhuman badass who lives for thousands of years.
>>64560776What issues are with Godbound? I played it and had a great time.
>>64564322I had a great time with 2e exalted, doesn't mean it's good.
Does anyone have the latest monthlies?
>>64564322Combat, mainly. It really can't handle combat with other Godbound level enemies, and anything less than that is a curbstomp.I mean, unless the point *is* to just do a blanket curbstomp of all your problems by beating down inferiors, but that gets old after a while.
>>64564534No, this is wrong.Combat in Godbound is an absolute mess because the enemies are often significantly superior to any Godbound who is not combat-optimized, despite those enemies frequently being mundane mortals. The game is designed in such a way that Godbound are supposed to use their "always goes first" privilege to alpha-strike down the opposition, and if that fails, combat quickly degenerates into attrition wherein the first to lose their Essence/Effort can no longer sustain perfect defenses (e.g. Nine Iron Walls) and die.It is a very crude simulation of Exalted 2e, except that the mortals are inexplicable combat monsters with terrifying action economies, should they actually be allowed to take a turn.
>>64564637>Combat in Godbound is an absolute mess because the enemies are often significantly superior to any Godbound who is not combat-optimized, despite those enemies frequently being mundane mortals. The game is designed in such a way that Godbound are supposed to use their "always goes first" privilege to alpha-strike down the opposition, and if that fails, combat quickly degenerates into attrition wherein the first to lose their Essence/Effort can no longer sustain perfect defenses (e.g. Nine Iron Walls) and dieBut that's what I'm talking about too. In a combat between two Godbound, combat ends up being attrition by default.
>>64564637I mean that's not too far off from 3e, where a combat focused heroic mortal can often take on a non-combat focused exalt and still reasonably expect to win. Although on an unrelated note is that pic you're using art from Godbound?
>>64564678Godbound art isn't like that. Though, again, it's not quite like Exalted 3E because while the mortal might beat a noncombat focused Exalt if he's exceptionally lucky in 3E, in Godbound the mortal's survival is more of a binary and reliant entirely on the Godbound deliberately fucking up.
>>64564678That's 2hu art
>>64556551>It will, with 800 Celestial exaltations, 25,000 Terrestrial exaltations, 1,000 Alchemical exaltations, and gods know how many Exigent, Getiminian, and Liminal exaltations, it would appear the only thing truly stopping people from becoming an exalt is their own lack of ambition.I'm pretty sure that all of the new Exalts are supposed to be rare, significantly rarer than the Dragon-Blooded. If we estimate the number of the Exalted very generously generously and say that there's maybe one Exalt for every 10,000 mortals, there's still quite a bit more than ambition preventing one from becoming an Exalt.>>64557167It's not a Bronze Age setting technology-wise, though, and never has been. >>64557229I have no idea why you'd presume there were trillions, but there definitely were more people than now.
>>64564952>I'm pretty sure that all of the new Exalts are supposed to be rare, significantly rarer than the Dragon-BloodedWith the exception of the exigents I'm inclined to agree with you.
>>64565061There's less than 100 exigents in creation IIRC.
>>64565111Wait, really? You got a sauce on that? That just seems improbable given how there's like hundreds of trillions of gods.
>>64565133Assuming that least gods aren't a thing, or at least not a thing that matters for the purpose of creating Exigents, I don't think there are that many gods. Most common gods are probably gods of things like fields, springs, streams and such, and there are bound to be significantly fewer such gods than mortals.
>>64565133Consider the fact that for most of those gods, creating an Exigent would literally kill them for good. Hell it might not even work for most of them because they just don't have enough juice to give.Then consider that, from the very few that even can make Exigents without dying, it still involves sacrificing a lot of their power. Would you chop off both your arms to have a single child, anon?
>>64565133In addition to what others have said, as far as we know it's not a thing you can simply do on command. You need to personally seek permission from the Sun
>>64565213You actually can create an exaltation without asking the Sun, it's just a little taboo to do so.
>>64565199>Would you chop off both your arms to have a single child, anon?It's not off the table.
>>64565238It's not "just a little taboo". It still requires Exigence originally coming from the Sun, you just need to acquire one through illegitimate means.
>>64565238All Exigence spring from the Unconquered Sun. You either get the UCS attention and receive an Exigence or you buy one off the black market, someone having sold their own Exigence they received. I'd classify it as a bit more than "a little taboo."
>>64565277What's the UCS gonna do about it? He to addicted to the Games of Divinity to get off his fat ass and punish you.
>>64565301Well presumably since it's a black market that means it's against the law. The UCS doesn't have to come down out of the Games to slap you, there are gods and shit to do that for him. I imagine gods who want to cheat the system and get an Exigence they don't deserve run afoul of plenty of laws that would get the Sidereals involved.
>>64565301UCS' reaction is not the point. The point is that you need to acquire a resource that's in a short supply before you can even think about empowering your own Chosen. The resource in question is also illegal to actually acquire, so your efforts to do so are likely to lead to trouble unless you're very careful.
>>64565199>loving and loyal son/daughter to take care of me when I'm old and frail and keep me company as my best friend for lifeVS>armsWell.......
>>64565467Anon I think its less of a "Would you prefer to lose your arms" and more of a "Would you like to play Russian Roulette?"
>>64565467There's no guarantee of said son or daughter being loving, loyal or in any way willing to stick with you, though.
>>64565505You can choose who to exalt though, personally I'd find a young malleable good orphan boy and raise him as my own after exalting him.
>>64565467You're a god. You won't get old, and you'll only get frail if you suck at your job. Frail is a relative term, here. You'll probably become more frail by making an Exigent than you ever would by losing your job, too.
How come Hypnotic Tongue is subject to unacceptable influence?
>>64557248>3e's Charm bloatregarding this.how are the dragon-blood charms compared to the solar charms?
>>645676781766 vs 621I think someone did a more detailed CharmCount breakdown. Didn't save it.
>>64541074It's honestly annoying how many Exalted oldfags don't seem to realize the parts where Exalted "jump the shark" are what got a lot of people into the game, and substitute their opinions about how the setting should function for objective statements of quality. You can argue until the cows come home about whether or not the Sun should be a giant robot or not, but at the end of the day you're not going to change my mind about how fucking rad it is and how sad I am to see it go, because in practice-it doesn't actually have an impact on how my Exalted games go. It's just a cool detail you don't see in a lot of fantasy settings that I thought made Creation special.
>>64541231Hell everyone talks about the heroin PISSING dinosaurs, but that one sidebar in Ink Monkeys also has it that the reason there's a frozen wasteland of dinosaur bones up north is because the crazy Solar bastards used to race them down the snowy slopes hard enough to kill the poor beasts. Imagine that. Imagine a society of divinely ordained god-kings who, upon attaining authority over all creation, decided that dino-tobaganning is the premium gentleman's extreme support.This is the very essence of what attracted me to Exalted.
>>64541349>Theion, the green-and-white plume of flame who wanted to introduce an evolutionary acidic catalyst to all life on Creation, rules the SPIRAL in the Gunstar Autocthonia setting. Half his Charms are dedicate to making big, manly speeches to inspire your fawning audience into carrying out your audacious, self glorifying dumbassery. He is the king of the Primordials, the beings who built Creation in the main setting. And in the early days of his reign he was so thoroughly gattai'd with his more studious and introverted but equally determined little sister nobody noticed herSure it is
>>64542174>the Silver Faction is actually just 3 Sidereals finding an excuse to huddle around the heavenly water cooler to talk about their anthro fursonas>they're a "faction" because their superiors agree pretending they're a serious political movement is more comfortable than realising part of Heaven's salary goes to a fetish club
>>64564747No, it's quite easy for the mortal to kill the exalt. Chosen natural resistances are in immune system, not iron skin.>>64567912A lot of people like a lot of garbage, we are aware, yes.
>>64565238>>64565301All the boons (the term used in the novel Circle of Protection) of Exigents always come from the Unconquered Sun, but apparently they do not have to be used at the moment they are received, they can be reserved for later or in certain cases they survive the death of Exigent and can be reused later.If it is stolen, sold or reused without permission is a serious crime and apparently the Siderals are responsible for tracking down the culprits, at least that's what the novel is about, the so-called Circle of Protection that gives its name to the novel is the task force Sideral in charge to track the improper use of Exigent boons and punish the guilty ones and they are only 5 Siderals with excess work, as always
Remind me, how much does the average Solar (or other Exalt) know about the mechanics of their Charms and the like in-setting?
>>64567912I mean, it was still genuinely retarded and hard to take even moderately seriously.
>>64570298Agree to disagree
>>64570033Nothing. Charms don't even exist in-universe. They're a mechanical abstraction for the players' benefit.
>>64570324Martial Arts charms are pretty close actually. Being singular techniques.
>>64567739AAre you retarded? There are about ~600 Solar Charms alone, and maybe about 50-60 fewer Dragonblooded Charms.Like maybe if you were to count Evocations, MA Charms, Sorcery, and Hearthstones and shit as “Solar Charms” even though any solar can take them, you still wouldn’t have even close to 1800 Charms, my nigga. Especially since DBs also has Evocations, MA, and Sorcery in their book too.
>>64570548>any splat can take themFUCK I meant any splat
>>64570548You're right. It's 782 vs. 621. My spreadsheet fucked itself and I forgot to double-check.
>>64567599When does unacceptable influence kick in anyway, suicide aside?
>>64567964Your best argument for that is a spin-off what-if setting that gets a short writeup in a book it shares with three other settings? A spin-off setting that was published at the very end of 2E and has no implications whatsoever for any material that came before? Very convincing, anon.
>>64570862When youäd have to completely abandon a Defining intimacy, at least.
>>64570324>Charms don't even exist in-universe.Except ofcourse when they actually do, like Glorious Solar Saber, Glorious Solar, Phantom Steed Technique, and so on.
>>64571129But isn't that already covered by the bonus to Resolve you get?
>>64571788No. Boosted resolve can still be overcome. Unacceptable influence is something you can just straight up refuse, no matter how eloquently someone tries to persuade you.
Hey, I'm fairly new to the game so I was wondering, how does Exalted handle social combat? Is it like "I roll to make this guy do what I say or convince him to my side" or is it more on the roleplaying side of things where there's less rolling and more talking.
>>64560208>I do seem to recall one particular Abyssal who walked up to a Deathlord and straight up demanded to be Chosen.Any idea where I could find more on this?
>>64560208>>64572192That doesn't sound right, Abyssals are chosen at the moment before their death, unless the Deathlord stabbed the guy right then and there it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense.
>>645721553E has a fairly fleshed out social system based on intimacies, which is a catch-all term to things people find important. Other people, places, values, ideals and so on. Intimacies come in three different strengths, and persuading people to do anything significant generally requires framing things in a way that somehow utilizes one of the target's intimacies. Basically, you have to figure out what people care about and work wuth that to get them to do things. It's also possible to instill new intimacies and to weaken or strengthen existing ones.
>>64572497That's exactly what happened, IIRC. Maiden of the Mirthless Smile was the Abyssal in question. I think Scroll of Exalts has her 2E writeup.
>>64572155A bit of both. Basically to make a roll at someone, you have to understand what makes them tick via their intimacies: the things they like and hate, and the principles they live by. Your arguments have to appeal to those intimacies, the stronger the intimacies you appeal to are, the more you can get from the other person.You can intuit people’s intimacies via role play: it’s not hard to assume an NPC that won’t stop ranting about the Guild really dislikes the Guild, but you can also roll Read Intentions to help you figure out other intimacies... or figure out that the dude is faking his loathing of the Guild, and he’s just covering for the fact that he takes bribes. He might still hate them, just not to the point where the intimacy is strong enough that he’ll turn down their money.
>>64572192I think he’s referring to the Maiden of the Mirthless Smile. And she didn’t actually walk up to the Mask of Winters and demand an Abyssal Exaltation, she ignored him and walked *past* him. MoW then struck her down for that bit of insolence with his innate Deathlord “reflexively kill a mortal” ability. Her reaction to *that*, was what prompted him to offer her Exaltation.
>>64567599? Where are you reading that it is?
>>64574198No, that's plain wrong. Charm says what it does right there. Suicide I could understand being out of bounds, otherwise this social ability charm is suddenly the most powerful combat charm in the game, but you can totally order people to do things they don't want to, the text is clear
when the fuck is lunars
>>6457434724 hours and 6 minutes as of time of writing
What's the rundown on the MAs from the DB book? Is Golden Janissary decent?
>>64574398It's okay if you want to fight Creatures of Darkness. Otherwise it's not very good.
>>64574308Dev probably forgot that unacceptable influence isn't just about suicide.
>>64574363word? can you link me, please
>>64574602We've known for a little while nowhttp://theonyxpath.com/11563-2/
>>64570324That's a 3e conceit - "no, focus on the MYTHIC STONE AGE HERO ARCHETYPE, there are NO EXPLANATIONS FOR COOL".It doesn't make much sense in the setting though.If they wanted to make Charms abstractions, they should have gone the route of making them abstract. As-is, it's crunchier than GURPS.
>>64574899You can have crunchy games and also abstract mechanics at the same time, those aren't opposed to eachother
>>64574899The level of crunch really depends on your version of GURPS but no, it's nowhere near GURPS. It's not even Shadowrun 5E.
>>64574899>That's a 3e conceit - "no, focus on the MYTHIC STONE AGE HERO ARCHETYPE, there are NO EXPLANATIONS FOR COOL".Whether Charms are in-setting thing or not doesn't really have anything to do with how well and thoroughly the setting is. You're confusing two entirely different things.
>>64574700so what, I have to go to the opp page tomorrow to get a link to the ks?sorry, I'm just new to this whole getting extorted by a company for products they should be paying to develop thing
What are the most important charms for a socialite?
>>64575578Well for one if you just want the book you don't have to pay dick, it's coming out one way or another, the entire text is already completed. But yeah the kickstarter links are put up on their website when it's time, and a number of other places as well I'm guessing
>>64575689I see, thank you. I'm just keen to start a commune of ridiculously good looking people who may or may not dabble in sorcery, is all
>>64575676Rose-Lipped Seduction Style, Indecent Proposal Method, Celestial Bliss Trick, and Monk-Seducing Demon Dance.
>>64575676Hypnotic Tongue Technique and precursor charms. That's all you'll ever need.
I have a question, anons. Do you think it possible for a Solar to always do the moral action 100% of the time and to never have the Great Curse strike them? Or is it an impossibility?
>>64576090If you stick to your intimacies and don't get triggered, you can.
>>64576090Nah. There are events in everyone's lives that annoy the fuck out of them and while regular people are able to diffuse that stress the nature of the Great Curse is such that Exalts can only do that through a psychotic break. Mechanically if your Exalt takes the very non-Exalt route of playing it safe and if you metagame it as if they were aware of their Curse you could avoid gaining Limit indefinitely but I can't imagine an ST allowing such bad faith play for long.
>>64576239>Mechanically if your Exalt takes the very non-Exalt route of playing it safe and if you metagame it as if they were aware of their Curse you could avoid gaining Limit indefinitely but I can't imagine an ST allowing such bad faith play for long.You can also avoid gaining limit by not going against your intimacies/trigger. Which isn't impossible, considering Solaroid toolkits.
>>64576153Most of the times you're not going to be able to control your trigger. If you try to make a Limit Trigger that will never come up that's pretty much giving the ST permission to physically slap you. You might try to avoid hitting your trigger but it should be something pretty intrinsic to your character. A do-gooder probably has Limit Trigger related to do-gooding, shit like that. So to avoid hitting your Limit Trigger you might have to avoid things your character shouldn't, character-wise, be avoiding.
And, even assuming with the great curse, what about always taking the moral or correct action? Is that also possible?
>>64576341Great curse doesn't have anything to do with morality.
>>64576362I know that anon. I'm just asking if it's possible.
>>64576284Sure, it's possible. One of the interesting choices players have to make is when put into a difficult position where they have to choose between doing what's best for the group/their goal and staying true to their intimacies (and crafting such opportunities is important for any ST worth their salt). Those choices don't happen in a vacuum though and sooner or later your circle is probably going to get pissed that you keep choosing creating complication for everyone over gaining a point of Limit.
>>64576341>what about always taking the moral or correct action?I'm not sure what that's even supposed to mean. Say you want to break up a slaving ring headquartered in one town and figure that the method that results in the least slave casualties is to sneak in and slaughter the leadership. Everything goes fine until you come across some slaves being savagely beaten in public, possibly to death. Do you abandon your disguise to stop the atrocity in front of you at the cost of alerting the guards so they can set up defenses and conscript the slaves you're trying to save or ignore it to rescue as many slaves as possible?
>>64547287Drowning, sense based effects If they can't act easily they can't react easily, poisoning (iffy due to them having stamina but could get around soak if potent or consistent enough), hearts and minds (social). Could be I'm thinking less harm and more disable them either way they could be out of the fight. But just some ideas.
>>64576090Yes. A lot of the intimacies also happen to overlap with doing the righteous thing. Get the right intimacies and you'll only ever be punished for wicked actions.
>>64576341Of course it's possible. Simply alter yourself into something similar to a Primordial, incapable of taking actions that are not in accord with their morals (unless something stronger forces it).
>>64576341Only you define your morals. If your had the principles "Weak people are insects" and "Rare talents should be protected", you'd be more conflicted killing one prodigy martial artist over committing state wide genocide.
>>64576555If you're so confused, can an Exalted game have a character who never does anything even so much as morally grey?
Anyone know what MA styles are coming with the Lunars? I remember Centipede but not the others.
>>64577192Of course! Just give a comprehensive description of what the fuck "morally grey" means, and it's easy to avoid it ever happening.Otherwise, no.
>>64577323Centipede, Falcon, Laughing Monster, and Swaying Grass Dance
>>64577366Thank ye much.
>>64577323Centipede, Falcon, Laughing Monster, and Swaying Grass. That last one is the only one I remember from 2e. It's Capoeira, a sort of dance fighting style.
>>64577374Falcon is magic Lucha Libra and Swaying Grass Dance is magic Capoeira. Laughing Monster is some kind of shaping style
>>64577414Like, shapeshifting or Fae shaping?
>>64577505Fae shaping, it was stolen from a raksha
>>64576090The Great Curse doesn’t necessarily make you evil it just drives you to excess. Think of it this way. When a poor man fucks up a good intention, he hurts those close to him. When a king fucks up a good intention the nation suffers. When a Solar Exalted does it the cosmos shudders because his misguided attempt to create utopia by making people immortal, not need food, and be incapable of bearing further offspring has resulted in a degenerate dystopia, and his subsequent plans to make things right keep going awry as the Curse subtly tempts him to match epic screwups with epic solutions that cause a wider clusterfuck.
>>64577539I can't help but wonder how much bullshit the Raksha lords had to go through while Lunars basically played the wacky neighbor that kept on barging into their holds for zany hijinks.
>>64580021"Howdy neighbor! Mind if I borrow a cup of raw chaos? I'm making a batch of owlbears and just ran out."
>>64580021They're probably used to it. I think Lun herself has been barging into their holds for zany hijinks, and sometimes for absolutely horrifying hijinks, for who knows how long. It's not easy being raksha.