Box Art and Book Covers edition>Resources (Rules, Lore and Warhammer Fantasy Role-play)WFB: https://pastebin.com/qVGrgwwhWFRP: https://pastebin.com/inbyBsR6Novels: https://pastebin.com/6FV6bSNQ>Alternative Warhammer Miniatures and Manufacturershttps://pastebin.com/2aqCz6fh>Warhammer Wikiswarhammerfb.wikia.com/wiki/Warhammer_Wikiwhfb.lexicanum.com/wiki/Main_Page>Warhammer Video Gameshttps://pastebin.com/GXHZQFSUPrevious Thread: >>63958140
Do you think it's plausible that a human/harpy coupling might occasionally produce humans or near-human mutants? We don't really know how harpies reproduce, but if we assume they do it like beastmen, then I'm not sure. I had a notion to have a Norscan warlord who bragged his mother was a harpy his father took as spoils while reaving, and accounted that blood to his particular ferocity.
>>64002346Honestly I would say leave it open either way. Maybe the Warlord is talking shite just trying to make himself and his bloodline sound more powerful or special, maybe his mother was just a mutant, or maybe the story is true.
Just picked up pic related from the local thrift store for a dollar (half off books on Fridays). Haven't read the Von Carstein trilogy yet. Did I score, or wasted buck?>>64002346It's chaos. While I bet it would result in a heartbeat typically, you could pretty much fudge anyting.Could also be just posture.
>>64002346His father just always called his mother a harpy because she was annoying, nagging and insufferable. The Warlord is an idiot and misunderstood.
>>64002346Harpies are strange, but interesting to me. Don't they also hang out with the Dark Elves sometimes? Like the Manticore and a few other monsters, they get shared between army lists, and I think that's a neat feature to make the world feel more interconnected.Anyway, there are two ways I can see this going: harpies being treated as their own race, and potentially open to interbreeding with beastmen or humans. Or harpies actually being female beastmen, or at least being close enough they can keep tribes that would otherwise die out from lack of viable females going. Either way, I wouldn't exactly call having a harpy mother a point of pride.
>>64002615Not read them myself but I've always heard them get okay reviews. Some people really like them, others are a bit annoyed there isn't more development given to the Vampires but say they are still alright especially the 3rd story.
My first army book.As much as I played 6th edition I always missed the big books of 4th and 5th.
>>64002346This being the first post impresses on me that this will be an awful thread.
>>64002987What was the exact point (year and edition) at which Orcs went from being man-sized green dudes with bad posture to 500-pound green bodybuilders?
>>64003389Gorkamorka had them still fairly mansized but a lot more muscled, that was 1997.They went full giant roid monsters with 3rd edition 40k Orks in 1999.There was a general scale jump around that time and the 6th edition multipart plastic kit miniatures were a lot bigger than 5th edition especially in the case of the Goblins.
>>64004234>Buy this>No lizards>Don't care at time because I don't play lizards>Now kind of want lizards because I can't play anymore and just collect>At least I still have the intact boxAnyone know what era of real history these dudes are supposed to kind of be an expy of? Trying to decide if I want them.
>>64003797*sigh*Was recently looking at some of the older Orc art and models. It was too good to last...
>>64005272Here you go.http://knightmareminiatures.com/By the guys who did the sculpting/art of that era. Get your Malal Daemons and Oldhammer Orcs. Here's their last Kickstarter too. https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/554542735/greenskin-wars-the-iron-orcs-and-bulbus-peppernose
Anyone know where to get all the 6th edition erratas?
>>64005185I don't think there's any real historicism to those Fireforge fantasy models beyond the quilted armour and helmets. Looks like they're just generic fantasy goons, switch up the shields and you'd do well with them as Men at Arms for Bretonnains.
>>64005320I've been trawling through the GW site on the wayback machine. The erratas and FAQs are dated mostly around July 06, just before 7th edition, anything after September is 7th edition errata/FAQ.
>>64005385Thanks, I'll check it out
>>64005385Is this the latest one?
>>64005555That's from 2003, so I doubt it.
>>64005660It's correct for the rulebook at least. it's even in the right font compared to the ones from GW's website.
>>64005703I was meaning more that it'd likely have been replaced with an updated version in the three years between 2003 and 7th edition.
>>64005185Very loosely 15th century except for the shields. Fireforge's Northmen range are very clearly going for the asoiaf Stark look, which explains the later medieval base spliced with dark age trimmings.If you want a horde of late medieval goons, the Perry Agincourt-Orleans and War of the Roses ranges are well worth checking out. Superb quality and far cheaper than FF. The French Agincourt infantry box is a good match for these guys; 38 soldiers in a variety of armors with a large range of weapons, and 6 foot knights in full plate. The only potential downside is whether you think the truescale proportions don't fit in with chunky figures in your collection.
>>64005555For rulebook errata I believe that was the most up to date one for 6th edition. I don't recall anything else published but it has been a long time.
>>64004234Hell Ya, brother. I like my old ones, I love the TWW2 Saurus, but I've started to really hate my 6th ed ones.
>>64001718I would suspect that it would be a seperate piece. If that's the case then all you'd need to do would be to remove or cover the attachment prong. That could easily be done by just slinging a shield over his back.
6th edition is shit. You only have good memories of it because each army had a book.
>>64006591Can't help but notice you declined to suggest a better edition that eets your exacting standards.
>>64006591I have good memories of 6th edition because I actually played 6th edition. My army didn't have a book either, but I made do.>t. chorf
>>64006812>My army didn't have a book either>tfw no Dogs of War army book.>tfw White Dwarf list that got left in the dust.It wasn't as bad as I lament in my greentext, but I get where you're coming from, everyone got their books and more cool shiny toys to work with while we were stuck with just the bare bones of our Ravening Hordes and White Dwarf lists.
>>64005296Those are some purdy orcs.
Thoughts on other orc styles? Namely the more feral Shieldworlf orcs and more intelligent looking Mantic orcs? And other orcs I'm not aware of.
>>64002039>>64004234>bright goofy comical imageryget this Age of Sigmar shit out of this thread
>>64007160I personally like my orcs either Warhammer, Oldhammer or LotR-style.
>>64007179And pic related is peak orc.
>>64005296Sadly there isn't any alternative to dodging the gougers on ebay when it comes to the "midhammer" Alan Perry orcs though, which I have a bit more nostalgia for as that's when I started playing.
>>64007160I quite like Shieldwolf's feral looking orcs, I'd probably use them for savage orcs if I can't find a regiments worth at a decent price out there. I don't care for the "new" plastic ones from GW, too static and weighed down with shit. Oldhammer, 6e, Shieldwolf, that's my order of preference.
>>64007179Huh, I totally forgot about LotR Orcs, but then again, they have little in common with Warhammer Orcs besides the name.Were the models bulkier they'd work as Warrior of Chaos, not as Orcs in Warhammer.
>>64007172If ET never happened and AoS was released as a skirmish counterpart that harked back to Oldhammer aesthetics it would have made everyone a lot fucking happier.
>>64003797Boarboyz were released in 1997, those are probably the first Nelson sculpted orcs.
>>64007243>midhammerI think Herohammer is more eloquent and apt.>>64007250Shieldwolf is just too damn expensive for resin, but their sculpting is quite nice. It's a shame they don't cast in metal.
>>64007328While herohammer is accurate it just seems odd to say that when you are talking about time periods with old and modern at the edges.
>>64007309I would still put them in the kinda transitional category with the Gorkamorka Orks of the same year. More muscle but still fairly human sized.Compared to the multipart plastic Orcs or the massive savage Orcs that came out in the early 00s.
>>64007243Yeah those are great.
>>640065916th edition put emphasis on movement, elite units and expanded a lot on the Warhammer world (Lustria sourcebook, Ogre army book).It was extremely fun to play and the last time Warhammer was growing.
>>64006812could use the ravening hordes book
>>64007550I never cared for the Lustria book and Ogre Kingdoms I felt shrank the Warhammer world by just giving this massive swath of free mountains over to one faction and some garbage "not-goblins" when they could have done all sorts of stuff with hobgoblin tribes, giants and more.Gameplay wise 6th was fun though.
Which faction would you totally delete or fundamentally change if it was your choice?For me, it's gotta be the lizardmen. I have no idea what would go in Lustria in their place, though. Maybe nothing, or have it populated by failed Old One experiments and dotted with their ruins.
>>64007328Shieldwolf mountain orc infantry are multipart hard plastic, not resin. Their hero models are though. I also wouldn't say 25 euros for 20 orcs is a bad price at all, shipping ups it to 30 and change, though.
>>64007591I did back then, because we had literally no other way to play them. But the ravening hordes book gutted bull centaurs big time among other things. Chorfs were in a barely playable state during 6th but that wasn't the point of my post. Even though my preferred army didn't get a book I still liked 6th a lot. I don't think that poster played during the early 2000s or else he'd know it was really good times in general. Some might say the best of times.Cheap miniatures sculpted by some of the best artists in the industry. Well written rules from competent game developers. A reliable supply chain that wasn't trying to milk customers into panic buying every few months. Skirmish and campaign supplements getting printed in actual books instead of relegated to an afterthought in some digital article. Specialists games to fill just about every niche desire one could imagine with Warmaster, Bloodbowl and Mordheim. Yeah, take me back to 2000 and let me do it all over again please.
>>64007673I'd ditch the Shreks too. They're relevant to nothing, waste a chunk of the world like lizardmemers, and have a frankly implausible society. I have no problem with ogres being mercs for any army, but their appetites and stupidity should keep them at the tribal level.
>>64007550>Ogre army bookHas no right to exist.
Would you lewd a lascivious Lady Lahmian, or let her languish in her lust?
>>64007647Chaos, they got too big and became this plot hole all fun disappeared into.
>>64007970I mean, I wouldn't remove them, but I'd be all for an edition or two where someone else got to wear the big bad hat for a change.
>>64007815>Chorfs were in a barely playable state during 6thWhat a joke. Chorfs were really strong with their Earthshakers, blunderbusses, 30pts two-per-slot bolt throwers and cheap hobgoblin speedbumps/redirectors, not to mention Chalice of No-magic-for-you.
Giant bodybuilder orcs > low test man-sized orcs
So I finally finished my regiment. I decided to go with a Tilean approach to this fella' as a sort of homage to Braganza's Besiegers.
>>64008257And here're some crappy pictures of the whole regiment.
>>64008229my orcs > your orcs
>>64008283>furry p'orc shitDisgusting.
>>64008279They look great. What unit do they represent tho? Marauder or warrior of chaos?
>>64008329Thanks mate. They're Warriors of Chaos.
>>64007647>>64007673I'll go for Ogres as well. Shit aesthetic of fat 10 foot tall mongolians, wasted potential with how the expanded that part of the darklands and mountains of mourn.
>>64008448Granted it's kinda lame that they own the entire mountain chain they live on but besides that I absolutely adore them. The aesthetics are excellent imo. I mean just look at those bad guys tackling horses.
>>64008448I kinda wish there was a small 'gag' army for halflings that incorporated them as heavy infantry. The shorties themselves could use slingers, crannequin-actioned crossbows, dog riders, and pikes. And the hot pot, of course!
>>64007366Superior Gorfang coming through.
Can't wait til ogres and chorfs are playable in TWW3 and completely shit all over the currently OP elf factions
>>64008257Quite a good finish>>64008279And now to kick ass and take names
>>64007647Several.Give Dark Elves more depth and variety than just evil spiky slavers.Give Ogres more depth and variety than just fat neanderthals.Split Lizardmen back into dinosaur men and frogmen.Rework Chaos from grounds up. Split it into Norscans (with non-evil options; also mammoths and beastmen - maybe also options for southern nigger barbarians and beasts), Chaos Wastes (mutants, chosen, daemons, god-specific beastmen) and Southern Followers (imperial cultists, beastmen from Bretonnia/Empire's forests, Chaos Ogres, shit like that).
>>64008468Their aesthetic came through a LOT better in the art than in many of the miniatures which is a big negative for me.I really like some of the fully helmeted ones and the more creative maneaters, and certainly don't dislike the "mongolianish"? style but the plastics for sure didn't look "strong fat" they just looked fat fat and their general sculpt is one I don't care for.It is that on top of the fact they basically wiped out 2 great potential other armies/allied factions in Hobgoblins and Old World Ogre Mercenaries which really turned me against Kingdoms.
>>64007647I would make greenskins less of an NPC faction.
>>64008229Orc boys are S3.
>>64008448>>64008468Darklands and Mountains of Mourn are completely wasted potential. They could fit a whole lot of Greenskin tribes, Chaos Dwarf realms, Dwarf holds, small human kingdoms, Ogre tribes, maybe a lost High Elf colony, Wood Elf forest or a hidden Dark Elf port there.
>>64008730so are dwarfs. your point?
>>64008468>>64008699say what you will, I kinda like Mantic Ogres, even though they are kinda just brown warcraft orcs scaled up>>64008730muscle size don't mean muchstrongest people don't have bodybuilder physiqueyou can be pretty lean-looking, but be stronger than an average bodybuilder
>>64008678There has always been a fair bit of potential for expanding the Norscans and they could easily have covered the varying degree of Chaos influence within a single book based on if your army had a Chaos worshiping lord or wizard in it.
>>64008740We could find out about that Hobgoblin Empire alluded to in the fluff for Oglah Khan's Wolfboyz and the special character Ghazak Khan from the Dogs of War.
>>64008800>muscle size don't mean much>you can be pretty lean-looking, but be stronger than an average bodybuilderRiiiight.>pic related: 6'3" 420lbs
>>64008730They have Toughness 4 to represent their large size, muscle mass, bone structure, and tendency to ignore pain.Orcs are quite stronger physically than humans, but in combat that isn't represented by such a big difference in straight up power. Their capacity to wield ridiculously large weapons does grant them a +1 to str on the first turn of a combat, which again works in making them generally stronger than humans without quite making it into the next bracket.Dwarfs are also stronger than humans and elves as a general rule, but also fall into the STR 3 template.
>>64008823Could also have options for Imperial General or something, to represent Nordland or even Middenland or Kislev
>>64008854I see your real-life ogre and raise you Bruce Lee
>>64009009How is Bruce Lee relevant? He's nowhere near as strong as Eddie Hall. A better fighter? Deadlier? Sure, but that's not what we were talking about.
>>64008800While not my preferred style, I like me the older warhammer ogres, there is certainly a place for that kind of style too in when it comes to fantasy in general. I know it's mostly the red/brown colour but makes me think of the Oni a lot.
>>64008940>Dwarfs are also stronger than humans and elves as a general rule, but also fall into the STR 3 template.Humans and Elves have better leverage due to long limbs though. Hitting UP instead of down or horizontally also reduces force of impact. So Dwarfs can have S4 muscles but will still be hitting on S3.
>>64008854Biceps are fairly useless. Maybe they good for the kind of lifting bodybuilders do, but its triceps that you use for fighting, climbing, stuff that you need to be strong for outside of bodybuilder wankfests. Look at rock climbers. They can lift themselves on fingertips, grasp onto rock with just fingers in a leap, etc, and take care not gain useless muscle mass.
>>64009073seems like we found a fat unatheltic dumbass who doesn't know shit about basic muscle function but will carry on as if he's an expert anyways
>>64009076hm, I still haven't watched neither Shad's nor Skall's videos on the matter. But this comment raises interesting points.
>>64008854You do realise you actually backed up his point?That is a STRONGMAN not a BODYBUILDER. Strongmen generally speaking are the extreme of "useable in every day life" type muscles, while bodybuilders have "show muscles".
>>64009108>">you can be pretty lean-looking, but be stronger than an average bodybuilder">Eddie Hall>lean
>>64009103You shouldn't watch Shad or Skall, desu. Medieval/fantasy nerds like them think they know everything about everything and always overplay their hands in topics like this, revealing they've probably never touched a weight in their lives.If you want a respectable and less-goony medievalist/HEMA nerd to watch, check out scholagladiatoria.
>>64009201Skall makes great sword reviews though and Shad is an expert on castles. Other than that they do have interesting opinions and point of views even when they are wrong.But yeah, I did realize scholagladiatoria is awesome when I compared Matt's and Skall's reviews of Tower of Joy fight, where Skall was nitpicky and kinda right in an informed amateur sort of way, and Matt provided a lot of insight into more obscure but still practical fencing techniques (i.e. dual-wielding was practiced and can indeed be useful against multiple opponents, as is sword twirling as it kinda helps you keep multiple opponents' attention).
>>64009201To be fair, Skall always presents himself as a hobbyist, not a professional. You may be thinking of that twat lindybeige. Scholagladitoria is a good rec though.
>>64009076>raven & starfire profile pictureAnd yeah, this person makes a great point.
>>64009316Fuck you, Lindybeige is awesome, even though he's often wrong. I admire a guy who has a truly Renaissance man range of interest and actually makes armour and stuff himself - as a matter of fact I'm learning to work with mastic as we speak, which I picked up from his videos. Also I really like his insight into skirmishing as opposed to dueling.Problem with HEMA youtubers is that you have to realize which topics from which youtuber you have to take with a load of salt.
>>64007243Black Tree sell the old Harlequin minis range which is pretty close. Be a bit careful with that company though, sometimes they take fucking forever to ship stuff.
>>64009450Yeah, that's always a shame. I always tell people to email ahead before they make an order to see if what you want is waiting for a new shipment. You always get your stuff in the end, but you'll bloody well wait if there isn't stock at hand.
>>64009407I have no problem with the man's hobbies and he can be interesting and engaging, my beef is with his arrogance and the way he presents himself as an expert. I can't recall any time he's recanted a major error, either - though that doesn't mean it hasn't happened, admittedly.
>>64009510Well, he's openly British and takes care to mention that in every video, what did you expect? Scholagladiatoria defending French actually rubbed me the wrong way - even though all he said was correct and right, its not something for a British person to say if they have any patriotism and self-respect.
>>64009510FYI, this anon >>64009407 is not me here: >>64009201
>>64009032Dwarfs have considerably longer arms than normal, as long as humans.But thats beside the point. S values are more like ranges. Everything stronger or weaker with minimal differences is grouped in the same S range.S3 is everything from tough goblins, sinewy elves and average humans to orcs and dwarfs.S4 ranges fron very strong and greatly above average humans/dwarves/elves to trolls and minotaurs
>>64009498>GW make a pretty good and popular - at least at the start - MMO.>MMO is full of new characters, some of which are quite interesting>never make models for them because fuck video gamesits such a shame that GW were as big idiots when it came to video games as they are now
>>64009567They made a model of Grumlok and Gazbag the greenskin faction leaderfor the collectors edition of the game(I bought that one, the cmoic and art book were awesome). They should have totally done a one off set of adventurers for order and destruction, like what they did for the Gotrek and Felix characters.
>>64009543>Scholagladiatoria defending French actually rubbed me the wrong wayWhy? I'd rather have a worthy foe.
>>64009656Zulu are worthy foes. Boers are worthy foes. American revolutionaries are worthy foes. Russians (in Crimean War) are worthy foes. Germans are very worthy foes. French are french.
>>64009567>>64009655Here we go, here's a pic I took of mine still in the blister. Keep meaning to open it and get him painted, but I just bring myself to do it. GW didn't even put out some rules for him, what a shame.
>>64009655>collectors editionWhich is why they don't count, too limited to really cash in on. They could've and should've made normally-available models for use in WHFB.And its same with Total War. Squatting models of in-game factions, squatting models of Legendary Lords that people get attached to is beyond stupid. Heck, I know a guy who doesn't play tabletops but would buy Settra's mini just to put on his shelf.And that they didn't make minis for Vampire Coast units - which are admittedly a bit over the top and would fit in AoS perfectly - is mind-boggling.
>>64009543>Scholagladiatoria defending French actually rubbed me the wrong wayYou are a retard. Neither british nor french anon speaking, but he got my eternal respect for how he rightfully pointed out what a strong military nation France actually was and still is.
>>64009510>my beef is with his arrogance and the way he presents himself as an expert.People say this all the time but I've never really understood it.I wonder if it's a cultural difference or something - his 'arrogance' is a joke. He plays up the British patriotism for humourous effect.I don't even think he presents himself as an expert, really. I just checked his latest video to make sure and at the beginning he explicitly says that he was a student of evolutionary psychology at one point but that was a long time ago and he's not up to date with the latest research.
>>64008940Humans are +1S with halberds even after the first turn.
>>64009779>And that they didn't make minis for Vampire Coast units - which are admittedly a bit over the top and would fit in AoS perfectly - is mind-boggling.GW still cared about the modeling aspect of the hobby back then. You were supposed to make your own zombie pirates using Empire militia and zombies.
>>64010538I meant TWWH Vampire Coast
>>64002615yup, gj. I found them worth the read, and I don't even like vampires.
>>64010538Was there ever a rotting leviathan model made in the early days?
>>64010812No, but the rotting leviathan is not any single type of monster but the corpse of any type of sea monster. Just using a zombie dragon without wings works fine.
We /vg/ now
>>64011033These threads have been very /tg/ lately. This is nowhere near /vg/ compared to the last year.
>>64011033To a certain extent, yes, as much as Total War General on /vg/ is a bit /tg/ ever since TWWH hit. Its okay.
I need ideas for "skaven tunnel appears!" markers.One I've made is a Skaven breaking through a grate in a sewer pipe. Another is a Skaven climbing from between loose tiles. I need at least 2 more.(its mostly for skirmish, so they gotta be small)
>>64011033Quit trying to sabotage the thread, smeghead.>>64011096Out of a walk-on basement. Pic related.
>>64011166Aha, good idea! And easy to make!One more to go.
>>64011096trap door with half a skaven climbing through, and one of those Warpgrinders (weapon teams) breaking through the soil
>>64011096An earthen hole with 3 skaven snouts smooshed together and poking out of the dirt.
>>64010885Its strange since Rob Hawkins modeled quite a few of the Vampire Coast troops.
>>64011191This is cheating, but a basement window?
>>64009201>>64009407Check out thegnthrand. They actually lift weights and test weapons on each other with armour on. Their early videos are the best ones
>>64012514yeah, I'm aware of him, Metatron, and othersI currently am a bit overwhelmed with just amount of interesting stuff on Shad's, Skall's, Lloyd's and Matt's channels. Right or wrong, I have to watch all they have, dammit.
Help me out lads, I've recently got hooked on total war and while I don't have anyone to even consider playing minis with, I became a real fan of the dawi. What's some good fluff dealing with dorfs?
>>64013836WFRP 1e's Dwarfs: Stone and Steel. It's all mostly canon still, too, except the bit about dwarf wizards.Gotrek & Felix, too, but only the first two authors. First one if you're a real purist.
>>64013894I'm really green with this stuff but considering my experience with comics and MtG, I don't really care about lore purity if the story's good (though it becomes a real issue if it's bad). I'll check those out, thx, I even modded Gotrek & Felix in 1 but ended up never recruiting them since I started playing Mortal Empires.The Book of Grudges is the best implementation of autism as a game mechanic ever.
>>64013945You might also ask for people to dump dwarf-related comics. There's a good few of those.
>>64013980I've seen that panel on a thread on /v/ a few days, asked for sauce but I believe by that point the thread was already autosaging and no one never answered me.
>>64008800>muscle size don't mean much>strongest people don't have bodybuilder physique>you can be pretty lean-looking, but be stronger than an average bodybuilderlies! if such was the case weight classes would exist.
>>64014042It gets dumped here semi-frequently. I don't have it on my drive but it's about a comic where a dwarf goes to court for murdering elves, and he reasons since a different group of elves stole his mine, killing any elf is fine since he'll eventually run out of elves and have killed the thieves.It really makes the sergeant think.
>>64013836The book about the war of vengeance is pretty cool
>>64014089>>64013836I might also add that C.L. Werner is probably the only BL writer that's actually good at his job. One proof of this is the fact that /tg/ almost never talks about him, and when they do, it's never in a bad way
for more dawi-nism, you can also read the "grudgelore" book from the mega
>>64014119His stuff is frequently recommended, in fact. Brunner in particular, but Matthias Thulmann too.I always wonder if he was miffed GW killed off Brunner in a nuthin personnel way to try (and once again fail) to make Archaon the Hedgehog seem cool. Penned by that fuckwagon Reynolds, by the way.
>>64014066Yeah, i've seen the reasoning and by the end of it I could actually feel Grimnir's beard growing inside of me and understood the need to slaughter wazzoks and knife years on a cosmic level.
>>64005745Gommer's a slag.
>>64008699>the plastics for sure didn't look "strong fat" they just looked fat fat and their general sculpt is one I don't care for.My opinion is that the base sculpt is decent but allows for a lot of customization/convertion which is what I'm all about.>they basically wiped out 2 great potential other armies/allied factions in Hobgoblins and Old World Ogre Mercenaries.How do you argue that?I can kinda see the latter on but one could just as well argue that the armybook allows for just such an army.
>>64014199Who's your favorite special character?
>>64009024I too liked the older ogre style. However I think that the Ogre Kingdom ogres were a prudent way to distinguish the species into its own thing. Fat mongolian middlemen on the silk road is a good theme imo.
>>64015172Then the deathblow strikes...
>>64015161I mean it doesn't really matter because Fantasy got ended but by adding a "super new original type of greenskin" instead of using Hobgoblins who were already in that area of the World in the older lore put a nail in Hobs ever getting expanded on.For the Mercenary side entirely new ranges were something that rarely happened, by choosing to pull the trigger on Ogre Kingdoms there was no chance of Dogs of War/Mercenaries which could have had a strong element of Ogres and a pure Ogre sub-army.
I'm starting an escalation league with some friends. Which edition should we play? (Current players are Ogres, Skaven & High Elves)
>>64015311I feel that your arguments is somewhat flawed. First off Hobgoblins have a completely different niche than gnoblars and they don't even inhabit the same general area of the world.Secondly there is nothing intrinsic about Ogre Kingdoms that means that a Dogs of War army couldn't have been released down the line if fantasy had a different outcome. Finally, there's is nothing about a Dogs of War army that precludes Ogres just because there already exists an all Ogre army. If WoC can have Ogres there is no reason to think DoW couldn't.
>>64008448>>64008468>>64008740>>64008850>>64015161>>64015311Not sure how much could have been expanded with Hobgoblins, be it in units or lore.HOW a Hobgoblin book would be? What kinds of units could ot have? How do you think the empire works?
>>64015216It varies quite a bit, honestly. Brunner's on the list. I like both Black Princes (Gashnag and the dark elf that appears in the Brunner novella). Drachenfels is fun. Malus Darkblade and Hauclir are also great.
>>64015457Hobgobs should just be a mercenary option. We know they'll sell their swords to humies and dwarfs. Enough so that even other greenskins consider them a bit deranged.
>>64015457I would reckon that a hobgoblin army would take a lot of inspiration from the historical mongols and other steppe nomads. I.e lots of swift cavalry archers, lancers with varying degrees of armour and some kind of meatshield consisting of the slaves/unmounted hobgoblins. Since this is the Warhammer World I would suspect that they would also have access to Giants and I could also see gargantuan wolfs with howdahs strapped to their back which would be filled with hobgoblin archers.The theme of the army would be hit and run.
>>64015596Sounds a bit plain.To be more interesting Hobgoblins would need to have more to them than just reskin mongols. Even ogres are at least living tanks that carry giant canons and have a religion that revolves around eating, and a slave caste of comedy reliefs. Hobgobos are just mongols.
>>64015915>Hobgobos are just mongols.Not really. They're a steppe people with historical connections to a sedentary slaver society (i.e Chaos Dwarfs) which causes them to be hated by their closest related species (Greenskins).And even if they were "only mongols" that's a unique and interesting theme to warrant an army all by its own.
>>64015915Also, what about it do you consider plain?
>>64015311> A company that sells boxes of affordable, simple but solid models like these.Could it work today?
>>64008740There are already Dwarf mines fleshed out there - some holds that got fucked over by Ogres. Just bring those back, you already have some solid Dwarf areas. Maybe have some human kingdoms clustered around them to, because relative safety in numbers. You could flesh them out as either being the frontier of Cathayan kingdoms, or being the primordial peoples from which the people of the Empire came from - if I remember right humans only wandered into the Old World from the east. Greenskin tribes are easy to stick in anywhere, there are woods that can be home to both Beastmen and Wood Elves. A secret Dark Elf port for raiding the southern seas would be fantastic, like one of the High Elf colonies.This doesn't even have to hurt the Ogres since most of their lore has them going nomadic and fucking off to travel the rest of the world anyway. You could just say the Mountains of Mourn is their ancient homeland and they sometimes return there.I am amazingly mad by the mere concept of Pigbarter, because even though it's amusing it's also just...there. Why? Because well I guess they need a town there, but there's no logical reason for it to exist beyond needing a trade stop. And it's a pretty shitty town to stop at. If we had actual kingdoms there that'd be a lot better.
>>640153616th of course
>>64015457>>64015915>>64016043Honestly, even if hated by everyone, i would'ne put Hobgoblins in as an army on their own. They should be part of a Chaos Dwarfs roster, with a Dogs of War Unit. Much like Hordes of chaos, dependingon your army general, you can make an army with either Chaos dwarfs units being core or Hobgoblin ones
>>64015480Those aren't special characters. Non-playing secondary confirmed. This just proves that actual Warhammer fans don't hate Archaon, just newfags who came here from /vg/.
>>64016655Yes, it does. Oathmark is a good example. This is an old image. They've since released the goblin box, along with elves and human infantry.
>>64017247If you want playables, Carnac, probably Lietpold the Black. But mostly just because he's a real Border Prince's Border Prince.
>>64017372>goblin infantry>it's actually Mordor Orcs
>>64007961I want to let her languish in her own lust long enough to make the lewd acts all the better.Followed of course by a nice feeding.
>>64009762I'm on the same boat, have the same mini from WAR and the Rook one from the Demigod CE mini. I would like to collect GS and Lizardmen but I'm third world SA, as if the hobby wasn't expensive enough already.
>>64017596In LotR Goblins and Orcs are basically the same thing so
>>64017596Nah, Oathmark goblins are more like early D&D orcs. If you want LotR orcs then go look at Wargames Factory orcs, they're quite literally ripped straight from Angus McBride's artwork and they're sold through Warlord Games now.
>>64017619you're gonna get dried out
>>64008229How can one person be so wrong?The biggest and meanest are the bosses. The rest are man-sized, including the big-but-not-mean-enuff. The small or timid are slaves.
>>64017638Slow and steady, just buy a kit a month and paint it before buying another.
>>64017247>people who actually care about the setting and characters hate Archaon>people who "played the game" (didn't buy a product in 10 years) like Archaon('s rules)Certainly provokes consideration
>>64017935>just buy a kit a month and paint it before buying another>tfw not done with my units and my 3 boxes of arabs get here next weekIs it autism or addiction?
>>64018015You're like those people who call themselves big fans of video games they watched other people play on Youtube/Twitch, your opinion is completely worthless.
>>64016148>And even if they were "only mongols" that's a unique and interesting theme to warrant an army all by its own.But there are already Ungols.>>64016164>what about it do you consider plain?I'd say they look too mundane,apart from riding wolfs, it would be cool of their society was more fleshed out and they had a woder range of units.The hobgoblin lands are enormous,they could have very distincts units vased on where they come from, like siege weapons from eastern slaves, "cyborgs" hobgoblins augumented by chaos dwarfs in the west, shaman shapeshifters that can turn into wolfs, or even wolf centaurs.
>>64018256>>64018399Shoo shoo, smeghead, shoo shoo.
>>64009567>GW make a pretty good and popular - at least at the start - MMO.Lot's not get carried away. It was gameplay sabotaged by WoW.
>>64007647Delete the lizardmemes.
>>64018693I've never played AoS so you can fuck off back to ribbit.
>>64018709I was playing WoW at the time and many people in our guild left to play WAR. Despite the fact being rip off of WoW, it was pretty fun and appealing at start.
>>64018742Imagine coming to another thread just to shitpost.
We seriously need to find a way to kick all the Total War fags back to /vg/.
>>64018797shut up chaosrager
These fucking TWfags only found out about the game because of the video game and now they're mad that they didn't get to play it while it was still alive. Actual Warhammer fans are happy that GW killed the game because the fluff was complete shit in the 8th edition and GW can't write rules anymore, just look at Age of Sigmar and 40k. At least now we still have good memories of the game and we can play older editions just fine. Total War fags have no memories of Warhammer when it was alive so they're all really butthurt and they project those feelings on Archaon whose fluff they only know from wikis that don't separate pre-7th edition fluff from the shitty fluff that came later. Everytime they have something bad to say about Archaon's fluff they cite the Black Library novels released in 2014 and 2015, even though in the next breath they will say that the End Times is not canon. What does canon matter to them anyway? The only fluff they know is from Total War, Warhammer wiki and Archwarhammer. I can't wait until the Chinese Total War is released and these people move on and we can have our general back.
>>64018984Archaon was garbage in 6th, too, Carnac.
>>64002987Do you suppose orcs know how to make bacon?
>>64018984Neck yourself, grognard. Archaon has always been garbage and the only good thing to ever come from him was GW being forced to write in Grimgor beating their super special OC.
>pleasant thread that is a mix of memes, models, media, and idea brainstorming for the RPG>out of nowhere, an attempt to start a flame warHmmmmm...
>>64019063It's Carnac, you can tell by his cute word no one else uses.But people keep fucking biting.
>>64007647Warriors Of Chaos.The cancer of modern Warhammer stems from them. Stick to Daemons and Beastmen for Chaos.
>>64009567GW didn't even make models for shit that was made up just for their army books.Fuck, when TWW came out they made a page out of the models still present in the game. They didn't put most of them there though.
>>64015915I disagree.The further Warhammer got from historicals, the worse it got. Pic related is what happen when you finish purging the expies or try too hard to be "unique".
>>64020613Were Halflings still bros with tree folk in 8e? Seems like the Wutelgi lore got too grimderp for it.
>>64020655>you cannot handle my potions got, they are too strong for a troll much less a goblin!
>>64020655For all the jank there, that evil sun mask is pretty great.
>>64020811Its a shame, some of these have very nice things but are way too fucking noisy visually. Like the one on the bottom in the middle. The mount is neat, the staff is neat, the scared pose looking at the bat mushroom is neat, but when you combine it all together you have way too much going on for a single 28mm mini.
>>64021133There's a lot of "nice touches," but it's all so busy that every neat little thing gets drowned out by all the other neat little things. Still, they're quite good compared to everything else for AoS.
>>64021165We made the same post.>>64021176Cheers, anon.
>>64020655I think I made it better.
>>64020582>Daemons, the faction that put the first nail in the coffin of Warhammer Fantasy
>>64021675Weren't Daemons the first actual lore for Warhammer?
>>64021703It was all downhill from there.
>>64020655these models are unironically good, if a little busy, with all the mushroom nonsense and snotlings running about
Finished building 20 more skeleton archers for my Tomb Kings. Going to start building some of my horsemen and some more chariots.
is there any bonus to parrying if you're dual-wielding weapons that can parry in mordheim? I have just enough points to upgrade a normal axe to a dwarf axe on a slayer, but I could probably allocate the points elsewhere if there's no point to it
>>64023298If I recall correctly, you'd get a re-roll to parries if you had a parrying weapon and a buckler equipped. Dwarfs could get some real shenanigans going with a pair of dwarf axes, which as a pair let the dwarf gain the parry re-roll, and the dwarf special skill Master of Blades, you could end up with two parry rolls plus a re-roll for both. It was great on a slayer paired with Step Aside from the combat skill tree.
>>64023461Excellent, thanks. It works the same way with a sword, right?
If someone wanted to get into WHFB now which edition should they play first? 6th or 8th?
>>64023244Hell, amazing to see a Tomb Kings army coming together.
>>64023525Yeah, sure does, though to lesser extent for the dwarfs, since the Dwarf Axe was to make up for the lack of buckler in their equipment list.
>>64023579I'm expanding mine, used to use light cav for my ranged support, now I'm getting the footsloggers built after all these years. Got another 20 I bought off someone else, but they're all multibased to some MDF rectangles. I think he was making a KoW army. Got some Empire stuff to build as well, but need to gather more parts.
>>64017372Those are some good looking dwarfs!
>>64018442>But there are already Ungols.They're not an army either.>it would be cool of their society was more fleshed out and they had a woder range of units.Well ofc that would happen if they were made into an actual army.
>>6401531110 finely detailed plastic models
>>64023549I'd take a look at what your local scene plays before deciding.
What size bases are beastmen infantry on?
>>64023586How would expert swordsman work with ferocious charge, assuming that the slayer has a sword? I've never really played before, so these mechanics are pretty foreign.
>>64024028Would work quite well, you'll have less chance to hit, but double the attacks and the sword re-rolls from expert swordsman I think will make up for it. Sounds like a nice combo, I think I'll give that a go on my next dwarf warband.
>>64024027Bestigors, Gors, Wargor/Beastlord/Shaman on 25mm, ungors on 20mm, Harpies on 20mms too.
>>64024088Excellent, I felt like I would really regret missing the rerolls from the dwarf axe combo. I'm doing a "what you see is what you get" thing with my initial dwarfs, so the items gear that the minis have are their equipment. My favorite slayer by far has an axe and sword, so that's why I'm so fixated on having the sword in the first place.Would the to-hit rerolls from swordmaster only apply to the two sword hits, or all of them?
>>640235496th edition or Kings of War, dependings on what plays in your area. 8th edition or t9a if you're unlucky.
>>64024187>so the items gear that the minis have are their equipmentThe items that are actually on the minis are the equipment that they get, my bad.
>>64024187Re-rolls for the sword attacks.>>64024140No worries.
>>64018070Adiction id say
>>64023244Groovy. What will the colour scheme be? Red and black?
>>64024379FOR THE RED AND BLACK
>>64024379Not sure, honestly. Repainting the whole army in a new scheme and I'm thinking of a black, off-white, and purple thing.
>>64007647>BretoniaThe most pointless faction in the whole setting. If anything I would push the "humans larping as high elves" aspect instead of "lol fantasy medieval Frence but even more shit." Also other dieties have more influence on Bretonia. To the point of elven gods being whorship and them turning Bretonian peasants int their playground.
>>64024395NAYI THINK NOT
>>64019314Only chaosrager calls everyone who likes Archaon and Chaos Carnac, because he has no actual arguments because he doesn't know the setting, only that there's a boogeyman called Carnac.
>>64016873I had an idea of portal wormhole opening between Reinkland and Dark lands. It cannot been closed and it is located close to hearth of the Empire. So, Emps send on the other side soldier and colonist to fortify the othe end and mine some ore. The same can work for Wood elves with world roots.
>>64024514Bretonnians never larped as high elves tho
Would my fellow Nurgle fans be so kind as to post their Gorebeast Chariots or any nice versions (preferably but not necessarily Nurgle) they might have come across? I'm waiting for some ordered parts to arrivebefore I start converting mine and could use the inspiration.
>>64016873>>64008740No reason you couldn't do that now, no? It's not so detailed there's no room for anything else?
>>64020655despite the fact that I never liked WHFB greenskins (except for as a stuff to kill), these new Night Goblins are exactly what Night Goblins are supposed to beI actually had to resist starting a Night Goblin army when I saw them
>>64024856I was thinking about writing my own "9th edition" with both lore and rules, fixing stuff I personally don't like - purely for in-house use.I might actually do that and rewrite Dark Lands for my own liking.
I made some bretonnian archers, they're not that great but I'm sure they're going to do fine on the battlefield
>>64024633You don't need something as bizarre as a wormhole. Cathay and the Empire are connected by the silk road. Its only natural for the Empire to have established tradeposts, forts and small settlements along it to guard the trade route from hobgoblin attacks, chaos dwarfs, ogres, beastmen, common greenskins and bandits
>>64024919They look great enough
>>64024919These lads have seen some shit. Red head, Blondie in the helmet, and the tard in front of Redhead in particular.
>>64024919They definitely look good for tabletop.Those eyes are hilarious though.
>>64024027>>64024107>>64024140Careful. What Edition are you playing cause for 6th and 7th edition Ungor were on 25mm bases.
>>64025090I must be mixing things up then, you're right, 6th/7th was 25mm, 8th put them in a separate box and base size.
What's the solution for Chaoragers?
>>64025137Whats the problem with chaosragers?
>>64025109I think technically they went onto 20mm right at the very end of 7th edition but that army book got released like a month before 8th hit.
>>64025090Seems strange that beastmen would be on the same bases as chaos warriors.But then again what do i know, all my models are on 20mm bases
>>64025143Annoying. I mean really annoying. Makes talking about anything Chaos hard.
>>64025236Saurus and orcs are on 25s too. They were big guys.
>>64007647Chaos as a whole. The first step would be to bring back the fucking crazy, legitimately chaotic aspects of it that were in the Realm of Chaos books. The next would be to divide it into two main groups: cultists and Northlanders.Northlanders would be more about the different peoples to the north, all unified by their worship of the dark gods. Rather than simply being "evil barbarians, weird animals, and big bad armored dudes that dominate the entire setting", there'd be more focus on individual Norscan societies; Fimir tribes, fallen norse Dwarf holds (there actually are northern Chorfs, believe it or not), and human villages/encampments. While the region as a whole would more or less share the same pantheon of gods, each clan has their own customs and traditions. A community may have a single shaman or holy man, but wielders of devastatingly powerful chaotic magic would be incredibly rare. They see chaos more as a genuine way of life, rather than using it for personal gain.Cultists would be about old-worlders that see chaos as a means to their desires. They're much more civilized than the savages to the north, as they're just normal people that have succumbed to the temptations of chaos. They'd practice chaos in a more scholarly and discreet fashion and focus more on the arcane and esoteric.Beastmen could belong to both groups, as both regions have their fair share of them.
Its canon that there are norscan tribes that venerate "southern" deities, such ad Ulric and Manaan. An order of the church of Ulric is located in Norsca. Does this mean that norscans can be converted to civilised worship? Does this mean that chaos is not actually that inescapable?
>>64025390Also, daemons and mutants would be constant as well, albeit they'd show up through different means. For Northlanders, they'd arrive through pre-battle blessings, while cultists may summon daemons through dark incantations or rituals. Mutation would pretty much stay the same as it is now; favored (or disliked) Northlanders would receive mutations as rewards (or punishments) for their deeds. Cultists would be more likely to obtain them through avid practice of chaos magic.
>>64025236It actually made even more sense with the older (5th and earlier) Beastmen back when they used to be toughness 4 and have 2 wounds each.
>>64025256What would you talk about, concerning chaos?
>>64025432Gors still have T4 in 6thDwarfs have T4 as a rule but they still are on 20mm
>>64025426You can live in Norsca without being converted to chaos. There's several normal human settlements and dwarven holds on the southern end of Norsca that have the Norse viking culture, just minus the chaos part.
>>64025454There is also a Norscan fron the tribe of Urslo (werebears) that studies poetry in Nuln.This means that southern and northern cultures are not so cut and dry, but individuals or groups of Norscans can and will travel south and have dealings with the Empire.All of this makes me think that norscans are not that chaotic as common lore depicts them, and the hold of the chaos gods on their souls is weaker than one may think
>>64025435A lot of things. Like how come this is the only world of the thousand worlds within the Old One Empire to survive the coming of Chaos.
>>64025489There are no other worlds and this question is moot. There may be other worlds beyond the realm of chaos, but it does't matter in the contest of discussing wfb. Do you want to talk about something else?
>>64025445Dwarfs are also 5' tall and under.
>>64025522But they are also very THICC
>>64024919>When you and your peasant friends see the enemy hydra charge straight towards youAlso, the are nicely painted
How would you justify factions not having stone throwers or bolt throwers in regular battles, but having them in siege scenarios? They either have the technology or not, no?
>>64026108Need further explanation. Why would mot fielding something be a sign of lacking that something?
Rolled 1 (1d6)Blood Bowl 2 team choose:1. Chaos2. Nurgle3. Orcs4. Norse5. Wood Elves6. >Halflings
>>64026275I allow your choice only if you go the fun way and field the minotaur
>>64020655>Chaos GoblinsI like them, their weirdness reminds me of the old Chaos Champions. Are they a separate set I can get without getting 200 random mooks in the same box?
>>64025518There are. The Realm of Chaos book lore says the WHFB world is one of the thousands worlds within the empire of the Slaan. When the Chaos disaster struck the gates on those worlds all exploded and unleashed Chaos on them. WHFB survived while many others were destroyed. What makes that world special?
Why Knights of Bretonnia wear armour? Shouldn't they trust into chivalry and blessings of the Lady to protect them? Wearing armour is like taking a leap of faith onto a trampoline for them.
>>64020582Or make warriors a troop choice rather than an entire fucking army. Makes their elite and allegedly rare nature more believable.
>>64020655The top two are okay. They remind me a lot of WoW in general, though.
>>64026538Warhammer has always been about us here saving our arses from demons/vampires/greenskins, not high fantasy adventure across the multiverse. While other words probably exist and some of them might resits Chaos too, linking them with Warhammer wouldn't be good for the game.
>>64020655Fuck, top right one reminds me of those little fucking midgets in Diablo II Act 3, which breathe fire at you and raise killed midgets from the dead. Ugh.
>>64026575Actually, it would have been a good way to expand the setting. Linking at least one alien world to the WHFB world via gate. You know, like Azeroth and Outlands in WoW.
>>64026699It works in WoW, where everyone is great hero and pigeons shit magic in the streets.Warhammer is generally about peasants and rat-catchers and random mercs and state troopers facing unspeakable horrors that come onto their turf and kick those horrors in the balls. Multiverse doesn't work well from that perspective.Warhammer is still plenty big and has a whole lot of unexplored lands, it doesn't need other worlds to expand. Minor demiplanes like Galleon's Graveyard miiiiight work, but its still too Warcraft-y for my liking.
What are you guys current working on?
>>64026854I myself just finished my first session of painting my Marauders of Nurgle, who are based on that lovely Adrian Smith artwork. For once assembly painting wasn't completely unbearable even though those twelve robes took something like 2 and a half hours to paint red. Hopefully however things like that will take go faster with a bit of practice.
>>64026854Bunch of minor scenery and objective markers.Right at the moment its wyrdstone markers for Mordheim
>>64026854Bretonnian, tomb kings and dark elves armiesAfter that, I'd like to repaint my skaven, and finish my flagellant
>>64026752Someone post the official art featuring floating battle castles!
Has anybody tried to rank the new goblins kits at all?
>>64027203its one things facing daemons, floating castles and lightning-spitting hamster wheels of DOOM on the battlefield, its another thing to travel to different worlds.Not to mention that flying towers, doomwheels and greater daemons are exceptionally rare, lorewise. They don't make the setting like WoW, where such things would be at every corner.
>>64009498Age of reckoning was the fucking shit
>>64027374it was fun
>>64005296>33 euros for 5 modelsOld GW aesthetic, new GW prices
>>64027985Anyone who buys those for rank and file games needs to be slapped. They're for skirmish.
>>64026908Will the edge of the cloak have a check pattern?
>>64018984>Actual Warhammer fans are happy that GW killed the gameOpinion discarded
>>64024625Go. away. carnac.
>>64028142That's...not a justification.
>>64009498>tfw some dark elven thot keeps making attempts to murder and sexual advances at you, and you're not sure which one is ironic
>>64028142hmm, naughty slapped or sexy slapped?
>>64025426>>64025454>>64025473Norscans are pretty simple, they'll worship a god if they think it will prove advantageous or help them in some way. Khorne is powerful and chaos is plain to see in the north so obviously they'll worship him for help in battle,but they'll worship taal for help in hunting or ulric in the winter. They won't worship southern gods of civilisation and trading but they'll worship a god that helps them in their tribal life.
>>64028291Of course it is, they're a niche company and the people who'll be buying them will only be doing so in small quantities. I think given this, they're pretty well priced.
This is my Skryre Plague Priest.I need an idea what to put on his staff as a staffhead.Yes, I am aware how awesome my lighting conditions are, no need to point that out.
>>64028315>not sure which one is ironicknowing Dark Elfs, probably neither
>>64028549> Starts tap-dancing.
Do you ever just wake up some days and thank fuck that Fantasy will never be ruined like 40K?
Migrate when ready my fellow firebellies. >>64028627>>64028627>>64028627
>>64028601The good thing about AoS is that it makes Fantasy immune to shit like this
>>64028648My goal is to have the complete collection of rule and source books for 1st to 8th edition. Preferably chronologically sorted in my study bookshelf. Every edition can be appreciated in some way.
>>64024514The larping thing is just a joke on how similar Bret knights seem to Silver Helms. There's not really any connection there.
>>64026538Even if there are, it would' t be good fir warhammer to assume a sort of interdimensional war vibe. We already have our invaders from beyond reality (demons) but warhammer has always been a rather grounded genre of fantasy. With absolutely insane characteristics like flying castles and giant iron golems, but still those are the exception, not the rule. Absurd places like castle Drachenfels work so well *because* they stanf out like sore eyes in an otherwise mundane, albeit slightly magical, setting.Age of sigmar is what you describe and nothing makes sense in it.But to answer your question, Grimnir, Caledor and Aenarion happened
>>64026854Getting queek ready for painting. Still not very good at it, but I'm trying.
>>64028549A slab of warpstone would both be thematically fitting aswell as look good.If you don't want that then perhaps the skull of some defeated nemesis and/or mentor?
>>64028648I wonder what's supposed to be the marketing target for this shit ?
>>64030282young teenagers, who their parents buy minis for
>>64030498I don't know much how teens are these days but when I started warhammer (I was 12) I was more attracted to pic related than this >>64028648
Me and 10~ other people down at our game club plays WHFB 7th edition.Would it be outside the realm of possibility to play this guy as a Skaven Vermin Lord? I really like the model and don't want to play Daemons..
>>64030691Teenagers are way too old for those, it seems like something you would get an 8 year old.Probably mostly for parents that are into Warhammer with young children.
>>64030498Young teenagers are not going anywhere near that. Pre-teens won't wan't it either, because they hate child protagonists.