The argument for legalization of these substances is always made and often they're pretty convincing. I'm just ignore those and ask the question why was it made illegal in the first place?
most drugs are illegal due to the previous opiod epidemic and it's horrible impact on society, we may see the same thing happen again now that drug consumption and legality is ramping up again
The secrets to the universe need to be guarded somehow. Can't have normies figuring it all out.
>>10961795Moral panic and the association between hippies and psychedelic drugs.
LSD trips last forever
>>10961798Wouldnt lsd be able to help with this?>>10961804>>10961811I've heard these general answers before and they always left me wanting more. If the grounds for it to be illegal in the first place are faulty, how is it still illegal? Can the truth be held forever?
>>10961804The illegality of it slightly increases the barrier of entry, coupled with the fact it is much less popular than other drugs like weed and cocaine. It means people who really want to get their hands on acid have to do more research than normal and need at least some functioning braincells to get it. I think this filtering is in itself a good thing, as LSD is not an everyman's drug. It can seriously make or break you.
>>10961817Would it not be better to have it be legal but used only in specific circumstances and environments? As it is now theres an extreme lack of discipline in the community and often times this produces people with God complexes (in the bad way) and dose is often not taken into account by a professionals. As it is, scientists cant even study it. What the fuck?
>>10961830>scientists cant even study it>he doesnt know
>>10961833Alright they can study it I misspoke but the barrier to studying it is stupidly high
>>10961795Normies and brainlets. They ruin everything.
druggies always want to believe their narcotic of choice is good for them instead of completely frying their brain, it's kind of sad but it's a waste of time to worry too much about the lower parts of society
>>10961838the U.S. government and its scientists know LSD all right
>>10961848Tell these anons about MK Ultra.>>10961847(you)
When I took LSD I was convinced I'm stuck looping the trip for eternity. Actual eternity, not a lifetime. I wouldnt recommend it to anyone, what if the real me is still looping and I'm a clone?
>>10961847>has not explored the depths of consciousnessLSD unironically saved me. I was broken before I tried it, and it gave me an experience that is entirely indescribable. This was well over a year ago, and since then I've done acid just one other time. I am now a much more open-minded and optimistic person, with actual goals and ambitions. Used correctly, it can have tremendously positive effects.
>>10961861you can find people claiming this about nearly every drug of choice. if you google weed cures and then any illness you can find reports of it doing that. it's just drug addict rationalization, but that's ok. some people just love narcotics. it's stupid to believe all their magical claims though.
>>10961852>Once Project MKUltra got underway in April 1953, experiments included administering LSD to mental patients, prisoners, drug addicts, and sex workers—"people who could not fight back," as one agency officer put it. In one case, they administered LSD to a mental patient in Kentucky for 174 days. They also administered LSD to CIA employees, military personnel, doctors, other government agents, and members of the general public to study their reactions. LSD and other drugs were often administered without the subject's knowledge or informed consent, a violation of the Nuremberg Code the U.S. had agreed to follow after World War II. The aim of this was to find drugs which would bring out deep confessions or wipe a subject's mind clean and program him or her as "a robot agent."
>>10961870>dude lets just trust these 1950s scientists they like, totally knew how good drugs were for you but covered it up man
>>10961795Because people generally don't know how to integrate these experiences. There aren't many things that can change person over night and we just don't know what to do with things like that. Once we have some sort of infrastructure to help people to integrate them then it will become legal.
>>10961867difference is that, objectively, drugs like LSD and psilocybin have much less potential for harm than other drugs like weed, alcohol, MDMA, meth etc.The effects are also completely different from most common drugs. Heroin makes you feel incredibly warm, relaxed and euphoric, cocaine makes you feel like you're on top of the world. Alcohol reduces anxiety etc.LSD can feel like you're traversing dimensions, exploring infinity and the nature of reality. It is seriously out of the realm of human experience. To compare it to the pleasurable and hedonistic effects of the aforementioned drugs, combined with their huge addiction potential--when psychedelics have virtually none--is absurd.
>>10961870I already know the history of mk ultra the point of me making the thread really was to start a psyop campaign to get people to ask themselves the question I posed. It's a crime against humanity to be prosecuting people for this and I want it to end now.>>10961877There is definitely a need to put these experiences into a certain context, as it is the main users are youth and party goers. Your point though is something of a catch 22 I have to say.
>>10961881LSD makes you feel like you have figured everything out
>>10961814>If the grounds for it to be illegal in the first place are faulty, how is it still illegal? Same reaaon cannabis is still illegal in many places and japanese porn is censored.Once a law is put into place, it doesn't disappear until some politician makes a conscious effort to change it.>Can the truth be held forever?Potentially, yes. In practice we are seeing a lot of the stigmas around psychedelic drugs disappearing, so change might be happening soon.
>>10961890And more than anything you would like to forget it all
>>10961887Juts look at weed as an example. People demonized it left and right and still more and more people started using it. Now we are approching a tipping point when more people are okay with it than not. And how can you keep something illegal when most people don't think it should be? Psychedelics are going to be used for therapy by professionals more and more. This way it will get into the mainstream mind as a not harmful thing but as a healing tool. Give it a few decades.
>>10961902except this has happened before during waves of drug use in society and eventually the pendulum swings back the other way to prohibition because people clue in on the extreme toll that drugs take on society
>>10961908Well there will be backlashes but sooner or later there will be a general agreement on to how to use these things properly. If something has a potential to better human kind we will find a way to make it work. Only hindrance to that would be some kind of a crisis that would set society back and we would have more urgent things to take care of. A substance that makes people question their existence would be seen as a threat.
>>10961929this is just druggie talk. druggies want to believe their drug of choice is illegal because it's going to awaken the population to all kinds of retarded social and political beliefs when the reality is they're illegal due to their physical harm and the harm they do to society. you can see the same half baked defenses of opium back in the day. it's just retarded drug addicts showing off their low IQ and drug addled minds.
>>10961798Opioid epidemic started after LSD was made illegal.
Why would you want to lie to your mother about smoking cigarettes although she evidently knows about it and why would you want to hate her Because of that? Why does this situation recurr to you again and again in different relations and why it's a reason to hate anybody in this world even if it wouldn't be a possible solution to change anything about it?
>>10961943>Opioid epidemic started after LSD was made illegal.I see you're completely ignorant of history
I think OP is on to something here. I for one am gonna join this psyop campaign. The truth will not be hidden forever and I will make sure I make as many people as I possibly can ask themselves this same question.
>>10961795What are these convincing arguments? I've heard none
>>10961993bro just do a ton of drugs and you'll understand, just trust me tee hee
>>10961993See >>10961881also >was made illegal on bullshit grounds>assumes we don't own our bodies and are not free to consume what we want to>repeated demonstrations showing enhanced creativity and actually helping people get off of addictive substancesAnd, again be cause I cant stress this point enough, why should someone else dictate what I should be allowed to put into my body if it has been proven not to do harm to others when countless substances that actually are legal cause cancer, addiction, and actually destroys families?
>>10961861I agree lsd isn't really that bad and can be beneficial but you act as if somehow doing acid makes you better than others, you can explore the depth of your mind without drugs
>>10961939Maybe we will see. But if something is beneficial for society it will eventually come into legality. Unjustified fear won't stop that.
>>10962022This is true but just an annoyance that is a consequence of people not having proper context given for the use of these substances.>>10961993First tell me why it should be illegal
>>10962037but I think acting like taking drugs makes you better than others causes bias against drugs
>>10962042Yeah its really annoying, but I dont think it can be helped. People do this sort of dick measuring with everything, drugs end up being just another medium for this.
>>10961798That would make sense if there was any relationship between drug use and a given drugs legality.>>10961795Societal values is why.
>>10961943>what is an opium den>what is the opium trade>what is human psychologyPeople crave escape above pretty much everything save survival and procreation.
>>109619931) People will consume drugs regardless of their legal status.2) There is no effective way to police their distribution and consumption without operating a police state.3) Legalization means new sources of tax revenue4) Legalization reduces your legal systems burden5) Legalization comes with standardization and regulation, which equates to safer consumption.6) Legalization creates jobs as you are now creating an industry7) Legalization reduces the rates of criminality and the influence of criminal groupsOff the top of my head, this took me 30 seconds to come up with and it is bore out by the statistical data of the last 100 years globally and the historical data going back 2 thousand years.
>>10962070basedre-legalize spiritual exploration, its fun
>>10962070>creates a society of drug addicts>productivity and quality of life plummetsbased retard who didn't learn from history
>>10962111>LSD is not addictive>people are already addicted to all legal drugs and can get addicted to anything>LSD helps people GET OFF addictive substances>ignoring all the great contributions from people more productive than you will ever be attributing their success or ideas to LSD
>>10961847LSD is probably safer than any other drug tho. I remember seeing in the news a history about some retards who mistook LSD for Cocaine and consumed like 1000x the normal dose. Most of them became comatose, but they all ended up waking up again. No lasting effects apparently.Alcohol and tobacco are much worse than that
>>10961795Why is it legal for these people to anally rape me and mutilate me?
>>10961795>Why is LSD illegal?because it makes you dangerous to others when under its influence
>>10961795because it isn't profitable for the police state to produce and sell./thread
>>10962231oh that explains why these same drugs are illegal all over the world, I guess nearly everywhere is a police state to druggie schizos
>>10962194This, unless you have a history of schizophrenia or something. Which is a very very small percentage. And in a regulated environment it would probably be more people micro-dosing it rather than people taking a large amount.>>10962199ikr? Is crypto-anarchism the only way?>>10962227source>>10962231it would be more profitable to (((them)))) if it was legal
>>10962227(You)>sourceI killed my dog when doing nbome, which is basically LSD but cheaper and the effect lasts about half as much (6 hours). Also it's way more toxic.I was absolutely convinced that the only way to escape my appartment (AKA: hell but pink) was to choke "LGBT Cerberus" to death, that being my wife's puddle.Imagine that same high but twice as long. You could fucking murder tens of people without even realizing it.
>>10961943Wrong. Opioid epidemic started when opioids flood the market. Banning is merely the correction to the problem.
>>10962276Nbome isn't "basically LSD."They don't even have the same backbone.
>>10962287same effect on your brain nigga
>>10962276>puddlepoodlesorry I'm doing salvia rn
>>10962280there have been several opiod epidemics, most of which happened before lsd ever existed
>>10962276Even if youre not larping, there are tons of drugs on the market that are legal right now that pose a significantly greater danger to the health and well being of everyone. >alcohol>tobacco>opiates>sugar>gambling>other behavioral addictions and not only that>you can literally buy guns and shoot other people but we still have gunsalso: >>10962287
>>10962291no, not at all. interacting with the same receptor =/= same effectthe only people who think this are ones who haven't had family lsd
>>10961891>Once a law is put into place, it doesn't disappear until some politician makes a conscious effort to change it.Sadly this. It's just like a new road. At first it's mostly free of signs, but then someone's cat gets run over and suddenly you have a speed limit, then some drunk retard drives into a wall and you have another sign and so on. Laws are put into place because>someone has to do somethingbut there's almost no effort to remove unnecessary shit.
>>10961858Nigger fuck off, time loops happen to everyone. You're just mentally weak if you can't enjoy it
>>10962323getting people to collectively ask why is this illegal is the first step to legislation because politicians will just cater to demands they see. And with a well coordinated psyop you can really shift consensus to accelerate re-legalization
>>10962354can we use code for this?
>>10962022>>10961867Honestly noWhat it does is it gives you a detechment from culture and society, it gives your mind a chance to decide what it ought to be and generally this involves looking at societally learned behaviors and their absurdity. Weed cures and shit like that involve taking it frequently. This isnt some addict rationalization since all thats suggested is a single trip.Also such experience is reachable sober and is generally what is historically known as a religious experience. Generally similar results too.
>>10962466>Also such experience is reachable soberOnly if you are autistic.
>>10962423Might be better off getting /pol/ to make a bunch of memes
>>10962515When has that ever accomplished anything other than making psychotic incels even more insane?
>>10962248I don't think it would be, which is why it's not. Here's why: >opening a quality lab to produce LCD for a market, paying the chemist a living wage and distribution would all be expensive and to a fairly small market>if the market Were larger for a drug that got you high for ~12 hours where you can't work is surely not profitable for (((them)))>a drug that makes you think abstractly about society as a whole certainly is not good for (((them)))
>>10962524>assuming they wont just create artificial scarcity and promote micro dosing
>>10961993It usually boils down to "i-it might be healthy and can help with muh depression." They then make the leap that you can't have a drug restricted to perscription only and should it be legal to buy from the local wal mart. You see this all the time with advocates of legalised cannabis use, parading it as a supposed miracle cure all. Morphine is a medically useful drug, but thats not to say it should be made readily available aswell should it?Lolbertarians need not apply.
I don't really get the arguments for drug legalisation, they don't seem to be coherent. If you're going to legalise heroin then you should be able to buy cyclophosphamide without a script right? I mean it's a drug that can be used in beneficial ways right?I don't really care about the issue but if you're going to push for "drugs" (psychadelic molecules) to be legalized you should be pushing for it to be legal to buy ANY prescription medication without a script. If you legalize LSD and heroin you should be able to walk into Wal-Mart and buy a gallon jug of cyanide. Druggies don't have a logical response because their brains are addled.
>>10961795>>10961798most things that make you happy are illegal because deep down the powers in control are trying to make you miserable. I don't think it's a conscious movement, but something that evolves naturally as a society to keep us moving forward. Everything has to be difficult and shitty for the people on the bottom in order for society to work and the people on top to maintain control.for example, prostitution is illegal. there's no good reason for it to be illegal except to keep the population of incels miserable. If we could just walk out and buy sex a lot less people would bother with getting GF's and people wouldn't have any reason to start careers since no family to provide for or reason to impress women with status. So society would eventually fail if prostitution were legal - look at the Romans or any ancient society where it was legal. I think collectively we as a society know that and usually just make up reasons for stuff to be illegal, and most of the time they're just excuses. In the case of prostitution out excuse is "human trafficking". For drugs it's usually "hurrr they're bad for you!" And before modern society the excuse was "God doesn't like it!"Now back to drugs. If LSD were legal people would just be hippies all day. Suddenly the miserable people trying to work their way up in society would be happier and more content with their place in life. If I could just do drugs and play video games and buy sex I wouldn't even care if I was a wage slave because I would be happy. This would cause a ripple effect in society causing it to stagnate, less people going to college, unemployment going up, etc.. The people in power need this idea of the "american dream" - something almost impossible to achieve without being a slave to a corporation - in order to entice people to keep working for them so they can stay in control. They need a carrot to dangle in front of you and they can't do that if you're already content and happy.
>>10962613>for example, prostitution is illegal.Only in shitty countries, stay mad fat american incel.
>>10962616oh I'm sorry, what was your country's GDP?
>>10962627you're just proving my point. American thrives as a country because the people in it are miserable. Look at japan - highest suicide rates and they're killing it as a country.
>>10962111>i have no grasp of the subject of discussion but i must interject You have a point with opiates, but all drugs aren't opiates.
>>10962636Switzerland is objectively more successful as a nation than Japan and much happier than either America or Japan. Your theory: debunked
>>10961795All drugs should be legal
>>10962644>Switzerland is objectively more successful as a nation than Japan I'm glad you mentioned Switzerland because it probably won't even exist in 200 years, gone the way of the Romans if they keep it up. All metrics they succeed at are usually related to quality of life. When was the last time switzerland invented anything or contributed globally to society? Has switzerland sent somebody to the moon?
>>10962650>When was the last time switzerland invented anythingthey invented cheese
>>10962650>When was the last time switzerland invented anything or contributed globally to society?You really do know nothing about science. All opinions discarded.
>>10962687>lose argument>Actually, haha, no I win because i threw your opinion away!
>>10962692Read a book kid, you don't even know the basic history of the natural sciences.
>>10962694>lose argument>Actually, haha, read a book, kid>haha, see I called you kid because I, the adult, won the argument! look how smart I am
>>10962584>person thinks a useful drug should be legalized>therefore ALL useful drugs should be legalized, with no regard to toxicity index, intent, addiction potential, or implications on taxes and regulationMaybe they don't have a logical response because you're asserting an irrational premise?
How do we force consensus on this?
>>10962855Would also like to know
>>10961811>>10961833>>10961844>>10961877>>10962022>>10962111>>10962144>>10962199>>10962299>>10962466>>10962577>>10962644>>10962855>>10962866THESE FUCKING DIGITS IS KEK IN HERE?
>>10962877>>10962872Holy shit kek really is here
>>10962879I imagine a similar thing happening with lsd that is happening with life saving medications in the US
>>10961795You can grow LSA instead. Its legal
>>10961795A clue.>Absinthe, despite its slight and documented psychedelic effect, is legal to sell in the U.S. so long as you do not advertise its psychic qualities.
>>10962701>>10962701not him but werner arber, cryo-em, roche and novartis hqs, 21 nobel laureates from eth among others. you are just a kid. a retarded one at that
>>10963418What even is absinthe? I've only drank it in Fallout New Vegas
>>10962111>create a society of drug addicts>>109620701) People will consume drugs regardless of their legal status.2) There is no effective way to police their distribution and consumption without operating a police state.Learn to read, I invite you to find the statistical data that contradicts either of the two preceding points.>based retard who didn't learn from historyhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prohibition_in_the_United_StatesTry again.
>>10962636>america>thrivingstop drinking the kool aid anon the US has been falling by virtually any metric you care to use for the past 20 years>>10962650>yeah well has your country sent someone to the moon!!!!111!If youre going to post as an underage try and cloak yourself a bit more.
>>10961902>Now we are approching a tipping point when more people are okay with it than not.This is not the case, you are just isolating yourself from rational people, hanging out exclusively with like-minded druggies whose brains are rotting away due to their substance abuse.
>>10962023Oh I see, that's why euthanizing retards, cripples and the elderly is legal, right?
>>10962070You can apply literally all of these arguments to, say, murder and vigilantism."Haha there are always people who kill other people so why forbid it haha it'll take a burden off the legal system"
>>10962524This might surprise you, but there is a huge number of people who use LCD every day. The Chinese are creating LCD in great numbers, exporting them into pretty much all developed countries.I hear they are working on replacing LCD with LED though.
>>10963580Yes you could however your point is specious af because a lot of people want to do drugs while very few people commit murder.
>>10963615I'm pretty sure more people have murderous thoughts than have considered taking drugs. I know I certainly do, every time I have to talk to some brain-dead meth head.
>>10963618The rate that you have thoughts is irrelevant, we are talking about taking action. The % of people that will consume narcotics illegally is many orders of magnitude greater than the % that will commit murder.
>>10963674One might view this as an argument in favour of the legalisation of murder, as the societal impact would be lower.The number of people who willingly consume narcotics is higher becausea) murder isn't addictive,b) the penalties for murder are higher,c) murder is socially less acceptable than drug use in degenerate countries like modern-day America.
>>10962568I think you mistook what I meant. I've never seen a good argument for why recreational drugs should be illegal
>>10963774First say why they should be illegal
decriminalized, but, people are idiots and lsd is really easy to "overdose" by taking too much than needed or the social effects of people being irresponsible with it (drunk driving or dosing other people)
>>10963781>>10963774My bad I read legal instead of illegal>>10963819Same thing with many modern prescription drugs and other recreational drugs that are legal
>>10962423Data science and social engineering
>>10963902Anybody here that knows that that wants to make this a psyop? Should one of us spam 60 minutes or the New York times or something
>>10961795>he doesn't know that 1P-LSD is still legal and can be purchased on the clearnet with crypto
>>10963993But why is regular LSD illegal in the first place
I mean they still prescribe ergot for migraines.
>>10963527Its 90 - 148 proof (45% to 74% alcohol) brew of wormwood, green anise, sweet fennel. Normally diluted with water and usually green but can be colorless.>The debate over whether absinthe produces effects on the human mind in addition to those of alcohol has not been resolved conclusively. The effects of absinthe have been described by some as mind opening. The most commonly reported experience is a "clear-headed" feeling of inebriation—a form of "lucid drunkenness". Chemist, historian and absinthe distiller Ted Breaux has claimed that the alleged secondary effects of absinthe may be because some of the herbal compounds in the drink act as stimulants, while others act as sedatives, creating an overall lucid effect of awakening. The long-term effects of moderate absinthe consumption in humans remain unknown, although herbs traditionally used to produce absinthe are reported to have both painkilling and antiparasitic properties.
>>10963583that actually made me laugh my fucking ass off.
>>10964481>The debate over whether absinthe produces effects on the human mind in addition to those of alcohol has not been resolved conclusivelyOf course it has effects on the human mind literally anything you ingest does.
>>10964481Psychoactive? Yes.Due to wormwood? No.It's in much too small of concentrations to have any effect
>>10964775Then why? And how do you know the fermented Rosewood isn't amplified somehow?
>>10963993In Canada you can buy it as easily as anything else (online). I took 1 tab last weekend and couldn't tell the difference from regular acid
>>10961795MoneyThey'll legalise anything that keeps you working and not thinking too much.
>>10961795Have you ever talked to somebody who drops a lot of LSD?
>>10962022>you can explore the depth of your mind without drugsHow? I've never been able to keep a thought train as long and as complex as the ones I've had on acid or weed or ssris. Does that make me a brainlet?
>>10963556You are talking to a bootlicker freind, the restriction of personal liberty and creation of a police state are positive things in his mind, so long as they are done by the people on "his side"
>>10965927What's it like
>>10961795It produces persisting flashbacks, for one. Had a bad trip and think it's over? Think again.
>>10961867>muh addictionLSD isn't addictive.
>>10963993Illegal in Australia
>>10966192see >>10962577>>10966596That only happens when you ignore safety precautions. You can have a psychosis incident or kill your own mood even when you self-induce trance or meditate just because of some poor mental or emotional hygiene, or if you do this in the wrong place. This isn't the only sphere where you have to follow strict safety precautions in order to be safe.>>10961795Studies shown that drugs like lsd and psilocybin can treat depressions and addictions. Which is a threat to pharmaceutical, alcohol and tobacco industries. So money is the reason. >>10963117>>10963993These substances are illegal in most countries
>>10963678No it isnt because>a)Try telling that to someone who suffers from compulsive delusions, this assertion is self evidently false.>b)There is an extreme amount of statistical data available showing that the legal penalty for a given action as very little bearing on the rate of incidence.The reason murder is illegal and isnt going to be legalized anytime soon is because it imposes to high of a moral cost on society even if it might be practically superior. The moral cost of legalizing recreational drugs is extremely low relatively.
>>10961817I agree with this, when I took LSD I felt like ELon Musk on steroids. I was so inspired to use my body and mind to make the world a better place that I couldn't even understand why people do the stupid shit that they do to set the human race back years, or even minutes.
>>10961795I don't need drugs cause i'm high on life. it's true!
>>10966712I've been meditating, i can't or don't understand how to achieve that altered state like when under the influence of acid.
>>10963992I said that as a data scientist. You don't spam media with it, you subliminally influence people to want legalized psychedelics. But no, this isn't a one person job. This is a company sized job.
>>10967876So Tooker, ready to finally rape some girls? I suggest white girls. What do you think?
>>10968501Tooker doesn't need to rape. Women need to wait their turn in line for a chance at his miraculous sex.
>>10968519They'd need to, but given that [insert Tooker lore], that won't ever happen. Actually, even if Tooker hadn't had this first incident and gone schizophrenic, he'd still have a hard time pulling pussy (though I'm sure he could, given that he can in fact build muscle unlike me). But, if you remember your Tooker 101, the entire reason he became schizophrenic was that 2 girls rejected him.
>>10966192depends on the person, I've done acid a couple dozen times and I've never had acid like experiences sober but weight lifting has helped me learn more things about myself than acid ever did different things for different people lad
>>10967247All you did is stared on a wall for an hour straight lying on a couch, "scientist"
>>10968679projecting is nice
Where do you even find legit LSD these days?
>>10963576>imagine being this tryhard
>>10961795Its a dangerous
>>10968491What else can be done? I don't have a company
>>10962878who is kek?
>>10969523God of 4chan
>>10969353Honestly man, just compiling research and making people aware about your findings. Literally write a research paper or compile notes from your sources and even if you don't push it to be published (being illegal you can't really research it professionally) you can still share it with others online and get the word out. Make people aware of what LSD actually is.