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Old thread >>10425157
>post retarded 'just PhD life' shit
>other grad school horror stories are welcome too
>your field
>your stipends(not including fee waivers, but actual cash you get after all deductions)
>your unattainable qt crushes
Very old and grey supervisor edition
>>
>>10453809
protip: if you do want to get a PhD in a competitive field, and you want to have the best chances of furthering your career in research, then the best thing to do is to start anti-grad school threads about why nobody should want to get a PhD (and thus be your competition).
>>
halp i have a phd in chemistry and can't get a jerb
>>
>>10453836
>biophysics
I called it early that she's a brainlet
>>
>>10453836
Good luck toby!
>>
>>10454105
Aren't you that north carolina guy peddling some b.s. schizo conspiracies though from another thread?
>>
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>>10453809
PhDs are funded if you're not a brainlet.
Undergrad is the real scam. Unless you had connections, pro tip, you would have struggled after undergrad too but with even less respect and more scorn.
Pic related is the process now. Most companies offer recent grads between 30k and 40k for most STEM jobs now without experience. Fuck that.
>>
>>10454105
I'm a chemistry PhD student, so I'll see you there in 3 years.

What kind of chemistry did you do?
>>
>>10453836
Good luck toby, plz be my waifu.
>>
>uneducated fags are also masturbateurs
Wew.
>>
>>10454300
How the fuck can you chemistry people not get jobs at the refinery?
>>
>>10453815
Thinking about it, a PhD student once tried to talk me out of doing a PhD. At the time it looked like he was giving me genuine advice, but now I'm not sure.
>>10454335
What kind of jobs are there for chemistry PhDs at refinaries?
>>
>>10454236
no, but thanks for your concern
>>10454300
computational
>>
>>10454335
>How the fuck can you chemistry people not get jobs at the refinery?
all those jobs were given to pajeets and chinks on H1B visas, and they are temporary jobs with no benefits at $15 an hour.
>>
>>10454366
>Thinking about it, a PhD student once tried to talk me out of doing a PhD. At the time it looked like he was giving me genuine advice, but now I'm not sure.
don't do it. seriously, go to a professional school
>>
>master's project supervisor asks me if I want to do a PhD with him a couple of times
>say no, I want to get some industry experience first and I don't want to be seen by employers as that guy who's been 9 years in school
>supervisor asks for the third time, but this time he tells me it'd be within a project financed by a good engineering company
>it would include summer internships with the company and I would get access to an office space in their facilities the rest of the year

This sounds good, right? The company is very good at what they do and the project looks interesting. I had some reluctances before but they're pretty much all gone because this almost looks like a job. Also, I'm guessing the company would give me guidance on what they want me to do (i.e. I'd be working with a clear achievable goal).

Does anyone have any experience doing industry-funded PhDs?
>>
>>10453836
good luck toby, plz be my waifu
>>
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>>10453836
I've seen her work and it wasn't that impressive

BAD LUCK TOBIAS
>>
how easy is it to transfer from an ms to phd

Engineering brainlet here
>>
>>10453809
A 2nd year PhD student reporting in. I honestly don't give a fuck about any of this, I just want to become a doctor because then I'd be one of the cool kids. This is also a great way to avoid having to work a real job.
>>
>>10454335

And do what? A chem degree is incredibly useless in the real world.
>>
>>10454966
>real world
Uhh, sweaty, ever though that you might be the one living a fantasy?
>>
>>10454863
>This is also a great way to avoid having to work a real job
But isn't it incredibly hard to get a position in academia?
>>
>>10454366
he was, you don't know what you're getting yourself into, if you love research you CAN actually look for stuff on your own, don't know about getting published though
>>
>>10454422
what do you mean exactly by a professional school?
>>
>>10455082
A professional school is a graduate school level institution that prepares students for careers in specific fields. Some of the schools also offer undergraduate degrees in specific professions. Examples of this type of school include: Architecture school, Business school, Divinity school, Engineering school, Journalism school, Law school, Library school, Education school (Normal school), Public policy school and Social work school. The field of healthcare has many professional schools including Medical school, Chiropractic school, Dental school, Pharmacy school, Physician Assistant school, Physiotherapy school, Podiatric medical school, Public health school, Speech-Language Pathology School, Occupational therapy school, Nursing school, Veterinary school and Optometry school.
>>
When do decisions usually come back. I'm finishing my Master's this semester and I applied to a few PhD programs. If it doesn't pan out I have a few good connections for a not mediocre job a la >>10454242 but like >>10454863 said, who the fuck wants to work a real job?
>>
>>10454242
OMG, I actually passed the selection process and got employed as a marine scientist.

And once you're inside... You realise you didn't need 90% of what they asked for.

>TFW I was sent out to do a field research task, and due to rough weather conditions as sea... Ended up being paid to work on my tan and surf for 5 days during downtime.
>>
>>10454422
>>10455078
Why exactly do you think a PhD is a bad idea? It seems to me that it is just a longer masters, and getting a masters was quite an enjoyable experience. Is it because academia is saturated and PhDs have a rough time finding jobs in industry?
>>10455088
Those do not exist in my country. Here you get both grad and undergrad degrees in any of those fields from universities.
>>
anons, i just got my PhD recently. AMA except not doxxing stuff
>>
>>10455248
PhD in....?
>>
>>10455047
Just be smart
>>
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suppose I have a masters in computer graphics and I don't want to wageslave working 9-5 for the rest of my life, is going for a ph.d so I can become a professor (working comfy part time hours) a good idea?

I really don't care about the salary, I just don't want to work long hours
>>
>>10454389
>computational
>>
>>10455267
physics
>>
Undergrad anon here. I’m currently in an Ivy League business program, but I want a PhD in a STEM field. If I don’t get an MBA from my Ivy League school after graduating, am I retarded?
>>
>>10455248

Do you recommend doing a PhD?
>>
>>10455386
Do you have a job?
>>
>>10455390
it depends on how dedicated you are to your field, and what programs you get accepted to. shitty PhD programs are generally not worth it. good PhD programs are worth it if you actually care enough to give up those years of possibly pursuing a real career -- academia is extremely pyramidical so you need to be good (i.e. care) to get an academic career that goes beyond your 30's.

>>10455393
yes, will be starting a postdoc soon
>>
>>10455401
>postdoc
I meant a real job
>>
Zotero or Mendeley?
>>
>>10455405
well then no, douchebag. but postdocs pay usually at least 2x what you made as a grad phd student
>>
>>10455410
nothing x 2 is still nothing anon, why didn't they teach you math in your PhD program?
>>
>>10455413
obviously you don't know anything about PhD programs. you do get paid, in the US it's typically $22-25k annually, depending on the quality of the program and the cost of living wherever the university is located
>>
anybody else want to AMA (recent PhD grad) before i go have dinner and hit the sack? honestly didn't want to shut down the thread by being a gigabrain douche
>>
>>10455458
How hard is it to get accepted into a PhD program? What are the prerequisites?
Do I have to have stellar grades, like get undergrad degree cum laude, considering my field is oversaturated?
Will getting some publications in my undergrad help me get into research?
>>
>>10455458
Please share some tips related to work and dealing with people
>>
>>10455458
Reddit
>>
>>10455479
>How hard is it to get accepted into a PhD program? What are the prerequisites?
it really depends on the program. for a decent one, you should have gone to a decent school and done decently. you can get accepted to a good PhD program having done _good_ at a middle-of-the-road undergrad, but if you do a crappy undergrad program, then the best you can hope for is mediocre grad school acceptances.
>Do I have to have stellar grades, like get undergrad degree cum laude, considering my field is oversaturated?
no, your grades have to be proportionate with your undergrad program. if you get a B from MIT, that's better than an A from, say, Florida State
>Will getting some publications in my undergrad help me get into research?
absolutely. this is a huge factor -- an undergrad who has research publications in an area to their intended field of study has a HUGE boost

>Please share some tips related to work and dealing with people
hmmm... well, it's best to buddy up with the people in your grad student class. they will be your competition, and if you make sure to work on homeworks in a group of grad students, it will at least make you look no worse than them. with professors, the idea is to try to be personable while respecting their (super much better than yours, at least in this context) authority on everything. be personable but still respectful.
>>
>>10455482
sorry, i was replying to you in this post: >>10455504
but i screwed up on making a (You). here it is:
>>10455482
>>
>>10454453

Any feedback on this guys?
>>
last call on recent physics PhD AMA. i'm pretty tired now so this may be my last post here unless somebody wants to follow up
>>
>Apply to MS program
>In interview, say I'm open to PhD if the research interests me
>they give me a fellowship that requires me do research
>i think they think I'm 100% phd

what do I do if I end up wanting to only do a masters? Tuition is like $70k/yr otherwise...
>>
>>10454453
You'll be getting paid significantly less than if you were in industry, and you'd only be in industry 1/3-1/4 as much as you would. Plus summer internships don't give you any real responsibility, and you'll be learning much less than you would.

It all boils down to if you want to do a PhD. That's the culminating effort. Your supervisor likes the work you do and wants you to put out something valuable. Do it only if that's what you want to do as well.
>>
>>10455609
Some programs let you get a Masters on the way to a PhD. It's generally bad manners to dip out after getting your MS in this way, but if you get an offer, who cares right? Ask around the program regarding the MS and in general - explore your options.
>>
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>tfw first year physics grad student
>tfw Jackson E&M
>tfw have grad student teaching grad level stat mech
>tfw not using Sakurai for Quantum, rather using Baym
>tfw 38+ hours of homework a week on top of 20+ hours of TA work
How did you guys make it through first year? I've already got an RA set up for the summer and the comp. exams fucking terrify me, for reference out of a class of 17 only 2 passed last year.
>>
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yo, where is the Canadian anon who was doing chemistry and CS?
>>
What are some ways to get blacklisted from academia?
>>
>>10454366
And become the god damn global manager of refinement at Exxon you fucking dipshit.
>>
>>10453836
GOOD LUCK TOBY, PLZ BE MY WAIFU
>>
>>10453836
"she" isnt even a qt. tha hell?
>>
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>>10453809
>MD, PhD, MBA

is it necessary to have all these credentials?
>>
>>10456109
Only to verify brainletness of the highest order.
>>
>>10453836
Good luck Toby, plz be my waifu
>>
>>10456092
Neck yourself
>>
>>10456109
If you want a senior position at a big corporation these days, you need an MBA.
>>
high school senior here, i know this isnt my threade but i thought a lot of you guys would have some good input. I have a strong interest in getting a physics PhD but i wanna know if it will just be the end of me. right now ive been accepted into a state school with what i hear has a good physics program which is where I plan to go for my undergrad. ive also been accepted into a good engineering school in case it's turns out physics is a bad idea.
Ive been taking a lot of college classes through concurrent enrollment and have calc1-3 and physics 1n2 taken care of, if that makes any difference.
>>
>>10456188
Do engineering or Math pair with Comp sci . Physics is a meme, dont fall for it. Wanna learn physic go read a textbook. Unless you wanna fall for phd meme and ending up jobless like retards above.
>>
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>>10455047
I'm going to live on welfare for the rest of my life once I receive my PhD. I live in a Nordic country so this is a viable plan.
>>
>>10455922
Always have study mates. Bonus points if one of them is a genius with a semblance of social skills. They'll help a lot, especially for fucking Jackson. Unless you're a savant-level genius, bobody does Jackson questions alone.
Fuck that book. Words are not enough to express my hatred and contempt for it. Genuinely made me question why I did grad school in the first place.
>>
Why do people think getting a PhD will land them a job? Its a title only used in Academia and even then it requires you to do the same shit you've been doing to get your PhD to begin with.
>>
>>10456109
Correct me if I am wrong anons but isn't there already a basic universal currency? Its the idea that tariffs, etc will even out the amount of what a bannana costs and it will cost the same everywhere.
>>
>>10456502
>Why do people think getting a PhD will land them a job?
Those silly desperate assistant professors will say anything to get your ass in their lab as a research slave, cause their careers depend on your research output. Even the ones at universities below rank 20 or so where your PhD would be worth less than dog shit.

God help you if you graduate from a place like University of Georgia, for example. I don't know what the hell those people end up doing. I imagine they're full of chinks who are just going back to China.
>>
>>10456188
>>10456217
don’t listen to this guy. math is way harder to get an academic career with vs. physics. at least physics gets funded; math is basically like humanities in terms of funding
>>
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>>10456839
>mfw live in a country where all unis are placed high in the world
>mfw it doesn't matter where you graduate or get a PhD
>>
>>10456839
by the way - the assistant professors that show up at lower ranked schools usually come from schools at the top 10 or so. That's how this system works.
>>
>>10454389
>someone else fell for the compchem meme
My condolences, comrade
>>
Just a retarded question, but why don't most phd students just try and launch their or business and gain funding for their independent research? I mean I understand like 90% why they don't typically, but tell me why you wouldn't do that and want a job instead.
>>
>>10457236
The answer to this my friend is beautifully detailed in the 1965 book "Stoner" by John Williams. It takes a long time to explain the handicap of academia and cannot be greentexted.
>t.applying for a ML PhD at at a tier3 school
>>
>>10453815
also make frequent posts about having a good work/life balance so everyone who reads them will be encouraged to slack while you're working twice as much as them.
>>
>>10457236
>>10457285

>why don't people accustom to and molded by group think start thinking for themselves?
>>
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>>10455409

obviously Zotero, f/oss product don't fall for the commercial publisher jew
>>
>>10457285
I’m doing my master thesis in AI right now. The PhD stories scared me, so I didn’t want to do it, but I’m really enjoying doing my thesis so far and my supervisor asked if I want to do a PhD in AI research with him, perhaps combined with internships at Facebook and the like.

What do?
>>
>>10457588
do a phd

t phd
>>
>>10457613
ok thx
>>
>>10457646
tell your supervisor before he makes other plans with your spot
>>
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>>10455380
>hexahedron
>>
I'm studying physics with the intention of becoming a military officer. I was thinking about maybe pursuing graduate education somewhere on down the line. Is it really as terrible as what I'm reading here? Are there ways to prevent this kind of crap from happening to me?
>>
>>10455482
>tips related to work and dealing with people
*Your employer does not thank you for going the extra mile
*Choosing a good supervisor is easier than changing supervisors
*Learn to sniff out parasites (faculty and students) and avoid them
*Ask no more of others than the work you put in yourself
*Learn the traits of narcissists and psychopaths. Keep a mental checklist of how many times each of your colleagues exhibits such traits. Be wary when someone goes off the charts compared to the rest of your co-workers.
*Learn the signs of burnout and of depression. Self-check every weekend.
*Learn the formal and informal scoring system at your workplace
*Learn what happens when people speak up against the boss
*Keep a long-term personal growth plan
*Work on developing skills, not a stream of easy publications
*Spend 25%-50% of your research time outside your comfort zone
>>
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>>10456217
Are u just doing what >>10453815 said.
>>10456859
cool guess im gonna be a physicist
>>
Defending on Wednesday. Finally, after almost 7 damn years. I did switch advisors 1.5 years in but still.
>>
>>10458359
What field are you in?
>>
>>10458485
you can't ask doxxing questions. how many people in the world do you think are defending on wednesday?
>>
>>10456120
all you need to do is pay the ~$20-30k to get one. Most programs are extremely easy to get into if you have any real work experience and no one actually looks at where it's from
>>
>>10457934
Do well do you can have officers vouch for you. Check out the big four military universities for opportunities.
>>
>>10454394
bitch you sound like that fucker who was complaining about having computer science degree

used the same damn phrase
>>
>>10458528
327 in the U.S. faggot
>>
>>10458919
It's actually way more than that, easily over 50,000 people get Phd's in the U.S. each year and it was rising based on info in 2013
>>
>>10458528
>>10458924
hear that?
its the sound of faggotry crying as bullshit is burned alive
>>
>>10458924
>50,000
If you assume it's at least somewhat evenly distributed over the number of days 300 is actually pretty reasonable though.
>>
>>10457588
PhD is a complete waste of time in ML imo

Just get in with a company and stack them greenbacks
>>
>>10453836
Good luck Toby!
>>
>>10456898
Yeah really. A really big chunk of my school’s faculty is from the top 10 engineering schools.
>>
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lel
>>
>>10459857
But how true is this stuff for ML PhDs? All the big tech companies want PhDs to do their research for them. Anything less and you’re relegated to codemonkeying (lucrative though that may be).
>>
>>10460019
>ML PHD
>"We need more layers"
>>
>>10455422
Not that guy.
I make $35k as an RA (already have a MS) in a private research institution.
I got accepted in a PhD program but it pays a $28k stipend. This shit pay is the only thing bothering me about investing 5 years of my life in this. Postdocs make about $60k for their appointments after 5 years of PhD.
I'm seriously thinking about jumping ship to industry.
>>
>>10453809
>want to pursue PhD.
>wtf why is there so much competition?
>make thread about how PhD's suck to deter my competition from applying.
>>
>>10460139
>ML PHD
>git clone some resnet variant
>spend every day cropping hentai and dick pics for training data
>>
Can anyone in the UK weigh in on how a doctorate in engineering impacts your career? It's been a life goal of mine to get a PhD since I was a teenager.

I'm in the defence/aerospace industry at the moment at one of the largest companies in the UK, but nearly everyone I've spoken to says it's pointless, and not worth it in terms of money.

Well shit, I'm not a Jew, money isn't everything. But is it worth the effort and the potential avenues it opens up?
>>
>>10460362
Get an MSc, get a job in the industry, do a part-time PhD while working. Ideally paid by your employer.
Check out Cranfield University
>>
I got accepted into a top 5 engineering school for machine learning with 31k/yr stipend. I also have a job offer for 100k. Which do I take? I did really well in my undergrad and feel like I need a PhD to get a job in ML but I do not want to be a "researcher" or stay in academia. Also, the opportunity cost is like 300k+ for not working :o

No brag, pls just give me advice
>>
>>10460660
Take the job offer. 100k is decent money, unless you're in SF
>>
>>10460660
Take the job, because you can always go back to school, but that 100k offer won't always be there.
>>
>>10460666
Its in DC but thats not much better. I'm leaning towards this and then getting a masters later. Yes, ML PhDs are paid a lot in industry research, but I feel like this will "pop" soon.
>>
>>10460677
>ML PhDs are paid a lot in industry research, but I feel like this will "pop" soon.
What makes you think that?
>>
>>10453836
GOOD LUCK TOBY, PLZ BE MY WAIFU
>>
>>10456092
The fact that you're an absolute faggot doesn't mean that we all have to share or even be aware of your degeneracy, so keep your comments and general faggotry to yourself, please.
>>
>>10460737
1) Historic trend with rise and fall of funding for "AI"
2) Political wave of resentment against tech companies (think splitting of Bell Labs)
3) No real novel breakthroughs in ML since GANs (which are really just memey and not significant)
>>
>>10458528
I am just curious about what could make a PhD last for so long.
>>
>>10455422
>>10460174
lmao my stipend is $33k as a computer science PhD student at a private university
other sciencelets need not apply to graduate school
>>
>Rejected by another professor
>Guy had ~125 people apply
At least he was nice enough to tell everyone else he hates them.
>>
>>10455148
You didn’t post tfw...
>>
>>10461631
Elaborate please
>>
>>10455148
>Wasted a week at the beach for $100
>>
>>10461980
Some professors don’t even bother sending out a mass email telling everyone else that they didn’t get the position, so you have to awkwardly contact them to ask if they’ve made their decision or not.
>>
>>10461587
i made over 50k as a physics PhD student by getting a fellowship on top of my stipend
>>
>>10462732
Whats a fellowship is it like a friendship?
>>
>>10456217
you have to take the absolute square of i, which is i x i* = 1
>>
>>10462834
it’s basically like a government gib that you apply for by saying “look how great i am at research and how great my work is for science, so gimme monies to do some project(s)” and then they go “monies4u, smartypants” and then you need to send them updates every couple of months to prove you’re working on the project(s)
>>
>>10462923
it goes on top of your stipend instead of replacing it?
>>
>>10462923
how did you market your research to the government?
>>
>>10453809
I got a PhD in math and I am not a research-cuck. I teach university (full-time, no adjunct gay shit) and I love it. Great hours, OK salary, and I can focus on things I really love like sex, weightlifting, learning more math, and vidya.
>>
>>10462956
>I got a PhD in math
I want to do that but I'm already 21 and just starting my bachelor.
Should I even bother pursuing it?
>>
>>10462933
for me it did; maybe because my advisor liked me
>>10462943
just hype it up in your application. the people who review them are usually experts in the field so you can be technical and they’ll understand
>>
>>10462967
Yea, plenty of my grad school buds were in late 20s when they started the PhD, good thing is you can go right from undergrad to PhD program.

Accelerate as much as you can, spend the next few years learning as much math as you can. A plan:

>Multivariate Calc
>Linear Algebra
>Basic Proofs class/discrete math

Once you have these three nailed down and are getting better at thinking with a bit more abstraction

Nail down either through class or self-study
>Analysis (Including measure theory and basic functional analysis)
>Algebra
>Probability
>Combinatorics
>Topology
>Diff. Geo
>PDE + Applied Math

Also make sure to take at least three courses in computer science, this will give you a big advantage. Something like
>OOP
>Data Structures
>Algorithms
>>
>>10462982
>Yea, plenty of my grad school buds were in late 20s when they started the PhD, good thing is you can go right from undergrad to PhD program.
That's good to hear

Thanks for the plan, I already did a course on LA a while back, also on set theory and logic.

>Also make sure to take at least three courses in computer science, this will give you a big advantage.

I'll be working/getting trained as a software developer by a multinational education in the next three years, so I got that covered.
>>
>>10463015
>education
*corporation
>>
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>>10453836
fuck you Toby, Immunity dog protects me.
>>
>>10453809
people who complain about their PhDs are nothing but weak fragile fucks who've never held a real job in their fucking life
>>
Said an expert >>10463090
>>
>>10454127
whatever gives you the impression that biophysics is "brainlet tier"
>>
>>10463093
>oh im doing a phd in organic chemistry and we do columns 1000 hrs a week

waaaawaaaaaa give me a fucking break
>>
>>10463090
not all of us wanted a career sucking dicks down at the docks like you
>>
>>10463121
notice I am referring to the ones that complain, go learn how to be a fucking adult first, instead of complaining about "my prof called me a dumdum :("

go finish your manuscript instead of whining about moronic shit on 4chan, peabrain
>>
>>10463138
>t. got rejected from grad school
>>
>>10463155
Why would anyone want to go to grad school when you can earn just as much earlier and still have career potential? Time value of money.
>>
>>10463164
>brainlet cope
>>
>>10463166
I'm too busy enjoying all this money to cope.
>>
>>10463172
>brainlet larp
>>
>>10454966
what about chemical engineering
>>
>>10463174
Too busy enjoying all this money to larp my cope.
>>
>>10463718
Pipelines and refineries.
>>
>>10463767
A friend of mine who is a chemical engineer is making silicone wafers for computer chips
>>
>>10463793
does he get paid well?
>>
>>10463793
>>10463834
The more important question is does she get paid well in an area with a lower cost of living?
>>
>>10463164
t. jew
>>
>>10463834
>>10463865
>he/she
>>10463793
does ze get paid well in an area with a lower cost of living?
>>
>>10454422
>professional school
Just stay away from healthcare. The suicide rates are highest for a reason. Physicians have told me they were taught they'd be treated like a professional and then got out as glorified fast food workers for healthcare, shitting out appointments in minutes and making snap decisions with high liability. I've been unemployed in Pharmacy for over a year. Many of my classmates are as well. It's heavily oversaturated. Nursing isn't as bad lately but that fluctuates frequently.
>>
>>10453836
GOOD LUCK TOBY, PLZ BE MY WAIFU
>>
>>10463982
>I've been unemployed in Pharmacy for over a year. Many of my classmates are as well.
that's too bad, i wouldn't have thought that was true, one of my undergrad cohorts just graduated from pharmacy school in an unremarkable state uni and coasted right into a retail pharmacy... can you move or something? good luck
>>
any EE phd students here?
>>
>>10463834
>>10463865
>>10463928
I assume she's getting paid pretty decently and she's living/working in the research triangle in Raleigh, NC.
>>
>>10460660
I would actually take the phd, if youre thesis is on something that makes big tech companies interested you can make batshit money. I read something in the nyt a few months ago talking about 7 figure job offers for post grads with memechine learning related theses. This is probably the single best time to get an ML phd so I'd go for it if you think you can actually get through grad school and produce a good thesis.
>>
>>10455582
how does someone get publications in undergrad?
>>
>>10467099
Writing papers and submitting them to journals.
>>
>>10457457
Hell yeah
>>
>>10454242
Salary: hasn't gone up since the 70's
>>
>>10454242
>be recent stem grad
>make $125k USD year after undergrad
>only work 2/3 of year
>really only work 1/2 of year for broken leg
>mfw
>>
>>10460955
I honestly don’t expect there to be another AI winter. The AI winter in the 80’s happened because the symbolic approach doesn’t scale. Neural networks scale very well. Neural networks have been around since the 40’s. They’ve only become relevant now because we finally have the computing power to handle them, and it’s only going to get better.

The people who talk of another AI winter are just impatient. It’s not gonna change the world overnight. I think of neural networks as similar to electricity. It used to be just a gimmick. It wasn’t until a century later that it was used to power PC’s and the Internet. Many years from now, neural networks will be used to create similarly world-changing technology. In the meantime, it’s going to take a lot of research to get there.
>>
>>10465551
Isn't ml on the decline? IIRC the 7 figs were for people with experience who got their PhDs near the end of the AI winter.
>>
I get my masters degree in a year in data science and have been wondering about doing a phd in it. I'm from Europe and will likely be able to attain a paid position (not that much pay, 2400-2900 euro a month but thats enough to live from) due to there being many open research spots in the field. Just on the fence about actually doing it since business pays more and I feel like if I would do a phd I would be locking myself in for another 5 years and I would be 29 when I would finally be done with that. The job field currently looks amazing for what I want to do, probably in 4-5 years it will still be this way, but I'm not sure if doing a phd for 4 years which would pay less would get me to a better position than just getting a solid paying position at a corp as middle manager or consultant or something akin to information officer functions and work up from there.

>>10455094
Kind of have this issue as well, in a company I would be working to enrich stakeholders or people above me without anything of it having meaning. At least with a phd I can say it's work I produced and I did.

>>10456109
I think you should be suspicious if someone with those credentials is posting obvious clickbait. I get tired of people who think that UBI is needed because work will take on a different form. No, automating physical work in production processes will lead to an even bigger service industry and jobs would get a more social factor with emphasis on context. I'd argue that it would be similar to tried experiments where the ones receiving ubi just stopped caring and lived off it, killing off economic growth in the process. Kind of like how soviets were killing of growth by not providing stimulus.
>>
>>10456188
Well you have a lot of time to think about it doing your actual program. Not to offend but when I started I had no actual clue what actual research looks like, how it's done, the methods behind it and so on. Once you get a better idea of what you actually want to do it's better to make that decision.
>>
>>10462982
>plenty of my grad school buds were in late 20s when they started the PhD
But how many ended up successful?
>>
>>10467195
Which job? What kind of arrangement let's you work 2/3 of the year?
>>
>>10467196
But we're already near the limit of Moore's law. What makes you think neural networks will keep getting exponentially more and more powerful?
>>
>>10467253
Not that guy but hya. Anyways LISTEN UP FUCKING PHYSICS TWINKS AND PSEUD "PURE SCIENCE" FAGS. I'M SICK AND TIRED OF REPEATING THIS.
>Moorefag's law does not apply to manycore(parallel).
>Parallel processors like GPUs are literally thousands of shitty CPU cores thrown together
>The real genius is in designing the communication pathways between them(the bridges)
>This still has a looooong way to go before it starts getting difficult to make em fast.
>So while the growth in the performance of a single superman core(or few handful of cores) has slowed, massively parallel processors like GPU still make yuge performance jumps gen to gen.
>Fuck any vidya gameboi who disagrees, I'm talking about enterprise hardware here not your shitty GayForce Experience®
>Anyway neural networks are basically matrix operations which are trivial to parallelize. This makes em scale insanely well on parallel systems.
>Linear deterministic algos needs a strapping hunk of an Aryan. The only way it gets better is if he gets more bulked.
>Parallel stochastic algos on the other hand can be run using a hundred shitty Mexicans. Want to make it better? Hire another hundred shitty Mexicans.
>Lo and behold it's now twice as fast (Not exactly twice because of something called Amdahl's law, but almost twice).
>So neurinets literally will keep on getting better and better no matter what you cucks keep shilling.
FUCK AND YOU WONDER WHY WE HATE HIRING YOU SCIFAGS
>>
>>10467335
thanks, i think you probably just convinced a few undergraduates considering grad school that industry guys are total douchebags
>>
>>10463015
>thinks that software development is the same as computer science
>>
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>have PhD+100k fellowship offer from Stanford (engineering)
>was pretty set on them
>just got into Carnegie Mellon for robotics masters (MRSD), obviously no funding
>Two weeks to make my decision

Two very different routes my life could take...I'm not crazy to turn down CMU.. right?
>>
Getting PhD atm.

I think I'll just be a technician.

This all too bothersome.
>>
>>10467398
mayne... you'd be crazy not to
>>
>>10467408
Technician here, it's not so bad but if you don't have at least a 4 year degree you will hit a ceiling.
>>
>>10467413

What do you even mean.
>>
>>10467413
I know people with technician level jobs that regularly make up to 200k a year and have made 350k during good times.
>>
Why would you spend >5 anguishing years destroying your mental health and career opportunities with slim chances of even staying in academia?

Genuine question, I kind of want to do the same.
>>
>>10467433
>2019
>doing a PhD to go into academia
>literally 400 phds competing for one post
>b-but I am s-special
Kek you guys deserve a shitty life
>>
>>10467433
six figure saladry
>>
>>10467441
If you can't get a six figure salary with an undergrad you're trash
>>
>>10467458
wow you really hurt my self esteem their bucko with your lesser diploma
>>
>>10467458
Dank shitpost
>>
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>Think I am on limbo here by having only a masters
>Think I need to get the PhD to be out of limbo but I am past 30 and no one will want a PhD student this old
>Lets ask /sci/ for some advice
>This is the first thread I see
I guess I should just kill myself
>>10453836
Good luck Toby, plz be my waifu
>>
>>10467433
What if I told you I self-funded a PhD for the lulz?
>>
>>10467777
I'd know you were lying for attention on a Taiwanese dong painting forum
>>
>>10467815
There are people plonking down $500k+ for their retarded kids to enter top unis, and you doubt an autist on a dickwashing BBS may have spent $50k to research whatever the fuck he wanted
>>
>>10460660
Take the job nigger
>>
>>10453809
I am currently working full time as an engineer earning ~80k annually in the Puget Sound, and have been accepted to a few PhD programs. Do I leave to go back to school? I am hesitant because they are Bioengineering programs, and I have realized since applying that biofags don't make decent dosh and job opportunities are concentrated in high cost of living areas like Massachusetts and California. In the five years I am out working on my PhD, I could climb the ranks at my current job to earn 100k+.
>>
>>10467775
There are students in my PhD program who are older than 30. If you want it go for it but if you're competent you should be able to get a solid job without a PhD. Unless you want to work in academia.
>>
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>spend your 10 most productive years doing nothing but studying instead of acquiring real skills (aka job experience)
>surprised when no one is willing to hire a 30+yo that can't do anything but spout useless knowledge
>>
>>10467984
>not doing a PhD while working
>>
>>10468050
>job experience
>dealing with retards, shitskins, and boomers
>>
>>10468621
>PhD experience
>dealing with retards, shitskins, and boomers
>no money either
>>
>>10457539
>pic
Kek
>>
>>10453836
Good luck toby, plz be my waifu.
>>
>>10456092
yeah she is fucking ugly lol
>>
There's a real lack of love for science here. Do all you guys just want degrees for the salary?
>>
>>10453836
GOOD LUCK TOBY, PLZ BE MY WAIFU
>>
>>10469514
>There's a real lack of love for science here
You sir are the pristine constituent of the exact target demographic for legends of science like Sir Neil The Grass Tyson, Lady Dick Dawkins and his Highness William Nysan the Science Gentleman.
>>
>>10456217
Comp sci is a fucking meme. Engineering, Math and Physics are all good majors though
>>
>>10469638
No u
>>
>>10469578
I just want to do some research that'll have some real effect to improve people's lives on a large scale. A decent salary to live off would be great too.
>>
>>10469767
>being this deluded
>>
>>10469827
It doesn't have to be much. Just a little piece here and there, that's well within reach of a standard academic. What happened to make you so cynical anon?
>>
>german, engineer
>got into phd because did not find a job in the industry
>salary ~50k €/a
>rent is about 1/6th of salary in this town
>no pressure about papers (1 per year)
>prof is a nice guy, my group is also very nice and helpful
am i the only one here having great life?
>>
>>10469862
Fuck I don't know man
>We all start out with that wide eyed wonder. All happy and enthusiastic about going on this beautiful hike up the hill. You've been told all your life that the summit is the best place to be. The pictures of the view from atop were by themselves otherworldly let alone the entire experience of being there. A hike which has always painted a marvelously romantic picture in your head.
>And so you set out
Oh what joy to be among all those beautiful trees, bushes and birds, along this serene path. So you start walking, picking berries along the way. You are enjoying your trail so much that the summit does not even matter.
>You pick so many berries. Each one so different in shape, size and colour. You are enjoying one upping each other in seeing who picks more berries--better berries. They taste so sweet and flavourful--so colourful on your tongue.
>But somewhere along the way you forget why you are there, why you are on this trail in the first place. At the back of your head you are aware of this obliviousness but you force yourself not to think about it much. You're picking so many berries! And such good ones too, who cares about looking around and enjoying the trail? You've found another purpose. You're a masterful berry picker.
>You eventually do reach the summit. What else can you do? It is the inevitability of time you see. You can't not reach the destination of your journey. And once on the summit you neither realize that you are there nor--worse yet--care. You are so busy counting the berries in your basket, that you care not to just look up. And it's only on the way back home that you stop for a brief moment in time. A moment where something tingles you and you feel a strong sense of discomfort. You feel like you missed something. But it's been so long since you've forgotten that you don't even know what you've missed.
>You guys ever left your house and you feel you are forgetting something, but you don't know what?
>>
>>10470010
cont.
>And then one day twenty years later your daughter asks you "Dad what's it that you do?". And you know there's no way to satisfactorily answer that. No set of words. None of your skills in rhetoric are enough and you merely bumble something about you being a scientist.
>"Cool I want to be just like you when I grow up dad"
>And there'll be tears in your eyes when you can't get yourself to tell her "No baby, be anyone but me"
You are ready to do anything to make sure your kid does not end up another berry picker like you. But alas, before you know it the damage is done and you're saying goodbye after dropping her off at her dorms.
>She'll be starting her bio-physics degree from tomorrow.
>>
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>>10470010
>>10470034
Scientific.
>>
How hard is it to get into a CS PhD program with a master's in materials science
>>
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>>10470034
>>She'll be starting her bio-physics degree from tomorrow.
>>
>>10470575
why would you do that
>>
>>10470639
$$$
>>
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Curious...

How important is it of where you go to graduate school/earn your PhD? How about when it comes to finding a post-doc position?

I just want to be a researcher in a specific area of interest.
>>
typical brainlet replies here. of course people who are satisfied and doing well with their phd aren't going to post here. this is all either shitty larpers or actual failures. sage.
>>
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Sophomore here. There is an assistant professor at another uni who's lab I'd like to join/do a PhD in. (They are researching areas of my interest and seem to have a good culture). I'm in another state, any advice on emailing them? Do I just send them an email telling them I'm an undergrad at so-and-so university that I'm interested in immunology/pathogenesis research. (Do I need to explain what background I have and how it relates to the research they're doing?) Do I ask what they're looking for in prospective PhD candidates?
>>
>>10453809
>>10453815
Reminder that this thread is a Chinese plot to open up more seats in Western university programs.
>>
>>10471963
Yes. Your ideas for the email are all good.
>>
>>10467433
Autists can't do anything else so they'll try to save their life and kill themselves when things don't work out so that they don't end up exploited by corporations for 50% of the salary of neurotypical people because they can't haggle effectively

t. autist thats gonna kill himself
>>
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>>10453809

Im new to sci.
I was unaware of these theories, what do you mean PHD's are a scam exactly ?
>>
>>10454105
Help I'm a PhD student in chemistry and you are my future
>>
>>10472148
You can still get out unscathed. Try dental school. Can't go wrong
>>
>>10471963
>There is an assistant professor at another uni who's lab I'd like to join/do a PhD in.
noooooooo working with an assistant professor is like saying you don't want a career past grad school. Employers would hire someone from an established PI over a no-name assistant professor in a heartbeat.

I tried saying this in the other thread. DON'T WORK FOR AN ASSISTANT PROFESSOR. It's terrible for your career. If you want a science PhD, go to the most prestigious school you can (preferably top 10 in your field) and work for an advisor who is famous or at least well established.

"but assistant professors need good students (to produce the research and publications they'll need to help get them tenure)!" No. Fuck them.
>>
>>10471502
At least in the physical sciences, it's all about specific labs and
knowing the right people. As a general rule the best and most famous PIs in a specific community are in good universities but not necessarily in the most famous universities.
What gives you a name in the field is not the university itself but the Lab/people you collaborate in and the papers you publish.
>>
>>10471963
>who's
whose
>>
>>10472164
Basically this,
you can do a PhD under a star associate prof, but that's the limit.
>>
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>>10472517
Thanks anon. (Really)

>>10472167
>>10472164
>>10472545

I see...So, basically only go for a PhD if it's with a tenured professor. Wouldn't competition be fierce? I'm not really special/don't stand out. I thought with an assistant professor I'd have more potential to propose research projects of my own to carry out.
>>
>very prestigious uni
>no-name supervisor

I probably could have gotten in to do a project for very big names here but I liked this research the most. Also the guy is very nice and easy to get along with.

However, there's always a little doubt nagging at the back of my mind about whether life would be better if I had chosen differently. Both in terms of advisor prestige and research area.
>>
>>10472611
Need more info on your field. Most projects are based on the ability to get funding. And yes the competition for a famous PI is really intense.
>>
>>10469946
Everyone agrees that the time spent doing a PhD is quite enjoyable (if you have a decent adviser). The problem starts after the PhD. There are very few academic positions available and industry don't give a fuck about PhDs without work experience.
>>10470575
I don't see how it would be possible in a decent university. However, I'm not american, and I heard that burgers do some weird shit like allowing philosophy degree holders into neuroscience grad programs, so maybe you have a chance.
>>
>>10467335
>parallel
OH NO NO NO
HOUSEFIRES INSIDE

memes aside, thanks for explaining. One more question: will chips become cheaper fast enough to keep up with the slowing of Moore's law?
I do think IOT data will go stratospheric soon thanks to 5g and everything moving to cheap SoCs. Although there's a lot if people writing on what to do with the data, there will be a shortage of people able to design structures able to handle the data and organize it. What do you think?
>>
>>10467424
How much do they work? What do they do?
>>
>>10467409
What makes the CMU choice better than the Stanford one?
>>10467398
What did you do in undergrad to get accepted? How prestigious was your undergrad uni?
>>
I have a PHD in computational biology, how am I doing?
>>
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>still waiting for last two application decisions to come back
the fucking deadline was december, get your shit together cunts
>>
>>10472852
anon...
>>
>>10463155
nigga i haven't even applied yet
>>
>>10472800
>memes aside, thanks for explaining.
You're welcome.
> One more question: will chips become cheaper fast enough to keep up with the slowing of Moore's law?
Nope. Chip manufacturers are very few in numbers. They collude to increase profits. Just enough to not be prosecuted for any anticompetitive behaviour.
>I do think IOT data will go stratospheric soon thanks to 5g and everything moving to cheap SoCs.
Yes and no. The volume certainly will explode. But most of it will be shit noise. >there will be a shortage of people able to design structures able to handle the data and organize it.
No, being able to handle vary large volumes of data was the third major area of research the database community got into. Pretty much every major problem was solved before 2009.
The first major research topic was representation and language (SQL, relational algebra etc). The second was a thorough characterization of the structure of the data( normal forms, ACID properties etc)
>but
There will be a shortage of people who know how to sift through the noise. It mostly just boils down to knowing what's a good data stream and throwing away bad ones.
>but this is normal
CS has always had this huge rift between supply and demand. There is a huge demand for good engineers, yes.
>but
There's also a huge supply of shitty koders
It's like the housing crisis. There are more empty mansions than what's required to house all the homeless. But the homeless literally add no value to any if these homes. Yea you may say you've solved the housing crisis. But have you really?
>anyway
Don't listen to these fags. Scifags telling you about the future of CS is like a CS fag talking about advanced quantum mechanics because he took phy101 in college. Everyone and their mother has an opinion. All that matters is the cold hard truth.
>Get a PhD right after ug
>Oldfag advisors only
>Quit academia right after PhD.
this is CS, you don't ever have to worry about sub six figure job for the rest of your life
>>
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>>10472966
>based and datapilled
>>
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>>10472966
>Scifags telling you about the future of CS is like a CS fag talking about advanced quantum mechanics because he took phy101 in college.
Scientists BTFOd to highly eccentric orbits
>>
>>10472988
he’s right tho. and that’s why CS guys are brainlets kek
>>
>>10472682
Field is molecular biology
>>
>>10473217
Im sorry for him
>>
What chances do I have to get into a top 50 (maybe even a top 20) PhD programme in math/theoretical physics/theoretical cs if I did an undergrad in a third world university?
My uni isn't completely shit, I'd say top 5 in latin america, but I'm scared if I apply to a anything they won't even consider me. Can I make it lads?
>>
>>10473220
Should I get a masters and gain experience while trying to get into a good PhD program then?
>>
>>10472839
See you in the unemployment office frend!

but seriously, you might do drug discovery but good luck, all job postings are like "5-10 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE REQUIRED"
>>
>>10456188
Don't even go to college. Go to a good trade school and learn a trade, and be as top tier during your schooling in the trade as possible. Maybe consider going to school part time afterwards (while working and making those money bags) and get a degree in business administration if you want to start your own company based around your trade school schooling.
>>
How early is too early to quit a PhD program?

I moved to Europe for PhD, and they went through a bunch of shit to get me over there, like helping with visa.

I'm really not having a good time. Having to go in 9-5, but still being paid like a student. Maybe I'm just homesick as well? I don't know. Still relatively early. If I'm going to leave I should do it fairly early to not waste their time/money?

Any thoughts/advice?
>>
>>10467226
>Isn't ml on the decline?
Source?
>near the end of the AI winter
Which?
>>
>>10473662
What country and what is even your problem? Just money?
>>
does the top 10 school/advisor thing apply to engineering too? I'd think an engineering PhD would have an easier time getting a decent job
>>
>>10472687
>However, I'm not american, and I heard that burgers do some weird shit like allowing philosophy degree holders into neuroscience grad programs, so maybe you have a chance.

Lol what universities do this?
>>
>>10473993
Sam Harris, so UCLA
>>
>>10473969
Germany.

The money itself wouldn't be that much of an issue if it was just me but I have a wife and kids.

Also, I'm sick of not having a direction/purpose in what I do. Want some real world work. I've looked at many job openings for my field and most want masters, and often want experience. PhD isn't usually needed, so I feel like if I'm going to industry anyway I should just do it now.
>>
>>10474285
Did you get a 50% position? WiMis are paid good enough to feed a family of 4 if you know how to save money. Are you on a project position or a Landesstelle?

>I'm sick of not having a direction/purpose in what I do.
Why did you start the PhD? Also have you talked to other people in your field about your work? I hear a lot from phd students that they feel like their work has no purpose, mainly because they don't talk to others.

>Want some real world work
Real world work is as purposeless as what you do in a PhD, except better paid.


To your original question, it is never too early to quit and if you know you will quit it is better to cut your losses. But if you are from some middle eastern shithole and got into Germany because the university helped you so much with the visa, people might judge you for being the opportunistic faggot that you are when they see your CV
>>
>>10473985
It just applies if you wanna get into academia. Industry doesn't give a fuck about your advisor.
>>
>>10472164
>Employers would hire someone from an established PI over a no-name assistant professor in a heartbeat.
By employers do you also mean those in industry? If so, what are you basing this on? I’m considering doing a PhD in ML and going into industry immediately after and I really doubt it would matter much. I have zero interest in becoming a postdoc or professor and getting tenure and begging for grants and all that.
>>
>>10453809

I don't see how a PhD can be a scam. You're getting paid for it.

Worst case scenario, the money you get covers your living expenses while you're getting your PhD and you win because getting a PhD allowed you to survive for however many years.
>>
>>10474479
>By employers do you also mean those in industry? If so, what are you basing this on?
yes and also academia. personal observation as well as coming from an assistant prof's group where our group's students didn't fare as well as other people from bigger name profs after graduation
>>
>>10475266
>our group's students didn't fare as well as other people from bigger name profs after graduation
Maybe that’s because the bigger name profs get the pick of the litter; they pick the students that are better in the first place and that’s why they did better. Correlation does not equal causation.
>>
>>10475330
most students got into the group of their choice. they didn't pick us, we picked them.
>>
>>10475266
At my school the people who did best came from the hardass PI's lab even more so than the famous PI who ran a dysfunctional lab. Just don't be lazy and you'll be fine
>>
Is it worth more getting a PhD in one subject or 2 Masters in two distinct subjects (granted that one is eligible to do so)?

Asking for a friend
>>
>>10475660
>is it worth more doing one big project or two smaller projects
>>
>>10475685
Is it?
>>
>>10475698
>>10475660
If you're not a genius, do one masters in an in-demand subject. If you're a genius, do a PhD that will stand the test of time.
>>
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>at visit day for phd program
>meet amazing, cute girl amongst sea of awkward and goofy looking prospective students
>hang out all day, ask her out a date
>actually start falling in love with her
>start talking about all the fun we're gonna have once we start our PhDs here
>find out yesterday she isn't getting funding from the school we visited
>shes taking the offer somewhere else on the other side of the world
>happiness turns to ashes, a week full of hopefulness and excitement quickly transcends into sadness and depression

why does it have to be like this
>>
>>10475754
Nice blog, faggot. Now post some pics of her.
>>
>>10472827
Not very prestigious
>>
>>10467398
Go to Stanford
>>
>>10475781
But how did you get in? How much effort did you spend on grades (what were they) vs research? What about extracurriculars?
>>
>>10475660
>>10475698
No. Either do just a masters or a masters and a PhD. Two masters would be meaningless.
>>
I did undergrad in math at a low tier SUNY school. 3.5 GPA

What can a brainlet like me do next? I'm thinking about online masters in CS so I can work and lern2code.
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>>10467246
Depends.

One works at Google
One at JP Morgan
One as a SWE at some startup
One is teaching university as well

Many of the others either dropped out or are still slogging away at their theses.
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>>10473298
shameless bump
>>
How did you figure out what you wanted to research? How did you figure out what your novel project would be? Currently a bio undergrad looking to skip straight to a PhD in chemistry.
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>>10476332
What tier of Uni was this? And were they all math PhDs? How relevant was thirty research to industry?
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>>10476038
I got into by working my ass off. Grades were meh (3.67/4). Had major internships that were relevant to the research. Good letters. Research in my school's lab relevant to research I want to do. Overall congruent profile.

It's not that hard. Choose something and get good at it.
>>
Is it worth getting a PhD in a field with high demand at a bad tier university?
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>>10477497
No.
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>>10476332
R1. None of us give a flying fuck about research.
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>>10477497
Only if it's a PhD in Influencer Marketing
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so what's actually the procedure for quitting a paid phd position? I'm technically employed not on a scholarship, but don't have any teaching responsibilities.

Should I just email my supervisor telling them, and the admin lady and then never show up again?
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>>10478292
beta
>>
So turns out I'm not able to get the grades for any semi-decent program. Any ways to game the system or is this path of my life ended?
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>>10478292
usually you should talk to your advisor, and they’ll probably give you the opportunity to instead do a “semester off” instead of really quitting. but if you take that, typically you have to finish the semester and phase yourself out smoothly by handing your work off to / teaching/training someone else. it also gives you time to apply for jobs without being unemployed
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>>10478310
>>10478344
I only started a month or two ago and my supervisor is never free for meetings especially if its administrative related.

Might lie and tell them I'm going back to my home country.
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>>10472152
jesus fuck, chemistry is boring, but I don't actually want t kill myself.
>>
Just learned I have three coworkers with PhDs that work as Data Scientists for a transit agency. Granted two are biological sciences but one has a Phd in Physics from Dartmouth.

Are they going to make it? They've all been here for around 4 years.
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>>10478836
Do you even know the origin of the term "data science"?
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42 KB JPG
>I know what line of research I want to pursue but I can't find a corresponding MRes
What do? Is there a way I can design my own MRes and submit it to a University?



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