Why is it being called "bottom surgery" instead of "genital mutilation"?
Enlighten us, trans sex expert.
>>10375810>eat out a non-opsoooo suck his dick?
>>10375849I think they mean "eat ass"
>>10375857No they mean "eat cock"
>>10375861You sound pretty defensive. We're you denied for your surgery based on your psych eval?
If surgeons could magically turn me into a 10/10 female, that every horny dude would be dying to fuck, I would have the operation in an instant. Even as someone who doesn't identify as female but likes dudes. Otherwise, I would never do it.
>>10375849the pussy has been added but the dick hasn't been removed.>>10375810political correctness>"mutiliation" implies the dick should be there WAAAAAAAAH
>>10375879>the pussy has been added but the dick hasn't been removedWow. Just imagine the possibilities.
>>10375885>>10375879>>10375849they turn the dick into a pussypre-op means they still have a dick
>>10375891To me pre-op means they want the surgery but haven't had it yet, but non-op means they haven't had it and don't intend to.
>>10375885https://youtu.be/PbBzhqJK3bg?t=1704Imagine.>>10375899back to >>>/r/eddit
>>10375899sorry i meant >>10375901 for >>10375898
>>10375810We generally don't call plastic surgery mutilation.
>>10375918most plastic surgery doesn't involve cutting off organs necessary for sexual reproduction.
>>10375920Fine, but we don't use mutilation for it neither. Its genital reassignment surgery. Why do you want to call it mutilation?
>>10375933because the phrase is:>in common use and almost universally accepted>emphasizes the gravity of the decision and the damage you're doing to your body. >"gential reassignment surgery" is cold and euphemistic. designed to be ((((accepting)))) but it gives GM the significance of a pulled tooth or pierced ear .>i think language should change according to natural linguistic drift, not overtly political rightthink campaigns. how much longer do you think i'll be allowed to say "genital mutilation surgery" in the workplace?
>>10375898Annie Sprinkles had a girlfriend who got a dick added, but had a pussy.
>>10375933>Cut off functional organ>Create what is essentially a wound that has to be constantly kept stretched open to avoid healing together>Also in no way does this new "organ" have any of the functionality or any remote similarities beyond being a hole to the organ it is attempting to replicateHow is this not mutilation? Giving it a euphemistic name doesn't change anything.
>>10375937>in common use and almost universally acceptedMutilation generally used when we talk about unwilling and needless surgery that damages. GRS is done willingly and been shown as effective in treating gender-dysphoria.>emphasizes the gravity of the decisionIn the real world doctors have to explain the gravity and implications and make sure its understood before they do anything.> how much longer do you think i'll be allowed to say "genital mutilation surgery" in the workplace?You're not getting a job anytime soon, don't worry about it. >>10375947Don't get your your information on GRS from /pol/. Its a serious operation, but the result can be very good if the patient is lucky. They are functional, can get wet and even have female orgasms.
>>10375879>the pussy has been added but the dick hasn't been removed.That's not how it works. The pussy is made from the dick.
>>10375965>if the patient is luckyWow great surgery, 10/10>Female orgasmsHahahahahahahahahaHahahaHa
>>10375933Why do you call bilateral orchiotomy, ie, castration, and full hysterectomy "neutering" or "getting them fixed"? Why do you want to do that? Invent your own language and terms for what already has a name?Could it be, through redefinition, you are trying to detach and hide from the true basis and nature of your actions?
>discord trannies on /sci/help
>>10375965>Mutilation generally used when we talk about unwilling and needless surgery that damages. GRS is done willinglyit does damage, but it is willing. nothing about genital mutilation implies the surgery is nonconsentual.>In the real world doctors have to explain the gravity and implications and make sure its understood before they do anything.obviously, the phrases used to describe a procedure shape how individuals think about it and how public discourse surrounding it unfolds.>You're not getting a job anytime soon, don't worry about it. my first day was yesterday, retard.>ur from /pol/!!predictable and bluepilled.
>>10375974redpill me on pussies made from dicks
>>10375981Because all these terms already have a different meaning. Why is this so important for you to call it mutilation? The suicide rate for people with gender dysphoria is really high, and things like hormone therapy and GRS have been shown as effective in treating it, just telling them they are a man and should deal with it has never worked. Just as telling gay people they are stridighet has never worked.
>>10375994>can't defend position>immediately pivots to tranny suicideyawn.> just telling them they are a man and should deal with it has never worked. Just as telling gay people they are stridighet has never worked.tremendous strawman. but i guess you had to get those upvotes.
>>10375965I recommend watching this video.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mtQ1geeD_c>>10375988You can look up videos of it. Pretty much the gist of it is penis is degloved its nerves extracted, some parts turned inside out, others used for other things. An orifice is formed and these parts are incorporated.Imagine having the nerve root providing you with the ability to experience (physical) sexual pleasure exposed and worked around, all the potential for accidents. This has gone much too far. People don't realize that sex change research actually began with a queen of England. I can't remember the details, might have been the one that bathed in blood for youth.
>>10375988Pussy's and dicks pretty much have all the same parts, only different. Clit = dickhead, scrotum = labia etc. They shuffle it around to make a pussy basically.
>>10375988Just about everything is cut out. The penis is inverted, the glans is greatly reduced, and made into a clit, and the scrotum is used as labia. This is assuming that some money has been spent. Also recommend beforehand is electrolysis to permanently remove hair.Also, the body want to heal the wound, so manual dilation is required.Renting the average whore will find you with someone much more sane and well adjusted.
>>10376001I'm saying it has been shown as effective treatment for gender dysphoria. So why do you insist on calling it mutilation?
>>10375994>Because all these terms already have a different meaning.I'm drawing a parallel with what we do to domestic animals. And no, the meaning is the same, the word has been changed. This is the same method Orwell described in 1984. Even further back Gustave Le Bon, Goebels, etc. Very old trick.>The suicide rate for people with gender dysphoria is really highIt is equally high after the surgery that was supposed to bring them peace, security, and clarity. It doesn't work, this was known long ago.>Just as telling gay people they are stridighet has never worked.Not relevant. LGB | T. The piggyback method and culture of walking on eggshells has been very useful. This has happened before. Know what's next? Pederasty then pedophilia. Just a different kind of love, but real love, to be sure! Athens, Rome, Ancient China, probably Japan in its Edo period. Etc. Done before. Know how it turns out. Sign of late stage cultures collapsing.
>>10376014I've already explained that. It's an accurate description of what's happening. I acknowledge it can be useful for some people but I'll call it mutilation until you show me that removing an important external organ somehow doesn't constitute that.
>>10376023>And no, the meaning is the same, the word has been changed. This is the same method Orwell described in 1984. im being pedantic but orwell's point was that changing words changes the meaning you express and how the concept is processed.
>>10376023>It is equally high after the surgery that was supposed to bring them peace, security, and clarity. It doesn't work, this was known long ago.This isn't true. The studie you're referring to keeps being misused to the point that the autor has come out and said it doesn't show what people want it to show. People are comparing high risk cases to lower risk cases to claim this point.>>10376023>I'm drawing a parallel with what we do to domestic animals. And no, the meaning is the same, the word has been changed. This is the same method Orwell described in 1984. Even further back Gustave Le Bon, Goebels, etc. Very old trick.You're the one who insists on controlling already well established langunge, GRS has never been called mutilation.
>>10376005>People don't realize that sex change research actually began with a queen of England. I can't remember the details, might have been the one that bathed in blood for youth.hmmm... sauce?
SO /sci/, what is the scientific way to diy cut off my balls?
>>10376113it all starts with the skull
>>10376116why are you so mean anon? i fucking hate being in this flesh suit
>>10376045That wasn't a queen of England. That was Countess Elizabeth Bathory of Hungary. Worth checking out. Not sure about the genital mutilation thing though.
>>10376006The real question here is if an OP on a circumcised male-to-female is actually FGM and so the doctor must be imprisoned.Also what does the equivalent of circumsision for females do?
>>10376137Oh, so it is the clitoral hood: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clitoral_hood
>>10376041>The studie you're referring to keeps being misused to the point that the autor has come out and said it doesn't show what people want it to show.Which study do you have in mind?>GRS has never been called mutilation.I'm not exerting control over anything, I'm just calling the underlying procedure and ideology what it is. The fact is these people are being preyed upon and systematically duped on multiple fronts, both by the overarching culture, what's being done to their biology and family structure, and various echo chambers people might find themselves in on the internet. Where suddenly they have the "answers" and then, like any cult, once they get love bombed and finally have that security they're given an agenda to push. And for it, we're all getting screwed. Everyone.Contrary to what many people are implicitly taught by their culture, your body is ultimately for enjoyment. Many things prevent this, but if desired, it should be there to be enjoyed. And I don't mean only sexually, I mean what your body is and provides is something you can derive value and comfort from. This is what the body should be, and generally unless you try real hard to fuck something up, that's exactly what it is.Surgically altering or in fact mangling the body will never provide peace. It will not get rid of the contrast between within and without. You're just a distorted and gimped version of what you started with. You cannot become the other sex. Running and dissociation produces pain. You will still be miserable. Lies only make people happy at first, then they're worse than the bitter truth.>>10376113You cannot become Lain. Accept your balls.
>>10375868I might agree with you here, even if that is kind of gayWhich sort of makes me wonder what percentage of the tranny population is taking their perversions too far
>>10376113Rubber bands around your balls until they die. Speaking from experience it hurts like hell after the first hour though
>>10375965>They are functional, can get wet and even have female orgasms.Fun fact: They can get "wet" because the lining is made from colon tissue. The "lubrication" is intestinal mucus.
>>10377573I can't think about this surgery and not get sickHormone therapy is one thing, but this is downright primitive. If it's above mutilation, it's only barely so.
>>10377600If only you knew how bad things really are...
>>10375937Aaaand you immediately go to MUH JEWSBack to /pol/.
>>10377605Ok I've actually seen this one before, the sad part is that these people only find out way after surgery, when there's no going back.I sort of hope for their sake that at some point real organs can be transplanted, because stuff like this depresses me.
>>10377573That’s pretty hot, but I prefer anal over actual vaginas anyway.
>>10377573>>10377605All of this and they still want to pretend they're real women. This type of self destructive behavior is definitely pathological.
>>10377898They are real women, since their gender is female.
>>10377902Not even their gender is female. They're caricatures of women.
>>10377902Not if chromosomes have anything to say about it
>>10377902>their gender is femaleIs it? Let's ignore chromosomes and genitals and focus on the social aspects of gender: Trans women are>raised as boys>lack formative social experience with females >unless they pass, which very few do, everyone treats them as a male or an androgynous weirdo
If we ever get to the point where we could change every single cell in their body to have XX chromosomes (or XY for the FtM), would you accept them as being the sex they transition to?Maybe by somehow creating a culture of the new DNA inside some type of virus or something that would inject the DNA into the cells, and putting it in a gas or something, and having them breath in the new infected cells into their lungs which would be picked up by the bloodstream and sent throughout the body to infect all the cells in their body changing their entire DNA structure in their whole body at once.
So just to be clear this: they expect you to be fine with buggering a man because he calls himself a woman now.
>>10377929That raises questions over the legitimacy of the conditionWhat if you do it on somebody who never had any problems with gender identity? Would he or she take it well, or exhibit behaviors similar to trannies? What is the ultimate cause for it? Are trannies insane? (probably)
>>10377923Gender isn’t related to chromosomes.>>10377911Yes it is, since they identify as such.>>raised as boysIrrelevant.>>lack formative social experience with females Wrong. Feminine males can and do enter female social circles.>>unless they pass, which very few do, everyone treats them as a male or an androgynous weirdoNot true, and irrelevant.
>>10377946Nope. Being trans was never a mental illness.
>>10378004What about what I identify them as? If a computer tells me repeatedly that it's human, should I then believe it's human? Does its purported self perception truly define its actual nature?
>>10378004Yeah gender is an independent dice roll, not like 99% of the time you can figure out anybody's gender by looking at just chromosomes
>>10375810Sucking cock is amazing. If I had a trans gf I wouldn't let her get the surgery
>>10378011>What about what I identify them as?Irrelevant. You can’t say “I promise” for someone else and make it so that they promised something. They only “promise” if they say they do.>If a computer tells me repeatedly that it's human, should I then believe it's human?Species is not gender.
>>10378012Most people are cis. We know.
>>10378017>Short shorts and thigh high socks in GermanyMasculine>ElsewhereStockings, and feminine.>ScotlandKilts, masculine.>ElsewhereSkirt, feminine.Gender is not gender.
>>10378028Then don't be spouting lies from your faggot mouthIt's a well known fact that trannies make up a small part of the population and a large part of shitposts that nobody wants to see
>>10375810for the same reason they call it a vagina instead of a puss hole, once the operation is done
Hhhhmmmmmm, state and media (power structure) supported and encouraged stupidity. I wonder why someone would want to do that...
>>10375810"Genital mutilation" is commonly associated with circumcision.While it would be funny to associate devout christians with the transgendered, I don't think the usage would catch on.
>>10378098Jesus loosely condemned circumcision."Circumcision is not of the Lord, but of the patriarch."
>>10378041Never lied about anything, honey. Gender is not related to chromosomes. They are independent things.>>10378029You’ve finally figured out the relative nature of gender norms. Congrats! I agree. A trans woman could continue to dress like a cis male and that’d be fine, because cis women can dress masculine too and that doesn’t stop them from being women.
>>10378118>Congrats! I agree.So why alter the body?
>>10378132Because of gender dysphoria.
>>10378132I don’t know, I’m not trans and I don’t experience gender dysphoria! I don’t see any particular reason to associate certain genitalia with any gender. Plenty of trans people don’t experience dysphoria in this sense, but some people are still bothered by this and associate certain genitalia with certain genders, so they may seek surgery to make their anatomy more in line with what they’d prefer. Me, personally, I’d like to become a hermaphrodite with both a true vagina and penis as well as tits and purple skin, but this desire is from curiosity and boredom.
>>10375810bottom surgery sounds like getting butt-implants
>ruining a perfectly good cock
>>10377932>So just to be clear this: they expect you to be fine with buggering a man because he calls himself a woman now.no it's transexual anon, the person having sex with the transexual is not gay or homosexual
>>10378142Essentially:>Attempt to erode contrast between inner and outerWhich is a well noted failed avenue.Refer to:>>10376005
isn't it amazing how many pro-tranny posters there are on 4chan? honestly there must be 10x more trannies than cis-women here; last time i saw a post by a woman on /sci/ it was a post about debugging python code like three weeks ago and she didn't even respond after /sci/ found her bug
>>10378198>>Attempt to erode contrast between inner and outerI think current technology is very insufficient for satisfactory faux genitals. Wake me up when we grow vaginas in testtubes and then implant them or something.
>>10378198>Which is a well noted failed avenue.This is just wrong, SRS is effective in treating gender dysphoria, this has been studied, we dont need a youtube video.https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19816764>In conclusion, almost all patients were satisfied with the sex reassignment; 86% were assessed by clinicians at follow-up as stable or improved in global functioning.https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11314574>Postoperatively the treated group was no longer gender-dysphoric and was psychologically and socially functioning quite well. Nobody expressed regrets concerning the decision to undergo sex reassignment. Without sex reassignment, the nontreated group showed some improvement, but they also showed a more dysfunctional psychological profile.https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16362252>After SRS, the transsexual person's expectations were met at an emotional and social level, but less so at the physical and sexual level even though a large number of transsexuals (80%) reported improvement of their sexuality.
>>10378223Watch the video.
>>10378236>Teens4Truth Conference>Totally misrepresents at least one Swedish studie>Nothing sourcedWhy are you taking this guy's opinion over actual studies? This is basically just an appeal to his authority because he is a doctor I guess? This video is full of non-sequiturs and anecdote. This isn't science.
>>10378270He was involved in the early stages of the field and had a chance to watch it form, and also provides insight into the control structure behind how they manufacture data.Debunk him if you can.
>>10378297>He was involved in the early stages of the field and had a chance to watch it formThere are far more people working on with this than this Christian conservative doctor. He still needs numbers to back up his claims. Show that his method of therapy and look into the family is outperforming what is currently accepted as effective treatment. >Debunk him if you can.Debunk what exactly? His opinions on gender? His anecdotes? Common, this just isn't science.
>>10375868you might be a fag
where did the whole "be strong. learn to accept who you are." turn into "safe places. the world needs to adapt to me"I support you OP
>>10378358>safe places. the world needs to adapt to meLast I checked, OP is the one who is demanding that the world should cater to his views. I dont know why trans people getting what has been shown as effective treatment is so triggering for people.
>>10375810Why do we call what we do to house pets "spay and neuter" or "getting fixed", instead of bilateral orchiotomy, castration, or full hysterectomy?
>>10378454Because pet owners need to convince themselves they're not committing animal abuse when they cut their dog's balls off and lock it in an apartment for 22 hours a day.
>>10378213Most of the trannyposting is organized by discord groups, google Reiko if you're not aware of this already.
>>10376014>it's so effective, they all kill themselves after a few years
>>10378577This isn't true.
>>10378586You're not true.
>>10375810>genital mutilationLike circumcision
>>10378358Science advanced so that we don't have to be strong(cucked) anymore. Now we can change the world to adapt for us.
>>10378599Foreskin is important. I find it upsetting that so many men have been denied bodily respect and integrity. The effects are far reaching.
>>10375965>effective treatmentbut thats fucking wrong
>>10378627Its not, see>>10378223
How are people still fucking up the correct usage of gender and sex? Jesus fucking christ.
>>10378358youre about 2200 year too late for a culture that understands stoicism my dude
>>10378028Why even call it "cis"? It should be called normal.You don't say people without HIV/AIDS as "non-HIV"
>>10378642Every successful civilization dominated boys.Especially Turks. They banged white twink slave boys.
>>10375994>Just as telling gay people they are stridighet has never worked.how come it is supposed to work on pedophiles?
>>10378714>how come it is supposed to work on pedophiles?Is it?
Why has this place turned into /pol/? Wasn't this bad 5 years ago.I don't get all the recent trans hate, this surgery has existed since the 1930s and nobody ever cared about it beyond the occasional joke. Now suddenly it's "mutilation" pushed by the "jews" as part of their "global agenda"
>>10378754It is an agenda. Look what it does to a culture, look what it's capable of, and look what is going on around it. You'd be a fool to not realize how it's a predatory instrument of the power structure.
>>10378017species and gender are biological
>>10378773Traits are biological. How we decide to group them and what we value is not biological.
>>10378772What does it do to culture? Explain how transgender rights will bring about the collapse of civilisation? The funny thing is bigots said the same thing about the gays 30 years ago "it's a lifestyle choice", "indoctrinating kids", "everyone is going to be gay by 2000"
Thank you, that's the most disgusting headline I've ever read.
>>10378773And it's determined by the wiring of your brain, not your chromosomes. Aside from the general hatred of LGBT the other cause of transphobia is that mental illness is still not taken seriously. Literally why transgender activists pushed for it to be no longer classified as a mental illness. I disagree with this but when "mental illness" is used as a paradoxical reason for why the sufferer should be laughed at and beaten up instead of treated I can see why they wanted it changed.
>>10378791Part of a broader agenda.>>10378634This has happened before.
>>10378822>Just look around>/sci/ - Science & MathNice dude.
>>10378822Honestly you're right, there is an agenda to destroy masculinity but it is the feminists who are behind it which is an actual real ideological organisation unlike transsexuals who are just unconnected individuals who want to live their lives. Ironically feminists hate transsexuals. You see transsexualism ruins their theory that male and female brains are identical, for this reason I am surprised that /sci/ is also anti transsexual.
>>10378791But everyone IS gay now.
>>10379276Loads of people were always bisexual (see roman times), but in the modern age they were forced to hide it until now.
>>10376001As a kid I remember really concentrating to try and conjure up both fireballs and lightning bolts in my hands, it used to annoy the hell out of me that the real world wasn't like the fantasy cartoons I used to watch, I remember wishing that magic to come a reality. The reality is me being annoyed about something that I don't have control over is a pointless effort and it is better to accept reality to what it is. This mutilation, indoctrination and drug intoxication is much more of a delusion than rather an actual remedy for transgender people. In the future I hope we can give these people the body they want but right now it just seems barbaric.
>>10375810Why not just say sex change. You're both playing a stupid game.
>>10379666Because they're not changing their sex. Their chromosomes are still XY, their bodies won't produce eggs, etc. They are still males, just with mutilated bodies
>>10375810It's because autogynephilic Transbians want to feel affirmed as "real women" rather than keeping their micro-dicks like Homosexual-Transsexuals.
>>10375810because genitals are in no way a useful or important organ.cutting off your dick is completely different than cutting off your arm or ear.arms and ears are useful, genitals are not and one should be able to do with them as he pleases.
>>10379799being able to reproduce is a basic function of life. It's more important than an arm or ear
>>10379814no it's not. reproducing does not help your survival.I don't like kids and never gonna have them. If you like reproducing so much go ahead and do it. Trannies are actually helping your (minuscule)chances.
>>10379866>reproducing does not help your survival.Grown children contribute greatly to your survival as you age. Even in today's society, you will simply be leeching off somebody else's kids for your social security benefits.
>>10379901not if you are rich
>>10379905People who get rich generally aren't mentally deficient. People who don't want to have kids are mentally deficient.
>>10379901And moreover it's not just about survival.It's more about quality of life.Because theoretically person who chopped their arm off, could survive just fine, but he would have intentionally reduced his QoL, which means he is insane.A penis does not add to your quality of life in any way.Chopping it off does not reduce your QoL, and therefore does not make you insane.In fact it is quite the contrary. People who reproduce are the crazy ones, since they have kids, which dramatically reduce your quality of life.
>>10378358>unironically not realizing this doesn't better describe the right-wingers projecting onto them.Fuck /pol/ for bringing all the facebookers here. Right win normies everywhere now.
>>10379916You are mentally deficient. Why do you even want to have kids?Because society says so? Because you are afraid of being alone when you are old?In the first case you are just a brainless sheeples, so mentally deficient.In the second case you are just a pussy, which is also a mental deficiency.But there is also a third case. Maybe you want to contribute to the survival of the human race.This is even more retarded, because you are sacrificing your personal well-being, for the hypothetical well-being of the human race, as if the survival of the human race is some sacred end-goal that we should all aspire to.Protip: It's not. The human race's survival is important as long as it benefits me as an individual. Sacrificing yourself for the human race is a paradox. And only mentally ill people base their lives on paradoxes.
>>10379922>>10379932>A penis does not add to your quality of life in any way.Chopping off your penis and inverting it into a neovagina that leaks piss and shit everywhere, loses a lot of the feeling due to scar tissue.Also there's a risk of teratoma because it's such a traumatic injury. That's when hair (and more rarely, teeth, eyeballs, and brain cells) begin to develop in a wound because the injury is so traumatic the body doesn't know what it's even supposed to be replacing.People with children live longer and happier lives than those who don't have them.Crawl back into your discord, Reiko
>>10375933You don't "reassign" the genitalsYou remove them
>>10379948And even if everything you just said is true, which it isn't, but even if it was what is your problem?Sexual reproduction is a competition. Trannies, faggots and people who don't want kids remove themselves from the genepool and the competition.So why do you attack them instead of thanking them.Unless you don't actually want to have kids?
>>10375985>feeling the need to reply to that postOof
>>10379948Someone had to save r9k mate
>>10375810It can be both
>>10375941>a girlfriend who got a dick added, but had a pussy.what?
>>10375810Why is it called transgenderism instead of gender dismorphia? Because there is no money in curing/treating the later.
>>10378772>You'd be a fool to not realize how it's a predatory instrument of the power structure.(((((((((((((((((((they))))))))))))))))))))Get off this board cretin
>>10378773https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/gender>"... especially when considered with reference to social and cultural differences rather than biological ones"How does it feel to be illiterate and retarded simultaneously?https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/simultaneouslyhttps://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/illiterateJust in case youre not clear on those either
>>10375810>bottom surgeryeuhhh it's called Gender Confirmation Surgery, you shitlord
>>10377228>Which sort of makes me wonder what percentage of the tranny population is taking their perversions too fartranny here, it's definitely 100%
neo vag ≠ real vagyou cant replicate the nonkeratinized epithelium of the vagina or the muscles.
>>10375965>Mutilation generally used when we talk about unwilling and needless surgery that damages. GRS is done willingly and been shown as effective in treating gender-dysphoria.Please define "gender-dysphoria". Then explain how it can be measured scientifically. Then show evidence that trans surgery results in meaningful improvements of said measurements.Oh, you can't do any of that? No problem, I guess we can just take your word for it and blithely continue to castrate sexually-abused teenagers