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File: earth3sa.jpg (548 KB, 2048x2048)
548 KB
548 KB JPG
https://apnews.com/aaf1091c5aae40b0a110daaf04950672

People are putting nature in more trouble now than at any other time in human history, with extinction looming over 1 million species of plants and animals, scientists said Monday.

But it’s not too late to fix the problem, according to the United Nations’ first comprehensive report on biodiversity.

“We have reconfigured dramatically life on the planet,” report co-chairman Eduardo Brondizio of Indiana University said at a press conference.

Species loss is accelerating to a rate tens or hundreds of times faster than in the past, the report said. More than half a million species on land “have insufficient habitat for long-term survival” and are likely to go extinct, many within decades, unless their habitats are restored. The oceans are not any better off.

“Humanity unwittingly is attempting to throttle the living planet and humanity’s own future,” said George Mason University biologist Thomas Lovejoy, who has been called the godfather of biodiversity for his research. He was not part of the report.

“The biological diversity of this planet has been really hammered, and this is really our last chance to address all of that,” Lovejoy said.

Conservation scientists from around the world convened in Paris to issue the report, which exceeded 1,000 pages. The Intergovernmental Science-Policy Platform on Biodiversity and Ecosystem Services (IPBES) included more than 450 researchers who used 15,000 scientific and government reports. The report’s summary had to be approved by representatives of all 109 nations.

Some nations hit harder by the losses, like small island countries, wanted more in the report. Others, such as the United States, were cautious in the language they sought, but they agreed “we’re in trouble,” said Rebecca Shaw, chief scientist for the World Wildlife Fund, who observed the final negotiations.
>>
“This is the strongest call we’ve seen for reversing the trends on the loss of nature,” Shaw said.

The findings are not just about saving plants and animals, but about preserving a world that’s becoming harder for humans to live in, said Robert Watson, a former top NASA and British scientist who headed the report.

“We are indeed threatening the potential food security, water security, human health and social fabric” of humanity, Watson told The Associated Press.

It’s also an economic and security issue as countries fight over scarcer resources. Watson said the poor in less developed countries bear the greatest burden.

The report’s 39-page summary highlighted five ways people are reducing biodiversity:

— Turning forests, grasslands and other areas into farms, cities and other developments. The habitat loss leaves plants and animals homeless. About three-quarters of Earth’s land, two-thirds of its oceans and 85% of crucial wetlands have been severely altered or lost, making it harder for species to survive, the report said.

— Overfishing the world’s oceans. A third of the world’s fish stocks are overfished.

— Permitting climate change from the burning of fossil fuels to make it too hot, wet or dry for some species to survive. Almost half of the world’s land mammals — not including bats — and nearly a quarter of the birds have already had their habitats hit hard by global warming.

— Polluting land and water. Every year, 300 to 400 million tons of heavy metals, solvents and toxic sludge are dumped into the world’s waters.

— Allowing invasive species to crowd out native plants and animals. The number of invasive alien species per country has risen 70% since 1970, with one species of bacteria threatening nearly 400 amphibian species.

“The key to remember is, it’s not a terminal diagnosis,” said report co-author Andrew Purvis of the Natural History Museum in London.
>>
>>392723
This is why young people care about the environment. The planet will survive the next extinction event. We won't.
>>
Fighting climate change and saving species are equally important, the report said, and working on both environmental problems should go hand in hand. Both problems exacerbate each other because a warmer world means fewer species, and a less biodiverse world means fewer trees and plants to remove heat-trapping carbon dioxide from the air, Lovejoy said.

The world’s coral reefs are a perfect example of where climate change and species loss intersect. If the world warms another 0.9 degrees (0.5 degrees Celsius), which other reports say is likely, coral reefs will probably dwindle by 70% to 90%, the report said. At 1.8 degrees (1 degree Celsius), the report said, 99% of the world’s coral will be in trouble.

“Business as usual is a disaster,” Watson said.

At least 680 species with backbones have already gone extinct since 1600. The report said 559 domesticated breeds of mammals used for food have disappeared. More than 40% of the world’s amphibian species, more than one-third of the marine mammals and nearly one-third of sharks and fish are threatened with extinction.

The report relies heavily on research by the International Union for the Conservation of Nature, or IUCN, which is composed of biologists who maintain a list of threatened species.

The IUCN calculated in March that 27,159 species are threatened, endangered or extinct in the wild out of nearly 100,000 species biologists examined in depth. That includes 1,223 mammal species, 1,492 bird species and 2,341 fish species. Nearly half the threatened species are plants.

Scientists have only examined a small fraction of the estimated 8 million species on Earth.

The report comes up with 1 million species in trouble by extrapolating the IUCN’s 25% threatened rate to the rest of the world’s species and using a lower rate for the estimated 5.5 million species of insects, Watson said.

Outside scientists, such as Lovejoy and others, said that’s a reasonable assessment.
>>
The report gives only a generic “within decades” time frame for species loss because it is dependent on many variables, including taking the problem seriously, which can reduce the severity of the projections, Watson said.

“We’re in the middle of the sixth great extinction crisis, but it’s happening in slow motion,” said Conservation International and University of California Santa Barbara ecologist Lee Hannah, who was not part of the report.

Five times in the past, Earth has undergone mass extinctions where much of life on Earth blinked out, like the one that killed the dinosaurs. Watson said the report was careful not to call what’s going on now as a sixth big die-off because current levels don’t come close to the 75% level in past mass extinctions.

The report goes beyond species. Of the 18 measured ways nature helps humans, the report said 14 are declining, with food and energy production noticeable exceptions. The report found downward trends in nature’s ability to provide clean air and water, good soil and other essentials.

Habitat loss is one of the biggest threats, and it’s happening worldwide, Watson said. The report projects 15.5 million miles (25 million kilometers) of new roads will be paved over nature between now and 2050, most in the developing world.
>>
Many of the worst effects can be prevented by changing the way we grow food, produce energy, deal with climate change and dispose of waste, the report said. That involves concerted action by governments, companies and people.

Individuals can help with simple changes to the way they eat and use energy, said the co-chairman of the report, ecological scientist Josef Settele of the Helmholtz Center for Environmental Research in Germany. That doesn’t mean becoming a vegetarian or vegan, but balancing meat, vegetables and fruit, and walking and biking more, Watson said.

“We can actually feed all the coming billions of people without destroying another inch of nature,” Lovejoy said. Much of that can be done by eliminating food waste and being more efficient, he said.

Link to the report: https://www.ipbes.net/news/Media-Release-Global-Assessment
>>
Another report from "scientists" which concludes that we're all going to die unless we institute global communism.
It's all so tiring.
>>
>>392731
Yeah, there is a great communist conspiracy. Animals are killing themselves in the name of communism now. Okay schizo.
>>
>>392726
They always have to paint a silver lining in these reports so people feel the need to do something, but we're seriously fucked, mainly because of brainlets like >>392731 who think preventing a mass extinction of our own doing will make Stalin rise from the grave.
>>
>>392731
>Cyka blyat, kill the planet, the planet is capitalist, da tovaritsch!

Do you have any idea how retarded that sounds?
>>
>>392731
How about this: You die and we won't need to put up with your retarded mindthink. Sound good?
>>
>>392731
what's fucking tiring is you babbling on about commies you fucking cretin
>>
>>392733
Yeah, I noticed that optimistic tone to the report and others before it.

>But it’s not too late to fix the problem, according to the United Nations’ first comprehensive report on biodiversity.
Why do i always see this sorta phrase? Is it true? Or are the scientists simply trying not to encourage humanity to fuck over Earth more since we’re past the point of no return? Perhaps if only we knew how bad things really are
>>
>>392783
If the Trump administration's environmental report was any indication, people would use this as free license to keep fucking things over because what's the difference, we're all dead anyway.

As long as there is a tiny sliver of hope we have to pursue it.
>>
At least we could say that we tried.
>>
Let me guess. They want to tax carbon while bringing in more refugees? Do you want a yellow vest movement in North America? Cause that's how you get one.
>>
>>392731
imagine actually thinking communists run the world...
>>
>>392949
really makes you wonder how deep these people are in their psychological delusions
>>
>>392945
>muh free markets
>>
>>392945
>tax carbon
We're well past that bullshit. Massive systematic changes are needed in a very short time-frame. Best case if we actually do it is we have a really shitty next few hundred years but eventually things should slowly recover. Worst case the planet becomes inhospitable for carbon-based lifeforms and we're all fucked. Taxes, credits and voluntary targets have only gotten us closer to the worst case scenario.
>>
Browsing the /pol/ thread about this article pretty much convinced me that we're all fucked, but I'm still holding out hope that some real changes can be made once Trump gets the boot.
>>
>>392971
You're as retarded as they are.
>>
We should just go full Caves Of Steel mode.
>>
>>392995
Thanks for the info bud
>>
>>392731
>Another report from "scientists" which concludes that we're all going to die unless we institute global communism.
>>392970
>Massive systematic changes are needed in a very short time-frame.
Yep. There it is.
>>
>>392971

People are too lazy to make 'real' changes anon, you should know that by now. The best we can do is delay the inevitable, or hope a mega-volcano wipes us out, an asteroid wipes us out, or anything that is sudden rather will take 50-150 yeers. At least when it comes to a giant space rock we can't delude ourselves into thinking 'we can do something lol'. It's already too late.
>>
>>393018
I'll admit I'm not the most knowledgeable about all the negative feedback shit we've already got ourselves into, but I would hope the steady stream of doomsday studies/articles on climate are starting to wake some people up. If we can get some real action via the government to move to nuclear+renewables, and have technology keep progressing in the carbon capture front I still have some hope. Really technological progress is the only thing that I have real hope in at this point.
>>
>>392723
>“Humanity unwittingly is attempting to throttle the living planet and humanity’s own future,”
I wouldn't say unwittingly
>>
>>393014
fine anon, you can have your changes via nature and catastrophic climate change instead.
>>
>>393043
> I wouldn't say unwittingly
Yeah, it's pretty obvious that it's not unwittingly at all.
As the attempts by the powerful to deny the ecological damage have grown increasingly unbelievable, they've started switching to a new tactic:
First they said it wasn't happening.
Then they said that it's just natural.
Now they're saying it's really a good thing.
That looks an awful lot like someone who always knew what was going on, but was just stalling for time until nothing can be done about it.
>>
>>393026
These days technology can only advance when it's the most profitable thing that the investors can be do with the money invested. That means something that would benefit everyone will not be developed, because there isn't an effective way of profit off of something where the benefits cannot be restricted to the people who pay for it.
>>
>>393013
You're welcome.
>>
>>392726
Why should "we" survive if "we're" the ones killing the planet?
Every time some retard comes along and tries to "fix" everything like replacing gasoline engines with battery operated ones, we find out that the process to produce said batteries is more toxic that gasoline engines can ever be.
>>
its safe to assume everything is irreversibly fucked and saving stuff is delusional so i say we should just pave over everything strip mine it all and build megacities that we subsist in on a diet of genetically engineered fungi/algae and a steady supply of video games
>>
>>393100
>diet of genetically engineered
maggots, it's a real thing.
>>
>>392726
The proverbial plot twist here is that humanity itself is the next extinction level event.
>>
I guess its time to take the varg pill boys
see yah in the woods :)
>>
>>393097
>Every time some retard comes along and tries to "fix" everything like replacing gasoline engines with battery operated ones, we find out that the process to produce said batteries is more toxic that gasoline engines can ever be.
Not true. Try again champ.
>>
>>393115
You should read the Sixth extinction. It’s in the title. Good book
>>
>>393200
Well maybe the mining process of these rare earth elements for the batteries is wasteful and polluting. And the fossil fuels burnt to create the power needed for such operations is excessive. In that same vein, it’s like paper or plastic bags. Paper is biodegradable but kills trees and needs more resources to make. Plastic is cheap, strong, and easy to mass produce, but can’t decompose and turns to trash. Trade offs you know? Although I agree that green is the future, no exceptions
>>
>>393219
>Well maybe the mining process of these rare earth elements for the batteries is wasteful and polluting.

Just like every type of production. But recycling makes that problem almost non-existent compared to problem called climate change. The scale difference of those problems is huge.
>>
Meh
>>
Funny how everyone is going around screaming their heads off like it's the end of the world.
What we need is just some sensible regulations, some limits, some good governing of the economy everything is fixed.
>>
>>392971
/pol/ is representative of a madhouse, not the general public.
>>
>>393230
Jesus Christ what a bunch of meaningless platitudes

You’d fit right in at Washington
>>
>>393235
>laws and regulations are meaningless platitudes
>>
>>393238
>If we make good laws and regulations then good things will happen,
>if governing body governs good, good things will happen
That’s what you said, bland meaningless platitudes, so again I’d look into politics anon, you’d fit right in
>>
>>393238
What laws, regulations, and how to enforce them? We don't have time to waffle about generalities now.
>>
>>393238
Just saying general words like "laws and regulations" without giving anything specific is basically a bunch of meaningless platitudes. What laws? What regulations? What good governing? Those are words, not actual ideas about what should be done. It's like if you're running a war and the sum total of your strategy is "use the military." Okay, great. We kind of figured it would involve that, but how should it be used? In what way? You've said absolutely nothing of substance to answer the real questions, you've only given a statement that is so generic and vague as to be useless.
>>
>>392723
We just need more taxes on pollution while China and India do jack shit.
>>
>>393246
Don’t forget news coverage that basically blames the west for all the worlds problems while sucking Chinese/Muslim dick
>>
>>393239
>>393242
>>393244
Anti-consumerism taxes would be a start. That would take care of the externalities of frivolous consumerism.
Beyond that, directly banning or heavily taxing materials and processes that do lots of harm.
Even beyond that you can augment environmental conservationist laws to protect and even enlarge natural habitats. And to be proactive about it too. Instead of just limiting the harmful interaction, you can also start programs to reintroduce flora and fauna were they have gone extinct.

There is lots of stuff we can do if only there is political will. It's not economically or technologically impossible. It is just that our politicians are captured by capitalists and corrupted to the point that they only care about making those same capitalists richer.
>>
>>393246
>>393254
Pushing blame isn't going to get us out of this shit, it's either we do this (fuck taxes btw) or we die.
>>
>>393246
I hate China as much as anyone here but at least they have waves of nuclear plants bring built and coming online, have infrastructural support for electric buses and great public transit, and per capita their emissions are far lower than the US.
>>
>>393430
the first country that will come up with a fully functional thorium plant will hit a real jackpot
maybe the us energy dpt is working hard on it without investing in any U/Pu designs to save on funds
that's the best i wish on you guys
>>
>>393280
so start by declaring war on China and India, they're putting out far too much pollution.
>>
>>393463
The military is one of the biggest contributers to pollution, so you're proposing accelerating to our death.
>>
>>393262
couple of good bits on youtube about neo-liberalism and climate change you'd appreciate.
>>
>>393225
>recycling makes that problem almost non-existent
Are you implying that
a) recycling recovers close to 100% of the materials with little to no waste
b) recycling doesn't consume resources to perform, resources that also leave behind waste
>>
The whole world is working around a system that is fucking us into the ground. Growth. IF growth stops, everything shuts down.
Nothing will change. It can not change without major collapse. No one wants that.
Everything, on every shelf, in every store is made to break and go into the trash can so you have to buy a new one.. Even if we don't use fossil fuels anymore the problem is still. Even if by some godly turn of event we stop climat change. We are still producing garbage/recycling way more than what we can handle.
Any of you ever saw a 70 years old working fridge. ? i do. My dad has one. Never stopped working. That thing is not going to trash. But that is not growth isn't it ?

I always smile when i ear specialst explaining their solution to the problem. Growth is the problem. Pollution is the result. No one ain't going to fix that.
>>
>>393619

Its now growth, its Capitalism in general.
Not exploiting a resource is a sin under Capitalism.
Not believing in infinite growth.
Not believing that the planet has infinite capacity.

Economists preach a fucking cult and we're trapped with a bunch of moron believers in every position of power.
>>
>>393628
Yeah but you got those new Yeezys in 2 days shipping.

You got a kitchen device you never use because you just go out to eat.

You got a custom holder with your cats face on it because you needed it for your new kitchen device.

You got a fridge that orders your groceries when they are going empty because getting food yourself became too hard.

You got a car so you could get to your job, now you have a job to pay off your car, which will depreciate to the point where you will need a new car, all while paying off credit cards and student loans, and your mortgage etc.

Capitalism is a great system I see nothing wrong with it.
>>
>>393628
>Its now growth, its Capitalism in general.
What's the alternative?
>Not exploiting a resource is a sin under Capitalism
Are you familiar with "the tragedy of the commons?"
>Not believing in infinite growth.
How do you propose to control production?
>Not believing that the planet has infinite capacity.
How do you propose to control population?
>Economists preach a fucking cult and we're trapped with a bunch of moron believers in every position of power.
Are you aware that the majority of economists are not capitalist?
>>
>>392731
>we're all going to die unless we institute global communism
>>393628
>its Capitalism in general
So tiring.
>>
>>392731
>we're all going to die unless we institute global communism
>>393230
>some good governing of the economy
So tiring.
>>
>>392731
>we're all going to die unless we institute global communism
>>393262
>Anti-consumerism taxes would be a start.
So tiring.
>>
>>393762
>>393763
>>393764
Go to bed.
>>
>>393761
>What's the alternative?
Did the merchants have to tell the feudalist aristocrats what system they had in place to replace them with?
>the tragedy of the commons
Caused by the enclosures by the capitalists. The common people managed and lived together on their lands together for centuries and millenia without issue until the enclosures happened. It is a staple of capitalist enterprise and can be seen from logging and overfishing, mining, overgrazing, pollution and other externalities from doing business.
>How do you propose to control production?
Kill the god of infinite growth that inevitably leads to wasting resources and causing depressions.
>How do you propose to control population?
Population is less of an issue than resource use. A random fuck in burgerville or eurostan has a bigger impact on global health than 10 guys in a slum.
>Are you aware that the majority of economists are not capitalist?
Are you an ancap using snowflake definitions of capitalism?
>>
>>392789
>>
>>394106
>Did the merchants have to tell the feudalist aristocrats what system they had in place to replace them with?
Are you referring to mercantilism? I'm not seeing how it's a relevant response to my question, unless you're advocating for a return to mercantilism. The question I posed to you is: with what economic system do you propose to replace capitalism?
>>the tragedy of the commons
>Caused by the enclosures by the capitalists.
No. In fact, it has nothing to do with capitalism, because there is no private ownership of property involved.
>The common people managed and lived together on their lands together for centuries and millenia without issue
No. The vast vast VAST majority of history is monarchist and feudal. The land was owned by the sovereign or his vassals. The land Lord determined who worked what parcel, their level of acceptable productivity, settled disputes, and any other real property issue.
>logging and overfishing, mining, overgrazing, pollution, and other externalities
Again, these were not things. Because it was illegal to take from the King's wood without a writ. People were hanged for this.
>>How do you propose to control production?
>Kill the god of infinite growth that inevitably leads to wasting resources and causing depressions.
By what means, exactly? I don't mean to quibble, but you're hand waving and these are important points. Do you expect to set up some kind of production management committee with will oversee orders and allocations?
>>How do you propose to control population?
>Population is less of an issue than resource use. A random fuck in burgerville or eurostan has a bigger impact on global health than 10 guys in a slum.
So, the random fuck in burgerville will have his stuff taken and redistributed to the 10 guys in the slum?
>>Are you aware that the majority of economists are not capitalist?
>Are you an ancap using snowflake definitions of capitalism?
No, I refer to the self-identification done by academic economists.
>>
>>394146
Not him but i don't think anyone's seriously suggesting we do away with capitalism, only that we regulate it, that we hold those elected to power responsible for protecting our rights instead of standing silent while the state is co-opted, controlled, or bought outright by corporate interests.
>>
>>393628
No it's not capitalism. We have feudalism. A few people that control everything. That is not capitalism.
Under capitalism we could have the option to buy a fucking toaster that never turn to shit. Because that could be a profitable option. But we don't.
Nobody on this planet believe in infinite groth. Thinking that some people do is just stupid. But what option do you have. An Iphone or an android ? They will both turn to shit in no time.
>>
>>393762
>>393763
>>393764
>a problem appears that needs to be solved
>no no no, we should do nothing, just pray to the almighty market to have mercy on us
Literally a fucking religion
>>
>>394359
>a toaster that never breaks and results in only a single purchase is more profitable than producing toaster that breaks (which is also cheaper to produce) and need to be rebought
>>
>>394359
>We are a feudalist society because we don't have invincible toaster technology
Kek
I can't even tell if this is a shitpost or not
Either way it made me laugh
>>
>>394359
I've decided to make it my life endeavor to invent and patent the indestructible toaster so I can Usher in the true era of capitalism
Also after reading this post I get the feeling you look like AIDS Skrillex
>>
>>394381
All shitposting aside regulations are only going to do so much good.
it most likely will be the market that saves us from this using carbon capture technology
>>
>>394417
Just download the toaster app frans
>>
>>394418

Muh free market will fix it
>>
>>393234

most americans believe in angels, the world is 6000 years old and deny human effect on climate change.
>>
>>394359
even if your toaster idea was sound, we're not under feudalism right now
there are plenty of systems where only a few are in power, feudalism is only one of them and means a lot more than just that
but the whole toaster thing is retarded, so that's moot to begin with
>>
>>394422
coincidentally, all of these people voted for Trump
>>
>>394418
>sure, we may have fucked up the planet, but we can reverse some of the damage, FOR THOSE WHO CAN PAY US, ofcourse
Fucking lol
>>
>>394447
It's more realistic to believe someone will pay for it rather than it just magically happening for free
So...
Get fucked retard
>>
>>394461
more likely that would have to be a government entity than a business whose sole purpose is to generate revenue
>>
>>394467
I agree, the most likely scenario is a government paying a business that does it
>>
>>394467
> government
> invent new technology
Good one.
>>
>>392723
To quote Michael Crichton,
“Let's be clear. The planet is not in jeopardy. We are in jeopardy. We haven't got the power to destroy the planet - or to save it. But we might have the power to save ourselves.”
>>
>>394461
Something not being free =/= something being for profit
But i wouldn't expect a braindead market fundamentalist to understand this
>>
>>394473
Like internet. Not going to happen.
>inb4 goalpost moving and claims it's not a government entity who came up with it
>>
>>394481
>We haven't got the power to destroy the planet
tell that to a 7-stage teller-ulam design
>>
>>394504
no, the only thing the govt will innovate in is the military sector, i agree.
internet was a military invention.
as far as climate stuff goes, thats not really the governments forte for any govt in the world
>>
>>394481
Timeline was great by him. Heck even his personal story was fire.
>>
>>394893
The idea of government is obsolete. Just run the shit show with algorithms and just get the human element out of managing things.
>>
>>394949
the only way it could happen right now is that lobbies will keep steering the algos behind the scene, which means exactly the same as the current situation except without human puppets shouting standard demagogic crap on tv
>>
>>394384
>>394415
>>394417
>>394428
Really. All you faggots got from this is the word toaster ? And i'm the shitposter.
>We are a feudalist society because we don't have invincible toaster technology
We live in a feudalist society so we don't have options.
>a toaster that never breaks and results in only a single purchase is more profitable than producing toaster that breaks (which is also cheaper to produce) and need to be rebought
Ok. let me explain why i chose the toaster. The same logic applies to everything.
The first models never did break. ( or rarely breaks ) You would have a metal clip that holds the toasts down. The releaser was a small metal twisted spring that under heat would expand and push on the clip. That would release toasts when at proper heat. It is metal on metal. never fails. They still work today.
It is not more expensive to produce. Now, we have electronic control with a defined amount of use before it fails.
My point is that under capitalism we would have the option to still be able to buy that. But we don't. All those that did offer that, have been bought and shut down or simply changed their way to """innovation and progress """".
Wouldn't you buy this toaster that never breaks ? i would if i could. Capitalism and free market would give you that option.
>>394417
Here, saved you time and money by telling you the secret.
>>
>>394980
capitalism gets more money by forcing you to consume breakable toasters
anyone building unbreakable toasters will be pressured by the toaster lobby to sell their patents or just disappear because they do not follow the brand new toaster regulation they got passed using a meager amount of their profit from the millions of toasters they sell each year since they all break down
>>
>>394980
>My point is that under capitalism we would have the option to still be able to buy that. But we don't
>Capitalism and free market would give you that option.
That is because of market pressures and capitalism's drive for profit and rent. A toaster so good you buy once and you could pass it down to your grandkids is a toaster that disappears from the market. A toaster that is good enough to work for a year and is cheap enough to make it a begrudgingly acceptable repurchase once it breaks is a reliable revenue stream. That's why shit like zinc-carbon and alkaline batteries are still being sold today at insane markups despite being obsolete for 60 years. They could make better products at comparable prices to the regular shit, but have few reasons to do so since the current model works at getting them consistent revenue. You as a consumer have no real option besides choosing the least shit toaster or buying a good toaster that will either be unnecessarily expensive or short-lived on the market as the startup that made it folds or gets absorbed by a larger competitor and everyone complains the new version is shit.

That is why we are fucked, it is simply not profitable to save the planet. The giants are more than fine with securing their positions in the upcoming shitshow.
>>
>>392723

All this actually puts me at ease. Humans are cancer and won't stop metasticizing despite the first World finally accepting at least partially that shits fucked. Green initiatives and drives towards efficiency wind up increasing the use of resources via jevons paradox. Everyone trying to catch up to first World standards aren't going to stop just because things are falling apart. Within a few decades nations are going to have to try to force rationing and reduction in numbers and its going to be a wild shit show. We're in the collapse stage heading to a new dark age.
>>
>>396095
I have some bad news for you. Your dream of a cataclysm is not a true one.
Nothing is falling apart. Less people now more than ever die from hunger and deseases. As living stantards rise, birth rates drops.
Anti-humanism is a weird concept.
>>
The technological singularity will get us first. Machines won't need plants.
>>
>>392741
If he's gonna die, you're going to die and so am I
>>
>>396164
>What are you worrying about? everything is fine and the trains run on time
what is it like ignoring obvious issues just because the reason foundation and prageru tell you nothings wrong?
>>
>>396216
one can dream, anon
>>
rule 11

Some say that the earth is resetting.
Its obviously changing.

If so many species vanish, why dont anyone do anything?
maybe it's survival of the fittest?
Only the species worthy of living will survive and thats why no one cares?
I have never met anyone who cared.
>>
>>396271
>If so many species vanish, why dont anyone do anything?
over 99% of all species ever are already extinct and it happened long before people came around, that seems like complaining that the sun rises in the morning and sets at night
>maybe it's survival of the fittest?
>Only the species worthy of living will survive and thats why no one cares?
that is generally how the scientific community describes it, yes
>>
>>396278
Imagine thinking protecting the climate is solely about species protection. A biosphere is heavily dependent upon biodiversity. The food you eat depends on a delicate balance starting with invisible species and working its way up to your dinner plate. Everything depends on one another. Brighten up kiddo.
>>
>>393457
>nuclear anything
>US
The NIMBYs and Leftist Coast will torpedo that. Hell I heard Three Mile Island's getting shut down. Advanced nuclear designs are the best solution to energy needs globally, but that isn't going to happen anytime soon.
>>
>>396295
As of right now, your right.
Nuclear is best option to reduce emmisions as quickly as possible and lefties won't allow it
>>
>>396287
>The food you eat depends on a delicate balance starting with invisible species and working its way up to your dinner plate
The food I eat is grown on a cow fed by corn and grass
Farmed food is not as nearly dependant on biodiversity as you seem to think
>>
>>396302
>The food I eat is grown on a cow fed by corn and grass
Feeding cows with soy and corn is such a wasteful system.
>>
Allahu Akbar!
The U.S. must take Monroe Doctrine now.
The U.S. must withdraw American Forces from all Foreign Countries now.
Stop America's doing its all wars now!
The U.S. must return to the gold standard now!
The U.S. must adopt the gold standard again now!
The U.S. must decrease its military-budget to 100-billion-dollar per year now.
Or, the U.S. must decrease its military-budget to 1% of its GDP now.

I love American99% and the U.S.


Germany and Japan must loosen Germany's and Japan's monetary policies now!
Germany and Japan must stimulate Germany's and Japan's domestic demands now!
Japan and Germany must issue a lot of construction bond now!
Japan and Germany must reduce Germany's and Japan's taxes now!
The U.S. must tighten its monetary policy now!
As a result, Dollar value will rise!
The U.S. will have trade surplus!


Japan and Germany are evil empires.
Islamists' true enemies are Japan, Germany, FRB, Top1%, Wall Street, American Military Industry and DOD!
Japan is the country which has been promoting Globalization!!!
Allahu Akbar!


American Revolutionary War!
We American 99% have the 2nd amendment!
American Revolutionary War!

Japan's Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry (METI) and Japanese-bureaucrats are the main largest promoters of FTA.
Wall-Street, American-top1%, American-Military-Industry are colluding with Japan and Japan's Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry (METI).

US DOD, Japan and Germany are enemies of American99%.
US DOD, Japan and Germany are enemies of mankind.
>>
>>396248
So anyone not sharing the principles that humans are cancer and every is falling apart is a negationist ? It is black or white ?
The catastrophic views of yours are only in your dreams. Humans survived for thousands of years in the most extreme conditions on earth.
We always found a way to fix the most complex problems.
Take the black plague, i bet they were a lot of people, like you, preaching for the end of the world.
>>
>>394327
>i don't think anyone's seriously suggesting we do away with capitalism
Ohh, you have no idea. Keep reading this thread and dive into the other sources me. Pay attention to the "solutions." Every one of them revolves around some level of centralized, authoritarian control that goes all the way down into individual households.
>>
I havent seen you in a while.
what have you been up to lately?
>>
>>396302
>corn and grass
You think those just grow by themselves?
The absolute state of burger education
>>
>>396368
no.
they take seeds and water and sunlight.
hell, if all the bugs died off they wouldnt need pesticide
they sure dont rely on other species though to grow.
>>
>>396317
>It is black or white ?
Brainlets that think everything is fine and we'll just innovate our way out of every problem are a problem.
>Humans survived for thousands of years in the most extreme conditions on earth.
Several times throughout human history there were times that the population was reduced to a few hundred to thousand people. It is only by luck that we didn't go the same way as the other humanoids so far.
>We always found a way to fix the most complex problems.
>the invisible hand will save us
t. (You)
>Take the black plague
Killed at least a quarter of the entire world population at the time, and most of Europe population since they were(are) nasty fucks, and didn't stop until modern sanitary measures were developed. Before this the only thing that stopped it was natural barriers that inhibited human movements like deserts and mountain ranges. Literally by luck that people survived it and the worldwide chaos the outbreaks caused.

The problem we have now is that we are endangering the very things that support and sustain life from microbes to us. We may have done enough damage already to not make this reversible.
>>
>>396375
Imagine only having a kindergarten-level education, burger education at its finest
>>
>>396393
ib4 muh electrolytes
>>
>>396393
imagine thinking corn relies on some massive ecosystem instead of minerals in the soil and sunlight
>>
>>396426
>>396436
Imagine not knowing how soil fucking works
>>
>>396375
Pretty sure soil health is dependent on bacteria and other microbes. Insects serve as pollinators.
>>
>>394106
>kill the god of infinite growth
Why is infinite growth impossible for you? With our reach starting to extend to space (which is for all intents and purposes infinite) isn’t infinite growth also possible?
>>
>>396522
if by 'infinite' you mean very long and vast then yes, that's feasible
if you mean actually infinite then no, there's only so much energy out there
>>
thing is there's nothing that can be done. the third world won't stop breeding and it's political suicide to suggest an ugandan having 10 kids per woman or an indian with 8 kids a woman might be the problem. that maybe we really don't need 200 million nigerians and 1.4 billion chinese.

no one is gonna stand up and propose genocide and they won't stop on their own. you think chinese and africans give a tenth of a shit about the environment? the only people who care are europeans, japanese, and urban (non-suburban) americans. and they aren't the problem to begin with.
>>393430
i agree we need to get away from car-centric transit, but china certainly does have a large number of cars, probably more than the US. i don't own a car and never will again, but the US makes it very, very hard to live this way.
>>393628
>>393619
These are also valid.
>>
>>396530
Calculations shows that population growth will stop and stagnate at around 10 billions human.
When a country gets out of poverty, their birth rate drastically drop. That is why China dropped their 1 children rule. Not only that but went to subsidize having childrens. The trend showed the population would drop too much for their country to handle economically. They get generally richer. India will follow.
>>
>>396522
>which is for all intents and purposes infinite
Most of it is impossible to ever reach. Of course you're implying we ever actually leave this pile of rocks we're on in the first place, which is not a given. And I mean actually leave, not just planting a flag or a colony that would die in a week without resupply from Earth.
>>
>>396589
>India will follow.
Ha ha! No. It's Africa with tigers.
>>
>>397228
that's a low blow, most africans don't eschew modern toilets due to fearing witches
they're usually too poor to have them instead
>>
>>396589
I propose we combat the overpopulation of invasive species by introducing a natural predator to Africa.

Allow for poltards to territorially expand into Africa to cull the native population. Now, the adverse effect would be low born white genetics usurping the native population, but I predict a stable sustainable population in just a few decades.
>>
>>397962
>Allow for poltards to territorially expand into Africa to cull the native population.
/pol/acks don't have any experience in fighting aside from getting bullied in school. That's why they join LARPing militias and white supremacist orgs and kill unarmed defenceless people to feel tough. You'll sooner see their heads lopped off in an Al-Shabaab video than anything else.
>>
>>397917
>they're usually too poor to have them instead
It's literally a hole in the ground. What do you need to afford? The time to dig one?
>>
>>398094
A proper latrine still has costs and is complicated. There's a lot of shit to consider before just digging a pit and contaminating your ground water.
>>
>>398048
>/pol/acks don't have any experience in fighting aside from getting bullied in school.
Your objectively wrong, one of them just got like a 40 to 1 kill ratio in New Zealand
>>
>>398228
>Your objectively wrong
>New Zealand shooter
>>398048
>kill unarmed defenceless people to feel tough
Learn to read, brainlet
>>
Again, we see another nonsense article from the fearmongers. You'll notice that they make no actual, quantitative connection between the biodiversity loss and any actual damage to civilization. That's because there isn't a connection, not in any significant sense.

We are losing things that are superfluous. Rhinos, tigers, frogs... that we don't actually need. Biodiversity and ecosystems are stupid concepts that have very limited utility. Every year is always the last chance, yet nothing actually happens, just like the peak oil meme.

The purpose of the doom and gloom is to prepare people for autocracy, creating the very insanity that you can see in this thread. There will be no Malthusian dystopia, there will be no 'uninhabitable', there will be no 'Earth survives without us'.

The doomsayers are always wrong because they always underestimate technology and engineering. Humanity is far too powerful to be defeated by slight temperature changes and a few dead frogs.
>>
>>398235
Well found the stupidest person in the thread
>>
>>398254
Careful now, there has been actual (((scientists))) in this thread who are giving him a run for his money.
>>
>>393561
thank you again Mr. Hole in the Bucket.

Next week you can fill us all in on the futility of trying since we will eventually all fail and we should accept the inevitable. I hope your new job making 1st graders hang themselves in despair goes well. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go dump my garbage in the ocean to get rid of the middle man and avoid the gas cost of getting there.
>>
>>398226
>still has costs and is complicated
You must work for the fucking government.
A pit latrine is one of the earliest civil engineering accomplishments of civilization. You dig it downwind and downhill of where get your food and water. It ain't complicated. Frankly, it you fuck that up you deserve the diseases you contract.
But I will remind you that we're talking about people literally shitting in fields. Even animals at least throw a little dirt on top.
>>
>>396375
What a suprise, the Mutt doesnt know that soil is the greatest influencer in crop yield lol
>>
>>398390
I didn't know soil was in danger of extinction
As for the accuracy, they don't even need soil. They can do with just water, ammonium nitrate, potash, and phosphates
And sun
>>
>>398390
Soil has literally zero to do with crop yield it is an inert substrate
It's the compounds in the soil which can all be factory made
>>
>>392726
Don't go giving me false hope like that anon. Humans have survived plagues, wars, famines, and instead of growing from it we're more miserable than our peasant ancestors who rolled in the dirt

Extinction is worthy of a skeleton floss dancing as the nukes drop
>>
>>396216
>imagine if the WAU was an actual thing and machines spread all over everything just because it wants to preserve life
Sometimes I wonder if some future scientist will make actual technology similar to that
>>
>>398391
>>398393
Brainlets or industry shills? Probably both.
>>
>>398393
lmfao "soil has nothing to do with crop yield" that's the most hilarious thing I've read all morning. Thanks for the laugh
>>
>>398906
>>398957
Guess you guys have never heard of hydroponics
it's some sort of new witchcraft that grows plants without soil
Using only water, the aforementioned nutrients and a light bulb it doesn't even need the sun
Guess what? Did even grows higher quality crops
Really shows who the super smooth brains are here
>>
>>398906
>>398957
Republicans located
I bet you think plants are grown using God's love don't you
>>
None of this shit is actually fixable because "consumerism" that is, consuming resources, is something people really like to do and they will not accept being told to stop. I won't either, I fully intend on ordering some tasty crispy chicken from one of the local places in my area later today, for example.
>>
>>398966
You can tax consumerism.
>>
>>399015
We ARE taxing consumerism. How do you expect that to fix anything?
>>
>>398966
ordering chicken strips is fine. restricting excessive air travel on a global scale, converting vehicles to electric, and introducing a diet that reduces cow emissions fits in a consumer model and would massively reduce pollution.
>>
>>399038

We'd have to put some massive carbon taxes in place, violently realign energy use policy and have the single largest sustained propoganda campaign in history.

It won't work under democracy before the disaster, so we're down to hoping that democracy during a disaster can make good decisions.

So we're basically fucked on the climate change front.
>>
>>399038
Not really. Quite the opposite.
>>
>>399039
>introducing a diet that reduces cow emissions
impossible foods is doing this
theyve engineered yeast to grow a meat replacement.
they have so many backlogged orders right now they cant keep up.
burger king is one of hteir largest customers, they are introducing an "impossible whopper"
>>
>>398740
if anything we'll cause some horizon zero dawn shit rather than anything positive
>>
>>398960

How much of global agriculture is grown with hydroponics?

Fucking retard
>>
>>399052
impossible whopper is a vegetarian meat substitute IIRC.

I didn't know they also made the anti methane grain.
>>
>>399044
So subsidies?
>>
climate change is a liberal death cult
>>
Its really not too hard to understand, even to communicate.

Tell one person every day they have to use 10% less energy per year, every year, for 10 years, and presto, we might just avoid the worst effects.

I've been living at about 10-20% of the normal energy use (American) for a decade with the following: Small living space no air condition, little electric heat some months, mostly vegetarian, mostly freegan, bicycle everywhere even though majority traffic is cars. I produce very little, make next to no money, and try to walk lightly as possible on the Earth.

The fact is that for every one of me there are 1000+ old, fat, meat eating wage slave retards who drive huge cars/trucks every day. They use about 100x the energy I do. Thats as much as 1,000,000 me's.

Popular boomer trend: two homes,winter/summer, and they fly between them. They go on cruises, and their investments in the market funds all kinds of waste and exploitation by corporations.

For every one of me there are like probably 50 of them and they use 10,000x the energy I do- A half million me's. And because energy level = proportional to CO2 pollution generally, its here where Gen Z is going to get the most bang for their buck.

Just start calling people out- tell them what they're doing is wrong, why its bad. Don't try to convince- too hard because they would rather die than give up their cars, rather kill themselves if forced to give up their lifestyles. Just let them know that, like you, there are others who also think this way. And maybe they will convert and we can get a mass movement of people to change things politically.

The way to achieve the goal is to tax energy sources, and use the difference to offset the planetary damage in some way. Imagine gasoline costing $20 a gallon, and taking $15 and giving every homeless person a house, planting 1,000 trees, or helping fund industrial pollution cleanup or solar panels.

It can be done. It must be done. It falls to you to do this.
>>
>>399424
>mostly freegan
>a person who rejects consumerism and seeks to help the environment by reducing waste, especially by retrieving and using discarded food and other goods.
>especially by retrieving and using discarded food
>using discarded food
so... you eat from a dumpster?
>>
>>399443
I have dumpstered but not really anymore. Discounted bruised produce, yes. Freegan also applies for things (not food) found, or bought second hand. eg, not primary consumption. I try to eat "low" on the food chain. I have a worm bin that turns my organic waste and paper into living soil.And to be honest, I'm fit as fuck and rich because I've not been blowing my wealth and health on a car.

I'm just answering your Q, not bragging. Either we find a way to use less per capita or we destroy the climate. Thats not an option. The manifestation of evil is clear here in the banality of the individuals involved who participate a little bit by bit, and think themselves blameless only because of relative measures and willful ignorance.

You have to call people out, that fights their will to deceive themselves. Changing people can be done but don't count on some movement or authority to make it so. They aren't going to do anything. This will only change one person at a time from the bottom up. Remember, its your future.
>>
>>392723
>and this is really our last chance
As life evolved before, so shall it again. These doomsayers aren't fooling me.
>>
>>399424

Is that you, Ted Kaczynski? Wow, so prisons ARE allowing you all internet access. This is sick! Commissary, uh?
>>
>>399481
>Massive death from extinction
>Some things survive and fill the niches left over from extinct species
You ever read about what life was like before the great dying?shit only weird little hamster reptiles made it and they evolved so much they became the dinosaurs.humanity is either gonna die,become robots,or evolve into a new species.i hope we become ayy lmaos and time travel back in time just to butt fuck anons because we feel angry about our smooth dickless grey bodies.
>>
>>399483
lol, get fucked boomer scum.
>>
>>399483

This is Ted Kazynski.

You didn't think they could keep me in prison, did you? Just kidding. There is a library PC.

I get mail, though:

Ted Kaczynski #04475–046
Federal ADX Supermax

5880 State Highway 67
Florence, Co. 81226
>>
>>399424
>meat eating wage slave retards
You write like a homeless person.
>>
>>399386
>climate change is a liberal death cult
This.
>>
>>399424
>two homes,winter/summer, and they fly between them
Sounds like a great way to cut back on the largest energy expense by a household: winter heating.
>>
>>399515
Found the retard. 1 round trip coach seat is 1/4 of the average carbon footprint of Americans. A first class or a charter jet uses orders of magnitude more since coach is the most economical seating arrangement.

Every time I cuck you the breeze smells that much sweeter.
>>
>>399522
Is why it costs over $3000 to heat a home for a winter and $300 (post-first class subsidy) to fly back and forth to Florida? Jet-A is 1000% cheaper than home heading oil? Who knew!
>>
>>399524
And air conditioning at a “summer” home will be equal. Unless your summer home is... Alaska?
>>
>>399524
300 hundred dollars to fly first class round trip?

Nice try, but I’m not buying into your timeshare. Thought I was safe here.
>>
>>399424

Fuck off commie

I'm going to leave my car running in the driveway just to burn extra fuel to negate your tranny shit lifestyle for today
>>
>>399524
No idea which one actually has a lower carbon footprint but I just want to point out that the cost of a first-class ticket doesn't have to be less than the cost of heating a home because many people purchase first class tickets contributing to an aggregate cost
>>
>>399614
>unnecessarily wasting more money on fuel to own the libs
Dare i say, based and redpilled
>>
>>399524
>(post-first class subsidy)
A round-trip coach ticket is (well) under $200. Smear the first-class premium across the coach cabin to come up with $300.
>>399527
>first class round trip
>>399619
>first-class ticket
Dumbasses.
>>
>>399809
This is how it works in secondlife not the real world.
>>
>>399854
>This is how it works in secondlife not the real world.
... what?
>>
OMG who the hell cares? If we are gonna die then we will die together.
>>
>>399964

Say no homo or I'll fuck you up
>>
>>399614
Knowing your low IQ you'll leave it running in the garage
Darwin Award winner
>>
>>399614
Better tape over any cracks inside your garage and step inside. Protip: Do some jumping jacks to get your lungs working
>>
>>392723
Out with the old, in with the new. I for one welcome the next mass extinction event with open arms.
>>
Humans are a disease. I hope Earth finds a cure, for the sake of the other animals
>>
If we can't get off this planet (we can't) there is no future for us anyway. It's been fun but all good things must come to an end one way or another.
>>
>>400343
honestly can't fucking happen soon enough
>>
is there a way to quickly and randomly wipe out something like 99.9% of the world population? that would pretty much solve our problems and make life real cushy for the 0.1%.
>>
>>400743
skynet or aliens taking over
anything else won't be thorough enough to kill this many people
>>
>>400743
>really cushy
I don't think you know how economic specialization works.
>>
>>400859
i don't think you know how the standard of living for just about everyone in europe improved after the black death
>>
>>400743
If you're not all in on killing 100% of all humans don't even bother. Nuke the ice caps, render all farmlands uninhabitable, take out all satellites and cause a massive Kessler effect to make escaping to space an impossibility, poison all fresh water bodies and destroy known seed bank locations and resources reserves. Your 0,1% would be the ones who have a fate worse than death and spend their remaining lives wandering the wasteland trying to survive just one more day in Hell.
>>
>>400917
>i don't think you know how the standard of living for just about everyone in europe improved after the black death
I clearly don't. Please explain to me how having every other person literally die and rot in the street somehow improved productivity.
>>
>>401056
it was a time when productivity wasn't the be all end all, anon
the same amount of grain but half of the population means twice as much food...
as if
it meant thrice as much food for the clergy & nobles, and the surviving peasants got about as much as usual
>>
The black death nearly killed feudalism in the areas most effected, and it took the ruling classes (feudal lords, aristocrats, clergy, merchants) all they could to not be killed in peasant revolts. Imagine a socialist revolution in the 14th century.



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