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https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2019/04/09/1818037116
>A new phenomenon of constructing distinctive funerary monuments, collectively known as megalithic tombs, emerged around 4500 BCE along the Atlantic façade. The megalithic phenomenon has attracted interest and speculation since medieval times. In particular, the origin, dispersal dynamics, and the role of these constructions within the societies that built them have been debated. We generate genome sequence data from 24 individuals buried in five megaliths and investigate the population history and social dynamics of the groups that buried their dead in megalithic monuments across northwestern Europe in the fourth millennium BCE. Our results show kin relations among the buried individuals and an overrepresentation of males, suggesting that at least some of these funerary monuments were used by patrilineal societies.
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>Whereas mtDNA lineages from megalith burials harbor haplogroups K, H, HV, V, U5b, T, and J (among others), males from megalith burials belong almost exclusively to YDNA haplogroup I, more specifically to the I2a sublineage, which has a time to most recent common ancestor of ∼15000 BCE (51)
Haplogroups. Gimbutas loses again.
>>
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marija_Gimbutas
>The Civilization of the Goddess articulated what Gimbutas saw as the differences between the Old European system, which she considered goddess- and woman-centered (gynocentric), and the Bronze Age Indo-European patriarchal ("androcratic") culture which supplanted it. According to her interpretations, gynocentric (or matristic) societies were peaceful, honored women, and espoused economic equality.
Chalk that up for feminist babble. Now we just need that Old Kingdom DNA to make the Amerifat Negroes salty.
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>I2a2

fucking knew it
>>
>1/4 WHG
>100% WHG paternal lines
what a strange race these Anatolians were
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>>6464011
Y-Haplogroups aren't more important than autosomes.
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>>6464036
They tell us that the G2 guys were incels
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>>6464011
These ones in Europe were more like 40%+ WHG. It just means the mixing between them was harmonious. Farmers were civilized and didn't rape anyone unlike steppeniggers.
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>>6464050
They were 1/4. Ansarve were over 30% but they look a bit shifted to SHG.
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>>6464063
If you count the WHG that was already in the original Anatolian farmers they were easily over 40% WHG autosomally (middle/late neolithic Euro farmers that is).
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>>6464103
That's different since it's not as strictly linked with I2
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>>6464108
Anatolians were mostly G but they also had high l2 presence as well.
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What did Anatolians, Steppeniggers, and the Native Europeans look like?
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>>6465129

Anatolians: medium skin dark hair + eyes
steppeniggers: like modern hungarians proably in terms of pigmentation. May have looked like this irish kid getting his results (irish are among the highest steppe in europe)
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>>6465246

inb4 nordicists come in and cry about the irish and scottish (and even north welsh - (south welsh are very neolithic)) having as much to more steppe than norweigians LOL.
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>>6465246
what about early european hunter gatherers?

were they blonde/blue eyed? or were steppeniggers?
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>>6465253
Why are Norwegians memed up as people with highest steppe if they have less Yamna than Balts and North-East Slavs? They also have much more EEF.
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>>6465246
He doesn't look typically Irish at all. Not even the dark type.

Enda Kenny (former "Prime Minister" of Ireland) was tested as I2-M223 CTS616+.
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>>6464011
I think the G men never really arrived to Britain and most of North Europe. Small groups of farmers probably arrived to Spain where they got dominated early on by the local hunter gatherers. Then these new farmers expanded to France, but they carried mostly I2a lineages (many G2a men stayed in Iberia).
In the East there was a different situation, with more farmers coming from Anatolia and many of them remained G2a without mixing with local hunter-gatherers.

Then in the Middle Neolithic farmers from the West (Megalithic farmers) expanded to Central Europe largely replacing post LBK farmers from the Balkans and bringing the megalithic tradition (Funnelbeakers and maybe also Globular Amphora).
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>>6465571
There is also some posibility of sample bias. They tested only 4 sites and three of them are from Britain (where even the earliest neolithic males show only I2a, so like I said G2a men probably never were in Britain). But it's interesting how megaliths were probably family necropoli and that many farmers were clearly patriarchal.
It's kind of bizarre how little samples we have from France.
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>>6463774
There is also another one from Nature (Ancient genomes indicate population replacement in Early Neolithic Britain)
Another one about Neolithic Britain. All males are again I2a2.
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>>6465625
There is also section on WHG/Neolithic pigmentation. It seems to vary a lot.

La Brana: intermediate (green/hazel) eye colour, black/dark brown hair color, dark/dark-to-black skin colour

Cheddar Man: blue/green eye colour, dark brown/black hair, dark/dark-to-black skin

Carsington Pasture (Neolithic): brown eyes, black/dark brown hair, dark/intermediate skin

Loschbour: blue/green eyes, black/dark brown hair, intermediate skin
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>>6463774
>WHG yDNA
>farmer mtDNA
ENF were cuckolds.
>>
so enf males and females made incursions into Europe and brought agriculture with them, and were then massacred by whg males who killed the enf males and took their females and inherited agriculture?

to be civilized is to be cucked, at the end of the day you're always just making a house for a barbarian to conquer and cuck you out of
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>>6465876
No. There were two waves of farmers to Europe. One through the Balkans, the other throughout the Mediterranean (Sicili, islands and Iberia). The first one remained largely G2 and at some point moved to Central Europe (LBK farmers). The guys that arrived to Iberia mixed with local HG males. Then later it was these farmers that moved to Britain. No British sample so far had haplogroup G2a so I'm guessing it's only males with I2 (mostly I2a2) that moved to Britain.

Then at some point (Middle/Late Neolithic) Globular Amphora with I2a2 expanded in Central Europe largely replacing the G2a farmers from the Balkans.
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>>6465891
But it seems to be true that farmers with I2a2 from Western Europe expanded to the East and probably brought the megalitic tradition. (Funnelbeakers).
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>>6465891
I've re read this carefully twice and I'm afraid it doesn't really make sense.
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>>6465914
None of it makes any sense we don’t have enough data to speculate intelligently about neolithic migration patterns yet
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>>6465914
How does this not makes sense? It's literally what we see in the DNA. I2 is rare in the Balkans but common in the West. And we know there were two routes from Anatolia and the Aegean.
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>>6465932
Is i2 supposed to be the y dna of whg? Also I believe a certain subclade of i2 is actually very common in the Balkans.
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>>6465948
It's common today, it wasn't common in the Neolithic or Chalcolithic.
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>>6465976
i dunno about that. I don't follow this all too closely but I do remember a recent paper being posted here talking about how i2 was found in vinca culture graves
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>>6465979
I don't know about such a paper. We don't have many Vinca samples but there was no I2 there.
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>>6466024
What haplo was vinca then, if you remember? E?
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>>6466031
G. Cucuteni-Trypillia was E and G tho.
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>>6466031
One H, two G2. Most of our Balkan samples come from the Mesolithic - I2 and early R1b (not M269). There were even some I in Neolithic Anatolia - one I2c from Western Anatolia (buried in a typical Anatolian fashion and genetically not different from other Anatolians) and one from South-West Anatolia (I).
For all we know even G2a could be intrusive to Anatolia as Anatolian HG (C) was slightly shifted towards WHG compared to later Anatolians.
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>>6465928
I actually somewhat agree. For some of these cultures we have two or three samples. This is nothing, really.
Sure, for Britain, PIE or Iberia we can already made some educated guesses as the number of samples is significantly higher, but for other places probably not so much.
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>>6465246
Looks like a beta cuck.
Why the fuck is he smiling like that?
>>
>Shamhat was a sacred temple prostitute or harimtu.[2] She was asked to use her attractiveness to tempt Enkidu from the wild, and his 'wildness', civilizing him through continued sexual intercourse. She was brought to a water source where Enkidu had been spotted and exposed herself to Enkidu. He enjoyed Shamhat for "six days and seven nights" (a fragment found in 2015 and read in 2018, disclosed that they had two weeks of sexual intercourse, with a break spent in discussion about Enkidu's future life in Uruk[3]). Unfortunately for Enkidu, after this long sexual workshop in civility, his former companions, the wild animals, turned away from him in fright, at the watering hole where they congregated. Shamhat persuades him to follow her and join the civilized world in the city of Uruk, where Gilgamesh is king, rejecting his former life in the wild with the wild animals of the hills.
Well, the myths were right again.
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>>6465523
>WHG looked like dark-skinned Pudzianowski
>Steppeniggers, pic related. Generally Eastern, Northern and Central Euros of the modern era.

But why does Steppe DNA always show them as dark haired/eyed with fair skin?

And why is WHG most common in Northern Europeans if they were dark skinned?
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>>6465246
>(irish are among the highest steppe in europe)

are they? source?
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>>6465876
Hardly since their aDNA is 70-80% farmer
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So BLACK I haplomeme BVLLS cucked F*rmeroids
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>>6466353
Paternal line matters, you know. Your half-brother and you will be similiar in terms of aDNA, but your mother is still a whore.
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>another anti-farmer cringefest
What a surprise
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>>6466433
Australia should be rangebanned.
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>>6466433
HUNTER GATHER BLACK BVLLS insrminated F*rmer females
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>>6466451
T Eastern European manchild
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>>6466465
Being a manchild is the domain of sheltered nanystate-living new worlders.
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>>6466475
T jobless manchild incel
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>>6466462
No, farmers were simply patriarchal bvlls who assimilated some I2 hunter-gatherers who then went on to establish farmer communities in other parts of Europe. This explains why these specific communities were autosomally typical farmers but dominated by I2. Zero cuckolding took place.
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>>6466480
Says the guy sitting here 24/7. Often spending his entire nights with the excuse of "having some unfinished work to do", and yet comitting entirely to shitposting against his polack mommy,
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>>6466485
I'm not even making those posts you autismo.
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>>6466488
Sure thing sport.
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Clear some things up.

Early farmer expansion into the Balkans was dominated by G2a, but with increasing WHG female-mediated admixture. Farmer expansion into Central Europe and Italy was again dominated with G2a and increasing WHG admixture. Farmer expansion into Iberia is also dominated by EEF haplogroups.

Late farmer expansion into Britain and the Baltic is dominated by I2 lines and paternal WHG ancestry.
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>>6466492
It's true, you can either accept that you're too autistic to realise this yourself or continue coping.
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>>6466499
Based schizo retard.
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>>6465564

i didn't say he looks irish, but he looks like a steppenigger
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>>6466500
>stating facts is a symptom of schizophrenia
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>>6465564

he has the epicanthal fold
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>>6466496
On top of that. Funnelbeakers and Globular Amphora seem to be lighter pigmented than the rest of farmers in Europe. I wonder why.
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>>6466518
Because of selection and nothing else
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>>6466154

lamnidis et al 2018 - irish are the same as scottish

i can also use g25 of dnmonte
"sample": "Norwegian:Average",
"fit": 3.3445,
"Poland_GAC": 50.84,
"Yamnaya_Samara": 49.16,

"sample": "Irish:Average",
"fit": 2.8831,
"Poland_GAC": 50.82,
"Yamnaya_Samara": 49.18,


This is the English.

"sample": "English:Average",
"fit": 2.765,
"Poland_GAC": 54.17,
"Yamnaya_Samara": 45.83,

higher neolithic in england is not native, and most of it has italic-balkan affinity rather than iberian
Rowan atkinson and russell brand for example don't look at all iberian, they look more southeastern - no suprise when you see Englands genetics
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>>6466518
Blonde-hair and blue-eyes were found among all groups of EEF, but did seem to reach near-given levels among Funnelbeakers and the like.
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>>6465246
>like modern hungarians proably in terms of pigmentation
really?what about this then?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamnaya_culture#Physical_characteristics
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>>6466525

England is not that Genetically close to Wales as people think, they have a hell of a lot of other stuff the welsh lack, a lot of it just cancels each other out and doesn't change their position on a PCA. Anglos are closer to normanndy/flemmings + central/south dutch than welsh according to g25.
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>>6466547
Steppe worshippers used to insist that they had the pigmentation of Finns, now they insist that they had the pigmentation of Hungarians, and one day they will accept that they had the pigmentation of Churkas.
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>>6466547

that roughly matches modern hungarians, Yamna had a lot of blondism and light eyes too
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>>6466525

are we ANGLO ROMAN BVLLS? god I hope anglos have a lot of roman ancestry
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>>6466558
>>6466547
Yamna are late PIE and more CHG than other cultures.
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>>6466560
says who?
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>>6466568
Why are you posting this Nafri made image?
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>>6466567
Pretty irrelevant
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>>6466567
from what i know yamna is the most likely candidate for PROTO indo-europeans, not late PIE
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>>6466567
Not even him but you're an idiot.
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>>6466575
Late PIE is still PIE. These copers think that this somehow makes a difference though LMAO.
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>>6466575
>most likely
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>>6466581
Yes it does. It's like saying Anatolian farmers are European farmers.
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>>6466568

matches modern hungarians
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>>6466581
The issue is that Yamnaya was as pure as PIE got, the Corded Ware and Bell Beakers were complete mutts.
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>>6466581
only one whos coping is people like you.the yamnaya were dark eyed dark haired swarthers by today standards, and you cant stand it
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>>6466596
>the yamnaya were dark eyed dark haired swarthers by today standards,
Brighter than modern Italians.
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>>6466587
No, it isn't.
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>6466591
Hungarians are nowhere near Yamnaya genetically or in pigmentation.
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>>6466558
Churkas are Europeans, so who cares if Yamnaya are Churkas?
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>who cares if Yamnaya are Churkas
This is the state that steppe worshippers have been reduced to. Embarrassing
>>
And farmers were nafri shitskins, so what?
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>>6466609

hungarians are quite dark-ish
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>>6466630
As were their farming ancestors they are closer to.
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>>6466632

possibly and possibly not
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>>6466567
Fun fact: CHG is closer to Balts(even Finns) in F3 than it is to Iranians
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>>6466675
No, not even close retard. Balts are closer to EEF or WHG than to CHG by a massive margin.
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>>6466686
I'm talking about F3 not PCA
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>>6466675
Balts in general are very close to many prehistoric populations. I think Lithuanians are the closest to steppe Maykop too.
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>>6466689
>I'm talking about my ass
Okay retard.
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>>6466692
CHG Latvian 0.264134 0.257315 Iranian
CHG Lithuanian 0.262547 0.257315 Iranian
CHG Estonian 0.261919 0.257315 Iranian
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>>6466518
They are definitely mixed with EHG, Baltic HG and SHG.
It's interesting but in the Balkans we have some very early farmers with I2c. I think some I lineages were probably present in Anatolia before farmer expansion.
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>>6466709
CHG Latvian 0.164134 0.557315 Iranian
CHG Lithuanian 0.162547 0.557315 Iranian
CHG Estonian 0.161919 0.557315 Iranian
Balts are not MENA.
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>>6466711
Funnelbeakers didn't have any EHG admixture. They were EEF.
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>>6466726
They had a lot of HG. It's often hard to tell the difference between different HGs in Europe.
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>>6466720
Iranians are broadly not closely related to CHG
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>>6466735
There is nothing to indicate that you shitskin, stop trying to make Europeans non-white.
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>>6466748
CHG is effectively European. They had light skin, blue eyes and their closest descendants live in Europe.
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>>6466749
CHG's descendants and relatives are Georgians and Balochi, you retard. CHG were not white and not Europeans.
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>>6466749
Even ancestors of primates came fro Europe. Europe is just the best continent and was the best since the Cretaceous.
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>>6466756
>Balochi
Clearly not those guys are Pakis. Georgians can have European pigmentation. North Caucasians have more CHG than them though.
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>>6465594
>It's kind of bizarre how little samples we have from France
It's not, they have strict DNA testing laws
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>>6466769
Is this because of retarded law?
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>>6466686
>Closest to Corded Ware are Finns
>Closest to Yamnaya are Tajiks
Based.
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>>6466726
Cope, it has been confirmed that TRBvlls had Baltic HG admixture
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>>6466808
Maybe in Gotland
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>>6466808
Maybe, but no EHG.
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>>6466818
So?
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>>6466825
You are an idiot, look at your post, and the post you were replying to.
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>>6466836
>They were EEF
The implication was that there was no non-WHG hunter-gatherer admixture
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>>6466848
Ansarve 3 >>6463810 looks shifted towards SHG/Baltic HG unlike other farmers
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>>6466112
It's how he smiles. Would you prefer he did your autistic smile, or a söy grin?
>>
>>6466860
btw Western Europeans in that PCA seem to be Basque
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>>6465286
Brown skin, blue eyes for WHG, fair to dusky skin and brown eyes for the ones in Sweden and Central Europe.
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>>6466886
Central Europe was WHG
EHG admixture started increasing around Belarus
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>>6466126
Northern Europeans are predominantly non-WHG. They have the most because they were the last to go extinct. Are you going to ask why are African Americans usually medium brown to dark skinned if they have 20-25% European ancestry on average?
>>
>>6465625
>>6465648
Kind of a shame that the British WHG are extinct, would have been cool to see a population that has naturally dark skin and light eyes, without being racially mixed (pic related)
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>>6466907
They were getting lighter towards the end of the Mesolithic. I doubt they would look much darker than modern day Europeans if they were still around.
>>
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>>6466907
Boy am I dumb, I forgot my image.
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>>6466911
They weren't exactly the Yamnaya (who were darker than modern Europeans, but not by much). I bet you that if the hunter gatherers of England survived up until the present day, they'd still be a good deal darker than mainland Europe, but not as dark as their ancestors.
>>
>>6466892
Thanks anon.

>>6466912
Oh, before some anons misreads what I said, I posted this image as an example of someone with dark skin and light eyes who definitely had a white ancestor.
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>>6466918
Jews in Eastern Europe underwent a selective sweep for light skin in only a thousand years
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>>6466617
>people from West Asia are European
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>>6466570
Can somebody do a legit version then? It’s hard to tell who is schizoing who here
>>
>>6466926
Levantine people aren't that dark skinned to begin with. Pic related, Samaritans. Besides, if you look at Ashkenazi and Sephardic genetics, you'll see exactly how they went from the people in this image to being much lighter, all that European blood mixed in (though to be fair, there are naturally light skinned people in the Levant, they just aren't the majority).
>>
>>6466995
That is the 100% legit version, and it was made by a mentally sound individual of European descent, not a Nafri.
>>
>>6466686
>multiple cultures in modern Germany cluster with Slavs...
Hmmmm
>>
>>6466568

Btw those pigmentation charts are pretty good and reliable but they mostly refer to childhood blondism. most of these samples are pre saxon englishmen, too blond for british adults, eye colour is probably fine
>>
Saving from death.
>>
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>>6467010
Nonsense. Also

>trusting genetinker
Might as well believe Carlos.
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>>6463774
>>6463810
>>6463920
>>6466119
> wall of illegible pale green text on a pale blue background

Why are so many on 4chan so incompetent?
>>
delusional farmoids
>>
>>6463774
>emerged around 4500 BCE along the Atlantic façade.

Obviously Atlanteans.
>>
>>6468531
It's likely that Sredny Stog was Uralic.
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>>6468624
None of them was Uralic.
>>
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>>6468641
Teal = Uralic
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>>6466496
>that E1b1b1 in iberia
kek, is this the north african haplogroup? Could people easily cross gibraltar?
>>
>>6468679
No, he was a typical farmer. It's probably from Neolithic Levant. There is another sample (I think from Neolithic or Bronze Age) that shows a North African male in the center of Iberia.
>>
>>6468711
It was 4000BC IIRC
>>
>>6468679
Of course they could cross it, the Neolithic and later Bell beakers spread from Iberia to Morocco, also the Cardium pottery expansion was maritme and The only supply of obsidian for Neolithic farmers in the Western Med was in islands far away from the mainland: Pantelleria, Lipari, Sardinia and Palmarola, so they were very often moving back and forth to get it throughout the Neolithic, Pantelleria couldn’t even be settled permenantly because it lacked water sources so Neolithic people in Sicily were frequently traveling there just to get obsidian and then going back on a regular basis
>>
>>6468986
the fuck? are you saying bell beakers originated in Iberia? they are IE related, right?
>>
>>6466525
So yamnaya = steppeniggers

LBK = Late beaker (?)

WHG = Western Hunter Gatherers

EHG = Eastern Hunter Gatherers

Nganasan = (?)
>>
>>6466895
so what are the "white" ancient groups? does anyone even fucking know?
>>
If anatolian farmers, yamnaya, and WHG were the three groups that made up modern europeans, and they were all swarthy, then when did light features come about?

weren't yamnaya supposed to be light featured indo-europeans?

were the IE people responsible for the spread of light features in northern europe? or did it just evolve there anyway, opposing "aryan race" myths of IE that spread light features? weren't IE people mostly yamnaya?
>>
>>6469108
>If anatolian farmers, yamnaya, and WHG were the three groups that made up modern europeans, and they were all swarthy, then when did light features come about?
Around the late neolithic through natural selection. No group alone spread white skin, it was selected within populations. Like lactase persistence, the genes were initially low frequency, spread with some peoples and then got positively selected later on.
>>
>>6469164
so they pretty much all mixed together, then formed indo europeans, and then spread white features?
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>>6469179
no, that guy is just fucking retarded, every time you see "sexual selection" on a post related to white or aryan features is the same faggot with the same shit, disregard his retardo arguments completely
>>
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>>6469108
>>6469179
>they were all swarthy
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>>6469222
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>>6469224
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>>6469191
Read again faggot. Where did I write anything of sexual and aryans?
The white skin selective sweep happened in purer farmers, mesolithic HG dominated and steppe people like it happened in their offspring. Migration and diffusion helped spread some mutations.
Lactase persistence is another story as it was selected over millenias with stagnant and rapid phases. Apparently it was rare in some areas of Europe until the iron age.
>>
>>6469029
Learn to read
>>
>>6469191
What's your theory then? God made Nordic people as they are?
>>
>>6469257
>>6469261
>>6469262
>natural selection
my bad, I thought it was the "le sexual selection" guy, carry one
>>
>>6469276
So you think brown eyes are as attractive as light?
I'm gonna have to disagree they look like shit
>>
>>6469094

You have Med/Middle Eastern looking types moving West from South Asia and another branch also moving from South Asia into Western Russia then into Ukraine. They were probably all mostly lightening as time went by because of the climate and were all roughly Caucasoid. I dunno about the abboriginals but they don't seem very significant contribution wise/

If you're asking who seeded the present genetics of Europe that are the most unique to it or who contributed the most then IMO its Yamnaya, the Northern migration. Its also likely the source of 95% of the languages spoken and most of the cultural background. 2800 years ago IEs were living North of the Black Sea and then proceeded to Genghis Khan their way back across Central Asia into India and Middle East on one side and into the rest of Europe on the other, with some Centum speakers being pushed out by Iranics as far as China. This was probably because of horse domestication, martial culture, suicidal religious beliefs etc.

btw there interpeetation that Yamna were distinctly darker than farmers doesn't add up for me. If they were all dark 3k years ago wouldn't you find at least one holdover of swarthy descendants? Instead the darkest Yamna successors are those who fucked the most Neolithic Farmers. You have light pre-Roman Gauls, darker Iberians or Italics right next to them - looks like you can't just say its climatic difference, way too stark.
>>
>>6469291
>btw there interpeetation that Yamna were distinctly darker than farmers doesn't add up for me. If they were all dark 3k years ago wouldn't you find at least one holdover of swarthy descendants?

Yamna were pretty serious about mixing with other peoples and most following steppe cultures were already significantly lighter. They absorbed white skin alleles and it got further selected within them, as the same selective pressure seems to have applied to all peoples in Europe at this time.
>>
>>6469287
and I won't argue with you
>>
>>6469287
Brown eyes are currently positively selected.
>>
>>6469291
>Yamna were distinctly darker than farmers doesn't add up for me. If they were all dark 3k years ago wouldn't you find at least one holdover of swarthy descendants?
It varies, but the group with the most Yamnaya ancestry is not even in Europe. Southern Europeans are mainly farmer and still can have blonde hair and blue eyes.
>>
>>6469337

So you're saying that Northern Yamna Satem speakers like Balts have the same skin color as, say, Bretons because they mixed. Who were they mixing with exactly for that effect?

Were all non-IE peoples around them, Finns, Etruscans etc. carrying the same traits? Or are you implying Balts imported Southerner sex slaves from Beakers in such numbers that it gave them the genetic material to turn pale within some 2.5k years?

Very, very flimsy explanation. jsut because the tendency is one directional doesn't mean you'll end up with the exact same result. East Asians also turned pale but their skin color isn't the same as Euros'.
>>
>>6469291
Were the yamnaya light haired + eyed though? like where did that come about? it seems to have taken place after the mixing

aren't northern euros only like half yamnaya anyway? and yamnayas were a mix of ANE and something else i believe?
>>
>>6469381
You're confusing so many things.
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>>6469355
Nope. They are out-breeding blue eyes but they are not preferred.
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>>6469390
>ere the yamnaya light haired + eyed though
Every single one of them was black haired and brown eyed. 90% of them did not even carry the alleles for blonde hair or blue eyes.
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>>6469410
So when did light hair/eyes appear? after the mixing of yamnaya, EHG, and AF?
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>>6469381
Alleles just diffuse among populations, their frequencies can change by small scale immigration and selection. But the driving force behind white skin is selection. Imagine if we had for example 100% white WHG and 100% black anatolian farmers mixing 50/50, the population would be intermediate. But white skin is evenly spread with derived alleles at a 95-100% frequency torough Europe. This only happens through natural selection and this is the driving force of whiteness in Europe, who had the first alleles and went where firs is pretty irrelevant when all ancestral alleles die out anyways.
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>>6469390
Imo, Yamnaya were blonde, with a good bunch of redheads, that's my deduction from superficially studying the haplogroups, migrations and mummies that are IE related. They were Aryan so to speak.
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>>6469375
>It varies, but the group with the most Yamnaya ancestry is not even in Europe.

I can already tell you're just looking at the paternal haplogroups, buddy.

>Southern Europeans are mainly farmer and still can have blonde hair and blue eyes.

Most Southern Europeans are like 65% R1b alone. Maternal lineage is weaker but not weak enough to pretend that most of the contribution isn't IE in like half of them. Its like pretending Mexicans are Mayas.
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>>6469416
ANE already had the alleles for blonde hair with the mtDNA of R1b, just saying
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>>6469423
Why does DNA analysis of Yamnaya people show them as dark featured then?
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>>6469433
I have no explanation for this, but CWC derived mummies in Tarim Basin were blonde and red haired, which leads me to think Yamnaya was mostly like this too, it's the only possible deduction to me.
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>>6469423
You should start by actually reading the papers.
>>6469427
Tajiks and Mordvins are also closely related to Yamnaya.
>Most Southern Europeans are like 65% R1b alone
And now you did what you thought he did. No, Southern Europeans aren't mostly Yamnaya.
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>>6469400
I only found the shitty study, but this selective trend is happening in casual dating too. The endgame of this is less blue and a bit less plain brown. Positively selected eye colors amongst whites are in the brown, grey green spectrum and with central heterochromia.
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0168458
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>>6469431
so are ANE the reason white people have white traits?
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>>6469467
Partially.
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>>6469456
You're replying to that one anon who will never learn that his opinions are stupid.
inb4 muh R1b admixture, correlation = causation, muh Irish and Mordvins
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>>6469418
looks like the ancient evil north eurasian white man genocided the swarthoid natives of europe
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>>6469467
this is my conlcussion, time will tell
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>>6469038
No, LBK is a farmer settlement in Germany from like 5,500 BCE. Nganasan are the pic related.
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>>6469427
>I can already tell you're just looking at the paternal haplogroups, buddy.
>Most Southern Europeans are like 65% R1b alone.
Do you understand just how stupid you are, brainlet?

Anyway, I am talking about autosomally, the closest groups to Yamnaya are outside Europe. Also Italy, Greece, and the Balkans are mainly non-R1b, and have little Yamnaya ancestry, the vast majority of their blue-eyed and blonde-haired people are of EEF and WHG descent.
>pretending Mexicans are Mayas
Good you brought that up actually, because the average Mexican is far more similar to the Maya in features than anything else.
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>>6469477
*mongoloid
>>
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>>6469477
Ancient north Eurasians were descended from Aeta fathers and were hence negrito-quadroons. Farmers were the first people with white skin. Based negritos destroying whitoids.
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>>6469473
>>6469480
I've heard this theory. Apparently ANE were basically living in a polar or near-polar climate in Siberia hunting woolly mammoths and other megafauna which made them large, stocky, wide jawed, large headed, etc. Also a "day" of sunlight was like 6 months, and similar for darkness. This possible made them develop blonde alleles even though they didn't actually have blonde hair yet.

Oddly enough this group went on to seem to form Native Americans as well after mixing with an east asian people, kind of explains why northern euros and natives have some similar dna link.
>>
>>6469495
*negrito
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>>6469448
CWC had slightly under 1/3 EEF + WHG. Yamnaya was actually pure steppe.
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>>6469502
*forms a cline towards Onge*
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>>6469504
Steppe (ANE) + CHG + WHG iirc
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>>6469499
>>6469499
it seems like white people are just a mutt race of like 5-10 different races that just so happened to mix in a certain way that they inherited light eyes from WHG, white skin from farmers, and light hair from ANE
>>
i didn't learn anything from this thread honestly, i'm still confus frens

let's start from the beginning. what paternal y dna were the WHG?
>>
>>6469506
*forms a cline in between Han and Onge
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>>6469500
This is what I believe, but we got to listen to science.
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>>6469500
>Large headed.
Pretty sure that that was only the Aurignacians + proto-WHGs. Also, everyone in Europe hunted mammoths until they went extinct like right around the end of the mesolithic or paleolithic I think.

As far as ANE heads are concerned, it would not be larger than this small headed bloke.
>>
>>6469504
>EEF

eastern euro farmers? were these like anatolian farmers or more like WHG?
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>>6469511
CHG were J and E iirc, I don't know about WHG
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>>6469517
>Also, everyone in Europe hunted mammoths until they went extinct like right around the end of the mesolithic or paleolithic I think.

They went extinct much later apparently where the ANE were living in Siberia or wherever.
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>>6469518
In between, they were very mixed, especially in northern Europe.
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>>6469418

In less than 2500 years you're claiming Balts changed as much as Bretons because of selection. But Meds are still darker for some reason and there's no gentle gradation due to climate. Noted.

My other question was what was the source of modern Euro skin expression that completes the phenotype. You didn't answer that. Farmer? You just punctuated how"serious" Yamna were about mixing like 2 posts ago.

here's the other thing, like this guy notes: >>6469423 Tocharians were redheads. They were centum speakers, Southern Yamnaya, that got driven far East when pre_sinthashta Northerners expanded into the steppe. Yet they were red heads who wove tartans... you know, that pattern Scots put on kilts and whatnot?

Please explain how selection gave one set of tartan wearing centum speakers red hair in GB and another set of tartan wearing centum speakers red hair AFTER they got separated by some 12k kilometers or whatever the fuck that distance is.

They turned out like they did independently and were actually all black haired and black eyed before that?
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>>6469518
early neolithic farmers (ENF) went on to become EEF (early European farmers) after mixing with whg (western hunter gatherers). i think.
>>
>>6469526
Yeah, in Siberia they went extinct right around 10,000 years ago so so which was the mesolithic. So in Europe they went extinct a bit earlier. But any images of Afontova related skulls only show modest sized skulls. EHG weren't large headed either. Heck, that Otzi ice man (farmoid) has a cranial capacity of 1550 cc. Can you find a reference of an ANE skull of that size?
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>>6469500
The ANE with blond hair is from Western Siberia. The "original" ANE (Mal'ta) was dark-skinned and haired.
ANE seems to come from a West Eurasian expansion to Siberia. I'm guessing the original group had haplogroup C or something similar which was replaced by P* from some East Eurasians related to Negritos/Onge/Papuans whatever. All of this probably happened around 30,000 years ago.
>>
>>6469529
>Please explain how selection gave one set of tartan wearing centum speakers red hair in GB and another set of tartan wearing centum speakers red hair AFTER they got separated by some 12k kilometers or whatever the fuck that distance is.

Different alleles, as explained in every other tread you dumb red headed samefaggot.
>>
>>6469535
ENF is basically anatolian farmers right?

there's so many of these ancient groups, it gets confusing, they also all seem to have like 2-3 names for the same thing
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>>6469544
yeah but ENF and EEF are supposed to be different, with EEF descending from ENF

somebody post that la creatura race mixing meme of all of the european genetic groups, it's quite entertaining (AND informative)
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>>6469544
Yes, to add to that ENF is almost the same thing as Dzudzuana which is the most important source of ancestry for all west Eurasians and is ancestral to more or less all farmers. The most direct of these descendants are the ENF.
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>>6469548
It is also oversimplified. Basically, gravettian + some basal = Dzudzuana. Dzudzuana + nothing else (just differentiation alone) = ENF. ENF + WHG (WHG is entirely derived from Gravettians) = EEF. EEF were mostly Gravettian descended with only a very small amount of basal ancestry (probably less than 10%).
>>
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>>6469529
On Tocharians, last papers suggest their origin is a later period migration of a specific Celtic tribe from Western Europe, (Chemurchek culture, just google them and you might find some papers, for some reason this hasn't even been discussed on /his/ to my knowledge) that would explain the fact they were redheads, they spoke Centum and the fact plaid was found around the Tarim Basin area. Pic related, plaid found in the silk route.
>>
The first and foremost things to remember about human DNA is that everything after A00 is derived subhuman freakoid shit. ANE was mongoloid, R1b causes red hair. J2a and CHG were BVLLS. Farmer = cucks, steppe = swarthy niggers, WHG had 1650 ccm of cranial capacity and a 150+ IQ.
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>>6469544
It's confusing, yes. Sometimes ENF refer to Israeli farmers from PPNB as they were the earliest tested farmers (ENF - Early Neolithic Farmers).
>>
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>>6469563
cro magnons were the ones with 1650 ccm of cranial capacity. are cro mangons supposed to be WHG? or are cro magnons considered to be an even earlier and distinct group from WHG?

what are the Y dna haplos of cro magnons?
>>
>>6469563
ANE is not mongoloid, it is part negrito. R1b is not thought to cause red hair. SOme guy on Eupedia made a weak correlation between recent red hair + R1b patterns but recent patterns are not representative of ancestral groups. J2a was formed after CHG iirc. The WHG cranial capacity was likely shy of 1600cc and an IQ associated with that would be more like 115, not 150 (assuming the size and IQ scale normally with the corresponding brain components associated with verbal + non verbal performance).
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>>6469499
>ANE were negrito-quadroons

close enough, yeah
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>>6469493
>Anyway, I am talking about autosomally, the closest groups to Yamnaya are outside Europe.

You keep repeating that like it matters. Spill the beans or stop. Who are these super swarthy Yamnaya Asians that break the pattern?

I actually forgot About the Greeks and Old Europe (although Balkans being primarily Neolitihic is still not very compelling to me), its late here.

>Anyway, I am talking about autosomally

Yeah, I doubt you can measure that reliably with the sample sizes that you'd manage to retrieve. Comparison would require significant amounts of data since you'd have to profile whole gene pools.
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>>6469576
C1a2 and IJ
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>>6469576
Early cro magnons were C1a2 but the early ones also had smaller heads. Later ones were F* + I* iirc and had much larger heads (like that 1600cc+ average size figure). F* no longer exists in Europe in large numbers but I still does.
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>>6469563
At least do it right, that's not as stupid as it gets
>cwc was le nordic :)
>wtf they were almost 1/2 farmer?
>even though steppe phenotypes were universally dark, we can say they were white because they were cool :)
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>>6469585
Was it I* or IJ?
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>>6469590
There was IJ in Czechia and I* in Italy
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>>6469548
found it in the archives
>>
It's a funny coincidence that blond hair developed in ANE and in their paternal ancestors like Melanesians. Or maybe it's not actually a coincidence.
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>>6469599
this is fucking retarded, saved it anyways, thanks for bringing it up, all I've seen are bastardiced versions of it
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>>6469584
>get btfo then cry
Okay brainlet. They are not "Asians", they are Tajiks, Udmurts, Mordvins, etc; and they have by far the most Yamnaya.
>hurr cognitive dissonance
You know nothing about this subject, so why open your retard mouth?
>>
>>6469562

Thank you, I will research that. Thanks for actually being helpful and informative.

>>6469543
>Different alleles,

While YOU are a filthy liar and deserve your filthy faggoty fingers chopped off for spreading disinfo, you horrible little cretin.
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>>6469606
Probably a coincidence unless someone finds the same blond gene in a pre-ANE melanesian skeleton.
>>
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>>6469612
it's factually mostly correct from what little actual reading i've done
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>>6469620
There's still zero evidence of a race of blond haired people in pre-BA Europe
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>>6469615
They think it's a different mutation, but maybe they are both related.
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>>6469599
why aren't globular amphora included in this

also,

>globular amphora
>globular skulls

really makes you think
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>>6469627
SHG were the blondest of all ancient populations.
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>>6469644
Which is why I said that it is most likely a coincidence. But the ANE people get their paternal haplogroups from that 25% Aeta-like admixture, so that might or might not also be a source for that blond hair gene.
>>
>>6469627
wtf is ba?

CAN YOU SPERGES PLEASE BE MORE CLEAR WITH YOUR ACRONYMS IN THESE THREADS THANKS NOT ALL OF US LURK ON THE EUPEDIA DISCUSSION FORUMS 24/7 THX
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>>6469651
Motala had red hair
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>>6469661
Bronze Age
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>>6469661
Bronze age.
>>
Even some Anatolians had blond hair, blue eyes and both light-skin alleles.
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>>6469671
Some Sudanese do too if you look hard enough
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>>6469620
imo ane was blonde, ehg was blonde and even yamna was blonde, I coul be wrong though
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>>6469671
IMAGINE a Europe without ANE intervention. JUST IMAGINE.

http://humanphenotypes.net/NorthAtlantid.html
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>>6469680
The blonde gene was likely not common in the ANE and there was not a single case of a blonde Yamnaya. It seems that the farmers went out of their way to select for widespread blondeness.
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>>6469686
if yamnaya wasn't blonde or red haired explain celts being red haired and r1b
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>>6469671
Yeah, we found it in both Anatolians and across EEF cultures.
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>>6469696
Brown maybe, blond no. Anatolians and EEF didn't have KITLG.
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>>6469599

How were funnel beakers involved with Corded Ware at its inception tho? Isn't that chronologicaly wrong? They're in a different origin point and only precede Y by some 800 years, what are the traces of contribution?

>>6469613

>Okay brainlet. They are not "Asians", they are Tajiks, Udmurts, Mordvins, etc; and they have by far the most Yamnaya.

How is that determined tho? Literally haven't seen any compelling arguments with the kind of genetic studies done on archaeological populations until you mentioned it.

>hurr cognitive dissonance

You're just being butthurt now and foaming.
>>
>>6469686
There was a case of blond Samarra, though, which is ancestral to Khvalynsk and very likely also to Yamnaya and CWC. Some steppe people were definitely blond.
>>6469696
Anatolians got darker due to admixture with Levant Neolithic.
>>
>>6469719
CWC was Globular Amphora admixed not Funnelbeaker
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>>6469719
Imagine being this retarded. It's determined by comparing the ancient Yamnaya samples to modern populations, fuck you are stupid.
>>
>>6469729

post em

or even just google and retrieve the article you've read about this

substantiate, ya faggot
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>>6469756
see >>6466686
>>
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>>6469710
Cope.
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>>6469793
Genetiker is a Peruvian White Nationalist and not at all qualified to say anything about anything
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>>6469800
Even if that was accurate, it doesn't change the fact that he only spots the SNP's and his work has been verified as correct by actual researchers, but keep crying over your hurt feelings.
>>
>>6469820
You can't determine complex traits like pigmentation based off a few SNPs. Not yet anyway.
It's possible that this sample had lighter hair than the other LBK individuals but it's also possible he had pitch black hair.
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>>6469843
No, because his work has been verified, and it's true to the actual pigmentation of samples. You're just making it worse for yourself.
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>>6469856
It hasn't
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>>6469864
It has
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>>6469880
Nice link
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>>6466805
this has been well known for a really long time
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>>6469912
Couldn't hurt to restate that fact.
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>>6469912
it's not true according to some data I've got on yamna distance to modern populations, first one is baltic iirc
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>>6469933
its sort of obvious if you know how the migration patterns were and just look at the reconstructions and compare them to the phenos of modern populations, Balts don’t look like Yamnaya or any of the steppe people. The scythian art depicts people of West and Central Asian physiognomies with lighter features. Basic induction, not necessary to state unless you’re stupid or trying to push an agenda and not interested in science
>>
>>6469952
post scythian art depicting fair people, news to me
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>>6469952
Well yeah, but there's a lot of people wewuzzing, stating the truth merely counters any wewuzzing. Look at the post above you.
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>>6469970
how about you sit on a knife and fuck off faggot
>>
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>>6469970
They were dolichocephalic and well-built, but no art of them as fair".
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>>6466686
source of that image please? im learning this stuff
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>>6469949
Stop lying, moron.

>Steppe
Yamnaya_Samara --> 1.0
Yamnaya_Kalmykia --> 0.996894012579
Afanasievo --> 0.996028801469
Scythian_Samara --> 0.945593714365
Sintashta --> 0.901839538842
CWC_Baltic --> 0.87277856866
Battle_Axe_Sweden --> 0.86659522357
Tajik_Afghanistan --> 0.865028440775
Tajik_Tajikistan --> 0.84311825487
Beaker_Britain --> 0.832793660244
Netherlands_BA --> 0.821748930351
Ingrian --> 0.817876442304
Finnish_East --> 0.814546921032
Tajik_Yagnobi --> 0.814904224005
Finnish --> 0.812829958004
Karelian --> 0.810970821109
Vepsian --> 0.801527025599

>Other
Swedish --> 0.769958610255
Slovenian --> 0.681742039841
Austria --> 0.679149929165
Moldovan --> 0.67913004682
Kalash --> 0.678800909055
Bulgarian --> 0.584153068509
Tatar_Lipka --> 0.576513738426
Greek --> 0.468524531201
Italian_Tuscan --> 0.462783637488
Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon --> 0.462627004851
>>
>>6469500
ANE lived in southern siberia and central asia. Other mongoloids lived in more harsh arctic climates.
>>
>>6469999
nearly all references to Scythians depict rufous, light skinned people with sharp robust features. The point in including them in the reply was to illustrate that a change in a phenotype through admixture with another isolated population can be reverse engineered to attain the correct image of the now extinct people, Central and West Asians especially tribes like the Kalash can serve as reference points, if one is careful, for what the Aryan tribes probably looked like albeit you really have to do some leg work separating embellishments, emotional injections of false imagery and checking pattern recognition against craniometric and molecular data from all the studies that have been done. A caucasianized, lighter, sometimes even blonde west asian would be a good image of the Andronovo or Scythian, that is not Baltic or Nordic however. They were definitely white and almost certainly lighter than everyone around them.
>>
>>6469988
kys
>>6469999
then what was your fucking point?
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>>6470006
i dont have the data right now, will post tomorrow if the thread's still up, faggot
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>>6470073
I never claimed that, >6469988 is the one who claimed that and couldn't back it up.
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>>6470081
i see
>>
>>6470078
>i don't h-have it r-right n-now
Pathetic.
>>
>DNA samples recovered from the remains of two Pazyryk males showed them to be members of Y-chromosome haplogroup N1b-P43.[6]
What does this mean?? Isn't this haplogroup non-european?
>>
>>6470106
Europe has always been raped by foreign males.
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>>6469762

THAT was your source? So you have two axes with no context. How much nuance do you think you can fit onto that, you twat?
>>
>>6470106
Asian steppe people
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>>6470106
There's mainly been J2, R1b, and G2 in Scythian samples.
>>
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>>6470122
so they basically were a mix of the region they lived it?
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>>6470122
scythians were mainly R1b
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>>6470140
Not exactly, they were had the strongest continuity with their ancestors of all IE groups, but did gain admixture over time, until their demise of course.
>>
>>6470141
Even in the smaller European section of the much larger Scythia region, there was a lot of J2, G2, R1b, etc.
>>
>>6470154
How IE blood had the "original" ones circa 600 BC? How much samples from that period were studied?
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>>6470161
doesn't change the fact
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>>6470175
The steppe IE pastoralists mainly admixed with other IE steppe pastoralists, because they stayed in the region and only slowly gained admixture with other groups. Compare that to a steppe group that migrates to a Neolithic farmer community and extensively mixes with EEF and WHG, losing their IE blood in just a few generations.
>>
>>6470036
During the time of the ANE, the ancestors of mongoloids were still living in southeast Asia. They later came out of southeast Asia in many waves much later on.
>>
>>6470205
Are you seriously so mentally ill you can't learn a simple thing? They came from eastern China. Hoabinhian HGs in Vietnam weren't related to East Asians.
>>
>>6464063
Were SHGs Nordic looking?
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>>6470244
everything points me in the direction of ANE being the ones who were nordic looking
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>>6470205
That's false you retard. ANE mongoloids lived in southern siberia or lower latitudes. Even their Q-YDNA descendants who lived in eastern siberia mixed with a local population of mongoloids making proto-amerindians exist.

Even back in 35000BC, mongoloids reached Japan (Jomon), or maybe you call them proto-mongoloids. The korean peninsula was occupied in contemporaneous times to Jomon peoples or probably before them. It's probable there were mongoloids in south-eastern siberia for millenia before ANE-Q haplogroup dwellers occupied eastern siberia.
>>
>>6470260
ANE was mongoloid.
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>>6470298
>ANE mongoloids
stopped reading right there
>>6470299
yeah, the classic blonde mongoloid R haplo
>>
>>6470344
>"The skeletal remains of MA-1 have been described as phenotypically East Asian ("Mongoloid"). Alexeev (1998, p. 323) in his later publication stated that this area was "inhabited by a population of Mongoloid appearance".[6] Genomic studies by Raghavan et al. (2014) and Fu et al. (2016) found Mal'ta Buret boy had brown eyes, dark hair and dark skin.[1][7]"
Simply ebin.
>>
>>6470358
>R haplo
>mongoloid
t. actual mongoloid
>>
>>6470369
>/int/ tier posting
Cope.
>>
>>6470358
For the last time- it is not moongoloid. The mongoloid ancestors were still in southeast Asia at the time. The east Eurasian admixture is almost certainly of the Aeta-negrito type.
>>
>>6470382
>were still in southeast Asia
Source?
>>
>>6470298
ANE weren't mongoloids you utter dolt. The Mongoloids came later on and replaced the ANE. If you want to slander ANE then just call then negrito-quadroons or something. Aeta aren't considered to be mongoloids, they are negritos and they are the only populations today with a high amount of the basal P* haplogroup and their isolation means that they would likely resemble the east Eurasian contributors to the ANE genome.
>>
>>6470389
>slander
This is the mind of the typical malicious faggot that spams his views and imposes half-assed hypothesis without basis until everyone stops answering him.

ANE was a mongoloid and I posted the source of my claims.>>6470358
>>
>>6470385
Look at that native american DNA paper from 2018. It clearly states that a new east Asian source wiped out the ANE people in their home range and mixed with the ones that were left behind.

Paleosiberians are ANE = the first southeast Asian expansion and they were primarily Q (ANE paternal lineages) but the neosiberians (a second southeast Asian expansion) were paternally asiatic Cs + NO. These neosiberians futher replaced the remaining ANE + paleosiberians. Today, the east Asians are descended from these neosiberians.
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>>6470376
no comment, faggot /int/ poster, go back to your subhuman containment board
>>
>>6470392
>Forensic anthropology

As opposed to actual genetic evidence. read a book, or a paper for that matter. https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/448829v1

East Asians today are defined by the C + NO lineages, not by P*.
>>
>>6470394
> It clearly states that a new east Asian source wiped out the ANE people in their home range and mixed with the ones that were left behind.
There is no guarantee ANS originally lived in siberia when there is actually presence of P haplogroup in the philippines and oceanic SEA.

>Paleosiberians are ANE = the first southeast Asian expansion and they were primarily Q (ANE paternal lineages) but the neosiberians (a second southeast Asian expansion) were paternally asiatic Cs + NO
There is no evidence of this. In fact, there is evidence of human presence in the korean peninsula and Japan since at least 40000BC, and this suggests post-Tianyuan mongoloids occupied northern China quite early.
>These neosiberians futher replaced the remaining ANE + paleosiberians. Today, the east Asians are descended from these neosiberians.
ANE weren't originally from siberia. In fact, their ancestors (ANS) probably came after Tianyuan derived peoples occupied the east asiatic areas and the surrounding regions of northern part of SEA, south-eastern siberia and eastern China. The paper itself takes an ANS sample from 30000BC approximately IIRC.
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>>6470398
>no u
Cope.
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>>6470399
>as opposed to actual genetic evidence
You haven't provided anything to contradict my statement.

ANE was mongoloid.
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>>6470427
you get BTFO every time faggot, kys
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>>6470438
Take your pills, imbecile.
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>>6470443
I already do, anti-white seething subhuman
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>>6470478
>/int/ tier post
Cope.
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>>6466622
Aren't you the guy who said that pure CHG were better than steppe, but not as good as your favorite WHG? Your opinion of these groups changes with which poster you're talking to.
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>>6471749
No, that was not me.
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>>6471758
Don't lie Australia-anon
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>>6471878
WHG isn't my "favourite", I simply prefer the ENF-WHG cline to steppeshits and the like. CHG is integral to steppe anyway though so I'm not sure how I could say that one is better than the other.
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>>6471912
I believe you said something along the lines of EEF-WHG > CHG > EHG, because CHG was involved in civilization building, but isn't white like EEF-WHG. Your words not mine.
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>>6471963
Perhaps, but I never said here that CHG was worse than EHG. I was just making fun of steppeshit worshippers being prepared to accept that Yamnaya were Churkas given that normally they'll try to prove that they were Nordic or "white".



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