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Who invented skiing?
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>>5774907
Depends, are you pronouncing it as sheeing or skeeing?
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>>5774907
Jennifer Skii of the University of Birmingham engineering department in 1972 as part of a British Rail high speed train project. The project was cancelled and when Thatcher privatized the concept was purchased by a small Portuguese firm.
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>>5774907
The oldest literary mentions of skiing are the skrithiphinoi of Scandinavia, aka the Sami people. The oldest found skis have also been from northern Russia from places the Sami inhabited.
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>>5775014
There have also been finds from Sweden (3300 BC), Norway (3200 BC) and Finland (3245 BC), well before the Sami settled there.
Could it have come from the Western Hunter-Gatherers?
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Gustav Vasa invented skiing. Everything else is fake news
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>>5774907
Ancestors of Finns when they were tired of gettting mauled to death by Indo Europeans. It made runing away much easier.
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>>5775014
>skrithi
is this a greek verb?
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>>5775031
Shut up slave
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>>5775027
What do you mean well before the Sami settled there? The Asbestos ceramic culture is thought to be the precursor of the Sami, and they spread to the Kola and norther Lapland around 5000 BC. We know they were related to the Sami because there are multiple Asbestos ceramic culture genomes from the Kola peninsula, who were related to the Sami genetically. Did they spwak Sami at 5000 BC? Most likely not, they likely spoke paleo-Lakelandic. But are the Sami their closest modern descendants? Absolutely.
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>>5774907
Scandi
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>>5774907
How do you even skii without modern super rigid skii boots?
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>>5775041
Fingol fantasy.
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>>5775042
>What do you mean well before the Sami settled there?
Haplogroup N didn't reach Scandinavia until 1500 BC, stop wewuzzing.
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>>5775034
Yes, the term was first used by Prokopios
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>>5775045
Cross-country skiing (the original kind) doesn't use rigid boots.
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>>5775052
and what does it mean?
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>>5775048
And Sami dont have much of it. What if I told you that N =/= being Sami?
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>>5775058
Skiing Finns.
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>>5775062
So the the word skrithi, meaning skiing existed in the greek language when they didn't even know what skis were?
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>>5775059
About 50% of it.
The rest is the ordinary R1a, R1b and I1, curiously enough the same proportions as among the Scandis, suggesting that these people were assimilated into the Sami relatively recently.
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>>5775043
Kalvträskskidan is the oldest ski found in Scandinavia:

>Each ski had four holes for the bindings, which corresponds well with ancient skis found in Siberia, but not typical of other skis found in Scandinavia. The ski pole is similar to ski poles used in historic times by the Sami people in northern Scandinavia.

>corresponds well with ancient skis found in Siberia
>but not typical of other skis found in Scandinavia
>SIBERIA
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>>5775075
So because I1 cant be indo-european, any population with it cant be from the proto-indo-europeans? Got you, thanks for clearing it up.
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>>5775076
>3200 BC
In other words before both nords (indo-europeans) and sami (finno-ugrics) had settled the area.
They were WHG.
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>>5775087
no, thats not what I said
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>>5775088
They were not WHG. WHG never lived in Scandinavia. If anything, they were related to EHG since the skis are also found deep in Siberia.
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>>5775091
Yes you did. You are saying that the populatiob that has clear material-cultural continuity to the objects is not relatez to them because they got later influences from elsewhere. The Sami are the closest genetic and cultural descendants of the people who made the skis, deal with it.
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>>5775110
What were the hunter-gatherers in Scandinavia called then? As I understood it they were WHG and had haplogroup I.
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>>5775119
The wikipedia page for the Asbestos-ceramic culture doesn't say anything about a link to the sami, got a source for that?
And even if it was true, no, since skis were invented before the sami people existed, they can't have been the inventors.
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>>5775120
Scandinavian hunter gatherers. They were different from WHG, and spread there from the East with the lithic technology. They were different from WHG in that they had Asian admixture the WHG didnt.
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>>5775128
>In northern Scandinavia, asbestos ware appears apparently from ca. 1500 BC to ca. 500 BC

>Asbestos-ceramic of 'Lovozero Ware' type is also found in Fennoscandia, on the Bolshoy Oleny Island in the Murmansk region of Russia.

Wanna take a guess at who the Bolshoy are related to? And who lived in the area up to 500 BC making the same ceramics?
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>>5775130
Oh, okay.
How come they aren't represented on graphs such as this one?
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>>5775142
Hol up, whst is this quote in the article about:

>The analysis made by University of Lund, Department of Quaternary Geology, on asbestos pottery was quite unexpected, since this part of Northern Europe, usually considered to be a step behind the rest of Europe, actually introduced iron production in the pre-Roman Iron Age

Dare I say it?
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>>5775153
Because thats very outdated, and only circulated on imageboards because some retards saved them up on their computer to post in threads to prove the Norwegians are aryan or some shit like that.
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>>5775142
>different language
>different mythology
>different culture
>different haplo
You can't consider yourself to belong to EVERY culture that some of your ancestors belonged to.
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>>5775159
Is there a more up-to-date one?
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>>5775164
So modern Germanics have nothing to dl with the Nordic Bronze age. Thank you for clearing that up.
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>>5775169
NBA spoke late stage proto-indo-european, Scandinavian languages are directly descended from them
The mythology of the NBA continued up until 900-1100 AD when they were forcibly converted
Culture depends on how you look at it
Haplogroups are the same now as they were then
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>>5775184
See, I knew it you wouldnt follow your own standards. The modern Germanics have had a lot of foreign admixture and their language has changed dramatically, and they are mostly christisn or atheist, but somehow they are still the same?

Funnily enough, the last people to worship Thor were not the Scandinavians, but the Sami. Are they descended from the Nordic Bronze age too? Or do you still have s ciew of ethnicity thats tightly coiled around language families?
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>>5775184
Asbestos ceramics were still being made 200 AD in Finland. How is that if there was no continuity?
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>>5775184
If haplogroups are culture, Germanics are barely indo-european.
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>>5775206
Your culture and your ethnicity is closely related to the language you're speaking.
>The modern Germanics have had a lot of foreign admixture
From where?
>the last people to worship Thor were not the Scandinavians, but the Sami
Source?
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>>5775209
Two people making the same kind of pots don't need to be related
>>5775212
Scandis are at most 50% I1, and in many areas less than 30%.
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>>5775216
So actually the Sami are closer culturally to the Nganasan than they are to northern Norwegians?
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>>5775221
Just like the Sami are at most 50% N, many places less.
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>>5775225
I think we have drifted from the topic.
The question was which people invented skis
The sami ethnogenesis happened several millennia after skis were invented.
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>>5775216

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Tim_Bayliss-Smith/publication/325367886_Colonisation_Sami_sacred_sites_and_religious_syncretism_c_AD_500-1800_Inga-Maria_Mulk_and_Tim_Bayliss-Smith/links/5b08392aaca2725783e5d00b/Colonisation-Sami-sacred-sites-and-religious-syncretism-c-AD-500-1800-Inga-Maria-Mulk-and-Tim-Bayliss-Smith.pdf?origin=publication_detail
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>>5775221
>Literally goes pots, not people
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>>5774907
eSKIIMOS
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>>5775236
The Sami are the continuation of the culture thst made the oldest ones, in light of their material culture carrying on until the Roman age among them.
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>>5775247
Fair enough, but they weren't Sami at the time
Dyeus Pter isn't a Celtic deity even though the Celts are descended from the people who worshipped him.
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>>5775257
If the Celts were the only people around that were relsted to them, and were connected with the materisl culture in a way the others wrrent, we most definitely would consider it Celtic.

A better comparison would be to say that the British have nothing to do with the pre-Germanic people of the British isles.
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>>5774907
Who the fuck smokes a pipe while skiing, shit would be the most tongue burning thing.
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>>5775237
>The priest Samuel Rheen (1615-1680) said that they had altars to Thor which they smeared in blood
I'd take that with a grain of salt, could be interpretatio suecica or whatever you should call it.
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>>5775263
What about Finns? Shouldn't they be descended from the same material culture?
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>>5775030
this
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>>5775268
They also used the Thors hammer pendant to bang their shaman drum until very recently.

>In Sami shamanism, Horagalles, also written Hora Galles and Thora Galles and often equated with Tiermes or Aijeke (i.e. "grandfather or great grandfather"), is the thunder god. He is depicted as a wooden figure with a nail in the head and with a hammer, or occasionally on shaman drums, two hammers. It has been suggested that name is derived from that of the Norse god Thor.
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>>5775272
No, Finns spread to Finland from the Baltics very recently, during the Iron Age.
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>>5775042
The sami came in late. There was probably another population there speaking a non-finnic language that the invading samis assimilated. There's a lot of words in sami that have no uralic root that could possibly come from these guys.

Most likely the sami came in and brought in reindeer herding and assimilated the previous hunter gatherers.
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>>5775284
It could also come from Perkunos or Perkele
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>>5775292
The Sami never had cultural contacts with Balts, but they had plenty with the Norse.
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>>5775290
Reindeer herding is very recent, from the 16th century onwards. I cant believe this myth still persists.
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>>5775290
I already said this here >>5775042 the originsl people most likely spike paleo-Lakelandic. But its only found as a substrate in Samic, not Germanic.
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>>5775296
Incorrect. The tame reindeers are genetically different from free reindeers. If you've ever been in the wild in scandainvia and seen these animals it's pretty obvious. Wild reindeers here are taller than tame ones, and the tame ones are more closely with reindeers from northern siberia than scandinavian reindeers.
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>>5775298
Responded to the wrong post, sorry
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>>5775301
The tame reindeers of Scandinavia are domesticated from the wild reindeer there. Of course the wild reindeer are different.
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>>5775301
>Our data demonstrate independent origins of domestic reindeer in Russia and Fennoscandia. This implies that the Saami people of Fennoscandia domesticated their own reindeer independently of the indigenous cultures in western Russia. We also found that augmentation of local reindeer herds by crossing with wild animals has been common. However, some wild reindeer populations have not contributed to the domestic gene pool, suggesting variation in domestication potential among populations. These differences may explain why geographically isolated indigenous groups have been able to make the technological shift from mobile hunting to large-scale reindeer pastoralism independently.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2593925/
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>>5775326
They are not tamed scandinavian reindeers. Exactly, they come from Russia where the samis come from.
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>>5775339
Can you read? The quote literally says the opposite, they were independently tamed from local reindeer.
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>>5775339
>This implies that the Saami people of Fennoscandia domesticated their own reindeer independently of the indigenous cultures in western Russia
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So skiing was invented by the Scandinavian Hunter-Gatherers during the neolithic y/n
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>>5775383
Unlikely, as the SHG lived in southern Scandinavia, and no skis have been found there. The skis are clearly distributed from Siberia into northern Scandinavia, but not the south.
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>>5775046

G*rmanic cope.
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>>5774907
Finns
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>>5775433
Where, approximately, did the Scandinavian HG/Siberian HG border go?
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>>5775626
They have only been found in southern Sweden. The Motala HGs lived on Gotland, while the older ones are from Huseby in Kronobergs Län in Sweden, also very much the southern part of Scandinavia.
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>>5775288
Finns who didn't speak Finnish(which is an Estonian language) have lived in Finland and Karelia before Saami came with their BOO-mongoloid heritage
There's an article in Helsinin Sanomat about an N1c man from 10th century southern Finland who was genetically close to Baltic HGs and not Saami
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>>5775642
>Finns who didn't speak Finnish
So in other words, not Finns?
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>>5775164
This, tribal/cultural continuity is what matters the most when wewuzzing, not admixture.
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>>5775657
Ancestral Finns who switched to Estonian Finnic
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>>5775667
See >>5775662
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>>5774907
>Who invented skiing?
White people, again.

You name it, it was invented by white people.
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>>5775264
Men do Anon, men do.
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>>5775669
Tell that to Brits who wewuz about Stonehenge, or English people who wewuz about Druids.
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>>5775685
True, they should stop with that.
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>>5775662
So these people are all Swedes?
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>>5775554
*Poolack
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>>5775690
No, because while they might identify as "Swedish" they know that they're immigrants who don't have tribal descent from the Svears.
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>>5774907
>The oldest wooden skis found were in what is today Russia (c. 6300–5000 BCE), Sweden (c. 5200 BCE) and Norway (c. 3200 BCE) respectively.
In this case "Russia" refers to karelia, that was inhabited by karelians until last century. I think "Finnic peoples" we all agree.
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>>5775714
>Finnics existing any time before the Iron Age
"No."
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>>5775720
Depends on the definition of Finnic. If it includes Mordovian then Finnic languages are from about 1500 BC. If it includes all non-Ugric then about 2000 BC or before. If just Baltic Finnic then the last centuries of the Bronze Age.
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>>5775724
I'm assuming he was referring to Baltic Finns, but I don't know.
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>>5775703
I agree with you, but the original Swedes were only one of the tribes that formed the Swedish kingdom, there were also the Geats, Gutes, Scanians and a number of tribes up north.
If you live in southern England, most of your ancestors were probably Saxons, that doesn't mean you're not English.
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>>5775714
But there weren't any finnic-speakers in Sweden and Norway at that time.
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>>5775727
The proper term in circulation right now is West Uralic for Finnic, Saamic and Mordovian languages
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>>5775734
If oldest skies are found in Karelia 6300-5000 bc, they pretty likely would have spread to sweden in thousand years.
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>>5775383
There were no SHG in the Northeadt of Moscow and western Siberia where the oldest skis are found. The lake Sindor skis are almost twice as old as the skis from north Sweden.
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>>5775681
More like fucking retards that don't want to feel the taste of food anymore.
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>>5775741
Even older skis are found from near the Urals in the Komi republic, the Lake Sindor Viz site.
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>>5775720
>Theory that was based primarily on comparative linguistics, the proto-Finns migrated from an ancient homeland somewhere in northwestern Siberia or western Russia to the shores of the Baltic Sea around 1000 BC, at which time Finns and Estonians separated
Even that would be older than "Iron age", faggot.

>During the last 30 years, scientific research in physical anthropology, craniometric analyses, and the mitochondrial and Y-chromosomal DNA frequencies have reduced the likelihood of the Migration Theory - a major westward migration as recently as 3,000 years ago
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>>5774907
>Who invented skiing?
(((skiing)))
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>>5775760
Tasting food is for women, men taste smoke and soot.
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>>5775768
Didn't know that before. That still supports the finnic claims.
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>>5775769
Migration from where again? Oh right, from where the oldest skis are found.
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>>5775769
Finnics migrated to Estonia around 800 BC and Finns and Estonians only separated some time within the last 2000 years.
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Imagine being as delusional as OP.
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>>5775776
That only supports that they were finnics who invented it
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>>5775783
OP here, I think you're confusing me with someone else. I just came home from two hours of skiing.
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So:
>Skis were invented around 7000 years ago by Finno-Ugrics in Western Siberia and quickly spread throughout northernmost Europe
/thread
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>>5774907
bump
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>>5777492
Why? The question was answered.



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