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/diy/ - Do It Yourself

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I don't have the damn OP text so sod off.

remember to keep the tools loaded

EDM intro video
they got this cool thing called archive

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qq5dFeBhvRQ [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPIkPGqjBCc [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABeio9yOtkI [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gJ0PDWs0iU [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQ332KGc-6M [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92ztzCP76ho [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WN1usZ2K8xI [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeKreZqgi9M [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrWskHpk3oo [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bbMbFvsRTJo [Embed]
>abom79 is a good channel for manual machining and good "big old iron" work
>ThisOldTony provides great videos in the range of hobby garage machining
>Clickspring shows what can be done with truly rudimentary tools
>Robrenz is a wealth of high precision machining, toolmaking, and metrology
>Joe Pieczynski has good tips for the budding machinist on a variety of topics mostly related to manual machining
>NYC CNC is half-decent most of the time if you can get past the tormach shilling bullshit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CX92C3klOiY [Embed]
and maybe https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Zy3yElAWwI [Embed]
and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1oASjbm2F8 [Embed]
and https://www.youtube.com/user/Threadexpress
and this guy does aluminum and steel casting (cool) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzaz39hUUKM [Embed]
and for old iron and restoring it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nc5Z_Mo2J0Y&t=0s [Embed]
and this guy isn't particularly funny, but sometimes interesting https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4vaszLFBOE [Embed]
and stefan gotteswinter https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJgXH6K9GIU&t=1s [Embed]
and another guy that does metal castings https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5pu3hJ7SZE [Embed]
and watch this redneck build a million dollar business in his barn https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aP3SIWIVlY&t=0s [Embed]
and this guy isn't too big an idiot https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDJOJSBXswo [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXoG9uEMIpA [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poOngCE7tyM [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BOdwByzXls [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wIEi1ElHa6w [Embed]
this one is toptier diy and even in 2018 he post pics like hes on a 56k
this one is good too
Still thinking about the cobalt drill bits, almost bought a DeWalt 14pc set just to keep around before going with a big set (I’m trying to avoid HF). Then I realized that I could drill wood for ages with the things, but how am I supposed to sharpen them after some holes in steel?
You don't use those for steel.
with dewalts you can sharpen a normal drill point onto the first half inch or so, but the meat of the spiral gets thicker towards the base so if you snap one halfway down it's trashed.
Man, I work in the place that makes those little fuckers. When we test new geometry or carbide we'll smash through close to 10 or 15 in day. Love threadmills.
Then why the hell is their set of cobalt bits like that?

Fusion 360 has tapered threads now!

there ye go
>$150 for HSS
Meh, I’m gonna destroy this $30 MKE set first. I will probably snap every bit under 3/8” immediately because cobalt.

Anyway there are some good prices on Amazon for bits. Norsemen and a few other decent brands, ~$100 for a 29pc cobalt set.
okay then
also more control over thread timing in fusion 360 now, this update is pretty impressive
>smash through 15 hundred dollar thread mills in a day
Eventually I want to get a 115pc index. And I have a feelingwhen I NEED a #44 or G bit because 64ths won’t work, it’s going to be in metal. So I want to mess around with the cobalt bits as well as sharpening HSS bits and see if it’s worth spending the $$$ on a reputable 115pc cobalt set.

Also pic related just went on sale but it isn’t sold in stores otherwise I probably woulda grabbed it.
subscribing to a cloud is morally wrong.
yes anon cloud storage = bad

just like orange man = bad

good npc
i will admit I wish fusion had an offline mode. maybe they will make it available for lump-sum purchase?
Turns out good quality HSS bits cut bretty gud if I haven’t totally fucked up the bit before starting the hole. And I only snapped one bit!
-Started off a machinist
-Learned on mastercam
-Went to surfcam as a dedicated NC programmer for a couple years 2014 vr2 ... oh my god the crashes...
- switched to 2017vr2 ..oh my god the solid works updates never work, along with crashes.
- Changed jobs and now have to work with prototrak controls ... fuck my life ...

That said they are putting in cam works module for solid works. What type of hell am I in for?
it would be $600 like autocad
That's a lot less than I expected.
I voted for the orange man because I care about guns and taxes.
All the orange man has done was fuck over my tax return and outright allow the ban of bumpstocks.
Do you work for a big manufacturer, or are you like a small shop?
I know places like Harvey and Gorillamill are relatively small shops.
>small shop

Ehhhh they smake small tools, but not what I would call small.
Why are you still shitting up the machinist threads with questions about non machinist garbage?
"Pilot points" like that
"chipbreakers" aka a fucking notched split point like these are not for putting in machine tools. They are for idiots who dont know how to use a hand drill who walk crappy and dull drill bits. Its a crutch for starting a hole, at the expense of losing 30-50% of your actual cutting edge.

Fucking trash
Also both are variable helix which is also fucking trash. The fast helix near the point is only good for aluminum and wood, the slow helix near the back is only good for steels.
AKA it will eject aluminum great in the bottom of your hole but poorly near the back where it matters. And it will be poor at steel at the point of cut which wont give it the push it needs when it hits the slow helix.

> And I have a feelingwhen I NEED a #44 or G bit because 64ths won’t work

You arent a machinist, you arent going to need it. And when you do, the cheap fuck set you buy youll realize its not actually a 44 or a G.

Also what makes you think HSS is not a suitable tool steel?
You do realize the cheap m35 cobalts you are looking at are only slightly harder than a proper HSS?
In cases like Milwaukee its literal marketing wank
Ah, for some reason I was under the impression Harvey was pretty small.
I still somewhat agree with anon who said that on a hand drill with chuck wobble and shit, it’s barely worth going more precise than 64ths because it will never drill that true. I won’t do the good 115pc or letters-numbers until I have the drill press.

And the Milwaukee wank, probably true. They gotta be a little better than the TiN bits but I’m sure not machinist grade. I didn’t pay machinist money for em either because I will likely fuck them up. There was a Bosch M42 15pc set at Lowe’s for $30, and it was supposed to be in stock, but then I went to the store and they were in the process of replacing 75% of their tool stock with new Stanley Craftsman and the Bosch cobalt bits were nowhere to be found.
>They gotta be a little better than the TiN bits but I’m sure not machinist grade.

There is no such thing as "machinist grade" and "better" is misleading.

Its like everything else in the tooling world.
You need to match your tooling to what material you are machining.
Your helix, your tip geometry, your flute polish/coating/lack thereof, your tool material all matter.

HSS bits can drill through stainless steel if you arent a retard and understand work hardening.

There is a reason that you see HSS, Jobber length, 118 drills everywhere. Because as long as you arent an idiot they are ok at pretty much everything.
Thats also the reason literally everyone has told you to just get them and be done. Hell even 135 split points of you dont want to do wood.

The nuances are lost on you because you arent buying tools to match your production, or even for hobby machining work.
You are buying drills to punch holes in garbage.
People shit on HSS because they do not understand SFM and chip load. I have met butchers working production that run every drill regardless of size at 1k and a feed of 1. It's mind numbing to watch. Then they get even worse when they try to hand sharpen drills cause "i'm a machinist and all machinists can hand sharpen drills".

to everyone who doesn't know:
(3.82 / (via of drill)) * surface footage of material = RPM

RPM * cutting flutes (2 for a drill) * chip load = feed in IPM

these 2 equations are the holy grail of tool life. use them.
>you arent buying tools to match your production
This is correct because I would have to be producing something for that to be the case.

What is the difference between the angles, like 135 and 118 or 112? Which is better at what? Seems like they advertise the sharper angles to reduce walking but I center punched the stuff and didn’t have that issue.

Edit- I just read a quick comparison and they seem to say 135 split point is better for basically everything except they’re more difficult to sharpen. Is this true?
118 is 100 year old technology that was established because consistent tool steel was iffy at the time. With modern metallurgy we can switch from a fat chisel point to a sharper pointed drill with less fear of the drill breaking due to crappy material. Thats all it really is. 118 has a fat web for strength. 135 has a cleared out center point for less pressure needed drill.
I swear, some places need to hide the bench grinder from their machinist.

People putting like 0.090 thou chamfers on endmills to try and get a few more parts out of them.
Putting 90 degree chisel points on drills. The complete lack of understanding what web thinning is or does, so people put something that looks cool on the bit but doesnt actually add clearance. When it comes time to resharpen you have to chop off half an inch off the tip because its ruined the geometry.

Dont get me started on fucking shops that use their tools HARD, but refuse to put proper coatings on their carbide. Then are surprised their regrinds dont last.

Its baffling how some shops can stay in business with how inept people seem.
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This is true
Not only that the roll point needed a steeper angle to cut better.

Look at the tip of a regular roll point. The big chisel point is not sharp, it doesnt really cut. It brute forces material out of the way until the cutting edges can hit and cut. It needed to be somewhat steep.
The ancient powers that be decided that 118 was a good middle ground for strength and angle to actually move material.

The split point, same principle applies, but its chisel is much smaller and walks less. And with the big chisel problem gone, you can put a more shallow angle on the cutting edge.

The shallower angles help cut metal better, all around a better metal cutting drill.

The fact that 118 roll point DOES cut metal ok and it cuts wood ok is why its still around. Even though ideally youd have 135 split points for metal and Brad points for wood.
>135 split point is better for basically everything except they’re more difficult to sharpen. Is this true?

Better for metal. And for how difficult it is to resharpen?
Depends on how tight of a tolerance you need and what you are sharpening it with.

A split point is nothing but a roll point that had a second gash operation done to it.

You can webthin and split any regular roll point drill bit on your bench grinder.
How "good" its going to be depends on if you have man hands, and what you plan to punch holes in.
Ok guys I got a good thinker for you. How can I modify a 9" southbend lathe to rifle barrels? The obvious solution is to modify the change gear stack to accomplish 10:1-16:1 ish ratios so the machine essentially works as a broach w/ regulated barrel rotation around the broaching tool.

Maybe strip the change gear stack and add a coupler on the change gear side of the spindle shaft. Have the coupler attach it to a helical gear box and couple the output to the power screw on the lathe. Alternatively, I could add an isolated power feed drive.

Either way obviously each pass could only take off a tiny amount, probably like 3-5 thou per pass. The other issue is obviously the tool. Obviously a modified boring bar is the best bet, but idk why rigid one would be with the required aspect ratio.

Any thoughts?
>man hands
Is this going to be a problem? My fish always look smaller in pics when they’re held in my bear paws. So I should buy 100pks of 1/4” bits and toss em when they get dull?
There are a few ways to do this, at least.

mount the cutter to a long thin rod supported at both ends, I would try a tool steel version before springing for a carbide one just because of price. Hell even a mild steel one might tell you what you need to know. Don't get killed trying to turn it, thin pieces turn into death flails quickly. This video illustrates that well, guy trying to turn a long piece in his rapid-turn on a tormach--luckily he didn't get hurt but it thrashed the shit out of his guards.

It might just be easier to make a device to rotate the barrel at a certain speed sitting on the cross-slide, then use the spindle for indexing, then you have the rifling rod mounted between centers and stationary, and using the ways and carriage traverse to move.

Nope, it's just easier to rig a servo motor to the spindle and carriage traverse, then your in-feed is the cross-slide (manual). As a bonus you have a partial CNC conversion then.
Damn this hits close to home

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Bore the holes on the lathe
Cut the rifling using a Rifle Button on a hydraulic press.
What kind of gunsmithing do you plan to do?
Ive always wanted to build a revolver or something like that.
DIY handgun designs, not for commercial use I'm just a gun nut with an engineering degree.

I'm thinking I want to start with a really goofy single shot derringer.
barrel blanks are pretty cheap, and then you just ream the chamber.

could painstakingly nail all the angles on a chamber reamer, or have a CNC guy do it, then turn your rifled blank to the sizes you want and ream the chamber (slowly).

remember you can in fact attach grinding wheels to milling spindles and use them as less accurate grinders.
DIY designs sound cool, ive just considered copying existing designs to be "safer". As least in the beginning.
Sticking with 22lr and such
If I'm going to burn thousands of dollars to built meme handguns I will never use outside of a range, I want to go all the way and start with barstock myself. Machinists in the 1850s could make derringers on far more primitive machines than I have access to, it is doable.

Rifling is tough because they either didn't bother or used very specialized machines that are extremely rare and expensive now, which is why I am trying to find a way to do it on the cheap.
I mean we are primarily talking about thick walled pressure vessels with dynamic loading, which can be calculated by hand in about an hour or using ansys in a few minutes. The fun part of the design process will be the firing mechanisms which will be far more interesting, but at least with a single shot derringer not especially hazardous as you don't need to worry about a runaway.
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I agree, if you are going to build a toy gun, why wouldnt you just build the barrel too?

>Rifling is tough because they either didn't bother or used very specialized machines that are extremely rare and expensive now, which is why I am trying to find a way to do it on the cheap.

Look up "rifling buttons"
They are form tools. You ream your barrel, then you press the button through the barrel. It spins on its own, forming the rifling.

Its cheap and quick, and any non "hammer forged" barrels are pretty much buttom formed.

You can buy chinese buttons for like $15 on amazon
sine bar rifling machine, you will probably have to build the components to convert your lathe to one

this guy apparently did it already
Fuck yeah! I'm going to shoot him a message and ask if he would be comfortable sharing his cad.

whole playlist related
i think it might actually be a girl

also, grabcad might have a lot of relevant stuff. I have a cnc mill and manual lathe and am confident I could manufacture all the components necessary to build one in a month or two. Lot of work, not hopeless though.
oh shit this one is dead simple, the very essence of the sine bar style

I wonder if a taper attachment would be handy for converting a lathe?
Oh that is your sine bar attachment?

Care to share the cad so I can amend for my southbend?
>Oh that is your sine bar attachment?
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You just confused the fuck out of me, I just reread your old message it makes sense now, sorry lol.

I'm going to cad up one of my antique derringers next weekend and make some drawings. Once I figure out how I am going to rifle I think my first firearm attempt will be a duplication of it.

>pic related, stevens and co from 1860s
if you have any questions about the modeling I can answer them for you
lathe soft jaw spider
Thank you but I am a master modeler at my company in Creo 4. I'll be sure to keep yall updated.
oh even cooler.

Someday I'm going to buy a millturn just to make machining porn with.

too short unless you are only doing pistol barrels. to cut rifling you need a special tool and a guide as long as your barrel. you can see on in this video
>he doesn't know what swing is
swing isn't important because barrels aren't big around. bed length is what matters.
Yes, 9" refers to the swing, not length of bed you jagaloon.
On chrome or nickel plated stuff like that, how do they do anything inside the barrel like boring and rifling with the plating? Plate it all before and then drill the hole? Or drill it first and plate it after with something protecting the inside of the barrel? Also how to keep a smooth transition from the bare metal to plating without it flaking at the edges?
ok any time someone was talking about swing to be they usually say swing over whatever. just saying x length lathe I would assume is bed length.
My 16" lathe has a 54" bed.
Please show me a southbend catalog from any point in history where they sold a lathe with a 9" long bed.
sorry I don't know about that manufacturer. most the lathes at the shop here are clausings and takisawas.
>. just saying x length lathe I would assume is bed length.

You would assume wrong
The shorthand number is conventionally the swing.

big ass cutter
You just plug the bore.
I have a cherry condition bridgeport and 12" x 48" Atlas lathe, along with a decent shelf of tools. I'm fucking tired of making money for shitbird shop owners who pay me pennies. I make $17/hr setting up and running a 9 axis millturn doing defense aerospace parts and its bullshit. Shop max rate is $23/hr so I'll never get above that, should be a $35/hr job minimum. What the fuck can I make at home that I can actually sell to people? I just need to profit $500/week to survive.
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how would you mill a blade with a cnc center ?
assuming there is a nice flat surfarce to mount the part , my concern is about the curvature of the blade that will make it hard to strap correctly
they might spin it or something too
>I make $17/hr setting up and running a 9 axis millturn doing defense aerospace parts
what the fuck. I know people who got hired for more than that in regular job shops while still in school.
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Get the business up and running first.

As for making a product, I think you have to lean on your interests. I like weapons. Glock accessory guy here. I won't lie, with manual machines it might be hard to find something you can make profitably without spending all your day cranking handles and turning knobs. Repairs and job shop work is probably a lot more manageable with manual stuff, you could approach a job shop and ask if they are willing to send some simple work your way.

You're going to be working ON the business before you can work IN the business.

I live in the middle of nowhere and a 35+ guy should make around $25/hr for semi-skilled labor like tool & die.

Back to the product though, you could probably make scope mounts on a manual machine with a relatively simple process and the proper tooling. The people that spend big money on scope mounts want them to be super fucking accurate though, likely doable without a grinder, I would probably lap the rings for cylindricity (I don't know anything about scope mounts though). There are a lot of interesting small machined parts on a lot of things desu. You could even tackle the e-cig or automotive worlds, hell even make machinist tools. There are even shops making go-pro cases. One comes to mind that used a go-fund-me to get started (I think), he now has a nice VMC and is working on version 2. let me find the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVXFTH8eogo

An ultra-luxury phone case might be cool too. I was considering a fairly intricate one with a slide-out keyboard tray (yes on a cell phone) if I could just find the right keyboard to build it around. Phones, ecigs, etc. aren't built for working people to throw in their pocket and not worry about breaking, protecting them might be reasonably valuable.

AR muzzle devices? Flashlight mounts? Flashlights? Weapon lights have serious impact/g-force requirements that lend themselves to high-end manufacturing like machining.
A ledge to push it up against is a good start I think. If you want to depend on holding it down with those holes in the handle then they need to not change, I went through that with fixturing my parts.

Matching the profile perfectly on funky 3d shapes is not always necessary, but that knife looks fairly simple. A perfect negative of the back side of the blade and you could drop it down into the pocket and have the bottom side of that angled blade surface properly supported.

You should look at John Grimsmo's fixtures, or at least what he is willing to share publicly, it could save you a mountain of fucking time fucking around with custom fixtures. I've went through the process already if you want to ask an amateur industrial designer questions on here too.

Yeah its fucking retarded. I hired in to run one horizontal mill at night at this wage and it was fine because it was 2 hours of work 6 hours playing on my phone. I jumped at the chance to move up but no pay increase because the economy something something, it's horse shit and I'll be quitting as soon as I can survive on my own.

Those are great suggestions. I'm aware i'll be cranking handles all day but idgaf as long as I can eat and I'm not making my shylock bosses money as slave labor.

The phone case idea is pretty cool. Maybe personalized aluminum, anodized colors, engrave pictures on the back with a chinese cnc router or something I can get cheap. Thanks again mate

some good info here
I'm so sick of this jackass on night shift not cleaning up after himself and scrapping jobs that I started. I work hard to keep everything neat around here and it all just gets trashed. Also who the fuck uses coolant when cutting cast iron? My jaws are so caked up in the screw I can barely adjust them.
>use screw holes as clamping points
>make jig to cut blade at angle
>toe clamps on non machined areas
Get creative

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