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>**Nrama**: So does this tie in to Doomsday Clock at all? Because we’ve seen the seeds of the Justice Society returning in Doomsday Clock.

>**Snyder**: Not really. I mean, Doomsday Clock really is its own wonderful, incredible story. The kind of light connection between them is just that, what Geoff and I talked about was because Doomsday Clock is kind of running at its own pace and in its own kind of continuity, what I didn’t want to do was bring the JSA back before he had a chance to reintroduce them as a concept in issue #10.

>I think that’s similar with other characters that he’s going to be using in Doomsday Clock as well.

>So there’s a nod to each other in that regard. I wanted him to be able to have the JSA as an idea, and have that first appearance in Doomsday Clock.

>But in terms of the continuities linking up, Doomsday Clock is a very special and inspirational book. We’re all amazed, I think, at how good it is. **But its effects are relatively self-contained to itself.**


https://www.newsarama.com/45553-scott-snyder-to-reintroduce-justice-society-of-america-has-big-plans-for-them.html
>>
So not only is doomsday shit and pointless it 's also inconsequential.
>>
Maybe it wouldn't be ignored if it came out on time.
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>>108129095
The delays are to blame for this
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>>108129095
Can you post that on other sites? Im banned from cbr for debating the color blue.
>>
>they literally can't reference Doomsday Clock until it's done
I'm fine with this, I'm waiting for it to finish before I read it but every page I've seen of this book is gorgeous
>>108129194
Neat, I'm banned for being pro-Trump
>>
>Johns fucked himself so hard his book is a glorified Elseworlds

JUST
>>
You got no one but yourself to blame Johns
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>>108129293
John's didn't do shit to himself. Every single fucking delay is a result of shitters like Didio, King and Bendis fucking with the characters to a degree that Doomsday Clock has to be continuously rewritten just to try and line them up.
>>
Did anyone REALLY think Doomsday Cock was going to precipitate a big shakeup/reboot?
It's just shaking the Watchmen tree for more money.
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>>108129293
>>108129318
Oh please, the reason for the delays is the artist.
>>
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>>108129293
>Johns fucked himself so hard his book is a glorified Elseworlds
I'm fine with this.
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>>108129318
What? Jons isn't accomodating to anything at all? What changes you'd say he's made from his original plan?
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>>108129095

Things changed when Didio got more power and Johns was removed from power.

So there really is a metaverse and earth zero.
>>
>>108129336
Johns openly admitted to rewriting the story following the election, which probably delayed the start of the book even further
>>
>>108129336
>>108129386
Sanctuary from HIC gets mentioned for whatever reason or another, and several delays were clearly made to try and accommodate changes made by the other writers.

I know nu/co/ is a bunch of dumbasses who want to blame Johns for being the root of all evil, but fucking come on.
>>
>>108129392
Plus at and t.
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>>108129095
Based Snyder
>>
>>108129293
he's rumored to be out of the company after DC Universe folds and 3 Jokers is completed
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>>108129392
Didio did not get more power you incompetent buffoon.
>>
>>108129464
He did.
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>>108129464
He fucking did.
>>
>>108129485
>>108129494
Explain how you retarded shit, he holds the same stupid fucking position he's held for years.
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>>108129538
He reduced Johnns short powers.
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>>108129569
Elaborate, shitfuck.
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>>108129419
>rewriting
It's worse. He admitted to WRITING it in response to the election. He didn't know what to do and hadn't really started before it, so there wasn't anything to rewrite.
>>
Lmaoo
Johns is a joke and so is DC for stroking his ego
>>
>>108129538
I think what they're getting at is is that Johns was the architect for the Rebirth push, but that's clearly changed by this point.
>>
>>108129336
And Johns decided to work on the book with absolutely no contingencies in place for if Gary Frank, a notoriously slow artist who Johns not only knows personally, but has worked with on several projects, couldn't keep up with a simple monthly deadline? It's not like they just decided to publish this on a dime, Johns had a solid two years from the inception of Rebirth up to its actual release to get the guy to pre-draw issues or at least get a head-start on the release and he fucked it up.
>>
>>108129632
Perfection takes time.
>>
DDC was just a vanity project so he could lift his leg and mark the publisher's most notable work, spite Moore, and be credited with "reintroducing the concepts" of several 50-80 year old properties that have always been in the mix, but that he hoarded for 4 years, before handing them off to other writers as if blessing them with a sugary wand made of cereal. What a fucking dweeb.
>>
>>108129684
It also takes preparation, which Johns didn't do.
>>
>>108129632
Did Johns decide or did DC throw him at him?
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>>108129538
Lee got Johns' CCO title, not Didio
>>
>>108129744
go fuck yourself hater, Doomsday Clock is already better than watchmen and it ain't even done yet.
>>
Johns Metaverse vs Didios Earth Zero.
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>>108129761
Johns decided. He literally considers Frank to be the best artist currently at DC and the best Superman artist ever, in the same league as Curt Swan.
>>
>>108129785
Wally the anti body vs Wally the ooops Killer.

Silver Age legion vs Bendis maybe Post Zero Hour Legion
>>
How the fuck did Bendis get his hands on Legion in this post doomsday clock splitting of properties
>>
>>108129774
Go to bed, Geoff.
>>
>>108129809
They already gave him Superman and Young Justice. They clearly thought it was a swanky idea.
>>
>>108129448
Hope that’s not true, guy’s comics were some of the first I ever read
>>
>>108129803
So Tom Kings Batman don't exist in Johns Metaverse or Jon El.

Synders JSA has Starman and Wildcat. While Johns has Johnny Thunder and Spectre.
>>
>>108129871
>While Johns has Johnny Thunder and Spectre.
Spectre's in Tomasi's Detective Comics
>>
>>108129871
3 jokers is black label.
>>
>>108129881
Not the same one from Johns. Nu52 one showing up in dect.
>>
>>108129885
In retrospect that should have been the first sign that they were shunting his stuff put of the main books
>>
>>108129906
And that there have been no details about his "Killing Zone" imprint in 11 months
>>
>>108129954
Thank God.
>>
>>108129954
KILLING ZONE
You're literally supposed to capitalize it anon. Which is cool and healthy and not him working out any personal issues.
>>
>>108129785
It's lot like old Earth 1 and B. Similar universes with 40 percent diffrences.
>>
>>108129870
It's for the best at this point. Johns hasn't written anything good in years.
>>
>>108129954
the fuck's that? is it different from black label and young animal or whatever that my chemical romance dude was?
>>
>>108129744
Johns' idea of perfection is sitting on an idea for years and doing literally nothing with it, then just farting it out in a six-month timeframe and tossing a mediocre book/ongoing out just to say he finally did it.

See:
>Rise of the Seven Seas (which he just straight-up gave up on when he lost power in WB to adapt it to film)
>Shazam (the series he forbid anyone else from using the character to make, for six years)
>Three Jokers (the series he called dibs on Fabok to draw, coming straight off of Darkseid Wars when he was literally offered any book at DC to draw)
>Doomsday Clock (which ultimately wound up getting so delayed that DC has literally been forced to turn it in to an Elseworlds book solely so they can actually move ahead)
>>
>>108129885
New Watchmen collection is Black Label too.
>>
>>108130024
Details were scare, but it seemed like it was supposed to be about exploring different moments in the DCU's history.
Like, books with characters in the 50s, 60s, 70s, etc
>>
>>108129448

It's rumored because you just made up the rumor
>>
>>108130031
>Shazam (the series he forbid anyone else from using the character to make, for six years)
lol, no one even storytimed that last week
>>
>Harass
>Didio
>Johns
No wonder DC has been shit for a decade
>>
>>108129095
The DR.m that showed up in DC ongoings will be retconned into one of those Sideway guys.
>>
>>108129711

This. All this hype for JSA when the JSA were only missing because Geoff doesnt like to share his toys. He acts like they're huge components of DC lore when in reality it's only the shit that he's written! Which isn't even very good. I was 25 when rebirth started. I'll be well into my 30s by the time there's a new trade of JSA sitting in my LCS. Like it'll even be worth it.
>>
>>108130132
You're forgetting Jim "SM/WW is the best DC can be" Lee, the current Chief Creative Officer and Co-Publisher
>>
>>108129095
Best news is most of pre flashpoint is never coming back.

And the relauch post Doomsday Clock and change to the dcu is aborted.
>>
>>108130074
kinda weird to have an edgy name like that with throwbacks.
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>>108129954
>Killing Zone
>KZ
>Johns' imprint
>EVS is close collaborator with Johns

Maybe DC realized what KZ also stands for
>>
>>108129996
I know but it’s like putting a horse out to pasture, it’s hard to say goodbye
>>
>>108129095
>doomsday clock is in its own continuity
The absolute state of this fucking company
Christ, Didio
>>
>>108129148
In a way I kind of feel bad for Johns. Doomsday Clock isn't that good and he's fairly overrated as a writer but watching everything he set up and tried to do for Rebirth get destroyed and booted into non-canon land be DiDio and his cronies (Snyder, King, etc.) because DiDio's a cunt must really fucking suck.
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>>108130181
Based Didio.
>>
>>108130108
I'm actually reading it and I can confirm that it wasn't storytimed for a reason.
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>>108129785
Lol.
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>>108130190
There was a avclub review of the most recent Doomsday Clock issue that directly compared that gay actor to Johns. Both go to Hollywood looking for success, and then get betrayed. Johns got fired from DC Film after Justice League failed, and now he's screaming about it in Doomsday Clock
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>>108130231
what
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>>108130235
Based Didio.
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>>108129785
Yay I have TWO main Earths now.
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>>108130240
>Fail at your job
>Get removed
>"BETRAYAL!"

C'mon now
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>>108129095
whats up with that kids zoomer haircut?
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>>108129464
Yeah man, that's why once Johns got removed from power a concerted effort was made to destroy everything related to Rebirth and roll everything back to New 52 style books and tone (Didio's baby). That's why Dick and Wally, characters Didio openly hates because they "age" Bruce and Barry, got completely fucked over once Johns lost power. That's why we're getting another fucking villain-centric event or month or whatever the fuck, something Didio loves.

Everything having Didio's fingerprints isn't actually proof that Didio gained power at the expense of Johns. That makes perfect sense.
>>
>>108130267
>C'mon now
that's why I said "screaming about it"
No one cares about what he feels
>>
>>108130240
i read an article about how Geoff Johns is self inserting as Dr Manhattan
>fucked with the DC universe in creating the new 52
>made a big mistake creating the new 52 and now everyone hates him for it
>>
>>108130303
Didio and Johns occupied the same positions while New52 was happening as they did before that and during Rebirth and Didio is still occupying the same position as he always has. You are a delusional retard and you don't even know how stupid you actually sound.
>>
>>108129095
DC is truly a mess.
>>
I read an article of Johns self inserting as Sally Jupiter
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>>108130311
I got that anon, i just found what the article was talking about silly.
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>>108130244
What part of that post do you need me to clarify.
>>
The LSH and the JSA are the only teams I really give a fuck about and they just keep getting fucked over at every turn. I don't even know why I care anymore. Aside from being such a sad fuckup that I try to disassociate through comics as much as possible so I won't have to bother with my mess of a life.
>>
>Metaverse
Doomsday Clock(Or how Grant Morrison gave Johns the idea to spite Moore once again) was already disrespectful and crap already but this is when it went to far. I, as a lot of other fans would agree, the multiverse was already cool and complex in itself. Now you're just adding another element to make it even more convoluted? Like it will serve no purpose in the long run so what's the point?
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>>108130363

The irrational hate for Didio is something I'll never understand. Pretty sure its like one anon since they keep regurgitating the same debunked points.

Didio is cool because he loves Kirby, spends money to keep Morrison around, and knows when to tell Geoffrey to fuck off.
>>
>>108130477
>that spoiler
are you me?
>>
>>108130519
DCfags don't deserve Morrison.
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>>108129095
Explains why the multiverse is dying in Earth Zero books but not in the metaverse.
>>
>>108129095
>>108129148
Based Snyder shitting on Johns the hack
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>>108129095
>We’re all amazed, I think, at how good it is.

Notice the deliberate absence of a statement on exactly HOW good it is.

Dials start at zero, after all...
>>
>>108129095
I think Snyder is really start to think he is the new Morrison in terms of importance when he says stuff like that.

As for the news itself, everything has already been said by the first post >>108129148.
This was to be expected since the delays, a year after it was already clear that everyone was ignoring DClock, and DC not respecting the continuity isn't anything new really but i'd have waited for the story to end because saying stuff like that, even if de facto everyone was already ignoring it.

The even is still boring shit and it shouldn't be a thing, but at least give some respect to your co-workers.
>>
The fuck's the metaverse? you guys are talking about it as if it's an actual multiverse or continuity instead of just Morrison memery to tell the haters to fuck off or whatever.
>>
>>108130610
The Metaverse is a collective virtual shared space, created by the convergence of virtually enhanced physical reality and physically persistent virtual space, including the sum of all virtual worlds, augmented reality, and the internet.
>>
>>108130519
>The irrational hate for Didio is something I'll never understand
I mean it's not that hard to wrap your head around scapegoating. DiDio has had a lot of bad ideas and a lot of good ideas, but it's a lot easier to remember bad ideas.
>>
>>108130610
John's doomsday clock Metaverse Earth isnt Earth Zero with this news. They don't match.
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>>108130642
The metaverse isn't just one earth though. It's the entire DC comics.
>>
>>108130600
>I think Snyder is really start to think he is the new Morrison in terms of importance when he says stuff like that.
He's an arrogant little cuss ain't he?
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>>108130658
I think you misunderstood Johns intention and what dc is doing. You will see im right in upcomimg monthes.
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>>108130678
Yup. Everyone knows the new(and improved) Morrison is Al Ewing.
>>
>>108130600
yeah, I've dropped everything but DDC and Green Lantern for now, and this just gives me the final push to drop DC for a few years at least. They're shitting on each other within the company, they clearly need time to get their shit together
>>
>>108130704
>>mistaking a mediocre continuityfag for a genuine creative genius

That's gonna be a yikes for me dawg
>>
>>108130704
why people have to keep comparing people's writing, i put "in terms of importance" in my post for this exact reason
>>
>>108129095
>Doomsday Clock is kind of running at its own pace and in its own kind of continuity
DC is a joke. Doomsday Clock, DC comics, however you want to interpret that.
>>
>>108130748
>i get my opinion from 4chan shitposting

Great.
>>
>>108130742

Am I the only one who still likes Snyder despite him ripping of Morrison at every turn? Like Grant always wanted people to play with his concepts but people (oustide of Tomasi and a few others) were too afraid. I'd rather have an 8/10 writer revisit it than have it rot in limbo or be picked up by some scrub like Orlando. Plus Snyder miraculously brings great artists.

And if people are mad that he's trivializing DC cosmic shit Geoff started it with his New52 Darkseid and """Moebius"""
>>
>>108130764
I don't know anon, personaly i've never felt arrogance coming from Morrison as i do from Snyder, Morrison feels like he does his lofty ideas because he really feels a natural impulse of creating those ideas they just happened to feel high concept. With Snyder it just feels like he has the initial impulse to create a big idea and then works from there, kind of an inverse and forces process.
>>
>>108130800

I got my opinion by reading his books. Ultimates was not good and no one would care about Immortal Hulk if it wasn't double shipping with Bennett's art and Ross covers.
>>
>>108130801
His shit is stupid and he knows fuck all about anything.
>>
>>108130801
>8/10 writer
hahahahahahahhaha
>>
>>108129095
NON-CANON
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>>108130679
No, the idea is that the earth everyone focuses on is the metaverse.
>>
>>108129148
FPBP

DC literally just admitted their biggest book is non-canon and doesn’t matter.

Way to go, guys.
>>
>>108130801
>Snyder
>8/10

That's really generous.
I don't have problems with people playing with Morrison or even Moore's toys (i was curious for DClock when it was announced, even with the knowledge of Before Watchmen being a thing. Gaiman did good with Miracleman, for example)
The problem is when you start flooding the lore with shit just for the sake of it and without really dwelling into it or putting some effort into building it up. Snyder's problem is that he uses garbage concepts of his own and he is a mediocre storyteller. Which is the case for most of the current writers considered bad.
>>
>>108130704
Morrison is Morrison.
>>
>>108130888
Nope.

The Meta Earth is what spawns off universes but was always the real Earth.
>>
>>108130801
He's genuinely unreadable for me, I think he's really really bad and is running roughshod over some of the coolest concepts in the DCU, but he seems like a nice enough guy and I wish him no ill will
>>
>>108130835
>bah bah bah CHEATERZ
Oh yeah, it is you little faggot. Keep sperging about IH outselling Batman, looks like you need it.
>>
Moore wins bay bay
>>
>>108130930
You're obsessed.
>>
DC are just ignoring Doomsday Clock completely now. They don't promote it at all. No ongoing books will tie in with it, despite Oz Effect and the Button already existing, which just screws up DC's continuity further... None of it make sense at all.

They dropped all the Rebirth branding. Doomsday Clock was supposed to close off the whole Rebirth-era DC and bring in the new continuity but now it's going to be relegated to a pointless and inconsequential story.
>>
>>108130835
>Ultimates was not good
Opinion discarded, also you mentioning Ultimates further proves that you only know about Ewing from what books other anons have talked about.

> Immortal Hulk if it wasn't double shipping with Bennett's art and Ross covers.
Oh you are just a retard.
>>
>>108130821
What I get from Snyder is that he's playing to a crowd.
>>
>>108130965
Someone truly is, and it is sad.
>>
>>108129095
>Doomsday Clock is literally not canon
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Holy shit! What is going on at DC?!! At they trying to crash or something?
>>
>>108130150
>Which isn't even very good.

Nah I have plenty of problems with Johns but his JSA is modestly well regarded
>>
Ewing's really good and occasionally great and it's cool he's such a tailor of continuity like Morrison but it's unfair and unnecessary to compare him to the bald GOAT (along w Moore)
>>
>>108130821
My thoughts on Snyder exactly.

>>108130973
>the Button
That was already retconned by King.
>>
>>108129448
>serves as consultant on Aquaman and Shazam
>best hit
>best reviewed
That does it, WB/DC is retarded.
>>
>>108130984
Pretty much yeah. You saw the reaction to the Superman Family Punch
>>
>>108131017
it's pretty mediocre and uninspired.
>>
>>108130160
Who hasn't had an original idea in his entire fucking life.
>>
>>108129095
Why do people still care about DC when they literally have no continuity and none of the books interact with each other?
>>
>>108131011
You are joking but saying shit like that will unironically influence DClock's sales.
>>
>>108131034
Than everything about the JSA would be mediocre and DC was right to axe it.
>>
>>108131028
That was such a dumb page, completely undeserved climax for a inconsequential arc.
>>
>>108131025
>Believing 4chan (((rumor)))
>>
>>108131045
>but saying shit like that will unironically influence DClock's sales
Then maybe Snyder shouldn’t have said that?
Maybe Didio shouldn’t have let him say that?
At the very least, they could have lied and said “Yeah, Doomsday Clock is totes canon. Totes.” But Snyder just openly admitted that Doomsday Clock doesn’t matter, that it is non-canon, and that everyone wasted their money worse than the Bat Wedding.
>>
>>108131081
And everybody ate it up.
>>
>>108131020
This is something I've seen repeated many times but they're opposites, actually. Ewing references continuity because he's playing to a crowd, Morrison just looks for old comics for inspiration, often times the best idea is to reinvent a bad one. For Batman he said he looked at stories that were considered stupid and that couldn't work in continuity so he could make them work.
Ewing's approach is to connect all stories and streamline them into a narrative in which "everything is canon". Morrison's philosophy is that as long as you hold a comic book in your hands, that comic is canon. You have a special bond with that comic and nothing will ever take that away from you, and you can put the comic down and read it again at a later time and it will be canon on every read.When you are "on a date" with a comic, you shouldn't think about where the events you are reading takes place in relations to other comics you've read in the past.
>>
>>108131097
Dude, what the hell can i say to you, i'm not their PR. And after that shit i'm starting to doubt there is someone who actually studied to be a PR over there.

Right now the reply that makes the most sense to me is >>108131044, i'm so over it. You wouldn't imagine.
>>
>>108131017
Spoken like a true retard.
The good parts of JSA were all written by Goyer and ghost written by Robinson.
>>
>>108131055
Retarded johnstard thinks Johns created the characters. No surprise.
>>
>>108131139
So many words, so little said.
>>
>>108131150
Robinson is as big of a hack as Johns. He only wrote the first arc and it's one of the worst of that run.
>>
>>108129095
>DC: Hey Guys we brought back Wally! We will totally treat him with respect!
>DC: FOOL’D YOU! Wally is a crazy serial killer now! Thanks for the money, Suckers!!!
>DC: Hey everyone! Batman and Catwoman are getting married!
>DC: FOOL’D YOU! Catwoman left Batman at the alter! Thanks for the money, Suckers!!!
>DC: Hey Readers! DC and Watchmen are having a crossover and it is the biggest most important book ever! Buy it now!
>DC: FOOL’D YOU! It is noncanon and an elseworld! Thanks for the money, Suckers!
Why do people still trust these assholes again?
>>
>>108131172
>so little said
Nope.
>>
>>108131144
Johns>Moore>Snyder>Morrison>Ewing

Nuff' said!
>>
>>108131178
I wish someone would sue DC for false advertisement.
>>
>>108131178
Fuck Wally West
Fuck BatCat
Fuck Geoffrey's Watchmen 2: Electric Boogaloo
And fuck you
>>
>>108131178
Better than reading marvel shit for brainlets or even worse creator owned shit like a fucking incel.
>>
>>108131153
Johns is the reason why we're even still talking about these guys.
>>
>>108129095
I guess this means Snyder is on Didio's/Lee's side. I remember Rich saying a while ago that certain high up people at DC were on their side over Johns and the way to tell was how they talk/don't mention Doomsday Clock at all. Hacks gotta stick together I guess.
>>
>>108131234
Why YOU are talking about them, maybe. Now why WE are talking about them. Idiot.
>>
>>108129095
NON-CANON
O
N
|
C
A
N
O
N
>>
>>108129095
Why does DC even make comics if they hate continuity so much? And don’t say money because we have seen the low sales.
>>
Based Dc. It's for non brainlets.
>>
>>108131244
Didio and Harras give Snyder a lot of power. Which is understandable since Scott can usually deliver. I mean heck, the Batman Who Laughs book is the highest selling Bat Book.
King was also given much power for awhile but it seems to have greatly lessened. King wasted his run on filler and unkept promises and chased readers away to the point that Batman lost to the Hulk. Not mention his Heroes in Crisis event sold less than Metal.

It is obvious which one is favored and which one is losing favor.
>>
>>108131260
You think that you would still be talking about the JSA without johns? Rest assure, you wouldn't.
>>
>>108130108
Just gave it a read, what a trash issue.
>>
>>108131394
Don't talk for me, you shithead. You don't know me.
>>
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>Caring about the place of a story in a bigger universe in the first place.

Shouldn't you guys be worried that the book is shit in and on itself already? that other nonsense is meaningless anyway. Were you really hyped to read Green Arrow or Cyborg, etc... on how their books would react to Dr. Manhattan's adventures?
>>
>>108129095
This is Johns’s own fault. Didio asked him if Doomsday Clock could be a company wide crossover event but he said no because it would “ruin his vision”. He could have satisfied Didio and allowed every creative team to be on his level instead of passing him fifty years in the future because he picked the slowest artist possible. Didio would probably have been easy on the delays if he played ball.

Now Doomsday Clock is not canon, not important, and being ignored by literally everyone. And now the same will happen to Three Jokers. Johns is no longer important or in the spotlight. Was it worth it, Johns?
>>
>>108131025
>WB/DC
>retarded
That was obvious when they put Michael "I want the BBOC" Bendis in charge of Superman
>>
>>108130973
Johns didn’t want any tie ins
>>
>>108131443
some anons were hoping that DClock would lead to a relaunch and maybe undo some of the shit that has been happening the year (like Adult Jon and killer Wally). Instead it just cemented the current shit continuity and deleted any chance of fixing anything. Bendis and King are the future of DC.
>>
>>108131551
Based.
>>
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>>108131490
The fuck is 3 jokers supposed to be and how did Geoff Jones get involved with it at all?
>>
>>108131390
Which makes no god damn sense though. Sure Snyder's Batman sold really well, but nothing else he's ever done has been a huge hit like that. Compare that to Johns whose taken B listers like Green Lantern and single handedly turned them into a top selling a lister. It really does seem that Didio is undermining Johns out of spite.
>>
>>108131443
The story is already shit. Johns wasted 90% of the book on his shit OCs Walking around the DCU. Superman was barely in it and almost did nothing. At the very least there was a chance to see the JSA and Legion of Superheroes come back. Except none of that shit is going to happening since Snyder is bringing back the JSA and Bendis is taking control of the JSA. The only other thing was that since the book takes “two years into the future” that it could fix some of the current problems of the current universe except it isn’t because it is not even in continuity. The book is now completely useless and utterly pointless. Might as well have Ambush Bug wake up and say it was all a dream.
>>
>>108129095
>WHO LET THE NON-CANON OUT?!!
>SNYDER! SNYDER!! SNYDER!!!
>WHO LET THE NON-CANON OUT?!!
>SNYDER! SNYDER!! SNYDER!!!
>WHO LET THE NON-CANON OUT?!!
>SNYDER! SNYDER!! SNYDER!!!!!!
>>
>>108131139
>Ewing references continuity because he's playing to a crowd, Morrison just looks for old comics for inspiration, often times the best idea is to reinvent a bad one
t. "I like Morrison and I don't like Ewing".
>>
>>108131551
Good. I want to see how bad DC will get before At&t closes the comic division down entirely.
>>
>>108131599
why did they choose 3 jokers that are so fucking similar for this? barely any contrast what a waste.
>>
>>108131599
Tom King only has one Joker.
>>
>>108131704
They only closing down Vertigo and making all the titles monthly again.
>>
>>108129148
Or maybe King’s work is pointless and inconsequential. I would say King’s Batman hasn’t really affected the larger DCU sans Nightwing and maybe Red Hood
>>
>>108131599
Geoff Johns wrote the New 52 Justice League (it was shit). His last big event for the comic was Darkseid War, which was boring and forgettable. Johns wanted everyone to not think his run was pointless so he decided to put Dr Manhattan in it and have him kill some characters. But BEFORE that he had Batman figure out the Joker’s Secret identity (DUN DUN DUUUUHHHHH) using the mobius chair. And by revealing his identity it actually revealed there are THREE Jokers in the DCU from different worlds.
Both of these were done to drum up controversy and get people talking. And then to add fuel to the hype fire he brought back Wally in Rebirth #1.
>>
>>108130329
>Superman beats the shit out of the World Forger, and extends his hand in welcome to the JL because he understands his villainy was well intentioned and the stakes were high
>Superman will beat the shit out of Manhattan and find him so insignificant and contemptible he ignores him forever

Damn
>>
>>108130600
Isn’t he working WITH Morrison on a bunch of stuff? Like apparently the whole Perpetua bullshit is something he and Morrison brainstormed together
>>
>>108129095
What do Big Foot, the Loch Ness Monster, and DC’s continuity have in common?

They don’t exist
>>
Y'all some fucking haters geeze, stop crying.
>>
>108132010
I don’t have to listen to your comment because it isn’t in continuity anymore. Snyder told me your comment is just an alternate comment in a self-constrained alternate board that doesn’t affect 4channel.
>>
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>>108132212
>N52 Action Comics
Chad Casual has some decent taste. That was a solid Morrison book.
>>
>>108132246
thats why hes a chad
>>
>>108132212
This, it is why the MCU is a complete failure and never made a billion dollars while the DCEU has made trillions.
Oh wait......oopsie.....
>>
I dont give a shit about pre flashpoint even i did read it.
>>
>>108132408
well then youre missing out on some of the greatest JLA runs in history
>>
>>108132449
I say i read it but dont need it in canon.
>>
>>108131851
I don't buy that bullshit for a second.
>>
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>>108132501
o i c
>>
Doomsday Clock is unfocused as fuck. Is it Watchmen 2: Electric Boogaloo? Well, one would think that due to all the time spent on the Superman Theory, all the Watchmen characters and the tensions between Russia and the US.
Is it a DC crossover? Well, one could think that due to the amount of DC superheroes appearing on issue #9.
Is it a metacommentary on DC rebooting? Well that was what they promised.
Honestly it just ends up being an unfocused mess.
>>
>>108132681
It doesn’t help that Johns rewrote the entire story.
>>
>>108132706
Really? has je ever said what was his inital plan?
>>
>>108130164
What does it stand for?
>>
>>108130519
>The irrational hate for Didio is something I'll never understand.

That's because you didn't live through his advent into DC.
>>
>>108129464
Didn't you notice the huge quality drop in DC comics after Johns stepped down?
>>
>>108133051
>Williamson Flash
>KingBats
>Hitch Justice League
>Robinson Wonder Woman
>Jurgens AC
>Abnett Titans
>Percy Teen Titans
>Tomasi Superman
Rebirth was a fucking trash fire that people convinced themselves was a mountain of gold because they believed DC lying through their teeth yet again.
>>
>>108133091
jurgens ac was fine
hitch jl was so fucking boring
>>
>>108132706
I wouldn't be surprised. Why the fuck is most of the story on Johns' OCs, the Superman Theory, Russia and all of that stuff just for it to go "Actually, none of that actually matters. Here's the metaverse or something." on issues #9 and #10?
>>
>>108133123
>>108132744
>>108132706
This is implying that Johns ever finished the story and isn't just making shit up as he goes.
>>
They edited the article to remove his comments about it not really being in continuity.
>[* A brief portion of Scott Snyder’s responses have been edited at his request to better reflect Snyder’s thoughts.]
Maybe he got a call from Johns.
>>
>>108133091
Same thing happened with DC You. So many tards here lost their shit when Didio said they were more committed to good stories than continuity autism. Then were surprised when DC didn't follow through with those good stories.
>>
>>108133150
Wtf.


Fuck off.
>>
>>108133120
>jurgens ac was fine
It was incredibly boring, basically a gigantic filler arc.
>>
>>108133168

Anyone who believed that bullshit didn't read dumpster fire that was Convergence.

It really should be mandatory reading material for anyone who wants to get into modern DC. It sums up the company perfectly.
>>
>>108133226
its better than the current run inmho
>>
>>108129785
>my faggotry vs your faggotry
Great
>>
>>108133091
>Robinson Wonder Woman
Conveniently """forgetting""" about Rucka's amazing run that salvaged the entire character and her mythos after the shit fire that was the New-52
>Jurgens AC
Was great. Lexbro was fucking awesome.
>Percy Teen Titans
Was the best TT run since Johns.
>Tomasi Superman
Oh, so you just have shit taste.
>>
Dc has never published a bad book nor has marvel.

All image comics are bad.
>>
>>108133309
>Rucka's amazing run
You mean his extended 'not muh' fix fic? The one that Robinson immediately torpedoed when he started his run, at Johns' request, explicitely to conclude a story arc from Johns JL run, again at his request?
>Was great.
Was fucking shit
>Was the best TT run since Johns.
Was a fucking dull, soulless slog
>so you just have shit taste
Tomasi's Superman was shit, anon.
>>
>>108129095
YOU ALL KNEW DOOMSDAY CLOCK WAS OUT OF CONTINUITY

YOU'VE KNOWN THIS SINCE BENDIS' SUPERMAN RUN STARTED AND HE OUTRIGHT CONTRADICTED DOOMSDAY CLOCK

WHY ARE YOU ACTING SURPRISED BY THIS NOW?
>>
>>108133091
Hitch's JL is better than Snyder's
>>
>>108133374
Oh, so you're doubling down on saying you just have shit taste.
>>
>>108134332
>>108134349
>Rebirthfags
>>
>>108129095
>because Doomsday Clock is kind of running at its own pace and in its own kind of continuity
Translation: because it's late as FUCK and the dick I need to suck at the moment belongs to Didio.
>>
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>>108133091
>>Williamson Flash
I will never understand how this hack is still on The Flash.
>>
>>108134377
Not a real response there
>>
>>108134406
If you genuinely believe that Hitch JL is better than Snyder JL then there's nothing to respond to.
>>
>>108134309
How did bendisfo that?
>>
>>108129996
Doomsday clock should’ve been good or at least decent, you had the lead ins teased in green lantern and ‘tec. While johns hasn’t been good in recent years he has been a pretty good creative head, and the failures of doomsday clock are more on editorial rushing the book without final art past the first 3 issues and shitty content changes from Didio. I won’t lose any sleep over johns going but it should’ve been didio first
>>
>>108130163
I forget the details but I think the name was reference to a dc property or the fact that it was an edgier take on cancelled DC properties from the implosion, etc
>>
>>108134309
Bendis is the only actually following up on Johns stuff though.
>>
>>108130519
DiDio ruined DC, it’s gonna crash very soon with no AT&T rescue package.
>>
>>108134714
Sure anon
>>
>>108134714
Sure retard that’s why they’re announcing a bunch of new series, because there about to close. God you fags are insufferably retarded today.
>>
>>108129148
And to think he drove away Hickman for this.
>>
>>108133256
I almost read the Convergence: Zero Hour TPB because Zero Hour is one of first DC events I remember from the early 90s.
>>
>>108134714
You think Didio might jump ship or something anytime soon? Dudes been running things for almost 20 years and hasn’t done a single good thing since
>>
I mean as far as we know Johns isn't actually even fixing anything, just using the fact they're not canon anymore as a device in his story, so Snyder restoring them wouldn't contradict that.

Alternatively all Johns will be doing is flipping a switch that says "JSA canon ON/OFF", and not actually outlining what their place will be in the current continuity.
>>
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>>108129095
I still dont get how younger Jon fits in synder's story when Bendis aged him up. I guess synder just does his own thing.
>>
>>108133150
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! My Sides! I wonder how posed Johns is that Snyder just told him his story is non-canon.
>>
>>108134309
Yes, but I didn’t expect DC to just openly admit it.

I expected them to at least keep on lying and pretending they have everything in order.
Not “Doomsday Clock is not canon! None of it matters! We are making up everything as we go along!”-Snyder.
>>
>>108133150
>>108133185
>>108135005
They changed
>But in terms of the continuities linking up, Doomsday Clock is a very special and inspirational book. We’re all amazed, I think, at how good it is. **But its effects are relatively self-contained to itself.**

to

>But in terms of the continuities linking up, Doomsday Clock is a very special and inspirational book. We’re all amazed, I think, at how good it is. Hopefully fans will be happy with the way things are revealed to have bigger connections later on. *
>>
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>>108134733
>>
>>108135027
>I didn’t expect Didio to just openly cuck Johns
You sweet summer child.
>>
>>108135079
I knew they would cuck him, just not to openly say they would. I would expect them to lie and not just openly say they are cucking him.
>>
>>108135048
.?..

I guess Doomsday loosely inspires them.
>>
>>108135057
Those are all low numbers, comics would be dead if DC and Marvel weren’t owned and backed by major media conglomerates.
>>
>>108133150
>>108135048
>It’s real
Holy Damage Control, Batman!
>>
>>108135057
>>
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>>108135108
>I knew they would cuck him, just not to openly say they would.
Yeah, they've literally fired people for breaking kayfabe in the past.
>>
>>108135135
More like,
>”Oh shit! Snyder just said Doomsday Clock is non-canon! Fix it! Fix it! Fix it!”
>Snyder: “Uh, What I meant to say is that Doomsday is totally special and we totally will have connections planned! Because it is canon!!...Did they buy that?!”
What a shitshow.
>>
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>>108135196
>>108135155
>>It’s real
>Holy Damage Control, Batman!
tfw all of this has happened before, and all of this will happen again
>>
>>108135213
FUCK DC
>>
>>108129095
>>108135048
>“But its effects are relatively self-contained to itself.”
to
>Hopefully fans will be happy with the way things are revealed to have bigger connections later on
I am sorry, but is hilarious. Snyder goes from “Doomsday is self-contained” to “Oh yeah there are connections planed”

Did Snyder not think things through? Did he not expect to be asked about Doomsday Clock when interviewed about the JSA? Did he seriously not have a proper answer prepared? Did he just improv the interview?
>>
>>108135335
I'm just surprised Rich didn't jump on this yet, I expected there to be a Bleeding Cool article about it.
>>
>>108134990
He’s definitely is, though it seems like Didio can’t give a shit about consistent continuity not like it matters anyways, but I thought they’d de-age John by tying up the doomsday Clock shit and having Jor-el be sent back to krypton but now absolutely no one gives a shit about it
>>
>>108135363
>I'm just surprised Rich didn't jump on this yet
Rich the Leach posting 2 years worth of forum comments in a "lying in the gutters" column is literally how McDuffy got fired:
>>108135196
https://www.cbr.com/dwayne-mcduffie-fired-from-justice-league/
>>
>>108134990
>bendis changes continuity
>snyder just ignores bendy and does what he wants giving zero fucks
POTTERY!
O
T
T
E
R
Y
!
>>
>>108135057
>Marvel putting out twice as many books as DC
>Just barely selling more
So both of the Big Two are fucked then retard?
>>
>>108134794
Totally bro, he’s going back to Marvel after mission accomplished!!!!!! XD

he’s not going anywhere you fucking dumbass
>>
>>108135048
That's a pretty big change to make since they say completely different things. One implies that Doomsday Clock has very little if any connection to the DC universe proper and the other implies that does in fact have big connections but they won't be known until later.
>>
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>>108135551
>moving the goalposts
>>
>>108135160
To be fair it's only that high because it's got a shit ton of store exclusive covers. It'll be back way down soon.
>>
>>108129148
>Pointless
It's going to reboot the DCU again and retcon everything these faggots hack writers did to our heroes.
>>
>>108135335
I've heard Snyder talk before and he can get pretty nervy and tangled up.
>>
>>108135585
Gee, It is almost like they (DC) made Snyder back-track on his original comment because he just outright said Doomsday Clock doesn’t matter to the rest of the current DC universe. It is almost like he just admitted Doomsday Clock was non-canon and/or unimportant and they didn’t want anyone to freak out. What a shock.
>>
>>108129167
This.
>>
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>>108135661
>reboot the DCU again
Oh, god ...
>>
>>108130601
Why.
>>
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>all this shit for a JSA revival that will immediately fall victim to current year trends and become a horrible dogshit metajoke about boomers or trump
Just stay dead holy shit
>>
>>108135661
According to Scott Snyder and his loose lips, it ain’t gonna do shit. Aka it is not canon.
>>
>>108135577
I mean the guys gotta retire eventually right?
>>
>>108135577
>going back to Marvel
He was never there. His history before DC was working at Mainframe and fucking up beastwars
>>
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>>108130801
Morrison wanted people to use his stories and concepts, not just retell his own stories but worse. He even went out of his way to shit on Snyder in by bamboozling his Invisible Emotional Spectrum in the first issue of GL.
>>
Continuity is for fags
We must destroy it
>>
>>108130519
Shut the fuck up Didio.
>>
>>108136094
everyone at DC is doing their level best
>>
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>>108136094
>Continuity is for fags
>We must destroy it
Based and Dido Pilled!
>>
>>108135969
What there did invisible spectrum even go?
Nowhere, that's where.
>>
>>108136094
Most problems with comics in the 2010's come from people thinking continuity doesn't matter at all and that they can do anything they want. Go back to the 00's, you relic.
>>
>>108134714
That's the best part. DC had to do the reboot as a last ditch effort for management to save their jobs after a close to a decade of stewardship by Didio drove off all the fans.

Any time some faggot wants to defend him I'll just point to that and his belief that "Countdown was 52 done right".
>>
>>108136128
>Nowhere, that's where.
Implying.
>>
>>108136128
because Morrison came in and said "that's fucking stupid" then showed everyone how stupid it was.
>>
>>108130632
A good example of Didio being shit is Phantom Stranger under him and Phantom Stranger under DeMatteis. Or Sideways when it was being "co-written" (i.e. mostly written) by Justin Jordan vs. when it was written by Didio solo.

Didio's a shit creative guy and a cancer on comics. Nothing more.
>>
>>108136145
>infinity+1
Kino
>>
>>108136133
>close to a decade of stewardship by Didio drove off all the fans
They can't seem to win for losing:

>Our #8 publisher in the Top 750 is DC Entertainment.

>This is, frankly, shocking to me. For the first decade-plus I have been doing these charts, DC’s attention to backlist had naturally rendered them the #1 publisher…. With a bullet! And even when, the last few years, they lost the #1 spot to Scholastic, they were still majorly, significantly always at least #2.

>2018 is pretty ugly in the book stores for DC – they haven’t had this tragic of a performance since 2005. And I’m still trying to wrap my head around it from 20,000 feet.

>Now, there’s no doubt that the rebranding from “New 52” to “Rebirth” simply did not work in the mid-term – it does not appear that the “civilian” audience understood why continuity was being “reset” again so quickly. And while the “Rebirth” GN numbers were OK to start, they very very quickly bombed out. Here’s an example: the first “Rebirth” “Harley Quinn” launched at 13k in 2017. In 2018, it sold just 1818 copies. Kind of shockingly, v1 of the “New 52” “Harley” outsold it at 1894 copies. You can see this over and over again down the line: “Rebirth” “Batman” v1 sold 24k in 2017, and just over 5600 copies in 2018. “Nightwing” v1 sold 12k in 2017, down to 3k in 2018. In fact, not a single “Rebirth” branded book passes 10k in 2018, and it completely slaughtered the sales of the “New 52” editions as well.

Sauce:
https://www.comicsbeat.com/tilting-at-windmills-274-looking-at-bookscan-for-2018/
>>
>>108131530
This is because Didio has no confidence in/a complete hatred of what makes DC DC and believes instead that they should emulate Marvel right down to taking their castoffs. The problem is that he's uncreative and saw Marvel doing "darker" and "more mature" stories during the Quesada/Jemas era and has been ineffectually chasing that for 15+ years.

He absolutely hates characters like Dick, Wally and Kyle and hates the idea of legacies in general because he believes having those characters around ages the "real" heroes or otherwise takes them off the table even though legacy is something that DC has pretty much spent decades (especially since the '90s and the re-introduction of the JSA) building itself on and being a core fucking component of the entire DC identity.
>>
>>108131599
>>108131812
John's contempt of Batman aside? I'm still not sure what to think about a 'World's Greatest Detective' who hasn't noticed he's been fighting three different people for several years.
>>
>>108136291
We still writing fanfiction about dan didio?
>>
>>108136198
>>infinity+1
Snyder in a nutshell, senpai.
>>
>>108136291
>Marvel doing "darker" and "more mature" stories
Which were directly inspired by Watchmen and Dark Knight Returns?
>>
>>108133150
lol
>>
>>108130821
Morrison is a hack but at least he is an earnest hack, Snyder is an all around fraud.
>>
>>108136357
>filename
Anon stop, you're giving Snyder ideas about how to make The Batman Who Laughs drag on forever
>>
>>108136324
Is it fanfic when he straight up admits to chasing Marvel?
>>
>>108137715
Yeah, still a fucking fanfic because it's all speculation and headcanons.
>>
DC ignoring continuity is their life motiv, so no surprise there. And btw DClock was already getting ignored by everyone.

What really surprises me is how fucked up is DC as a workplace, just like when King blamed his fuck ups on his artist twice, i can't help but wonder how will those two handle each other from now on.
Snyder did a huge disservice to Johns' work - which is boring garbage, no doubt - but he had no right in saying that, especially not when the event is still getting published.

What a giant piece of shit.
>>
>>108135551
>another episode of anon doesn't understand how economy works

Oh gee.
>>
>>108137883
King has literally gotten people killed with zero accountability for years of course he’s gonna a fucking asshole and start scapegoat the seconds people can actually blame him for shit
>>
>>108137883
This. They are co-workers dammit, you don't see that kind of drama anywhere outside of DC comics.
Even WB handled better the change of director and the JL fiasco.
>>
>>108129184
The comic is complete and has been for some time. The delays are Didiot wanting to assert control over the DCU from Johns. His vision is the HiC, BatCatBatCat nonsense. Johns is far from perfect, but he at least gets why DC works.
>>
>>108129334
Retards literally thought Doomsday Clock would wrap up and conclude every single thread in the last two issues that the book has introduced, despite the obvious fact that it's going to be more open ended where the ending will just foreshadow upcoming stuff instead of giving a concrete conclusion.
>>
>>108130108
>lol, no one even storytimed that last week

It's sad when people here think this is somehow a sign of quality.
>>
>>108130329
>creating nu52
>bald fuck everyone hates
...Wait isn't that DilDio?
>>
>>108130519
>morrison
>identity crisis
>nu52
>post-rebirth shitfest including hiring bendis and publishing heroes in crisis
hmmm
i wonder who could be upset at him
>>
>>108136133
>Any time some faggot wants to defend him I'll just point to that and his belief that "Countdown was 52 done right".

You do that, it really shows what an ill informed, butthurt fucktard you are when you dosn't understand the basic context behind that quote.
>>
>>108130748
I wouldn't call Morrison a continuityfag, he couldn't even remember Batman boned Talia for fun, and that was a crucial plot point in his run.
>>
>>108136291
>He absolutely hates characters like Dick, Wally and Kyle

No, he rightfully sees them redundant because there's no place for them. This is seen as hate because character fags get fucking mad every time something bad happens to their favorite.

And legacy only works when it doesn't require mainstays like Batman and Superman be 90 years old in-continuity. People are always bitching and whining how there's too many bat-sidekicks and when your kid characters age into their mid-twenties and then another batch of teen sidekicks age to their mid-twenties and your mentor hasn't aged a day, it's a fucking problem.
>>
>>108131647
>but nothing else he's ever done has been a huge hit like that.

What the fuck are you talking about, Metal and his Batman books sell really well. Snyder has never been given a floundering title to resurrect.
>>
>>108131851
He's had conversations with Morrison about story ideas, I doubt Morrison is actively collaborating with him.
>>
>>108133256
I do not fucking understand why people are so autistic about Convergence. It was a fucking filler thing for couple of months years ago but people still whine and cry like DC personally came to their house and took a shit in their cereal. It was nostalgia wank. Nothing more, nothing less. Just because you were so goddamn stupid you bought the hype doesn't make it bad, it makes you a fucking idiot who falls for marketing gimmicks and can't handle feeling dumb afterwards.
>>
>>108138360
bad bait

it's not redundant, sliding timescale is fine, and DC reboots ever 10-15 years regardless

it's not about characterfags "getting mad" when "something bad happens," it's under didio's reign that it's always a complete abortion because didio has his hate boner

all you have to do is look at heroes in crisis and see the complete assassination of wally after johns just brought him back. it's a complete rebuttal from didio. he shot dick in the fucking head for christ's sake. he's been trying to kill him since infinite crisis, and now he's dick in name only.

what didio doesn't understand, is that trying to chase the "mature" quesada era is futile if you don't have GOOD stories first. fucking brubaker brought back bucky for christ's sake. bucky was one of the big 3 who could never be revived along with gwen & uncle ben. but it worked because it was a great story.

heroes in crisis is shit
indentity crisis is shit
countdown ("52 done right") is shit
convergence is shit
bendis' run is shit. snyder's runs have been shit. king's runs have been shit

liefeld was right the other day, DC's editorial needs a complete napalm strike and new blood. AT&T can still salvage it
>>
>>108133309
>Rucka's amazing run
>Percy Teen Titans, the best TT run since Johns.

Holy shit dude, what horrible taste.
>>
>>108129954
What the fuck is Killing Zone ? I never heard of it
>>
>>108138443
>he shot dick in the fucking head for christ's sake.

So? At least it pushed Dick's book into a new direction instead of just being there because "we need a mediocre and completely forgettable Nightwing book!"
>>
>>108129095
based. fuck doomsday shit
>>
>>108130267
Justice League failing wasn't on Johns. I've never seen a more obvious fall guy
>>
>>108138368
I'm talking about how Johns has made hits out of a bunch of different characters and books.
>Metal
Which was a Batman event book.
>his Batman books
Which are Batman books.
>>
>>108138461
Stay a bad dream Azzarellofag.
>>
>>108138518
If he sells well on Batman, why wouldn't DC give him more creative power when Batman is still involve?
>>
>>108135057
Now post the latest sales where War of the realms is selling worse than Heroes in Crisis you fucking coward
>>
>>108134309
Bendis going against continuity doesn't prove anything
>>
>>108137883
This, Snyder should have shown some professionalism and instead came off as egotistical.
>>
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Can i please just see the legion one last time before it all comes tumbling down
>>
>>108138643
Yeah. It will be written by Bendis
>>
>>108138470
that's the point

"new" doesn't always mean good. especially for DC's sake. we all know dick will be back eventually which means ric will be looked back as some shitty chapter in dick's career, which it is. which surprise dates him anyway, defeating anything didio wants to do.

don't want a mediocre nightwing book? get a good fucking writer and get talent on your books, not hard. christ, marvel revived the fucking guardians for god sakes because even though quesada himself wasn't a huge fan of the cosmic stuff he realized it had tons of untapped potential than just starlin stuff, and they got giffen and DnA to write about a fucking raccoon and look how it paid off for them

didio will just cancel a book that he doesn't like and keep one that he writes going instead
>>
>>108129095
>Hawkman continuity gets fixed
>DC's continuity as a whole collapses
This is some monkey paw shit
>>
>>108138663
>Just get good talent, bro, that magically fixes everything because they will regurgitate old stuff and now it will be good since change is bad

Oh my God it's like talking to a child.

GotG literally did a radical reinvention of the old IP by doing completely different and new shit with it, yet you whine that doing something new with Dick is bad because it "dates" the character.
>>
>>108138703

Guardians kinda just took the name at first. It'd be like if Nightwing was a Kryptonian again

the problem right now is scott lobdell is a shitty writer
>>
>>108138663
>don't want a mediocre nightwing book?
don't read a Nightwing book
>>
>>108138740
>It'd be like if Nightwing was a Kryptonian again

Or like Dick Grayson quitting as a superhero due to memory loss, and other, less competent people trying to take his place in Bludhaven?
>>
>>108138703
you're the fucking idiot

didio. does. not. like. legacies. period. he hates them, so he doesn't "try new shit," he fucking has a hateboner for them and deliberately tries to ruin them

gotg was new and different but it still had a quality team on it AND paid homage to the original, especially as the run went on past the 2nd arc because DnA had a plan.

i'm saying what they did with ric will date the character because everybody will ignore it, but be consciously aware of it. grayson was a good book despite didio trying to sabotage it, why? because seeley and perhaps king were perfect fits for it. quality does in fact matter

so yes, talent does fucking matter you mong
>>
>>108138443
>fucking brubaker brought back bucky for christ's sake. bucky was one of the big 3 who could never be revived along with gwen & uncle ben. but it worked because it was a great story.
Awful example, that was complete shit.
>killed off Nomad for shits and giggles in a pretty anticlimatic way, apparently he hated the character
>retconned Bucky into a black ops killer, basically turned him into an OC
>more and more retcons up the wazoo
>shilled the fuck out of him and his other OCs, specially after killing off Cap
that whole fucking run was a mistake
>>
>>108138872
>i'm saying what they did with ric will date the character because everybody will ignore it

But it isn't being ignored. It's directly being addressed in other books.
>>
>>108138872
Grayson wasn't a good book
>>
>>108131390
>that Batman lost to the Hulk.
When will this meme fucking die? Hulk has """""outsold""""" Batman for a couple of issues because it had a shit tone of store exclusive variants. Soon it'll be back at least 30k below it again.
>>
>>108139610
>Hulk has """""outsold""""" Batman for a couple of issues
One. One issue. #17 wound up dropping out of the top 10.
>>
>>108139610
>because it had a shit tone of store exclusive variants.
When will this meme will fucking disappear? It outsold Batman because King is an hack and Batman has been constantly dropping since the last cornerstone issue.
Also there is the fact Hulk is a better book, but this hardly counts since Batman has been in the top for years.
>>
>>108139697
>Also there is the fact Hulk is a better book
Oh yeah, quality! That always dictates how well a book sells
>>
>>108129386
We've seen Superman in the original cover with his Superman Reborn outfit but later with the Bendis one. He was lucky that Superman wasn't actually in action in those early issues.
>>
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>>108129148
>comic books
>consequential
You're reading an article that explicitly states the JSA is going to be REINTRODUCED in the middle of 2019.
>>
>>108138518
>I'm talking about how Johns has made hits out of a bunch of different characters and books.
That was a decade ago though. Outside of Doomsday Clock it has been a while since he managed any top seller.
>>
>>108130498
What's convoluted about it? That the "main" Earth shapes the flow of the rest of the multiverse is pretty self-evident.
>>
>>108140021
>>108130498

Yeah, the main Earth forming the rest of the multiverse has been a thing since 52, and that was a Morrison idea.
>>
>>108139620
Hasn't it been April and May already?
>>
To be honest, Doomsday Clock and Green Lantern are the only things from DC that I still enjoy enough to keep reading. Snyder hasn't written anything good since the early years of American Vampire. Him on JSA and Bendis on Legion just means more money for indy books and back issues.
>>
>>108140225
I don't think anybody in this thread is actually reading Doomsday Clock. They just want to laugh at Johns as if DC's nebulous state in the canon wasn't an issue since its first issue.
>>
>>108139871
Looks like you don't pay too much attention to what is written, not a big surprise here:

>but this hardly counts

I admitted the quality isn't worth a damn in the sales, there has been better books than Batman over the years from the Big two, yet Batman stood in its place. King managed to end the momentun, dropping the sales, and letting Hulk outsold it. This would have happened either way, but it is better if it is a book that deserves those numbers to do it.

Really current batfags are pretty innocent, most people still remember how the Spider-Man's drop happened, it didn't changed from the week of OMD to the other, but over the time. And just like the what seemed to be the unstoppable juggernaut of sales ended up barely reaching the top ten.
When people made up excuses and whatnot i can't help but smiling because some newfags are ignorant to the fact that story is repeating itself, and there is no denial who will stop that.
>>
>>108129615
Fuck off Didio
>>
>>108139620
Hulk #17 was in 7th place
#18 came in 13th in the same month

A new printing of #2 also came in at 73rd place with 26,999 extra copies.

You can question its quality, that's subjective. It's clearly a grassroots hit for every single issue to still be in print, along with the trades. It is the closest that Marvel has had to this sort of a hit since the 80s.
>>
>>108140250
I am still reading it. It's not Johns' best, but it's still better than 99% of what DC is belching out these days.
>>
>>108129419
>believing johns
Johns didnt knew what to write before, he probably still doesn't know where the story ends
>>108129318
>johnsfags being deluded
Why? why you guys always do the same shit? from saying JL was wrote by jim lee to imply a the same writer from forever evil is being forced to delay instead of just not finnishing his scripts on time
>>
>>108140279
Yep. Last issue was particularly good.
>>
>>108140250
Aww buddy, I've read every issue and it's actually very bad. It's cool if you like it, but I'm not going to act like it's good simply bc it exists and is "important" bc its an event and uses watchmen characters. Johns and a flailing, it's all over the place, lacking any cohesive critical purchase. Johns' Moore voice is like a chimpanzee mimicking an astrophysicist. It's actually really funny.
>>
>>108129711
>DDC was just a vanity project
Warner mandated this comic and Johns had to come with a story for it, introducing characters for the new HBO series so he can get royalties, it's not just vaniry it's plain greed.
>>
>>108130108
And the only reason we are getting new issues is that Johns needs something to be used as the base for the new movie so he can get shekels
>>108130181
>only good stories are canon
>doomsday clock is not canon
BASED DIDIO
>>
>>108140287
This. It was worth pulling all the previous issues just for that. When Manhatten explained his plan I was like..: holy shit. Kino
>>
>>108140293
>I hate it because run of the mill PR promises good things about the book (like all PR does) and people told me I should hate that for some reason
Okay, casual.
>>
>>108130498
If you think Morrison is ok with this you are retarded, his is literally the kind of shit Final Crisis was all about, editorial and writers sucking the life out of art and ideas, Johns is literally Mandrakk. He commented on Doomsday clock "I have read the first 2 issues and they were mm interesting, it will be interesting to see what Johns will do". Morrison likes Johns on a personal level, and he can't stop talking about thinks he LIKES, "interesting", he was asked if doomsday clock was hot and his answer was "it has a nice personality and a great sense of humor".
>>
>>108138184
This is DC's largest problem. From their events to their maxis and minus to een the arcs in their ongoing a there is never a single "ending" because they fear more than anything the dreaded jump in off point these days. The things is there is no reason to ever jump in for the first time or back into comics if you aren't going to be able to feel like you've "finished" something wen you finish an arc/story.

I imagine this is worse for trade waiters who can wait months sometimes a full year for the new trade and then get 120-200 pages of slow plodding pace leading to a non-ending.

We're past the point of the "writing for trades" problem. Now they're writing for nobody
>>
>>108140353
>This is DC's largest problem.
The main problem is shitty writers and warner.
>>
>>108138227
Please don tell me you think that atrocious book is good. Johns does not understand billy.
>>
>>108140362
He does, since this is Billy Johnson, not Billy Batson, the comic was shit, but since Shazam is Johns OC you can't really say he doesn't understand it.
>>
>>108140343
>casual
I mean. Yeah you have shitty taste, I'm not gonna rag on you for that, but "casual," what? Just an odd angle to pursue. If you don't like Geoff Johns' Watchmen 2, you're just a casual. Ok!
>>
>>108140353
>The things is there is no reason to ever jump in for the first time or back into comics if you aren't going to be able to feel like you've "finished" something wen you finish an arc/story.

Ever heard of it's the journey, not the destination?

>a non-ending.

There's a fundamental difference between an ending where nothing is resolved, and an ending where you get resolution but not every single plot thread is resolved, because they're going to be picked up later. You don't seem to see the distinction. You seem to want instant gratification without any long term storytelling. You are the problem.
>>
>>108140376
It's amazing that you can write so many words in a post and have none of them hold any meaningful context. I didn't attack your taste. I mocked your quasi-obsession with PR statements, most of which have nothing to do with the quality of the book.
>>
>>108140362
Let me guess, you're one of those not muh Billy people who kept whining about Curse of Shazam based on a single page?
>>
>>108140408
You're doing great
>>
>>108129148
That's what everyone here with half a brain has been saying for the past two years.
>>
>>108140436
Only of you go by the PR statements
>>
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>>108140416
>wh-whatevs lmao
>>
>>108140391
>There's a fundamental difference between an ending where nothing is resolved, and an ending where you get resolution but not every single plot thread is resolved, because they're going to be picked up later.
Remember when you were saying the same thing about Johns JL run saying Darkseid war was gonna tie things? Johns doesn't plan things, he introduce shit so he can "hype" future comics, he constantly run out of issues, every story he does is the same: Half-ass 8 issues, rush the story in the 9-10 and then write a messy end that makes no sense. The guy is a shitty writer
>>108140449
The PR statements were that this was about "hope"
>>
>>108140473
What's wrong with introducing things and letting other people resolve them? That's what comics do in a shared universe.
>>
>>108140353
This, actually. Ironically if they kept making stories with nice endings like immediately before Flashpoint or before Marvel got rid of editors, people would be far more satisified and motivated to keep buying.
>>
>>108140453
Ok fine, what's this whole "PR statements" angle supposed to mean?
>>
>Pandora supposed to have secret knowledge of the new 52 universe

>Rendered completely pointless and killed off by Manhattan

>Manhattan suffers the exact same fate

POETRY
O
E
T
R
Y
>>
>>108140490
>What's wrong with introducing things and letting other people resolve them?
Foreshadowing and dropped plot points are not the same things, especially when you don't have a plan.
>>
>>108140512
Why even bring up the PR statements as if they even impact the quality of the book? Who gives a shit if some DC talking head said the book was about hope or some shit. Read the actual book and judge it according to its merits. Nothing in your post suggested you even read the comic book, since the only direct reference to the content you mentioned is, you guessed it: a fucking PR statements.
>>
I wish we could kick ALL the DC top brass out, and get people with new ideas.
>>
>>108140537
>>Pandora supposed to have secret knowledge of the new 52 universe
But Anon, Pandora was huge for trinity war! Just like Cold and the CSA were big in Darkseid War.
>>
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>>108140558
>Who gives a shit if some DC talking head said the book was about hope or some shit
That was Johns, and Johns is writing the comic around the PR guidelines Warner gave him. >Read the actual book and judge it according to its merits.
It's a extremely shitty comic for retards.
>>
>>108140558
Genuinely have no idea what you're talking about anon. Not trying to meme. Another anon said the hope thing.
>>
>>108140582
>Johns isn't a DC talking head
Who gives a shit, my guy? That's my point.

>It's a extremely shitty comic for retards.
You see why I have such a hard time believing you? Doomsday Clock is nowhere near this bad and a cursory glance will tell you that much. You gotta stop playing angry YouTube reviewer.
>>
>>108140560
But you hate new ideas. You never buy new ideas. You whine about new ideas.
>>
>>108140589
>Another anon said the hope thing.
I just told you that focusing on shit like this is basically admitting you don't read comic books. Who gives a flying fuck what anons think?
>>
>>108140623

New ideas that are actually new, instead of trying to rewrap old ideas with a woke cover.
>>
>>108140361
>warner
More like AT&T, warner used to be pretty based before becoming an empty shell of what it once was.
>>
>>108140636
Man, listen. You're arguing at me about something someone else said, I think. This is weird. Anyway, enjoy the conclusion, not here to rain on your parade.
>>
>>108140623
But everything about current DC is beating someone's else horse, DClock is just the main example.
People have every right to bitch about it.
>>
>>108140640
>New ideas that are actually new
You particularly hate those.
>>
>>108140650
That's a strange fetish you have, to barge into unrelated conversations only to state that, yes, you have no fucking clue what's being discussed.
>>
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>>108140621
I just posted Doomsday clock being shit.
>>
>>108140684
>It was another Anon that said the "hope" thing that you're now yelling at me about, not me. You may be confused.
>Who gives a fuck what he thinks???
>Right, yeah I'm saying that wasn't me so--
>PR STATEMENTS
>>
>>108140695
this is pretty genius
>>
>>108140737
There's any reason to be sarcastic? isn't the image stupid enough?
>>
>>108140771
fuck off didiot
>>
>>108140836
Anon, please defend the image, as you probably know i'm not didio, now is your turn, please, defend an image that thinks you are an imbecile and quite literally spell the "deep" meaning of everything in your face several times so you don't miss how deep Johns is.
>>
I just don't understand, Snyder is using JSA from the '40s, but what about them in the present day?
And if this JL story is close to Doomsday Clock timeline they could still be connected without contradicting themselves, since it is almost given some elements of the continuity will be restored
>>
>>108140905
>as you probably know i'm not didio
I can't be sure all I see you is attacking clever writing like a moron.
>>
>>108140695
I'm not looking at your /b/-tier memegraphics directly ripped from Cracked listicles.
>>
>>108140916
>since it is almost given some elements of the continuity will be restored
We should have learned to not take anything for granted, anon.
>>
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>>108140940
Post the cracked listicle then
>>108140923
>clever
Are you sure you want to defend Johns by being open about you being stupid?
>>108140916
It's simple, the JSA is coming to other media, Johns was supposed to re-introduce them over one year ago, but he fucked up by not finnishing doomsday clock in time, he doesn't have the power he once had to hold the IP hostage for longer so Snyder will have to work with the JSA since Johns probably hasnt finnished 3 jokers yet and won't be able to do a JSA story in years.
>>
>>108141045
Moore was even cheekier about the punny transitions. But yeah, how dare Johns juxtapose the text against the art to create a memorable page that's living in your head rent free. What does he think he is, a comic book writer?
>>
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>>108141101
Johns writes for literal retards, but his fanbase thinks he is being smart. Now that's some nice poetry
>>
>>108141186
Okay, person who clearly doesn't enjoy comic books.
>>
>>108141186
Geoff Johns is a genius and these pages are just proof of it.
>>
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>>108141210
I just bought golden house of samarkand and the grendel omnibus. Just becuase you enjoy garbage doesn't mean everyone needs to have low standards. Doomsday Clock is for braindead manchildren that don't think twice about what they are reading, "just turn your brain off" is not a valid defense for bad comics.
>>
>>108129852
Bendis's Superman is bad, but giving him YJ was a stroke of genius. It's been good so far and he's undoing all the damage caused by Lobdell and Johns.
>>
>>108129095
This is unreal, it is like everyone who works at DC is addicted to drama.
This reminds me of the shades Moore would give to Grant except this is the hack edition.

I think DDC is shit (and since Snyder felt the need to say this i'd say most of the readers probably think the same) and it was pretty clear early on that this story would end up being ignored, but this is the biggest disservice anyone could do to a colleague.

We are talking about an event that is still ONGOING and Snyder is saying: "Yeah, that thing doesn't matter at all and it is going to be ignored". At least wait until it's done
>>
>Doomsday Clock #11, a title solicited originally for the 22nd of May, is currently listed on DC’s site as releasing on the 14th of August
>almost THREE MONTHS late

The absolute fucking state of this comic...
>>
>>108129095
I made the point in a different thread that DC seems to be infighting a lot and everyone wants their own vision for the universe and I was told that I had bought into a meme and that it doesn’t happen.

wew lads
>>
>>108138493
The main problem with the Justice League movie is that Johns sided with Zack Snyder against Hamada. That was it. Zack Snyder always wanted to have solo movies first, but had to follow Hamada. Then came Justice League. First Snyder and Terio did their script, which everyone thought was too creepy. Then Johns came in and rewrote the script. Terio fought Johns, but Snyder sided with Johns. Then Hamada started to dislike the delays that Johns was creating with the script and fighting both Snyder and Johns on their big plans for the rest of the movies. That's when Hamada fired both Snyder and Johns, and brought Whedon as the main guy. Hamada even wanted Whedon to give pointers to Wan and Jenkins, but both of them told Hamada and Whedon to fuck off. Specially Jenkins. Wan and Jenkins kept on consulting with Johns and somewhat Snyder.

So in all it was just corporate bullshit.
>>
>>108143229
>Johns sided with Zack Snyder
What the fuck are you talking about? Johns was against Snyder and worked against him and against the Suicide Squad movie, you are confused, there was a 3 front conflict at warner, Johns was in bed with the some old executives, Hamada with the new ones and Snyder and the production was the last one. WB is a bigger clusterfuck than what most people think, but Johns was pretty pissed at snyder, not for muh superdaddy superman reasons but because Snyder didn't use his stories so he couldn't get royalties. Johns and Whedon were in the same bed, Terrio HATED working with Johns. I wish i could find the screecaps or the links but i'm on my phone.
>>
>>108129095
So how long until Johns goes to Marvel?
>>
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>>108140905
As if the original was any better.
>"true face"
>smiley face pin
>"gutters are full of blood"
>literally blood in the gutter
>"the footsteps of good men"
>bloody footprints
>"over a precipice"
>literally as the panel is looking over a precipice
>"staring down"
>take a guess what's happening in that panel
>>
>>108143339
not as long as he can still use his production company to produce some /tv/ stuff.
But with the streaming service in trouble, who knows how long that will last
>>
I hope we at least git a Mime and Marionette ongoing. They were pretty fun.
>>
>>108142148
Why people seem to realize only now of DC's incompetence? This is not the exception at all, people seems to have forgot about it for some reason.
>>
>>108133374
>Tomasi's Superman was shit
Worst joke ever
>>
>>108142584
In the current state of /co/ everything you don't like is "trying to push a meme"
>>
>>108143651
>MUH WHOLESOME AND COMFY
Single handedly drove Supes to Bendis's arms.



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